Teams that were almost relocated

[boredmale]

I vaguely remember when the Blues wanted to move to Saskatoon they basically "showed" the NHL up by opting not to participate in the 1983 draft(grant you they already traded away their first and second rounder)

That is sort of like me telling somebody I will show you, then I punch myself in the face

 

[nutbar]

In 1980, other options for the Flames included Dallas and New Jersey.

Also, along with Houston, I believe Oklahoma City was a serious contender to get the Oilers in the late 90's.

 

[Hamilton Tigers]

1980 Colorado Rockies to Hamilton.

MacDonald, Ticat legend Bernie Faloney, former Ticat GM Ralph Sazio and a still-unnamed financial backer had a verbal deal with Harold Ballard which would have paved the way for the Colorado Rockies to move into a new rink, which they would make sure was built in Hamilton.

Ballard owned both the Leafs and the Tiger-Cats at the time and for $1 would have waived the Leafs' NHL territorial rights to Hamilton and supported the Rockies' move here. In return he would get 10,000 additional high-rent seats built between Ivor Wynne's 35-yard lines.

But MacDonald lost to Bill Powell Sr., who didn't support the agreement as it was then constituted.

The tentative deal collapsed, the Rockies moved to New Jersey to become the Devils and it wasn't until three years later that construction started on Copps Coliseum

The Calgary Flames, the New York Islanders, the St. Louis Blues and the Edmonton Oilers just after Peter Pocklington moved his farm team here, have all made public threats to move to Copps.

There was Harrah's Casino money behind bids to deter Quebec or Winnipeg from migrating south and coming to Hamilton in the mid-1990s. There were the two failed expansion bids of 1990 and 1997 and, over the last four years, three attempts by Balsillie to buy teams – the Penguins, Predators and Coyotes – with increasingly public and brazen intentions of moving them here.

Balsillie's Phoenix gambit gave national clout to an argument which previously existed only in Hamilton: the GTA can and should support a second NHL team.

In fact, even Bettman, considered to be severely anti-Hamilton, had to admit in court that this market was “a league opportunityâ€.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2179856-copps-always-an-nhl-bridesmaid/

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

I believe A$G was negotiating with Seattle as soon as they bought the team. This article doesn't mention Seattle, but does site Hamilton and QC in addition to Winnipeg (in talks since 2005).

http://www.ajc.com/news/sports/lawsuit-thrashers-owners-have-been-trying-to-sell-/nQpwh/

 

[New User Name]

Leafs to Edmonton and Oilers to Toronto

http://www.thestar.com/sports/hocke...k_says_oilersleafs_almost_swapped_cities.html

 

[garnetpalmetto]

no, they don't actually. Used to before the 04 lockout, but basically since 05-06 the team has been either break even or close to it even in their non-playoff years. They made money in the two playoff years and in 10-11 when they hosted the ASG.

Seriously Dave, where do people get their BS sometimes? The Canes relo to Hartford? Right. Now that the 'Yotes situation is settled are we going to be the team that the ill-informed vultures are constantly circling over?

 

[Lupul1990]

Does anyone have anything more on Canadiens move to Cleveland in 1935? Apparently there's something about it in the book celebrating 100th anniversary of the Habs, but it's impossible for me to get it .

 

[SavageSteve]

In 1980, other options for the Flames included Dallas and New Jersey.

Also, along with Houston, I believe Oklahoma City was a serious contender to get the Oilers in the late 90's.

There was a rumor that A Houston Group wanted to buy the Oilers and then swap them to Nashville for the expansion franchise to give them time to construct a suitable arena: http://www.nytimes.com/1998/02/13/sports/plus-nhl-nashville-owner-denies-franchise-swap.html

 

[Tackla]

Seriously Dave, where do people get their BS sometimes? The Canes relo to Hartford? Right. Now that the 'Yotes situation is settled are we going to be the team that the ill-informed vultures are constantly circling over?

It certainly could happen in 10 years. If Karmanos is out of the picture by then, it would be poetic justice to move back to Hartford, and a very popular move across the league to be honest.

 

[SavageSteve]

I vaguely remember when the Blues wanted to move to Saskatoon they basically "showed" the NHL up by opting not to participate in the 1983 draft(grant you they already traded away their first and second rounder)

That is sort of like me telling somebody I will show you, then I punch myself in the face

I was a fifth grader in StL at the time and what happened was that Ralston Purina (the Dog/Cat Chow folks) left the team at the leagues doorstep as an orphan and basically ceased normal operations because they were losing too much money. I think that the team's GM had the sense to trade the first round pick for Rob Ramage because they weren't going to participate in the draft and Purina figured that the players would be dealt with in a dispersion draft anyway. I have a hard time buying Purina products to this day because of that...

 

[garnetpalmetto]

It certainly could happen in 10 years. If Karmanos is out of the picture by then, it would be poetic justice to move back to Hartford, and a very popular move across the league to be honest.

That's a big if. Karmanos has largely stepped down from the day to day operations of Compuware and has announced once he's completely separated from it he plans to move to the area fulltime and make the 'Canes his primary focus. But let's say that Karmanos is out of the picture. He's not the sole owner and you have a coalition of local owners including the owner of Epic Games down here. Hate to burst your bubble but the Canes stay here in the Triangle. Go poach somebody else's team.

 

[Tackla]

That's a big if. Karmanos has largely stepped down from the day to day operations of Compuware and has announced once he's completely separated from it he plans to move to the area fulltime and make the 'Canes his primary focus. But let's say that Karmanos is out of the picture. He's not the sole owner and you have a coalition of local owners including the owner of Epic Games down here. Hate to burst your bubble but the Canes stay here in the Triangle. Go poach somebody else's team.

Peter Karmanos Jr. is 70 years old. He's never been very happy with Carolina. He can only charge below average ticket prices, has an unimpressive TV contract, and has lost a lot of money. Any owner following in Karmanos' footsteps would also take the best possible offer after the lease is up, including relocation. Don't expect Carolina to ever be an untouchable franchise!

 

[manisback121]

The Devils were very close to moving to Nashville in 95. Rumors were if not for the Stanley cup run they would have ended up in Nashville.

That's a bunch of *********. I remember being in the car on the way home after game 4 where bettman said it was an idea floated around but never made it anywhere close, it sounds like something that went out of hand.

MOD but I still would trust him back then...

 

[PCSPounder]

Peter Karmanos Jr. is 70 years old. He's never been very happy with Carolina. He can only charge below average ticket prices, has an unimpressive TV contract, and has lost a lot of money. Any owner following in Karmanos' footsteps would also take the best possible offer after the lease is up, including relocation. Don't expect Carolina to ever be an untouchable franchise!

Given NC State basketball has all but taken over the arena, I'd say anything BUT untouchable. They'll get a few years for NC State to bleed them out of dates.

 

[JMROWE]

So we can all agree the people that are responble for Hamilton not having an NHL.team right now are former Hamilton mayor Bill Powell Sr. , Harold Ballard , Seymore Knox , John Ziegler . So why is Hamilton continueing to be black balled by the NHL. , MLSE & to lesser extent the Sabres when all 4 of those men who started the black balling of an NHL. team in Hamilton are all dead? .

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Given NC State basketball has all but taken over the arena, I'd say anything BUT untouchable. They'll get a few years for NC State to bleed them out of dates.

This is news to me, and I go to NC State. The people that run the arena day-to-day (Gale Force Holdings) also own the Hurricanes.

If you are talking about Kay Yow playing hardball with Gale Force Holdings, she released the dates after the media in the area got involved (it was a slow news week):

Since discussions first started, NCSU has released a few dates. For example:
• By May 31, N.C. State had released all but 13 dates for nine scheduled games and four additional holds to complete the non-conference portion of the schedule (September – December).
• By June 18, N.C. State had released all but 23 dates for the conference portion of the season (January – March).

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/blog/2013/07/one-potential-scheduling-conflict-in.html

 

[candyman82]

It certainly could happen in 10 years. If Karmanos is out of the picture by then, it would be poetic justice to move back to Hartford, and a very popular move across the league to be honest.

Hartford: The pipe dream of relocationists

 

[tarheelhockey]

The Canes are going nowhere, least of all Hartford. There isn't even the vaguest rumor of this in the real world. Where do people get this crap?

 

[Skobel24]

The Canes are going nowhere, least of all Hartford. There isn't even the vaguest rumor of this in the real world. Where do people get this crap?

Agreed. Carolina isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

 

[Skobel24]

It certainly could happen in 10 years. If Karmanos is out of the picture by then, it would be poetic justice to move back to Hartford, and a very popular move across the league to be honest.

Don't hold your breath.

 

[garnetpalmetto]

Peter Karmanos Jr. is 70 years old.

Hey, a factual statement to start out! A shame you didn't continue by giving us facts and figures rather than speculation - to wit:

He's never been very happy with Carolina.

Proof? I have some - to the contrary.

“I like owning the Hurricanes,” Karmanos said.

Told that his decision to sell the Everblades could cause concern, even some nervousness, among Canes fans, Karmanos laughed.

“Some people have been nervous ever since we moved to North Carolina (in 1997),” he said. “Some called us carpetbaggers. Some were nervous when Compuware stock dropped.

“I keep saying we have one of the best arena deals in the league. We have one of the best facilities. We’re in one of the fastest-growing markets in the country. Why would we ever move?"

Yup, those sound like the words of a man who just positively hates Raleigh.

He can only charge below average ticket prices,

Here's where it'd be nice if you brought some Business to the Business of Hockey Forum. How about analyze what our average ticket price is compared to the League on the whole?

has an unimpressive TV contract,

That's awfully subjective. Personally I find the Big Ten's TV contract unimpressive. But that's because I'm an SEC fan and find everything about the Big Ten unimpressive. See how that works? How about an objective measurement here?

and has lost a lot of money.

Again, subjective and you're not even giving us a timeframe, let alone actual monetary figures. Are you talking the two years in Greensboro? Accounting for the death of Thomas Thewes when Karmanos had to take on Thewes' share of the team?

Any owner following in Karmanos' footsteps would also take the best possible offer after the lease is up, including relocation.

Except when those owners are local investors who've invested for the specific purpose of keeping the team here.

Don't expect Carolina to ever be an untouchable franchise!

I never said anything about untouchability - no franchise is. However, your pipe dreams of some imminent relocation to Hartford are precisely those - pipe dreams.

Don't hold your breath.

I rather he would...less baseless speculation and rumor-mongering is a good thing.

 

[htpwn]

The St. Pats (Leafs) almost relocated in 1927, due to arena issues.

Conn Smythe managed to convince the investors to sell him the team for a discount as opposed to moving the team to Philadelphia.

 

[tarheelhockey]

The St. Pats (Leafs) almost relocated in 1927, due to arena issues.

Conn Smythe managed to convince the investors to sell him the team for a discount as opposed to moving the team to Philadelphia.

Pretty crazy to imagine the alternate universe where this move went through.

 

[Warhead77]

Nashville Predators were rumored to move to Winnipeg in 2007.

And it indeed was true. Bettman did offer TNSE the Preds back then as was confirmed by Chipman himself.

 

[MuzikMachine]

Peter Karmanos Jr. is 70 years old. He's never been very happy with Carolina. He can only charge below average ticket prices, has an unimpressive TV contract, and has lost a lot of money. Any owner following in Karmanos' footsteps would also take the best possible offer after the lease is up, including relocation. Don't expect Carolina to ever be an untouchable franchise!

The Canes are going nowhere, least of all Hartford. There isn't even the vaguest rumor of this in the real world. Where do people get this crap?

But shouldn't every relocation that occured since 1967 expansion be reversed? Sure, you would have two teams in New York, Atlanta, and Minnesota..but still!

The Hurricanes aren't going anywhere.