Noah Dobson or Evan Bouchard?

[soothsayer]

Fine. He is easy to go wide on, doesn't use his size effectively, has a super low compete level, struggles with his positioning, and has a tough time getting back quickly enough to his own zone when the opponents counterattack.

The only thing I sort of agree with is the bold, but not totally. I said he needs to work on his pivots or ability to read the transition quicker, because he can get beat wide by quick skaters. The other stuff you said reminds me of that video some scout (?) made shredding Bouchard when he was in the CHL.

I had Dobson above Bouchard and wanted the Oilers to take him at 10 because I thought Dobson was the more mobile and physically superior defenseman. He probably will always have that over Bouchard. But Bouchard is way better defensively than I thought he would be at this point, and his offense has come as advertise (on pace for 55 pts with little pp time). I would now take Bouchard over Dobson in the draft if I could go back.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

He's been better this year and he still has the handicap of Nolan Baumgartner. He's not nearly as awful as the guys I mentioned.

He’s gotten torched more than Bouchard haha

He started the season with some improvement but the past month has been ROUGH

 

[Oleksiak]

He’s gotten torched more than Bouchard haha

He started the season with some improvement but the past month has been ROUGH

Whole team has looked bad; the assistant coach running our D is not even qualified to coach at the BCHL level. Hard to evaluate anyone when you have Baumgartner sabotaging the defence. Even still, Hughes has played far better in his own zone than Bouchard and has demonstrated a basic understanding of defensive positioning.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Whole team has looked bad; the assistant coach running our D is not even qualified to coach at the BCHL level. Hard to evaluate anyone when you have Baumgartner sabotaging the defence. Even still, Hughes has played far better in his own zone than Bouchard and has demonstrated a basic understanding of defensive positioning.

Want to provide any evidence for that?

Rather than “I think so” especially when you’re pretty biased

you can’t since Bouchard been solid defensively and the entire Canucks dcore (except Myers surprisingly) is getting their teeth kicked on defense

 

[Oleksiak]

Want to provide any evidence for that?

Rather than “I think so” especially when you’re pretty biased

you can’t since Bouchard been solid defensively and the entire Canucks dcore (except Myers surprisingly) is getting their teeth kicked on defense

Wouldn't the entire team playing poorly defensively support the theory that the coach is a problem. Again, I'm basing off the eye test; Hughes is doing a better job at getting back defenisvely this year and doesn't look like a lost puppy when the puck's in his own zone, unlike the pylon who is one of the subjects of this thread. If you think the way Bouchard plays in his own zone is acceptable, that's up to you, although it will certainly cost your team in the playoffs.

 

[Xspyrit]

Bouchard > Kotkaniemi

Not sure why you're saying that to me and what it has to do with what was said.

I was asking the poster to confirm if he wanted the Habs to draft Bouchard as high as 3rd OA

Habs could have drafted Tkachuk or Quinn Hughes too

 

[Rengorlex]

Wouldn't the entire team playing poorly defensively support the theory that the coach is a problem. Again, I'm basing off the eye test; Hughes is doing a better job at getting back defenisvely this year and doesn't look like a lost puppy when the puck's in his own zone, unlike the pylon who is one of the subjects of this thread. If you think the way Bouchard plays in his own zone is acceptable, that's up to you, although it will certainly cost your team in the playoffs.

Conversely, it will get their team in the playoffs.

 

[Oleksiak]

Conversely, it will get their team in the playoffs.

They're winning in spite of Bouchard, not because of him.

 

[Rengorlex]

They're winning in spite of Bouchard, not because of him.

That's still better than actively ruining your teams chances like Hughes & Pettersson are doing two years in a row playing like ECHLers.

 

[ThomasG]

I think Dobson will have the longer and more stable career without complaints.

Bouchard I think is electrifying when it comes to offense, but I think he'll get worn out after he's 33.

I could see him making it to 34.

 

[Regal]

Want to provide any evidence for that?

Rather than “I think so” especially when you’re pretty biased

you can’t since Bouchard been solid defensively and the entire Canucks dcore (except Myers surprisingly) is getting their teeth kicked on defense

Yea, that’s not true at all. Statistically, Hughes and OEL have had very solid defensive seasons, and the eye test has generally backed it up as well. Saying the defense is the problem in Vancouver at all suggests you haven’t seen the team much. Their main issues are special teams, in particular the PK, which Hughes doesn’t play on, and the offense. At 5v5, they’re actually middle of the pack defensively by most metrics, and are actually one of the best in the league in goals against per 60.

As for Bouchard, Hughes literally has better CA/60, FA/60, SA/60, GA/60, xGA/60, SCA/60 and HDCFA/60

 

[Dion TheFluff]

Defenseman A:
30.8 shots against/60
2.5 xGA/60
29.5 scoring chances against/60
12.6 high danger chances against/60

Defenseman B:
36.3 shots against/60
2.9 xGA/60
37.8 scoring chances against/60
16.2 high danger chances against/60

taking their names out of it, which guy is really the defensive liability?

Dobson has been a train wreck this year

 

[seafoam]

Has to be Bouchard considering Dobson is a bottom pairing guy at best right now.

 

[Dempsey]

They're winning in spite of Bouchard, not because of him.

Are you kidding?

 

[Bounces R Way]

Gotta go with Bouchard here. Dobson is the better skater but Bouchard has closed that gap and is the more intelligent player. Don't think either are anything special defensively but Bouchard is much more dynamic walking the offensive blueline.

 

[ClydeLee]

Dobson takes charge and impresses me more as a standout of a team without as much working possession wise

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I know Bouchard’s numbers look better, and he’s certainly having a good season, but I like Dobson’s game a little more. Bouchard has closed the gap though since they were drafted.

 

[MessierII]

I know Bouchard’s numbers look better, and he’s certainly having a good season, but I like Dobson’s game a little more. Bouchard has closed the gap though since they were drafted.

What gap? Bouchard always had more potential.

 

[Davo Ikinzom]

He's such a defensive liability that he's the Oilers #1 penalty killer. #12 in the league.

 

[biturbo19]

I still take Dobson over Bouchard. Same as at the draft. I think Dobson still has the potential to become that absolute stud all-around #1D, that might not be entirely within Bouchard's wheelhouse, as more of an offensive specialist (but a good one).

Dobson is a guy who always felt like a bit of a Pietrangelo-style "late bloomer" who might take a minute to really find his footing in that expected role at the NHL level. The flashes are definitely there though, so i'll stick with that...

 

[saintunspecified]

It's still way too early to tell on this. From NYI perspective, Dobson has definitely becoming more assertive with the puck, but he's also been making mistakes in the defensive zone. I don't see hem as Pietrangelo, or a future #1, but then again I didn't expect 23 year old Adam Pelech to turn into what he turned into either. He still hasn't really filled out.

 

[wetcoast]

I still take Dobson over Bouchard. Same as at the draft. I think Dobson still has the potential to become that absolute stud all-around #1D, that might not be entirely within Bouchard's wheelhouse, as more of an offensive specialist (but a good one).

Dobson is a guy who always felt like a bit of a Pietrangelo-style "late bloomer" who might take a minute to really find his footing in that expected role at the NHL level. The flashes are definitely there though, so i'll stick with that...

I’m higher on Bouchard, his skating and how it would hamper him defensively was always the big question with him and he seems to be well on the way to answering those concerns.

Dobson just doesn’t have the high hockey IQ that Bouchard does but he has the better physical package and overall physical skill set but seems a bit awkward offensively.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

I know Bouchard’s numbers look better, and he’s certainly having a good season, but I like Dobson’s game a little more. Bouchard has closed the gap though since they were drafted.

Closed what gap?

Bouchard was the higher rated prospect on draft day and was picked higher

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Closed what gap?

Bouchard was the higher rated prospect on draft day and was picked higher

What is the point of this poll if our own opinions don’t matter?

 

[Lacaar]

I really wanted Dobson over Bouchard at the draft.

Bouchard has been playing pretty decently this year. Not amazing but pretty good.

I don't have a clue how Dobson is doing since I didn't get to see him last year or this year yet. Not paying a whole lot of attention to the NHL in general other than the Oilers so didn't bother to vote.