# La liga part II



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Not sure who locked the last thread but no one bothered to make another?

The ref committee which I can only assume is run by blind monkeys has filed complaints against Pique as well as Villarreal's president. Again I can only assume they're mad because they were shown how incompetent they are.


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## xavi4life

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not sure who locked the last thread but no one bothered to make another?
> 
> The ref committee which I can only assume is run by blind monkeys has filed complaints against Pique as well as Villarreal's president. Again I can only assume they're mad because they were shown how incompetent they are.




Villarreal's coach has also been suspended for 2 games because of his protests of that ridiculous penalty call.


Look, both Barcelona and Madrid get away with a lot of calls, They generate the league a ******** of money and make everybody richer in the league... BUT, what PiquÃ© has brought out in his tweets deserves a look. And why the **** are teams in Spain giving gift bags to refs anyway??? ****ing conflict of interest much???

The normal protocol in Spain is for the home team to give "gifts" to the referee crew, however, in this instance REAL MADRID was the away team and still walked out of there with baggies.

Spain is a joke.


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## Vasilevskiy

Apparently Madrid does this all the time, that's what they said when asked about this.

Still think Villareal could have played much better with the 2-0 lead but refs gifted Madrid the path to a comeback that may give them the league, it's a joke honestly


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## Power Man

Lol Bruno from Villareal obliterated PiquÃ© in a press conference when told about Pique's latest whiny tweet


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Lol Bruno from Villareal obliterated PiquÃ© in a press conference when told about Pique's latest whiny tweet




Did he raise his hand?


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## les Habs

xavi4life said:


> Look, both Barcelona and Madrid get away with a lot of calls




Well that would depend on what your definition of "a lot of calls" is and if you're referring to calls in general (legitimate or not) or just bad calls in their favor. There's no comparison here. BarÃ§a don't get the calls that Madrid do. That's not to mention the calls that other clubs in the league get when they're playing BarÃ§a. That's not to say that BarÃ§a never get calls they shouldn't, but it's nothing like what Madrid get and not more than all the other clubs in Spain as is sometimes wrongly perpetuated.



> BUT, what PiquÃ© has brought out in his tweets deserves a look.




Of course it does. He's right too. It clearly won't get a look and now clearly hasn't. The refs committee has, once again, closed ranks on their ****** refs. And the table would look a lot different, with Madrid not even in first place, match in hand or not. 



> And why the **** are teams in Spain giving gift bags to refs anyway???




Exactly. What a ridiculous practice. I've never heard of it before. Maybe BarÃ§a need to put more swag in the bag.



> The normal protocol in Spain is for the home team to give "gifts" to the referee crew, however, in this instance REAL MADRID was the away team and still walked out of there with baggies.




Well that's the part that I found odd based on what I read. Madrid being the away team. The crazy thing was there was a photo of the ref, talking to reporters, carrying his Madrid swag bag! On top of that, it wasn't the keychains, etc that are the supposed norm. Clearly a Madrid jersey, and Lord only knows if it was signed by the team, in the bag. It looked like the guy went shopping at the Real Madrid club shop, yet again he was at de la Ceramica.



> Spain is a joke.




Yep. Thing is this is nothing new. This has been going on for decades. And let's not forget the whole transfer ban nonsense as well. 



Vasilevskiy said:


> Apparently Madrid does this all the time, that's what they said when asked about this.
> 
> Still think Villareal could have played much better with the 2-0 lead but refs gifted Madrid the path to a comeback that may give them the league, it's a joke honestly




Well apparently other clubs do it as well. Again, I hadn't heard of it, but also this is Madrid playing away.

Yeah, and it's nothing new.



Power Man said:


> Lol Bruno from Villareal obliterated PiquÃ© in a press conference when told about Pique's latest whiny tweet




So you're saying Bruno is an idiot then. Question is who is the bigger idiot, Bruno or Ramos?


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## Luigi Habs

So Luis Enrique announces he won't be back next season.


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## HajdukSplit

BeIN reports the Enrique will step down at the end of the season

Real Madrid should have scored 4-5 goals already against Las Palmas but to be fair, Las Palmas have been creating chances as well, very open game


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## Jersey Fresh

Gareth Bale 

Morata looked onside from that free kick, though.

Ramos' arms looked tucked into his body. Not sure about the call, but Las Palmas lead.

Haha this is amazing! Navas came out to challenge and loses out. Madrid have lost it.


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## HajdukSplit

huge error by Navas and Boateng finishes it...3:1. Also, Real players losing their cool after every foul


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## Savi

HajdukSplit said:


> BeIN reports the Enrique will step down at the end of the season


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## Power Man

Hahahahaha WTF Madrid


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## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Hahahahaha WTF Madrid




WTF indeed, we are pissing the league away. That's pathetic


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Has to be said Ronaldo was onside. Makes the L even better.


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## HajdukSplit

Las Palmas kicking themselves now for all those Jese chances, they might even lose this game now


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Has to be said Ronaldo was onside. Makes the L even better.




What L ?


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## xavi4life

Bale! 

Luis Enrique leaving is not surprising, good for him to relax and enjoy his life. BarÃ§a need a new coach who can get Neymar scoring goals and playing better defensively. Ter Stegen has been ****ing BOMB all season though. One of the best goalies I've seen in BarÃ§a net.


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> What L ?




That's fine...Zizo taking D's until he loses the league.


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> That's fine...Zizo taking D's until he loses the league.




Tbh we haven't been playing great.
We find ways to come back but we have to play better


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

You've always played bad under zizo... It's just starting to catch up with y'all. Should be 3 straight losses but you managed to grab 4 points. Count your blessings.


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## HajdukSplit

Barca probably won't have CL to deal with and their fixtures are reasonable, the go to Real Madrid end of April and host Sevilla next month. Their toughest away trip besides the Bernebeu is probably Malaga where they traditionally struggle

Real still have to play both Barca and Atleti, both at home however, they still go to Bilbao as well. Eibar this weekend could be tricky too, especially preceding the 2nd leg in Napoli

Even Sevilla is still in this, however they probably have the toughest fixtures, still have to go to Barca/Atleti + Valencia who are improving in the 2nd half of the season


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> You've always played bad under zizo...




Uh no


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## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Spent 10 days on vacation and find out Barca is back in 1st place

Good ****


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## les Habs

Savi said:


>




I'm fine with a change as it'll have been three years and something needs to change, but if the team can do another Double then Lucho will be leaving with an incredible record. On top of that there aren't many managers out there I'd be interested in. The squad needs an overhaul as well. 



TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Spent 10 days on vacation and find out Barca is back in 1st place
> 
> Good ****




Well despite some of the sentiment here, the league very clearly was never over. The reason being that Madrid weren't playing that great despite their results. Of course Madridistas couldn't see it unlike we Cules when assessing BarÃ§a's play.


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## maclean

HajdukSplit said:


> Barca probably won't have CL to deal with




this is a good point, Real will be worn more thin, plus they have a league game to make up some time (though Barca has the copa final too)


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## Corto

maclean said:


> this is a good point, Real will be worn more thin, plus they have a league game to make up some time (though Barca has the copa final too)




Real's CL run (if its deep) is miles above what Barca has in their Cup game, but that said, schedule is no exuse for Real at this point...

As long as they're not winning games due to stuff like Bale pulled off last night, they can blame noone but themselves.


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## Power Man

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Spent 10 days on vacation and find out Barca is back in 1st place
> 
> Good ****




2 game in hand tbh


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## Savi

No just 1


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## Power Man

Savi said:


> No just 1




lol I meant 1 , long nights, not enough coffee


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## Luigi Habs

So in last 2 games Real have 4pts out of 6 instead of a deserved 0pt. Lucky *******.


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## les Habs

Thing about Madrid's match in hand, or at least one of them, was that they had a match postponed not too long ago and it wasn't for fixture congestion. At the time I didn't think that would do them any favors. 



Corto said:


> Real's CL run (if its deep) is miles above what Barca has in their Cup game, but that said, schedule is no exuse for Real at this point...
> 
> As long as they're not winning games due to stuff like Bale pulled off last night, they can blame noone but themselves.




Exactly, just like Vidal's injury is no excuse for BarÃ§a. Clubs this size really don't have any excuses as far as the number of fixtures unless they're really decimated with injuries, but even then they have the cantera to rely on. 



Luiginho said:


> So in last 2 games Real have 4pts out of 6 instead of a deserved 0pt. Lucky *******.




Didn't look like luck.


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## Galactico

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Has to be said Ronaldo was onside. Makes the L even better.



Ahah take that! Plus the fact that we had THREE goals ruled off for being offside when at least 2 should have counted. That Barcelona propaganda really worked yesterday because the officiating was brutal. Bale deserved the red tho. I didn't see Pique complain on twitter about those offside calls. Anyway, great comeback for us, early stoppage by the ref too. Should have essily been 5 minutes ET plus he gave a yellow to a Palm Tree player for waisting time during stoppage time and still blew the whistle at 3 min.


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## Savi

Just checked in for the ending of Depor-Atleti. Anyone know what happened? Seems like a lengthy injury threatment and upset players?


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## DatsyukOwns

Savi said:


> Just checked in for the ending of Depor-Atleti. Anyone know what happened? Seems like a lengthy injury threatment and upset players?




Torres had to get stretchered off.

Not sure if it was the same incident though.

He has to stay overnight for observation after suffering serve head trauma.


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## les Habs

Galactico said:


> Ahah take that! Plus the fact that we had THREE goals ruled off for being offside when at least 2 should have counted. That Barcelona propaganda really worked yesterday because the officiating was brutal. Bale deserved the red tho. I didn't see Pique complain on twitter about those offside calls. Anyway, great comeback for us, early stoppage by the ref too. Should have essily been 5 minutes ET plus he gave a yellow to a Palm Tree player for waisting time during stoppage time and still blew the whistle at 3 min.




That's all great, assuming it's even accurate, but that sounds part and parcel of every BarÃ§a match. Against Atleti a penalty wasn't called and there should have been a red, but then I could see Busquets being sent off that match as well (for a potential second yellow). That of course was Lahoz, who despite what was said about City-Monaco was his usual poor at best self that match as well.


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## Wee Baby Seamus

Savi said:


> Just checked in for the ending of Depor-Atleti. Anyone know what happened? Seems like a lengthy injury threatment and upset players?




Torres hit his head on the ground very badly after a collision. Looked really bad.


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## Power Man

Luiginho said:


> So in last 2 games Real have 4pts out of 6 instead of a deserved 0pt. Lucky *******.




Lol Juverefs fan talking


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## spintheblackcircle

Savi said:


> Just checked in for the ending of Depor-Atleti. Anyone know what happened? Seems like a lengthy injury threatment and upset players?


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## Power Man

Yikes

I hope he will be ok


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## maclean

Corto said:


> Real's CL run (if its deep) is miles above what Barca has in their Cup game, but that said, schedule is no exuse for Real at this point...




Of course, I meant Barca's Cup game as balancing out Real's extra league game


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Lol of course a missed penalty for Barca. How does this guy get this match after the Villarreal /Madrid?

Messi what a a finish.

Offside on Ivan but flag stays down 3-0 barca.


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## Savi

That Neymar goal was nasty


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## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Terrific performance by Barca all around, bring on PSG.


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## les Habs

Globetrotters today. Sure it was Celta, but they've beat us what, once each of the last three seasons? And while they weren't great, they probably should have had at least a goal. Of course we could have had a few more.

Best performance of the season? Certainly for Busquets. He looked like a toreador multiple times. Neymar phenomonal. Second best player in the World? His stats certainly don't tell the whole story considering how he gets the attacking three going. Messi Man of the Match. 

Rakitic's goal was indeed offside, but ref missed a clear penalty and should have doled out two more yellow cards for Celta. 

Loved Umiti's goal and the celebration. If you follow the papers they were doing rondos midweek in training and Umtiti and Paco lost out and they had to go down the line and get sort of hit on the head by the rest of the squad. Well Umtiti didn't look too keen before he did it. Anyway, you could see the atmosphere in the team and you could definitely see it today. 

Have to feel for Sergi Gomez. He had a lot of good defensive actions, but he was just up against all match long. All things considered though I thought he was Celta's best player after maybe Aspas.

If they put in this sort of performance against PSG I won't care that they are eliminated.


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Holy **** Osasuna/LPA has been hilarious. 3 goals by Las Palmas all due to ****** goalkeeping or an own goal by a defender.


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

**** that didn't look like a corner leading up to Deportivo's 2nd goal.

Messi has been crap since, i tuned in.


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## Power Man

If Real doesn't capitalize on this loss...


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## Luigi Habs

I expected Barcelona to come out flat today and they delivered. They were terrible out there. It was expected after a huge win against PSG but c'mon.


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## maclean

looks like they don't want the treble after all


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## PeteWorrell

I have to say that Ter Stegen has been really solid for Barcelona.That Bravo sale has been a total win for them.


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## Power Man

Lol Navas got away with murder


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## Power Man

Lol Navas doesn't get a deserved red then makes up for it by giving away an easy goal


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## PeteWorrell

Sergio Ramos is an animal.But really poor defending by Betis on the 2 Real Madrid goals today.


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## Pavel Buchnevich




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## Galactico

Ramos is an absolute legend and should seriously be considered for WPOTY because he is freaking beast. Clutch as hell!!


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## Scandale du Jour

Ramos is the definition of clutch.


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## Power Man

Ramos can be **** defensively but he makes up for it with all his big goals


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## Panteras

well, we got destroyed by Leganes, but somehow beat Barcelona...okay Deportivo  I'll take it


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## Corto

Yeah, Barca needs to be better in some of these games.
Ultimately, Deportivo didn't even feel like a complete outsider, they turned up and played good football.


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## les Habs

Corto said:


> Yeah, Barca needs to be better in some of these games.
> Ultimately, Deportivo didn't even feel like a complete outsider, they turned up and played good football.




No commentary on the ref this go round eh?


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

**** ya! It was coming for the lions.


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> **** ya! It was coming for the lions.




Too bad we won


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Agreed.


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Agreed.




Lol.


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Literally schoolboy defending from barca... **** outta here Lucho.


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## Luigi Habs

It's amazing how bad Barca defense is.


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## Evilo

So for the second time now, Ronaldo has insulted Zidane after being subed.


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## Power Man

Evilo said:


> So for the second time now, Ronaldo has insulted Zidane after being subed.




Audio file?


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## les Habs

Gerry


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## Power Man

Gerry is salty as **** 

Goooooood


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## Savi

What did he do now?


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## les Habs

He commented about how Madrid box has the prosecutor in the Neymar and Messi cases present as she has been multiple times. I mentioned this in the past on this forum. She's a former associate of Florentino Perez. Just corrupt Real Madrid and Spain, nothing new.


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## Power Man

Yeah because thoae Catalan clowns are not corrupt

Lmao


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## Hadoop

You're both right!


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## les Habs

Power Man said:


> Yeah because thoae Catalan clowns are not corrupt
> 
> Lmao




Yeah, because they have government prosecutors who go after Madrid players but ignore all other players sitting in the BarÃ§a box.


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## Power Man

It's a conspiracy!!!!!!


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## les Habs

So apparently Florentino Perez had an online media source created that would pressure the refs, put pressure on Ancelotti, help improve Perez's image, etc, etc. He paid 300,000 euros to set it up. Should have called it "Bernabeu Breitbart".


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## les Habs

So it goes deeper apparently. This guy that Perez had set up the website is apparently the prime suspect in a money laundering scandal in Spain that involves politicians, business owners, etc. There are even texts between them that show the moves they made like pressuring Ancelotti to play Bale.


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## Power Man

I approve tbh


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## Savi

BarÃ§a B won 12-0 today 

They're 8 points ahead of the 2nd placed team and 12 on Valencia B

So good chance they will be back in the Segunda Division next year


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## les Habs

Savi said:


> BarÃ§a B won 12-0 today
> 
> They're 8 points ahead of the 2nd placed team and 12 on Valencia B
> 
> So good chance they will be back in the Segunda Division next year




That's great, but what players are actually going to be potential candidates for the first team? I say that as if I know while coming from a place of not entirely knowing. The thing is that in the past couple of years seemingly more and more players were brought in to simply be B team players. To a degree I get it as you want them back in the Segunda, but the main purpose for me should be developing the younger players to eventually make the first team. Of course they then have to be given a shot, and by that I mean a real shot, and that's down to the manager. It's just frustrating watching players not be given a chance. Deulofeu is apparently making an impact at Milan. The rumors around Grimaldo are somewhat infuriating. And the guys who were given a chance like Sergi and Rafinha are contributing to the first team. Obviously they all can't make the first team, but the club starting with the managers really need to start leveraging them more.

8 points ahead of second place, but Alcoyano has a match in hand. 12-0 against the bottom dwellers too. Still it's been a good season and moving back up to Segunda will be a big step in the right direction. What's interesting is that the Castilla side could also make it.


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## les Habs

Lucho!


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## les Habs

Forgot to mention the Ronaldo news. Appears he's now trying to steal Gary Busey's bust:


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## Scandale du Jour

Free BeIN <3

Varane being hurt


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## Scandale du Jour

Real playing like **** in the second half.


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## Scandale du Jour

Dat gol by Isco :wow:


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Suarez on point today beauty goal and should've had maybe 2 penalties.


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Lucho please take the Valencia rejects with you. 

Insane that Denis doesn't get these types of games. Hell Alena would've been a better option.


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## Savi

It's ridiculous Alena still doesn't get any minutes even in blowouts

Mathieu having a terrible game again as usual. It was his man who scored the goal as well


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## Savi

Savi said:


> It's ridiculous Alena still doesn't get any minutes even in blowouts




Well, he got 5 minutes tonight


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## Power Man

My boy Zaka called up by Simeone, about damn time
☺


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## Savant

What happened to Bakambu this season? This time last year he was in great form and playing very consistently.


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## TheLeastOfTheBunch

MSN's looking scarier


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## Savi

3-0 already and not even halftime, some vintage BarÃ§a stuff here tonight


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## PeteWorrell

Sampaoli's stock has been falling hard this last month.


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## Savi

It's the Bielsa syndrome

2/3rds of the year playing great and then running out of gas in the final stretch


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## Scandale du Jour

Hat trick for Morata. Happy for him.


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## Power Man

Our D was bad


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## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Our D was bad




Yeah, if they give that much space to.Barca and Bayern, we will leak goals.


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## Corto

Scandale du Jour said:


> Hat trick for Morata. Happy for him.




Kovacic needs to move in the summer. Maybe Isco as well. 

Both are way to good to be rotation players behind Modric and Kroos - and they're not gonna get in front of them.


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## Power Man

Corto said:


> Kovacic needs to move in the summer. Maybe Isco as well.
> 
> Both are way to good to be rotation players behind Modric and Kroos - and they're not gonna get in front of them.




Modric is getting older and is injury prone, so we need the depth

I think James is leaving after this season, as Isco has a better attitude and works on the defensive send

So personally I think we will keep Isco and Kova


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## Milos Krasic

Nice match at the Mestalla. Valencia beats Celta 3-2. 

Carlos Soler was impressive.


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## Savi




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## Scandale du Jour

Must win game for Real today, IMO.

If we win this one, we can afford to lose the Clasico and still control the league.


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## Scandale du Jour

Pepe (with hair) scores!!!!


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## Power Man

Good job Carvajal, give all the space Griezmann needs, smh


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## Scandale du Jour

Go **** yourself Griezmann 

Nacho just had to take one step to put him offside, bad defending.


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## Power Man

Should have been a corner but whatever


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## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Go **** yourself Griezmann
> 
> Nacho just had to take one step to put him offside, bad defending.




I knew we were in trouble when ZZ called up Nacho because of Pepe's injury


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## Scandale du Jour

Dreadful last 10 minutes, absolutely putrid. Couldn't hold the ball at all.

What a **** touch by Lucas...

Now, we pretty much need points against Barca. Just made life muxh more difficult for.ourselves. Dammit.


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## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Dreadful last 10 minutes, absolutely putrid. Couldn't hold the ball at all.
> 
> What a **** touch by Lucas...
> 
> Now, we pretty much need points against Barca. Just made life muxh more difficult for.ourselves. Dammit.



Nah we'll be fine


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## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Thank you Atleti, thought they'd bottle this


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Game was lost when Kroos went out. Isco and Vazquez provided nothing. 

Oblak kept Atelti in it in the first half.


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Game was lost when Kroos went out. Isco and Vazquez provided nothing.
> 
> Oblak kept Atelti in it in the first half.




Agreed


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## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Game was lost when Kroos went out. Isco and Vazquez provided nothing.
> 
> Oblak kept Atelti in it in the first half.




True enough.


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## Power Man

ZZ with the "keep the locals happy " substitutions


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Kameni looks to be in the mood. Which is not a good thing for barca. They can't get frustrated, he's going to steal more goals from them before it's all over.

That's a penalty! ****... but wtf was Gomes waiting for! Messi gave it to him on a silver platter.


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## maclean

sound's not working for me, why'd the coach get sent off there?


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

maclean said:


> sound's not working for me, why'd the coach get sent off there?




Probably protesting for an offside... it wasn't.

Lucho/ZZ out doing themselves to squander the league. If either of them win the CL the soccer world should be ashamed of themselves.


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## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Probably protesting for an offside... it wasn't.
> 
> Lucho/ZZ out doing themselves to squander the league. If either of them win the CL the soccer world should be ashamed of themselves.



Picked Bayern to win the CL before the season started, I would be shocked if they don't


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## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> ZZ with the "keep the locals happy " substitutions




Bad strategy considering the locals will be super unhappy if we choke the league away.


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## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Bad strategy considering the locals will be super unhappy if we choke the league away.




Exactly 

Double edged sword


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Picked Bayern to win the CL before the season started, I would be shocked if they don't




Well they are the team to beat but don't rule out the others.

LOL Lucho makes 2 subs and Gomes is still on the field?

Nasty challenge and the defender cowardly fakes like he's hurt to not get a yellow. Ref buys it SMH.


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

Great job Neymar... but that same foul was committed in the box on Gomes in the first half not called.


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## maclean

dear lord brca, and they havent even looked much like scoring


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## Power Man

Lol Malaga parking the bus despite having the man advantage


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## Duchene2MacKinnon

**** another stonewall penalty!


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## Power Man

Those refs lmao


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## maclean

well, that was almost inevitable the way the game was going


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## Scandale du Jour

Thank you Barca. Thank you very much


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## Power Man

Yay I guess

We still dropped 2 points 

Not over


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## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Yay I guess
> 
> We still dropped 2 points
> 
> Not over




Not over by any stretch of the imagination, but Barca threw us a huge life-line.

We have room to breathe.


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## Power Man

Neymar is really dumb


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## DatsyukOwns

Power Man said:


> Neymar is really dumb




He is easily triggered and teams obviously realize that. Also helped that he wasn't able to do any of his usual tricks. 

Who has the harder schedule for the rest of the season?


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## Power Man

We still have a game in hand though


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## Milos Krasic

Sandro Ramirez was dangerous all match. 

What a waste by Barca. Kameni saving that Suarez chance early on was huge.


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## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Great job Neymar... but that same foul was committed in the box on Gomes in the first half not called.




What foul? When Gomez watched the Messi-through ball and the Malaga dude ran in front of him?
That's not a foul. 
(if we're talking about the same one)

Reffing was classic La Liga rubbish though.

Malaga should've been 2 up if not for the weak offside call.
And Barca should've had a penalty after a (blatant) foul on Sergi Roberto - but the ref made it into a foul outside the box.

All in all, Barca did another "Deportivo" game, where they paid for a short bench.

Madrid can sit out the front 6 and they'll end up with Kovacic, Isco, Vasquez, James, Morata and Asensio.

Barca never sits out MSN and if they sit Iniesta and Rakitic you have a midfield of Andre Gomes, Denis Suarez and Turan - maybe S. Roberto if he's not playing RWB...

Messi did everything he could vs Malaga (perhaps should've left FKs to Neymar while Neymar was on), but the rest were sub-par (except Umtiti, he was great).

Neymar and Luis Suarez acting like petulant kids when things don't go their way certainly doesn't help Barca.

...

That's the biggest difference right now, between Real and Barca.
Starting 11 is the best two teams in the world, very little to choose from.

But Madrid has a longer bench, and Barca are struggling on rotation.
Its no coincidence they finally started looking better after Iniesta's latest injury and Rakitic's contract negotiations over and him and Busquests returning to form.

And the only bad games since then have been coming when 2 of those 3 guys were being rested or suspended.


----------



## les Habs

Can't say the ref cost us the points, but tough to tell with the missed red cards, the both penalty call and the timing of the missed calls. Of course Malaga should have had another goal as Penaranda's goal was onside. Still with the order who knows what the result might have been. Either way it was an absolutely disgraceful performance from the ref.

Andre Gomes should never wear the shirt again. Dreadful player. Denis Suarez needs to go too. He really shouldn't be in the team much less wearing the "6". Umtiti on the other hand is excellent. Thrilled we signed him.



Corto said:


> What foul? When Gomez watched the Messi-through ball and the Malaga dude ran in front of him?
> That's not a foul.
> (if we're talking about the same one)
> 
> Reffing was classic La Liga rubbish though.
> 
> Malaga should've been 2 up if not for the weak offside call.
> And Barca should've had a penalty after a (blatant) foul on Sergi Roberto - but the ref made it into a foul outside the box.
> 
> All in all, Barca did another "Deportivo" game, where they paid for a short bench.
> 
> Madrid can sit out the front 6 and they'll end up with Kovacic, Isco, Vasquez, James, Morata and Asensio.
> 
> Barca never sits out MSN and if they sit Iniesta and Rakitic you have a midfield of Andre Gomes, Denis Suarez and Turan - maybe S. Roberto if he's not playing RWB...
> 
> Messi did everything he could vs Malaga (perhaps should've left FKs to Neymar while Neymar was on), but the rest were sub-par (except Umtiti, he was great).
> 
> Neymar and Luis Suarez acting like petulant kids when things don't go their way certainly doesn't help Barca.
> 
> ...
> 
> That's the biggest difference right now, between Real and Barca.
> Starting 11 is the best two teams in the world, very little to choose from.
> 
> But Madrid has a longer bench, and Barca are struggling on rotation.
> Its no coincidence they finally started looking better after Iniesta's latest injury and Rakitic's contract negotiations over and him and Busquests returning to form.
> 
> And the only bad games since then have been coming when 2 of those 3 guys were being rested or suspended.




The Gomes play he's referencing is likely that play. While I don't think it was a penalty either the player didn't just "run in front of" Gomes. 

As for the bench argument, while I don't disagree, what do you suggest they do? They tried to sign better players than Alcacer or had them in the past, but those players didn't want to sit on the bench. Pedro left for more playing time. Sanchez left for more playing time. I think Deulofeu should have been given a shot, but Munir did little to impress and Sandro never put in the sort of performance he did today. So up front it's a bit of a tough ask. In midfield I agree, but there's more to it than that. Cesc left for more playing time. Thiago left for more playing time. Roberto is there, and made a big impact coming on today and very clearly wasn't "sub-par", but with no other healthy RB (though Palencia could arguably be called up) they rest him. Rafinha is an option, but now he's out for the rest of the season. Again though, who do they sign? I think Alena should be playing right now and I would have held on to Samper, so for me it's an issue of not using the canteranos. Madrid are lucky they have unambitious players like Morata, Kovacic, Isco and Rodriguez who seem happy to collect a paycheck for the rotational appearances they make.

Again, while I agree we have a shorter bench, that's not the difference right now. The difference is, and today's match aside, clearly the refs. That's been obvious for months.

As for Neymar and Suarez, Neymar is the one who did something and the ****** ref never called anything that went against him. He was fouled well after the ball had left early in the match, no call. Sandro slid through him on another play, no call. He was fouled way off the ball on the play where his header went over the bar, no call. And Suarez while not great did amazingly well on that early chance that Kameni saved.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> The Gomes play he's referencing is likely that play. While I don't think it was a penalty either the player didn't just "run in front of" Gomes.




Can describe it anyway you like, but on no planet is that a foul.
Blame Gomes for basically not doing ANYTHING after a superb ball from Messi.



> Madrid are lucky they have unambitious players like Morata, Kovacic, Isco and Rodriguez who seem happy to collect a paycheck for the rotational appearances they make.




Lovely little veiled insult lol...

I can't speak for their ambitions, I don't know them (neither do you, for that matter).
But whatever their ambitions are, they're quality footballers - that remains the same, regardless of how you coat your feelings toward them.



> Again, while I agree we have a shorter bench, that's not the difference right now. The difference is, and today's match aside, clearly the refs. That's been obvious for months.




That's "obvious" only to a Barca fan. To any neutral, a game like yesterday or vs Depo the other week is a sign they need a stronger bench. No Iniesta, no Rakitic = no midfield.

Much like it was "obvious" only to Barca fans that the ref didn't help them vs PSG.

That's some textbook witch hunt material there, Barcelona (or Real, for that matter) fans crying how they're being done in by the refs.

Like yesterday, when the assistant coach was sent off after Barca players and staff got into officials' faces after the first goal.
Laughable.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Neymar probably would get more calls if he didn't try to buy 32483948239 of them every game with his diving and constant whining. Complaining the refs are not giving Neymar the benefit of the doubt is like complaining that Steve Downey was targeted.

They both brought it on themselves.


----------



## Corto

Scandale du Jour said:


> Neymar probably would get more calls if he didn't try to buy 32483948239 of them every game with his diving and constant whining. Complaining the refs are not giving Neymar the benefit of the doubt is like complaining that Steve Downey was targeted.
> 
> They both brought it on themselves.




Basically, yes.

For every call he or Suarez don't get, there's 2 others they cheat out of the ref.
They're not alone at it, don't get me wrong, but they're the most obvious examples.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> What foul? When Gomez watched the Messi-through ball and the Malaga dude ran in front of him?
> That's not a foul.
> (if we're talking about the same one)
> 
> Reffing was classic La Liga rubbish though.
> 
> Messi did everything he could vs Malaga (perhaps should've left FKs to Neymar while Neymar was on), but the rest were sub-par (except Umtiti, he was great).
> 
> And the only bad games since then have been coming when 2 of those 3 guys were being rested or suspended.




- It was a foul Gomes was day dreaming but the defender clattered into him without attempting to play the ball. It was body check not shoulder to shoulder.

- Agreed, on the bench argument I've mentioned it previously too. 



les Habs said:


> Andre Gomes should never wear the shirt again. Dreadful player. Denis Suarez needs to go too. He really shouldn't be in the team much less wearing the "6". Umtiti on the other hand is excellent. Thrilled we signed him.
> 
> The Gomes play he's referencing is likely that play. While I don't think it was a penalty either the player didn't just "run in front of" Gomes.
> 
> Again, while I agree we have a shorter bench, that's not the difference right now. The difference is, and today's match aside, clearly the refs. That's been obvious for months.




Agreed Gomes but Denis is fine. I did/do find him overrated by some but as a bench player he's fine. Forced to start and should start more due to Gomes/Turan terribleness. 



Scandale du Jour said:


> Neymar probably would get more calls if he didn't try to buy 32483948239 of them every game with his diving and constant whining. Complaining the refs are not giving Neymar the benefit of the doubt is like complaining that Steve Downey was targeted.
> 
> They both brought it on themselves.






Corto said:


> Basically, yes.
> 
> For every call he or Suarez don't get, there's 2 others they cheat out of the ref.
> They're not alone at it, don't get me wrong, but they're the most obvious examples.





So, how does that explain Ronaldo, ADM and co?


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> So, how does that explain Ronaldo, ADM and co?




Ronaldo is the same ilk of whiny diver.


The Gomes play?
http://lasthl.com/malaga-vs-fc-barcelona-highlights-full-match/2/

2.40 on that.

That's just not a foul dude, it just isn't.
Even the commentators aren't even mentioning it.


----------



## Power Man

Lol #10 not giving a f... about playing some D at 1:00

https://youtu.be/XKvlTDMca0U


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> Can describe it anyway you like, but on no planet is that a foul.
> Blame Gomes for basically not doing ANYTHING after a superb ball from Messi.




Like I already said, I don't think it's a foul, but that's based on how that ridiculous rule is often called. However that very clearly wasn't what I replied to. Read my post, again, assuming you bothered the first time. I said he didn't just "run in front of Gomes" like you said he did, and he very clearly didn't. In fact watching it again, and the commentary I'm seeing is saying it's open for debate and refers to it as a "body check", Rosales clearly plays Gomes and not the ball first as he takes him out of it. 

I also blame Gomes who, again if you actually read my post, blasted for his performance that play included.



> Lovely little veiled insult lol...




LOL. Nothing veiled about it whatsoever. Furthermore I didn't intend it as an insult but rather a matter of fact type statement. Love little overreaction on your part though. Considering the players in question I can't imagine why.



> *I can't speak for their ambitions, I don't know them (neither do you, for that matter)*.
> But whatever their ambitions are, they're quality footballers - that remains the same, regardless of how you coat your feelings toward them.




   at the bolded part. 

Obviously they're quality footballers. Did I say otherwise? My point still stands.



> That's "obvious" only to a Barca fan. To any neutral, a game like yesterday or vs Depo the other week is a sign they need a stronger bench. No Iniesta, no Rakitic = no midfield.




Plenty of neutrals know it's obvious. As for your take on the bench, still doesn't change the fact that it's not the reason the league table doesn't look different. And yesterday's match does little if anything to prove your point considering the ref's influence and Malaga's performance.



> Much like it was "obvious" only to Barca fans that the ref didn't help them vs PSG.




I don't know any BarÃ§a supporters that said that the ref didn't help against PSG. 



> That's some textbook witch hunt material there, Barcelona (or Real, for that matter) fans crying how they're being done in by the refs.




Well if you actually pay attention to the league, watch a lot of the matches and know the rules then textbook fact.



> Like yesterday, when the assistant coach was sent off after Barca players and staff got into officials' faces after the first goal.
> Laughable.




Not really sure your point with that one, but no, like yesterday when Malaga should have had multiple players sent off. Camacho alone should have been sent off on at least three different occasions for yellow cards. When BarÃ§a should have been awarded at least one penalty and could have easily been awarded another. 



Power Man said:


> Lol #10 not giving a f... about playing some D at 1:00
> 
> https://youtu.be/XKvlTDMca0U




Yeah, in what minute was that? Who else was between he and the attacking player? Iniesta, who was fresher than Messi didn't track back either and Alba didn't react seriously enough. To actually single out Messi is just stupid. I mean can you imagine if you were a Madrid supporter? What would Ronaldo have done? Can you imagine if he did that in a CL Final against BarÃ§a and they ended up losing? Oh wait...


----------



## Power Man

Love that statue 

Gonna use it as a Ronaldo troll face at the end of the season


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> Plenty of neutrals know it's obvious. As for your take on the bench, still doesn't change the fact that it's not the reason the league table doesn't look different. And yesterday's match does little if anything to prove your point considering the ref's influence and Malaga's performance.




I'm not sure what you're saying, that the refs were somehow responsible that Barca lost vs Malaga?

Aside from the fact that Malaga had a goal disallowed for no reason, Barca should've had a pen on Sergi.
Other than that, I'm not sure what Barca can complain about.

And much like people tried to explain to you on the Verratti example in the PSG game.
Saying Camacho should've been sent off because he made 3 challenges that could've been booked, is not how football - or life - works.
It's logical and safe to assume that he'd have changed his game after the first booking.

I can agree he could've or should've gotten booked at some point, but I assume (as would anyone reasonable) that he wouldn't be committing similar challenges from then on.

...

And the Malaga game is EXACTLY an example of Barca's weak bench costing them points.

Here are their 4 losses this year, Lucho did some rotations:

For AlavÃ©s he started with almost an entire B team (only Rakitic and Neymar from the first choice XI).
Against Celta he started with a midfield of Busquets, Arda, and AndrÃ© Gomes
Against Depor he rested Umtiti and Rakitic (even though the international break was coming up) and put the not-particularly-defensively-minded Jordi Alba on the left of a back three. And he started Gomes.
Against MÃ¡laga he started a midfield of Gomes (him again), Denis and Busquets.

The Iniesta-Rakitic axle was barely ever present in those game, and the other Barca midfields respond horribly to being pressured.
You replace Modric and Kroos with Kovacic and Isco.
You replace Iniesta and Rakitic with Gomes and Denis.

And you're telling me the refs are the difference?
Refs somehow cost Barca points in those 4 losses?

Please.


----------



## Alklha

Barcelona have had zero penalties given against them in games that they have dropped points in this season, and Neymar was the first time they have been reduced to 10 men.

They have failed to score twice in almost 37% of their matches this season, including a third of their games against teams in the bottom half of the table. Compared with Madrid who have failed to score twice in only 20% of their games, and only once to a team outside of the top 6.

But yes, referees... not their inconsistent goalscoring.


----------



## Power Man

Neymar suspended 3 games? 

I think all the talking to the refs added up (and not some conspiracy) 

It should have been 1 game imo I want both teams with all their players for El Clasico


----------



## Corto

Power Man said:


> Neymar suspended 3 games?
> 
> I think all the talking to the refs added up (and not some conspiracy)
> 
> It should have been 1 game imo I want both teams with all their players for El Clasico




2 games.

One for the sending off and one for unsportsmanlike behavior on the way out (sarcastically applauding the ref).

Noone to blame but himself. Both bookings were textbook stuff and he had nothing to complain about.

Same as Bale vs Las Palmas... You can deflect blame and look for scapegoats etc., but ultimately, as they say, a just society rests on the concept of personal responsibility.

Like Bale vs Las Palmas, Neymar has noone to blame but himself.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Corto said:


> 2 games.
> 
> One for the sending off and one for unsportsmanlike behavior on the way out (sarcastically applauding the ref).
> 
> Noone to blame but himself. Both bookings were textbook stuff and he had nothing to complain about.
> 
> Same as Bale vs Las Palmas... You can deflect blame and look for scapegoats etc., but ultimately, as they say, a just society rests on the concept of personal responsibility.
> 
> Like Bale vs Las Palmas, Neymar has noone to blame but himself.




So Neymar is missing the clasico?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> Ronaldo is the same ilk of whiny diver.
> 
> 
> The Gomes play?
> http://lasthl.com/malaga-vs-fc-barcelona-highlights-full-match/2/
> 
> 2.40 on that.
> 
> That's just not a foul dude, it just isn't.
> Even the commentators aren't even mentioning it.




It wasn't shoulder to shoulder and the defender makes contact. IT could've easily been a penalty. Couldn't care less what the commentators were ranting about.




Corto said:


> 2 games.
> 
> One for the sending off and one for unsportsmanlike behavior on the way out (sarcastically applauding the ref).
> 
> Noone to blame but himself. Both bookings were textbook stuff and he had nothing to complain about.
> 
> Same as Bale vs Las Palmas... You can deflect blame and look for scapegoats etc., but ultimately, as they say, a just society rests on the concept of personal responsibility.
> 
> Like Bale vs Las Palmas, Neymar has noone to blame but himself.




Sarcastically, clapping and getting a game is BS. it happens all the time and players receive at most yellow. To get a game is absurd. 

There's quite a difference in how Bale acted and how Ney did. Not that it matters as win, lose or Draw barca won't get the league.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

"Ney" 

That's a worse nickname then Giroux's "G"


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Alklha said:


> Barcelona have had zero penalties given against them in games that they have dropped points in this season, and Neymar was the first time they have been reduced to 10 men.
> 
> They have failed to score twice in almost 37% of their matches this season, including a third of their games against teams in the bottom half of the table. Compared with Madrid who have failed to score twice in only 20% of their games, and only once to a team outside of the top 6.
> 
> But yes, referees... not their inconsistent goalscoring.




Not a single person here has claimed the refs are the reason barca won't/not winning the league. 



Scandale du Jour said:


> "Ney"
> 
> That's a worse nickname then Giroux's "H"




It's not a really a nickname... I was just lazy. Still better than CR7.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not a single person here has claimed the refs are the reason barca won't/not winning the league.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not a really a nickname... I was just lazy. Still better than CR7.




The Welsh Samurai Warrior = best nickname ever.

Lamest haircut though.


----------



## Alklha

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not a single person here has claimed the refs are the reason barca won't/not winning the league.




Sure looked like that was what les Habs was doing in his last couple of posts.


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> I'm not sure what you're saying, that the refs were somehow responsible that Barca lost vs Malaga?
> 
> Aside from the fact that Malaga had a goal disallowed for no reason, Barca should've had a pen on Sergi.
> Other than that, I'm not sure what Barca can complain about.




Clearly you're not sure what I'm saying since I didn't say that. In fact if you go back to my initial post after the match I clearly said "can't say the refs cost us the points." 

Wrong, again. Malaga should have had players sent off as well and as has already been discussed BarÃ§a could have had another penalty.



> And much like people tried to explain to you on the Verratti example in the PSG game.
> Saying Camacho should've been sent off because he made 3 challenges that could've been booked, is not how football - or life - works.
> It's logical and safe to assume that he'd have changed his game after the first booking.
> 
> I can agree he could've or should've gotten booked at some point, but I assume (as would anyone reasonable) that he wouldn't be committing similar challenges from then on.




That is how football works. You get two yellow cards in the same match you get sent off. He committed multiple bookable offenses and additionally should have been booked for persistent fouling. 

It's every bit as logical and safe to assume that he'd have not changed his game after his first booking.



> And the Malaga game is EXACTLY an example of Barca's weak bench costing them points.




To a degree, but not entirely. Other factors contributed as I've already noted.



> Here are their 4 losses this year, Lucho did some rotations:
> 
> For AlavÃ©s he started with almost an entire B team (only Rakitic and Neymar from the first choice XI).
> Against Celta he started with a midfield of Busquets, Arda, and AndrÃ© Gomes
> Against Depor he rested Umtiti and Rakitic (even though the international break was coming up) and put the not-particularly-defensively-minded Jordi Alba on the left of a back three. And he started Gomes.
> Against MÃ¡laga he started a midfield of Gomes (him again), Denis and Busquets.
> 
> The Iniesta-Rakitic axle was barely ever present in those game, and the other Barca midfields respond horribly to being pressured.
> You replace Modric and Kroos with Kovacic and Isco.
> You replace Iniesta and Rakitic with Gomes and Denis.
> 
> And you're telling me the refs are the difference?
> Refs somehow cost Barca points in those 4 losses?
> 
> Please.




Before March alone BarÃ§a lost six points due to the refs. That doesn't even include the Betis match. Madrid at the same time have gained at least six points (and that's a conservative figure). Do the math. So yeah, the refs are the difference. It's shades of 2011-12 and other seasons all over again. Hilarious you actually cited the Celta match and then asked the question. Please indeed.


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It wasn't shoulder to shoulder and the defender makes contact. IT could've easily been a penalty. Couldn't care less what the commentators were ranting about.




Look, if you think that's a penalty (or a foul, on any part of the pitch), I don't know what to tell you.
Except as a guy who played high tier youth football, reffed it and been playing and around football my whole life - it just isn't a foul.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not a single person here has claimed the refs are the reason barca won't/not winning the league.




As pointed out, les habs literally said just that.



> Sarcastically, clapping and getting a game is BS. it happens all the time and players receive at most yellow. To get a game is absurd.




Much like with Messi getting 4 games in WC qualifying, I very much approve of the suspension.
I hope it happens regularly and across all competitions. Regardless of the player involved. Messi, Neymar, Cristiano, Pogba, Diego Costa, Robben, Bonucci,... Anyone.
I hope cheaters and divers get suspended retroactively and disrespecting the refs (crowding, swearing, getting into his face, etc.) is an automatic yellow and if harsher words are said, a straight red card.

Football has become a game of corrupt officials, biased refs and cheating players.
For every fantastic goal you see, you'll see 4 dives, 3 guys faking injuries and rolling on the ground and 3 dodgy ref decisions. And people crowding that same ref 10 times per game.

Bringing in replays for select plays, banning dives and faking injuries retroactively and suspending people disrespecting the ref is the only way to get some respect back into the game.

...

The link below is to some examples of rugby refs.
A game where people with very little protective gear absolutely maul each other.
And a game where players respect each other and the ref, and the ref respects them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43AdWFSXhgs

Wouldn't football be a better game if we had respect in the game like this?


----------



## les Habs

Let me be clear here. There is no "sure looked like" that was what I was saying. That absolutely IS what I am saying because that's exactly how it is.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> That is how football works. You get two yellow cards in the same match you get sent off. He committed multiple bookable offenses and additionally should have been booked for persistent fouling.
> 
> It's every bit as logical and safe to assume that he'd have not changed his game after his first booking.




Well, if you think a player already on a yellow card would be committing to challenges as hard as a when he's not on a yellow card, I don't really know what to tell you.
It's reasonable to assume any player is wary of getting a second yellow card.

(FWIW, Camacho should've been booked at some point, yes... But again... That changes his game)

So again, if you're saying Camacho (or Verratti in the PSG) game, would continue to make challenges with the same intensity had they been booked before...
That's just flawed logic.

I have no idea how anyone can't see that. It's common sense.
I mean, anyone who's played any sort of competitive football will have that in his head every time you're going into a challenge.
"I've already been booked" changes the way you go into challenges.

Same way if you get a parking ticket in life, or a speeding ticket, a reasonable person will be wary of it and try to avoid doing it again...



> Before March alone BarÃ§a lost six points due to the refs. That doesn't even include the Betis match. Madrid at the same time have gained at least six points (and that's a conservative figure). Do the math. So yeah, the refs are the difference. It's shades of 2011-12 and other seasons all over again. Hilarious you actually cited the Celta match and then asked the question. Please indeed.




Well, okay then.

I actually applaud your lack of any self criticism. Or criticism towards Barcelona, that is. 
It takes some serious effort.

And at least D2M can now see that, yes, there are people (I'm gonna say only Barca fans) who think Barca are behind in La Liga only because of the refs.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

After every Barca game les Habs claims that an opposing player should have been sent off. Everytime he watches a Real game, he claims one of our guys should have been sent off.

I mean...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> Much like with Messi getting 4 games in WC qualifying, I very much approve of the suspension.
> I hope it happens regularly and across all competitions. Regardless of the player involved. Messi, Neymar, Cristiano, Pogba, Diego Costa, Robben, Bonucci,... Anyone.
> I hope cheaters and divers get suspended retroactively and disrespecting the refs (crowding, swearing, getting into his face, etc.) is an automatic yellow and if harsher words are said, a straight red card.




Much like the Neymar you'd be wrong. Others have done worse than what Messi did and got similar bans. To give it hours before a crucial qualifier is a ****ing joke. Especially, how Fifa got its evidence and the ref himself didn't complain. 

Messi didn't scream to the refs face, even if he did say it out loud out of frustration. The mere thought that swearing costs you 4 games and maybe a WC is absurd. They're not kids out there.


I'll concede about Les Habs...Shoulda read his posts more carefully. I disagree with that thinking.


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> Well, if you think a player already on a yellow card would be committing to challenges as hard as a when he's not on a yellow card, I don't really know what to tell you.
> It's reasonable to assume any player is wary of getting a second yellow card.




A great example of something you could reply "no **** Sherlock" to, though considering you actually posted that perhaps "no **** Watson" would be more apt. 



> (FWIW, Camacho should've been booked at some point, yes... But again... That changes his game)




It's also just as reasonable to assume that players in plenty of instances don't change their games or don't change them enough. Camacho's match performance looked like a glaring example of this. 

Furthermore though what you're failing to bring the table here is that the advantage the player has been getting by not getting carded, which was perfectly illustrated by Camacho all match long in this instance, is no longer there and the game opens up for the other team. Today's match against Juventus was a prime example with Dani Alves. He committed about four fouls, all challenges from behind and nearly all deep in BarÃ§a's half to stifle breaks that had barely even formed. The ref booked him on the fourth foul, perhaps a foul too late but that's beside the point, and right there it stopped. Camacho should have been carded by the 45th minute at the latest, yet was never carded when he should have been multiple times on the way to committing something like eight fouls.



> So again, if you're saying Camacho (or Verratti in the PSG) game, would continue to make challenges with the same intensity had they been booked before...
> That's just flawed logic.




No, that's reality. It happens. Hilarious you keep bringing up Verratti when you consider the actual challenge he made late on. Still even more hilarious considering the first leg in Paris when Rabiot should have been sent off in the last ten minutes or so for a second yellow card when he was already on one. 



> I have no idea how anyone can't see that. It's common sense.
> I mean, anyone who's played any sort of competitive football will have that in his head every time you're going into a challenge.
> "I've already been booked" changes the way you go into challenges.
> 
> Same way if you get a parking ticket in life, or a speeding ticket, a reasonable person will be wary of it and try to avoid doing it again...




I don't know whether to laugh or face palm. The fact that you've actually made my reply into some sort of black and white take from me and yet apply the same "logic" conversely is mind boggling. Considering your posts on the matter and especially what I'm about to quote below, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.



> Well, okay then.
> 
> I actually applaud your lack of any self criticism. Or criticism towards Barcelona, that is.
> It takes some serious effort.
> 
> And at least D2M can now see that, yes, there are people (I'm gonna say only Barca fans) who think Barca are behind in La Liga only because of the refs.




Well OK then indeed.

I actually applaud your lack of common sense and failure to actually come up with a reasonable reply to this or anything else we've discussed here. I've very clearly outlined, multiple times, that BarÃ§a deserve criticism. From management at various levels and to the players themselves. I don't give players free passes, any of them, including Messi. I will admit the ones I don't like get an extra dose of vitriol when they don't perform, but that's generally because I never wanted them in the team in the first place and they usually end up not working out. To the point though, as I noted to a Madridista co-worker a few weeks ago, even if we were to win the league it wouldn't be a league I'd be celebrating too much if at all. That's not because the refs will have taken us there, at least not likely at this stage all things considered, but simply because it won't have been an impressive league win in terms of performances. Sure there have been some amazing ones, but I've seen better out of this team and unlike most supporters I don't celebrate a win for a win's sake. I watch to be entertained. Same were I Madrid supporter. This season's league performance isn't one I'd celebrate were Madrid to win. Back to the point though, regardless of what one can criticize BarÃ§a for, or any team for that matter, if they do enough to win a match or title and don't because of the refs then they lost it first and foremost because of the refs. Simple as that.

Additionally though I also call it when BarÃ§a get calls and I already noted as such with regards to the Malaga match. I do so with every match I comment on as well. It's there for all to see assuming A) you actually read it and B) you can actually comprehend it. Take today's match for example. Juve's fourth clearly wasn't offisde and therefore should have stood. Whether players stopped playing I would say is open for discussion and worthy of consideration, but the player wasn't offside. That ref made other mistakes and there was actually a similarity between that match and the Malaga match as regards cards, but for me it was a night and day difference in refereeing. Anyway, point is that I call them both ways and do so consistently. More so than the vast majority on this forum (I won't even comment on this thread individually) and I don't wait until prompted. 



Scandale du Jour said:


> After every Barca game les Habs claims that an opposing player should have been sent off. Everytime he watches a Real game, he claims one of our guys should have been sent off.
> 
> I mean...




I mean, Asbestos? Really? You can't write this ****. So much context there.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> It's also just as reasonable to assume that players in plenty of instances don't change their games or don't change them enough. Camacho's match performance looked like a glaring example of this.




Yes, there are players who make reckless challenges even when on a yellow. Those players get sent off... And the number of those players, the number of booked players getting their 2nd yellow in a game, is what... 5%? 10%?

So, again, using statistics, and common sense, it's reasonable to assume a player on a yellow card changes his game and lets up.
(yes, give us another "no s**t, Sherlock" comment - because you're the one that doesn't seem to take it into account)

I think it's pretty funny you're using Trump as an example of something when you seem to lack the basics of what makes an argument based in logic.

*You cannot, by default, make an argument that "Camacho's match performance looked like a glaring example" because he never got booked.*

For your argument to make any sense at all, Camacho would've had to have been booked - and THEN continued to make borderline challenges.

Your example, in fact, is the precisely the point _I'm trying to make._
Your example, in its core, cannot be used as an argument for the point you're trying to make - *because he never got booked.*

How can you not see that?


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> Yes, there are players who make reckless challenges even when on a yellow. Those players get sent off... And the number of those players, the number of booked players getting their 2nd yellow in a game, is what... 5%? 10%?
> 
> So, again, using statistics, and common sense, it's reasonable to assume a player on a yellow card changes his game and lets up.
> (yes, give us another "no s**t, Sherlock" comment - because you're the one that doesn't seem to take it into account)
> 
> I think it's pretty funny you're using Trump as an example of something when you seem to lack the basics of what makes an argument based in logic.
> 
> *You cannot, by default, make an argument that "Camacho's match performance looked like a glaring example" because he never got booked.*
> 
> For your argument to make any sense at all, Camacho would've had to have been booked - and THEN continued to make borderline challenges.
> 
> Your example, in fact, is the precisely the point _I'm trying to make._
> Your example, in its core, cannot be used as an argument for the point you're trying to make - *because he never got booked.*
> 
> How can you not see that?






I absolutely can make the argument that Camacho's match performance was a glaring example because he'd already been spoken to by the ref and still didn't let up. That's obvious if you look at the types of fouls he was making. Based on your commentary I suspect you didn't see a single foul he made so I can see where the rest of it escaped you. On top of that, again, when the ref actually does his job and say the player does start to play differently, that has a positive effect for the other team.

Everything I've posted is not only based in logic, it's also based in fact. The problem with your argument is that it's all black and white, one way or the other. Of course there's the fact that you cherry-pick your points and ignore everything else. Just like the fact that I didn't mention Trump. As for me, what you say I didn't take into account, I absolutely did. The entire time, just as with every performance, I take it into account. The difference here is that you don't take anything else into account.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> *I absolutely can make the argument that Camacho's match performance was a glaring example because he'd already been spoken to by the ref and still didn't let up.* That's obvious if you look at the types of fouls he was making. Based on your commentary I suspect you didn't see a single foul he made so I can see where the rest of it escaped you. On top of that, again, when the ref actually does his job and say the player does start to play differently, that has a positive effect for the other team.




*He. Never. Got. Booked.*

You are arguing that a certain player didn't change his game after getting booked in a game where he didn't get booked.
I mean...

A "warning", a "talking to"... means very little.
A booking changes your mindset in how you go into challenges. A "talking to" means you're just likely to get booked at some point - but not sent off and crippling to your team.

I don't know if you ever played any competitive football.
I have, I'm some other guys here have, at least on youth level.

A booking goes into your head and changes your game. Much like the lines on the pitch do.
You don't make the same challenges inside the box as you do outside the box.

There's a reason why guys like Gattuso ot Torricelli got loads and loads of yellow cards in their careers, but only got sent off a handful of times.

You play one way before the booking, but you let up after it. It's just what you have to do unless you want to hurt your team.

...

Like Dani Alves last night, for example.
He was riding Neymar every time - until he got booked at something like 27 minutes.
After that, he was much more careful and barely committed a foul.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Yes, les Habs, as ridiculous as it sounds (and it does sound very ridiculous), there is a town in Quebec called "Asbestos" and I (un)fortunately grew up there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asbestos,_Quebec

That being said, I would have a question for you... do you consider Suarez should have been booked for his awful dive against PSG? You know, the dive that led to that penalty...


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> *He. Never. Got. Booked.*
> 
> You are arguing that a certain player didn't change his game after getting booked in a game where he didn't get booked.
> I mean...
> 
> A "warning", a "talking to"... means very little.
> A booking changes your mindset in how you go into challenges. A "talking to" means you're just likely to get booked at some point - but not sent off and crippling to your team.
> 
> I don't know if you ever played any competitive football.
> I have, I'm some other guys here have, at least on youth level.
> 
> A booking goes into your head and changes your game. Much like the lines on the pitch do.
> You don't make the same challenges inside the box as you do outside the box.
> 
> There's a reason why guys like Gattuso ot Torricelli got loads and loads of yellow cards in their careers, but only got sent off a handful of times.
> 
> You play one way before the booking, but you let up after it. It's just what you have to do unless you want to hurt your team.
> 
> ...
> 
> Like Dani Alves last night, for example.
> He was riding Neymar every time - until he got booked at something like 27 minutes.
> After that, he was much more careful and barely committed a foul.




You can keep repeating yourself, ignoring the facts that I've stated, but it doesn't matter. It still doesn't matter nor does it address that the fact that had he simply been booked he wouldn't have got away with all the fouls he did where he stopped attacking plays. It also doesn't allow for the possibility that he could have still been sent off. I get it, if a player's on a yellow he won't get sent off unless he's Neymar.

I have not remotely argued that a player didn't change his game after getting booked in a game where he didn't get booked. As is already painfully obvious, you don't read well, but still quote where I've said that he got booked. I won't hold my breath.



Scandale du Jour said:


> Yes, les Habs, as ridiculous as it sounds (and it does sound very ridiculous), there is a town in Quebec called "Asbestos" and I (un)fortunately grew up there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asbestos,_Quebec
> 
> That being said, I would have a question for you... do you consider Suarez should have been booked for his awful dive against PSG? You know, the dive that led to that penalty...




I don't think it's ridiculous to have a town called Asbestos and that wasn't what I said. That would be like replying to your post and saying something like "Ney". I said it didn't surprise me that you hailed form a town of that name considering your post (and the vast majority of posts).

Clear foul, clear penalty. Refs definitely did us a bunch of favors in that match as I've already noted.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> I have not remotely argued that a player didn't change his game after getting booked in a game where he didn't get booked. As is already painfully obvious, you don't read well, but still quote where I've said that he got booked. I won't hold my breath.




Okay then, now we're getting somewhere.

So, what you're saying now, like me, is that Camacho would've likely changed his game had he gotten booked at some point?

Or do you think Dani Alves lets up after a booking, like thousands of other players playing high and low level football, but Camacho would be the one guy continuing with borderline challenges?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Les Habs, you complain about the refs every ****ing game. That was my point.


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> Okay then, now we're getting somewhere.
> 
> So, what you're saying now, like me, is that Camacho would've likely changed his game had he gotten booked at some point?
> 
> Or do you think Dani Alves lets up after a booking, like thousands of other players playing high and low level football, but Camacho would be the one guy continuing with borderline challenges?




Yeah, we are getting somewhere. You said that I said something that I clearly did not say and I corrected you, again.

No, that's not remotely what I'm saying. 

Camacho very clearly could have continued with borderline challenges. If you actually watch the match and pay attention to such things you'd see it. And speaking of players never getting a second yellow, looks like Javi Martinez set a record in doing so today. 



Scandale du Jour said:


> Les Habs, you complain about the refs every ****ing game. That was my point.




Your point and your post are two different things. You clearly misrepresented my posts. 

As for my complaining about the refs, no, but just about. When you see your team get shafted by the refs over and over again you say something.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> Camacho very clearly could have continued with borderline challenges. If you actually watch the match and pay attention to such things you'd see it.




I saw the match, I watch most Barca matches - out of a point of view of a football fan who loves quality football, not a Barca fan looking through Barca-coloured glasses.




> Camacho very clearly could have continued with borderline challenges.




Based on what?

Seriously, based on what?

You're saying it's expected players let up after a booking (citing the Dani Alves example, as did I)... Except in case of Camacho?
Or Verratti? Because they were playing Barca, or what?

The dude (Camacho) has been booked 12 times this season. Sent off? Zero.

In fact, in 196 professional matches, he's been booked 61 times and sent off... Twice.
To me, those are exactly the stats of a guy who plays on the edge, will get a booking every 2 games, but is smart enough to let up after that booking, stay on the pitch, and not hurt his team.

So yeah... Based on what, exactly? Based on what would Camacho continue the borderline challenges?


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> I saw the match, I watch most Barca matches - out of a point of view of a football fan who loves quality football, not a Barca fan looking through Barca-coloured glasses.




Well then we actually have something in common.



> Based on what?
> 
> Seriously, based on what?
> 
> The dude has been booked 12 times this season. Sent off? Zero.
> 
> In fact, in 196 professional matches, he's been booked 61 times and sent off... Twice.
> 
> So yeah... Based on what, exactly?




Based on the match you supposedly watched and the evidence of his challenges in front of you. Again, whether he would have been sent off or not, he and Malaga still benefitted by the fact that he wasn't even booked when he should have been about four times.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> Well then we actually have something in common.
> 
> 
> 
> Based on the match you supposedly watched and the evidence of his challenges in front of you. *Again, whether he would have been sent off or not, he and Malaga still benefitted by the fact that he wasn't even booked when he should have been about four times.*




I agree on that, but that's not the same as saying he should've been sent off.

Yes, Camacho playing more aggressive would be undoable for him if he were on a yellow card (as he should've been, at some point).
And yes, I agree that Malaga certainly loses a bit of edge if he's booked and has to think twice about challenges and potentially letting his team down with a red.

But that's entirely different as saying he should've been sent off, or that he would've continued his aggressive play had he gotten booked - based on no evidence whatsoever - in fact, based on his career, it's REALLY safe to assume he does let up after getting booked.


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> I agree on that, but that's not the same as saying he should've been sent off.
> 
> Yes, Camacho playing more aggressive would be undoable for him if he were on a yellow card (as he should've been, at some point).
> And yes, I agree that Malaga certainly loses a bit of edge if he's booked and has to think twice about challenges and potentially letting his team down with a red.
> 
> But that's entirely different as saying he should've been sent off, or that he would've continued his aggressive play had he gotten booked - based on no evidence whatsoever - in fact, based on his career, it's REALLY safe to assume he does let up after getting booked.




It's not the same and I didn't say it was, but the fact remains he still should have been sent off. When you make at least two bookable offenses in a match, you should be booked twice and thus sent off. He made about four and thus should have been sent off.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> It's not the same and I didn't say it was, but the fact remains he still should have been sent off. When you make at least two bookable offenses in a match, you should be booked twice and thus sent off. He made about four and thus should have been sent off.




Holy *****.

And after we made some progress with the Dani Alves analogy, we're back to square one, you insisting a player would continue the same challenges after a booking.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Oh ****... down 1-0 after 15. Come on B Squad...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Iscooooooo what a goal!


----------



## Power Man

Classic Madrid **** start after a big UCL win


----------



## Scandale du Jour

B team is ****ing up...


----------



## Power Man

B team is bad lol


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> B team is bad lol




Ramos will save the day.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Alvarooooooo! Day semi-saved.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Ramos will save the day.




Nice jinx he almost ****ed up


----------



## Power Man

Morata lets go


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Nice jinx he almost ****ed up




Nacho saved his ass.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Isco is such a treat to watch.


----------



## Power Man

Yeah Isco is staying and James is leaving


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Yeah Isco is staying and James is leaving




James is ****ing invisible


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Yeah Isco is staying and James is leaving




It might not be up to Madrid though. I think both will leave... well they should anyway.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It might not be up to Madrid though. I think both will leave... well they should anyway.




Yeah we have too many AMs


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Putting on a DM when you need a goal?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Hand ball dammit!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Hand ball dammit!




It wasn't a penalty.

**** off Isco


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Issssssscooooooooo!!!!!!!! Man of the match by far. What a performance by Isco!


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It wasn't a penalty.
> 
> **** off Isco




He heard you


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It wasn't a penalty.
> 
> **** off Isco




Hand in a natural position close to his body, I tend to agree with you.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> He heard you




It was after the goal lol. 

Madrid snatching wins in the jaws of defeats/draws all season. This should seal it.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It was after the goal lol.
> 
> Madrid snatching wins in the jaws of defeats/draws all season. This should seal it.




For me it's not over tbh


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> For me it's not over tbh




We need points in the Clasico and it'll be over.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> For me it's not over tbh




I could see why you think that considering you guys don't play up to your potential but you guys are finding ways to win while Lucho finds new ways to lose. That's the difference between these 2 teams.

The good thing is summer will bring on a lot of changes.


----------



## Corto

Well, I think this game makes Real's decision that much easier both for the summer and for the Bayern game.

Let James go, keep Isco and get him more playing time.

And start Isco in Bale's place (with slight positional adjustments) vs Bayern, as Bale's out.

He's in fantastic form.

...

Now a quick interlude with Soton-ManCity, then on to Barca-Sociedad.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> Well, I think this game makes Real's decision that much easier both for the summer and for the Bayern game.
> 
> Let James go, keep Isco and get him more playing time.
> 
> And start Isco in Bale's place (with slight positional adjustments) vs Bayern, as Bale's out.
> 
> He's in fantastic form.
> 
> ...
> 
> Now a quick interlude with Soton-ManCity, then on to Barca-Sociedad.




The decision should've been easy to begin with but his coaches are morons. Now it's up to whether he wants to leave or not.


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> The decision should've been easy to begin with but his coaches are morons. Now it's up to whether he wants to leave or not.




Agreed, Isco has been carrying the "B team" for quite a few games now.
Well, him, Kovacic and Morata - but Isco has been the man.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> The decision should've been easy to begin with but his coaches are morons. Now it's up to whether he wants to leave or not.




Isco had to earn his place

He used to hold onto the ball for the too long and didn't always played hard defensively. 

He has clearly made adjustments and has been great.

So I would say his coaches aren't morons


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Isco had to earn his place
> 
> He used to hold onto the ball for the too long and didn't always played hard defensively.
> 
> He has clearly made adjustments and has been great.
> 
> So I would say his coaches aren't morons




Nah, his coaches are morons. He's not without his flaws like any other player but there;s no way a guy like Kroos should have over 500 more minutes than him.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Nah, his coaches are morons. He's not without his flaws like any other player but there;s no way a guy like Kroos should have over 500 more minutes than him.



Kroos decision making is just better (an aspect Isco has improved on)

It's not always about talent


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Kroos decision making is just better (an aspect Isco has improved on)
> 
> It's not always about talent




You've complained about Kroos soft defence for awhile now...he's not without his warts. Combine that with Modric being a walking injury, the amount of games Madrid play, there should be ample minutes to satisfy Isco but he was neglected over lesser players. 

You also have to take in context the minutes he's played, the mid week game against Munich the game 1-1 and you put on Asensio. With the pressure mounting and Real up a man but still not finding a winner until the 77th minute, Isco was stapled to the bench. ZZ makes his 2nd sub in the 83 minute James comes on. 

He plays today against the bottom feeder and single handedly wins you the match.

You think that's not lost on Isco?


----------



## Power Man

Oh yeah I still maintain that Kroos is soft defensively 

That is why I hate it when he is playing DM

But as an AM he is fantastic


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Just LOL at barca's defence.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

What is defence


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> Holy *****.
> 
> And after we made some progress with the Dani Alves analogy, we're back to square one, you insisting a player would continue the same challenges after a booking.




Well we are indeed back to square one as once again, for probably the tenth time in a week, you have completely misrepresented and lied about what I said. 

How about that Javi Martinez example? Oh yeah, you're not talking about that one.


----------



## Savi

Isco is amazing

That run at 1:10


----------



## Power Man

Yeah 1:10 could have been up for GOTY


----------



## John Pedro

Sooo, Ganso who has been in Sampaoli's doghouse all year finally is given a shot in the starting11 against Granada and he scored both Sevilla goals. 

His last game was January 4, against Real Madrid.


----------



## les Habs

John Pedro said:


> Sooo, Ganso who has been in Sampaoli's doghouse all year finally is given a shot in the starting11 against Granada and he scored both Sevilla goals.
> 
> His last game was January 4, against Real Madrid.




As much as I thought it was a good signing this past Summer, I have to admit that I completely forgot he was even there.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Tomorrow is the last trophy Barca could win. Let's hope Lucho doesn't **** this up.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Don't have my hopes high for today's game. Just a good show and hopefully a win.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronaldo - Benzema - Bale
Kroos - Casemiro - Modric
Marcelo - Nacho - Ramos - Carvajal
Navas

I am Bale's biggest fan, but I would have started Isco.


----------



## Power Man

Yup I would have preferred Isco as well.

Last year Barca was the favorite and we won on the road, this year we are favorites so Barca could beat us


----------



## les Habs

Madrid will win.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Nice try Cristiano, but no foul there.


----------



## les Habs

I thought it was a penalty, but Ronaldo embellished. Would have to see replay again.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Why u no pass Cristiano?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Casemiro already should off. What a ridiculous challenge. ****ing butcher.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Casemiro already should off. What a ridiculous challenge. ****ing butcher.




Stop crying. He got the yellow he deserved.

Come on Benz...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Messi bleeding.


----------



## Tony Romo

That looked intentional tbh


----------



## Scandale du Jour

If Ronaldo lets the ball go.to Bale, it is 1-0...


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

Great match so far.


----------



## Power Man

Bale is utter ****

Where is Isco


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Bale is utter ****
> 
> Where is Isco




Speaking of ****, how many chances can Benzema waste?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Casemiro!!!!!!!!!! D2M will be uber pissed


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Stop crying. He got the yellow he deserved.
> 
> Come on Benz...




right from the back along with 2 fouls prior that got not called. This guy is only good because the refs allow him to be. Shameful stuff that he's on.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> right from the back along with 2 fouls prior that got not called. This guy is only good because the refs allow him to be. Shameful stuff that he's on.




He could easily have been sent off for the one he just commited. He gotta calm down.


----------



## Power Man

God Omar Da Fonseca is so ********

Replay clearly showing Ramos is onside but he says that he isn't

EVILO


----------



## Adonis Creed

Onsidee goal 
Casemiro should be on a yellow. No red yet

Neutral point of view.

Marcelo elbow was nothing.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Why u let him go through? Foul his ass before he gets to the box...


----------



## Tony Romo

So good. Wow


----------



## Power Man

Great goal by Barcelona wow


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Gareth missing the mark by a mile on every cross and every shot...


----------



## Evilo

Power Man said:


> God Omar Da Fonseca is so ********
> 
> Replay clearly showing Ramos is onside but he says that he isn't
> 
> EVILO




Yeah, no offside. But I can understand his doubts before the replay. After it however, no.


----------



## Power Man

Lol Bale
Lol sprinter


----------



## Adonis Creed

Great goal by Messi...

shouldnt he be off the pitch...got blood all over his face lol!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> He could easily have been sent off for the one he just commited. He gotta calm down.




No one need he'll never get sent off... apparently.



King J0ffrey said:


> Onsidee goal
> Casemiro should be on a yellow. No red yet
> 
> Neutral point of view.
> 
> Marcelo elbow was nothing.




Thought you had better things to do?



Power Man said:


> Great goal by Barcelona wow




Who scored?



Scandale du Jour said:


> Gareth missing the mark by a mile on every cross and every shot...




He's been terrible. Isco must be laughing his ass off.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Great save on a great shot. 

Bale hurt...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

I'd sell my mom to have Messi's ball control


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio and not Isco? Y Zizou?


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Was bale injured a lot when he played for spurs?


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Asensio and not Isco? Y Zizou?




Even Asensio has been better than Bale

And thats his natural position


----------



## Adonis Creed

Usuallly i dont enjoy classico, this 1 been great. 

No mob around refs yet etc...!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Even Asensio has been better than Bale
> 
> And thats his natural position




Asensio is great, I love him. Isco is better though. Well, at this stage of their respective careers anyway.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Casemiro...


----------



## Tony Romo

Lol casemiro


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Very fun half of football. Real started strong, but overall Barca has been the better side. Casemiro is lucky to still be on the pitch.


----------



## Adonis Creed

no need for 8 refs.

Casemiro should be off....this will get ugly now


----------



## Power Man

Lmao Navas


----------



## Power Man

Casemiro is very lucky


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Damn messi....


----------



## Savi

I have no clue what Casemiro has to do to get a second yellow


----------



## Corto

Zidane needs to take Casemiro off at half-time, dude's gonna get a 2nd yellow if he stays on - he just is; it's what happens when you mark Messi like that and think you're the one guy in the world that can do it... And you can't.

Fantastic goal by Messi, decent reffing (possible pen vs Ronaldo, possible 2nd yellow on Casemiro... but neither is what I'd call a mistake, just that you couldn't blame him if he called that stuff).

Other than Messi, everyone else is "okay" I guess.
Their usual selfs, high level of football, but sort of canceling each other out.
(well, I say okay, Ramos and Kroos had some shocking passes at the back at one point)

And oh, Real needs a new keeper. Little Navas is useless at set pieces, and he's not exactly a world beater at reading plays either.


----------



## Evilo

Ronaldo pen? Tough to say even with a replay.
Casemiro red? No need for a replay. Ref mistake.

Also mistakes on corner kicks.


----------



## Corto

Evilo said:


> Ronaldo pen? Tough to say even with a replay.
> Casemiro red? No need for a replay. Ref mistake.
> 
> Also mistakes on corner kicks.




It's really not hard to say on the Umtiti tackle. He didn't see Ronaldo, he went for the ball, missed it, caught Ronaldo.
Ronaldo being Ronaldo doesn't get the call (Neymar and Suarez go through the same sometimes, the "boy who cried wolf" syndrom).
But I've seen those given almost every single time something similar happens.

..

Casemiro is lucky to be on, yeah.

...

Mistakes on corner kicks...? I mean, what about them? They happen, seen 5 different ones today in the Arsenal-ManCity game, corners or throw ins.

...

I wonder if video replays will root out people crowding the ref and whining about calls.


----------



## Power Man

Evilo said:


> Ronaldo pen? Tough to say even with a replay.




I don't think it was a penalty tbh


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronaldo was alllll alone. Come on Marco.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

ter Stegen is just wow.


----------



## Power Man

Stegen is amazing today


----------



## Adonis Creed

Biscuit with his diving antics...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

That wasn't a foul, but I guess Casemiro has lost the benefit od doubt...


----------



## Power Man

Lol that wasn't a foul


----------



## Power Man

Lmao Rakitic doesn't want to talk to Enrique


----------



## Power Man

Carvajal dmmit shoot


----------



## Power Man

Modric and Kroos are meh today

Isco pls


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Shoot Marco


----------



## Scandale du Jour

What a spectacular game


----------



## Power Man

Omg Ronaldo lmao


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Kovacic and not Isco...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And this is the sound of Real choking the league away.


----------



## Power Man

Wow RALPHAkitic


----------



## Adonis Creed

just awful by kroos....lazy lazy defending there


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Wow RALPHAkitic




4 guys around him, no one blocks the shot.


----------



## Power Man

Lol softi kroos as a DM


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Rakiticcccc


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Deserved straight red. And we are done folks.


----------



## Power Man

Deserved red for Ramos tbh


----------



## Adonis Creed

was a yellow....pansy league...barely touched him lol


----------



## Scandale du Jour

King J0ffrey said:


> was a yellow....pansy league




Both feet off the ground, not close to the ball, to prevent a counter. Straight red.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

As clear as it can get

Dumb stuff from Sergio


----------



## Adonis Creed

Scandale du Jour said:


> Both feet off the ground, not close to the ball, to prevent a counter. Straight red.




Maybe, refs lost control before when Biscuit faked and Casemiro not off before...

Dont mind a red...stupid tackle anyway...


----------



## Power Man

Anyone but Pique


----------



## Scandale du Jour

James and no Isco. Are you drunk Zizou?


----------



## Power Man

Hamez?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Isco to send his transfer request after the game.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Neymar got 3 games for clapping we'll what Ramos gets?


----------



## Adonis Creed

Messi dived right into that tackle....I wish ref would give card for the intent...so player could stay on theyre feet instead of semi-diving


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Today will be remembered as the day the league was.lost.


----------



## Power Man

Lol Isco must be like what do I have to do?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Scandale du Jour said:


> Today will be remembered as the day the league was.lost.




#reversejinxftw

James!


----------



## Adonis Creed

great goal by James....Marcelo is incredible


----------



## Power Man

Ok not a bad sub after all


----------



## Scandale du Jour

If Ronaldo lets.it go to James, he scores.


----------



## Power Man

It's a game of ifs


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronnie missed sooooo many chances today.


----------



## Power Man

Ronaldo has been utter crap lol


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Why push so hard? Why the ****? All we needed was a point... stupid stupid gamble.


----------



## spintheblackcircle

A Real Madrid surrender cobra!


----------



## Power Man

Lmao what a game


----------



## Adonis Creed

stupendous defense by both sides lollll

wtf was that


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Lmao what a game




What a game indeed. I wish I was a neutral right now though 

League status: choked


----------



## Evilo

Where's the idiot of the other day with his Ronaldo lollipop?


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

GOAT right there


----------



## Power Man

Man I'm not even mad

Great game


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Man I'm not even mad
> 
> Great game




I am more sad than mad. Awesome football game indeed.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Messi

He doesn't score in big games.

Where was Ronaldo today? Missi sitters.

Eat it Madrid. With all the BS reffing still couldn't save your ass today.


----------



## HajdukSplit

What the hell were Real doing that final minute, pushing so many players forward when draw was ok and then not fouling Messi in the build up to the goal


----------



## Corto

What a game.

Considering everything, ref did fine. Straight red for Ramos was fine.

Some crappy defending on both sides (as usual lol), Kroos on Rakitic and Busquets watching the ball on the James goal. 
And no idea why Real felt it was wise to press with 5 people a man down with a minute to go lol... Stuff like that makes me think Juve has one hand on the CL.

Messi GOATastic again. 

(Ronaldo was utter **** lol)


----------



## Power Man

Lmao ball watching and not taking a foul on that counter

We were weak defensively on those last 2 goals


----------



## les Habs

League is still over. Refs made sure of that a long time ago. Or was it the benches?



Evilo said:


> Where's the idiot of the other day with his Ronaldo lollipop?




A LOT of Ronaldo lollipops on this forum.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> What a game.
> 
> Considering everything, ref did fine. Straight red for Ramos was fine.
> 
> Some crappy defending on both sides (as usual lol), Kroos on Rakitic and Busquets watching the ball on the James goal.
> And no idea why Real felt it was wise to press with 5 people a man down with a minute to go lol...* Stuff like that makes me think Juve has one hand on the CL.
> *
> Messi GOATastic again.
> 
> (Ronaldo was utter **** lol)




I said a few weeks back that if either team wins the CL, the soccer world should be ashamed of themselves. 

and No the ref was **** and the linesman were worse.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Has to be said Roberto's work leading up to the goal was fantastic. One barca get a proper coach and a real RB, i'd like Roberto to go into the midfield and see what he can do.



les Habs said:


> League is still over. Refs made sure of that a long time ago. Or was it the benches?




I'm sure barca will find a way to **** this up but no Ramos, Varane, Pepe there's a slight chance.


----------



## Power Man

Pepe and Varane injured, Ramos to be suspended

Do we have other CB's?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Favourite team wins an epic game that put them in a position to win the league.

Best player has a game-breaking performance.

The opposition captain is rightfully sent off.

Barca fans on this forum still find a way to cry about the refs.

Salty even in victory. That's funny as hell.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Has to be said Roberto's work leading up to the goal was fantastic. One barca get a proper coach and a real RB, i'd like Roberto to go into the midfield and see what he can do




Kid works his ass off. Took an elbow from Mandzukic in each leg against Juventus too and just got on with it. Prime example of why the club should have relied on La Masia instead of the Turans, Dignes, Gomes', Alcacers, etc.



> I'm sure barca will find a way to **** this up but no Ramos, Varane, Pepe there's a slight chance.




We'll see. If they pull it out and can win the Copa it will be an incredible season.


----------



## Luigi Habs

It's very rare I enjoy a classico but this one was one of the best I've seen. Great game by Both teams and Messi Amazing!!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Favourite team wins an epic game that put them in a position to win the league.
> 
> Best player has a game-breaking performance.
> 
> The opposition captain is rightfully sent off.
> 
> Barca fans on this forum still find a way to cry about the refs.
> 
> Salty even in victory. That's funny as hell.




Barca are not in a position to win the league...they have a legit chance but from where I'm sitting they're still 2nd. 

Not crying just correcting a statement. The ref missed **** from both sides... one more than the other but that is to be expected. 

Enjoy the choke job though.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Barca are not in a position to win the league...they have a legit chance but from where I'm sitting they're still 2nd.
> 
> Not crying just correcting a statement. The ref missed **** from both sides... one more than the other but that is to be expected.
> 
> Enjoy the choke job though.




You are in a much better position to win the league that you were at the beginning of the day. I wasn't clear, sorry.

Casemiro should have been sent off at least twice. He was lucky as hell.


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Barca are not in a position to win the league...they have a legit chance but from where I'm sitting they're still 2nd.




Actually they are in 1st now based on H2H results

But man, what a great game. Even if it would have finished 2-2 I'd say the same thing. The entire game it went up and down, both teams with a boatload of chances, some very hectic stuff at times. Great clasico.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

King J0ffrey said:


> Onsidee goal
> Casemiro should be on a yellow. No red yet
> 
> Neutral point of view.
> 
> *Marcelo elbow was nothing.*




Are you ****ing kidding me?


----------



## Power Man

Ter Stegen and Roberto bailing out Messi tbh


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Has to be said Roberto's work leading up to the goal was fantastic. One barca get a proper coach and a real RB, i'd like Roberto to go into the midfield and see what he can do.




Yup. Hope Unzue isn't as stubborn as Lucho if Barca goes that route.


----------



## les Habs

Messi's winner was his 500th for the club.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

King J0ffrey said:


> Messi dived right into that tackle....I wish ref would give card for the intent...so player could stay on theyre feet instead of semi-diving




Messi doesn't do that and he gets injured for a year


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Vasilevskiy said:


> Messi doesn't do that and he gets injured for a year




This. Sometimes it is better to fall. If you go against your momentum with your leg stuck, you will get badly injured. Anyone who played sports should know that.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

I love Marcelo, he's a super player and I'd have him in Barcelona in a heartbeat but that elbow was crap, La Liga should have a look at it, you cannot be throwing flying elbows just like that.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Kid works his ass off. Took an elbow from Mandzukic in each leg against Juventus too and just got on with it. Prime example of why the club should have relied on La Masia instead of the Turans, Dignes, Gomes', Alcacers, etc.
> 
> We'll see. If they pull it out and can win the Copa it will be an incredible season.




Oh 100% they should but they won't unless a new president comes in. Let's hope Alena doesn't get shafted too.

It will be pretty incredible but Lucho's legacy will always be a let down. Like I envisioned. 



Scandale du Jour said:


> You are in a much better position to win the league that you were at the beginning of the day. I wasn't clear, sorry.
> 
> Casemiro should have been sent off at least twice. He was lucky as hell.




It's not lucky but okay.



Savi said:


> Actually they are in 1st now based on H2H results
> 
> But man, what a great game. Even if it would have finished 2-2 I'd say the same thing. The entire game it went up and down, both teams with a boatload of chances, some very hectic stuff at times. Great clasico.




Madrid have a game in hand.



TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Yup. Hope *Unzue* isn't as stubborn as Lucho if Barca goes that route.




Oh good God no. Please no. I want one of my sports teams to have a good coach. Haven't experienced that since 2014.


----------



## Power Man

Vasilevskiy said:


> I love Marcelo, he's a super player and I'd have him in Barcelona in a heartbeat but that elbow was crap, La Liga should have a look at it, you cannot be throwing flying elbows just like that.




Marcelo is lucky it wasn't Suarez, he would have lost his elbow lol


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch




----------



## les Habs

Not only was Messi's winner his 500th for the club, but that goal also made him the all time leading scorer in el Clasico history as he surpassed di Stefano.


----------



## Vipers31

Happy to see the result. Even more so given the garbage from Marcelo and Ramos.


----------



## MrFunnyWobbl

Messi GOAT 

Wish I watched that, damn


----------



## Vamos Rafa

I need details on why Messi celebrated the goal like that. First time I've seen him do that. Was he taunting Real fans or was he looking at the away BarÃ§a fans?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Could be directed at the Madrid fans, given the goal in context emotions getting The better of him considering what it means for Barca and to him personally. Or directed at the Barca fans for the same positive reasons. 

Either way it's unlike messi... Never has he taken off his shirt in celebration.


----------



## les Habs

Probably the Madrid fans. One can only imagine what they said to him during the match.

Speaking of imagining what one might say, we don't have to with Ramos who apparently said the following:

â€œMy clap? It was directed towards Pique. He got to the ref with all his tweets & impacted the match."


----------



## kov

Want to give Suarez some love for the tireless work throughout and for helping to setup Messi for both his goals. 

Goal one, he steps over the pass and runs to the right drawing defenders with him, leaving a gaping space on the left for Messi to run into.

Goal two he blocks out one of the defenders to keep a shooting lane open for Messi to fire home.

That Marcelo elbow is hard to tell whether or not it was intentional. I thought it was dirty at first, but a few other folks with me watching the match didn't think so (no, they weren't Madrid fans ).


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

Had tickets to the match and couldn't make it due to an interview tomorrow (today), my father got them from a businessman he knows. He went and didn't even sell the other ticket or give it to anyone. What a shame to have missed it, it was a cracker.


----------



## les Habs

Helluva match and this after both sides had big CL matches midweek. There's a reason it's the Clasico though.

Both keepers with some huge saves in this one. A testament to their matches but also to the chances created. 

Were I a Madridista I think I'd constantly be complaining about Bale and Kroos. I would just imagine what they could make selling the pair the players they could have brought in.

Well once again "choker" Messi delivers. Smashing goals the pair of them and yet he's scored both of them before. In fact the winner is a pretty typical Messi goal.



King J0ffrey said:


> was a yellow....pansy league...barely touched him lol






King J0ffrey said:


> Messi dived right into that tackle....I wish ref would give card for the intent...so player could stay on theyre feet instead of semi-diving






King J0ffrey said:


> Marcelo elbow was nothing.




  



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Has to be said Roberto's work leading up to the goal was fantastic.




Yeah, that was a great run. Just the drive to go forward like that. 

Alba's ball to Messi made up for losing Rodriguez on Madrid's second.



kov said:


> Want to give Suarez some love for the tireless work throughout and for helping to setup Messi for both his goals.
> 
> Goal one, he steps over the pass and runs to the right drawing defenders with him, leaving a gaping space on the left for Messi to run into.
> 
> Goal two he blocks out one of the defenders to keep a shooting lane open for Messi to fire home.
> 
> That Marcelo elbow is hard to tell whether or not it was intentional. I thought it was dirty at first, but a few other folks with me watching the match didn't think so (no, they weren't Madrid fans ).




Good call on Suarez. I would add that he put in the defensive work too. His technique on that volley that Navas saved was excellent too.

In real time I didn't think it was intentional. Slow motion reply however gave me pause. He's looking to the linesman and for me that's a sign of him knowing what he was doing. I certainly wouldn't put it past him as Marcelo has shown himself a dirty player before. Had it been Suarez it would have been called intentional.


----------



## Corto

Few highlights from me from last night:
- Rakitic was excellent, best Barca player after Messi and ter Stegen (Roberto was amazing on the goal as well)
- Iniesta's pass to Suarez and his volley and the nice Navas save was as good a pass as you'll ever see, simply amazing
- Ronaldo was awful lol... Like... I mean, at this point, if he doesn't put away chances, he doesn't offer much to their team
- Casemiro was beyond dumb, and ultimately, probably cost his team - Kovacic and Kroos are not nearly as adept defensively, both were way too far and reacted badly on Rakitic's goal - and Zidane had to take him off because it was a matter of time before he got a 2nd yellow
- linesmen were awful, for both teams - ref however, held up pretty good. Marcelo's elbow looked like an accident to me, and I'm sure to most people... Ramos' red was deserved and was the right call. The Ronaldo pen thing at the start... I've seen those given more often than not, but he did go down easy
- Ramos got sent off twice in the last 3 El Clasicos (last year in the 2-1 win at Nou Camp) - both times well deserved
- neither of these teams can't hold a candle to Juventus as far as tactics or tactical discipline goes
- Marcelo needs to stop Roberto and get a yellow (even a red) on that last play - it's something every Juve player does no questions asked (Khedira did when Alex Sandro lost the ball vs Barca, for example)
- I love Kovacic and his potential, but he was jogging back on the last Messi goal... Modric and Marcelo sprint back to cover people, Kovacic jogs back - and he only came on 20 mins earlier. Awful, irresponsible defending (similar to Masche vs Juve on the 2nd Dybala goal)
- ter Stegen is the best Barca keeper in recent memory

And finally, I never got to see Gretzky play at his peak, just the last few years. I got to watch only the last 3 Chicago years of Jordan's career (95-98).
It's a pleasure, and a privilege, to have watched Messi throughout his career.
What a player, what an athlete - I have no idea how people compare anyone else to him as far as football goes. Peak Cristiano was a goal machine, IMO #2 player all-time, but doesn't come close to Mesi.

...

I think Zidane has some tough calls to make in the upcoming games. 
At some point, he's got to give a chance to Morata over either Ronaldo or Benzema (Ronaldo has been shockingly bad at every but finishing - but now failed there as well).
And having an injured, out-of-shape Bale doesn't help.
I hope Bale's back to his full form next season, such an amazing player when he's on form.

Barca has the easier schedule, and no CL, I fully expect them to grab all 15 points from now on
Osasuna, Villareal and Eiber home, Espanyol, Las Palmas away.
Real has Valencia and Sevilla at home, and then Deportivo, Malaga, Celta and Granada away. Some tricky games there.

It's very likely that Real stupidly high press with 5 players, a man down, at 91.30 of the game, Roberto's run and Messi's finish turned the championship with that one move.
I just wonder if it was Zidane's call or the players just pressed of their own accord there.

Best game I watched in a while - at least the most exciting one.


----------



## Bakayoko Ono

Knew Real were doomed the moment I saw Ronnie's hair.


----------



## Power Man

Pressing forward with 1 man down in the last few seconds left was all kinds of stupid


----------



## Ar-too

The Classico got stale there for a bit. It's had a genuine revival the last couple years. Real's win last year after Ramos got sent off, and then Messi's winning goal this year. As someone who favors Barca in these games, I think this one was sweeter than the 5-0 from a few years ago. Two of the Messiest Messi goals you'll ever see. The touch with his right foot to make Carvajal look silly on his first. And the Suarez boxout on the second. Messi is amazing. He's lost a yard of pace in the last couple years, but he's made up for it with more intelligence and better free kick taking.

The one Madrid player I feel badly for is Navas. He had a great game and was hung out to dry on two of the three goals.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Memphis The Pie said:


> Knew Real were doomed the moment I saw Ronnie's hair.




His 1990s boys band hair was hilarious indeed.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> His 1990s boys band hair was hilarious indeed.




I thought he just decided ti istick with only hair gel, exfoliations, and moisturizers but no he had to dye his hair 

By the way, when Messi had blonde hair, in combination with his facial hair he reminded me of Asterix lol


----------



## Corto

Ar-too said:


> Two of the Messiest Messi goals you'll ever see. The touch with his right foot to make Carvajal look silly on his first.




Thing is, he makes that play 9/10 times or something, in the same conditions.

Any other TOP striker probably doesn't even think of it - but if they do, they manage to do that maybe 1/10 times.

Incredible, incredible player.

I'm not even sure he's lost a step... His speed with the ball is the same, and that's what makes Messi what he is, among other things: abnormal speed with the ball in his feet, and he never ever loses control of it.


----------



## Corto

BTW, saw the game again today, watching for some more tactical stuff etc.

All I can say is, either these players are uncoachable tactically...
Or Zidane and Lucho have their jobs because of who they were when they played.

Okay, I'm being too mean... But tactically, especially on defence, these teams are a wreck. 
They get by on a ridiculous amount of talent... but yeah.

I don't know what's more amazing, Barcelona pushing forward 2-1 up and against 10 men and getting countered; or Real pushing 6 players at Barca's 30m line for a Barca throw-in and opening themselves up for a counter with 30 seconds to go at 2-2.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Not only was Messi's winner his 500th for the club, but that goal also made him the all time leading scorer in el Clasico history as he surpassed di Stefano.




Pretty sure the first goal made him top scorer? Now he's 2 goals up?



Corto said:


> Few highlights from me from last night:
> - Rakitic was excellent, best Barca player after Messi and ter Stegen (Roberto was amazing on the goal as well)
> - Iniesta's pass to Suarez and his volley and the nice Navas save was as good a pass as you'll ever see, simply amazing
> - Ronaldo was awful lol... Like... I mean, at this point, if he doesn't put away chances, he doesn't offer much to their team
> - Casemiro was beyond dumb, and ultimately, probably cost his team - Kovacic and Kroos are not nearly as adept defensively, both were way too far and reacted badly on Rakitic's goal - and Zidane had to take him off because it was a matter of time before he got a 2nd yellow
> - linesmen were awful, for both teams - ref however, held up pretty good. Marcelo's elbow looked like an accident to me, and I'm sure to most people... Ramos' red was deserved and was the right call. The Ronaldo pen thing at the start... I've seen those given more often than not, but he did go down easy
> - Ramos got sent off twice in the last 3 El Clasicos (last year in the 2-1 win at Nou Camp) - both times well deserved
> - neither of these teams can't hold a candle to Juventus as far as tactics or tactical discipline goes
> - Marcelo needs to stop Roberto and get a yellow (even a red) on that last play - it's something every Juve player does no questions asked (Khedira did when Alex Sandro lost the ball vs Barca, for example)
> - I love Kovacic and his potential, but he was jogging back on the last Messi goal... Modric and Marcelo sprint back to cover people, Kovacic jogs back - and he only came on 20 mins earlier. Awful, irresponsible defending (similar to Masche vs Juve on the 2nd Dybala goal)
> - ter Stegen is the best Barca keeper in recent memory
> 
> And finally, I never got to see Gretzky play at his peak, just the last few years. I got to watch only the last 3 Chicago years of Jordan's career (95-98).
> It's a pleasure, and a privilege, to have watched Messi throughout his career.
> What a player, what an athlete - I have no idea how people compare anyone else to him as far as football goes. Peak Cristiano was a goal machine, IMO #2 player all-time, but doesn't come close to Mesi.
> 
> ...
> 
> I think Zidane has some tough calls to make in the upcoming games.
> At some point, he's got to give a chance to Morata over either Ronaldo or Benzema (Ronaldo has been shockingly bad at every but finishing - but now failed there as well).
> And having an injured, out-of-shape Bale doesn't help.
> I hope Bale's back to his full form next season, such an amazing player when he's on form.
> 
> Barca has the easier schedule, and no CL, I fully expect them to grab all 15 points from now on
> Osasuna, Villareal and Eiber home, Espanyol, Las Palmas away.
> Real has Valencia and Sevilla at home, and then Deportivo, Malaga, Celta and Granada away. Some tricky games there.
> 
> It's very likely that Real stupidly high press with 5 players, a man down, at 91.30 of the game, Roberto's run and Messi's finish turned the championship with that one move.
> I just wonder if it was Zidane's call or the players just pressed of their own accord there.
> 
> Best game I watched in a while - at least the most exciting one.




Can't disagree much here. I still think Ronaldo was not a penalty has it wasn't much contact and he wasn't in a position to score.JMO

Again, don't disagree with a lot here.



Corto said:


> BTW, saw the game again today, watching for some more tactical stuff etc.
> 
> *All I can say is, either these players are uncoachable tactically...
> Or Zidane and Lucho have their jobs because of who they were when they played.
> *
> Okay, I'm being too mean... But tactically, especially on defence, these teams are a wreck.
> They get by on a ridiculous amount of talent... but yeah.
> 
> I don't know what's more amazing, Barcelona pushing forward 2-1 up and against 10 men and getting countered; or Real pushing 6 players at Barca's 30m line for a Barca throw-in and opening themselves up for a counter with 30 seconds to go at 2-2.





Thanks, it's clear as day they are clueless but the majority seem to think they're wonderful coaches. Pity.

I was laughing my ass off at how open they were. Less so, when Barca was pushing up on 2-1. Lucho didn't even bother using a 2nd sub when he should've brought on Masch to wrap the game up.


----------



## Theokritos

Corto said:


> All I can say is, either these players are uncoachable tactically...
> *Or Zidane and Lucho have their jobs because of who they were when they played.*




Frankly, isn't that a given?


----------



## Luigi Habs

Lmao RM are going to appeal Ramos' red card.


----------



## Power Man

Luiginho said:


> Lmao RM are going to appeal Ramos' red card.




So? A lot of team do it (including Barca recently with Neymar)


----------



## Luigi Habs

Power Man said:


> So? A lot of team do it (including Barca recently with Neymar)




It's a clear red. In Neymar's case they were trying to delay his suspension so he could play in the clasico.


----------



## Corto

Luiginho said:


> It's a clear red. In Neymar's case they were trying to delay his suspension so he could play in the clasico.




Well, nothing prevents them from appealing.

It's gonna be denied because it was a clear red, and everyone'll go on.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Corto said:


> Well, nothing prevents them from appealing.
> 
> It's gonna be denied because it was a clear red, and everyone'll go on.




This.

Appealing is the right move. Chances of success are however very low.


----------



## Live in the Now

http://www.marca.com/futbol/primera-division/2017/04/25/58fe79d0ca474184338b457c.html

Definitely not a rigged league.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Theokritos said:


> Frankly, isn't that a given?




It's not just ask Mcsorely and the other Madrid fan. 

It's even worse in real life.



Scandale du Jour said:


> This.
> 
> Appealing is the right move. Chances of success are however very low.




I actually wouldn't be shocked if it does get over turned.



Live in the Now said:


> http://www.marca.com/futbol/primera-division/2017/04/25/58fe79d0ca474184338b457c.html
> 
> Definitely not a rigged league.




That's hilarious... Especially , when you think a 2nd yellow and "clapping" gets you 3.


----------



## Power Man

Perez doing work


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Perez doing work




Hopefully he is successful in his attempt to send Messi to jail this time


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

BTW I forgot to mention this is the 2nd big game Isco has been hung out to dry. IF this doesn't show him that he needs to get his ass out of Madrid (in a WC year) he doesn't deserve his talents.


----------



## Savi

1 game for Ramos 

Frankly, I'm almost surprised they haven't suspended Messi for his vicious headbutt on Marcelo's elbow


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Hopefully he is successful in his attempt to send Messi to jail this time




At least he tried

He also wanted to napalm poor Catalunya but he ultimately changed his mind


----------



## les Habs

Live in the Now said:


> http://www.marca.com/futbol/primera-division/2017/04/25/58fe79d0ca474184338b457c.html
> 
> Definitely not a rigged league.






Savi said:


> 1 game for Ramos
> 
> Frankly, I'm almost surprised they haven't suspended Messi for his vicious headbutt on Marcelo's elbow




Not surprised by any of it. It's been this way for a long time. Fortunately guys like Pique and Lucho stand up to it. Still we need a guy like Laporta back who will call out it out for what it is.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> At least he tried
> 
> He also wanted to napalm poor Catalunya but he ultimately changed his mind




Barcelona is beautiful, maybe just napalm Camp Nou.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Barcelona is beautiful, maybe just napalm Camp Nou.




No. Take all prisoners


----------



## Savi

Well... Andre Gomes just scored

Hopefully AleÃ±a gets some playing time in the 2nd half


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> No. Take all prisoners




Force Messi to play for Real?


----------



## Power Man

ZZ resting CR against Depor

Not a good idea imo


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Masche gets his first


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> ZZ resting CR against Depor
> 
> Not a good idea imo




Working ok so far. 

I love Morata btw. Oh and Isco. They deserve more minutes.

Edit: what kind of defending was that 

Edit 2: Varane is back... where was he on Sunday?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

I should go back to work, things were going well before I got home and turned the tv on 

Edit: Isco said... we are struggling? Hold my beer mate. What a play to set up the goal.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Isco is man of the match each time he starts. Zizou, get the message.


----------



## Corto

Real's "B team" plays more Ancelotti-football than Zidane-football.
More lateral passing, more dribbles with Isco, Kovacic and Asensio, etc.

That said, it's really hard to gauge as the "A team" plays vs Bayern, Atleti, Barca, Sevilla, etc... And the "B team", since they started playing like that a couple of months ago, plays vs Depor, Eibar etc.
Honestly, Marcelo and Carvajal play so high up field, that I don't see why Zidane doesn't put Isco in Bale's place (instead of Asensio) and go for a modified 4-4-2, where Kroos and Modric help out the flanks (as they do now) and Isco play a more free role beind Ronaldo and Benzema (assuming they both play vs Atleti).

Depor was awful tonight, no press, and outside of a 10 minute spell at the end of the first half, they were rubbish.

That said, Isco and Kovacic had fantastic games, James was good as well.
Morata and Vasquez wasted some glorious chances but still got a goal each.


...

Only saw the first half of Barca before I switched over to the Tottenham game.
Poor Osasuna was depleted by injuries, it was always gonna be hard for them... 
I don't see Barca spilling points anywhere, Messi's bossing games and Rakitic is back to his best and controlling the midfield with Busquets... With Neymar back, they should glide to the finish line and put pressure on Real.


----------



## Power Man

No cross cross cross today.
I dig


And Kovacic is so underrated


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> No cross cross cross today.
> I dig
> 
> 
> And Kovacic is so underrated




His ball control is incredible.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> His ball control is incredible.




Yup.

Can't wait to see Morata and Isco ride the bench this weekend and in the CL.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Just watching the replay... Masch <3. He could've had one earlier in the game too. Glad he potted one in his last year here.


----------



## Savi

Corto said:


> I don't see Barca spilling points anywhere




Espanyol and Las Palmas away aren't exactly easy games, I could easily see a couple of draws here.


----------



## Power Man

La casa del fÃºtbol‏ @casadelfutbol

Pepe Mel: "Es mÃ¡s jodido ganarle al 'Madrid B' que al A"

(Pepe Mel is Deportivo's coach )


----------



## les Habs

So it looks like Madrid don't have to worry about Malaga:

"I would prefer if it was all over before the final weekend -- better to welcome the champions than to knock your old team -- but I am a professional.

Everyone has talked to me about those final Ligas in Tenerife. And it's true that Valdano is a Madridista, but I am more, as I spent 25 years of my life at Real Madrid and I still follow them despite being here now at Malaga."

You can click the link to read more of his comments somewhat to the contrary, but can't imagine being a Malaga player and reading that.

On top of that Malaga's president referred BarÃ§a as "the scum of Catalonia" and said the club "will not smell the championship."


----------



## Scandale du Jour

These are disgusting comments. If we win because the other team lays down... yuck!


----------



## Power Man

les Habs said:


> So it looks like Madrid don't have to worry about Malaga:
> 
> "I would prefer if it was all over before the final weekend -- better to welcome the champions than to knock your old team -- but I am a professional.
> 
> Everyone has talked to me about those final Ligas in Tenerife. And it's true that Valdano is a Madridista, but I am more, as I spent 25 years of my life at Real Madrid and I still follow them despite being here now at Malaga."
> 
> You can click the link to read more of his comments somewhat to the contrary, but can't imagine being a Malaga player and reading that.
> 
> On top of that Malaga's president referred BarÃ§a as "the scum of Catalonia" and said the club "will not smell the championship."




This warms my heart


----------



## Power Man

It's a trap

Malaga wants to help Barcelona and wants to to catch us sleeping


----------



## Scandale du Jour

No Varane today. I guess they are resting him for CL play. He just came back from injury after all...

Must win game against an opponent that usually does well at the Bernabeu. James starting over Isco, meh. Bale still hurt.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> No Varane today. I guess they are resting him for CL play. He just came back from injury after all...
> 
> Must win game against an opponent that usually does well at the Bernabeu. James starting over Isco, meh. Bale still hurt.



ZZ might be resting Isco for the CL


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

God Nani is horrible... As is that orellana fella.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema finally does something good... hits the post 

Penalty! Stopped


----------



## Power Man

Lol Ronaldo


----------



## Savi

Alves does it again 

Was never a pen though. Great selling job by Modric


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ouch, poor Lato.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

God damn it. Unless we score in the last 10 minutes... liga = all but lost.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Marcelo!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Again Casemiro should be sent off.. Lol give the trophy to Madrid no point in exhausting the players.


----------



## Power Man

Alves is incredible 

Goat penalty stopper tbh


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Again Casemiro should be sent off.. Lol give the trophy to Madrid no point in exhausting the players.




But you have the so called goat so you should be able to make a comeback despite the odds


----------



## Corto

Savi said:


> Alves does it again
> 
> Was never a pen though. Great selling job by Modric




It was a soft call, but the dude put both his arms around Modric, what did he think was gonna happen...

Anyway, another awful game from Ronaldo, and Benzema and James were pedestrian as well.
Zidane might have to put in Isco vs Atleti .


----------



## Power Man

Corto said:


> It was a soft call, but the dude put both his arms around Modric, what did he think was gonna happen...
> 
> Anyway, another awful game from Ronaldo, and Benzema and James were pedestrian as well.
> Zidane might have to put in Isco vs Atleti .




Isco will most likely start vs Atleti because of Bale's injury


----------



## Corto

Power Man said:


> Isco will most likely start vs Atleti because of Bale's injury




James started in Bale's place today, so I don't know if its guaranteed - but I would be SHOCKED if Isco doesn't have the spot vs Atleti.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> James started in Bale's place today, so I don't know if its guaranteed - but I would be SHOCKED if Isco doesn't have the spot vs Atleti.




I'd be shocked if he started... In need of a goal today he was an unused sub for the likes of Morata, Asensio and Lucas. 

Against barca also an unused sub. The only games starts he gets subbed off.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

It's sad that we have to play Gomes in the most crucial time of the season.

He's so noticeable because he's terrible

I hope he follows Enrique. Sell him for peanuts please.


----------



## Power Man

You know Espanyol will find a way to **** it up


----------



## Asiantuntija

Prepare to lose Barcelona fans


----------



## Live in the Now

Asiantuntija said:


> Prepare to lose Barcelona fans



Lol.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Asiantuntija said:


> Prepare to lose Barcelona fans




Not against real tho.


----------



## Savi

dat Espanyol defence


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Hopefully Sergi gets his chance in midfield next season, the runs he makes are a pleasure to watch.


----------



## Savi

Some magical stuff from Neymar today  he always plays well against Villarreal


----------



## Power Man

Neymar has mad skills


----------



## Scandale du Jour

**** you BeIN for airing the Barca game and not the Real game


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> **** you BeIN for airing the Barca game and not the Real game




That's why I have IPTV

I can watch the game on BeIN Fr, Canal+ La Liga, some UK, German, Italian, Russian sports channel etc etc for much much less money 

**** cable companies


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Digne should've been sent off.


----------



## Live in the Now

I thought Liverpool would for sure have scored the worst poor sport goal today, but that's even worse.

For those who didn't see, Asensio fakes injury after foul, Nacho runs over and scores while Sevilla is helping Asensio up. And the referee is standing in the way of the defense so the keeper could literally have never seen anything that happened.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

I think it was Asensio.

Saw a quick replay... Ref looked to be in front of the shot too.


----------



## Live in the Now

That should never be allowed. Then the **** gets up and celebrates. Give me a break.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Just saw a video of it... what the ****. Ref should have blown the whistle.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ah well better luck next year.

Well played Madrid. ZZ is still a **** manager.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Ah well better luck next year.
> 
> Well played Madrid. ZZ is still a **** manager.




Nothing done. Still need to close this game out and win two more. Celta is not a given. Malaga neither.


----------



## Evilo

Between the crossbar and Navas' save, Real is lucky to be ahead by 2.


----------



## Power Man

Wow Keylor


----------



## Power Man

Evilo said:


> Between the crossbar and Navas' save, Real is lucky to be ahead by 2.




It's part of the game


----------



## Evilo

It's Zizou's assistant coach really.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Nothing done. Still need to close this game out and win two more. Celta is not a given. Malaga neither.




Celta have been poor recently and Malaga will roll over. They basically said it.


----------



## Live in the Now

I don't want to keep watching this game because of the inevitable result, but you can't play defense like that against Juventus unless Higuain and others decide they aren't going to show up.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> I don't want to keep watching this game because of the inevitable result, but you can't play defense like that against Juventus unless Higuain and others decide they aren't going to show up.




I've been saying this since Zizous arrival... yet he's on the cusp of winning the double and back to back CL.


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I've been saying this since Zizous arrival... yet he's on the cusp of winning the double and back to back CL.



That's true. But still a bit different than doing it against Sevilla or some of the teams they played in the last CL and Juventus, who simply won't give up those chances.


----------



## Power Man

What a **** defense lol


----------



## Corto

Live in the Now said:


> That should never be allowed. Then the **** gets up and celebrates. Give me a break.




It's legal. 
It's part of the reason why you see defenders stand in front of the ball until the ref gives the signal that he'll set the wall distance.

Here's Graham Poll on it http://news.bbc.co.uk/sportacademy/hi/sa/football/features/newsid_3409000/3409567.stm:



> This is their window of opportunity to surprise the defence.
> If they want it quick, then they have given up the right to re-take it, no matter if it hits a defender who's three yards away.
> The same goes if they kick it over the bar. They only get one chance.
> The flip side is if they want it slow, they can't then take it while I count out the ten yards for the wall.
> They must wait for my whistle.
> There is nothing in the laws of the game that say we have to indicate for the free-kick to be taken.
> It's just like when someone wants to take a free-kick anywhere else on the field.
> As long as the ball is stationary and in the right place then the attacking team can take it as quickly as they like.




So, maybe a ******-move, but legal.


----------



## Live in the Now

It's legal but it's a lot worse than maybe a bad move. It's completely unsporting. I would probably feel a little differently if he hadn't gotten up to celebrate and if the referee wasn't standing in the way of the whole Sevilla team.


----------



## Corto

Live in the Now said:


> It's legal but it's a lot worse than maybe a bad move. It's completely unsporting. I would probably feel a little differently if he hadn't gotten up to celebrate and if the referee wasn't standing in the way of the whole Sevilla team.




Yeah, it leaves a sour taste in the mouth - but I don't think taking the FK fast is unsporting. As Poll says above, the attacking team has the advantage.
The guy rolling on the floor, dying in agony from another human's leg touching his, and then jumping for joy - yeah, that's just crap. And unfortunately, that's become oh-so-normal in football.

Reminds of Verratti, the other week:
https://streamable.com/pe8oz


----------



## Live in the Now

Corto said:


> Yeah, it leaves a sour taste in the mouth - but I don't think taking the FK fast is unsporting. As Poll says above, the attacking team has the advantage.
> The guy rolling on the floor, dying in agony from another human's leg touching his, and then jumping for joy - yeah, that's just crap. And unfortunately, that's become oh-so-normal in football.
> 
> Reminds of Verratti, the other week:
> https://streamable.com/pe8oz



Yeah, that was awful too. Another problem I have with this was the referee blocking the whole team including the goalkeeper.

I did also say Liverpool's goal today was also very poor sport and knowing you're a West Ham fan I expect that kind of response.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Marlon was great today, here's hoping Valverde or whoever they bring in give the young guys a fair shot, there's some promising talent on Barca B.


----------



## Power Man

Ronaldo 's 1st goal holy ****


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Sooooo, a draw against Malaga and we are the champs


----------



## YNWA14

Isco is fun to watch. Ronaldo is a monster.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Sooooo, a draw against Malaga and we are the champs




Don't jinx it!


----------



## les Habs

Not that it affected the result, but it sounds like more Madridista reffing yet again.


----------



## Power Man

les Habs said:


> Not that it affected the result, but it sounds like more Madridista reffing yet again.




Hello there


----------



## Power Man

That was fast


----------



## Power Man

Lol Elbar is up


----------



## Scandale du Jour

What a save!


----------



## Power Man

Dammit Navas


----------



## maclean

Power Man said:


> Lol Elbar is up




yeeesh, good thing for barcelona atleti and sevilla got shaken off their tail the past few rounds. still, not a good look in the last round, though i guess lucho's gone anyways


----------



## Power Man

Hey Camacho **** you


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benz!!!!!


----------



## Power Man

Phew


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Lol offside not called... What's one more time? 

Lol Lio totally casual.


----------



## Power Man

CR7 scoring on the road at Malaga

Missi ******** the bed at home vs... Elbar


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

You try so hard... It's actually quite sad.


----------



## Savi

Soooo many missed chances


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> You try so hard... It's actually quite sad.




Maybe Missi should try harder


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

...Because it would've changed anything right? Players have missed worse chances, including Messi. 

but keep attempting( and failing) to be funny. We're all super impressed.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> ...Because it would've changed anything right? Players have missed worse chances, including Messi.
> 
> but keep attempting( and failing) to be funny. We're all super impressed.




Sodium everywhere


----------



## Power Man

Lmao Misso missing a penalty hahajahajaja


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Sodium everywhere




Telling someone he's not funny isn't being salty...its letting you know the truth. You're trying extremely hard and it's cringe worthy.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Lmao Misso missing a penalty hahajahajaja




Oh look...what a difference that made?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=132606287

and scoring.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Telling someone he's not funny isn't being salty...its letting you know the truth. You're trying extremely hard and it's cringe worthy.




Missi missing penalty


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Telling someone he's not funny isn't being salty...its letting you know the truth. You're trying extremely hard and it's cringe worthy.




He's mainly trying to annoy you and it is working.


----------



## Power Man

Lol that penalty combo to help Missi score


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> He's mainly trying to annoy you and it is working.




It really isn't, he's been doing it for awhile now and this is the first I've commented on it. It isn't funny(unlike the other things he says).


----------



## Power Man

I'm not even trying tbh lol


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Champs, wooooooo!


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Champs, wooooooo!




Wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii


----------



## Savi

Man what a weird game. This literally could have ended 11-4 or something like that.


----------



## Power Man

Capello is in the house


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Madrid have dominated barca in the transfer market in recent years and I'm talking about buying the superstar player. It's the smart low key buys that won them this trophy and has allowed them to compete with barca on all fronts. They stopped going after all the big fish and started buying sensibly. 

While barca have gone the opposite direction. Neglecting, what made them superior and started going after the glamouring type buys. In a few short yews they've destroyed what Pep/Laporta have built. With irrational buys and going after Pep 2.0.


----------



## Cassano

I still can't believe the Arda transfer. Insanity.


----------



## Power Man

Now let's try not to lose the CL Final


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Now let's try not to lose the CL Final




Cracking that defense will be difficult.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> Cracking that defense will be difficult.




Yep

And their offense and MF isn't too shabby either


----------



## Suiteness

Zidane just keep piling up trophies.


----------



## Power Man

Suiteness said:


> Zidane just keep piling up trophies.




Genius tbh


----------



## les Habs

All throughout Spain referees are celebrating.



DrRecchi said:


> I still can't believe the Arda transfer. Insanity.




He's one of HFBoards' favorite players to overrate too. Just thinking about him pisses me off.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Lol offside not called... What's one more time?




It's par for the course. Has been for a very long time and will very likely continue to be for a very long time.


----------



## Power Man

Like those 2 Barca dives rewarded with penalties... 
It's par for the course


----------



## Evilo

Wow, just saw a replay of Barca's penalty call at 1-2. 
Is this for real?
I thought it was a fake when I saw it. How can this possibly be a penalty? Like in real life?


----------



## les Habs

Power Man said:


> Like those 2 Barca dives rewarded with penalties...
> It's par for the course




It's like a Valencia supporter was saying this week. Madrid get calls on a completely other level than everyone else.


----------



## Corto

Both clubs benefited from reffing more often than not, and both were on the ends of some bad calls.
But if you're getting your news from one source, and especially if you're not watching the games, you can easily buy either club's propaganda.

I mean, we all know what Real's calls were since Pique tweets about them and Barca fans use it as some kind of measuring stick, but off the top of my head:
- Masche foul on Vasquez in the Barca clasico in the 2nd minute, should've been an easy penalty call
- Umtiti foul on Ronaldo in the Madrid clasico in the 2nd minute, 9/10 times a ref calls a pen in that situation. It's harsh, Umtiti went for the ball, Ronaldo got there first, he caught his leg.... but it's a pen
- Digne's last man foul on Jese in the 5th minute vs Las Palmas - only yellow... A guy clear through on goal, should've been an easy red, and Barca with 10 men for basically the entire match
- penalty on Alba yesterday (that one takes the cake btw, no players was withing 2 yards when it happened)
- penalty on Neymar yesterday 

That's just off the top of my head. Will link videos later when I'm at home (at work now  ).
Of course, it's relatively easy to think of examples where Real benefited from shoddy reffing as well... Or examples where Barca got screwed, or Real got screwed.

Point is, there's no conspiracy. For either side. No matter how much fans of either club cry in the years they lose.

Barca lost the title early on, when their midfield was either injured (Iniesta) or struggling for form and in contract negotiations (Busquets, Rakitic).
They lost it when Lucho rotated players in Malaga, La Coruna and vs Alves.
They lost it because of a very short bench, where every game with rotations meant a roulette and the work for MSN was made that much harder. They lost because for much of the season they were hemorraging on the flanks.
That said, Messi is now more ahead of Ronaldo than ever, and if they can bring in 2 top players (midfield, right back) and some depth in the summer, they'll be as good as ever.
They'll be losing Masche in the summer, but Umtiti has been spectacular, and they're covered with him there for the next 7-8 years. 

On the other side of the fence, Zidane may not be the best tactician out there (well, he most certainly isn't), but his man management skills seem to be a huge part of why Real has been doing so well this season.
It takes character to get guys like Ronaldo, Benzema, Modric, Marcelo, etc... To buy into rotating and sitting out games. 
The "B" team basically won them the league, winning all of their "easy" games and letting the first 11 rest for the CL and top matches in La Liga.
Ronaldo has had a very pedestrian season, up until the last month and a half. He looks more rested at this point of the season than ever, seems up for it every game.
In the end, Real won the title because of breaking records like scoring in 63 consecutive games and every La Liga game this season.

All in all, for all of Barca's woes early on, Real had their struggles in January, before Zidane started using the "B" team more often, and Barca nearly caught them.
Real had 93 points, Barca 90, which is mad, for both teams.

If anything, this season showed that Real has a deeper and more balanced team, but the MSN trio has now opened up a gap on BBC - and it should be even wider next season, with Ronaldo and Benzema a year older and already struggling for parts of season.


----------



## PeteWorrell

les Habs said:


> It's like a Valencia supporter was saying this week. Madrid get calls on a completely other level than everyone else.



Yeah it's always a conspiracy.Barcelona winning multiple trebles and league titles in the last few years while also getting some crazy calls for them and their fans still play the victims.

We're not in the Franco era anymore.


----------



## les Habs

LOL. Talk about propaganda. Mr Madridista reffing is back again. "Of course, it's relatively easy to think of examples where Real benefited from shoddy reffing as well..." but we won't see those.

Here's another video, dated 2/17 it should be noted, that also demonstrates all the BarÃ§a reffing that went on:



Alba penalty yesterday was absolutely ridiculous, but that came at a 1-2 scoreline and it didn't affect the outcome of the match which was a 4-2 win. Neymar's was a clear penalty.


----------



## les Habs

PeteWorrell said:


> Yeah it's always a conspiracy.Barcelona winning multiple trebles and league titles in the last few years while also getting some crazy calls for them and their fans still play the victims.
> 
> We're not in the Franco era anymore.




Yeah, and when we get crazy calls basically every single time the other team gets an equal if not disproportionate number of calls in the match or over the course of the tie. 

Did you figure that out yourself? That doesn't change the fact that it's one thing for team and another for all the rest.

Kinda funny coming from a guy who just *****ed about the refs in another thread.


----------



## PeteWorrell

les Habs said:


> Yeah, and when we get crazy calls basically every single time the other team gets an equal if not disproportionate number of calls in the match or over the course of the tie.
> 
> Did you figure that out yourself? That doesn't change the fact that it's one thing for team and another for all the rest.
> 
> Kinda funny coming from a guy who just *****ed about the refs in another thread.



I complained about about the lack of consistency in the handing of cards from the referees.Nothing to do with this conversation.

Also i completely agree with everything Corto said in his post above.The lack of depth and Lucho getting out coached is what killed Barcelona this year.


----------



## les Habs

PeteWorrell said:


> I complained about about the lack of consistency in the handing of cards from the referees.Nothing to do with this conversation.
> 
> Also i completely agree with everything Corto said in his post above.The lack of depth and Lucho getting out coached is what killed Barcelona this year.




Yeah, and that lack of consistency in refereeing is exactly the problem here. On top of that it's still *****ing about the refs.

Well just like Corto you'd be wrong.


----------



## PeteWorrell

les Habs said:


> Yeah, and that lack of consistency in refereeing is exactly the problem here. On top of that it's still *****ing about the refs.
> 
> Well just like Corto you'd be wrong.



It's your choice if you want to look ridiculous acting like it's BarÃ§a against the world when they are one of the biggest clubs in the world and have been winning everything for the last decade.It's just not very effective anymore.


----------



## les Habs

PeteWorrell said:


> It's your choice if you want to look ridiculous acting like it's BarÃ§a against the world when they are one of the biggest clubs in the world and have been winning everything for the last decade.It's just not very effective anymore.




It's your choice if you want to say something stupid like what I'm quoting here when it has nothing to do with what I said just as it's your choice if you want to ignore some facts for others.


----------



## PeteWorrell

les Habs said:


> It's your choice if you want to say something stupid like what I'm quoting here when it has nothing to do with what I said just as it's your choice if you want to ignore some facts for others.



I could also cherry pick "facts" like you do from some random Real Madrid channel on Youtube.I just can't be bothered.


----------



## les Habs

PeteWorrell said:


> I could also cherry pick "facts" like you do from some random Real Madrid channel on Youtube.I just can't be bothered.




Yet that's essentially what you did when you talked about "crazy calls" in your initial post, unless of course you can be bothered to specify. Anyway, feel free to to be bothered to actually counter anything I posted.


----------



## Corto

les Habs said:


> Alba penalty yesterday was absolutely ridiculous, but that came at a 1-2 scoreline and it didn't affect the outcome of the match which was a 4-2 win. Neymar's was a clear penalty.




Clear penalty? lol...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udsO8bne0F0
12.23

I'll do you one better, I'll find you the angle where you can see Eibar player slides parallel to Neymar and never even toucher him.

You're not commenting on the uncalled penalties vs Real in both derbies, or the Digne yellow vs Las Palmas (which should've been red in the 5th minute), etc.

...

Look I don't even care.
Contrary to what a hardcore Barca fan (who admittedly doesn't watch most Real games) sees when I defend complete BS vs anything Real does, or what a Real fan sees when I defend Barca or Messi against the made-up stuff they chuck at the Catalans, I'm fascinated by both clubs, and by their history, but I'm not a fan of either.
It's like watching a really really good movie with artistic integrity.
You harbour no feelings towards it, but you'll defend it if someone chuck random insults at it - especially without evidence.

And all I'm saying is that most of the time the "ref victim" card is played by the team who is having the worse season.

During the "quinta" it was Barca complaining even though Real was winning the league with 5 rounds to spare.
During the Cruyff era, it was Real's turn to cry foul, even though Cruyff made Barca the juggernaut that it is today and they won 4 straight La Ligas.
Both of those teams (Butragueno's "quinta" with Hugo Sanchez and Schuster etc.; and Barcelona with Stoichkov, Koeman, Laudrup, later Romario, etc.) had the misfortune of playing vs Sacchi's Milan and then Cappello's Milan.
As Michel once put it, when they played Milan, they were already down on themselves because they realized after the first time they played them just what a machine Milan was.

Then came a period when both teams struggled and the victim crying stopped, as Atletico, Valencia, Depo, all won titles.

Then the Galacticos formed, Barca's turn to cry, and finally Ronaldinho and then Messi's Barca - Real's turn to cry; helped by the "Uefalona" Chelsea game.
Where all the world wanted to see how Chelsea got mugged - though in reality, most of those calls were good and Chelsea played the victim perfectly, outraged and in arms over every decision.

I cannot really describe how fascinating the whole thing is, from the Kubala and Di Stefano transfers, to Cruyff the player, to the quinta and that night in London when Koeman scored vs Sampdoria with Mancini, Vialli, Jugovic, Mihajlovic, etc., to the Galacticos, the new "dutch" era in Barca with Kluivert, Ronaldinho, and finally Pep's Barca with Real, to Mou getting Real back on track, Ancelotti getting them to player more offensive football and now Zidane vs Lucho, Messi vs re-invented (but ultimately inferior, more team-dependent) Ronaldo.


----------



## Corto

Also, seeing Isco and Ramos do their "Pique cabron, saluta al campeon" makes me sad as a human, that people can't enjoy their success without mocking their rival.

EDIT: And before les Habs comes and says how terrible Real players are because of that, here's Barca players doing the same thing, "Madrid Carbon, saluta al campeon":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjkHfoBlCnI&app=desktop


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

No question Barca dropped points due to referee errors this season, games vs Betis and Malaga (1-1, and 0-0 games) being prime examples. Don't recall Real's gone through anything like that this season, but I digress. Suarez missing easy chances and Messi dribbling everyone for the 4th goal pretty much is the microcosm of this season.


----------



## Corto

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> No question Barca dropped points due to referee errors this season, games vs Betis and Malaga (1-1, and 0-0 games) being prime examples.




Do you recall them beating Las Palmas after not having Digne sent off at 5 mins?
Or not going a goal down to Real in the first clasico after Real wasn't awarded a clean pen?

I mean, if you're gonna pull examples of them being hard done for, bring up the ones they benefited from as well.

They got shafted by some ref decisions, so did Real.
And if you can't recall Real getting shafted, start with this. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7OC9YW0Ogs

...

Anyways.


----------



## Evilo

How can you say the penalty on Alba didn't affect the outcome since Eibar was LEADING at that point???


----------



## phisherman

Evilo said:


> How can you say the penalty on Alba didn't affect the outcome since Eibar was LEADING at that point???




Because Barca can do no wrong.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> How can you say the penalty on Alba didn't affect the outcome since Eibar was LEADING at that point???




... Because messi missed the penalty. Thought that was obvious?


----------



## Evilo

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> ... Because messi missed the penalty. Thought that was obvious?



Haha, OK, missed that. 
I only saw the replay of the "foul", not the rest of the game


----------



## Power Man

Corto said:


> Do you recall them beating Las Palmas after not having Digne sent off at 5 mins?
> Or not going a goal down to Real in the first clasico after Real wasn't awarded a clean pen?
> 
> I mean, if you're gonna pull examples of them being hard done for, bring up the ones they benefited from as well.
> 
> They got shafted by some ref decisions, so did Real.
> And if you can't recall Real getting shafted, start with this.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7OC9YW0Ogs
> 
> ...
> 
> Anyways.




Interesting


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> Clear penalty? lol...
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udsO8bne0F0
> 12.23
> 
> I'll do you one better, I'll find you the angle where you can see Eibar player slides
> parallel to Neymar and never even toucher him.




LOL. So you're using the exact same footage I looked at again last night. Fact you can't see the contact isn't surprising. Were that _insert Madrid player here_ you'd have called it the pen it was all day long.



> You're not commenting on the uncalled penalties vs Real in both derbies, or the Digne yellow vs Las Palmas (which should've been red in the 5th minute), etc.




You mean the ones I already commented on in the past? It would be funny if it weren't so pathetic that you don't do the same, but that's the difference between you and I. You talk about what I'm not commenting on and yet you completely ignore Carvajal's blatant handball in the box in the derby. You're not commenting on Marcelo's elbow, which in replay looks intentional and for which he should have been suspended, assuming that would have actually happened even had he been carded, for which he would have missed the fixture against Valencia where he scored the winner and was by some accounts Man of the Match.



> Look I don't even care.




Oh, clearly you don't. That's what as a "neutral" you're always on top of everything Madrid and even revising things in the process. You've been doing it for months now and you've even been called out for your reffing commentary.



> Contrary to what a hardcore Barca fan (who admittedly doesn't watch most Real games) sees when I defend complete BS vs anything Real does, or what a Real fan sees when I defend Barca or Messi against the made-up stuff they chuck at the Catalans, I'm fascinated by both clubs, and by their history, but I'm not a fan of either.




LOL. Not even worth my time.



> It's like watching a really really good movie with artistic integrity.
> You harbour no feelings towards it, but you'll defend it if someone chuck random insults at it - especially without evidence.




Yeah, that's why you just completely ignored the little bit of evidence I actually bothered with above which equates to quite a lot of points and that was a video that was post in February.



> And all I'm saying is that most of the time the "ref victim" card is played by the team who is having the worse season.




Well that's very clearly not all you're saying. Too bad for you it's not, but at this point I don't think it matters.



Corto said:


> Also, seeing Isco and Ramos do their "Pique cabron, saluta al campeon" makes me sad as a human, that people can't enjoy their success without mocking their rival.
> 
> EDIT: And before les Habs comes and says how terrible Real players are because of that, here's Barca players doing the same thing, "Madrid Carbon, saluta al campeon":
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjkHfoBlCnI&app=desktop




LOL at the "sad as a human" nonsense. 

Wow. You actually edited your post just to post that bs? I saw what they said before I was done posting yesterday. While it's absolutely hilarious coming from Ramos, I could care less. More power to them. If you feel the need to celebrate a cooked league like that go right ahead.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> ... Because messi missed the penalty. Thought that was obvious?




Yeah, you'd think so, but apparently not.


----------



## Power Man

Poor Catalan victims 

But you haven't seen anything yet. 

Perez and the Spanish government are planning a napalm attack on Catalonia.


----------



## Corto

I have no idea why you're so hateful, les Habs, or why you seem to take things and distribute them so personally, but whatever, it's the internets, yeah...

Anyway, Iniesta apparently doesn't agree with you it was the refs:
http://www.goal.com/en/news/8/main/...e-better-than-us-barcelona-midfielder-iniesta


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> I have no idea why you're so hateful, les Habs, or why you seem to take things and distribute them so personally, but whatever, it's the internets, yeah...
> 
> Anyway, Iniesta apparently doesn't agree with you it was the refs:
> http://www.goal.com/en/news/8/main/...e-better-than-us-barcelona-midfielder-iniesta




Wow. Hypocrite warning!

You keep posting things I already know. I don't care.


----------



## Corto

Copa del Rey final is Saturday.

If Barca win, we start the season with the Super Cup clasico.


----------



## Savi

There will also be a clasico on July 29th when they play eachother in Miami.


----------



## Live in the Now

Theo Hernandez 

Amazing pass by Messi on the third goal!


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Nice to see that Vidal is back.

Guess we will have 3 clasicos in the summer


----------



## les Habs

Well, not overly chuffed as I'm sure the players aren't either. Don't get me wrong, the Copa is a big deal and historically significant for the club, but would have liked the Double again. Felt this match was a microcosm of the season in a lot of ways too. They showed up though and it's great that the players always give the Copa it's due.

King of Kings. Such an apt title for Messi and once again he showed why he is undeniably the best in the World and the King of the Copa del Rey. Excellent goal and an amazing assist that had shades of that goal he scored against Athletic Club in the final.

Glad they won for Lucho. He wasn't perfect, but his record really is incredible and he was definitely our best manager post Guardiola. 



TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Guess we will have 3 clasicos in the summer




Not a fan. That "friendly" is ridiculous.


----------



## HajdukSplit

Girona earn promotion to La Liga following a scoreless draw with Zaragoza, on twitter a lot of speculation this match was "fixed", draw was good result for both sides and the betting sites had very low odds on a draw (1.1 or something like that )

I watched the match on BeIN Espanol and the last 10-15 minutes was literally that Simpsons soccer skit. Also there wasn't a shot on target the entire match


----------



## Vamos Rafa

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Nice to see that Vidal is back




Huh?


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Agusti Benedito is going to submit a motion of no confidence against the Barcelona board. 

More details are suppose to be released at 12:00 CET

There was also another link to a Spanish twitter account saying the board didn't want to renew Iniesta's contract and Val Verde refused to that decision.

Also Messi invited everyone on the team to his wedding essentially expect for the coaching staff and Board Members.

Again I don't how much of this is true but there must be some bad blood.


----------



## les Habs

DatsyukOwns said:


> Agusti Benedito is going to submit a motion of no confidence against the Barcelona board.
> 
> More details are suppose to be released at 12:00 CET




Great! Hopefully it goes somewhere. Laporta has correctly been making some noise as well. Saw something the other day that even after Rosell stepped down he was still running the board. There was a text of his telling someone what to do.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Vamos Rafa said:


> Huh?




Aleix Vidal returned from the broken ankle he suffered a number of months earlier


----------



## Savi

The lower Spanish leagues are finally finishing up as well.


Segunda Division (2nd div)

*Levante* easily win the league and go straight back to La Liga after finishing in last place in 2016. They were basically in first place the entire season.

Catalan side *Girona* came really close to promotion last year but ultimately lost to Osasuna in the playoff final. They finished 2nd this season and will play in La Liga for the very first time in their 87-year history. 

The final promotion ticket will go to the winner of the playoffs between teams 3-6. *Huesca* will play *Getafe*, who are looking to go straight back to La Liga as well, and *Cadiz* plays *Tenerife*, who haven't been in La Liga since 2010.

Mirandes, Elche, Universidad Murcia, and Mallorca amazed have been relegated to the 3rd division.


Segunda Division B (3rd div)

Two teams have already been promoted to the Segunda Division; *Cultural Leonesa* and *Lorca FC*. Lorca have only been in existence since 2003 and were still playing in the 6th division just 10 years ago. Since then they've steadily climbed up the ladder and will now make their way to the Segunda for the first time. They are under Chinese ownership since last year as well.

Two more teams can achieve promotion this week, as there will be a double matchup for the final tickets. *Racing Santander* will play *Barcelona B* while *Valencia B* will battle *Albacete*.


----------



## Savi

Barcelona B won the first game 4-1 at Santander 

Unless they screw up the return leg, it's back to the Segunda Division


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Barcelona B won the first game 4-1 at Santander
> 
> Unless they screw up the return leg, it's back to the Segunda Division




Saw that. Amazing result and now they just have to finish it off. Getting back into Segunda is a big deal.


----------



## Power Man

Congrats guys


----------



## les Habs

BarÃ§a B have now officially secured promotion. Should be a good rise in competition for guys like Alena and Cucurella for next season.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Yerah's teammates shaving their head in solidarity.<3


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Agusti Benedito has collected enough signatures to start a vote of no confidence. The teeet apparently said there will be more details next week.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Yerah's teammates shaving their head in solidarity.<3




Very cool.



DatsyukOwns said:


> Agusti Benedito has collected enough signatures to start a vote of no confidence. The teeet apparently said there will be more details next week.




Excellent news. Hopefully this goes somewhere.


----------



## Evilo

Meanwhile Ronaldo had some gems during his hearing for his :
- I'm here because my name is Ronaldo. 
- you are jealous of my genius.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> Meanwhile Ronaldo had some gems during his hearing for his :
> - I'm here because my name is Ronaldo.
> - you are jealous of my genius.




No 10 page thread eh?


----------



## Evilo

You can't blame my objectivity!


----------



## les Habs

i actually read that Ronaldo's violation was far worse than Messi's. I didn't read the specifics, but it's amazing there's no big discussion about it here. Actually it's not amazing considering the sentiment around here.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Somebody should start a new thread!

Umititi has been amazing today.

Casemiro is wreckless as ever, ref finally called him out.

Btw Isco is a beauty, totally dominating the midfield.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Is kroos even playing? Such an overrated player


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Vasilevskiy said:


> Is kroos even playing? Such an overrated player




Is Bale?

Isco is and he's abusing Vidal... as is Marcelo. New kid should've started.


----------



## Live in the Now

Isco, Umtiti, and Kovacic have looked like heroes in this match. Everyone else a bit off the boil.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Is Bale?
> 
> Isco is and he's abusing Vidal... as is Marcelo. New kid should've started.




At least Bale touches the ball.

Yeah Isco is abusing Aleix


----------



## Power Man

Both teams look a little uninterested. 
Or maybe my expectations are too high lol


----------



## Power Man

What a rough week for PiquÃƒÂ©


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

deulofeuOUT


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Both teams look a little uninterested.
> Or maybe my expectations are too high lol




It is a trophy, it is el clasico, but it still is "preseason".

I still wanna us to win though.


----------



## Power Man

Scandale du Jour said:


> It is a trophy, it is el clasico, but it still is "preseason".
> 
> I still wanna us to win though.




Yup. 

Last 5 minutes have been brutal though, we are ball watching


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Why is Vidal playing?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That's a pk but biscuits should've scored. Denis should always be ahead of Everton boy.


----------



## Power Man

Ffs Carvajal and Ramos


----------



## PeteWorrell

Suarez dives.


----------



## Adonis Creed

2 games ban incoming for Suarez?

awful dive


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Stonewall call!

Lio is frustrated tho


----------



## Power Man

To be fair Barcelona should have had a penalty earlier


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Hahaha suarez


----------



## spintheblackcircle

The best!!!!!


----------



## Adonis Creed

GONALDOOOOOOOOOO

Beautiful.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Holy ****


----------



## Jersey Fresh

Aaaand the shirt's off.


----------



## Jersey Fresh

Oh ****! And he pushed him lol.

Suarez gets a pen, Ronaldo gets sent off.


----------



## spintheblackcircle

CR7 is ****ed now.


----------



## Power Man

Alphanaldo doing Alpha things


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Lmfao 

That should be 5 games? Oh wait it's a real player


----------



## Live in the Now

Deserved and then he pushed the ref. Wow.


----------



## Power Man

Lmao wtf refs


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Entertaining **** happening. 
Umtiti is a boss


----------



## Jersey Fresh

Live in the Now said:


> Deserved and then he pushed the ref. Wow.




It's deserved if you're going to call it both ways.


----------



## lidstromiscool

And people still say Madrid get the beneficial calls


----------



## Live in the Now

Jersey Fresh said:


> It's deserved if you're going to call it both ways.




Yeah I agree. I was away when the Suarez penalty call happened so I didn't see it at all, but yeah. If he took a dive then it should be a yellow card.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

lidstromiscool said:


> And people still say Madrid get the beneficial calls




La Ligalona


----------



## PeteWorrell

Asensio...Wow.


----------



## spintheblackcircle

Wow!!!!


----------



## Live in the Now

Pique looked horrendous in this game.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

What a shot, this guy is spain's future. Should have signed him before Madrid


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Eat that Barca.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Kid is disgusting. Glad we choose Douglas to appease Neymar instead of him.


----------



## Power Man

Iove Isco and Asensio


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Iove Isco and Asensio




Isco is stupid remember that's why he doesn't get playing time.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Not saying Madrid's win is undeserved, but I think we played slightly better, still Madrid scored on their chances and we did not. 

Hard job to overcome the result


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Just lol at this season before it even starts. The only hope to this season is that Bartomeu might get voted out.

Madrid doesn't even have Modric playing. Plus they can bring on Isco, Asensio and kovacic.


----------



## PeteWorrell

Vasilevskiy said:


> Not saying Madrid's win is undeserved, but I think we played slightly better, still Madrid scored on their chances and we did not.
> 
> Hard job to overcome the result



Madrid missed tons of chances also.They got an own goal by PiquÃ© and two unstoppable goals to win.


----------



## Power Man

PiquÃƒÂ© involved in all 3 goals,, da real MVP


----------



## Live in the Now

Vasilevskiy said:


> Not saying Madrid's win is undeserved, but I think we played slightly better, still Madrid scored on their chances and we did not.
> 
> Hard job to overcome the result



I think Barcelona did play slightly better in certain phases, but they have a massive problem on left wing. Lots of attacks that should have been capitalized went out there to die. D. Suarez was better than Deulofeu there, but €150m for Coutinho will solve that. 

When Suarez went ballistic over not getting a ball from D. Suarez it pretty much summed up the game for me. Pique in the 1 v. 1's wasn't very good either and I don't know what to think of that.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Power Man said:


> PiquÃƒÂ© involved in all 3 goals,, da real MVP




Started really good but...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Vasilevskiy said:


> Not saying Madrid's win is undeserved, but I think we played slightly better, still Madrid scored on their chances and we did not.
> 
> Hard job to overcome the result




I don't know about being better but the scoreline is in their favour for sure. Doesn't help when you play with short a man for 70+ minutes. 

You can see the frustration in both Suarez and Messi. Suarez yelling at both Del and Denis. The former was abysmal and single handedly ruined half a dozen chances for barca. Too slow in decision making and usually picking out the wrong option. Denis was miles miles better he too wasn't that great. 

Messi was doing things he normal does not and that's forcing plays. Shots from the outside. Gonna be a long season if they're going to rely on Del for anything.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

DatsyukOwns said:


> Just lol at this season before it even starts. The only hope to this season is that Bartomeu might get voted out.
> 
> Madrid doesn't even have Modric playing. *Plus they can bring on Isco, Asensio and kovacic*.




I see that and raise you Paco, Gomes and Paulinho.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Live in the Now said:


> I think Barcelona did play slightly better in certain phases, but they have a massive problem on left wing. Lots of attacks that should have been capitalized went out there to die. D. Suarez was better than Deulofeu there, but â‚¬150m for Coutinho will solve that.
> 
> When Suarez went ballistic over not getting a ball from D. Suarez it pretty much summed up the game for me. Pique in the 1 v. 1's wasn't very good either and I don't know what to think of that.




Denis was good, at least decided to do something different. Deulofeu had clear shoot chances or 1vs1 but all the time his decision was to pass to Messi/Suarez.

We need Dembele there.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> I think Barcelona did play slightly better in certain phases, but they have a massive problem on left wing. Lots of attacks that should have been capitalized went out there to die. D. Suarez was better than Deulofeu there, but â‚¬150m for Coutinho will solve that.
> 
> When Suarez went ballistic over not getting a ball from D. Suarez it pretty much summed up the game for me. *Pique in the 1 v. 1's wasn't very good either and I don't know what to think of that*.




Probably suffering from that own goal. He was great prior to that. Plus he was facing a lethal counter attacking team with little support in both occasions.


----------



## sabremike

Live in the Now said:


> Deserved and then he pushed the ref. Wow.



Ronaldo has a well earned rep but on this one he didn't dive. He clearly just lost his balance. The stupid thing was getting the yellow for taking his shirt off after the goal. While I think that is the stupidest rule in all of soccer it's the rule and breaking it and getting a pointless yellow is just dumb.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Deulofeu was like a deer caught in the headlights in this game


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Vasilevskiy said:


> Not saying Madrid's win is undeserved, but I think we played slightly better, still Madrid scored on their chances and we did not.
> 
> Hard job to overcome the result




Yup. Worried about Suarez, he hasn't been all that great this year.


----------



## sabremike

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Yup. Worried about Suarez, he hasn't been all that great this year.



So you're saying he's lost some of his bite???


----------



## les Habs

Glad we lost this. Haven't seen and not sure I'll bother, but reading the comments here I probably should. Ronaldo's obsession with Messi speaks volumes about how he's simply not on his level.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Isco is stupid remember that's why he doesn't get playing time.




Is this in reference to me?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Glad we lost this. Haven't seen and not sure I'll bother, but reading the comments here I probably should. Ronaldo's obsession with Messi speaks volumes about how he's simply not on his level.
> 
> 
> 
> Is this in reference to me?




Skip the first half. It was Z feast. 2nd was entertaining though. Hell watch the whole game, you'll get a good sense of how this team will play.

Nope, it was towards Mcsorely.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Skip the first half. It was Z feast. 2nd was entertaining though. Hell watch the whole game, you'll get a good sense of how this team will play.
> 
> Nope, it was towards Mcsorely.




Yeah, not in the mood tonight. Early days, but I don't have a good feeling about Valverde on top the issues with the squad.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

GODNALDO.

It's like the movie Groundhog Day... Cristiano breaking hearts in the Camp Nou, sending Pique sprawling across the pitch like a clown over and over again.






1-3 in the dump, it's going to be a rout at the Bernabeu on Wednesday. Can't wait.


----------



## Hadoop

sabremike said:


> So you're saying he's lost some of his bite???




I lol'ed at this


----------



## les Habs

RoyIsALegend said:


> GODNALDO.
> 
> It's like the movie Groundhog Day... Cristiano breaking hearts in the Camp Nou, sending Pique sprawling across the pitch like a clown over and over again.
> 
> 1-3 in the dump, it's going to be a rout at the Bernabeu on Wednesday. Can't wait.




Ronaldo sending Pique sprawling is nothing like Groundhog's Day. As for the picture, as hilarious as that is seeing as how he's clearly bothered Messi is and always has been better than him, it's even more hilarious that a supporter would actually post it.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Embarrassing stuff an inferior complex if I ever seen one.


----------



## Power Man

les Habs said:


> Ronaldo's obsession with Messi speaks volumes about how he's simply not on his level.




Hahahahahaha


----------



## Power Man

RoyIsALegend said:


> GODNALDO.
> 
> It's like the movie Groundhog Day... Cristiano breaking hearts in the Camp Nou, sending Pique sprawling across the pitch like a clown over and over again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1-3 in the dump, it's going to be a rout at the Bernabeu on Wednesday. Can't wait.




Big d... Naldo showing up in big games once again
Misty needed a BS penalty to score. 

Alphanaldo comes in and scores the game winner a few minutes later.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Embarrassing stuff an inferior complex if I ever seen one.




Yeah, their posts in this thread are pretty telling.


----------



## Jussi

les Habs said:


> Yeah, their posts in this thread are pretty telling.




Yes, UEFAlona fans really are embarrassing themselves again.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Yeah, their posts in this thread are pretty telling.




I was referring to Ronaldo celly mostly but ya.



Jussi said:


> Yes, UEFAlona fans really are embarrassing themselves again.




Not to be out done by the stupidity of Madrid fans... here comes Ronaldo's ex. 

UEFAlona eh been awhile since you lot played in that. Enjoying spending a fortune without winning anything worthy of the price.


----------



## Live in the Now

Enough. I'll reopen this before the next game.


----------



## Live in the Now

Great strike there.


----------



## les Habs

Valverde is a moron. Management needs to be gutted.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Valverde is a moron. Management needs to be gutted.




Well I don't think it's fair to judge his early but no not liking this lineup.

To be fair I think Barca can't match Madrid right now.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Well I don't think it's fair to judge his early but no not liking this lineup.
> 
> To be fair I think Barca can't match Madrid right now.




I saw about 25 minutes of the first half last week and they were more than matching them. This formation though? Wonder goal to be sure, but stupid and cowardly lineup.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio is such a treat to watch.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Vazquez has wasted three glorious opportunities so far. Barca's defense is swiss cheese.


----------



## Cassano

Men against boys right now.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> I saw about 25 minutes of the first half last week and they were more than matching them. This formation though? Wonder goal to be sure, but stupid and cowardly lineup.




You can't really dominate teams for 90 minutes not when you still have elite players.



Scandale du Jour said:


> Vazquez has wasted three glorious opportunities so far. Barca's defense is swiss cheese.




There's just too much space down the flanks. These players have no experience playing with 3 at the back. It shows.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

This has been a slaughter fest


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> You can't really dominate teams for 90 minutes not when you still have elite players.
> 
> 
> 
> There's just too much space down the flanks. These players have no experience playing with 3 at the back. It shows.




Agreed. Real have been launching all of their counters from the side with long passes to the flank. Working great so far.

Benz!!!!!!!


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Deserved. What a nightmare


----------



## ecemleafs

real are miles ahead of barca right now.


----------



## PeteWorrell

Barcelona aren't coming back unless Real just stops playing.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

It was coming!


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Men, we are making look Lucas Vazquez like Garrincha in this one


----------



## Vamos Rafa

Would Ronaldo's suspension include UCL playoff matches if RM were to play in the playoff round?


----------



## les Habs

Like I said. Valverde is a moron. Madridista reffing isn't helping either. 



Vamos Rafa said:


> Would Ronaldo's suspension include UCL playoff matches if RM were to play in the playoff round?




Is that a serious question?


----------



## Cassano

Imagine Ronaldo against these defenses.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

les Habs said:


> Like I said. Valverde is a moron. *Madridista reffing isn't helping either*.




You cannot be serious


----------



## John Pedro

That's really sad. BarÃ§a needs Coutinho, Dembele, and a young defensive mid to be Busquets' heir.


----------



## les Habs

Vasilevskiy said:


> You cannot be serious




Kroos goes down on minimal contact it's foul then Messi clearly fouled and nothing. Hence Messi talking to the ref afterwards.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Valverde has a lot of work to do with this midfield and defence. It's August after all, but it does feel like another season of wasting Messi's prime 

Atleast they will get closer to ousting this useless board.


----------



## Cassano

John Pedro said:


> That's really sad. BarÃƒÂ§a needs Coutinho, Dembele, and a young defensive mid to be Busquets' heir.




They have one already (Samper). 

But they don't want to play him.


----------



## les Habs

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Valverde has a lot of work to do with this midfield and defence. It's August after all, but it does feel like another season of wasting Messi's prime
> 
> Atleast they will get closer to ousting this useless board.




He shouldn't have changed the formation for starters. Same starting XI as last week except Semedo for Vidal, Roberto/Alena for Iniesta and possibly Denis for Deulofeu. That's it. Instead he comes up with this. 

Hence my liking this result. Pressure will be huge on them if this continues or stays the same.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Kroos goes down on minimal contact it's foul then Messi clearly fouled and nothing. Hence Messi talking to the ref afterwards.




I think he was referring to Biscuits getting dispossessed leading up to Benz goal. Either way right now Madrid don't need the ref, doing an excellent job beating Barca.



TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Valverde has a lot of work to do with this midfield and defence. It's August after all, but it does feel like another season of wasting Messi's prime
> 
> Atleast they will get closer to ousting this useless board.




He can start by starting the natural RB, they bought for 30 ****ing million. I mean how is it he's not had some minutes in this glorified exhibition?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

les Habs said:


> Kroos goes down on minimal contact it's foul then Messi clearly fouled and nothing. Hence Messi talking to the ref afterwards.





Next time you want to complaim about the refs, don't use a game in which your team is getting ass ****ed. Last game Barca was gifted a penalty and Ronaldo was sent.off for "diving" on a clear foul. Didn't see you crticize the refs...


----------



## John Pedro

DrRecchi said:


> They have one already (Samper).
> 
> But they don't want to play him.




yeah don't get why they aren't giving a fair shot for La Masia kids to prove themselves. Alena is also a hot prospect that should be giving more PT.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Next time you want to complaim about the refs, don't use a game in which your team is getting ass ****ed. Last game Barca was gifted a penalty and Ronaldo was sent.off for diving on a clear foul. Didn't see you crticize the refs...




Yeah it wasn't a foul.


----------



## Peen

Scandale du Jour said:


> Next time you want to complaim about the refs, don't use a game in which your team is getting ass ****ed. Last game Barca was gifted a penalty and Ronaldo was sent.off for "diving" on a clear foul. Didn't see you crticize the refs...



+1 

Classensio


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I think he was referring to Biscuits getting dispossessed leading up to Benz goal. Either way right now Madrid don't need the ref, doing an excellent job beating Barca.




I don't care what he was referring to. I wasn't referring to that.

Agreed the don't need the ref, hence my saying it "isn't helping either." 



Scandale du Jour said:


> Next time you want to complaim about the refs, don't use a game in which your team is getting ass ****ed. Last game Barca was gifted a penalty and Ronaldo was sent.off for diving on a clear foul. Didn't see you crticize the refs...




Because I didn't see that one, and I posted as much, genius. I saw about 25 minutes of the first half today and that was even worse than this.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Yeah it wasn't a foul.




Wasn't a dive either. At worse their bodies tangled. My point was mostly that it is easy to complain about refs, no matter who you root for.


----------



## les Habs

Scandale du Jour said:


> Wasn't a dive either. At worse their bodies tangled. My point was mostly that it is easy to complain about refs, no matter who you root for.




So their bodies tangled or was it a foul?


----------



## Live in the Now

I thought the last game was fairly officiated as a whole. Only watched 10 minutes of this one though.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

Barca will have done well if this game doesn't finish 4-0 or 5-0. 

Two teams on completely different levels of class. Barca look clueless in all areas of the pitch, Madrid's high pressing, width, and one touch football is simply too much for clowns like Pique/Umtiti/Mascherano.


----------



## John Pedro

SE QUEDA subbed off


----------



## Cassano

Hahahha Real fans chanting se queda as he goes off.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

John Pedro said:


> SE QUEDA subbed off




A mercy substitution. 

He has been the worst player from either team over the two games. This saves him 45 minutes of, essentially, a live comedy roast in front of the Bernabeu. 

Excellent move from Valverde.


----------



## Power Man

Lulz


----------



## les Habs

RoyIsALegend said:


> A mercy substitution.
> 
> He has been the worst player from either team over the two games. This saves him 45 minutes of, essentially, a live comedy roast in front of the Bernabeu.
> 
> Excellent move from Valverde.




No. For starters he hasn't been bad in this match and Vidal was worse.


----------



## John Pedro

Marcelo is freaking ridiculous. Best LB I've ever seen. Better than Roberto Carlos, imo.


----------



## Live in the Now

He's definitely up there. Especially going forward.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

John Pedro said:


> Marcelo is freaking ridiculous. Best LB I've ever seen. Better than Roberto Carlos, imo.




Not at all, lol, and I'm Madridista.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

les Habs said:


> So their bodies tangled or was it a foul?





IMO it was a foul. At worst, one could argue they tangled. Clearly not a dive though.

Varane is having a great game so far.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

We want Ceballos.


----------



## Power Man

RoyIsALegend said:


> Not at all, lol, and I'm Madridista.





Agreed. 
Marcelo is awesome but RC was on another level


----------



## Live in the Now

Roberto Carlos is massively overrated.


----------



## John Pedro

RoyIsALegend said:


> Not at all, lol, and I'm Madridista.




It's alright, for me he's the best. His technique is quite ridiculous for an FB and he has the vision of a '10'. Definitely my fav full back.


----------



## Power Man

The good news for Barcelona fans is the presentation of Paulinho tomorrow


----------



## Power Man

Live in the Now said:


> Roberto Carlos is massively overrated.




But is he better than Milner?


----------



## Live in the Now

Nope

I'd rather have Maldini and Marcelo.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

Would be nice to see SeÃ±or Anti-Cule himself Dani Ceballos come on and finish them off.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Power Man said:


> The good news for Barcelona fans is the presentation of Paulinho tomorrow




Lul.


----------



## John Pedro

Tough luck for Barcelona too


----------



## Cassano

Power Man said:


> The good news for Barcelona fans is the presentation of Paulinho tomorrow




Sav.


----------



## les Habs

TF is Valverde doing now?


----------



## PeteWorrell

les Habs said:


> TF is Valverde doing now?



Making poor decisions.


----------



## John Pedro

urgh Suarez pulled a muscle


----------



## RoyIsALegend

Ruthless... PSG's Twitter account during the game:


----------



## Deficient Mode

Would definitely take Marcelo over Roberto Carlos


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

RoyIsALegend said:


> Salt in the wounds. Ruthless.





Next they should post their champions league trophy cabinet.


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

RoyIsALegend said:


> Ruthless... PSG's Twitter account during the game:




PSG is such a pathetic club.

Hot take: mid 2010s dynasty Madrid is better than Peak Barcelona from Pep's era.

Cool take: Kroos and Modric are the two best midfielders in the world. Without question.

Paulinho a close turd.


----------



## Deficient Mode

WhiskeySeven said:


> PSG is such a pathetic club.
> 
> Hot take: mid 2010s dynasty Madrid is better than Peak Barcelona from Pep's era.




Not even that hot of a take anymore. This squad is unbelievably good.

Sadly it will become about Cristiano vs. Messi.


----------



## Power Man

RoyIsALegend said:


> Ruthless... PSG's Twitter account during the game:





Damn


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Deficient Mode said:


> Not even that hot of a take anymore. This squad is unbelievably good.
> 
> Sadly it will become about Cristiano vs. Messi.




2 trebles how many do this Madrid have?


----------



## Cassano

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Next they should post their champions league trophy cabinet.




Give it a couple of months.


----------



## YNWA14

This Madrid is stupidly good. Easy favourites for the CL again.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

DrRecchi said:


> Give it a couple of months.




More than willing to give that. If y'all wanna crown them go ahead.


----------



## John Pedro

The weird thing about football now, at least European football, is that teams barely celebrate their titles, unless it's a UCL... kinda sad. Looks like Madrid just won a friendly match.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> 2 trebles how many do this Madrid have?




They have 3 CL titles in 4 years and are favorites again. That's probably more impressive than the trebles.


----------



## Cassano

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> More than willing to give that. If y'all wanna crown them go ahead.




True. Forgot about their coach for a second.


----------



## PeteWorrell

John Pedro said:


> The weird thing about football now, at least European football, is that teams barely celebrate their titles, unless it's a UCL... kinda sad. Looks like Madrid just won a friendly match.



It's a glorified friendly like pretty much all preseason trophies.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Deficient Mode said:


> They have 3 CL titles in 4 years and are favorites again. That's probably more impressive than the trebles.




Not really considering you have to be nearly perfect to win all the major competitions. You can't afford one slip up. That and the amount of games you play in a season. It's all in context of how the games are won too.

Pretty shocked you of all people would argue against this.


----------



## les Habs

Deserved win for Madrid. Too bad the second leg wasn't at the Camp Nou. Would have liked to have seen if some hankies came out.



Deficient Mode said:


> They have 3 CL titles in 4 years and are favorites again. That's probably more impressive than the trebles.




To each their own, but I'd take the Trebles.



WhiskeySeven said:


> PSG is such a pathetic club.
> 
> *Hot take: mid 2010s dynasty Madrid is better than Peak Barcelona from Pep's era.*
> 
> Cool take: *Kroos *and Modric are the two best midfielders in the world. Without question.
> 
> Paulinho a close turd.




No and no.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Deserved win for Madrid. Too bad the second leg wasn't at the Camp Nou. *Would have liked to have seen if some hankies came out*.
> 
> 
> 
> To each their own, but I'd take the Trebles.
> 
> 
> 
> No and no.




Good thing it wasn't...as it would've been really embarrassing.


----------



## Live in the Now

Valverde won't be at Barcelona long. I give it four months.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not really considering you have to be nearly perfect to win all the major competitions. You can't afford one slip up. That and the amount of games you play in a season. It's all in context of how the games are won too.
> 
> Pretty shocked you of all people would argue against this.




Me of all people? Because I like Pep?

I'd take Pep's Barca slightly, but it's not that hot of a take to say Madrid now are better honestly.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

DrRecchi said:


> Give it a couple of months.




GL against this Madrid team


----------



## Nalens Oga

I grew up watching footy in the early 2000s so can I just say how much I enjoy seeing Barca be humbled? I hate their dominance since the Rijkaard/Ronaldinho days, it's an annoying club for me whenever they're winning so this is glorious. Too bad it's Real beating them instead of Valencia like back in the day but still.

Also, that lightish blue colour on the Real jersey is quite ugly, they need to go back to the black or at least navy blue stripes.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Deficient Mode said:


> Not even that hot of a take anymore. *This squad is unbelievably good.*
> 
> Sadly it will become about Cristiano vs. Messi.




Agreed, one of the deepest teams I've ever seen.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> Valverde won't be at Barcelona long. I give it four months.




You guys are ruthless.

Sadly, I see no replacement.



Deficient Mode said:


> Me of all people? Because I like Pep?
> 
> I'd take Pep's Barca slightly, but it's not that hot of a take to say Madrid now are better honestly.




Nope, because I value your opinion when it comes to how the games are played and this Madrid team doesn't touch Pep's barca. The day they demolish a WC Mourinho team 5-0 then we can talk.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Good thing it wasn't...as it would've been really embarrassing.




So what? Long term is the key here. 



Live in the Now said:


> Valverde won't be at Barcelona long. I give it four months.




Hopefully. Problem is who do you bring in?


----------



## Deficient Mode

Live in the Now said:


> Valverde won't be at Barcelona long. I give it four months.




Valverde is a good coach but a poor fit for what we normally associate with Barca. Probably not good enough to compensate for the deeper issues with the squad while under so much pressure. You could tell right from the first few minutes that he had a horrible game plan too.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Nope, because I value your opinion when it comes to how the games are played and this Madrid team doesn't touch Pep's barca. The day they demolish a WC Mourinho team 5-0 then we can talk.




I was very low on them last year but at some point that much CL success isn't a fluke. They seem poor tactically from match to match but they can really put it together in the big matches.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> You guys are ruthless.
> 
> Sadly, I see no replacement.
> 
> 
> 
> Nope, because I value your opinion when it comes to how the games are played and *this Madrid team doesn't touch Pep's barca*. The day they demolish a WC Mourinho team 5-0 then we can talk.




I agree that Pep's barÃƒÂ§a played better football but re-watch today's 1st half... these guys can play if they want.


----------



## les Habs

This Madrid has more depth, but under Pep we had midfield. That said to say they "don't touch" us from back then is wrong. 

Right now since Neymar is gone Madrid should be putting in results like this.


----------



## Live in the Now

les Habs said:


> Hopefully. Problem is who do you bring in?




All that's really out there is Tuchel. Maybe Klopp or Blanc. Not exactly many options. I don't think Valverde is clueless or anything but he has no experience managing these kinds of personalities. It won't go well.


----------



## les Habs

Live in the Now said:


> All that's really out there is Tuchel. Maybe Klopp or Blanc. Not exactly many options. I don't think Valverde is clueless or anything but he has no experience managing these kinds of personalities. It won't go well.




Clearly looked clueless today. Dumb formation, some dumb selections and dumb substitutions. I think the personalities, which weren't even an issue for him, are the least of his worries right now. 

Tuchel is who came to my mind.


----------



## PeteWorrell

Tuchel would clash with the board.They want a yes man.


----------



## Luigi Habs

This Madrid team is incredible. One of the best I've ever seen. People tend to make it a Ronaldo vs Messi but really there's no comparison to be made. Even without Ronaldo and Bale, RM blows Barca. Barca were all MSN last season, and if they don't bring Dembele and Coutinho they'll be a 2 players club this season. It'll be an easy Liga title for RM.

Btw Asensio is an incredible talent.


----------



## Cassano

PeteWorrell said:


> Tuchel would clash with the board.They want a yes man.




Ã¢â„¢ÂªÃ¢â„¢ÂªÃ¢â„¢Âª There's only one Arsene Wenger... Ã¢â„¢ÂªÃ¢â„¢ÂªÃ¢â„¢Âª


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Hot-take: Asensio is the best young player in the world.


----------



## YNWA14

Asensio is Dutch for the record.

Also he's certainly up there.


----------



## Live in the Now

Mbappe and Dembele are better. Third isn't a bad place to be.


----------



## PeteWorrell

Curtinho said:


> Asensio is Dutch for the record.
> 
> Also he's certainly up there.



His mother is Dutch but his father is Basque.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Curtinho said:


> Asensio is Dutch for the record.
> 
> Also he's certainly up there.




In the same sense Zizo is Algerian.



Live in the Now said:


> Mbappe and Dembele are better. Third isn't a bad place to be.




Not to mention Simeone and Calleri.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not to mention Simeone and Calleri.




Hope you aren't serious.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> In the same sense Zizo is Algerian




At least Zizou has an algerian name


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> Hope you aren't serious.




You're clearly under rating them. Probably never watched Udiense.



Luiginho said:


> At least Zizou has an algerian name




This is true. So yeah, "Dutch" indeed.


----------



## Live in the Now

Marco Asensio Willemsen sounds pretty Dutch to me, but none of his football development or life was spent there.


----------



## Savant

Live in the Now said:


> Marco Asensio Willemsen sounds pretty Dutch to me, but none of his football development or life was spent there.




Interesting story. Dutch mother named him after Van Basten. Unfortunately she passed away before his Real Madrid move.


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

This Madrid team is incredible head to toe. They should go down as superior to Peak Barcelona. Especially if Zizou handles the transition toward Isco and Asensio well. La Liga's gonna be boring this year.



Toni Kroos' trophy cabinet must be one of the largest ever at this point.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not to mention Simeone and Calleri.




No offense but it is not close. He is on another level, just like dembele and mbappe are


----------



## Corto

Kovacic was immense for these two games (and the best Real player in the US game as well), Asensio great, etc. Modric and Kroos killed the midfield again, etc...

But one guy who I'm more impressed with every single game is Varane.

I'm not sure people realize how stupidly fast he is. 
Suarez is not the fastest guy out there, but Varane left him absolutely for dead a couple of times.

...

It's not that they have basically a world class player at every position. It's that they have a world class talent as a replacement for every position.

...

Barca need help, but they also need some of their guys to step up. Busquets losing the ball 5 times is not down to Neymar leaving or Dembele not signing yet. Rakitic not passing to Semedo is not down to Coutinho not being there yet.
Pique being an absolute wreck is not down to some outside factor.
Suarez's numbers were good last year, but his play has been below par (for his usual play).
Messi was at his least noticable that I've seen in a while (Kovacic man marking was pretty great, I gotta say) - even though he'll still always create something, it's GOAT Messi.

It's not just that they're missing some top-end quality. It's that their existing top talent is playing subpar football (compared to what they're capable of).


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Vasilevskiy said:


> No offense but it is not close. He is on another level, just like dembele and mbappe are




You also haven't been paying attention to udinese.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

D2M, just stop my dude. It's ok.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Not until everyone here admits Simeone has been great for Udiense.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

On a serious note Suarez out for a month according to initial reports. Silverlining is this is good for Argentina.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> On a serious note Suarez out for a month according to initial reports. Silverlining is this is good for Argentina.




Lmao what a terrible off-season for Barca. Nightmare.


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

Luiginho said:


> Lmao what a terrible off-season for Barca. Nightmare.




Genuinely might be the worst off-season of any big club that I can remember.


----------



## PeteWorrell

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> On a serious note Suarez out for a month according to initial reports. Silverlining is this is good for Argentina.



So smart from Valverde to bring in Lucas Digne instead of subbing out Suarez when the game had lost all meaning.


----------



## Power Man

Srsly as much as I hate Barca, it's sad to see this, we need competition


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Srsly as much as I hate Barca, it's sad to see this, we need competition




I'll enjoy it this year. But, yeah, in the long run, I want la liga to be as competitive as possible.


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

Power Man said:


> Srsly as much as I hate Barca, it's sad to see this, we need competition



Should humble many of their so-called fans. It's good to shake the homers and plastics off every so often.


----------



## Savi

Power Man said:


> Srsly as much as I hate Barca, it's sad to see this, we need competition




Relax. Madrid won't be as good as people think, and BarÃƒÂ§a won't be as bad. In the end Madrid will win the league but it'll still be pretty close.


----------



## Power Man

WhiskeySeven said:


> Should humble many of their so-called fans. It's good to shake the homers and plastics off every so often.




On 2nd thought I'm gonna enjoy it. 
I remember how much they were trolling us during their golden era


----------



## Evilo

Not tonight man, not tonight.


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

Power Man said:


> On 2nd thought I'm gonna enjoy it.
> I remember how much they were trolling us during their golden era



Madrid were worse then than Barcelona are now. Madrid earned all the mockery, to be honest.


----------



## xavi4life

WhiskeySeven said:


> Madrid were worse then than Barcelona are now. Madrid earned all the mockery, to be honest.




BarÃ§a deserve theirs. Madrid have done almost everything right starting with the signing of Zidane as coach. Although he employs a more pragmatic and direct style, he is up there with Pep Guardiola as far as his tactical acumen. He also uses the talent at his disposal to perfection, something that Pep really struggled with and managed to **** off Eto'o, Ibrahimovic and a slew of others which really hurt the team financially.

The fact that people have been calling for this board and specifically Bartomeu to resign is not reactionary. Any fan can see the deterioration of the club's play style and values. Laporta was right, this new board has systematically tried to tear down everything they accomplished. It's really sad that while having the best player in the world (Messi), BarÃ§a has only managed to win 3 UCLs.


----------



## Evilo

Read an article about socios fed up with Camp Nou becoming a new Disneyland. 
Couldn't agree more.


----------



## Savi

xavi4life said:


> It's really sad that while having the best player in the world (Messi), BarÃƒÂ§a has only managed to win 3 UCLs.




4 UCL's

Winning 4 CL's in 12 years seems pretty decent to me though.


----------



## maclean

Savi said:


> 4 UCL's
> 
> Winning 4 CL's in 12 years seems pretty decent to me though.




Real's won 3 in the past 4 years though with no signs of slowing down


----------



## Savi

That doesn't mean that 4 in 12 is "sad".


----------



## xavi4life

Savi said:


> That doesn't mean that 4 in 12 is "sad".




True, but seeing them fall short so many times with such a great team is frustrating. Especially with RM winning 3 in the last 4 years. 

Madrid knows the secret to building an elite squad...








































It's all in the midfield. 
Somehow BarÃ§a forgot that they owed their success to Xavi, Iniesta & Busquets.


----------



## Savi

xavi4life said:


> True, but seeing them fall short so many times with such a great team is frustrating. Especially with RM winning 3 in the last 4 years.
> 
> Madrid knows the secret to building an elite squad...




But Madrid had plenty of luck, especially during those first two wins. Some more of that luck and we could've had 5/6 CL wins. Going on out away goals (Liverpool 2007), against Inter (2010) or Chelsea (2012) playing at home against ten men and both times only needing one goal, away at Man Utd (2008) or Atletico (2014) needing one goal as well, that Atletico game in 2015.. So many close exits. I feel in all those years only Juve last year and Bayern in 2013 completely overwhelmed us.


----------



## Jersey Fresh

Zaza actually looks like a competent player at Valencia. 

Also, Halilovic went in hard, but I think that was a harsh red.


----------



## Savi

Good result for Valencia. Really needed to win their first game since their next two are against Madrid and Atletico.

With Kondogbia, Murillo and Gabriel coming they should be a lot more solid than last season. Plenty of young up and coming talents up front as well.


----------



## Savi

Atleti down 0-2 at Girona after 25 minutes


----------



## PeteWorrell

They were bad at the beginning of last year too.


----------



## maclean

Did Griezmann just get sent off for diving?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Gimenze ties it up. Terrible decision by Iraizoz


----------



## Live in the Now

I was just about to say something nice about Sevilla's squad, then N'Zonzi gives the ball away and literally does not jog back a single foot from midfield before they concede.


----------



## Power Man

Boudebouz not fit to play against Barcelona 

**** I was eager to watch him play in La Liga

But hey, Mandi will offer a show, his defense is comical


----------



## booyakasha

Barca coming at Betis in waves.....what a free kick by Messi, unlucky.


----------



## booyakasha

nice goal.....just dissected the defence of Betis.


*own goal.


----------



## Nalens Oga

Ugh this Betis defense is too static, making Barcelona look better than they are come on.

Also not sure if that tackle was clean, I think he clipped him before he even got the ball.


----------



## booyakasha

holy!
what a challenge by Mascherano, and counter.
clynical.


----------



## booyakasha

Nalens Oga said:


> Ugh this Betis defense is too static, making Barcelona look better than they are come on.
> 
> Also not sure if that tackle was clean, I think he clipped him before he even got the ball.




I thought so as well, but the replay showed a brilliant tackle.
risky but worked out.


----------



## bluesfan94

Unreal tackle by Mascherano


----------



## Cassano

bluesfan94 said:


> Unreal tackle by Mascherano




Did he tear open his ******* on this one too?


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Semedo looks great, wish Rakitic would link up more with him.


----------



## booyakasha

Roberto is looking really bright this game as well.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Navas with two great saves already. Real will have to be more careful defending the counter...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

My boy Bale with perhaps the easiest goal of his career.


----------



## bluesfan94

Marcelo is so good.


----------



## Live in the Now

The Isco heat map there. Whole field covered.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema having a tough first half.


----------



## bluesfan94

Ramos should be off.


----------



## Live in the Now

Schar also lucky to not be off.

Also while I'm thinking about it, Bakkali shows what happens when talent remains undeveloped. All he can really do is chase the ball.


----------



## bluesfan94

Live in the Now said:


> Schar also lucky to not be off.
> 
> Also while I'm thinking about it, Bakkali shows what happens when talent remains undeveloped. All he can really do is chase the ball.




I'll rewatch but I don't think SchÃ¤r did much. 

That's a little unfair. He played fairly well today. You can definitely see the talent underneath.


----------



## bluesfan94

Ramos ends up getting a second yellow anyway. Also Navas saved a pen that wasn't great to begin with


----------



## S E P H

La Liga refs man, worst in Europe. 

Every 50/50 decision is either a red card or penalty. 

Those two plays would never been called in the EPL, especially when Carvajhal got a touch of the ball before contact was made. And even Ramos, that was more forearm accidental contact than deliberate, perhaps a bit careless. No elbow in the play at all.


----------



## Panteras

well I knew we were going to lose to Madrid. But is the score representative? How did Depor play?


----------



## Live in the Now

Depor played well, I thought.

They had one chance that Navas had to make a 7.5/10 save on.

Another that required an 8/10.

Penalty that was missed.

Score is not representative as RM's first goal was gifted to them by the keeper. Third was deflected, may or may not have been going in anyway.


----------



## Panteras

Live in the Now said:


> Depor played well, I thought.
> 
> They had one chance that Navas had to make a 7.5/10 save on.
> 
> Another that required an 8/10.
> 
> Penalty that was missed.
> 
> Score is not representative as RM's first goal was gifted to them by the keeper. Third was deflected, may or may not have been going in anyway.




cool thanks for the review. I don't feel too bummed out, gives me some hope for the rest of the season. I wish they just remain competitive.


----------



## RoyIsALegend

With his 18th red card in his La Liga career, Ramos tied retired footballers Pablo Alfaro and Xavi Aguado for most ever reds in Spanish top flight football.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

RoyIsALegend said:


> With his 18th red card in his La Liga career, Ramos tied retired footballers Pablo Alfaro and Xavi Aguado for most ever reds in Spanish top flight football.




He'll probably break the record before Christmas.


----------



## les Habs

If the refs called it like it should be Ramos would already be the record holder.

All things considered I wasn't too displeased with BarÃ§a's performance. Messi could have had a hat-trick and hit the post three times. Focusing on a few specific players some encouraging signs. Sergi had a good match apart from that lazy back pass as he really worked hard and covered a lot of ground. Could definitely see him scoring more goals like the one he scored. I thought Deulofeu was pretty good in the final third and played a part in both goals. I still think we need a Neymar replacement, but Deulofeu with Messi and Suarez still would surely produce something. Alcacer wasn't great, but he put in a lot of hard work and he makes some good runs. Would have preferred him in the middle, Messi on the right and Deulofeu out left. Really like Semedo on the right. I think they need to get him more involved in the attack.


----------



## Corto

RoyIsALegend said:


> With his 18th red card in his La Liga career, Ramos tied retired footballers Pablo Alfaro and Xavi Aguado for most ever reds in Spanish top flight football.




The card is one thing... His second yellow was harsh (and not a yellow tbh), but both he and the Depo player should've been sent earlier.

But that incident started because there was a Depo player lying on the ground (who knows whether players are injured or not these days, I rarely give them the benefit of the doubt) and 9/10 times the opposing team kicks the ball out of play (begrudgindly, but they do).

Ramos lifted his arm like he was gonna stop play, then took a few quick steps and passed the ball laterally to Modric, hoping for a play.
That's what started the trouble, the crowd reaction and the Depo players got mad after that.
Modric, the friendly goblin that he is, put the ball out of play, but it was already too late.

I mean, it's almost laughable what an ass he is (Ramos).
2-0 up, dead game, and he pulls stuff like that.

In short, Ramos is an ass. Always has been. 
One hell of a CB, but his on pitch behavoir is appaling and only few players go into that tier (Costa, Suarez, etc.).


----------



## Evilo

Barca is in a rough stretch :

They couldn't get Verratti.
They lost Neymar.
They got ripped 5-1 by Real.
They overpaid for Paulinho.
Even overpaying, they can't get Coutinho.
They can't seem to offer enough for Dembele.
Messi STILL hasn't signed an extension. Now rumors are surfacing he might join his Guardiola buddy in City.
Iniesta is being vague about his future.

And now, Neymar RIPPED them apart yesterday after the game. Saying the Barca officials were not good enough for Barca (and that everyone knows it) and that they had to go. That his former teammates didn't feel well at the club and it made him sad.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Evilo said:


> Barca is in a rough stretch :
> 
> They couldn't get Verratti.
> They lost Neymar.
> They got ripped 5-1 by Real.
> They overpaid for Paulinho.
> Even overpaying, they can't get Coutinho.
> They can't seem to offer enough for Dembele.
> Messi STILL hasn't signed an extension. Now rumors are surfacing he might join his Guardiola buddy in City.
> Iniesta is being vague about his future.
> 
> And now, *Neymar RIPPED* them apart yesterday after the game. Saying the Barca officials were not good enough for Barca (and that everyone knows it) and that they had to go. That his former teammates didn't feel well at the club and it made him sad.




As you say in the next phrase, he ripped the board, which is what we've been doing for the whole summer, nothing new.

We will be fine when Barto leaves, hopefully soon.


----------



## YNWA14

Corto said:


> In short, Ramos is an ass. Always has been.
> One hell of a CB, but his on pitch behavoir is appaling and only few players go into that tier (Costa, Suarez, etc.).




It's interesting though how often those players that live on the edge are some of the best players to have on your team. van Bommel was like that too, and a very successful player as well, but everyone but his teammates hated him.



Vasilevskiy said:


> As you say in the next phrase, he ripped the board, which is what we've been doing for the whole summer, nothing new.
> 
> We will be fine when Barto leaves, hopefully soon.




Do you think that Messi will actually leave? I find it bizarre that City went and bought all those attackers already and are still trying to get Messi as well. Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, B. Silva, etc. and they still have academy players that want to break in and have to keep some kind of defensive shape. No wonder Sancho wants to leave.


----------



## maclean

Curtinho said:


> Do you think that Messi will actually leave? I find it bizarre that City went and bought all those attackers already and are still trying to get Messi as well. Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, B. Silva, etc. and they still have academy players that want to break in and have to keep some kind of defensive shape. No wonder Sancho wants to leave.




Um, if you have the opportunity to get Messi, you make room for Messi, I think that's pretty clear. Who wouldn't want him? Messi is an upgrade on whatever you have and if it came to that what player would you not be willing to sell off to make space? It's a no-brainer. As to whether Messi will leave, I think that depends on the board right now.


----------



## Savant

Curtinho said:


> Do you think that Messi will actually leave? I find it bizarre that City went and bought all those attackers already and are still trying to get Messi as well. Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, B. Silva, etc. and they still have academy players that want to break in and have to keep some kind of defensive shape. No wonder Sancho wants to leave.




City have infinity money and a top 3 coach who actually knows how to integrate those players. They won't stop. They also have plenty of games and aren't afraid of squad depth.


----------



## YNWA14

I'm not so sure. 300m for a 30 year old Messi? With the wear and tear he's had as well I wouldn't be surprised if his career is not much longer; haven't seen many players take the abuse he has over the last decade, and despite all the joking about the EPL it is a more physical league.


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

Financially, the 300m investment would very easily be worth it though. The brand exposure in Asia and South America, plus the "Messi as the face of ADIDAS" factor. In footballing, I also think he'll have at least a few more years as the best in the world. If City can make a Messi transfer happen, they'd be stupid not to bite IMO.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Curtinho said:


> I'm not so sure. 300m for a 30 year old Messi? With the wear and tear he's had as well I wouldn't be surprised if his career is not much longer; haven't seen many players take the abuse he has over the last decade, and despite all the joking about the EPL it is a more physical league.




He didn't have any major knee injury though (knock on wood). Also Messi can still be useful when he ages coming from midfield, with his insane vision and passing abilities. Also can always be a threat from FKs.


----------



## Evilo

http://www.mundodeportivo.com/futbo...43726219197/digne-barca-atentado-heridos.html


----------



## les Habs

Vasilevskiy said:


> As you say in the next phrase, he ripped the board, which is what we've been doing for the whole summer, nothing new.




Not to mention none of that is really new. Messi speculation is pretty grand. Iniesta makes total sense too.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Cadena SER says the big name Barca players/staff are extremely frustrated with the board and their performance this summer. Next week is the vote of no confidence, here's hoping..



Curtinho said:


> I'm not so sure. 300m for a 30 year old Messi? With the wear and tear he's had as well I wouldn't be surprised if his career is not much longer; haven't seen many players take the abuse he has over the last decade, and despite all the joking about the EPL it is a more physical league.




Think Messi has another 4-5 years in him, 300M for him is a bargain to a club like City.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Curtinho said:


> Do you think that Messi will actually leave? I find it bizarre that City went and bought all those attackers already and are still trying to get Messi as well. Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, B. Silva, etc. and they still have academy players that want to break in and have to keep some kind of defensive shape. No wonder Sancho wants to leave.




I think it is ********, but again, I would have thought the same if they told me about neymar


----------



## WhiskeySeven*

Scenes if Messi leaves on a free.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Vidal has been crap. Not sure where Semedo is, he was great last game.


----------



## S E P H

Barca look horrible, that Messi penalty had to be one of the most predictable pens I've seen in the last two seasons or so.

After losing Neymar and not playing Suarez you can see that this club clearly lacks depth. I get why they want both Dembele and Coutinho. Though with that said, I am not getting some of their personnel decisions. Why are they playing Roberto, Vidal, and Deulofeu over the likes of Turan and Rakitic (injured?)? Without Suarez or Dembele on the wings, a 4-3-3 seems like the stupidest formation you can choose. And not only that, but all you need is to suppress Messi and their goalscoring goals down the drain. They need to put Alcacer on the pitch.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Rakitic is playing. They're not playing with a 433. It's more of a 4-2-3-1.

Also Turan is a waste that's why he isn't playing.

Messi has been off but still managed 2 goals.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

That was a fantastic save on the pen by the keeper more than anything. Rakitic is playing, Paco (who was just substituted in) and Turan shouldn't be playing for Barca, especially the latter.

Edit: Admittedly Paco did well here, hope he keeps improving


----------



## S E P H

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Rakitic is playing. They're not playing with a 433. It's more of a 4-2-3-1.
> 
> Also Turan is a waste that's why he isn't playing.
> 
> Messi has been off but still managed 2 goals.




You sure? beIN Sports said during halftime that they're playing a 4-3-3 and Busquets was playing as the lone CM with Iniesta on the left side. It made no sense.

The whole team looks off, if this was an EPL side besides AlavÃ©s, Barca would be struggling to score one.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Yeah, pretty sure. They have 5 midfielders.

They are struggling. Lio's first goal was lucky. Alaves has had better chances just couldn't cash in.


----------



## Savi

That's 3 goals, 4 posts and a missed pen for Messi through 2 games

He could've almost had the pichichi locked up already


----------



## Luigi Habs

I thought Turan was loaned to a turkish club?


----------



## les Habs

Awful stuff today. Valverde with another clueless selection. Someone should explain to him what Suarez's role is and who Alcacer is. Then he starts Sergi at RB ahead of Vidal, which is smart because Sergi is better, but plays Vidal anyway. Fortunately Messi saved the day. I liked Sergi, but not a fan of the stupid cards from Pique and Umtiti. We definitely need a midfielder.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

****ing BeIN showing a stupid super bike race instead of the beginning of the RMCF/Valencia game. Nobody is paying 15$ a month to watch ****ing superbikes. Gimme my footy.


----------



## Savi

Asensio can't stop scoring.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio = god


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Beautiful passing play by Valencia.


----------



## booyakasha

What a goal by Valencia. Wow.


----------



## Savi

Gaya to Lato to Soler. Canterano golaso


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> Asensio can't stop scoring.




As soon as he took the ball I was like **** goal!

Soler looks good as does that 18 year old LB for Valencia.


----------



## Live in the Now

Bale looks past it and I don't think I'm the only one who sees it that way. Has no confidence and is slowing the game down.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Past it? I don't know about that. I just think he was never that good. Like at all.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Past it? I don't know about that. I just think he was never that good. Like at all.




He was great at Spurs and for his first year at Real, been meh ever since. Great Euro though.

Still luv him though.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Sometimes I think Benzema thinks he is Giroud. Should have easily scored hwre.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And again...


----------



## Savi

Savi said:


> Asensio can't stop scoring.




Benzema on the other hand..


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> He was great at Spurs and for his first year at Real, been meh ever since. Great Euro though.
> 
> Still luv him though.




Even his first year with Madrid was nothing special. Iirc he won the CL first year eh? Yup, he was complete **** in the final


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

I think that's pk on Casemiro. No play on the ball and has his hands on Gaya.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And... another glorious chance missed by Benzema.


----------



## Live in the Now

Benz with two sitters and two half chances and the only one on target is the first half chance. Not a good performance.


----------



## mmk786

Benzema channeling his inner Cavani


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I think that's pk on Casemiro. No play on the ball and has his hands on Gaya.




Got the ball with his feet.


----------



## Live in the Now

Some amazing champagne football at the back there.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Got the ball with his feet.




He got as much of gaya's legs as the ball. Clumsy atleast.



Live in the Now said:


> Some amazing champagne football at the back there.




Not sure if serious?

Casemiro reckless and gets a yellow.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He got as much of gaya's legs as the ball. Clumsy atleast.
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure if serious?
> 
> Casemiro reckless and gets a yellow.




Clumsy indeed, but he did get the ball.

Makes me laugh when a guy stays down after committing a clear foul. Be a man Casemiro, you deserved that yellow.


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not sure if serious?




When Navas and others were passing it around? Dead serious. Exactly what I like to see, they were never in danger of losing the ball without getting fouled.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> When Navas and others were passing it around? Dead serious. Exactly what I like to see, they were never in danger of losing the ball without getting fouled.




They were extremely loose passes I thought. Especially the Casemiro one, if you would call it a pass.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And now Bale misses a rather easy header


----------



## Live in the Now

Neto has made nice saves. And these haven't been shot straight at him like some other "nice saves."


----------



## Savi

Kondogbia


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Are you ****ing kidding me?

We need another CB. Varane is always injured and Ramos gets suspended often.


----------



## Live in the Now

Great football.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

**** ya Kongo!



Scandale du Jour said:


> Are you ****ing kidding me?
> 
> We need another CB. Varane is always injured and Ramos gets suspended often.




You have Vallejo but he's out


----------



## Live in the Now

That goal wasn't because of the CB's. Kroos drifted towards the box, didn't track the runner, and Kondogbia slides in behind him.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Live in the Now said:


> That goal wasn't because of the CB's. Kroos drifted towards the box, didn't track the runner, and Kondogbia slides in behind him.




Not blaming anyone, just saying we need a CB. Casemiro looked lost all night.


----------



## Savi

Man. Asensio.


----------



## Evilo

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> **** ya Kongo!




But you implied he sucked the other day?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Marcoooooooooo!


----------



## Deficient Mode

Madrid 3-2 was inevitable as always after Kondogbia's goal


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> But you implied he sucked the other day?




Implied it was stupid to trade Cancelo for him. He's been fantastic today tho.

**** off asensio.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema 

If he scored on 50% of the chances he had today, he would have scored like 3.


----------



## Live in the Now

Asensio is unplayable.


----------



## Luigi Habs

With Asensio emergence RM can cash in on Ronaldo


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema again... is he drunk or what?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> Asensio is unplayable.




That's on Neto who had a MOTM performance going On up until that decision.

Lmao love you Benz


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Luigi Habs said:


> With Asensio emergence RM can cash in on Ronaldo




No. Play Ronaldo at center forward. Bench Benz's ass.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And... again! But that one is not his fault. Great save.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Zaza you're worthless.

Casemiro acting like a *****.


----------



## Savi

Wow what a chance for Valencia to steal it


----------



## Power Man

Yikes


----------



## Vasilevskiy

lol Benzema


----------



## Deficient Mode

Scandale du Jour said:


> No. Play Ronaldo at center forward. Bench Benz's ass.




Sounds like a bad idea


----------



## Power Man

Deficient Mode said:


> Sounds like a bad idea




Agreed


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Very disappointed about the result, but it was a super fun game to watch.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

ZaZa how does this guy get paid money to play football!


----------



## Live in the Now

Stonewall penalty for me. 

Will be surprised if there's a better game than that all season. In any league.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Well, that is two points I did not expect Madrid to lose. Not like it will matter much at the end of the year but good to see.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Deficient Mode said:


> Sounds like a bad idea




Why?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Another masterclass performance by Marcelino. Should be at barca.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Another masterclass performance by Marcelino. Should be at barca.




Masterclass? They played well, don't get me wrong, but their keeper and Benzema being inept are the two reasons why it was not a 3 or 4 goal win for RMCF.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Masterclass? They played well, don't get me wrong, but their keeper and Benzema being inept are the two reasons why it was not a 3 or 4 goal win for RMCF.




You are playing what consider here the greatest team ever(they're way off)... you need a heroic effort from your keeper. 

Madrid right now are the best in the world by a fair margin. Valencia could've won so, yeah it's a masterclass performance.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Scandale du Jour said:


> Why?




Same reason Zidane didn't want Aubameyang


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch




----------



## Live in the Now

I would have guessed it was more like 3.5. Three of the sitters you would expect a defender to put on target and they weren't even on target.


----------



## les Habs

Vasilevskiy said:


> Well, that is two points I did not expect Madrid to lose. Not like it will matter much at the end of the year but good to see.




When I saw that both Ramos and Varane weren't playing today I was open to the possibility. Then I saw that it was Valencia and at the Bernabeu, but still possible.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> I would have guessed it was more like 3.5. Three of the sitters you would expect a defender to put on target and they weren't even on target.




What's XG mean?



les Habs said:


> When I saw that both Ramos and Varane weren't playing today I was open to the possibility. Then I saw that it was Valencia and at the Bernabeu, but still possible.




Parejo is a beast.... barca should sign him.


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> What's XG mean?




Expected goals. Mathematical formula to grade every aspect of the scoring chances the player gets. Angle, distance, defenders, which foot or head, etc.


----------



## S E P H

Carrasco with Koke went on a rampage against Las Palmas. Carrasco in particular made so many things happen, it was similar to watching Mane though slower. Koke with a wonderful bicycle kick, very well organized, and Greizmann didn't even play and they looked dominant. Let me tell you guys the complete difference going from Arsenal on a regular basis and the amount of mistakes I have to watch to a team coached by Simone and the overall structure about them. It's such a night and day difference that it's almost insane how Arsenal as an entity haven't realised this. 

Some pundits saying that Oblak is the best goalkeeper in all of La Liga.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Cat radio has said that some board members are not in support of Bartomeu and he's aware of that. Some of them asked him to resign.


----------



## xavi4life

Savi said:


> Gaya to Lato to Soler. Canterano golaso




They look great! Imagine had they kept Alcacer and Gomes... 

Which leads me to this article detailing what most people have been thinking about BarÃ§a for the last year or so.:

http://outsideoftheboot.com/2017/08/27/fc-barcelona-transfer-recruitment-circus/


----------



## Savi

So after cutting his contract short last year, Simeone has now extended it by two years again. Not really getting the point of all of this, but good move for AtlÃ©tico. Thought for sure he'd leave for Inter come summer/


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

So, Isco still hasn't signed a new contract despite earlier reports. "Breathes heavily"


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> So, Isco still hasn't signed a new contract despite earlier reports. "Breathes heavily"




It was reportedly agreed but not signed. Either way I would expect him to sign a new contract and the longer Perez the waits the more it will cost him.


----------



## Evilo

Barca have reached out to Maxime Lopes. Finally. Been a while I've said he was made for that team.
Still, he's been awful to start the season. Not worried though, pressure might have been too hard for such a young guy.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Da ****?


----------



## Savi

Good to see Theo and Llorente already getting a start.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Bale caught Benzemaitis.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Crosses and passes in the last third have mostly been atrocious for Real today...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Yup Benzemaitis...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Back to back draws at home... absolutely unacceptable.

Few missed chances, but they haven't done enough with the ball. Many crosses straight at the keeper. These dropped points will hurt us at the end of the year...


----------



## Savi

Well this is unexpected.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Marcelo is a ****, what are you doing


----------



## Luigi Habs

too many squad rotation may not be a good thing really. Zidane is acting like an overconfident coach. It's biting him in the ass so far this season.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Luigi Habs said:


> too many squad rotation may not be a good thing really. Zidane is acting like an overconfident coach. It's biting him in the ass so far this season.




I disagree. Injuries (mostly to Varane) and suspensions (Ronaldo and Ramos) forced some of the rotations. Resting Modric and Navas after the International break wasn't a bad idea. Today, they were just bad in the last third; atrocious. Bad crosses, too cute, missed chances. Against Valencia, the keeper being amazing and Benzema being a putz cost us the game.


----------



## Power Man

ZZ was overconfident today.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Benz could be out for more than a month


----------



## Power Man

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Benz could be out for more than a month




It's ok we have Morata


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> It's ok we have Morata






I miss Alvaro


----------



## les Habs

Power Man said:


> It's ok we have Morata




No, you sold him. You have Mbappe' now.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Rakitic looks great, need him back in form this season.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Really good game from Barca. They're having a good start. Semedo looking good and that midfield looking better than last year. Valverde is playing Messi CF and Suarez LW. Let's see if it's a permanent thing.


----------



## John Pedro

Nice assist from DembÃ©lÃ© too. BarÃ§a and Espanyol is such a boring derby...


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Luigi Habs said:


> Really good game from Barca. They're having a good start. Semedo looking good and that midfield looking better than last year. Valverde is playing Messi CF and Suarez LW. Let's see if it's a permanent thing.




I know he's only played 2 games and we haven't played against a top team with Semedo starting but I'm so excited for him this year.


----------



## Buda

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Rakitic looks great, need him back in form this season.




So much for being too injured to play on tuesday I guess...


----------



## Savi

Always fun to hang five on Espanyol


----------



## Luigi Habs

If you take a step back and look at Barca squad objectively you could argue they have a better team than last season. Sure Neymar was a huge loss but Semedo at RB is looking really good and surely better than Vidal/Sergi. In midfield they have better depth with Paulinho and same with Deulafeu up front. We shall see how Dembele does but it's been 2 years I've predicted this kid to become a top 5 player in the world in the near future. For sure he's not at Neymar level yet and he won't be this year but if he can give them a solid season, Barca may well steal the Liga from RM.


----------



## les Habs

Scoreline definitely flattered us today. Apano actually played pretty well and the refs didn't help them with the first goal and a few other calls. Still they're Apano and I hope they get relegated. As for us, not a perfect performance, but it was still good. Love the fluidity and pace that the new signings bring. Messi is looking really determined and in excellent form. Really liked what I saw from Deulofeu. He's got pace, he can dribble a player, he can set up a teammate and he can make good runs off the ball. Like I said before we signed Dembele, who let me be clear is the superior player, I would like to see what Deulofeu could do in a full season as a starter. Now that Dembele is here he surely won't be, but I think there's room for both considering where Messi has been lining up. Anyway, really liked how the team looked out there and there was definitely a spirit in the team which is great considering the Super Cup fallout.

Have to make a note on the commentary. I generally try and get a Sky replay if I can and I've enjoyed their coverage for some years now. However I read today that BeIN had Graham Hunter which I thought would be interesting though probably not something that would work. Well the second half I saw was the BeIN broadcast and I have to say that Graham Hunter was absolutely fantastic. I've always liked him and he knows his stuff such that he can add enough to the color commentary by way of interest. However he also really read the game well. He really was excellent. And on that note he mentioned a couple of interesting points:

-Messi was apparently paying close attention to Dembele in the training they had together and he was impressed with what he saw. 

-Valverde while not going total authoritarian has told the players they need to be more serious in training.

One more thing of note, the lines for the vote of no confidence against Bartomeu were apparently. Photos I saw definitely had lines. Hopefully they racked up a ton of signatures. 



Luigi Habs said:


> Really good game from Barca. They're having a good start. Semedo looking good and that midfield looking better than last year. Valverde is playing Messi CF and Suarez LW. Let's see if it's a permanent thing.




That is what I was touching on above when I was commenting on Deulofeu. With Messi playing centrally it tends to leave the left flank to be pretty open and up to Alba for the most part. Even when Dembele came on, a player can easily function out left, he was on the right side. So I'd be curious to see something like this Suarez up top, Messi just behind with Deulofeu out right and Dembele out left. That would leave only two in midfield which I wouldn't love, but I think that would be a hell of an attack.



John Pedro said:


> Nice assist from DembÃ©lÃ© too. BarÃ§a and Espanyol is such a boring derby...




To each their own, but this match wasn't boring and this derby in general isn't boring. In fact just a few years ago it was pretty tough for us. 



DatsyukOwns said:


> I know he's only played 2 games and we haven't played against a top team with Semedo starting but I'm so excited for him this year.




Other than his debut in preseason, if you look at all the preseason and regular season matches so far his only "poor" match for me was the debut. He looks like the perfect RB for us. His defending has really been excellent. He can get forward too, but he doesn't get forward enough for me. With his pace and skill he should be attacking more. Anyway, he really looks a very good signing.



Luigi Habs said:


> If you take a step back and look at Barca squad objectively you could argue they have a better team than last season. Sure Neymar was a huge loss but Semedo at RB is looking really good and surely better than Vidal/Sergi. In midfield they have better depth with Paulinho and same with Deulafeu up front. We shall see how Dembele does but it's been 2 years I've predicted this kid to become a top 5 player in the world in the near future. For sure he's not at Neymar level yet and he won't be this year but if he can give them a solid season, Barca may well steal the Liga from RM.




I agree that the team does look better, but it should look even better still. Not enough players were offloaded. Turan and Vermaelen at minimum should have been offloaded. I'd have axed more guys, but just looking at those two would have left room for a CB. Of course Mina was bought, but he won't play until January if then. Anyway, this team was always going to be competitive in the league for at minimum a CL place and that's even without Dembele. Still under the right management they could much more.


----------



## les Habs

Obviously very early days, but BarÃ§a B in 3rd place in Segunda. Cucurella with a really nice assist today on Alena's opener.


----------



## les Habs

Forgot to give credit where it's due, but Gomes' play and pass on Suarez's goal was excellent.


----------



## Savi

Another win for La Real who started the season 3-0 and will host Madrid next Sunday. And Madrid will be without Cristiano, Benzema and Marcelo.


----------



## Savi

BarÃƒÂ§a had a deal with Palmeiras to sign Yerry Mina in January but now there's an article on Marca saying he won't come over till next summer


----------



## Vasilevskiy

les Habs said:


> One more thing of note, the lines for the vote of no confidence against Bartomeu were apparently. Photos I saw definitely had lines. Hopefully they racked up a ton of signatures.
> .




A friend of mine was there making his signature and he says there were huge queues. Looking good.


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Another win for La Real who started the season 3-0 and will host Madrid next Sunday. And Madrid will be without Cristiano, Benzema and Marcelo.




Would love a result there. Even a draw would be big. Our schedule leading up to the Atleti fixture looks nice and 12 more points between now and then would be perfect.



Savi said:


> BarÃƒÂ§a had a deal with Palmeiras to sign Yerry Mina in January but now there's an article on Marca saying he won't come over till next summer




That's as I've always understood it. That's why another CB (instead of Vermaelen) would have been ideal and another reason why I wanted us to sign Sanchez. 

Speaking of Sanchez, saw much of Spurs' match against Everton yesterday and I thought Sanchez looked pretty good. Also, Marlon played the full 90 minutes in Nice's route of Monaco. Not sure how he's doing but if he plays consistently it will be great experience for him.

Speaking of January, while I wouldn't expect a lot of signings it'd be nice if we cleared out the dead weight. Really wish we'd done so this Summer and wishing we'd signed Seri.



Vasilevskiy said:


> A friend of mine was there making his signature and he says there were huge queues. Looking good.




Lines looked long, but I was just thinking of the signatures they need in the time frame they need them in. A couple of lines of say 500 each aren't that big. The way I see it is they need 14,000 signatures over the course of three home matches. Sure they have time in between, but realistically you need to get them during these home matches. On top of that you're probably getting a good amount of the same Socios going to these matches, so you need to capture a lot of signatures up front. Ideally they captured at minimum half the signatures they needed yesterday alone and for me that's still a low number. 

Anyway, good news as you say, but this is only the first step. They didn't vote in Laporta when they had the chance the last time and this sort of thing happened with Nunez and Gaspart as well.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Vasilevskiy said:


> A friend of mine was there making his signature and he says there were huge queues. Looking good.




A Reddit post said there has been 2920 signatures collected.

What makes someone able to live vote? Do you just need to live their?


----------



## Power Man

No Boudebouz in the Real Betis group yet, he's not 100%

I can't wait to see him in action in La Liga, he should do well there


----------



## Talisman

La liga needs salary cap!!.


----------



## maclean

oyoy, Barca down 0-1 to Getafe..


----------



## bardown88

maclean said:


> oyoy, Barca down 0-1 to Getafe..




Dembele off injured too! Very nice goal by Gaku


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Roberto over Semedo is a huge mistake.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

maclean said:


> oyoy, Barca down 0-1 to Getafe..




Meh, 45 minutes left. You just know Messi will score 2 in the second half.


----------



## maclean

Scandale du Jour said:


> Meh, 45 minutes left. You just know Messi will score 2 in the second half.




This was my line of thinking too, but one of these days going down to these teams in the first half is going to come back to bite them


----------



## Scandale du Jour

maclean said:


> This was my line of thinking too, but one of these days going down to these teams in the first half is going to come back to bite them




I certainly hope so


----------



## maclean

Pretty similar goal to come back, though not quite as nice as Gaku's


----------



## Evilo

Umtiti has read the play very well.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Evilo said:


> Umtiti has read the play very well.




He just made another great play. Wonderful intervention. I thought it was a foul at first, but on the replay it shows it was great timing.


----------



## Evilo

What an awful play by Suarez.


----------



## Evilo

Could only be him ! 

Goalie was awfully badly positionned for the shot.


----------



## maclean

Evilo said:


> Could only be him !
> 
> Goalie was awfully badly positionned for the shot.




He was, though it was pretty impressive Paulinho made it through to get the shot off


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Barca again a little lucky to come away with all 3 points. Nice to see them on top and by a fair margin considering how early we are but these guys have to raise their game up. Suarez in particular has been ****, if you go by this early season alone you'd think he's a Sunday league player. Decision making awful poor touches and passes. That one late in the game where he slow down the counter and passed it to Getafe defender was just abysmal to watch. I'm hoping it's just down to his latest injury but he's got to be better. 

Hopefully, Dembele isn't hurt too bad but don't like hamstring injuries.

Nice finish by Denis as always please give him more playing time. Also Paulinho deserves some respect has done more in what 3 games than Gomes has in his entire barca career.

Let's hope La real continue their fantastic form tomorrow.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Sergi improved in the 2nd half, still puzzling to see EV not play Semedo, he's quite the RB. Nice comeback win, the sort of games where Barca looked toothless otherwise last season.


----------



## les Habs

Like I said when we signed Paulinho, he's averaged about 6-7 goals a season throughout his career when he's played a full season. I'd say those three points could easily be worth... 4 million of his transfer fee. He was never as bad a signing as everyone on this forum made it out to be. Sure I'd have done differently with that sort of money (Seri for example), but Paulinho at that fee in this market especially when it's a buyout was never that bad.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Evilo said:


> Umtiti has read the play very well.




Business as usual for Umtiti, at the moment he's Barca's best defender.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

les Habs said:


> Like I said when we signed Paulinho, he's averaged about 6-7 goals a season throughout his career when he's played a full season. I'd say those three points could easily be worth... 4 million of his transfer fee. He was never as bad a signing as everyone on this forum made it out to be. Sure I'd have done differently with that sort of money (Seri for example), but Paulinho at that fee in this market especially when it's a buyout was never that bad.




As long as he continues contributing to the team there will be no more complaints from my part... as Duchene said he already has done more than Andre last season.


----------



## les Habs

Vasilevskiy said:


> As long as he continues contributing to the team there will be no more complaints from my part... as Duchene said he already has done more than Andre last season.




I was referring more to posters in general and not Cules. 

Just saw the goal myself and it was an excellent goal. He rode that challenge and finished from that angle... I think that sort of goal from midfield is exactly the reason they brought him in.


----------



## les Habs

Just to clarify, despite seeing the goal I have yet to see today's match, but from what I have seen prior to today Paulinho has looked a bit awful. That said he just started.


----------



## les Habs

Got around to watching the match. I'm pleased with the performance. It wasn't great, but they put in the work. Especially in the second half where they looked good to bring it back. Getafe, who have started the season well it should be noted, were definitely not pushovers and even went for the win when it was 1-1. 

Suarez and Iniesta were both poor. Umtiti was good at the back. I thought Sergi played well and his assist to Denis was nice. Liked the spark that Deulofeu brought. Denis even more so and I thought it was one of his best midfield performances in our shirt. Have to give Paulinho credit again for the goal considering he rode that challenge and hit that shot from that angle. 

Still trying to understand some of Valverde's decisions. Sergi played well, but he should have been in midfield with Semedo starting at RB. And once again the left flank is left open. 

Really unfortunate to see Dembele go down like that. That said I'm happy to see Deulofeu get a shot. I'll be interested to see how he plays with an extended run as a starter.


----------



## maclean

Any word on how serious Dembele's injury is?


----------



## Savi

maclean said:


> Any word on how serious Dembele's injury is?




Pretty serious. Will be out 3-4 months.


----------



## Power Man

Savi said:


> Pretty serious. Will be out 3-4 months.




That sucks tbh


----------



## Evilo

Awful


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Great play by Ramos. Easy finish for Mayoral.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

WTF Keylor...


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Pretty serious. Will be out 3-4 months.




Wow. Didn't think it'd be that long. Good news is we have both Deulofeu and Denis. Deulofeu in particular has played well all season and his work rate has been excellent.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Bale <3


----------



## Power Man

Phew


----------



## les Habs

Nice goal by Alena against Alcorcon.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

There is a rumour that Demeble started feeling discomfort before the game even started and possibly didn't report it to the medical staff. It was just a picture of him holding the area 10 days ago during training and then during the game that may of been taken before kick off.

Just a rumour so idk.


----------



## Corto

It's probably been mentioned, but no Neymar and a proper right back has Rakitic and Alba back to their best.
More space and more responsibility for those two, and a Messi who seems more motivated than ever, and honestly, this Barca team is looking better than the last couple of years - even without Dembele.

One noticable dip in form is Suarez. Despite his numbers, he's looked "off" for a season+ now.

...

Winning the CL will take beating some top teams and timing your form to perfection.

But a league, as often said, is won vs the smaller teams.
Barca definitely has the potential to win the La Liga even if Real does prove to be the better team in the head to heads (which may or may not happen) - they just look as consistant at beating smaller teams as they did 3 years ago.


----------



## les Habs

Corto said:


> It's probably been mentioned, but no Neymar and a proper right back has Rakitic and Alba back to their best.
> More space and more responsibility for those two, and a Messi who seems more motivated than ever, and honestly, this Barca team is looking better than the last couple of years - even without Dembele.
> 
> One noticable dip in form is Suarez. Despite his numbers, he's looked "off" for a season+ now.
> 
> ...
> 
> Winning the CL will take beating some top teams and timing your form to perfection.
> 
> But a league, as often said, is won vs the smaller teams.
> Barca definitely has the potential to win the La Liga even if Real does prove to be the better team in the head to heads (which may or may not happen) - they just look as consistant at beating smaller teams as they did 3 years ago.




Both Alba and Rakitic look better, but they've also show better than what we're seeing so we'll see if they can get back to that level. Neymar's absence has certainly helped Alba though. I also think that consistently seeing four at the back helps both players too. Deulofeu has also done well looks very capable of covering Dembele.

Still I don't trust Valverde. Formation is still unbalanced and his selections are still somewhat odd at times. He's doing some things better in terms of training, but I fear he'll make some poor selection choices down the road.

BarÃ§a for me were always capable of competing domestically. Valverde will be key though. Can't stress enough the importance of the manager's role which I think gets overlooked. As for Madrid, while the Super Cup was one thing last season was entirely another. Europe will be a different challenge, but I think they can compete with anyone there as well.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Semedo is a heck of an RB, guess Sergi is played whenever the former needs rest (like last game).


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Goal, assist and an amazing dummy from Paulinho that also led to a goal. Making me eat my words, hope he keeps it up


----------



## Savi

Nah just keep Sergi in midfield. There's still Vidal as backup RB, he deserves some games based on the second half of last season.

Paulinho has been very good tonight. He offers so much more than Gomes.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Savi said:


> Nah just keep Sergi in midfield. There's still Vidal as backup RB, he deserves some games based on the second half of last season.
> 
> Paulinho has been very good tonight. He offers so much more than Gomes.




Yeah, Sergi is much more useful in midfield. Doesn't seem like Valverde trusts Vidal enough as a defender, but I hope EV gives him a shot there


----------



## gary69

Messi 

Anything Dybala can do, Messi can still do better. It would be such a shame for the tournament if Argentina won't make into next year's WC.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Paulinho seems very good at using his runs to open up space. Was very clear on the fourth goal.

Semedo is one hell of a player it seems.


----------



## les Habs

I thought the scoreline flattered us a bit, but some good positives to take away. Semedo is just excellent. Good on both sides of the ball and did a great job winning that penalty. Once again looks like he's the perfect RB for us. Paulinho had his first good match and he did quiet well as the match wore on. Definitely a threat from midfield with his runs into the box. Excellent header on his goal and set up Messi as well. Ball didn't drop for him a few times, but I really liked what I saw from Deulofeu. He makes really good runs and puts in a ton of work. Despite the stats I thought he put in a better performance than Denis. Then of course there's Messi making it all look so easy when for anyone else it wouldn't be. Even scored while being pulled back by a defender in the box. Finally I liked the more balanced approach with wide players on both sides.

On the flip side Iniesta again didn't do much at all and Pique seems inconsistent so far this season.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Messi is so stupid. Sad I missed the 2nd half



gary69 said:


> Messi
> 
> Anything Dybala can do, Messi can still do better. It would be such a shame for the tournament if Argentina won't make into next year's WC.




They'll make it and proceed to score 3 goals in the entire campaign. All 3 from Lio but it'll be his fault they get bounced.


----------



## Savi

les Habs said:


> but I really liked what I saw from Deulofeu




I think he's actually frustrating to watch. His movement is really good, he always seems to be open and has a knack for finding these open spaces but then he gets the ball and 9 out of 10 times nothing comes of it. He tries to dribble and loses the ball, he scews up a cross, gives a bad pass.. His decision making has always been a problem and I'm starting to realise it hasn't improved at all over the years.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Messi 11 goals in the last 4 games


----------



## PeteWorrell

Savi said:


> I think he's actually frustrating to watch. His movement is really good, he always seems to be open and has a knack for finding these open spaces but then he gets the ball and 9 out of 10 times nothing comes of it. He tries to dribble and loses the ball, he scews up a cross, gives a bad pass.. His decision making has always been a problem and I'm starting to realise it hasn't improved at all over the years.



Not surprising that the guy couldn't cut it in Everton.


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> I think he's actually frustrating to watch. His movement is really good, he always seems to be open and has a knack for finding these open spaces but then he gets the ball and 9 out of 10 times nothing comes of it. He tries to dribble and loses the ball, he scews up a cross, gives a bad pass.. His decision making has always been a problem and I'm starting to realise it hasn't improved at all over the years.




His movement is very good and he's not an off the ball type of attacker, at least he wasn't so much before. His work rate has been excellent too. As for that final ball, I'd pay closer attention. It's a matter of margins in most cases and just last night he made an excellent over the top pass that found it's target. And if you're making riskier passes your success rate is going to go down. I wouldn't call it a problem of making poor decisions at this point. I'd also just add that he's essentially playing a new role in a new team. He's leading the line in a lot of cases. We're five matches into the season. Give him a chance.


----------



## les Habs

And in other news,  to Gerry.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Real once again looking very "meh" at home. No excuse this time, the only one missing from the ideal 11 is Benz.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronaldo paying hommage to Benzema tonight with all those missed chances.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Time wasting extraordinaire...


----------



## Scandale du Jour

0 win, 1 loss, 2 ties at home. That's pathetic. Absolutely and disgustingly pathetic when you have all this talent.

**** the league, 7 points down after 5 rounds. Let's put all the eggs in the CL basket.


----------



## Power Man

Yikes


----------



## Power Man

Boudebouz 's roulette was nice though


----------



## les Habs

Wow. Didn't see that result coming. Granted Betis are a bit tough to read at the moment. 

I'm assuming the press will now be all over them after that result. Madrid will win their next match for sure though.


----------



## Cassano

Probably should've bought Mbappe in hindsight.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Greatest team of all time, getting exposed.

It's still way to early to judge anything.


----------



## Hadoop

This thread should really be renamed the Real/Barca discussion thread considering 99% of posts pertain to one of the two super-clubs (although I prefer the term two-headed monster).


----------



## maclean

Just watched the highlights for this game, crazy chances and saves on both sides!


----------



## Deficient Mode

Madrid's hilariously good luck the past couple years has flipped to hilariously bad luck. Betis did not deserve to win. I'm happy to see them doing well under Setien though. The buildup to their goal was fantastic.


----------



## YNWA14

Real Madrid showing that it's not just Liverpool with weird, against the run of play results!

Early in the season but they've already lost too much ground to Barcelona IMO, especially since they'll have extra incentive this season (I think).


----------



## les Habs

Ramos commenting on the refs. My guess is he's truly upset with the fact that they weren't allowed to field 12 players.


----------



## Luigi Habs

I still think Real will end up winning La Liga. They have much better depth and just the better team overall. It will be more difficult for them than I thought though. 

Dembele's injury will end up costing Barcelona. Messi will eventually cool down a bit. But if Rakitic, Paulinho and Busquets continue their impressive play, they might be able to keep up with their lead. Maybe Neymar leaving was not only a good thing for him, but also a good thing for Messi.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Madrid have been waiting for Messi to cool down for a decade now.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Luigi Habs said:


> I still think Real will end up winning La Liga. They have much better depth and just the better team overall. It will be more difficult for them than I thought though.
> 
> Dembele's injury will end up costing Barcelona. Messi will eventually cool down a bit. But if Rakitic, Paulinho and Busquets continue their impressive play, they might be able to keep up with their lead. Maybe Neymar leaving was not only a good thing for him, but also a good thing for Messi.




Barca's depth has been more of a problem in the CL than in La Liga. 

7 points is a lot to have dropped even after only 5 matches.


----------



## Savi

Luigi Habs said:


> They have much better depth




They did last year, and that's what won them the league eventually. But this year?

Just looking at their first team, these are the guys who are normally on the bench, if ZZ plays his 'once de gala'

Casilla
Vallejo
Theo Hernandez
Nacho
Marcos Llorente
Dani Ceballos
Kovacic
Asensio
L. Vazquez
Mayoral

They are really thin on defence. Sure, the starting four are fantastic, but after that it's a decent backup and a couple of young guys with still very much to prove.
In midfield Kovacic the main backup, nobody knows if Llorente and Ceballos will be good enough for Madrid yet.
Up front Asensio is basically a starter already. I think Vazquez is vastly overrated, and Mayoral is a rookie.

They have depth, but nowhere near as good as last year


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Seems like it was a huge mistake to let Morata go and not replace him with another striker. He was one of highest scorers last season afterall. Madrid did have a boat load of chances, ZZ's weird subs cost them in the end.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Madrid have been waiting for Messi to cool down for a decade now.




Yup, Valverde has set up the team well around Messi, who's playing more centrally and further up the pitch. Means a lot of goals


----------



## Savi

I actually like this formation we played against Eibar. Kind of a 4-2-3-1 with Paulinho and Busquets paired together, Iniesta as a playmaker with Denis and Deulofeu on his wings and Messi up front.


----------



## Luigi Habs

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Seems like it was a huge mistake to let Morata go and not replace him with another striker. He was one of highest scorers last season afterall. Madrid did have a boat load of chances, ZZ's weird subs cost them in the end.




I don't think Morata would have made a difference overall. Sure it looks bad now with Ronaldo's 5 games suspension, but no one could have predicted that. 

When Benzema sits, Ronaldo takes his place and Asensio/Isco play LW. I don't see Real having a weaker side than last season at all. Their midfield remains the best over any team in Europe. Don't forget Isco who's improved a lot and is now one of the best spanish players, if not the best already.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

We should never have sold Morata. I guess they have a lot of faith in Mayoral.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

https://www.theplayerstribune.com/ivan-rakitic-barcelona/


----------



## Luigi Habs

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> https://www.theplayerstribune.com/ivan-rakitic-barcelona/




 he really wanted that girl


----------



## Burner Account

Seeing the Nou Camp on Monday


----------



## les Habs

Valverde has chosen not to select Semedo and Deulofeu for the Girona fixture.


----------



## Savi

Atleti with an easy win over Sevilla

Sevilla look a lot less fun than they did with Sampaoli


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ceballos!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

What the **** is going on?


----------



## Power Man

Ceballos is the GOAT


----------



## Scandale du Jour

We are very lucky the game isn't tied. What an unconvincing performance.


----------



## Power Man

Isco back to his old ballhogging habits.

Oh well


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

More like Madrid fans going back to abusing Isco for some reason.


----------



## S E P H

What a ****ing pass by Roberto. Girona obviously gave them that much space by focusing on offence, but Suarez won't score anything easier than that. WOW.


----------



## les Habs

Ref was really poor in the BarÃ§a match. Should have given out at least four more yellow cards to Girona and Maffeo should have been sent off. First own goal was fortunate, but the second was a well executed play. Liked Sergi and Alba in this one. Busquets was excellent when he came on. Some nice defensive work from Iniesta Ter Stegen probably MotM for me though with some key saves.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Valencia score out of no where. Thought this match was destined for 0-0 tbh.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

This Guedes kid is quality. *****ing PSG.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

I've pissed on Zaza since his days with Sassuolo but he's had a petty good start this year and relatively speaking his stint with Valencia last wasn't abysmal.


----------



## Power Man

Carvajal out 1.5 month 
Oh well


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Carvajal out 1.5 month
> Oh well




No Carvajal and no Marcelo, ouch.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

You're deadlocked against a mid table team that is vastly inferior to your own squad, with about 20 minutes to go what do you do? Well if you're the 3rd best coach in the world apparently, you take out your most important and best player for a defender. lol


----------



## Savi

Barça's game against Las Palmas might be postponed due to the chaos in and around the city because of the vote on independency.


----------



## Ivan13

Las Palmas wants to play, but the police will have the final say.


----------



## Savi

*Barcastuff*‏ @barcastuff__ 7m7 minutes ago
Today's league game between Barcelona and Las Palmas has been suspended #fcblive [via @Alfremartinezz]

*Barcastuff*‏ @barcastuff__ 24m24 minutes ago
Barca aren't under Catalan federation's jurisdiction. Decision on their game still hasn't been made by Spanish federation #fcblive

*Barcastuff*‏ @barcastuff__ 23m23 minutes ago
Barcelona could hit with a 6-month ban if the club suspends today's game against Las Palmas. [via @esport3]

lol


----------



## Albatros

3 points to Las Palmas and that's that.


----------



## Savi

Well now it looks like it could be played, but without fans


----------



## Power Man




----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> *Barcastuff*‏ @barcastuff__ 7m7 minutes ago
> Today's league game between Barcelona and Las Palmas has been suspended #fcblive [via @Alfremartinezz]
> 
> *Barcastuff*‏ @barcastuff__ 24m24 minutes ago
> Barca aren't under Catalan federation's jurisdiction. Decision on their game still hasn't been made by Spanish federation #fcblive
> 
> *Barcastuff*‏ @barcastuff__ 23m23 minutes ago
> Barcelona could hit with a 6-month ban if the club suspends today's game against Las Palmas. [via @esport3]
> 
> lol



La Liga couldn't get any more incompetent.



Albatros said:


> 3 points to Las Palmas and that's that.




That would be comically stupid.

Anyway I really hope Viktors is safe. This might get worse before it gets better.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Disgusting violence from the Spanish police. La Liga is incompetent, but why did Bartomeu decide to punish the club's own fans by blocking them from the stadium? Seems like a weird protest.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Deficient Mode said:


> Disgusting violence from the Spanish police. La Liga is incompetent, but why did Bartomeu decide to punish the club's own fans by blocking them from the stadium? Seems like a weird protest.



Probably did not want things to get out of hand at the camp nou. I read somewhere fans were planing on storm the field. So, it probably was a good idea.


----------



## Savi

Barça players barely look ready to play. Still scoreless at the half but Las Palmas could've easily been up a couple of goals.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Deficient Mode said:


> Disgusting violence from the Spanish police. La Liga is incompetent, but why did Bartomeu decide to punish the club's own fans by blocking them from the stadium? Seems like a weird protest.




That's the wisest decision he took all year. Things could've gotten really ugly in there. Barca were threatened to lose 6 pts if the game wasn't played today.


----------



## Albatros

Las Palmas is playing for Spain. Still, maybe all things considered one should wish for an amicable draw.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Albatros said:


> Las Palmas is playing for Spain. Still, maybe all things considered one should wish for an amicable draw.



What in the world are you smoking?


----------



## Savi

What a pass from Denis


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

My Goodness Denis what a pass. 

Poor Pique wanted the goal so bad. Wonder how he would celebrated. 

A fan sneaks on the pitch.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Denis has played really well whenever he's given the chance, direct style comes in handy whenever they're in a lull in the final third.

Messi with his 2nd goal now


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Perfect ball from Gaya. Injuries and inconsistent has cooled his hype but the boy can play.


----------



## Pyromaniac

I don't even like Barca but that game should never have been played. I am glad they got the 3 points.


----------



## Power Man




----------



## Ceremony

Albatros said:


> Las Palmas is playing for Spain.



My favourite city is Madrid in the fifties.


----------



## Luigi Habs

So what happens with Barca in La Liga and Catalan players with the national team? 

Catalogna announced the Yes won the referendum, it's going to be very complicated going from here for recognized independence, but Spain might force out some real good players for the WC: Busquets, Iniesta, Pique, Cesc, Jordi Alba, Bartra. Don't know if La Liga will be forced to kick Barca out, that'll be a huge blow for both La Liga and Barca.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Albatros said:


> Las Palmas is playing for Spain. Still, maybe all things considered one should wish for an amicable draw.




One colony defending the empire's honor against another colony. Nice.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Luigi Habs said:


> So what happens with Barca in La Liga and Catalan players with the national team?
> 
> Catalogna announced the Yes won the referendum, it's going to be very complicated going from here for recognized independence, but Spain might force out some real good players for the WC: Busquets, Iniesta, Pique, Cesc, Jordi Alba, Bartra. Don't know if La Liga will be forced to kick Barca out, that'll be a huge blow for both La Liga and Barca.




There is precedent of a team playing in a league that's not part of a country. Also years before the French league offered Barca a spot. LA liga would be incredibly stupid to let them go, don't think that'll happen. Although, I never thought I'd see this day so you never know. 

As for the players Pique offered to step down today if he's " a problem" for the Spain NT. While in tears. Doubt any of them get kicked off the team. However, going forward we will see more and more players opting to play for Catalunya. Spain most likely made a lot of enemies today in the youth of Catalyuna.


----------



## Evilo

Monaco is in L1 and not in France.


----------



## Ivan13

Don't get me started on Pique. Dude is out of touch, his speech was a bunch of incoherent ramblings, and his reasoning why he plays for Spain is absurd. 

By I'm far more disappointed with Xavi, a guy who collects a paycheck from real life slave drivers goes on about democracy and violation of human rights. BTW I do not condone what has happened in Catalunya and I feel for all who were impacted by the horrific actions of Madrid and police. Just can't stand keyboard warriors like Pique who says one thing and then dumps on it by playing for Spain and the faux moralists like Xavi who collect blood money but have a need to preach about civil rights.


----------



## Corto

It's amazing how good at football these "lowbie" Spanish teams are. Las Palmas first half vs Barcelona actually played better football, it took a set piece goal to break them. Betis last week in Madrid, etc.

Now, they might lose and be outplayed by Real, Barca, Atletico, Sevilla... But they are good at actual football and try to play ball-on-the-ground, quick pass football.

In comparison to some of the mid-table English teams (including West Ham, who I root for) it's another world.
West Ham, Everton, Soton, WBA... All these mid-table PL teams can't hold a candle to the type of football these Spanish teams play.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> Don't get me started on Pique. Dude is out of touch, his speech was a bunch of incoherent ramblings, and his reasoning why he plays for Spain is absurd.
> 
> By I'm far more disappointed with Xavi, a guy who collects a paycheck from real life slave drivers goes on about democracy and violation of human rights. BTW I do not condone what has happened in Catalunya and I feel for all who were impacted by the horrific actions of Madrid and police. Just can't stand keyboard warriors like Pique who says one thing and then dumps on it by playing for Spain and the faux moralists like Xavi who collect blood money but have a need to preach about civil rights.




This post will probably be deleted because it's not footy related but I couldn't give a shit. It's worth it for those who'll see it. First off let me preface this with that my views are not because I cheer for barca and if the roles were reversed I'd be defending Madrid just as hard. What Catalyuna are trying (accomplished) to do is a human right. SELF DETERMINATION. Even if it is against the constitution then they still are more than in their right to fight it. Sometimes actually a lot of the times the law is wrong and just because it disallows a group of people acting one way does not make it ok. This is in reference to your post on the matter in the political thread. 

As for Pique I didn't listen to the whole interview but what did he say that was so, wrong? He plays for the NT of Spain because he had no alternative if he wanted international glory? He also offered to stop playing for Spain if those in power think he'd be a distraction. I'm not the biggest Pique fan, I love and hate his antics but I couldn't be any prouder in how he's acted. He took a stand which is more than what I can say for most.

Regarding Xavi that is just absurd. As anybody getting paid by a big corporation shouldn't talk about human rights violations? The western states have similar problems to Qatar/UAE. Guess, all those that get a pay check from them shouldn't say anything regarding equality. IF you don't think so, then you're a hypocrite and no better than those bashing NFLers taking a knee.

Some thoughts from a human rights student.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Corto said:


> It's amazing how good at football these "lowbie" Spanish teams are. Las Palmas first half vs Barcelona actually played better football, it took a set piece goal to break them. Betis last week in Madrid, etc.
> 
> Now, they might lose and be outplayed by Real, Barca, Atletico, Sevilla... But they are good at actual football and try to play ball-on-the-ground, quick pass football.
> 
> In comparison to some of the mid-table English teams (including West Ham, who I root for) it's another world.
> West Ham, Everton, Soton, WBA... All these mid-table PL teams can't hold a candle to the type of football these Spanish teams play.




This has been the case, for awhile now.


----------



## les Habs

Luigi Habs said:


> So what happens with Barca in La Liga and Catalan players with the national team?
> 
> Catalogna announced the Yes won the referendum, it's going to be very complicated going from here for recognized independence, but Spain might force out some real good players for the WC: Busquets, Iniesta, Pique, Cesc, Jordi Alba, Bartra. Don't know if La Liga will be forced to kick Barca out, that'll be a huge blow for both La Liga and Barca.




Like I've said before, Catalunya would have a good side that I think is capable of qualifying for at least a Euro. Spain could rely on plenty of other players to fill the gaps, but they wouldn't get the same quality in some positions and then the Basques might want to have their own team as well. Iniesta though, despite having played for Catalnya before, is not Catalan and would likely be part of Spain's setup if he played.

As for the referendum, Spain has handled it completely wrong. From what I understand there is actually only a minority who would vote for such a referendum in the first place. Then they take a heavy-handed approach like they have.



Ivan13 said:


> Don't get me started on Pique. Dude is out of touch, his speech was a bunch of incoherent ramblings, and his reasoning why he plays for Spain is absurd.
> 
> By I'm far more disappointed with Xavi, a guy who collects a paycheck from real life slave drivers goes on about democracy and violation of human rights. BTW I do not condone what has happened in Catalunya and I feel for all who were impacted by the horrific actions of Madrid and police. Just can't stand keyboard warriors like Pique who says one thing and then dumps on it by playing for Spain and the faux moralists like Xavi who collect blood money but have a need to preach about civil rights.




You should do yourself a favor and not get started in the first place. I don't what "speech" you're referring to, but Pique's commentary from what I've seen has been spot on. Also, were I him I would have quit Spain a long time ago, but he's made a very good point about playing for Spain still and he's also been supported by many of his international teammates.



Corto said:


> It's amazing how good at football these "lowbie" Spanish teams are. Las Palmas first half vs Barcelona actually played better football, it took a set piece goal to break them. Betis last week in Madrid, etc.
> 
> Now, they might lose and be outplayed by Real, Barca, Atletico, Sevilla... But they are good at actual football and try to play ball-on-the-ground, quick pass football.
> 
> In comparison to some of the mid-table English teams (including West Ham, who I root for) it's another world.
> West Ham, Everton, Soton, WBA... All these mid-table PL teams can't hold a candle to the type of football these Spanish teams play.




Haven't had time to watch the match yet, but I recall noticing Las Palmas had the majority of possession in the first half as well.

I've been saying this for some time whether in La Liga threads or in the league vs league debates. Joe Blow comes into this thread if there's a blowout and makes it out like it's the SPL and La Liga needs a salary cap. Anyway, I'd also add that La Liga sides as you go down the table are working on much smaller budgets.


----------



## les Habs

Albatros said:


> 3 points to Las Palmas and that's that.






Albatros said:


> Las Palmas is playing for Spain. Still, maybe all things considered one should wish for an amicable draw.








Deficient Mode said:


> Disgusting violence from the Spanish police. La Liga is incompetent, but why did Bartomeu decide to punish the club's own fans by blocking them from the stadium? Seems like a weird protest.




Assuming he was indeed protest, yes and no. An empty stadium like that is pretty newsworthy as we've seen. On top of that the club is losing revenue (not sure about tickets, but they lose any concessions revenue) and possibly pissing off fans. My guess though is that despite his comments he feared the worst. Also, with the confusion of the match not going forward but then being told it had to meant they may have somehow felt unprepared with so many sitting out at the gates at once. He could have been told the club would be fined for displays by the fans. Uefa does it. Who knows? Were it me I would have let them in if the security was indeed in place.


----------



## Ivan13

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> This post will probably be deleted because it's not footy related but I couldn't give a ****. It's worth it for those who'll see it. First off let me preface this with that my views are not because I cheer for barca and if the roles were reversed I'd be defending Madrid just as hard. What Catalyuna are trying (accomplished) to do is a human right. SELF DETERMINATION. Even if it is against the constitution then they still are more than in their right to fight it. Sometimes actually a lot of the times the law is wrong and just because it disallows a group of people acting one way does not make it ok. This is in reference to your post on the matter in the political thread.
> 
> As for Pique I didn't listen to the whole interview but what did he say that was so, wrong? He plays for the NT of Spain because he had no alternative if he wanted international glory? He also offered to stop playing for Spain if those in power think he'd be a distraction. I'm not the biggest Pique fan, I love and hate his antics but I couldn't be any prouder in how he's acted. He took a stand which is more than what I can say for most.
> 
> Regarding Xavi that is just absurd. As anybody getting paid by a big corporation shouldn't talk about human rights violations? The western states have similar problems to Qatar/UAE. Guess, all those that get a pay check from them shouldn't say anything regarding equality. IF you don't think so, then you're a hypocrite and no better than those bashing NFLers taking a knee.
> 
> Some thoughts from a human rights student.




I value personal beliefs more than glory and for one would not dump on my beliefs to win a freaking WC, but we are all wired differently. 

As for political topics, please read all I wrote on the political board.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> I value personal beliefs more than glory and for one would not dump on my beliefs to win a freaking WC, but we are all wired differently.
> 
> As for political topics, please read all I wrote on the political board.




Easier said then done. Pique played for a team outside barca... doesn't make him love barca any less. Why should it be any different to the NT. 

I've read enough. Against the law blame the victims... yet no one is calling the tragedy for what it is... terrorism.


----------



## Ivan13

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Easier said then done. Pique played for a team outside barca... doesn't make him love barca any less. Why should it be any different to the NT.
> 
> I've read enough. Against the law blame the victims... yet no one is calling the tragedy for what it is... terrorism.




You trully are out of touch. No one is blaming the victims and the innocent people who got hurt.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> *You trully are out of touch.* No one is blaming the victims and the innocent people who got hurt.




The irony here. 

You said the Catalan government is trying to do something against the law no?


----------



## Ivan13

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> The irony here.
> 
> You said the Catalan government is trying to do something against the law no?




Because they f***ing are. The referendum is illegal, what Spain did is disgraceful and they should be scolded for it, but what Catalan government did is against Spanish constitution, and not to mention that 91% of Catalan people voted in favour of that constitution back in 70s and that more people were against the spilt leading to the vote according to polls (49 to 41 percent).

The only referendum that can grant emancipation is the one across all Spain, thanks to the constitution that Catalunya backed heavily back in the day, which sucks for the separatists, but it is what it is. Still doesn't condone what the clowns in Madrid did and how disgraceful they were in this whole mess. So again, please read all I wrote there and stop taking things out of context to build up your inane narrative because someone dared to saying something bad against a clown like Pique. 

And last but not least, the victims were the people on the street that got beet up by cowards hiding behind police gear, not Catalan government officials that played a big part in this mess as well.


----------



## Albatros

Barcelona should adopt a more constructive approach like their neighbors Espanyol have done, football can build bridges instead of trenches in a situation like this.


----------



## Jussi

Albatros said:


> Barcelona should adopt a more constructive approach like their neighbors Espanyol have done, football can build bridges instead of trenches in a situation like this.




Barcelona actually were more in favour of a legal process when it came to the referendum.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> Because they ****ing are. The referendum is illegal, what Spain did is disgraceful and they should be scolded for it, but what Catalan government did is against Spanish constitution, and not to mention that 91% of Catalan people voted in favour of that constitution back in 70s and that more people were against the spilt leading to the vote according to polls (49 to 41 percent).
> 
> The only referendum that can grant emancipation is the one across all Spain, thanks to the constitution that Catalunya backed heavily back in the day, which sucks for the separatists, but it is what it is. Still doesn't condone what the clowns in Madrid did and how disgraceful they were in this whole mess. So again, please read all I wrote there and stop taking things out of context to build up your inane narrative because someone dared to saying something bad against a clown like Pique.
> 
> And last but not least, the victims were the people on the street that got beet up by cowards hiding behind police gear, not Catalan government officials that played a big part in this mess as well.




As I said the constitution is wrong. As it has been before. 

Again, this has nothing to do with Pique I've bashed him here before. However, in this case he has said nothing wrong and i'd say that regardless of the team he plays for.

Their could be more than one victim.


----------



## Evilo

How US citizens who went through a secession war can come and say Catalunya's right to freedom is weird.

Catalunyan's authorities were an embarrassement. They've been trying to do this for years and show zero respect to Spain's unity.
Of course, their stupidity was only matched by Spain's central governement that chose repression to such a "poll" (can't find a better word).
Let them vote and be done with it since it absolutely has no meaning. Simple as that.

Majority of catalans were against independance anyway.


----------



## les Habs

Still waiting to hear what Pique's "incoherent ramblings" were. 



Albatros said:


> Barcelona should adopt a more constructive approach like their neighbors Espanyol have done, football can build bridges instead of trenches in a situation like this.




Pray tell what Espanyol have done that Barça should do. Both clubs have gone on strike now.


----------



## Albatros

Espanyol correctly took a neutral position regarding the referendum, protesting against police brutality is a whole different thing.


----------



## maclean

Ivan13 said:


> The referendum is illegal




At the risk of veering too far off topic, if the government makes being gay illegal does that mean you'll criticise people for breaking the law by being gay? The Catalonian authorities have lots of experience with their policies being overturned by political constitutional court rulings, you have to take the situation in context. As an outsider I'd honestly be happier if Catalonia stayed in Spain but if I were in their place I would've had enough as well. And if I were Barcelona the team I would've let the fans in, fines be damned, what else is life about?


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Evilo said:


> How US citizens who went through a secession war can come and say Catalunya's right to freedom is weird.
> 
> Catalunyan's authorities were an embarrassement. They've been trying to do this for years and show zero respect to Spain's unity.
> Of course, their stupidity was only matched by Spain's central governement that chose repression to such a "poll" (can't find a better word).
> Let them vote and be done with it since it absolutely has no meaning. Simple as that.
> 
> Majority of catalans were against independance anyway.




Yep. This would have been the most intelligent approach. Sadly we're governed by idiots (in both sides).
Was in Prague during the 1st of October but I feel ashamed of what happened.
I'm fine and all that I know too, the situation is heating up though :/

As far as I know the game was held in the empty stadium because there was a real possibility of people going down to the grass at the end and start a brawl. I think it was a good decision by the board.


----------



## les Habs

Albatros said:


> Espanyol correctly took a neutral position regarding the referendum, protesting against police brutality is a whole different thing.




There is nothing wrong with the stance that Barça took as regards the referendum. It doesn't surprise me that Espanyol took a neutral stance because their supporter base is very different than Barça's.


----------



## MrFunnyWobbl

Did I ever tell you about the time I went horseback riding with Paulinho, but there weren’t any horses around? Well, Paulinho throws a saddle on my back and rides me around Canoves i Samalus for three days. Well, wouldn’t you know it, my stamina increases with each day and I develop tremendous leg muscles. So anyway, Paulinho decides to enter me in the Breeders’ Cup, right, under the name Turkish Delight. And I’m running in second place, and I’m running and I break my ankle! They’re about to shoot me. Then someone from the crowd yells out, God bless him, ‘Don’t shoot him, he’s a human


----------



## Theokritos

les Habs said:


> There is nothing wrong with the stance that Barça took as regards the referendum. It doesn't surprise me that Espanyol took a neutral stance because their supporter base is very different than Barça's.




I guess the surprise is that Espanyol didn't take an anti-referendum stance. Weren't they originally called Real CD Español Barcelona before the Catalan government made them change the name to the Catalan version "Espanyol"?


----------



## les Habs

Off, away at the Cauldron after an international break.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema didn't miss! OmG!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ugliest goal ever


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Cristiano saves the day!!!!


----------



## Evilo

You just know before he shoots the shot is going to be perfect...


----------



## Evilo

Umtiti is anticipating so well...


----------



## Savi

Godin was amazing this game

Solid point for Barça, didn't deserve to win I think. Atleti were better in the first half, certainly had the better chances. Good seeing Suarez getting the goal.

No clue though what Valverde was thinking putting Gomes on the right wing.


----------



## Live in the Now

Saul is a hell of a player.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Thought Barca should've gotten away with the win, especially with a couple of pens that Atleti got away with. Deulofeu played well on the right wing, Alba not so much. Dembele was missed


----------



## Hadoop

Has hoping Atletico Madrid would be able to sneak a victory at home but it looks like another 3rd place finish this year at best.


----------



## Savi

Woah. What a goal from Guedes.


----------



## Savi

What a game this is  Valencia were up 4-0, now Betis with three quick goals to get back within one. 5 minutes to go

edit: Zaza makes it 5-3

another edit: Pereira in injury time, 6-3 Valencia


----------



## Savi

Guedes is so good.


----------



## Savi

Valencia beat Sevilla 4-0. What a difference a season makes.

Guedes with 2G 1A and another man of the match performance.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> Valencia beat Sevilla 4-0. What a difference a season makes.
> 
> Guedes with 2G 1A and another man of the match performance.



What a difference a coach makes.

Even Zaza looks like a footballer under Marcelino. 

Guedes, soler both look good and I wouldn't mind both along with Gaya but they're tainted with the stink of Valencia.


----------



## Power Man

Lol that goal

The ball was so out of bounds


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Savi said:


> Guedes is so good.




Surely a top-10 U21 player in the world. I would even go as far as saying top-5. This boy is absolutely unreal.


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

The region of Catalonia has voted to declare independence from Spain. I expect games to be affected by this.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Girona and Madrid might be cancelled due to security reasons... funny the Barca game wasn't a security risk.


----------



## xavi4life

The Inquisition.
The indigenous populations of North, South and Central America.
The Cubans.
The Puerto Ricans.
The Filipinos.
The Basques.
Now finally, the Catalans.

For a very catholic nation, they sure are a bunch of murdering assholes.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

xavi4life said:


> The Inquisition.
> The indigenous populations of North, South and Central America.
> The Cubans.
> The Puerto Ricans.
> The Filipinos.
> The Basques.
> Now finally, the Catalans.
> 
> For a very catholic nation, they sure are a bunch of murdering *******s.




Argh I sooo want to dig deeper but I really shouldn't! Don't want to derail this thread thanks for setting me up Xavi!


----------



## xavi4life

Damnit, nobody has taken my bait lol. I wanted to see where this goes...

Needless to say my loyalties lie with democracy. Had the Catalans been able to have free elections there's no guarantee that the majority would have voted for independence. Because of the violent and aggresivie manner in which the central government acted this has all gone to shit. Many catalans who were in favor of keeping spain unified swtich their allegiances. On the other hand, the way Puigdemont has handled this without a clear majority in favor of independence has pissed off a lot of people.

It's a shite state of affairs...


----------



## Evilo

Where do you live Xavi?


----------



## Evilo

Never mind LA. 
Imagine for a second the California government chooses secession just for the heck of it. 
Calls for independance elections just like that without any reason.
How do you think the US would react?


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

MAtS a top five keeper in the world?


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Evilo said:


> Never mind LA.
> Imagine for a second the California government chooses secession just for the heck of it.
> Calls for independance elections just like that without any reason.
> How do you think the US would react?




There are a number in California who want to do that.


----------



## Evilo

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> There are a number in California who want to do that.



That's not the question though.
How would the US federal government react?


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Evilo said:


> That's not the question though.
> How would the US federal government react?




I'd say this US federal government is very unpredictable. 

In reality, I get your point. I think its more similar to Quebec though in Canada than any US state. Isn't the culture in Catalonia very different from the rest of Spain? There are small differences here or there around the USA, but nothing too major.


----------



## Evilo

Catalonia insists on their differences though. Nobody cares about their language, they try to keep their meager 3 letter differences.

Every region of Spain has its own culture. But that doesn't mean they ask for independance.
Quebec/Canada is vastly different because of completely different language.
I get your point about California/US, but maybe another example would be Bayern/Germany. The lander have strong independant identities, but I don't think they want independance.


----------



## Savi

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> MAtS a top five keeper in the world?




No. But he's been very good as of late.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Issssssco!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Trailing against Girona... I do not know wheter to laugh or cry. It isn't a fluke either, they have been the better team all game long.


----------



## Power Man

Congratulations on the title, Barcelona


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Congratulations on the title, Barcelona



8 points back would indeed be a disaster.


----------



## Savi

Real lost to Girona? Woah.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Power Man said:


> Congratulations on the title, Barcelona




Barca didn't look too good yesterday, but great to be in this position since they're still missing Dembele.


----------



## Bakayoko Ono

Ronaldo has one goal on 40 shots in La Liga this season.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Savi said:


> No. But he's been very good as of late.




De Gea, Neuer, Oblak,?, ?


----------



## Savi

Courtois, Buffon..


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> I'd say this US federal government is very unpredictable.
> 
> In reality, I get your point. I think its more similar to Quebec though in Canada than any US state.* Isn't the culture in Catalonia very different from the rest of Spain*? There are small differences here or there around the USA, but nothing too major.




So is Asturias and you will not see them asking for independence. For 90% of the pro-independence party has always been about the $$$ (at least before everything that has been happening this month)


----------



## DoyleG




----------



## Vasilevskiy

And... way to go Girona!!!!


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Savi said:


> Courtois, Buffon..




Buffon's form has dropped off this season, I think he's about even with Courtois.


----------



## Evilo

Savi said:


> Courtois, Buffon..



Lloris.


----------



## Savant

Scenes when Zidane is replaced by Pochettino....


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> That's not the question though.
> How would the US federal government react?




I envision they slowly turn Californians as the other then establish them as some how inferior thus allowable to be abuse. Probably in the name to spread "democracy" or some shit.



Evilo said:


> Catalonia insists on their differences though. *Nobody cares about their language*, they try to keep their meager 3 letter differences.
> 
> Every region of Spain has its own culture. But that doesn't mean they ask for independance.
> Quebec/Canada is vastly different because of completely different language.
> I get your point about California/US, but maybe another example would be Bayern/Germany. The lander have strong independant identities, but I don't think they want independance.




THIS IS HILARIOUS. Considering you can say that about most if not all that is not your culture. I mean who really could tell a Tutsi from a Hutu? A kurd from an "Iraqi"? If you are not part of the culture or ethnic group you all get grouped together from an outsiders perspective. So, yeah they couldn't give a f*** if you care about their language or not. You have no say in how they are governed.

Make no mistake about it, they have legitimate reasons for wanting to be independent and they are valid.


----------



## Evilo

Which valid and legitimate reasons then?
Please enlighten us.

You're an outsider as well mind you. I, at least, spend some time in Spain every year and have many friends there (both in and out of Cataluna).
The Cataluna language is a farce.


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Make no mistake about it, they have legitimate reasons for wanting to be independent and they are valid.




They really don't, not reasons based in how the world and Spain is today.
It's mostly based on history and "feelings", but the oppression is now long gone. Noone is touching their culture or language etc. any more.

The referendum was both illegal and non-representative of how all of Catalunya would vote (people who would vote "no" just stayed at home on a referendum illegal according to the consitution), and was more like the Russia referendum in Crimea than the Scottish referendum.

I really CBA to get into this here, but I can link you up some of my posts on the politics forum about this.
It is complicated, but basically Evilo is right - Catalans are not opressed in Spain, far from it.
But it's an age-old dream in Catalunya, and the politicians are playing to people's feelings.

Now, its not helped that a moron running Catalunya is balanced by a moron running Spanish government.

If Rajoy was smart, he'd tell them to, sure, have a proper referendum, without mob-mentality or Crimea-like circumstances, do a real "yes" and "no" campaign like in Scotland - and its very likely you'd end up with similar results.
These things are always in the 55-45% range, one way or the other. Anyone who thinks that the 90% "yes" referendum is representative of how a real referendum would turn out doesn't know much about politics.
And the million people protesting in Barcelona the other day saying "no" have finally become active so it's really unclear what the results of a real referendum would be.

To be clear, my country has always felt a link to Catalunya, and if the majority there want independence, I'm all for it.
But it has to be done properly and the way Puigemont is running this is both childish and irresponsible.
It doesn't help that Rajoy's responses are mostly childish and irresponsible as well.

Without a referendum recognized by Spain and the EU, it's just a road to misery and despair - for Catalunya, for Spain, and ultimately for the EU.

...

Anyway, sorry about the OT post - happy to take it up in the politics forum.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> Which valid and legitimate reasons then?
> Please enlighten us.
> 
> You're an outsider as well mind you. I, at least, spend some time in Spain every year and have many friends there (both in and out of Cataluna).
> The Cataluna language is a farce.




For one thing $$$ why should Catalunya keep carrying Spain's corpse around? 



Corto said:


> They really don't, not reasons based in how the world and Spain is today.
> It's mostly based on history and "feelings", but the oppression is now long gone. Noone is touching their culture or language etc. any more.
> 
> The referendum was both illegal and non-representative of how all of Catalunya would vote (people who would vote "no" just stayed at home on a referendum illegal according to the consitution), and was more like the Russia referendum in Crimea than the Scottish referendum.
> 
> I really CBA to get into this here, but I can link you up some of my posts on the politics forum about this.
> It is complicated, but basically Evilo is right - Catalans are not opressed in Spain, far from it.
> But it's an age-old dream in Catalunya, and the politicians are playing to people's feelings.
> 
> Now, its not helped that a moron running Catalunya is balanced by a moron running Spanish government.
> 
> If Rajoy was smart, he'd tell them to, sure, have a proper referendum, without mob-mentality or Crimea-like circumstances, do a real "yes" and "no" campaign like in Scotland - and its very likely you'd end up with similar results.
> These things are always in the 55-45% range, one way or the other. Anyone who thinks that the 90% "yes" referendum is representative of how a real referendum would turn out doesn't know much about politics.
> And the million people protesting in Barcelona the other day saying "no" have finally become active so it's really unclear what the results of a real referendum would be.
> 
> To be clear, my country has always felt a link to Catalunya, and if the majority there want independence, I'm all for it.
> But it has to be done properly and the way Puigemont is running this is both childish and irresponsible.
> It doesn't help that Rajoy's responses are mostly childish and irresponsible as well.
> 
> Without a referendum recognized by Spain and the EU, it's just a road to misery and despair - for Catalunya, for Spain, and ultimately for the EU.
> 
> ...
> 
> Anyway, sorry about the OT post - happy to take it up in the politics forum.




As I said on here sometimes laws are wrong and in this case it is. Most of the Catalans did not want independence but didn't vote out of fear... who's fault is that again? Oh, yeah the ones who claim Catalunya are not oppressed and are free. lol.


----------



## Evilo

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> For one thing $$$ why should Catalunya keep carrying Spain's corpse around?



LOL 
As if you have never been there.

And yes, Catauna is not oppressed...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> LOL
> As if you have never been there.
> 
> And yes, Catauna is not oppressed...




Don't have to be there, we are in the information age and we are in a globalized world.

Not oppressed but don't have the right to self determine themselves... hmm.

The people choose independence what right do we have to oppose them?


----------



## Evilo

"People" chose independance"? Some people voted 5 times. Others couldn't vote (stupid Rajoy), some anti-independensists were also afraid to vote, etc...
The f***ing Barca mayor is against independance.

At this point, you should go there to judge before saying they're oppressed.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> "People" chose independance"? Some people voted 5 times. Others couldn't vote (stupid Rajoy), some anti-independensists were also afraid to vote, etc...
> The ****ing Barca mayor is against independance.
> 
> At this point, you should go there to judge before saying they're oppressed.




Again the integrity of the vote and people not having the option to vote is down to Madrid... which you alluded to. If Spain did not infringe on the Catalans right maybe we wouldn't be here but they did and now are left with this mess.

Couldn't give a shit what the Barca mayor wants.

If they weren't oppressed you wouldn't have terrorists abusing the people on the streets.


----------



## maclean

As someone from outside, I can't claim to see the situation clearly and really it's in the best interests of outsiders for it to remain a part of Spain, but that said, the 'autonomy' the Catalans allegedly have is constantly overturned and curtailed by Madrid. There is more to it than just language and culture, it is about freedom to self-determination, to govern themselves in the way they want and not constantly be told that their decisions are invalid even if they should theoretically be part of their purview. That desire is understandable and Madrid's reaction is not, that's what it boils down to for me, independent of whether or not they should be independent.


----------



## Evilo

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Again the integrity of the vote and people not having the option to vote is down to Madrid... which you alluded to. If Spain did not infringe on the Catalans right maybe we wouldn't be here but they did and now are left with this mess.
> 
> Couldn't give a **** what the Barca mayor wants.
> 
> If they weren't oppressed you wouldn't have terrorists abusing the people on the streets.



Catalan right? They had no right to secede.


----------



## Live in the Now

Whatever right they do have, if it is determined they should have one, should be decided by every adult in the region as well. This is unquestionably not applicable to this situation as every adult has not decided. 



Pavel Buchnevich said:


> There are a number in California who want to do that.




Those people are brain dead.


----------



## Evilo

BTW, still waiting on the valid reasons Cataluna has to seceede. That oppression you know.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> Catalan right? They had no right to secede.




EVERYONE has the right for self determination... I thought this was obvious guess not. Funny how some want independence for the Kurds but not for the Catalans. Which is it guys?

Please, don't point to the constitution as "evidence" of lack of rights. As I hope one would agree that rights did not have to be law in order for it to exist. 



Evilo said:


> BTW, still waiting on the valid reasons Cataluna has to seceede. That oppression you know.




$$$


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Evilo said:


> Lloris.




Top five: Neuer, De Gea, Oblak, ter-Stegen, Courtois

6-10: Lloris, Buffon, Handanovic, Donnarumma, Navas

Next few not in any particular order: Ederson, Fahrmann, Buerki, Perin, Rico, Butland


----------



## Evilo

Yeah Ter Stegen is not better than Lloris by any stretch of the imagination. Buffon's still better too. Handanovic has a say as well.

Burki? Seriously? Not even close.

Anyway, not respecting the Constitution and the Law is a right now. Big news.

So Cataluna's oppressed with money... LOL


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> Yeah Ter Stegen is not better than Lloris by any stretch of the imagination. Buffon's still better too. Handanovic has a say as well.
> 
> Burki? Seriously? Not even close.
> 
> Anyway, not respecting the Constitution and the Law is a right now. Big news.
> 
> So Cataluna's oppressed with money... LOL




LOL indeed. Way to twist my words. You're better than that, I thought at least. I said sometimes the constitution is wrong and just because something goes against the law of the land does not make it less of a right. Don't believe me just ask the citizens of Saudi Arabia. 

Again twisting my words or lack of reading comprehension... You asked for valid reasons Catalans have to secede from Spain I said $. 

I suppose this is fundamental difference in different world perspectives.


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> EVERYONE has the right for self determination... I thought this was obvious guess not. Funny how some want independence for the Kurds but not for the Catalans. Which is it guys?




Yes everyone. Not just the ones who voted. Very clearly not everyone voted.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Evilo said:


> Burki? Seriously? Not even close.




He's had a bad few months, but he's mostly a very good keeper. I think if we discussed this 2 months ago or in 2 months, most would have no problem him being in a top 20 of keeper rankings.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> Yes everyone. Not just the ones who voted. Very clearly not everyone voted.




Out of fear from Spain... but again no oppression at all right? LOL


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Out of fear from Spain... but again no oppression at all right? LOL




So you're taking the stance that all 56.97% who didn't vote on something important decided not to vote out of fear from Spain?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> So you're taking the stance that all 56.97% who didn't vote on something important decided not to vote out of fear from Spain?




It's ludicrous to speak in absolute terms. I do not know everyones reasons for not voting. Some probably don't care enough to vote ( I personally didn't vote up until the last Canadian election despite having that right for a decade), some are lazy but most I envision did not want their face bashed. Weird Catalans I guess.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Evilo said:


> Yeah Ter Stegen is not better than Lloris by any stretch of the imagination. Buffon's still better too. Handanovic has a say as well.
> 
> Burki? Seriously? Not even close.
> 
> Anyway, not respecting the Constitution and the Law is a right now. Big news.
> 
> So Cataluna's oppressed with money... LOL




I think Handanovic is a better keeper than Ter Stegen ATM.
Not sure about Lloris, I think they're on the same level. Ter Stegen has been brilliant this season.


----------



## S E P H

I'm fine with Catalan wanting to secede from Spain, however, I am not okay with a far-left communist extremist group threatening voters and taking over the city, which is what is happening.

It's similar to the Russia and Ukraine incident which happened a couple years back, except that Russia was providing weapons for the pro-Russians which we're not seeing here thankfully.


----------



## DoyleG

Live in the Now said:


> Yes everyone. Not just the ones who voted. Very clearly not everyone voted.




If those who didn't vote did so because Madrid told them to, no sympathy then.


----------



## DoyleG

S E P H said:


> I'm fine with Catalan wanting to secede from Spain, however, I am not okay with a far-left communist extremist group threatening voters and taking over the city, which is what is happening.




Exactly which group are you referring to?


----------



## maclean

Live in the Now said:


> Yes everyone. Not just the ones who voted. Very clearly not everyone voted.




I think it's fair to say that a lot of people didn't vote because there were police in the street barring people from doing so, because polling boxes were being confiscated, and some just out of a respect for "rule of law" or because they didn't believe the result would have any weight under such circumstances. I agree with you the issue should be decided by "all", the problem I see is that Madrid caused the situation under which this wasn't possible, when it (meaning united Spain) very likely could have won anyhow. Thus I understand how the Catalan leadership has been strongarmed into a corner and doesn't want to let Madrid dictate the circumstances. Basically Madrid has taken an approach a jailor takes to a prisoner - you have no rights and any way you act out will only be met with more repression until you break. Personally I can understand why the Catalans in such a situation would decide f*** you, we won't break, so the only choice is to defy them and declare independence. But if Madrid is so assured of the inassailability of its constitution, it could have let the referendum go through and on the off chance independence had won, we'd be in the same situation we are now but without all the unnecessary violence. With one exception - the separatists would have gained some validity in the eyes of the international community. That was what Spain wanted to prevent and I find it disturbing that they succeeded in that after what they did to innocent people trying to act democratically.


----------



## Evilo

The Catalans I know who didn't vote didn't go because they thought it had no reason to be.


----------



## Evilo

What is democratic?
Certainly not something against the Law in a free voting country.

In any case, I agree with Rajoy acting like an idiot. I said so from the beginning. But to say Catalans are oppressed and are the one rich region in Spain is laughable. Completely laughable.
Again, that's very much like California saying they're too rich for middle west, even though they are other rich regions in the US.


----------



## Evilo

And since Russia was tossed, of COURSE Russia is happy with all of this. They want Europe to separate into tons of small countries. Heck, they found a map the other day from 5-10 years ago with the ideal political situation of Europe per pro-Russians. They had Catalunya, Scotland and others as seceeded.


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It's ludicrous to speak in absolute terms. I do not know everyones reasons for not voting. Some probably don't care enough to vote ( I personally didn't vote up until the last Canadian election despite having that right for a decade), some are lazy but most I envision did not want their face bashed. Weird Catalans I guess.




The vast majority of people wanting independence turned up.
It's the ones who would vote no that largely stayed at home. I'm not sure how you're missing that.

I've read and studid politics and geography and history and you get an idea how these referendums work, but when you live through one, that just completes the picture.
The atmosphere in Catalunya right now, created by Puigemont in his irresponsible politics is one of hatred and resentment towards anyone NOT voting for secession and people can't even say they feel Spanish in public out of fear.
That is how nationalism works, how campaigns based on emotions work, and how the world works.
It doesn't mean that historically Catalans weren't oppressed (they quite clearly were), it doesn't mean that Spain even makes sense culturally (half the countries in Europe are made of people completely unlike each other simply because one ruler or another "united" them by force 500 or 800 years ago - my own country included), but right now the illegal referendum is irresponsible and an incredibly bad idea for Catalunya, Spain and Europe.

There was a million people march in Barcelona the other day from the "no" crowd.
Pure numbers (and logic) tell us that the majority of people who abstained from the referendum belong to that part of the population.
Not to mention that referendums like these tend to have a bigger turnout among the crowd who rely more on feelings and fight passionately for something (and those always tend to be nationalistic in cases like these) compared to the opposition where you have to show cold facts and numbers (if there are any) and present the people the options (because they need to have facts and numbers that work for them to vote "no", campaign based on emotion here won't work).
There was no campaign for the referendum. Noone presented any numbers or possibilites to the Catalans as to how their economy would look like out of Spain and EU - even if Spain and the EU were to formally recognize them as a nation.
These FACTS are simply being ignored by the "yes", the quite irrefutable facts that Catalunya would be facing an ecomonic catastrophe, much more than any negative consquences Spain would be suffering. Puigemont completely ignored ALL OF IT, never even compiling a plan for going forward.
He's the most irresponsible politician Europe has seen in a while - though that doesn't excuse Rajoy who went completely the wrong way about the whole thing.


Take any religion-based initiative, or any referendum where one side represent a more nationalistic POV, and you'll see quite clearly that the side basing its views on emotions will be far more active and be far more likely to vote.
The ones basing their choices on reason and facts and numbers will have to be enticed to vote. Or be motivated by fear (mostly when it comes to human rights and religion, from abortion to gay rights).

TLDR; IMO your reasoning here is (very) faulty. The majority of the people abstaining from the referendum would be the "no" voters - some abstaining because they weren't as motivated to vote as the "yes" crowd, but mostly because it was all illegal.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Evilo said:


> The Catalans I know who didn't vote didn't go because they thought it had no reason to be.




The referendum was not serious. There are a lot of reasons why it wasn't:
1. Universal vote announced 45 minutes before the voting started... that's ridicolous.
2. The IT system was sabotaged by the Spanish police. Therefore no control whatsoever on who voted, etc... the final count of votes had a 100,8% over the people that in theory voted. Therefore there is an 0.8% of magical votes that came out of nowhere (people that decided to vote more than once, etc)
3. The boxes being hidden and transported from one place to another like if it was a cinema movie whenever they were told police was close.
4. Last but not least... it had zero validity to the Spanish government.


I might get ripped apart from what I'm about to say, but I've been here in Barcelona the whole time and I'm tired of the victimhood shown by a lot of the pro-indepence party.
While the violence on 1st october was completely avoidable, let's not forget that the team of police that did it was the riot guys.


Sounds similar to any of you? These guys were in Plaza Catalunya doing a demonstration against the government a few years ago. It was quite a famous demonstration too. The lovely police of Catalunya did the VERY SAME that was done by the Spanish guys. It was again the riot team. These guys are trained to do this. They got rightfully blamed back in the day... I didn't listen anyone say that we were being oppressed. 

There has not been any other violent incident during all this time and Spanish police could have easily acted more times, because they were being taunted for days at the hotel they were staying, I'm surprised they didn't snap.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Corto said:


> The vast majority of people wanting independence turned up.
> It's the ones who would vote no that largely stayed at home. I'm not sure how you're missing that.
> 
> I've read and studid politics and geography and history and you get an idea how these referendums work, but when you live through one, that just completes the picture.
> *The atmosphere in Catalunya right now, created by Puigemont in his irresponsible politics is one of hatred and resentment towards anyone NOT voting for secession and people can't even say they feel Spanish in public out of fear.*
> That is how nationalism works, how campaigns based on emotions work, and how the world works.
> It doesn't mean that historically Catalans weren't oppressed (they quite clearly were), it doesn't mean that Spain even makes sense culturally (half the countries in Europe are made of people completely unlike each other simply because one ruler or another "united" them by force 500 or 800 years ago - my own country included), but right now the illegal referendum is irresponsible and an incredibly bad idea for Catalunya, Spain and Europe.
> 
> There was a million people march in Barcelona the other day from the "no" crowd.
> *Pure numbers (and logic) tell us that the majority of people who abstained from the referendum belong to that part of the population.*
> Not to mention that referendums like these tend to have a bigger turnout among the crowd who rely more on feelings and fight passionately for something (and those always tend to be nationalistic in cases like these) compared to the opposition where you have to show cold facts and numbers (if there are any) and present the people the options (because they need to have facts and numbers that work for them to vote "no", campaign based on emotion here won't work).
> There was no campaign for the referendum. Noone presented any numbers or possibilites to the Catalans as to how their economy would look like out of Spain and EU - even if Spain and the EU were to formally recognize them as a nation.
> These FACTS are simply being ignored by the "yes", the quite irrefutable facts that Catalunya would be facing an ecomonic catastrophe, much more than any negative consquences Spain would be suffering. Puigemont completely ignored ALL OF IT, never even compiling a plan for going forward.
> He's the most irresponsible politician Europe has seen in a while - though that doesn't excuse Rajoy who went completely the wrong way about the whole thing.
> 
> 
> Take any religion-based initiative, or any referendum where one side represent a more nationalistic POV, and you'll see quite clearly that the side basing its views on emotions will be far more active and be far more likely to vote.
> The ones basing their choices on reason and facts and numbers will have to be enticed to vote. Or be motivated by fear (mostly when it comes to human rights and religion, from abortion to gay rights).
> 
> TLDR; IMO your reasoning here is (very) faulty. The majority of the people abstaining from the referendum would be the "no" voters - some abstaining because they weren't as motivated to vote as the "yes" crowd, but mostly because it was all illegal.




Just adding some things to the bolded parts:
1. Completely true. Depending who is around you, there's a good chance you get taunted, maybe even insulted just because you say something contrary to what they think. It could even be a neutral opinion or a fact that is not what they're in favour. You're already a fascist in their minds, and I'm no joking, I've been told I'm one for saying a neutral opinion. Mind you, the same happens for the radical pro-Spain.
2. True, but most important, of all people that I know that vould vote NO, barely anyone assisted, that means there's a LOT of people still that didn't show up, a lot. Everything being said, there were quite some spanish tourists that assisted the march, still, there's much more people than they think that is against the independence, which is at least what the polls say.


----------



## Ivan13

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> LOL indeed. Way to twist my words. You're better than that, I thought at least. I said sometimes the constitution is wrong and just because something goes against the law of the land does not make it less of a right. Don't believe me just ask the citizens of Saudi Arabia.
> 
> Again twisting my words or lack of reading comprehension... *You asked for valid reasons Catalans have to secede from Spain I said $*.
> 
> I suppose this is fundamental difference in different world perspectives.




It is far, far more likely that the succession will cause massive economic problems for Catalunya rather than the other way around. 

And I don't know how in the world can someone equate people of Saudi Arabia or Kurds with freaking Catalans, this kind of nonsensical parallels boggles my mind. No one is oppressing them, Franco is dead, buried and rotting in the ground, stop acting like it's 1960s. Citizens of Catalunya have every right as those that live in any other part of the country, and again to repeat what I wrote on the politics forum, in the last poll leading up to the referendum (if we dare to call that travesty a referendum) more people wanted to stay in Spain as opposed to split. It's to bad both sides are lead by morons, the government should've allowed the farse to happen, the referendum would likely fall, this way with their actions they effectively did what Catalan government wanted and played into their hands.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> What is democratic?
> Certainly not something against the Law in a free voting country.
> 
> In any case, I agree with Rajoy acting like an idiot. I said so from the beginning. But to say Catalans are oppressed a*nd are the one rich region in Spain is laughable. Completely laughable.*
> Again, that's very much like California saying they're too rich for middle west, even though they are other rich regions in the US.




Don't think anyone here said this. 



Corto said:


> The vast majority of people wanting independence turned up.
> It's the ones who would vote no that largely stayed at home. I'm not sure how you're missing that.




It's not lost on me. It's painfully obvious and again as I said previously that's on the Spanish government. 


Corto said:


> I've read and studid politics and geography and history and you get an idea how these referendums work, but when you live through one, that just completes the picture.




That's great.... you're not the only one. Sooo.?



Corto said:


> There was a million people march in Barcelona the other day from the "no" crowd.
> Pure numbers (and logic) tell us that the majority of people who abstained from the referendum belong to that part of the population.
> Not to mention that referendums like these tend to have a bigger turnout among the crowd who rely more on feelings and fight passionately for something (and those always tend to be nationalistic in cases like these) compared to the opposition where you have to show cold facts and numbers (if there are any) and present the people the options (because they need to have facts and numbers that work for them to vote "no", campaign based on emotion here won't work).
> There was no campaign for the referendum. Noone presented any numbers or possibilites to the Catalans as to how their economy would look like out of Spain and EU - even if Spain and the EU were to formally recognize them as a nation.
> These FACTS are simply being ignored by the "yes", the quite irrefutable facts that Catalunya would be facing an ecomonic catastrophe, much more than any negative consquences Spain would be suffering. Puigemont completely ignored ALL OF IT, never even compiling a plan for going forward.
> He's the most irresponsible politician Europe has seen in a while - though that doesn't excuse Rajoy who went completely the wrong way about the whole thing.




I personally have no horse in this race. It will not affect my life directly if Spain stays intact or if Catalunya wins independence. What I don't like is when people get their basic rights infringed upon. That's all I'm arguing for.



Corto said:


> TLDR; IMO your reasoning here is (very) faulty. The majority of the people abstaining from the referendum would be the "no" voters - some abstaining because they weren't as motivated to vote as the "yes" crowd, but mostly because it was all illegal.




Like I said they never got a chance at a fair election. Thanks to the civilized democratic west. If it was that glaringly obvious that Catalunya would've voted "no" Spain would've played ball. One would think. The majority also thought the UK would exist the EU and Trump would never win. Here we are though. Let's stop talking in absolutes and let people decide for themselves how they want to be governed shall we?



Ivan13 said:


> It is far, far more likely that the succession will cause massive economic problems for Catalunya rather than the other way around.
> 
> *And I don't know how in the world can someone equate people of Saudi Arabia or Kurds with freaking Catalans, this kind of nonsensical parallels boggles my mind.* No one is oppressing them, Franco is dead, buried and rotting in the ground, stop acting like it's 1960s. Citizens of Catalunya have every right as those that live in any other part of the country, and again to repeat what I wrote on the politics forum, in the last poll leading up to the referendum (if we dare to call that travesty a referendum) more people wanted to stay in Spain as opposed to split. It's to bad both sides are lead by morons, the government should've allowed the farse to happen, the referendum would likely fall, this way with their actions they effectively did what Catalan government wanted and played into their hands.




Whether that is the case or not doesn't make it any less of a right to self determine. 

Yeah, nobody said that. I said people still have rights whether they are written down or not. This is why people claim human right violations regardless of the law of the land.... if they needed to be written then citizens in Saudi Arabia do not have their rights infringed upon. Got it?

As for the Kurds they are as oppressed as anyone in that region no better or worse. Actually they might have it better considering they are well organized.

It's disheartening to see so many people opposed to basic rights. Honestly, it's sickening. It is what it is I suppose. Y'all can have the last word. I'm out.


----------



## S E P H

DoyleG said:


> Exactly which group are you referring to?



Candidatura d'Unitat Popular where some members are part of the Euskadi Ta Askatasuna.


----------



## Ivan13

Opposed to civil rights? Dear God the drivel that some people come up with.


----------



## Evilo

Saudi Arabia is nto a democracy.

I don't agree with Macron's policy. It's very likely he doesn't have the majority in Normandy where I live.
Doesn't mean we have the right to seceede. He was elected properly. Just like Rajoy in Spain.
The law in a democracy is by definition the rights.


----------



## DoyleG

S E P H said:


> Candidatura d'Unitat Popular where some members are part of the Euskadi Ta Askatasuna.




A party that gets 8$ of the vote? 

I'd believe you more if they were CNT.


----------



## xavi4life

Evilo said:


> Never mind LA.
> Imagine for a second the California government chooses secession just for the heck of it.
> Calls for independance elections just like that without any reason.
> How do you think the US would react?



As a Californian I'd absolutely love it if California went independent, but I know sure as hell that the Federal government would never allow it.

I just don't want to see anymore violence in Catalunya. I'm going to have to catch up on reading all the great stuff you guys have posted. I was in Barcelona in April and it feels like it's really split 50/50. Rajoy is an idiot for sure though.


----------



## S E P H

DoyleG said:


> A party that gets 8$ of the vote?
> 
> I'd believe you more if they were CNT.



Some of them are also the CNT, but budget doesn't really have a lot to do with any (potential) violence. ANTIFA is probably a low budget organization, but are quite good when it comes to riot tactics.


----------



## Savi

Alcacer with 2 goals. Good for him.

Luis Suarez though. That's going to be a problem if he continues like this. It's not just his lack of goals , it seems like he can't play football anymore. Really basis stuff like passing the ball to a teammate is almost too hard for him at this point.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> Alcacer with 2 goals. Good for him.
> 
> Luis Suarez though. That's going to be a problem if he continues like this. It's not just his lack of goals , it seems like he can't play football anymore. Really basis stuff like passing the ball to a teammate is almost too hard for him at this point.





Barca were lucky to get the win. One was an offside goal and the other could've been called back because of the tackle by Umiti. Sevilla were the better team.


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Barca were lucky to get the win.




I don't agree. Barça could have been up 3-0 easily after only 10 minutes. It was one chance after another. Sevilla only started playing well in the second half.


----------



## TheMoreYouKnow

Gotta love the massive political derail in here. I guess it's inevitable given that FC Barcelona is the separatists' golden cow and itself probably one of the biggest promoters of the illegal insurrection that took place. I think it's quite humorous how many people who like Barca for some reason automatically then also take the side of the separatists as if they knew even 1/10 of what would be required to form an educated opinion on the matter.

In the case of Barca I think it's funny that they took 150 million Euro from Qatar, a ruthless authoritarian regime condoning slave labor, but then support nonsense radical propaganda which pretends modern democratic Spain is 'oppressive'.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema f***ing sucks. Another glorious chance missed. Get rid of this guy and get a real god damn striker.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

TheMoreYouKnow said:


> Gotta love the massive political derail in here. I guess it's inevitable given that FC Barcelona is the separatists' golden cow and itself probably one of the biggest promoters of the illegal insurrection that took place. I think it's quite humorous how many people who like Barca for some reason automatically then also take the side of the separatists as if they knew even 1/10 of what would be required to form an educated opinion on the matter.
> 
> In the case of Barca I think it's funny that they took 150 million Euro from Qatar, a ruthless authoritarian regime condoning slave labor, but then support nonsense radical propaganda which pretends modern democratic Spain is 'oppressive'.



Oh f*** off. 

I said numerous times it has nothing to do with football and it's probably better for Barca if Cataluyna remains under Spain. 

My views have to do with the profession I have chosen as a career. So f*** off with your garbage.

I'll take the infraction.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Benzema ****ing sucks. Another glorious chance missed. Get rid of this guy and get a real god damn striker.



Should get rid of others as well, your boy included.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Linesmens blind this weekend. 

Lovely interplay by las palmas.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Should get rid of others as well, your boy included.




Bale? Well, he is always out so unfortunately, yeah. He probably should go.

We should not have sold Morata. Dumb move.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Bale? Well, he is always out so unfortunately, yeah. He probably should go.
> 
> We should not have sold Morata. Dumb move.



Even if he was healthy, don't see the hype about him or the price tag. There are better options.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Even if he was healthy, don't see the hype about him or the price tag. There are better options.




He has been pretty good when healthy this year. His style doesn't really fit though, I agree.

Casemiro opens the scoring!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> He has been pretty good when healthy this year. His style doesn't really fit though, I agree.
> 
> Casemiro opens the scoring!



HIs style, his hair, his price... he's just bunk lol.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> HIs style, his hair, his price... he's just bunk lol.




Hey, watch it


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio <3 <3 <3


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Casemiro as usual gets away with a card and a penalty.


----------



## BKIslandersFan

If Barcelona B finish in a promotion spot I know they don't get promoted but who takes their spot? Team that finished immediately before them or only two teams go up and two sent down?

What if Barcelona is good enough to make the promotion playoffs? Do they play?


----------



## Savi

BKIslandersFan said:


> If Barcelona B finish in a promotion spot I know they don't get promoted but who takes their spot? Team that finished immediately before them or only two teams go up and two sent down?
> 
> What if Barcelona is good enough to make the promotion playoffs? Do they play?




Neither Barça B or any other B team can be promoted or participate in promotion playoffs for La Liga. 

If they finish 1 or 2, then the 3rd ranked team will get promoted. If they finish 3-6 then the 7th ranked team takes their place in the promotion playoffs


----------



## Corto

Scandale du Jour said:


> Bale? Well, he is always out so unfortunately, yeah. He probably should go.
> 
> We should not have sold Morata. Dumb move.




You can't keep a player against his will. But Morata wouldn't help them now, it's not just "Benzema missed a sitter" that's the problem.

I mean, yes, Benzema needs to finish some of those chances, but he's worlds ahead of Morata in build up play. As much as he's struggling to score, he's part of the reason why Ronaldo scored so many crucial goals last season.

Real is missing two things right now, making them look in more trouble than they really are:

- Real "B"... No Morata, Isco, Pepe and Danilo, Kovacic out injured... Together with Isco, Kovacic and Morata were key in unlocking stationary defenses against "lesser teams"... Real's starting 11 is built for power football and taking down big teams, there's a reason why they won 3 out of the last 4 CLs and only one La Liga - Barca has the game (and the players) to play more consistently and dominate lesser teams (but they also tend to struggle more in the later rounds of the CL... "struggle" sounds bad for a team that is 2 years removed from winning the CL lol...).
Real "B" wasn't just fantastic so the "A" team could rest for the CL, but they genuinely played a style of football perfect to destroyed lesser, defending teams with no attacking ambitions.
Barca is even more consistent now, no Neymar and Semedo patching up the RB means they're much more compact and harder to break through... They may not score as much, but Messi will create something in the end, and I don't see them dropping many points in "small" games in La Liga unless they drop in form

- No Carvajal. I said this before, most people - even a lot of people who know a decent amount about football - underestimate how much a team can miss one player.
In Carvajal, they lost the world's best RB, Modric and Casemiro are suffering, Achraf is simply not yet on the required level. They're having to cover defensively and the moves are ending with Achraf making a run, but ultimately doing nothing. At this point last season, Real's right side created 18 goals. This season, they've created 1.
They're hemmorraging there much like Barca was last year and its making the entire team look worse off than they are.
Also, Marcelo is nowhere near top form, he's struggling after the injury, he's miles away from the player he was last season - but I think all agree it's a matter of time before he puts it together again.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

ter-Stegen is elite. Can't believe the dobbers wanted to get rid of him to City instead of Bravo.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

And also, people blame the Barca board, but they signed Umtiti and ter-Stegen who are two core pieces in that side. Lets give credit when its due. Two great signings.


----------



## Savi

I missed the game, how was it?


----------



## les Habs

What are you on about? Who wanted ter Stegen sold instead of Bravo? The only time anyone would agree that would have been if City were throwing stupid money at ter Stegen. Either verify what you're saying or go back to the drawing board.

The sporting directors signed Umtiti and ter Stegen and not the board. They also signed Vermaelen and Turan so it's a two-way street. Two excellent signings don't excuse other poor decision making.


----------



## Savi

Correa  what a miss


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

les Habs said:


> What are you on about? Who wanted ter Stegen sold instead of Bravo? The only time anyone would agree that would have been if City were throwing stupid money at ter Stegen. Either verify what you're saying or go back to the drawing board.
> 
> The sporting directors signed Umtiti and ter Stegen and not the board. They also signed Vermaelen and Turan so it's a two-way street. Two excellent signings don't excuse other poor decision making.




I remember that there was some debate at the time on who to keep. Man City was rumored to sign both, Barcelona was basically going to have to make up their mind on which one to keep. There were some fans, it probably wasn't very many, but some who wanted to keep Bravo who sucks now, and he's why City had to buy Ederson.

I think Barcelona have made some good signings, I think the problem is the lack of depth. When Deulofeu is your fill in for an injured Dembele, you don't have enough depth. Part of the problem is that Barcelona has abandoned La Masia. They get nothing from their academy anymore.


----------



## les Habs

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> I remember that there was some debate at the time on who to keep. Man City was rumored to sign both, Barcelona was basically going to have to make up their mind on which one to keep. There were some fans, it probably wasn't very many, but some who wanted to keep Bravo who sucks now, and he's why City had to buy Ederson.
> 
> I think Barcelona have made some good signings, I think the problem is the lack of depth. When Deulofeu is your fill in for an injured Dembele, you don't have enough depth. Part of the problem is that Barcelona has abandoned La Masia. They get nothing from their academy anymore.




Well dig something up and link it or I don't know what you're talking about. Like I said, ter Stegen for a big fee I could see, but I don't recall anyone wanting to keep Bravo over ter Stegen. And for the record, Bravo was excellent for us the entire time he was here.

What are you talking about? You're complaining about Deulofeu as a depth player and then saying the club abandoned La Masia and that they get nothing from the academy anymore. For starters, as a depth player, Deulofeu is great to have right now. He's a homegrown player, cost very little to buy back and most important he's played very well this season. The problem is Valverde who rotates too many players and isn't giving the Deulofeu the consistent minutes he's earned. I honestly doubt you've seen him play since he's come back. As for La Masia, it's still producing players and the club gets plenty from La Masia. The problem is the manager not giving certain players chances. Deulofeu is a prime example. He's proving his worth this season. You've got Alena in the B team, who for my money looked better than every other midfielder in preseason, having what looks like an excellent season in Segunda. You've also got Cucurella who looks like he'll be a top drawer LB. Plenty of players still coming up through La Masia and it will continue to produce talent for the foreseeable future. The only question is who will get a chance and who won't.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Dig something up?  Sorry, I'm not doing that. This is a year and a half ago, I don't even know how I could find twitter reactions from that long ago. I'm not saying it was most Barcelona fans, but I do remember the debate. At the time they were splitting time with Bravo getting the league games, Man City had enquired about both, and I remember there were some who preferred to keep Bravo. I'm only saying that imagine the difference had they chosen to keep Bravo who lasted only a few months as City's starter.

Didn't Deulofeu struggle on all his loans? I'm talking about players who do well in La Masia initially, not a player who returns after like 4 or 5 unsuccessful/semi-successful loans at age 23. Maybe he is doing well, I'm not sure declaring he's back after 3 months makes sense, but its besides the point. I'm talking about players who might have Barcelona quality or might've had a chance to have it when they were coming through the ranks, but don't ever get a chance. Thiago, Samper, Grimaldo, Sandro. Bartra's another one, although he was let go at an older age, but it doesn't seem like he was ever given much of an opportunity. Were any of those players given a real opportunity right out of the academy? You guys have forgotten your identity. You brought all these players through La Masia when Messi was starting out, and now you haven't even brought one through in years who's now playing on a consistent basis for your first team, unless you count guys like Deulofeu and Roberto, but they were La Masia players years ago.

I also didn't say the academy is a problem, your club is not bringing these players through, which is a problem. Depth becomes an issue when your only way to build your roster is through the transfer market, especially when your signings have been so hit or miss. There have been a few really good ones, but then just as many or more not good ones. I kind of feel like instead of these dumb Mathieu, Vermaelen, Vidal, Turan signings, there was a better way to go about who could play those parts in the squad.


----------



## les Habs

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> Dig something up?  Sorry, I'm not doing that. This is a year and a half ago, I don't even know how I could find twitter reactions from that long ago. I'm not saying it was most Barcelona fans, but I do remember the debate. At the time they were splitting time with Bravo getting the league games, Man City had enquired about both, and I remember there were some who preferred to keep Bravo. I'm only saying that imagine the difference had they chosen to keep Bravo who lasted only a few months as City's starter.
> 
> Didn't Deulofeu struggle on all his loans? I'm talking about players who do well in La Masia initially, not a player who returns after like 4 or 5 unsuccessful/semi-successful loans at age 23. Maybe he is doing well, I'm not sure declaring he's back after 3 months makes sense, but its besides the point. I'm talking about players who might have Barcelona quality or might've had a chance to have it when they were coming through the ranks, but don't ever get a chance. Thiago, Samper, Grimaldo, Sandro. Bartra's another one, although he was let go at an older age, but it doesn't seem like he was ever given much of an opportunity. Were any of those players given a real opportunity right out of the academy? You guys have forgotten your identity. You brought all these players through La Masia when Messi was starting out, and now you haven't even brought one through in years who's now playing on a consistent basis for your first team, unless you count guys like Deulofeu and Roberto, but they were La Masia players years ago.
> 
> I also didn't say the academy is a problem, your club is not bringing these players through, which is a problem. Depth becomes an issue when your only way to build your roster is through the transfer market, especially when your signings have been so hit or miss. There have been a few really good ones, but then just as many or more not good ones. I kind of feel like instead of these dumb Mathieu, Vermaelen, Vidal, Turan signings, there was a better way to go about who could play those parts in the squad.




Well if you're referring to away from the forum then so be it. Still I doubt there was anything close to a majority who would have preferred selling ter Stegen apart from getting a great fee for him.

Not from what I understand and even when he did "struggle" I'd say there's some context around that. Not sure how that's relevant to how he's playing now anyway. Deulofeu did well in La Masia initially too. And I didn't say "he's back". I simply replied to you saying he's not good enough to cover for an injured Dembele when it's clear he is if he gets the minutes. He also definitely has the quality. He may not be good enough to start right now when the squad is at full strength with no injuries, but he's good enough to be the in team. He never got a chance unless you'd care to demonstrate otherwise. As for the other players, Sandro technically isn't a La Masia product and got much more of a chance than Deulofeu ever did. Thiago and Bartra both had chances as well. Samper and Grimaldo did not. None of the latter four got the chances I think they deserved and have said as much for years now, still I wouldn't make such a statement as the club has forgotten it's identity. Deulofeu and Roberto are proof of that, Suarez too by your definition of a youth product, as well as Rafinha. The point though is it's down to respective manager's decisions. Those managers have won titles, even trebles. So while I disagree with their decisions, they were still successful. That's not to mention that some players like Thiago chose to leave and there were other factors at play. 

You said the club gets nothing from the academy anymore which isn't true. You're also now saying the only way to build the roster is with the transfer market which also isn't true. As for the signings you mentioned, the club has made as many good signings if not more. Hell, the year Vermaelen and Mathieu were brought in so were Suarez, Rakitic, ter Stegen and Bravo.

Were it up to me the likes of Thiago, Bartra, Grimaldo and Samper would all be in the squad right now. Alena next season at the very latest.


----------



## Cassano

It'll be comical when Ronaldo wins the Ballon D'Or for half of season of good performances and half of it being utter shit.


----------



## Evilo

Rumor is that Messi won it.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Should be Messi and no one even close really. Barca and Argentina were relevant only because of him. 

At this point i think De Bruyne would be even more deserving than Ronaldo.


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

Luigi Habs said:


> Should be Messi and no one even close really. Barca and Argentina were relevant only because of him.
> 
> At this point i think De Bruyne would be even more deserving than Ronaldo.




De Bruyne would be some serious recency bias. He was good the first half of the year, no doubt, but it's only been since the start of the new season that he's been at this next level. Kante would be more deserving than both.


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

Marcelino is bae.


----------



## Savi

That's 8 straight W's for Valencia.

One week from now it's Valencia-Barça at the Mestalla.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

It would be hilarious if Messi doesn't win it.

He pretty much locked up a la liga title in November. I don't envision Suarez ever waking up so, it's really all on Messi if he continues like this Barca will take it. If not then it opens up the door to AM and Valencia.


----------



## Caramel

Valencia will probably lose but the Mestalla will roar for all 90 minutes of it


----------



## les Habs

Was just having a look at a few things and Madrid's record in it's last four matches is 1-2-1. During that stretch Asensio started one match and that was the match they won. He was also Man of the Match. Meanwhile Ronaldo and Benzema started all of those matches. Ronaldo contributed a goal and assist, Benzema nothing.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

les Habs said:


> Was just having a look at a few things and Madrid's record in it's last four matches is 1-2-1. During that stretch Asensio started one match and that was the match they won. He was also Man of the Match. Meanwhile Ronaldo and Benzema started all of those matches. Ronaldo contributed a goal and assist, Benzema nothing.




Benzema needs to be blasted into the sun.

He is done. Good bye Karim, been nice knowing you.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema scored in La Liga? Hell has frozen over. Even I would have buried that one though.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And we continue to be awful at home


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronaldo is snake bitten af. He is entering Benzema land with all those missed chances.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Ronaldo is snake bitten af. He is entering Benzema land with all those missed chances.




He's snake bitten or on the decline? Like Suarez?


----------



## Evilo

Scandale du Jour said:


> Ronaldo is snake bitten af. He is entering Benzema land with all those missed chances.



He is?
Weird, I thought Benzema had as many goals in less minutes.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He's snake bitten or on the decline? Like Suarez?




Considering how well he plays in Europe, I wouldn't say he is declining.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Considering how well he plays in Europe, I wouldn't say he is declining.




You mean the way he plays against Apeol?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Evilo said:


> He is?
> Weird, I thought Benzema had as many goals in less minutes.




You love Benzema so much that you probably think he didn't try to scam Valbuena.

Benzema has been shit this year.


----------



## Evilo

Scandale du Jour said:


> Considering how well he plays in Europe, I wouldn't say he is declining.



Stats say so, not performances. He scored 4 goals on APOEL in blowout wins, 2 goals at BVB and 2 pens. His performances weren't that great.

That said, I agree he's not declining. Just a bad spell, like the whole Real team.


----------



## Evilo

Scandale du Jour said:


> You love Benzema so much that you probably think he didn't try to scam Valbuena.
> 
> Benzema has been **** this year.



I don't love Benzema. Not even close. Don't think he tried to scam Valbuena however since the justice doesn't seem to think so (and they're better informed than me, but less than you apparently).
And yes, he has been crap this year. Which makes the whole L'Equipe "bring back Benzema" campaign all the more ridiculous.

But mind you Ronaldo has been utter shit as well. You can't seem to realize that, but he has. At least Benzema is working his ass off.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronaldo has been underwhelming particularly in league play, yes. Hell, the whole team is playing like shit.


----------



## Alex Jones

Savi said:


> That's 8 straight W's for Valencia.
> 
> One week from now it's Valencia-Barça at the Mestalla.




Soler is a fun player. I'm pretty happy to see Valencia return, Spain needs another good team. Hopefully they have their books balanced and can keep players this time.


----------



## Savi

Betis last season flashback. Truly amazing reffing.


----------



## Savi

No goal boys, play on!


----------



## Cassano

La Liga refs


----------



## Evilo

Don't they use GLT?


----------



## Savi

Evilo said:


> Don't they use GLT?




Nope. Only one of the big leagues which doesn't use VAR


----------



## Hadoop

Savi said:


> Nope. Only one of the big leagues which doesn't use VAR




Says something doesn't it?


----------



## Savi

I know he's not related to Sergio, but his style is very similar. Nice debut from the kid


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Another miss call but we missed to many chances today that the ref is not even an excuse. Umtiti also went off injured.


----------



## Savi

What a dumb way to drop points at home. Paulinho and Pique especially, both of them couldn't even just put the ball into an empty net. Celta had about 3 good chances and scored on 2 of them.

Next 3 away games are Villarreal (next week), Madrid and Sociedad. Title race could be back on very quickly


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Savi said:


> What a dumb way to drop points at home. Paulinho and Pique especially, both of them couldn't even just put the ball into an empty net. Celta had about 3 good chances and scored on 2 of them.
> 
> Next 3 away games are Villarreal (next week), Madrid and Sociedad. Title race could be back on very quickly




We are screwed if Umiti is out injured for a long time. Like you could of gotten a decent back up for CB but instead wasted all your time on f***ing Couthino.


----------



## Savi

Vermaelen will do fine in most games, he was solid at Valencia last week. But at Madrid.. I'm not sure. Would surprise me if we see Umtiti back in the lineup this month.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Does Ramos think to himself when he gets a yellow that he needs to start playing less aggressive?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Halol madrid


----------



## Evilo

At what point does ZZ get heat for his team's performances?
8 points off Barca.
If they lose the Clasico, they're doomed.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> At what point does ZZ get heat for his team's performances?
> 8 points off Barca.
> If they lose the Clasico, they're doomed.



Umiti being out... and it's messi on attack not confident TBH


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> At what point does ZZ get heat for his team's performances?
> 8 points off Barca.
> If they lose the Clasico, they're doomed.



Umiti being out... and it's messi on attack not confident TBH


----------



## Evilo

2 months for Umtiti.


----------



## Savi

Ugh.


----------



## les Habs

Digne, respect.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Must win for RMCF today. Must win.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Nachooooooo!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

What a pass by Asensio and CR7 gets the 2-0 goal.


----------



## maclean

Real just tearing Sevilla apart


----------



## Power Man

I'm not going to lie, I was worried before the game


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

How good has MAtS been this season? Second best keeper this season in Europe behind De Gea.


----------



## Corto

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> How good has MAtS been this season? Second best keeper this season in Europe behind De Gea.




With Neuer out, if someone wanted to call MAtS the best in the world - I'd have no problem with it.
He's been flat out amazing.


----------



## Theokritos

5-0 over Sevilla. Is this the turnaround for Real Madrid?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Another legit goal for Barca taken away... this is ridiculous.


----------



## BKIslandersFan

Anton Griezmann posted picture of himself in blackface


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Another legit goal for Barca taken away... this is ridiculous.




Yeah that seemed cleary in


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

BKIslandersFan said:


> Anton Griezmann posted picture of himself in blackface




Came here to post about this. Jesus Christ.


----------



## Savi

Messi with a hattrick of posts tonight

edit: and misses a PK now


----------



## StevenF1919

BKIslandersFan said:


> Anton Griezmann posted picture of himself in blackface



Maybe he just wanted to fit in with the rest of the French national team?


----------



## les Habs

6 goals now for Paulinho. He may have cost over the odds and he sucks at buildup play, but on the counters he's an asset. Goals aren't pretty, but the runs and the positions he gets in are. 



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Another legit goal for Barca taken away... this is ridiculous.




It would be incredible if you didn't see this sort of thing season after season.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> 6 goals now for Paulinho. He may have cost over the odds and he sucks at buildup play, but on the counters he's an asset. Goals aren't pretty, but the runs and the positions he gets in are.
> 
> 
> 
> It would be incredible if you didn't see this sort of thing season after season.




I figure bad calls happen all the time... however, these balls crossing the goal line and not counting are absurd. 3 within one calendar year, has that happened ever before? Almost Buffalo Sabres like.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

How are they able to spend that much on a prospect. Like f*** OFF


----------



## Power Man

Lol game at 4:00 am for West Coast viewers


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Lol game at 4:00 am for West Coast viewers



Incredibly stupid... how they expect people to wake up that early?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Sevilla so heartless.... football can be a mean bitch sometimes.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Incredibly stupid... how they expect people to wake up that early?




Luckily for me, I am on the East Coast


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Offside


----------



## John Pedro

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Incredibly stupid... how they expect people to wake up that early?




alarm clock


----------



## Scandale du Jour

CR7 should have scored here.


----------



## John Pedro

Ronaldo pulled a Salah lol.


----------



## Luigi Habs

can someone please pm me a link


----------



## John Pedro

Paulinho gonna score today, Navas made a great save on him already


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema, I still hate you. Bring in Asensio.


----------



## John Pedro

Navas again doing a great save on Paulinho.


----------



## John Pedro

Almost... Benzema.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

John Pedro said:


> Almost... Benzema.




Story of his season...


----------



## Power Man

Ronaldo tucked up twice too


----------



## Scandale du Jour

That was pathetic defending.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Busquets is GOAT


----------



## John Pedro

El pistolero


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Deficient Mode said:


> Busquets is GOAT




At diving, crying and acting like a little bitch, sure.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Scandale du Jour said:


> At diving, crying and acting like a little *****, sure.




Why are you mad though


----------



## John Pedro

Deficient Mode said:


> Busquets is GOAT




Fernando Redondo


----------



## Power Man

Good job Kovacic watching Rakitic.

Sigh


----------



## Bakayoko Ono

Suarez


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Deficient Mode said:


> Why are you mad though




Unless we come back and win, la liga is over.


----------



## Deficient Mode

John Pedro said:


> Fernando Redondo




Another GOAT


----------



## John Pedro

Barcelona doesn't play half as well as their points/lead, would suggest.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ramos getting the card. Ok. He deserves it. But the little bitch Suarez milking it is pathetic.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio and Bale coming in.

I love Bale, but please bring Isco in instead.


----------



## John Pedro

Unbelievable! How Suarez missed it. Incredible pass by Messi.


----------



## Bakayoko Ono

Real Ma ri


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And la liga is over. What a pathetic 15 minutes.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Not coming back from that


----------



## John Pedro

LOL ref robbed Paulinho of a goal


----------



## Scandale du Jour

That is what you get for starting Kovacic and Benzema over Isco and Asensio.

If Zidane won't sit his useless ass perhaps Perez should sell him to Australia or something.


----------



## Bakayoko Ono

Zidane must have given the worst HT speech ever.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Sure let's bring in a defender...


----------



## John Pedro

Should've signed Mbappé


----------



## Halladay

John Pedro said:


> Barcelona doesn't play half as well as their points/lead, would suggest.



Madrid was the same way last season.


----------



## John Pedro

Halladay said:


> Madrid was the same way last season.




Agreed. Madrid was lucky in La Liga last season, scoring a lot of late goals and finding ways to win almost every match.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

John Pedro said:


> Agreed. Madrid was lucky in La Liga last season, scoring a lot of late goals and finding ways to win almost every match.




This year, we are finding ways to lose.


----------



## John Pedro

Madrid is lucky to have Navas. Have made 4 to 6 amazing saves. Embarrassing effort.


----------



## Power Man

f*** this 442.

It just doesn't work, lol Zizou


----------



## Scandale du Jour

John Pedro said:


> Madrid is lucky to have Navas. Have made 4 to 6 amazing saves. Embarrassing effort.




First half was fine. Second ishhh


----------



## Power Man

Lol Ronaldo has been shit


----------



## Deficient Mode

Power Man said:


> **** this 442.
> 
> It just doesn't work, lol Zizou




Tried too hard to slow down Barca rather than just play their own game.


----------



## Luigi Habs

Rakitic is quietly having an amazing season


----------



## John Pedro

Gomes scoring would be too much to handle.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Perez about to go crazy in the January window.


----------



## John Pedro

damn


----------



## Scandale du Jour

I should have stayed in bed.


----------



## John Pedro

Scandale du Jour said:


> Perez about to go crazy in the January window.




He should buy Icardi. Benzema isn't good enough anymore.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Scandale du Jour said:


> Perez about to go crazy in the January window.




Good luck with that


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Deficient Mode said:


> Good luck with that




Oh, he'll try and likely do something really stupid.


----------



## Power Man

Lol the ball went out before that 3rd goal.
Not that it would have changed anything to the outcome


----------



## Halladay

John Pedro said:


> He should buy Icardi. Benzema isn't good enough anymore.



Probably have to wait till the summer for that, cant see inter selling him this season.


----------



## John Pedro

Power Man said:


> Lol the ball went out before that 3rd goal.
> Not that it would have changed anything to the outcome




It's inspiring that La Liga gives job opportunities to blind people, but they gotta realize they aren't a very good fit as referees.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

What a dominant second half. Barca put them into submission with the trademark Possession . I hear ZZ is still trying to make his subs. 

Seriously, that was hilarious to see him struggle like that. To top it off his first sub ended up being for Nacho Libre. What a gutless manager. Suits Madrid well.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> At diving, crying and acting like a little *****, sure.




Stilll bitching about that one dive huh? Ronaldo has done it twice since then as has Marcelo and Pepe. You still cry its hilarious.



John Pedro said:


> Barcelona doesn't play half as well as their points/lead, would suggest.




Yup, its the ZZ effect playing like crap and still win. (not today though)



Scandale du Jour said:


> Ramos getting the card. Ok. He deserves it. But the little ***** Suarez milking it is pathetic.




Yup, again same shit...Never seen you call out a Madrid player doing that though?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

John Pedro said:


> LOL ref robbed Paulinho of a goal




Wait when was this? I'm honestly surprised they counted the Vidal goal... it barely crossed the line how the ref saw that?



Luigi Habs said:


> Rakitic is quietly having an amazing season




He's been hit or miss...some great days some not so. Still miles better than last year.



John Pedro said:


> Gomes scoring would be too much to handle.




He's trash, that effort was pathetic. Should be his last year for barca. He's a total waste.


----------



## John Pedro

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Wait when was this? I'm honestly surprised they counted the Vidal goal... it barely crossed the line how the ref saw that?
> 
> 
> 
> He's been hit or miss...some great days some not so. Still miles better than last year.
> 
> 
> 
> He's trash, that effort was pathetic. Should be his last year for barca. He's a total waste.




Paulinho 'goal' was on the play that resulted in the penalty and red card for Carvajal. Suarez missed 1x1 against Navas, Paulinho then scored on the rebound but the ref then called a handball on Carvajal (he clearly did use his hand to try to save a goal, but the ball crossed the line anyway so it wasn't necessary a save). It was the correct call, though. Barça also would much rather a penalty + red card than just a goal.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

John Pedro said:


> Paulinho 'goal' was on the play that resulted in the penalty and red card for Carvajal. Suarez missed 1x1 against Navas, Paulinho then scored on the rebound but the ref then called a handball on Carvajal (he clearly did use his hand to try to save a goal, but the ball crossed the line anyway so it wasn't necessary a save). It was the correct call, though. Barça also would much rather a penalty + red card than just a goal.




Oh lool that play. I was screaming up and down at Suarez, Messi and the Ref. At some point I thought he sent the barca player off. Good time.


----------



## Savi

Just watched the game and did not expect this result at all.

I think, on paper, and even going back to the Rijkaard days, this might be the least (individually) talented Barça team in a while. Definitely the least spectacular one of the field as well. But you have to give Valverde credit because this might be one of the most solid and defensively responsible teams I can remember. 

It certainly helps Ter Stegen is playing lights out this season, but the general feeling I have is we give up less chances (this game was a perfect example of that) and aren't as wide open at the back as we've been in the past. Vermaelen has come in and played some of his best football in, well, ever (it does have to be noted he was very good at the EC last year - in fact he was Belgium's best defender throughout the tournament, he has a tendency for stepping up when you really need him), Sergi Roberto, I can't say enough good things about him. Remarkable development in the past 2-3 seasons, one of the best today again both on D and going forward. Alba is quietly having a great season as well.

Honestly when I saw the lineup I thought it was going to end 2-1 or something like that, but Madrid didn't impress me that much even in the first half when they were the better team. Outside of the Cristiano chance and Benzema's header, they didn't create that much. Second half they were terrible. A game like this really shows how tactically limited Zidane is. Also, how is it possible that you have 4 central midfielders on the field yet on the first goal Rakitic can make a vertical run through the heart of your team without running into someone? (That play by Busquets that started it though. Oh my) The Nacho for Benzema sub really made me laugh as well. 

All in all this was a typical, business-like Valverde game. Controlling the game as well as you can, don't take too many risks, try getting that first goal and play it smart after that. It's been working all season and the current 25-game unbeaten streak proves that.


----------



## Hadoop

SIGH. Congrats to Barca on basically winning the league before Christmas (with the win today fivethirtyeight.com now gives them a 96% chance of the La Liga title). They've really become more pragmatic this season sans Neymar and the results speak for themselves. Would be a fool not to pick them to go deep in the CL as well.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Busquets has been amazing this season, what a turnaround for him under EV who's put more of an emphasis on midfield play compared to Lucho. Barca is thin upfront, hope they bring in some reinforcements soon


----------



## BKIslandersFan

Hadoop said:


> SIGH. Congrats to Barca on basically winning the league before Christmas (with the win today fivethirtyeight.com now gives them a 96% chance of the La Liga title). They've really become more pragmatic this season sans Neymar and the results speak for themselves. Would be a fool not to pick them to go deep in the CL as well.



Well at least we can still hope for its not the usual one two duo at the top.

ATLETICO!


----------



## les Habs

Not the best Clasico win, but away at the Bernabeu like that I'll take any time. Madrid were clearly better in the first half, but even then we carved out our own chances. Second half though the possession game turned on and was really effective after Carvajal was sent off. In fact that five minute or so spell where Bale and Asensio were just standing there waiting to get on was priceless. Imagine being a poor Madridista and having to just watch Bale standing there about to come on knowing he's going to do nothing. That's almost as bad as having to sit behind the guy waving a "7" flag in the last 20 minutes much less waving one at all. 

Really loved that first goal. Busquets at the back was excellent and I really liked Sergi's one-touch to set up Suarez. It was funny too because Kovacic could have probably broken that play up, but instead he stayed back and just marked Messi. Second goal was unexpected. Lord knows what Carvajal was thinking there. Even if we don't convert the penalty they're still down to ten men. Carvajal must be related to Ramos. Dirty, stupid and overrated.

While he wasn't our best player, Paulinho definitely caused some problems and forced that save from Navas. Despite Messi's ball on that play it was really well taken by Paulinho. He's having the effect that management said he would and while I'm not thrilled with some of their work they deserve credit there. 

Sergi's assist was his sixteenth in the league in the last three seasons, but that's in only 58 starts. Imagine how many he'd have in 114 starts in three seasons. Anyway, it got me thinking of Alba. Saw a stat about him a couple of weeks back where no other back had more assists in any of the top five leagues since 2015 than Jordi. I was surprised but it actually checked out. Pretty crazy considering how little attention he gets and how Lucho essentially benched him for periods.

As for any moaning about Barça players, Madridistas should never comment. No one is worse than either Pepe (when he was at Madrid at least) and Ronaldo. Nobody. Varane even embellished in this one. Then you've got all that Madridista reffing going on per usual.



Savi said:


> I think, on paper, and even going back to the Rijkaard days, this might be the least (individually) talented Barça team in a while. Definitely the least spectacular one of the field as well. But you have to give Valverde credit because this might be one of the most solid and defensively responsible teams I can remember.




Meh. Valverde isn't horrible but he's not great either. He's got a ton of talent at his disposal, one could definitely argue more than Rijkaard. Still he makes stupid decisions when it comes to selection and how he's lined up the team at full strength. He's getting results and the team has improved defensively, but if we had a better manager this team would be notably better.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Semedo doesn't not get enough credit. He's been immense this year if he continues like this it won't be long until he's a top RB.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Holy shit celta vigo


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Dembele back after 3 months and have to say it shows. Argh. Lol


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Semedo doesn't not get enough credit. He's been immense this year if he continues like this it won't be long until he's a top RB.




So what you're saying is Semedo will be sold then, right, since Valverde rotates him at best? Speaking of Valverde, he better not f*** up the Copa this season. Priority signing should be a proper manager.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> So what you're saying is Semedo will be sold then, right, since Valverde rotates him at best? Speaking of Valverde, he better not **** up the Copa this season. Priority signing should be a proper manager.




Barca sit 14 points on top of the league. Are competing on all fronts and looking pretty. Life is good mate.

I have no qualms for Valverde...yet. So, I can't nitpick right now. He can do as he pleases as long as the results remain the same.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Barca sit 14 points on top of the league. Are competing on all fronts and looking pretty. Life is good mate.
> 
> I have no qualms for Valverde...yet. So, I can't nitpick right now. He can do as he pleases as long as the results remain the same.




It's good and it could certainly be worse, but it's not great. Imagine six months from now and Semedo is loaned out or sold.


----------



## John Pedro

Diego Costa scored and got sent off cause he celebrated with the fans in the stands earning a second yellow. Classic


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

John Pedro said:


> Diego Costa scored and got sent off cause he celebrated with the fans in the stands earning a second yellow. Classic




God, I'm gonna miss him so much.


----------



## Hadoop

les Habs said:


> It's good and it could certainly be worse, but it's not great.




Lol at the "Glass is mostly full but it's still a bit empty" sentiment... I mean Barca just added Coutinho to one of if not the best team on the planet but hey, forget the La Liga crown that's already in the bag, it's CL or bust right?


----------



## Hadoop

John Pedro said:


> Diego Costa scored and got sent off cause he celebrated with the fans in the stands earning a second yellow. Classic




I know right? Diego Costa doing Diego Costa things. Love it!


----------



## Savi

That was a fun Seville derby. 8 goals between both teams

Betis have been in some crazy games this season


----------



## les Habs

Samper out for the season with a horrible ankle injury. Not that it looked like he'd ever get the chance he deserves, but surely this is the final nail in the coffin for him ever playing for the club again. 



Wee Baby Seamus said:


> God, I'm gonna miss him so much.




Oh the list of guys you miss so much. Poor guy. 



Hadoop said:


> Lol at the "Glass is mostly full but it's still a bit empty" sentiment... I mean Barca just added Coutinho to one of if not the best team on the planet but hey, forget the La Liga crown that's already in the bag, it's CL or bust right?




I'll try and keep this concise so that's it easy for you to understand since least of which you're an Arsenal supporter:


It's not just about winning. It's also about how the team plays (amongst other things). Things could be worse (see van Gaal's time), but they could also be better (see Pep's time).
As I noted to Duchene, Semedo, who we were discussing, is being rotated when he should be the starting RB. That's not disrespect to Sergi who has again been very good at RB (curious how many of his assists the past four seasons have been RB and what other RBs even match that number) and who is one of my favorite players, but Sergi should be in midfield and Semeedo starting. If Semedo is continually rotated he may want to leave and that would be a horrible move. My concerns are in part based on similar situations in the past (see Thiago). So despite the good work Valverde has done, he's far from perfect and I think a better manager could get more out of the team and do better for the club in the long run.
I didn't want us to buy Coutinho and never have. While I think he'll do well, I don't see him living up to his price tag and I would have invested the money differently.


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

les Habs said:


> Oh the list of guys you miss so much. Poor guy.




Well, Chelsea have sold so many gems over the years it's easy to miss them


----------



## Hadoop

LOL @les Habs response.... so in-depth, detailed and verbose, and yet there's always that undertone of arrogance as if you always feel the need to spend hours defending everything you say and put others down (I do support Arsenal but there's not my favourite team in either the world nor even the EPL, so not sure why the personal attack).

(Fully expecting a reply from you by the way, one thing I know is that you ALWAYS need to have the last word)


----------



## Hadoop

By the way when you have 13144 posts including many well-written essays but only 3 likes received, well hey that pretty much speaks for itself.

Your knowledge and passion for all things related to Barca is first-rate though.


----------



## les Habs

Hadoop said:


> LOL @les Habs response.... so in-depth, detailed and verbose, and yet there's always that undertone of arrogance as if you always feel the need to spend hours defending everything you say and put others down (I do support Arsenal but there's not my favourite team in either the world nor even the EPL, so not sure why the personal attack).
> 
> (Fully expecting a reply from you by the way, one thing I know is that you ALWAYS need to have the last word)




So you've made personal replies to me before, as in the case here, and then you're somehow the "unsure" victim now? OK.



Hadoop said:


> By the way when you have 13144 posts including many well-written essays but only 3 likes received, well hey that pretty much speaks for itself.
> 
> Your knowledge and passion for all things related to Barca is first-rate though.




What was that you were saying about getting personal?


----------



## les Habs

Wee Baby Seamus said:


> Well, Chelsea have sold so many gems over the years it's easy to miss them




I'm sure. I suppose the next time I think about the gems Barça have lost, which will probably be tomorrow, I can just think of Chelsea and feel better. Sadly it doesn't work that way though.


----------



## Evilo

Some people really do care about "likes" on an internet forum?

Man I thought that was for teenagers... Ouch.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Hadoop said:


> By the way when you have 13144 posts including many well-written essays but only 3 likes received, well hey that pretty much speaks for itself.
> 
> Your knowledge and passion for all things related to Barca is first-rate though.




Didn't know one could actually see how many likes people have. LOL

From now on I will only be liking @les Habs posts as well as Savi and Viktors. 



Evilo said:


> Some people really do care about "likes" on an internet forum?
> 
> Man I thought that was for teenagers... Ouch.




Pfft its the only reason I post here.


----------



## John Pedro

lol wtf Rulli tried to do on the Leganes goal


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Hoping for a big game by Ousmane


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Messi feeling it this morning.

Already a beautiful goal and should've had an assist but Suarez is still not Suarez like.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

John Pedro said:


> lol wtf Rulli tried to do on the Leganes goal



Didn't see the goal but this guy is in a fog.... every other week he has a howallor. Between city pulling out of the deal and Sampa calling lesser keepers over him hi confidence is shot. Probably needs a change of scenery.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Roberto <3

What a pass! Finally Suarez cashes in on a chance. Not sure how Levante are still playing with 11 players.


----------



## les Habs

Paulinho scores again.  Not a good match from him and the goals may not be pretty, but looks like he's doing exactly what they brought him in for with all these goals. He took free kicks in China too which he doesn't really get with us. He just needs to be a "super sub" or rotated though. 



Evilo said:


> Some people really do care about "likes" on an internet forum?
> 
> Man I thought that was for teenagers... Ouch.




Apparently so. I had an immediate reply to that bit, but I decided not to waste my time.



Vasilevskiy said:


> Hoping for a big game by Ousmane




As are we all, but I wouldn't expect so much just yet. He's just back from injury and he's hardly played any minutes. The key is he doesn't re-injure himself. I remember Neymar's first season. Was doing really well and then got injured. Then when he returned he wasn't quite as good. Dembele could need some time here and it might not even be until next season before we really see him shine. 



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Messi feeling it this morning.
> 
> Already a beautiful goal and should've had an assist but Suarez is still not Suarez like.




And look who assisted Messi, one of his favorite teammates and the guy Lucho benched, Alba. Just adds to Alba's tally of the most assists from a LB in the top five leagues (yes, more than Marcelo) in the past I can't remember how many seasons. That said the goal was pretty much all Messi. 



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Roberto <3
> 
> What a pass! Finally Suarez cashes in on a chance. Not sure how Levante are still playing with 11 players.




Now imagine Nelsinho (another good match from him) at RB and Sergi in midfield. No need for Saul and the incessant Isco (what has he done this season) whining can finally come to an end. WTF anyone would want those guys when you have the coolest midfielder in the World is beyond me.

Suarez, another player you want to replace, now has 5 goals in his last 4 league matches having scored in all 4 including in el Clasico. Actually it's 6 in his last 5 matches and 8 in his last 7. He probably had a legit goal disallowed against Valencia too. He's just hotting up and one of Messi's pals so another player you're stuck with.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

That was such a Bale kind of goal. Beautiful pass by Kroos.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And a brace for my man Bale. Woooooo!


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Almost.


----------



## gary69

les Habs said:


> Samper out for the season with a horrible ankle injury. Not that it looked like he'd ever get the chance he deserves, but surely this is the final nail in the coffin for him ever playing for the club again.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh the list of guys you miss so much. Poor guy.
> 
> 
> 
> I'll try and keep this concise so that's it easy for you to understand since least of which you're an Arsenal supporter:
> 
> 
> It's not just about winning. It's also about how the team plays (amongst other things). Things could be worse (see van Gaal's time), but they could also be better (see Pep's time).
> As I noted to Duchene, Semedo, who we were discussing, is being rotated when he should be the starting RB. That's not disrespect to Sergi who has again been very good at RB (curious how many of his assists the past four seasons have been RB and what other RBs even match that number) and who is one of my favorite players, but Sergi should be in midfield and Semeedo starting. If Semedo is continually rotated he may want to leave and that would be a horrible move. My concerns are in part based on similar situations in the past (see Thiago). So despite the good work Valverde has done, he's far from perfect and I think a better manager could get more out of the team and do better for the club in the long run.
> I didn't want us to buy Coutinho and never have. While I think he'll do well, I don't see him living up to his price tag and I would have invested the money differently.




What's Rafinha's status, is he soon fit to play again? Are they looking to loan him out or will he get some games at Barca?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Now imagine Nelsinho (another good match from him) at RB and Sergi in midfield. No need for Saul and the incessant Isco (what has he done this season) whining can finally come to an end. WTF anyone would want those guys when you have the coolest midfielder in the World is beyond me.
> 
> Suarez, another player you want to replace, now has 5 goals in his last 4 league matches having scored in all 4 including in el Clasico. Actually it's 6 in his last 5 matches and 8 in his last 7. He probably had a legit goal disallowed against Valencia too. He's just hotting up and one of Messi's pals so another player you're stuck with.




Semedo is the future RB... just is getting eased in. Rightly or wrongly so far its working. 

As for Sergio as a starter in the midfield I'm not 100% sure he has it in him yet. Saul and Isco are class though. If ZZ had half a brain Isco would be his best player right now. 

Suarez should've had 4. He wasn't actually any good today. The game should've been done with 30 minutes into the first half.



gary69 said:


> What's Rafinha's status, is he soon fit to play again? Are they looking to loan him out or will he get some games at Barca?




He should be back soon and is on the chopping block. Celta want him back.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That has to be a red on Navas.ARGH


----------



## Scandale du Jour

So much talent yet so much sucktitude this season. W...T...F 

Yeah Zizou... sub the guy with the brace off...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Varane who's apparently better than Pique let's Gomez with a free header. Anyway greatest team of all time are in trouble... They should fire ZZ who in fact is not an actual manager but I hope they don't. 

Still think they have a shot at anything @Deficient Mode? LOL.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Semedo is the future RB... just is getting eased in. Rightly or wrongly so far its working.
> 
> As for Sergio as a starter in the midfield I'm not 100% sure he has it in him yet. Saul and Isco are class though. If ZZ had half a brain Isco would be his best player right now.
> 
> Suarez should've had 4. He wasn't actually any good today. The game should've been done with 30 minutes into the first half.
> 
> 
> He should be back soon and is on the chopping block. Celta want him back.




And Thiago was the future CM... was just getting eased in. Rightly or wrongly it was working too. Then he left. Point is there is room to win whatever if anything we will win this season while also starting Semedo at RB. 

Sergi has it in him. He's just never been given that run. 

He's been better of late though. No need to sell him off and especially not in favor of a big money move for Griezmann.

@gary69 Basically what Duchene said. I think his fitness in relation to the time left in the window might play a part in his staying or going, but it sounds like he's on the outs. Sad too because I think he could definitely be a squad player and this is exactly the problem with management's approach (board, technical staff and even some of the managers) to the squad. Anyway, could be a real bargain for somebody. I'd be remiss if I didn't mention Grimaldo here, who I've been tempted to bring up in the Transfers thread. Good player we lost for peanuts and who should be in the squad right now who is apparently on the brink of a move to Napoli for about 30 million if Ghoulam goes. 



Scandale du Jour said:


> So much talent yet so much sucktitude this season. W...T...F
> 
> Yeah Zizou... sub the guy with the brace off...




Modric's substitution seems more questionable to me. I didn't see the match, but I'd rather Modric out there to help keep possession when you have the ball.

As for the talent, yes, but not as much as they're given credit for. At least not as much as on this forum. Some of us have made it pretty clear for some time about close things were for them where luck and other things saw them through. 



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Varane who's apparently better than Pique let's Gomez with a free header. Anyway greatest team of all time are in trouble... They should fire ZZ who in fact is not an actual manager but I hope they don't.
> 
> Still think they have a shot at anything @Deficient Mode? LOL.




Coming from someone who's drafted Varane three times (twice on this forum) and who still thinks that the skills the player has make him capable of being a generational CB, let me say that he's got a lot of proving to do and that he's overrated on this forum. Like I said in the hot takes thread, Umtiti has had a better career if you ask me. Varane for me right now is very much a case of ability/skill vs performance and the latter is what is missing to some degree. Fortunately for Varane and Madrid he's still very young and he has a ton of experience at his age. 

I never count them out. Liga is starting to look really tough at this point though. Anyway, could Celta have snatched all three points? Aspas with a post and a penalty miss? At least they show up against Madrid as well. Thanks Unzue!


----------



## Evilo

You can't say Umtiti has had a better career with a straight face. If you feel Umtiti's better, that's a matter of preference. But better career?

One has started most games for Madrid 4 years running (4 years this year), and has 3 CLs (2 as starter) and 3 WC titles to show for it. Also 2 league titles.
He's been also the NT starter for many years.

Umtiti, who's got the exact same age, has started for Barca for two years (2 this year), and has 0 league title, 0 european title and has only been called up for the NT since summer 2016 (because of injuries). He has 4 times less NT caps.


----------



## Luigi Habs

IMO prior to his injury Umtiti was the best french defender of the last 12 months or so.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Luigi Habs said:


> IMO prior to his injury Umtiti was the best french defender of the last 12 months or so.




I would probably agree but 12 months doesn't make a career. Varane has had a better one.


----------



## les Habs

Evilo said:


> You can't say Umtiti has had a better career with a straight face. If you feel Umtiti's better, that's a matter of preference. But better career?
> 
> One has started most games for Madrid 4 years running (4 years this year), and has 3 CLs (2 as starter) and 3 WC titles to show for it. Also 2 league titles.
> He's been also the NT starter for many years.
> 
> Umtiti, who's got the exact same age, has started for Barca for two years (2 this year), and has 0 league title, 0 european title and has only been called up for the NT since summer 2016 (because of injuries). He has 4 times less NT caps.




I think Varane has the better skillset, but Umtiti has had the better career based on performances and consistency. 

Varane hasn't started "most" games for Madrid for four years running unless you have a very liberal definition of the word "most". He's started 78 of a possible 132 league matches the last four years (this season and the previous three). That's more than half, but that isn't "most". As for the titles, the league titles he didn't play a lot in. I'll give you the CLs. Either way I'm not sure how trophies are factoring in here as I was referring to their play and not the achievements of their teams. David May won more than Lord knows how many other defenders that had better careers based on their actual play. Does that make him better? 

Umtiti is exactly the same age, yes, hence the comparison. In the same period he's started 101 matches out of a possible 132. Notable difference there. That's not to mention how many more appearances he had with Lyon before the time period in question. To the point though, IMO he's been more consistent than Varane at this stage in their respective careers. IMO Varane has had higher peaks than Umtiti, but he's also been more inconsistent. 

As for France, Umtiti has of course played less, but Varane hasn't put together a tournament like Umtiti's Euro 16.

As of right now Varane has been inconsistent (not entirely his fault) and hasn't lived up to the billing, and this is coming from someone who has rated him from a very early age.


----------



## les Habs

Yeray Alvarez apparently close to a return to Athletic Club. With his emergence last season, that of Unai Nunez this season and Laporte still there they have a good stable of young CBs. Laporte's contract is up in 2020 so I just wonder if Yeray stays healthy do they sell him (Laporte)?


----------



## Evilo

les Habs said:


> I think Varane has the better skillset, but Umtiti has had the better career based on performances and consistency.
> 
> Varane hasn't started "most" games for Madrid for four years running unless you have a very liberal definition of the word "most". He's started 78 of a possible 132 league matches the last four years (this season and the previous three). That's more than half, but that isn't "most". As for the titles, the league titles he didn't play a lot in. I'll give you the CLs. Either way I'm not sure how trophies are factoring in here as I was referring to their play and not the achievements of their teams. David May won more than Lord knows how many other defenders that had better careers based on their actual play. Does that make him better?
> 
> Umtiti is exactly the same age, yes, hence the comparison. In the same period he's started 101 matches out of a possible 132. Notable difference there. That's not to mention how many more appearances he had with Lyon before the time period in question. To the point though, IMO he's been more consistent than Varane at this stage in their respective careers. IMO Varane has had higher peaks than Umtiti, but he's also been more inconsistent.
> 
> As for France, Umtiti has of course played less, but Varane hasn't put together a tournament like Umtiti's Euro 16.
> 
> As of right now Varane has been inconsistent (not entirely his fault) and hasn't lived up to the billing, and this is coming from someone who has rated him from a very early age.



Yes, you're comparing who you think is better, not who had the better career.
Achievements are totally part of a "better career" measurement.
And yes most means the majority.


----------



## les Habs

Evilo said:


> Yes, you're comparing who you think is better, not who had the better career.
> Achievements are totally part of a "better career" measurement.
> And yes most means the majority.




No, I'm not. I'm comparing who has had the better career based on their play. Andy Cole's "achievements" being on Man Utd dwarf Alan Shearer's, but the latter had a better career based on his actual play.

Yes. 59% of the league matches.


----------



## Evilo

I didn't say you should limit career on achievements. But yes trophies are clearly an important component of better career discussions.


----------



## les Habs

If actually put into the proper context then perhaps to an extent, but in this case it was about their actual performances.


----------



## Evilo

Fine, but when you say better career, people understand it by being their stature, their achievements and their play.
In which case Varane has had clearly the better career.


----------



## les Habs

Evilo said:


> Fine, but when you say better career, people understand it by being their stature, their achievements and their play.
> In which case Varane has had clearly the better career.




Like I said before, David May.


----------



## Evilo

No, that's only achievements again.


----------



## les Habs

All you brought up in your initial post were achievements and the amount of matches he's played.


----------



## Evilo

Yes, and Varane has more stature in his career.

Again, as I said, the only argument is that you feel one has been better. That doesn't make a "better career".


----------



## les Habs

Evilo said:


> Yes, and Varane has more stature in his career.
> 
> Again, as I said, the only argument is that you feel one has been better. That doesn't make a "better career".




Yeah, and that's rather the point about Varane that I've been making for a couple of years now. Ability looks to be there, but what has he done with it? Like I said, not all his fault with the injuries and some of the selection, but he's also been inconsistent. So the stature is questionable. Apply stature to your take on Maradona.

It does make a better career if he's been better during his career than the other player during his respective career. Again, by your initial take, David May.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Couthino is out for 3 weeks with a thigh injury.


----------



## Evilo

les Habs said:


> Yeah, and that's rather the point about Varane that I've been making for a couple of years now. Ability looks to be there, but what has he done with it? Like I said, not all his fault with the injuries and some of the selection, but he's also been inconsistent. So the stature is questionable. Apply stature to your take on Maradona.
> 
> It does make a better career if he's been better during his career than the other player during his respective career. Again, by your initial take, David May.



yeah well, we'll disagree. You said one had a better career, I disagree.


----------



## les Habs

Evilo said:


> yeah well, we'll disagree. You said one had a better career, I disagree.




Either way I think it's really close.


----------



## John Pedro

Marcelino is a God among men


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

Vietto looked like a new man.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

John Pedro said:


> Marcelino is a God among men




Came here to post this... exhibit A as to why Simeone is an overrated manager. He's taken 2 pearls of Argentina and has derailed or completely ruined their potential.

ZERO goals in official matches in all of 2017... take that in and a hat trick in his first start. With Marcelino who again doesn't get enough credit. He's the best manager in La liga. As I said when he and emery were breaking out he is and will always be forevere better.


----------



## Savi

John Pedro said:


> Marcelino is a God among men





Link is down, here's a new one



Pretty sick goal


----------



## Savi

The Messi-Alba connection has been deadly this season

Alba having a great year so far. He really benefitted from Neymar leaving


----------



## les Habs

Yeah, Neymar leaving definitely has played a part. I think he also has a point to prove after Lucho benched him last year. Like I've mentioned a couple of times now, Alba's assist numbers in the league are the best over a few seasons' period out of the top five leagues in Europe.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> The Messi-Alba connection has been deadly this season
> 
> Alba having a great year so far. He really benefitted from Neymar leaving




...and Lucho leaving.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

That pass by messi on Alba's goal.

Like how do you even make that pass?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Early report on Dembele... fast and full of tricks however,decision making could be a concern moving forward.


----------



## les Habs

Take it easy. Besides, can't blame him for looking for a goal.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Not trying to jump to conclusions but Demeble looked like he was in discomfort towards the end of the game.

Valverde saying it's nothing


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Take it easy. Besides, can't blame him for looking for a goal.




As I said it's early but something to watch out for.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> As I said it's early but something to watch out for.




Nah. Sorry, but you're too harsh here. Majority of his decision making was spot on. That ball to Arnaiz was Messiesque. Kid is really special. It's just too bad that he got hurt and has missed so much of the season. He and Nelsinho could torch teams on that right side. 

Suarez definitely heating up as well.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Ronaldo with a bad case of Benzemaitis today.


----------



## Evilo

Scandale du Jour said:


> Ronaldo with a bad case of Benzemaitis today.



Ronaldo and Benzema are responsible for 6 and 5 goals respectively this season. But Ronaldo has played 300 more minutes.

At this point, Ronaldo is even more to blame than Benzema. Not withstanding their respective salaries.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Evilo said:


> Ronaldo and Benzema are responsible for 6 and 5 goals respectively this season. But Ronaldo has played 300 more minutes.
> 
> At this point, Ronaldo is even more to blame than Benzema. Not withstanding their respective salaries.




Both have been atrocious in the last third, indeed.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And Ronnie misses another one.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Bale and Isco were our two most dangerous players today... Zidane subs them off both... WHAT THE f***?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

At this point... sell some aging players, turn over the team to the youngsters. They cannot do worse.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

At this point Real is a staple for me to watch. Week in and out. Love it. Greatest team of all time might be in jeopardy of making the CL if they keep ZZ all season and he continues to play like this.



Scandale du Jour said:


> Bale and Isco were our two most dangerous players today... Zidane subs them off both... WHAT THE ****?




He pretty much made the same mistake as last week lol. Too bad I didn't get to see the finish. Stream crapped out on me at the end.



Scandale du Jour said:


> At this point... sell some aging players, turn over the team to the youngsters. They cannot do worse.




You mean like Bale and CR7?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> At this point Real is a staple for me to watch. Week in and out. Love it. Greatest team of all time might be in jeopardy of making the CL if they keep ZZ all season and he continues to play like this.
> 
> 
> 
> He pretty much made the same mistake as last week lol. Too bad I didn't get to see the finish. Stream crapped out on me at the end.
> 
> 
> 
> You mean like Bale and CR7?




CR7 and Benzema sure. Bale maybe too, I love him though.

Won't happen though.


----------



## Cassano

Kroos has been trash this season.


----------



## les Habs

All Might said:


> Kroos has been trash this season.




Kroos has always been overrated around these parts. Gotta love his post match comments today though. I'm sure that'll go over well with the supporters.


----------



## Cassano

les Habs said:


> *Kroos has always been overrated around these parts*. Gotta love his post match comments today though. I'm sure that'll go over well with the supporters.



Agreed.


----------



## maclean

Just finally watched the highlights for this, Villarreal's keeper was on fire, beautiful to watch


----------



## Savi

1-0 Sociedad. Here we go again 

edit: 2-0


----------



## Evilo

What a goal for the 2-2 !


----------



## Savi

Well; Sociedad scored twice while I was watching

Changed to the channel to the NFL game and then Barça scored twice. I'm staying with Pitt


----------



## Savi

Pretty epic comeback.


----------



## John Pedro

heck, to think that Rulli once was considered a future star. He's been dreadful this season, every game he does a blunder. Karius/Mignolet level.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Evilo said:


> Fine, but when you say better career, people understand it by being their stature, their achievements and their play.
> In which case Varane has had clearly the better career.




Can't believe there's even an argument favouring Umtiti's career at this point in time.
Umtiti has been the better player though for the past 12 months


----------



## Vasilevskiy

les Habs said:


> *Kroos has always been overrated around these parts*. Gotta love his post match comments today though. I'm sure that'll go over well with the supporters.




top-5 mid-fielder. Or that's what I had to read for months on here. Geez.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

John Pedro said:


> heck, to think that Rulli once was considered a future star. He's been dreadful this season, every game he does a blunder. Karius/Mignolet level.




I've never seen a goalie make so many blatant mistakes combined with great saves. As polarizing as it gets.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

John Pedro said:


> heck, to think that Rulli once was considered a future star. He's been dreadful this season, every game he does a blunder. Karius/Mignolet level.



He's had a baad half season but 19 games doesn't make a career. His confidence is shot (thanks to Sampa and City) and might need a change of scenery to wake him up, he'll be fine long term though.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Barca team invincible's?


----------



## les Habs

Big win at the Anoeta. Anyone who still (much less ever did) buy into that "rainy night in Stoke" bullshit should watch this match. Surely la Real can't be that good week in and week out and still be in 15th place. Of course keeping up winless for a decade when we roll into town must a great motivator. If Eusebio can keep them playing at that sort of clip they'll climb the table and he should keep his job. 

Have to say we were fortunate to some extent to get the three points. Jose's goal should have stood if you ask me as the call for a foul on Rakitic was pretty weak. Still I think they would have pulled it out considering that performance. 

Have to give Paulinho credit for yet another goal, and a very important goal it was. Say what you will about the quality of his goals, but he definitely makes the right runs and it's no mistake that he's in the scoring positions he's in. The problem is that he offers pretty much nothing else. So for me it begs the question why Sergi isn't give that role. He isn't the aerial threat that Paulinho is, but surely he can make the runs. Paulinho is a talisman you say? I agree, but then so is Sergi. Anyway, point is that Paulinho pays some more of his fee.

Suarez, who I've been saying is hotting up, was first fiddle for me though. No Suarez and no points, simple as that. You can slate him for his gamesmanship, and he's one of the best in the World at it, but the guy is a fighter and winner. And that second goal... wow. 

That leaves Gomes. Does he have some Trumpian sex tape on Bartomeu? Does he hand wash Valverde's car during training every day? Is he just a really swell guy? What is he doing in the team much less in the starting XI? Look, he's not a donkey and he's a fairly talented player. Still his performances offer little to nothing. Didn't like the transfer from day one and he's not change my mind. Sell him now if the rumors of interest are to be believed. 



Savi said:


> Changed to the channel to the NFL game




I get that sometimes it can be difficult to fall asleep, but wait until after we're done.


----------



## Savi

Dembele out 3-4 weeks again, Iniesta injured again as well *sigh*


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Agreed on A. gomes. I rather play Denis there, and Denis really needs some playing time.


----------



## John Pedro

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He's had a baad half season but 19 games doesn't make a career. His confidence is shot (thanks to Sampa and City) and might need a change of scenery to wake him up, he'll be fine long term though.




Of course, I'm not writing him off, he's still young and has all the tools to be a quality keeper, but his season so far has been abysmal, Sociedad fans want him gone... He needs to cut down these ugly blunders ASAP.


----------



## les Habs

les Habs said:


> He isn't the aerial threat that Paulinho is, but surely he can make the runs.




Re-watching the beautiful Suarez goal yesterday I noticed a player arriving at that far post as the ball went in. It was Sergi. Liking what Valverde has done so far, but he needs to improve on the selection and getting Sergi into the midfield needs to happen.



Savi said:


> Dembele out 3-4 weeks again, Iniesta injured again as well *sigh*




Better now than further down the line, but he really needs to be eased in.



Vasilevskiy said:


> Agreed on A. gomes. I rather play Denis there, and Denis really needs some playing time.




I think Gomes was more of a defensive selection which Denis wouldn't have offered. For me it could have easily been Sergi. 

That's what I'm saying about Valverde though. Guys like Denis and Deulofeu, love them or hate them, they're not getting a lot of real chances. I still think Deulofeu could have shown more if he'd been given the confidence and opportunity of consecutive starts when Dembele got injured at the start of the season. On a related note, Rafinha, who could also play some of these roles, and Deulofeu aren't in the manager's plans and yet the club is digging their heels in on the transfer fees. That's not to even mention the differences in wages between the respective players.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

I don't want to be that guy when his team loses but it's never been more clear that Vidal is not Barca quality. I got a headache with how many plays broke down on that one side.

We need a player that can make that deep pass or always look forward at least. I know we have Iniesta but he is not able to play the same.

Is Coutinho the type to make those passes?


----------



## les Habs

Finally caught up with the Copa match. Ref was garbage. First he doesn't send Aaron off when he could have twice (though the yellow he failed to give that last time was the same as he failed to give Messi earlier in the match). Then after Cillessen get's pelted with something from the crowd just below his eye he gives him an earful. 

Valverde's selection once again leaves a lot to be desired. So Deulofeu isn't in his plans, but Vidal at RW is? And for the umpteenth time, get Sergi in the midfield. Anyway, not the best match from the team. Guys like Denis and Digne need to go. Vermaelen on the other hand has been on fire for a while now. Really liked what I saw from Alena.

Can't wait for the return leg at the Camp Nou. Douchey Apano supporters will realize all their celebrating and object throwing was for naught.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

He left the great development of Celta too soon and has only shown flashes but Mina with a goal already coming off 2 assists last game. Would be nice if he were to develop chemistry with Vietto and not compete for minutes but with Zaza (lol) playing well. It's not realistic right now.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Paco is suicidal. Can't call this boring, that's for sure.


----------



## kov

So is Ronaldo done? I've always had the theory that his dependence on strength and speed would limit his ability to play into his 30's but he'd proved me wrong the last couple seasons. I'm wondering if the clock is finally catching him.


----------



## Deficient Mode

kov said:


> So is Ronaldo done? I've always had the theory that his dependence on strength and speed would limit his ability to play into his 30's but he'd proved me wrong the last couple seasons. I'm wondering if the clock is finally catching him.




Nah. Just going through a cold spell. He'll find his touch again. He has had some totally shocking games lately, but he has had those in previous years, too. The goal totals distracted from it, but now that his finishing touch has abandoned him, people are paying more attention to it. Nowhere close to best player in the world, but he'll start scoring again.


----------



## maclean

Great defending real!


----------



## maclean

Marcelo looking determined to make up for losing his man


----------



## maclean

...aaaand there's the assist at least


----------



## Panteras

wow we got wrecked! I ain't even mad Depor sucks so bad this season. We deserve to be relegated.


----------



## maclean

Statement match for Real


----------



## Savi

Cristiano with the huge 5th and 6th goal. Really won them that game.



les Habs said:


> And for the umpteenth time, get Sergi in the midfield.




Looks like he'll be in midfield tonight


----------



## Savi

4-2 win at Sociedad, 5-0 win at Betis. Pretty good week, considering how hard those teams usually play us and the injuries we still have.

Vermaelen injured himself though, such a shame. Looked like a pulled hammy so he'll miss a few weeks.


----------



## gary69

Another breathtaking display from Messi. Shirt pulled, grapped and tripped all the time, with three guys on him and they still couldn't contain him until the end. In one instance he picked the ball near Barca's penalty area, dribbled past several opponents and made a perfect pass in the end.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Dame looks like I missed a hell of a game.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Deficient Mode said:


> Nah. Just going through a cold spell. He'll find his touch again. He has had some totally shocking games lately, but he has had those in previous years, too. The goal totals distracted from it, but now that his finishing touch has abandoned him, people are paying more attention to it. Nowhere close to best player in the world, but he'll start scoring again.




He's done in terms of being a candidate for best player of the year. He's been declining as a poacher the last couple of years now. He's not going to be this awful everywhere just yet though.


----------



## les Habs

Championship winning performance away at the Villamarin. First half was pretty even and Betis weren't giving away many opportunities. Ref's refusal to card them didn't hurt. Second half though the gulf in class eventually showed. 

Some excellent stuff from Messi of course, with his second looking like something from the training ground, but Suarez also played a big part. Suarez's assist to Rakitic was pretty much perfectly weighted and even his assist to Messi was a nice one-touch volley. His first goal was very well taken as well. El Pistolero now has 100 goals in 114 matches in La Liga. Quite the goal haul for him. Thrilled Sergi got played in midfield as I've been calling for it for a long time and he definitely delivered. Especially if we're going to play this 4-4-2 of Valverde's, then he really needs to start. Once again demonstrating his versatility replacing Gomes on the left when he was taken off. And while he didn't socre, if you see some of the replays he was at the goal ala Paulinho in case of a rebound. That of course meant Nelsinho at RB. Love his pace and seeing come from behind a player in a sprint to win the ball back. Good defensive performance at the back too, but tough luck for Vermaelen. Another strong outing from him before going out injured. Fortunately Umtiti is back. Also very happy to see Deulofeu get minutes. 



gary69 said:


> Another breathtaking display from Messi. Shirt pulled, grapped and tripped all the time, with three guys on him and they still couldn't contain him until the end. In one instance he picked the ball near Barca's penalty area, dribbled past several opponents and made a perfect pass in the end.




Yes, that was excellent as well.


----------



## les Habs

Forgot to mention Fabian (Ruiz). Definitely can see what the fuss is about and with a buyout of only 14 million he'd be an absolute steal. 

Also saw this. Messi away from the pitch goes unnoticed from what I've seen. Here he is with Guardado's boy before the match:


----------



## Savi

Vermaelen will only miss about 3 games so that's good news. Still plenty of time to ease in Iniesta/Umtiti/Coutinho/Mina/Dembele before the tougher part of the schedule comes around at the end of next month with the CL games and Atleti. Next 4 weeks should be the easiest of the season (on paper)


----------



## bluesfan94

Deficient Mode said:


> Nah. Just going through a cold spell. He'll find his touch again. He has had some totally shocking games lately, but he has had those in previous years, too. The goal totals distracted from it, but now that his finishing touch has abandoned him, people are paying more attention to it. Nowhere close to best player in the world, but he'll start scoring again.



He'll still win the Ballon D'Or somehow


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Vermaelen will only miss about 3 games so that's good news. Still plenty of time to ease in Iniesta/Umtiti/Coutinho/Mina/Dembele before the tougher part of the schedule comes around at the end of next month with the CL games and Atleti. Next 4 weeks should be the easiest of the season (on paper)




Good news about Vermaelen. With Mascherano leaving and Mina new to the team we'll need him fit down the stretch. Hopefully the injury doesn't hurt his form though.

Yes, noticed the schedule shouldn't be too tough a week ago. That said they can't let up. Things can change in a hurry and the sooner La Liga can be secured the better assuming we're still in the CL at that stage.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

They still have Espanyol away from home coming up and Eibar away...can't sleep on either of those teams.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> They still have Espanyol away from home coming up and Eibar away...can't sleep on either of those teams.




Eibar is the fixture that worries me most. Espanyol after the Copa defeat and after will having played them in the second leg doesn't worry me as much. Of course despite this not being the Premiership (...) there really aren't a lot of easy fixtures. Betis despite the scoreline made a match of it for 60 minutes. Also, an "easy" stretch means you're just going to get hit with tougher fixtures down the line. The good news there though is the majority of the tougher fixtures will be at home.


----------



## les Habs

To put numbers behind Sergi's performance in midfield: 


92% pass completion rate (49/53), 3rd behind Rakitic and Tello (starters)
4 successful dribbles (4/5), 3rd behind only Messi and Fabian
3 aerial battles won (3/4), most in the match
2 tackles (2/2) and 3 interceptions

Forgot to mention yesterday, Messi with 12 dribbles...


----------



## les Habs

Sevilla bounced Atleti from the Copa with a 5-2 aggregate scorline.


----------



## Hadoop

Best of luck to Javier Mascherano in China. Heart and soul player for Barcelona and a guy who always punched above his weight.


----------



## Savi

les Habs said:


> Sevilla bounced Atleti from the Copa with a 5-2 aggregate scorline.




Surprising.

Valencia escapes Alaves on penalties and are through as well.

Madrid in trouble at home to Leganes. 15 minutes to go and they need a goal or they're out.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

With Barca needing to over turn their tie... might be Marcelino's redemption.


----------



## Live in the Now

Leganes!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Zidane and the greatest tea of all time can't get it done even in the copa. Tick tock lol


----------



## Live in the Now

Football, such a sport. The absolute best. First Leganes goal the strike of a lifetime. Bet he couldn't do that in training. They could have scored more.


----------



## Savi

Wow

Losing at home to Leganes, must be a new low


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Zidane and the greatest tea of all time can't get it done even in the copa. Tick tock lol




Fun to look back on those comments, even last year they were knocked out of the Copa by Celta. 

Hopefully Barça pulls through tomorrow, look forward to seeing Coutinho and Iniesta back.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> Wow
> 
> Losing at home to Leganes, must be a new low



Yup, until they get regulated later this year.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Zidane and the greatest tea of all time can't get it done even in the copa. Tick tock lol




Get arrogant when your team is through...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Fun to look back on those comments, even last year they were knocked out of the Copa by Celta.
> 
> Hopefully Barça pulls through tomorrow, look forward to seeing Coutinho and Iniesta back.



Just imagine pep's Barca going through something similar? Even at their down Years they still were making the final 4 in CL while competing in La liga.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Get arrogant when your team is through...



Couldn't careless I had zero expectations for this Barca and they've already locked up the league prior to the new year... considering the hype around Madrid before the start nah I'll keep laughing my ass off at those experts. Who haven't a clue.


----------



## Evilo

At least Zidane is exposed.

Good.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Couldn't careless I had zero expectations for this Barca and they've already locked up the league prior to the new year... considering the hype around Madrid before the start nah I'll keep laughing my ass off at those experts. Who haven't a clue.




Ok, keep being an arrogant little twerp then, suits you well my friend.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Ok, keep being an arrogant little twerp then, suits you well my friend.




I fail to see how I'm being arrogant? Never said barca will with the Copa or the CL. Hell I've many times earlier in the season that they are lucky to be winning games and even called them paper tigers.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I fail to see how I'm being arrogant? Never said barca will with the Copa or the CL. Hell I've many times earlier in the season that they are lucky to be winning games and even called them paper tigers.




I never understood why some people seem to care more about their rivals failing than their own team winning.


----------



## Live in the Now

Because when teams with billion dollar squads lose to teams with a small budget, it's totally awesome. They had two chances to smash them and everything was in their favor including the opposing club being in Madrid, and they still couldn't.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> I never understood why some people seem to care more about their rivals failing than their own team winning.



You've went from me being arrogant to thinking I care more about Real failing than Barca succeeding. Mind you the 2 are not mutually exclusive and are actually somewhat related. I do care that Real is a laughingstock right now... why well that's easy, they are my favourite team's rival and I HATE Ramos, Ronaldo,Marcelo, Casemiro, ZZ and that white shirt.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> You've went from me being arrogant to thinking I care more about Real failing than Barca succeeding. Mind you the 2 are not mutually exclusive and are actually somewhat related. I do care that Real is a laughingstock right now... why well that's easy, they are my favourite team's rival and I HATE Ramos, Ronaldo,Marcelo, Casemiro, ZZ and that white shirt.




Both are related. Wait until Barca win tomorrow (and I believe they will) before rejoicing about RMCF's demise.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Both are related. Wait until Barca win tomorrow (and I believe they will) before rejoicing about RMCF's demise.



Nope I'll rejoice that greatest team of all time got bounced out by the smallest budget in Liga...if barca do in fact share the same fate I'll hang my hat on the fact they clinched a trophy I (as did most) thought they had no business in winning. Barca are playing with house money... This ZZ Madrid was supposed to bring Real out of Barca's shadow and stake their claim as being the best in Spain. ZZ was supposed to usher in a golden era for Madrid with all that young talent, he was Flo's answer to Pep's barca. Yet, they will probably go trophy less this year and are playing some weak football.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Nope I'll rejoice that greatest team of all time got bounced out by the smallest budget in Liga...if barca do in fact share the same fate I'll hang my hat on the fact they clinched a trophy I (as did most) thought they had no business in winning. Barca are playing with house money... This ZZ Madrid was supposed to bring Real out of Barca's shadow and stake their claim as being the best in Spain. ZZ was supposed to usher in a golden era for Madrid with all that young talent, he was Flo's answer to Pep's barca. Yet, they will probably go trophy less this year and are playing some weak football.




We won 2 CLs in a row + La Liga. Bad years happen.

Is ZZ overrated? Yeah. Is he THAT bad? Nah. We need to start replacing some aging guys. Things will get fixed in due time.

Rejoice if you must, but Madrid will always be Madrid.


----------



## Cassano

They might not even make the Champions League.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> We won 2 CLs in a row + La Liga. Bad years happen.
> 
> Is ZZ overrated? Yeah. Is he THAT bad? Nah. We need to start replacing some aging guys. Things will get fixed in due time.
> 
> Rejoice if you must, but Madrid will always be Madrid.



This isn't a bad year it is a catastrophe...As I said, Madrid were supposed to be going through a golden age. Yet, they're playing like they're Malaga. Down years are expected it happens to the actual best team(Peps) however, they were still competitive. As of now Real is not. That's the difference and that's why we'll see big changes in Madrid in the summer( IMO).

Nope, he's not overrated... that implies he's good to a degree. He's not.


----------



## maclean

I mean, at the end of last season Real looked so gorgeous that one couldn't help but think they were going to cruise this year while Barcelona looked like garbage who might have trouble even fighting for second spot. The fact that the tables are so turned is rather impressive you have to admit.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

All Might said:


> They might not even make the Champions League.




If that happens, ZZ and Perez might be hanged at center pitch.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Vidal starting today.


----------



## Savi

Vidal and Sergi both starting.. hopefully with Vidal at RB and not on the wing 

Coutinho and Mina both in the squad as well


----------



## les Habs

f***ing Valverde. WTF is he doing starting Vidal? Not sure why Nelsinho isn't in the squad, but either way you don't start Vidal.


----------



## les Habs

les Habs said:


> ****ing Valverde. WTF is he doing starting Vidal? Not sure why Nelsinho isn't in the squad, but either way you don't start Vidal.




Wow, that reverse psychology stuff really works.


----------



## Savi

That cross was the best thing he's done in months probably


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> That cross was the best thing he's done in months probably




All I'm gonna say is Sergi would have two assists already, and that's with Duchene not rating him at all.


----------



## Savi

Messi has a subscription to the goalpost this season I swear

Also amazing yellow cards were 4-4 if you watched this game. Horrible refereeing


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Messi has a subscription to the goalpost this season I swear
> 
> Also amazing yellow cards were 4-4 if you watched this game. Horrible refereeing




That's Lahoz for you. 

Coutinho looked good for those interested. Slotted in really well and looked really confident.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> All I'm gonna say is Sergi would have two assists already, and that's with Duchene not rating him at all.




I like Sergi enough I just don't think he's barca quality to start week in and out. While competing for a treble. 

So, it time to gloat lol.


----------



## Cassano




----------



## les Habs

Love the post-match comments from Gerry and Busquets.

Gerry: "Espanyol of Cornella."


----------



## maclean

All Might said:


>





Looks like a great fit, he must be over the moon right now


----------



## Savi

Semi finals of the Copa will be Leganes-Sevilla, and Barça-Valencia

for Valencia it will be a grueling 10 days with Madrid, Barça, Atleti and then again Barça


----------



## YNWA14

Coutinho will definitely be a very good fit at Barcelona, and in Spain in general.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I like Sergi enough I just don't think he's barca quality to start week in and out. While competing for a treble.




In our current formation he most definitely is Barça quality, though I'd argue he is either way. I wouldn't hesitate to give him a starting role at CM. I think it depends in part on what you want out of your CM though and with this loose or perhaps formationless 4-4-2 he's best suited at RM. 



Savi said:


> Semi finals of the Copa will be Leganes-Sevilla, and Barça-Valencia
> 
> for Valencia it will be a grueling 10 days with Madrid, Barça, Atleti and then again Barça




I figured we'd land either Valencia or Sevilla. God forbid we draw Leganes. That said, and certainly not to get ahead of ourselves here, winning the Copa will have been done against quite the run of opposition.


----------



## Power Man

We don't suck when we play 433 and don't cross cross cross.
Who knew


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Wow rulli dropped... can't say I blame them. Wouldn't done it a couple of weeks ago maybe not after he had an alright game to build off.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Wow La real getting torn apart.

Still blame Rulli lol


----------



## Savi

Power Man said:


> We don't suck when we play 433 and don't cross cross cross.
> Who knew




Didn't think u were very good either. Very flattering scoreline

First half you had more PK's than goalscoring chances, while Valencia missed a few wide open ones. Second half Valencia finally scored and a huge save from Keylor prevented them from tying it before Marcelo iced it (that was a very nice goal though)


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

What an insane game 4-1 inside 35 minutes. You knew more goals were coming too.

Samu what a strike too! Take a bow boy. Very underrated, pretty young and never hear anything about him. Deserves more hype.


----------



## Jussi




----------



## Power Man

Savi said:


> Didn't think u were very good either. Very flattering scoreline
> 
> First half you had more PK's than goalscoring chances, while Valencia missed a few wide open ones. Second half Valencia finally scored and a huge save from Keylor prevented them from tying it before Marcelo iced it (that was a very nice goal though)



Yup.
That Keylor save was huge, too bad for Valencia because it was a great offensive sequence


----------



## maclean

Oh man, Barca's gotta watch those breaks


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

f*** they look like shit... Messi way too deep. Not enough width. There's no outlet on the flanks and Alaves knows this, swarming the midfield giving them no room to operate. I'd sub Alba on.


----------



## YNWA14

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> **** they look like ****... Messi way too deep. Not enough width. There's no outlet on the flanks and Alaves knows this, swarming the midfield giving them no room to operate. I'd sub Alba on.



How's Coutinho looking?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Curtinho said:


> How's Coutinho looking?



Not good


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That weak "shot" from Messi might be barca's best chance from open play. LOL.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Paulin'dor how u miss that!


----------



## kov

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not good




He's not playing well and my concern is that he seems to have thrown off the chemistry and link-up of other players. Several times in the first half I saw him drift into his favored central positions but Messi was there and had to turn around and head out to the wing.

Did they really need to start with Iniesta, Rakitic, AND Coutinho? Surely one of them could've sat?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

f*** YA Suarez!


----------



## maclean

Alaves with some amazing luck leading up to the goal


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

kov said:


> He's not playing well and my concern is that he seems to have thrown off the chemistry and link-up of other players. Several times in the first half I saw him drift into his favored central positions but Messi was there and had to turn around and head out to the wing.
> 
> Did they really need to start with Iniesta, Rakitic, AND Coutinho? Surely one of them could've sat?



Seems to me they wanted to rest Biscuits...


----------



## kov

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Seems to me they wanted to rest Biscuits...




Yeah, I can certainly see the rationale; they have looked out of sorts though, does that mean his absence is the problem or Coutinho's presence?


----------



## maclean

And Messi does it!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

kov said:


> Yeah, I can certainly see the rationale; they have looked out of sorts though, does that mean his absence is the problem or Coutinho's presence?



I wouldn't read too much into an off game. Alves have played well and its his first start.

Messi that should do it. Has to be said Alaves deserve better and Paco was offside leading up to the foul.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Side note, Messi and Suarez scoring that's the first time a duo scored in 5 consecutive games.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That's a penalty on Umititi. No luck in this half for Alaves.


----------



## les Habs

Definitely an off performance today and for me the responsibility lies with Valverde and once again it's about his selection. I get resting Busquets and bringing in guys like Digne and Nelsinho, but one of Iniesta, Rakitic or Paulinho needed to sit. My money would have been on Paulinho, but the balance is a bit tricky then. Still you then have an open spot for Sergi (the obvious choice), Vidal considering his outing last match or Paco. So you line up with a midfield of:

Coutinho - Rakitic - Iniesta - Sergi/Vidal/Paco

That gets Coutinho on the left and someone on the right who can get forward more. That said you could argue the midfield was fine but a guy like Nelsinho, who has only started 9 of 21 league matches thanks in large part to Valverde's selection, struggled to get forward at times because he still isn't compatible with the team do to a lack of playing time. This is why I keep hounding on Valverde's selections. Too many rotations, sometimes not the right rotations and often times not the right selections. And you could immediately see the impact Sergi was making when he came on. The one thing I will give Valverde credit for is seeing that Nelsinho and especially Digne weren't effective and making the chance early. 

Both lucky and unlucky on the day. Play leading up the free kick where Messi tied it was offside. That said Wakaso should have been sent off before halftime, and while that's not guarantee of 3 points I would think that Alaves down to ten men for more than a half is probably in trouble. Umtiti's handball? Meh, I wouldn't call that an "unnatural" position and it was point blank. 



kov said:


> He's not playing well and my concern is that he seems to have thrown off the chemistry and link-up of other players. Several times in the first half I saw him drift into his favored central positions but Messi was there and had to turn around and head out to the wing.
> 
> Did they really need to start with Iniesta, Rakitic, AND Coutinho? Surely one of them could've sat?




Like I said above, the balance is a bit tricky but Paulinho could have sat as well. With Busquets out Rakitic was going to always start. I mean he could have started Samper but... oh yeah, he sent him out on loan leaving us with only one DM. 

Coutinho drifted to the middle at times, but I didn't see a big effect on Messi. Either way he should be out on the left if you ask me and if his being on the right is a problem due to Messi being more on the right then that's on Valverde. The guy put Dembele out right too. Anyway, if we're going to play this 4-4-2 then Coutinho if he's playing wide should be on the left. The way he plays should still leave plenty of room for an overlapping Alba. 



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> That's a penalty on Umititi. No luck in this half for Alaves.




Like I said, not really, and Wakaso should have been sent off in the first half.


----------



## Savi

Wakaso  he got a yellow about halfway through the first half, then for the rest of the game just kept on kicking everything and everyone around him. Second half alone had about 6 or 7 fouls and AT LEAST half at them were clearly bookable so for him to actually finish the game is quite miraculous

That said the ref was garbage again and it went both ways as we were on the right side of some decisions as well, also Suarez should have been off for kicking Duarte in the nuts. He'll never learn

Coutinho wasn't very good but give him some time, as LH said the formation and lineup didn't really help him with too many CM's already included, also in the long run he will have to replace Iniesta and having both of them on the pitch at the same is a bit counterproductive.


----------



## Savi

Again with Vidal on the right wing come on man


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Just tuned in... not sure what Mina was thinking but great tackle by Cliessen.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Umtiti is so good.


----------



## Savi

Valencia almost seemed scared to leave their own half, I've rarely seen a Marcelino coached team play like that. A sleepwalking win for Barça who basically played in first gear all night.

Vidal sucked again and you can see players starting to hesitate passing to him - especially Messi


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

Maybe Martínez was the issue with La Real all along.




DatsyukOwns said:


> Umtiti is so good.




One of my few good picks in the fantasy draft.


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

Delete


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Rulli clean sheet after being dropped... didn't see the game but hopefully he can build off this and gain some momentum. Still has an outside shot at 2018


----------



## les Habs

Big win for La Real. They're better than their position in the table would suggest. Of course so few points separating the teams the middle parts of the table. 



DatsyukOwns said:


> Umtiti is so good.




That performance was a masterclass. Hopefully they get that renewal taken care of soon and slap a 500 million buyout clause on it, not that I'm worried about him leaving. 



Savi said:


> Valencia almost seemed scared to leave their own half, I've rarely seen a Marcelino coached team play like that. A sleepwalking win for Barça who basically played in first gear all night.
> 
> Vidal sucked again and you can see players starting to hesitate passing to him - especially Messi




Valencia didn't offer a lot on the counter. I thought we had some good performances though. Messi was of course very good. That assist to Suarez was excellent. Credit to Suarez though as he had to react to the keeper getting a touch on Messi's ball. That was Suarez's 16th goal in 16 matches and he's now having a nice impact on the season. Coutinho was good when he came on and when Iniesta went off. Very clear to see, again, that he should be playing LM. When he's played there he's slotted in very well and looks like he was signed in the Summer window and not the Winter window. Also have to give Cillessen a mention as he had a good performance. 

I think the hesitation to pass to him on some occasions had to do with the positions he was in or the lack or runs from him. Either way he shouldn't have started and apart from being a backup RB (backup to Nelsinho since Sergi should be in midfield) you could say he shouldn't even be in the team. Of course no one (Sevilla) would meet the asking price and so here he is. Sergi or Alcacer should have started in that spot. And this is why I would have preferred Deulofeu were around as he would have been an option. Vidal when he's up top with Suarez doesn't make any runs. And I'll keep saying it, as good as Valverde has been he still makes selection mistakes.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

What a gorgeous save by oier on Ramos. Nice mid table battle. Race for 4th place is heating up


----------



## Power Man

Ramos and Varane have been very sloppy today


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Nice mid table battle.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Real's defence has been sloppy all season. Fullbacks aren't anywhere near as good as last season as well.


----------



## les Habs

Wow. Didn't expect that result. I saw Madrid were up 0-1 at one point and then checked back hours later. A Valencia win would be nice tomorrow. 



TheLeastOfTheBunch said:


> Real's defence has been sloppy all season. Fullbacks aren't anywhere near as good as last season as well.




The comments that were made about them last season...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Pique to the rescue... Shhh.

Game is being played in a pool. Haven't seen the before.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That tackle was all based on Pique's comments from a a week or so back. Pure vengeance from Moreno. Should've been sent off and his reaction to it was embarrassing.


----------



## Savi

I'll be happy to get out of here without any injuries. Some of those tackles have been ridiculous. Espanyol over-agressive as usual.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Team invincibles intact. 

Nice dive by Garcia at the end. Umititi getting heated at the end of the game for it. Pique playing peacekeeper. LOL


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Apprentaly Umiti had racial slurs thrown at him at the end of the game by one of the esponyal players and that's why he was so heated. Pique had to stop him.

Can't even describe how disgusting it was to read that. 

I really hope La Liga gets involved if they can. It has to stop.


----------



## Panteras

DatsyukOwns said:


> Apprentaly Umiti had racial slurs thrown at him at the end of the game by one of the esponyal players and that's why he was so heated. Pique had to stop him.
> 
> Can't even describe how disgusting it was to read that.
> 
> I really hope La Liga gets involved if they can. It has to stop.




it's like saying murders , wars, thieves have to stop.... Capture the perpetrators , punish them, punish the club and the fans in some way or another as a deterrent. Other than that what can you do? 

on another note, Deportivo fired the manager no surprise there. Awaiting the 11th manager to come in since 2005.


----------



## Live in the Now

Little behind catching this on my DVR, but wow. Great goal by Correa.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Poor greizzman... he needs to go asap. As well as Simeone. 

As for Umititi if it's true then Garcia should be suspended. For the remainder of the year, his coach telling Umititi to leave is embarrassing maybe look at your own players. Garbage stuff.


----------



## les Habs

Considering the conditions and that we didn't start Messi or Alba I'll take the point. Consider the shit that went down in Cornella I'm thrilled with the point. Gerry stepping up and sticking it to them again. Gerry talked the talk and today he walked the walk. Apano probably think they won the league or something, but in the end they gave up the points in disgraceful fashion. Moreno is a piece of trash and considering his intention should have been sent off. It's not going to be called that way, but still. Sergio Garcia is another piece of trash and his challenge on Umtiti, which he tried to wave off as nothing, was dangerous. He also apparently racially abused Umtiti, but I won't repeat what was apparently said. Victor Sanchez is another piece of garbage. Granero and Sanchez Flores are both full of shit. Have to give kudos to Alba for stepping in in defense of Gerry and for Umtiti for backing up Alba. Sadly we won't get them again this season, but hopefully the only time we see them next season is when they face the B team.



DatsyukOwns said:


> Apprentaly Umiti had racial slurs thrown at him at the end of the game by one of the esponyal players and that's why he was so heated. Pique had to stop him.
> 
> Can't even describe how disgusting it was to read that.
> 
> I really hope La Liga gets involved if they can. It has to stop.




I'm reading that it was in the tunnel after the match. There were verbal exchanges between players and staff. I think the exchange on the pitch might have been more about Sergio Garcia embellishing (essentially he dove), but Umtiti looked heated enough so who knows. Either way it was another disgraceful showing from them, but it's to be expected.


----------



## les Habs




----------



## Power Man

Seems like it was a heated game, I need to watch some highlights lol.

The Espanyol player apologized, but it doesn't excuse his disgusting action.

Good on Piqué for stepping up


----------



## DoyleG

La Liga is apparently launching an investigation......

....into Pique's goal celebration.


----------



## Power Man

Lol wut


----------



## les Habs

Umtiti suspended for the match against Getafe as a result of an accumulation of yellow cards. On top of that Pique might be slightly injured (see below). Mina should definitely be starting that match. 



DoyleG said:


> La Liga is apparently launching an investigation......
> 
> ....into Pique's goal celebration.




I read that earlier. So instead of investigating the racism let's look at the goal celebration. Thebas also apparently said that the crowd hadn't abused Pique before the goal celebration, yet someone posted video and you could hear it while the players were in the tunnel. Oh, and Pique is apparently injured. Can't think of another player where it happened either other than that deliberate challenge by Moreno. Where's that investigation?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Lunacy. 

Pique might miss the champions league match vs Chelsea. f*** Espanyol for trying to ruin team invincibles. 

Moreno should really be suspended.


----------



## maclean

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Game is being played in a pool. Haven't seen the before.




I know, eh? I was saying this to my kids while we were watching, seen lots of games played in the rain, but never a swamp of that level. Felt like a video game the way ever single movement let out an explosion of water and the ball would roll at most a foot before stopping dead. When the players were trying to do any fancy footwork on the ball it looked like they were in glue.


----------



## Savi

Except Iniesta. He looked like he was playing futsal


----------



## les Habs

Actually I thought Messi looked as if he was walking on the water with some of the plays he had.


----------



## Extra Texture

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Lunacy.
> 
> Pique might miss the champions league match vs Chelsea. **** Espanyol for trying to ruin team invincibles.
> 
> Moreno should really be suspended.




Suspension in Europe for an incident in the domestic league?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Extra Texture said:


> Suspension in Europe for an incident in the domestic league?



He might miss the Chelsea math because he suffered an injury from Moreno's tackle.


----------



## Extra Texture

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He might miss the Chelsea math because he suffered an injury from Moreno's tackle.




Ahh, thanks for clearing that up.


----------



## Power Man

maclean said:


> I know, eh? I was saying this to my kids while we were watching, seen lots of games played in the rain, but never a swamp of that level. Felt like a video game the way ever single movement let out an explosion of water and the ball would roll at most a foot before stopping dead. When the players were trying to do any fancy footwork on the ball it looked like they were in glue.



Look up Algeria vs Bosnia friendly.

It was much much worse


----------



## Panteras

So our new manager Clarence Seedorf ok whatever just avoid relegation please!


----------



## les Habs

No wonder Espanyol's players keep saying "it should stay on the field."


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Sevilla on to the final

So, much for the Pique "injury" he's in the squad for tomorrow.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Sevilla on to the final
> 
> So, much for the Pique "injury" he's in the squad for tomorrow.




Playing Pique is still risky as he does have a knock. Potential ligament damage actually.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Welp for better or worse Pique starts

Parejo grabs Messi by 2 hands and no foul(advantage played I think) but no card at the end of the play. Amazing.

It really sucks that Garay has a self imposed exile from the NT. Considering Argentina is crying for a responsible CB.

WOw LIO feeling it.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Gomes is beyond awful... just look at Valvaerde's reaction to that "cross". I'm shocked I thought once he was a good young player at Valencia.


----------



## Savi

That was filthy


----------



## Savi

This ref is amazing. They're literally pulling Messi's shirt off his back and he still doesn't call a foul


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Game is chippy and had some hard tackles. DOesn't feel like things will get out of hand though. Barca need to start creating more though, they haven't done much with messi. Playing a man down its no surprise. 

They'll need a goal because you know Valencia have a goal in them.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Coutinho does more than Gomes has ever done in about 3 minutes. LOL.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Suarez to Coutinho... Sorry Liverpool fans.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Simeone did a number on Vietto... guy looks lost.


----------



## les Habs

I don't have time to watch the match tonight since I need some sleep. Very much looking forward to it though and I'm thrilled the team is through to the Final. A few things:


Valencia supporters vandalized Barça's team bus and even broke some windows. They also were apparently insulting the club, Pique, Catalunya and racially abused Umtiti. 
Barça have set a record now as they'll appear in their fifth straight Copa Final. This trophy has been very important historically for the club.
Very happy to see Mina got his debut. Sounds as though he looked good out there as well. Also made some nice comments post match. Said that while everyone helps him he talks a lot with Paulinho, "Sam" and Pique.


----------



## Savi

Mina only played about 10 mins so hard to judge.

I thought our second half was really good btw


----------



## Scandale du Jour

I miss 5 mins and I miss a goal. Hopefully we won't choke for once.


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

That goal was bad by Rulli.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Wow, what a play by Asensio and Marcelo. CR7 with the easy finish.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

And it is officially a trashing. About time we have a good performance.


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

La Real, please.


----------



## Power Man

CL Ronaldo mode activated


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Look who still cannot score. Hello Karim!


----------



## les Habs

Finally caught up to the Copa match. Not thrilled with the lack of chances we've created the last two matches. That said were Messi not so dependent on his left foot he'd probably have scored. Coutinho's finish looked fortuitous, but good to see him get his first goal. Suarez again making an impact. He's been in excellent form for a while now and hopefully it carries on through the rest of the season. Anyway, per usual Valverde's selection leaves a lot to be desired. Once again Gomes gets the nod and doesn't impress. In fact it was flashing neon saying "sell him". Sergi should have started there and Nelsinho at RB. Finally have to give Cillessen a plug. Guy knows his place in the team and yet comes out and puts it all out there when he's playing. Excellent point blank save from him. It's funny too because after the player's come off the line where they shake hands he spun around and was really intense. 



As for Valencia, they were able to field a stronger side and were much better. Still at times they didn't seem as urgent as you'd expect. Curious to see how they fare after this season. They can afford to lose Guedes to a degree, but losing Kondogbia will be huge. I would think a bigger club will come in for him. Gaya isn't bad, but he's definitely overrated. Gabriel isn't that great either. I think they'll hold on to that last CL spot, but they'd better as they'll have to reinforce the side.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> So, much for the Pique "injury" he's in the squad for tomorrow.




His knee was wrapped and he looked in pain on the bench when Valverde finally subbed him off. He missed training after the match, but it also looks like Valverde is going to play him tomorrow. 



Savi said:


> This ref is amazing. They're literally pulling Messi's shirt off his back and he still doesn't call a foul




That Parejo one where he didn't get carded... Only Barça and only in La Liga.



Savi said:


> Mina only played about 10 mins so hard to judge.




He looked comfortable out there. Had a nice clearance on a corner. Looking forward to seeing him start vs Getafe.


----------



## Savi

Looks like Digne and Mina will play together in central defence today. Not too confident about that.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Digne playing with Mina in the middle. Should be interesting. Wish Val would start Semedo. 

Wonder if Demeble will come on for one of Messi or Suarez.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Not the greatest run of form for Barca. They have Eibar away and Chelsea coming up. Better wake up fast.


----------



## Savi

God that was dreadful


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Not the greatest run of form for Barca. They have Eibar away and Chelsea coming up. Better wake up fast.



Eh I think Barca should beat Chelsea, don't worry


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Mina continues his stellar form.


----------



## les Habs

Haven't seen the match, but all I'll say is Valverde f***s up selection yet again. Every match he gets something wrong.


----------



## Savi

Power Man said:


> Eh I think Barca should beat Chelsea, don't worry




I don't know man. Last 3 Liga games have been utter shit


----------



## YNWA14

I know it's still somewhat early but how has Coutinho been in general? I haven't watched any of the Barcelona games yet just curious to hear how he's fitting in.


----------



## Live in the Now

Curtinho said:


> I know it's still somewhat early but how has Coutinho been in general? I haven't watched any of the Barcelona games yet just curious to hear how he's fitting in.




Didn't watch this one, but good. Played out of position on the right side in the other games so not as good as he can be.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Savi said:


> I don't know man. Last 3 Liga games have been utter ****




They look tired and uninspired. Athletico are now only 7 points as well. Hopefully the long week break helps.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

I think COuts has actually been dreadful. I haven't seen every game but so far meh. Still early but much like DEmbele if he ever will justify that fee needs to improve immensely.


----------



## les Habs

Definitely not a good showing and a fixture where all three points should be secured. As I thought, Valverde's selection once again made a big difference and really hurt us. What an obvious fixture for Nelsinho to start in and once again he plays Sergi at RB. Don't get me wrong, Sergi as a RB isn't the problem. The problem is it keeps Sergi from playing in the midfield where he belongs. Nelsinho should have started at RB and Sergi at RM (or even CM) where instead Valverde decided to start... Alcacer. Alcacer might as well not have been on the pitch. Often times he was way behind Sergi. I was able to get the Sky broadcast and Gerry Armstrong even questioned what Alcacer was doing out there. Sergi in midfield would have added creativity and been an option getting into the box. 

Of course the ref didn't help. Bruno could have been sent off once or twice and we could have had a penalty. That said they had a possibly one-on-one that was ruled offside that may not have been. Either way the ref let way too many calls go and it just played into Getafe's approach. 

Some mixed performances out there. Alcacer was awful. I thought Sergi played well though and really drove forward. Messi looked a bit tired. Coutinho looked a bit lost. I'll leave it with Mina. Pretty good debut from him. Not perfect, but he looked comfortable out there. Some early giveaways with some balls that tried to force, but generally looked a lot like Pique in how he had to distribute the ball from the back. Definitely a force on set pieces. At the end of the day he looked comfortable and easily worth what we paid for him.

As for Valverde, I'm going to keep sounding off about his selection. He plays Vidal on the right side. He plays Alcacer on the right side. Yet he offloaded both Deulofeu and Rafinha. 



Savi said:


> I don't know man. Last 3 Liga games have been utter ****




I think the team is tired, Valverde f***s up the selection and there's been a lack of creativity. I don't care how many goals we score so much as we're consistently creating quality chances and that hasn't been happening enough.



Curtinho said:


> I know it's still somewhat early but how has Coutinho been in general? I haven't watched any of the Barcelona games yet just curious to hear how he's fitting in.




I would say it's been a mixed bag. One performance he looks good, the next not so much. As @Live in the Now said when he's out right he doesn't look as good. Today he was somewhat of a CM, but didn't look like he had his positioning down. Either way he didn't see much of the ball at all. What he has shown in at least three matches now is a signature shot coming in from the left side to the far post. Every time he's done it he's forced a good save from the respective GK. At the end of the day I think the key will be making all the pieces fit. My concern is it looks like we have a piece too many and I'm not confident Valverde will get the selection right then if he can't when some are injured.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I think COuts has actually been dreadful. I haven't seen every game but so far meh. Still early but much like DEmbele if he ever will justify that fee needs to improve immensely.




FFS. Dembele is 20, has been injured multiple times now, is played probably where he shouldn't be and has started all of three matches all season. He's clearly demonstrated his quality all of that considered and with the market being what it is he's clearly demonstrated that the fee looks correct.


----------



## Evilo

Dembele judged on parts of 3 games.

That's even worse than Arsenal fans


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Eh I think Barca should beat Chelsea, don't worry




Beat? Destroy is more like it. Chelsea has struggled recently. Barca has too, but they are much better. English teams outside of Man City are overrated AF.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> FFS. Dembele is 20, has been injured multiple times now, is played probably where he shouldn't be and has started all of three matches all season. He's clearly demonstrated his quality all of that considered and with the market being what it is he's clearly demonstrated that the fee looks correct.




Nothing you said is wrong... I'm just saying.



Evilo said:


> Dembele judged on parts of 3 games.
> 
> That's even worse than Arsenal fans




Judged implies I'm making some conclusions about him/his play. I haven;t done either so no judgment has been made on DEmbele.


----------



## Evilo

Look at your own post history. You have.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> Look at your own post history. You have.




The burden of proof is on you my friend.


----------



## Evilo

Short memory AND lazy 


> fast and full of tricks however,decision making could be a concern moving forward.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Evilo said:


> Short memory AND lazy



Lol that's not making a judgement. Hence COULD BE. Neither actually.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Nothing you said is wrong... I'm just saying.




To each their own, but he's clearly demonstrated his quality. He did against Getafe. Of course he has a long way to go before he justifies the fee, but it looks like he's definitely capable. Assuming he's not this oft injured, Valverde's use of him is my biggest concern.


----------



## Deficient Mode

I think Dembele's struggles - such as they are - have more to do with the immense pressure of the situation rather than his ability purely to make the right decisions with the ball.


----------



## les Habs

Umtiti is apparently only looking for 6 million a year net. My answer to that would be to offer him 7 million. Samu in training this week:





Deficient Mode said:


> I think Dembele's struggles - such as they are - have more to do with the immense pressure of the situation rather than his ability purely to make the right decisions with the ball.




I would never rule that out, but I think it's not so much that. I think it's in part the way he's being fielded and simply a lack of playing time. Like I said above, the guy has started 3 matches and played in total in only 8 matches. That's nothing when he's only started 3 matches. There should really be almost no reaction to his play at this stage. I personally like a lot of what I've seen. Even against Getafe he put in a really nice cross that I still don't know how he was able to get past the defender. He also put in a nice through ball. If Dembele couldn't pass the ball as he can I wouldn't be so optimistic about him. Anyway, while I don't think it's so much about the pressure the club is circling the wagons and apparently keeping him out of the media eye.


Read today that the club is hiring a cook for Dembele to improve his diet and help reduce the risk of injuries. This did this for Messi back in the day and it work wonders.


----------



## les Habs

Copa Final date is bullshit BTW. Only in Spain.


----------



## Savi

Has there been a game this season in which Messi didn't hit a post? Unreal.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Man Valencia sucking today... only thing worse is the ref.


----------



## Cassano

Is Maxi Gomez any good or is he just like a tap-in merchant?


----------



## Live in the Now

He's like Falcao. Huge finisher who is a little better in the air. He isn't going to go around dribbling past players. Defensive work optional for now.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Nice to see espanyol being as dirty with Villarreal as they are with Barca. 

Two very impressive players at Villarreal,Rodrigo who scored his first senior goal and this fella fornals.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio!!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Dammit. The last 20 have been all Betis.


----------



## Power Man

Algerian goal, so I'm not totally mad


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Algerian goal, so I'm not totally mad




You should be, we are playing like garbage.


----------



## Power Man

Nacho smh


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Captain Clutch <3


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Asensio!!!!!


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Theo 10 yards behind his man


----------



## Power Man

Game over


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

If Betis' defence was Sunday league level they'd be fighting for Europe right now. Amazing going forward piss poor at defending.


----------



## Evilo

Saw highlights of Boudebouz humiliating Real players time and time again, especially Casemiro.
Guy's talent is crazy. He really made bad choices in his career moves.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Tuned in as soon as Leganes potted that in. What timing lol.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Madrid get a 50/50 call in the box while Leganes don't. Should've been a draw. Dame.


----------



## Power Man

Evilo said:


> Saw highlights of Boudebouz humiliating Real players time and time again, especially Casemiro.
> Guy's talent is crazy. He really made bad choices in his career moves.



Yeah seeing him play like that makes me really mad, talkabout wasting your career. 

I don't think he even has a real agent.

He has matured but he really used to have a peanut sized brain


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

*Prison without bail for Villarreal defender Ruben Semedo!*


woah


----------



## les Habs

Dani Ceballos vs Leganes:


----------



## Power Man

That was quick


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Benzema cannot score, but he is making himself useful by being a good passer. 2 assists today.


----------



## Power Man

Benz was great
And on that missed opportunity he slipped, not his fault tbh

Good on Ronaldo reminding the fans who assisted him by pointing at Benzema, and letting him take the PK
(Also Ronaldo could had have his 50th hat trick today)


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Demeble, Couthino and Semedo to all start today.


----------



## Luigi Habs

DatsyukOwns said:


> Demeble, Couthino and Semedo to all start today.




Dembele looking like crap so far


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Messi's grandpa died earlier today... surprised he's playing. Only a goal and an assist while playing sublime.

Please give him a rest at 3-1


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

My God messi like falling in love all over again.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Messi stop they have families.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

DEmbele has to play that ball across. He had Suarez and Messi wide open.


----------



## Savi

Dembele had a good second half.

Coutinho was very good, on his goal you could see that shot coming and I though to myself "well that's ambitious" but then it went in anyway


----------



## Live in the Now

Yeah, that's the typical Coutinho goal. He will score many of those. I don't know who or why or how he developed his shooting but he used to not even be able to get the ball off the ground.

Clear to see how he fits in that team as well. Deal appears to have worked out for everyone.


----------



## Il Mediano

Messi is absurd.

That is all.


----------



## John Pedro

Dat 442 with Coutinho and Dembele playing wide has some nice potential. Question is, can they use it against good teams? it can be very problematic defensively.


----------



## Savi

Semedo out for 5 weeks.


----------



## YNWA14

John Pedro said:


> Dat 442 with Coutinho and Dembele playing wide has some nice potential. Question is, can they use it against good teams? it can be very problematic defensively.



I think this is part of the problem Liverpool ran into against other top teams earlier in the season with Coutinho in midfield. He can be hard working and combative at times but doesn't have the engine to keep it up and definitely prefers to go forward. Not sure about Dembele though.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Muriel bringing his fantastic finishing ability from the manu game here early nice

Mina with another brace... his second was extremely lucky given that it came off a howler from La real's keeper. Where have I seen this before. Luckily it wasn't Rulli who was injured for todays match. Still Mina has been breaking bad this season. Great run of form, his move was to Valencia was too early but he's turning it around. 

Oyarzabal scored a beauty too. 2 of the best players in La liga. I still say this guy changed his name from his first year but no way to confirm it lol.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Atleti up 4-0.

2 absolute gifts and a pk. If I'm Sevilla's manager I'd be livid.


----------



## les Habs

Very good performance against Girona, but I still don't think they were that close to high gear. Still you could see the potential if Valverde actually got the lineup right and they could have had 8 or 9 goals in this one. Messi was Messi which makes it easy to take him for granted. His goals were fantastic and he almost had a hat trick. His assist makes him the all-time assist leader in La Liga and he's got a long way to go yet. So most goals in La Liga history, most assists in La LIga history and also only player to score against 36 different first division sides in La Liga history. Suarez was excellent as well. Took his first really well and almost had another assist on Messi's effort that was cleared off the line. Suarez is now 6th on Barça's all-time scoring list. I could see him getting up to 4th before he leaves the club. Rakitic quietly put in a good performance. Some excellent long balls and through balls. Coutinho's goal was excellent and it's been coming. He's put shots like that in pretty much every match he's played in and they all required excellent saves. He had a good match and looks comfortable out there when he's on the left as I've been saying, but he didn't see a lot of the ball. As for Dembele, it's unfortunate people can't actually put his performances into context. He's clearly still adapting and he also looks as though he's a bit scared after the injuries. He'll need more time and especially more regular minutes. Still you can see the talent and his assist to Suarez is something we should be seeing more of. Great to see Nelsinho out there and you can see he should be starting RB, but of course now he's injured. I wonder if he actually gets the minutes he deserves if he gets hurt like that. f***ing Valverde. Then Valverde has Pique out there suffering and takes forever to get Vermaelen on. Pique said something to Valverde on the way to the bench too and I'd be curious what he said. 

Away to Las Palmas isn't the best timing considering the following fixtures. Also not sure why it's on Thursday, but I suppose I shouldn't be surprised. Nelsinho out, Alba suspended and Pique had better be rested. If Valverde is going to rotate this is the match for it.

Saw this graphic yesterday:






I know the club got someone who was doing social media for United, but then I think they also just lost him. Either way I hope the club is able to monetize this in some way or another. I'd be curious to see YouTube statistics as well considering how active the club is there.



John Pedro said:


> Dat 442 with Coutinho and Dembele playing wide has some nice potential. Question is, can they use it against good teams? it can be very problematic defensively.




I think if Valverde gets the rest of the lineup right (gets the back line right and the midfield - IE no Paulinho) it can.



Savi said:


> Semedo out for 5 weeks.




Like I said, I'm looking at Valverde for this and I wonder if he actually played more if he would have pulled up. Really liked him out there and I like him defensively.


----------



## spintheblackcircle




----------



## Live in the Now

Losing to that lot...lol.


----------



## Power Man

Lmao


----------



## Power Man

We played with our B team tho


----------



## les Habs

Live in the Now said:


> Losing to that lot...lol.




Well to be fair they can bring it when they want. And Moreno is a pretty good player. 



Power Man said:


> We played with our B team tho




To a degree, but you still started Bale, Isco, Ramos, Varane and Navas. Asensio is also arguably not a B teamer, or at least he shouldn't be.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> We played with our B team tho



One player (bale) from that "B" team costs more than the enter Espanyol squad. They gave barca fits too in the cup. You chalking up their victory down to madrid playing their "lesser" players is hilarious.


----------



## Live in the Now

What happened was that Ceballos who is for some reason rated here, actually really sucks and did nothing to prevent an easily preventable goal. Madrid deserved nothing from the game either as there was another play where Espanyol should have created a sitter and for some reason their player kept dribbling like an idiot.


----------



## Power Man

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> One player (bale) from that "B" team costs more than the enter Espanyol squad. They gave barca fits too in the cup. You chalking up their victory down to madrid playing their "lesser" players is hilarious.



Son we have given up on La Liga in case you haven't noticed


----------



## YNWA14

In what way does Ceballos suck?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> We played with our B team tho




Our "B" team was winning these games last year.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Son we have given up on La Liga in case you haven't noticed



Tell that to Varane and if they continue to play like this that 4th spot might not be a forgone conclusion


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Tell that to Varane and if they continue to play like this that 4th spot might not be a forgone conclusion




Part of me would like to see what would happen if we missed on the CL. Perez's reaction would be to go nuclear for sure, it would be quite entertaining.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Suarez is starting for some reason. Another yellow and he is out for the Atletico match. Also why play vidal over Couthino and Demebele.

Sorry i keep posting the line ups but I just can't get past how stupid it is. Like why would you not rest Messi and most importantly Suarez. I'm interested to see how many games Couthino and Dembele get this year.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

DatsyukOwns said:


> Suarez is starting for some reason. Another yellow and he is out for the Atletico match. Also why play vidal over Couthino and Demebele.



Pretty dumb Messi starting again too.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Pretty dumb Messi starting again too.




Last game was the first time i wasn't stunned when i looked at the starting 11 in a while but he's back at it again.


----------



## les Habs

Like I keep saying, Valverde's selections are always wrong for some reason. We better take an early lead and he better get Suarez off. And Coutinho should be starting. He's CL tied so he should be playing every league match. f***ing Valverde...


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Pretty dumb Messi starting again too.




dat FK tho


----------



## Savi

Great reffing...


----------



## les Habs

Sounds like Lahoz and Valverde happened...


----------



## DatsyukOwns

les Habs said:


> Sounds like Lahoz and Valverde happened...




Lahoz is a sorry excuse for a ref but I guess it just shows you how much of a shit show refs are in La Liga. It happens to every team as well. Just a disgrace.

The game was so open I don't get why the f*** he didn't start Couthino or Demeble. Couthino did more in 5 seconds then Paulinho has in a month.

Now we are only 5 points ahead.

Valverde said they players still didn't know what the penalty was for on the way back to the dressing room.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Cheap excuse to blame this one on the ref. We f***ing sucked. Good game on the weekend, we better show our true play


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That was hilarious reffing.... how could not see such a blatant handball by the keeper outside the box? Also thats' never a penalty the slightest handball that was going away from goal.

Sidenote, Messi scores a outstanding FK and not more than one post about it.... another player does that it would have 10 posts on the sheer quality but with Messi its mentioned in passing. LOL.


----------



## les Habs

Vasilevskiy said:


> Cheap excuse to blame this one on the ref. We ****ing sucked. Good game on the weekend, we better show our true play




I haven't seen the match, but it sounds like it cost us points. So it's relevant. That said, as I noted, Valverde f***ed us as well.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

What a bullshit penalty call. Nacho CLEARLY got the ball.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Safe to say Messi is the best FK taker in the World by a big, big margin


----------



## Savi

His FK against Las Palmas on Thursday was still better IMO


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> His FK against Las Palmas on Thursday was still better IMO




The one under the wall is the best for me.


----------



## Savi

Great, Iniesta injured again


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Gomes is the worst player in recent history to play for barca on a regular basis. He's never had a good game and the reactions to his amateur plays in attacking positions by barca players are hilarious. They know.


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Gomes is the worst player in recent history to play for barca on a regular basis




No that's actually Mathieu

but Gomes certainly is up there


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Savi said:


> No that's actually Mathieu
> 
> but Gomes certainly is up there




Nah, Mathieu at least scored. Andre is f***ing useless


----------



## Savi

Vasilevskiy said:


> Nah, Mathieu at least scored




And gave me several heart attacks per game


----------



## Cassano

Damn Sergi Roberto is unreal.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Suarez is so pathetic


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> No that's actually Mathieu
> 
> but Gomes certainly is up there




He had an actual good run at one point.


----------



## Savi

We're like the Juve of Spain this season. Solid defence, don't too anything stupid at the back and then try to get one or two goals and win the game.

Atletico were very disappointing though. Even with 4 strikers on in the second half they only had 1 attempt on goal.


----------



## les Habs

Thrilled with the result, but I haven't seen the match yet. 



Savi said:


> No that's actually Mathieu
> 
> but Gomes certainly is up there




Nah, Gomes has been worse. Mathieu had some moments and was actually halfway decent in the first season or so. Either way Gomes has to go, yesterday.


----------



## les Habs

La City about to jump into a Europa League place.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

CR7 in great form lately. Nice to see. Still won't win the league, but it is refreshing. Team has looked better in the last month. CL is the only thing left though.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Messi out for Malaga game.... great that he's finally takes a rest. Just wish it wasn't this reason just months before the World Cup. Hope this doesn't affect his game.


----------



## maclean

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Messi out for Malaga game.... great that he's finally takes a rest. Just wish it wasn't this reason just months before the World Cup. Hope this doesn't affect his game.




Did it with the first two?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

maclean said:


> Did it with the first two?



I think so to an extent.


----------



## Savi

Valencia with a huge win at Sevilla, that should wrap up the CL race for them

Still don't understand why this Sevilla defence is so bad this season


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

What a cross from Alba. Take a bow boy.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That right there is a goal snatched away by the linesmen.


----------



## East Coast Bias

Brutal tackle on Alba. Deserved red.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Malaga look like a beat dog. This could get ugly, their keeper has been keeping them in it so far. 

Demebele has been great as is Couts.


----------



## John Pedro

Pretty telling interview from Gomes.


----------



## Power Man

Boudebouuuuz


----------



## Savi

Villarreal score 2 late goals including the added time winner to beat Atleti 

If Madrid wins tonight they can close the gap and Atleti, Madrid and Valencia are within 5 points of eachother.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Villarreal always ply Atleti tough. 

Glad Vitolo got a well deserved red should've given Costa one too. He loves this shit.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

I guess Benzema said to himself : "f*** it, I cannot score, but I still can pass it and get a shitload of assists"


----------



## kov

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Villarreal always ply Atleti tough.
> 
> Glad Vitolo got a well deserved red should've given Costa one too. He loves this ****.




I only saw one replay of it, but Athletico's PK looked like a complete and utter dive by Greizmann to me. Did I miss something?


----------



## Savi

kov said:


> I only saw one replay of it, but Athletico's PK looked like a complete and utter dive by Greizmann to me. Did I miss something?




Nope


----------



## Cassano

2-3 months ago ronaldo looked terrible and surely on decline. Now he's 1st in golden boot race at 33.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

All Might said:


> 2-3 months ago ronaldo looked terrible and surely on decline. Now he's 1st in golden boot race at 33.




He's playing the same way he has been the past 2/3 years... a bonafide poacher. A lethal one at that but hardly impactful anywhere else on the pitch. I have my doubts that he can win the boot considering how consistent Messi has been in the league. 6 goals is a fair margin. He won't have enough games in the CL to cover the spread.


----------



## Cassano

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He's playing the same way he has been the past 2/3 years... a bonafide poacher. A lethal one at that but hardly impactful anywhere else on the pitch. I have my doubts that he can win the boot considering how consistent Messi has been in the league. 6 goals is a fair margin.* He won't have enough games in the CL to cover the spread.*



They'll play 1 less game than Barca at worst from that competition most likely.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

All Might said:


> They'll play 1 less game than Barca at worst from that competition most likely.



They'll bow out to Juve so, I count 2/3 games. Mind you nothing's set in stone and I'm just predicting.


----------



## Bures Elbow

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He's playing the same way he has been the past 2/3 years... a bonafide poacher. A lethal one at that but hardly impactful anywhere else on the pitch. I have my doubts that he can win the boot considering how consistent Messi has been in the league. 6 goals is a fair margin. He won't have enough games in the CL to cover the spread.




Man you're like a broken trainwreck.

Ronaldo today for example was much more than a simple poacher. The hatred against him is honestly laughable.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Bures Elbow said:


> Man you're like a broken trainwreck.
> 
> Ronaldo today for example was much more than a simple poacher. The hatred against him is honestly laughable.




What the f*** is a broken train wreck? LOL

Today for example I didn't watch the match. His body of work the last 3 years is pretty obvious what kind of player he's devolved into. I mean its only natural for his body to decline and he has to reinvent himself.


----------



## TRG

Ronaldo. What a legend.


----------



## Cassano

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> They'll bow out to Juve so, I count 2/3 games. Mind you nothing's set in stone and I'm just predicting.



Fair, but still I doubt it. Pjanic and Benatia will miss the first legs. They're pretty much screwed imo. And I want Juve to win the whole thing.


----------



## Evilo

No way Ronaldo wins the GB since Portugal probably won't do anything in the WC.


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He's playing the same way he has been the past 2/3 years... a bonafide poacher. A lethal one at that but hardly impactful anywhere else on the pitch. I have my doubts that he can win the boot considering how consistent Messi has been in the league. 6 goals is a fair margin. He won't have enough games in the CL to cover the spread.




Are you talking about total goals in all competitions? Cause something's off there.

This season:

Cristiano Ronaldo - 37 goals in 35 games (1.06)
Lionel Messi - 35 goals in 43 games (0.81)


As for La Liga, Messi has 25 goals (28 games), Ronaldo has 22 (23 games).


----------



## Wee Baby Seamus

Evilo said:


> No way Ronaldo wins the GB since Portugal probably won't do anything in the WC.




Didn't you know that all Portugal has to do is qualify for the WC for Ronaldo to snag a Ballon d'Or?


----------



## YNWA14

Every time Ronaldo looks on the decline he still turns it around. His work ethic and consistency has to be admired. The number of goals he still manages at this point is pretty unreal regardless of whether you consider him a pure poacher or not.

Like I don't understand how people can throw a million superlatives at Salah then turn around and try to disparage Ronaldo. Their roles are not dissimilar; though Salah is much more likable for some.


----------



## Pouchkine

Evilo said:


> No way Ronaldo wins the GB since Portugal probably won't do anything in the WC.



Like you said before Euro 2016 in France.


----------



## Cassano

Evilo said:


> No way Ronaldo wins the GB since Portugal probably won't do anything in the WC.



He can still score plenty without that. It's not like anyone but Muller snd Hamrz have insane scoring record at World Cup ATM.


----------



## les Habs

"Noticias falsas!" Ronaldo taking a page out of Trump's book. Curious there's no thread about this. Oh yeah, I forgot where I was.


----------



## SJSharks72

Bures Elbow said:


> Man you're like a broken trainwreck.
> 
> Ronaldo today for example was much more than a simple poacher. The hatred against him is honestly laughable.



Isn’t a train wreck already broken? Is this train wreck more broken than a normal one?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Man what a finish between Athletic and Celta. Vigo tie it up in the 92 minute then hit the bar...Bilbao go the other way and are stop by a last ditch tackle. Celta manage one last attack in which they could've had a penalty but scored a disallowed offside goal. 

Bilbao have no one but themselves to blame for not taking all 3 points. Invited pressure and just allowed Celta to play their beautiful passing game the last 10 minutes. Even when Adruiz was subbed on. They deserved better but their manager sucks.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Sevilla running barca's ass ragged... lucky Muriel is on the pitch so, it's like Manu/Sevilla right now


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

You could've landed a plane between Umtiti and pique. You can't have that big of a gap in the 6 yard box


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

So, Barca =Argentina without messi. Hope @Seph is watching.


----------



## Savi

Credit Sevilla for this game, might be their best of the season

For Barça, the Paulinho/Rakitic/Iniesta midfield has been non-existant today. Priority for next summer should be a CM.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> Credit Sevilla for this game, might be their best of the season
> 
> For Barça, the Paulinho/Rakitic/Iniesta midfield has been non-existant today. Priority for next summer should be a CM.



So Dybala Lol


----------



## Savi

LMAO


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> So Dybala Lol




Yeah but we'll play him at CM


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Fack off messi woooooooow


----------



## YNWA14

Messi is ridiculous.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Team invincibles bitches!


----------



## les Habs

I didn't get a chance to see the match yet, but I first checked the scoreline around the 80th minute. I said to myself "you thought we might lose this one" and was disappointed I was right. So I checked the scoreline one more time about fifteen minutes later just to see the final score and just started laughing. This has happened to me more times than I can remember (see Chelsea 09). Of course Messi.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> I didn't get a chance to see the match yet, but I first checked the scoreline around the 80th minute. I said to myself "you thought we might lose this one" and was disappointed I was right. So I checked the scoreline one more time about fifteen minutes later just to see the final score and just started laughing. This has happened to me more times than I can remember (see Chelsea 09). Of course Messi.





You didn't witness Iniestas' screamer live? Wow

My friend ruined Messi' goal vs Madrid in the 90th minute last year for me. Still enjoyed it though


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> You didn't witness Iniestas' screamer live? Wow
> 
> My friend ruined Messi' goal vs Madrid in the 90th minute last year for me. Still enjoyed it though




No I didn't, but I can picture where I was when I read the final scoreline. I was working and checked the score on my phone and I could tell it was done. Continued on with my day. Was heading out of work, and I can literally picture where I was, and checked the score again and was thrilled. Didn't really take any of the enjoyment out of it for me and it's probably a little story I'll never forget.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Enjoyed this video


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Sevilla rocked by Celta... So, much for the consistent Banega/Sevilla. This is what I was implying when I said there's 2 Sevilla's one at home and the other away. I don't think they have a slight chance in Munich. They lost that tie the second they blew their lead.


----------



## Deficient Mode

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Sevilla rocked by Celta... So, much for the consistent Banega/Sevilla. This is what I was implying when I said there's 2 Sevilla's one at home and the other away. I don't think they have a slight chance in Munich. They lost that tie the second they blew their lead.




Celta is better than Bayern though tbh

I don't think Sevilla have been that great at home either or as good as some past Sevilla teams. Their goal differential is really poor for where they are in the table. Even at home it's not that great.


----------



## les Habs

Didn't get to see the match and can't find a replay as of yet. Looking at the highlights though it looks as though we could have had six goals. Suarez looked really hungry. Coutinho played a nice ball to Messi for his second and had another nice through ball to him (though Messi was offside), so hopefully they are forging a connection that we'll see the benefits of next year. Messi with another excellent free kick for his first. No numbers in front of me and I'm going off the top of my head, but he seems to be putting more free kicks of late. Messi's third looked like a handball from one angle, but from a better angle less so. Still tough to tell from the highlights I saw.


----------



## les Habs

Speaking of Sevilla, crosstown rivals Betis have now won four on the trot and are in the top Europa League spot. What's more they've only let in one goal in those four matches. Looks like Bartra's arrival has been quite helpful. In fact they've won seven of the ten matches he's played in with the only losses being against Madrid and Valencia. They won't catch Valencia, but it'll be interesting to see how they'll do next season if they can keep Ruiz and reinforce the squad.


----------



## Deficient Mode

les Habs said:


> Speaking of Sevilla, crosstown rivals Betis have now won four on the trot and are in the top Europa League spot. What's more they've only let in one goal in those four matches. Looks like Bartra's arrival has been quite helpful. In fact they've won seven of the ten matches he's played in with the only losses being against Madrid and Valencia. They won't catch Valencia, but it'll be interesting to see how they'll do next season if they can keep Ruiz and reinforce the squad.




Bartra is GOAT why did both of our clubs let him go


----------



## les Habs

Deficient Mode said:


> Bartra is GOAT why did both of our clubs let him go




Your club did good by him in letting him go home. My club's manager f***ed up. The players we've lost do to managers' decisions... and the crazy thing is these managers won trophies despite losing these players. Anyway, with us it helped him though because he was never going to feature as much until it was too late in his career. Still love the homegrown players as squad players and I always thought Bartra could be our third choice CB.


----------



## Deficient Mode

les Habs said:


> Your club did good by him in letting him go home. My club's manager ****ed up. The players we've lost do to managers' decisions... and the crazy thing is these managers won trophies despite losing these players. Anyway, with us it helped him though because he was never going to feature as much until it was too late in his career. Still love the homegrown players as squad players and I always thought Bartra could be our third choice CB.




Maybe he'll make his way back to Barca after Betis. I hope so at least.


----------



## Halladay

Ive liked this Madrid derby so far. Atletico is pretty open.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Insane how can a lineman get an offside call this wrong when it's a footway from him. Sad stuff really.Surprised Simeone didn't lash out on him .



les Habs said:


> Didn't get to see the match and can't find a replay as of yet. Looking at the highlights though it looks as though we could have had six goals. Suarez looked really hungry. Coutinho played a nice ball to Messi for his second and had another nice through ball to him (though Messi was offside), so hopefully they are forging a connection that we'll see the benefits of next year. Messi with another excellent free kick for his first. No numbers in front of me and I'm going off the top of my head, but he seems to be putting more free kicks of late. Messi's third looked like a handball from one angle, but from a better angle less so. Still tough to tell from the highlights I saw.




I missed the game as well... still pissed Messi started and played the whole game.



les Habs said:


> Speaking of Sevilla, crosstown rivals Betis have now won four on the trot and are in the top Europa League spot. What's more they've only let in one goal in those four matches. * Looks like Bartra's arrival has been quite helpful. In fact they've won seven of the ten matches he's played in with the only losses being against Madrid and Valencia. * They won't catch Valencia, but it'll be interesting to see how they'll do next season if they can keep Ruiz and reinforce the squad.




Wonder who thought this might be the case prior to his move. Betis are boss.


----------



## Savi

Halladay said:


> Ive liked this Madrid derby so far. Atletico is pretty open.




Meh, it's way too lacklustre


----------



## Halladay

Savi said:


> Meh, it's way too lacklustre



Normally when Ive seen them, just too many yellowcards and hard fouls. Marcelo nearly scored with that shot before the end of the half.


----------



## Power Man

Whi else?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Whi else?




What a cross by my man Bale


----------



## Power Man

Nice goal by Atleti tbh



I mean shit


----------



## Halladay

Griezmann answer right away. I'm impressed by Partey.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> Nice goal by Atleti tbh
> 
> 
> 
> I mean ****




Varane NEARLY stopped it with his left foot.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Whi else?

Greizz was an interesting celebration. 

Real winning would be better for barca but f*** that.


----------



## Power Man

Our D has been bad all game though


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Koke! should've been 2-1 Navas with a great save.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Subbing off CR7? Wut?


----------



## Power Man

Lol that sub


----------



## Power Man

I hate Olblak


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Disappointed by the result, but it was a very fun game to watch.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

I hope Benz gets called up to the NT. Guy is so uninspired this year. Just straight up abysmal.


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I hope Benz gets called up to the NT. Guy is so uninspired this year. Just straight up abysmal.




Yes and no. 
He was struggling in the early part of the season, when everyone was playing off-form (or injured) aside from maybe 3-4 players (Asensio, Modric, Varane,..) but he's been coming to his best "Real Benzema" form.

And to be clear, maybe people don't watch the games, just see the misses and the highlights, hear about the boos from your average football fan (your average football fan knows jack about football btw), but Benzema does what he is supposed to do better than any other footballer I could see doing it in his position. (again, when on form, which he - and Real - clearly weren't before January)

From an out-and-out striker, a goalscorer and predator, he's turned into a team player, fantastic defensively and one of the world's premier build-up and link-up forwards, and most importantly, a Ronaldo-enabler.
There is a reason why Benz is a fixture in the starting 11 of a side that's won 3 CLs in the last 4 years.

Off form Benz is, yes, terrible. Most players off-form are.
On form Benz, however, is a special player, fits Real like a glove, but he'll never get recognition.



Scandale du Jour said:


> Subbing off CR7? Wut?




Rested for the Juve game. Real have nothing to play for in La Liga.


----------



## Evilo

Yes Benz is an incredible player for Real.
For the NT however, he acts as if he's Ronaldo and everyone should play for him.
Which results in him being on his couch and the NT being better off without him.


----------



## les Habs

Interesting matchup today. I think Betis win despite playing away, but Girona are not pushovers at home. Another win for Betis would mean five in a row making them one of the top two most in form sides in the league.

EDIT: changed "now" to "not"...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Girona are beasts at home and betis away form is better than their home form.

I think betis take it because they are the better team plus bartra.


----------



## les Habs

VALVERDE OUT! WTF LEAVES DEMBELE ON THE BENCH?!?!!! Valverde is a coward.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

This team, roster wise has no business winning the league let alone team invincibles. Valverde is one of the bigger reasons why. Yeah, the meltdown in Rome was insanity and I didn't see the game but this team needs new blood. 

It's been a great year in relation despite context of falling out in CL.


----------



## Savi

The longer this season goes on, the more boring football we seem to play. It's unwatchable at times really. Yes the results are very good and I'm really happy we're going to win the Liga.. but next season things will have to change.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> This team, roster wise has no business winning the league let alone team invincibles. Valverde is one of the bigger reasons why. Yeah, the meltdown in Rome was insanity and I didn't see the game but this team needs new blood.
> 
> It's been a great year in relation despite context of falling out in CL.




To say the team has no business winning the league is utter nonsense. The team should be winning the league, though I won't say we should be undefeated. Valverde's arrival has helped on the defensive end, but he's far too conservative. I haven't seen the match against Roma either, but there's no way we should have gone out like that. A better manager and one who actually understands how the club should be playing would realize that. 

Yeah, new blood in the form of a new manager. We need a CM too, but after that it's more about backups.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> To say the team has no business winning the league is utter nonsense. The team should be winning the league, though I won't say we should be undefeated. Valverde's arrival has helped on the defensive end, but he's far too conservative. I haven't seen the match against Roma either, but there's no way we should have gone out like that. A better manager and one who actually understands how the club should be playing would realize that.
> 
> Yeah, new blood in the form of a new manager. We need a CM too, but after that it's more about backups.




I mean no business in wing with the players they have in relation to Madrids... I mean did anyone believe barca would win late into the summer with the transfer debacle and the thrashing Madrid handed them? Yet here we are on route with a domestic double... Roma is a complete failure but one game doesn't get you fired. At least it shouldn't. 

I mean the CL campaign rested on Messi doing all the scoring and OG pitching every now and then. How long was that going to last? Roma scored more goals than barca in that 4-1 win. They scored more than Suarez has in 12 months for barca just that game. I hate to pick on him considering we had a 4-1 lead but they were never going to win if he didn't get his shit together in the CL. 

I agree abut the CM/back ups I'd add a 9 to that list too. Being more proactive should be barca's aim this window. 

Coutinho coming in full time help in that it gives Iniesta a reduced role I'd add another though.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I mean no business in wing with the players they have in relation to Madrids... I mean did anyone believe barca would win late into the summer with the transfer debacle and the thrashing Madrid handed them? Yet here we are on route with a domestic double... Roma is a complete failure but one game doesn't get you fired. At least it shouldn't.
> 
> I mean the CL campaign rested on Messi doing all the scoring and OG pitching every now and then. How long was that going to last? Roma scored more goals than barca in that 4-1 win. They scored more than Suarez has in 12 months for barca just that game. I hate to pick on him considering we had a 4-1 lead but they were never going to win if he didn't get his **** together in the CL.
> 
> I agree abut the CM/back ups I'd add a 9 to that list too. Being more proactive should be barca's aim this window.
> 
> Coutinho coming in full time help in that it gives Iniesta a reduced role I'd add another though.




I know what you meant and it's utter nonsense. Quite frankly that's an embarrassing statement. Not even going to bother reading the rest.


----------



## Panteras

I can’t believe Deportivo have managed 2 wins in a row. Although I’m sure that will come to an end next game against Sevilla, we also have Barca and Valencia and the one that will hurt the most Celta away. So yeah we’re still being relegated..... : (


----------



## Savi

Yeah too bad. They're not that far behind Levante but the rest of their schedule is brutal.


----------



## les Habs

Can't get the full match just yet, but saw the extended highlights. Nice assist from Coutinho to Suarez and somewhat quietly Coutinho has put up good numbers. Ter Stegen made an excellent save after he made a poor clearance. He also nearly saved that penalty. As for Valverde, I get making the sub to waste time, but I'm sure Semedo isn't chuffed with being brought on for a matter of seconds.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Iniesta to announce his decision after the Copa final. If that's actually the case, I think he's gone. Otherwise, there's nothing to announce. Hope I'm wrong he still a class player when his usage is limited. This is gonna hurt like a motherf***er.


----------



## Panteras

Savi said:


> Yeah too bad. They're not that far behind Levante but the rest of their schedule is brutal.




I appreciate the support for Depor. The schedule is really bad and Levante face Celta last game, so if we need help in that last match day we ain't getting it lol...but oh well we put ourselves in this hole. It's been brutal football for like 90% of the season. Lot of heart breakers. I wouldn't be that mad if we go down and just build up with Seedorf as something seems to be working. Perhaps players are buying into the system. Then come back and be at least mid table team like what's happened to Newcastle with Benitez.


----------



## les Habs




----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Well I was wrong Bartra solved all their problems. Pisses me off he was let go and jerked around then sent to the wolves after an injury and not playing all year by playing him against Madrid/Munich sealed his fate as a barca player. Kid can play.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Wow B team starting at Celta minus MAtS. Ballys move by coward Valverde. If this ruins team invincibles argh.

Sidenote, not a single La Masia player(suarez is .5) embarrassing stuff really.


----------



## les Habs

I'll actually give Valverde a pass here. Copa Final is on Saturday, which is f***ing ridiculous, and so we'll need everyone rested.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Denis looks great going forward however he still gives up the ball way too easy and trying for killer balls has lead to dangerous counters.


----------



## Savi

Nice finish from Dembele


----------



## Cassano

Lol Gomes


----------



## Savi

Don Paulinho


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Don Paulinho




You sure? I think Kane got a touch.


----------



## les Habs

Stupid red by Sergi there. I say let ter Stegen have a shot and a goal only ties it.


----------



## les Habs

Hard to call it, but Aspas handled that.


----------



## les Habs

f*** the advantage rule. That was a yellow card.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Sneaked by that even though that shouldn't be a goal. Whatever works now tho.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Sneaked by that even though that shouldn't be a goal. Whatever works now tho.




Paulinho offside? I thought the second guy sliding in got a touch, but didn't get a good replay.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Paulinho offside? I thought the second guy sliding in got a touch, but didn't get a good replay.



No aspas's handball.


----------



## Cassano

Januzaj with a MoTM performance vs Atletico. Wonder if there is still a top player in there.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Correa you're terrible... how this guy will make the WC squad is a mystery.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Last man back... that's a red card.


----------



## Savi

This is going easier than expected.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

That pass by Messi was ridiculous.


----------



## Savi

Lovely goal from Iniesta. 

Looking at how everyone reacted when he was subbed I think it's safe to say he's going to leave.


----------



## les Habs

Can't wait to see the Copa Final as it sounds like they were in top gear. Thrilled with the result as it's a very important trophy for the club historically.


----------



## Savi

Barça beat Chelsea 3-0 in the Youth League final this afternoon. Looks like the cantera is still alive and well.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Savi said:


> Barça beat Chelsea 3-0 in the Youth League final this afternoon. Looks like the cantera is still alive and well.




For other teams yeah sure. At this point La Masia is more about making money than anything else.


----------



## les Habs

Betis held Atleti to a goalless draw away at the Wanda. Atleti didn't start their best XI, but they still had a pretty strong side and either way another impressive result from Betis.
Athletic Club losing today. They'd be in the relegation scrap if there wasn't a gap between 17th and 18th. Again surprised Ziganda is still around



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> For other teams yeah sure. At this point La Masia is more about making money than anything else.




I wouldn't say that, but it's badly managed. Gerard under some pressure now, but he claims he has the dressing room. Alena's comments could be considered to support that, but either way interesting to read a B team player in the press like that.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> I wouldn't say that, but it's badly managed. Gerard under some pressure now, but he claims he has the dressing room. Alena's comments could be considered to support that, but either way interesting to read a B team player in the press like that.




I mean who is the last B player to have an impact with the first team? Hell is the most recent graduate to have any impact... Denis? Boy can barely get any minutes. I don't think he's a star but he deserved more of a chance than the soccer Pejorative Slur Deulofeu.


----------



## Savi

les Habs said:


> I wouldn't say that, but it's badly managed. Gerard under some pressure now, but he claims he has the dressing room.




He's out.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> I mean who is the last B player to have an impact with the first team? Hell is the most recent graduate to have any impact... Denis? Boy can barely get any minutes. I don't think he's a star but he deserved more of a chance than the soccer ****** Deulofeu.




Like I said, it's badly managed. That however doesn't mean it's being used to make money since it's not making a lot of money to begin with.



Savi said:


> He's out.




Great, but what took so long? I don't follow the B team that closely, but the writing looks to have been on the wall for a while now if you ask me. I mean they could sacked him in December. Time to send Paulinho and Yerry the legend down to get them in the top five before the season is out.


----------



## les Habs

Iniesta confirming he will leave at the end of the season. The club needs to give him a proper sending off like they did Xavi. Some nice comments from him and as a supporter I feel very privileged to have been able to see him player throughout his career.


----------



## les Habs

I wonder if Montella will survive the season. I thought he was going to be sacked last week. Now they've lost to Levante (albeit away) thus missing the opportunity to draw level on points with Villarreal. Villarreal also now have a game in hand. That said I think they still get a place in the Europa League if we win the league, though I'm not entirely positive on that point. Anyway, they haven't won since mid March. Meanwhile Betis have been on a tear.


----------



## Savi

I think it's stupid we play 4 hours after Atletico tomorrow

I can totally see Simeone rotate and rest players for the Arsenal return, also Alaves have been pretty good lately so I wouldn't be surprised if they get at least a point, which would win us the title without even playing


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Couts nice finish. Bring on the trophy.


----------



## les Habs

That pass from Suarez and that goal from the third best player in the World. Amazing.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> That pass from Suarez and that goal from the third best player in the World. Amazing.



Who's the first two?

Ascacibar and L.Martinez?


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Who's the first two?
> 
> Ascacibar and L.Martinez?




Yerry Mina and Paulinho. 

I was just saying since "when in Rome."


----------



## les Habs

Pique!


----------



## les Habs

Suarez and Messi again. Very unselfish of Suarez there.


----------



## les Habs

And again.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Denis is the best Suarez at barca. 

Messi gunning for Salah's throne.

Now only the Classico to play for. Sit every other game please!


----------



## les Habs

Gerry needs to put that last chance away if he's going to show a manita again.

Depor definitely made a match of it in the second half until the third goal.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> Gerry needs to put that last chance away if he's going to show a manita again.
> 
> Depor definitely made a match of it in the second half until the third goal.



Well he'll get another chance next week.


----------



## les Habs

Finally got around to the Copa Final. Wonderful atmosphere at the Wanda to start off the match. Really shows how big the cup is in Spain. Though perhaps the Bernabeu would have been a better setting with Barça supporters' shirts being confiscated. Anyway, this edition was the Copa don Andres. Thrilled to see him score a nice goal like that and he had a good match overall. He nearly had a second goal and did well playing in Alba on the second goal. Definitely still has it to keep going, but I understand the move to China. Globetrotters stuff at times with Messi of course at it as always pulling the strings and scoring. People talk about the season he's having in comparison to other players, but none of those other players are the playmaker he is and yet he puts up the same goalscoring numbers. On top of that none of those other guys would deliver this sort of performance. Suarez had a good match and was competitive as he always is. Cillessen was excellent making a nice save at one stage and of course providing that ball to Coutinho on the first goal. Sadly I would think he's gone in the Summer as someone will surely come in for him as good as he's been for us. Also want to highlight Alba's assist. Excellent no-look back pass to Messi. That's at least his sixth assist of Messi this season and he still probably has the most assists of any LB in a major league for the past how many years. Still you rarely hear about him.

I have to note that the atmosphere amongst the players still looks very strong. Sure there are closer relationships within the group, but overall there still seems to be a really strong team element. Coutinho rightly being given the penalty when Suarez was chasing a hat trick and with Messi chasing records says a lot. Then you've also got the players and their kids and their families after the match. While that may not be unheard of, it doesn't seem as prevalent at other clubs. Part of that is an age thing, but I think the atmosphere is important for the squad to get on and do their jobs.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Denis is the best Suarez at barca.




No, and as the kids like to say "and it's not even close." Go watch the Copa Final and how he gamed Mercado, who should have been sent off in the first half as a result (and who should have been sent off in the second as well, but that's not the point). Suarez started the season a bit slow and I'd have liked more from him in the CL, but he's had a very good season overall and there's still time for him to get thirty goals in the league (though I don't think he will). Ideally he'll be around for a while yet even if a replacement comes in, but I don't think he'd accept a backup role when the time comes.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> No, and as the kids like to say "and it's not even close." Go watch the Copa Final and how he gamed Mercado, who should have been sent off in the first half as a result (and who should have been sent off in the second as well, but that's not the point). Suarez started the season a bit slow and I'd have liked more from him in the CL, but he's had a very good season overall and there's still time for him to get thirty goals in the league (though I don't think he will). Ideally he'll be around for a while yet even if a replacement comes in, but I don't think he'd accept a backup role when the time comes.




It was definitely tongue and cheek.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> It was definitely tongue and cheek.




How am I supposed to surmise that when you bag on Suarez all the time, actually want to sign Isco and think Messi shouldn't play every remaining minute of the season so he can waste his Summer in Russia? FFS man, get serious!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> How am I supposed to surmise that when you bag on Suarez all the time, actually want to sign Isco and think Messi shouldn't play every remaining minute of the season so he can waste his Summer in Russia? FFS man, get serious!




You're not supposed to surmise... I meant to post it knowing it would get a reaction from you lol. Suarez is declining but I don't think Denis has a future with barca. No more than a role position anyway...and that remains to be seen.

Isco is a beauty... just got caught into a bad crowd. Don't be too hard on the boy, he'll hopefully find his way.

As for Messi he has bigger fish to fry in the summer than beating up on minnows such as Madrid on Sunday.

All he has to do is beat Spain in the quarters, Germany in the Semis and France in the finals....If he gets through Denmark that is. Done and done.


----------



## Power Man

Hoping ZZ rests everybody, I don't care if we get trashed 20-0


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Power Man said:


> Hoping ZZ rests everybody, I don't care if we get trashed 20-0



I really hope so too.


----------



## maclean

Just imagine the smugness if Real broke the invincibles streak, ugh


----------



## Halladay

That was a beautiful counter from Barcelona. Down Marcelo's side again.

Ronaldo equalizes, great play.


----------



## Evilo

He's not Robertson, that's for sure.


----------



## S E P H

It's unbelievable how good Barca is at Camp Nou considering how much of a library the stadium is filled with plastic Asian fans.

Lol thug fight between Ramos and Suarez. 

Barca been the better team.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Me FairPlay Ramos this guy is deranged.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Love it messi f*** Ramos


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Insanity bale should be off but Roberto is?


----------



## Live in the Now

The Barcelona goal shows exactly how RM is vulnerable. Very vulnerable to a good striker heading back into midfield creating space for other players to run forward.


----------



## Halladay

Roberto sent off, Bale should have been booked.


----------



## Evilo

Wow.
Bale should be straight red.
Marcelo comes and shoulders Roberto off the ball who reacts a tad too strongly and he gets the red.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Booked my ass... umiti clearly beats him to the ball and goes after his foot. Clear red


----------



## Cassano

So what minute does Ramos get sent off?


----------



## Evilo

Live in the Now said:


> The Barcelona goal shows exactly how RM is vulnerable. Very vulnerable to a good striker heading back into midfield creating space for other players to run forward.



And Real's goal shows how they escape pressing in midfield to score.


----------



## S E P H

All Might said:


> So what minute does Ramos get sent off?



Minute? Lol, he gets sent off when both teams come back onto the pitch from the lockerroom.


----------



## S E P H

Wow, that is a complete red on Bale there. Dark age sport lads. 


Live in the Now said:


> The Barcelona goal shows exactly how RM is vulnerable. Very vulnerable to a good striker heading back into midfield creating space for other players to run forward.



One of the problems is due to Casemiro, ZZ thinks he's a CDM so he plays him in that role, but he's far from it. He's like a better version of Xhaka and that role is more of a BxB instead of a pure #6.


----------



## S E P H

Wow, Ronaldo subbed off. Due to a knock?


----------



## maclean

whatta goal


----------



## S E P H

maclean said:


> whatta goal



Barca look way better being down a man, but Navas should have done better there. Messi curving the ball inside is magical, but that was the only place he could have shot at at that angle. Brutal goalkeeping.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

S E P H said:


> Barca look way better being down a man, but Navas should have done better there. Messi curving the ball inside is magical, but that was the only place he could have shot at at that angle. Brutal goalkeeping.



Lol there's no keeper in the world that can save that... maybe 2?

Should been called back but love that it wasn't.


----------



## Halladay

Navas appears to be hurt.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ramos not sent off? Lol


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Again wow


----------



## Cassano

RM are poor without Ronaldo. One man army.


----------



## Halladay

All Might said:


> RM are poor without Ronaldo. One man army.



You were saying? Great goal by the player who should have been sent off.


----------



## S E P H

I'm all for RM to ruin Barca's invincible run, but yikes, the guy who ties the game is one who should be off. All the calls are going against Barca.


----------



## Cassano

Halladay said:


> You were saying? Great goal by the player who should have been sent off.



Yeah point still stands. They look considerably worse with him off the pitch.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Bale gets booked now... he didn't when he butchered umiti how many invitations does this coward need?


----------



## Cassano

Should've been a penalty there. Marcelo was fouled.

This game reflects poorly on La Liga reffing.


----------



## S E P H

All Might said:


> Should've been a penalty there. Marcelo was fouled.
> 
> This game reflects poorly on La Liga reffing.



Yeah, but I get called an EPL homer when I said this multiple times the past seven years here.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

La liga is ref poorly as is serie A and EPL? This new to anyone


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Not surprising... munich on the brink of existing THIAGO put the all out.here it's a tie game with no real attacking threat they play on. Lol 9 men


----------



## Scandale du Jour

S E P H said:


> I'm all for RM to ruin Barca's invincible run, but yikes, the guy who ties the game is one who should be off. All the calls are going against Barca.




The refs should have called a foul on Messi'a goal. Not ALL calls are going against Barca.

Marcelo fouled in the box.

Bale and Ramos could be off.

Very poorly reffed game overall.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Could be? Lool but those are certain calls on Madrid? Yeah, typical.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Could be? Lool but those are certain calls on Madrid? Yeah, typical.




Quit being such a cry baby.


----------



## Savi

Spanish reffing at it's finest again, although I do think the Sergi Roberto red was correct

Entertaining game for the most part and I'll take the tie considering the circumstances

I thought Rakitic had a massive game


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Scandale du Jour said:


> Quit being such a cry baby.



Crying? I'm laughing my ass off... against 10 men for 50 minutes and you couldn't get a lead.


----------



## Live in the Now

S E P H said:


> Yeah, but I get called an EPL homer when I said this multiple times the past seven years here.






Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> La liga is ref poorly as is serie A and EPL? This new to anyone




Officials everywhere are terrible. How the hell can anyone think there are more than like five good refs? They don't pay them enough first of all and second of all they need video help to begin with. I'm sure refs make loads more money by retiring and going on TV.


----------



## Corto

I was wanting to watch Barca vs Real.

I saw Hernandez vs Hernandez.

If there's one league in the world that needs VAR, it's La Liga. What. A. S**tshow. lol...

Lucky for everyone game decided absolutely nothing.


----------



## hatterson

Live in the Now said:


> Officials everywhere are terrible. How the hell can anyone think there are more than like five good refs? They don't pay them enough first of all and second of all they need video help to begin with. I'm sure refs make loads more money by retiring and going on TV.




Or doing what Clattenburg did and going to some random country to be a ref consultant for probably 10x what he was making in the PL.


----------



## Live in the Now

hatterson said:


> Or doing what Clattenburg did and going to some random country to be a ref consultant for probably 10x what he was making in the PL.




Yeah seriously. Why the hell would anyone bother? Fans send death threats too. The games are eventually gonna have to be officiated by video and administered by one poor bastard who goes out on the field.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Has to be said Iniesta looked awful. Holding on the ball far too long and missed passes everywhere. Only reason he want subbed off before Coutinho is because it's his last year.

Also Dembele is in the dog house for Valverde. He's completely lost his trust


----------



## Power Man

Lmaoooo


----------



## Savi

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Also Dembele is in the dog house for Valverde. He's completely lost his trust




I don't think that's it. It's more that he doesn't have enough of his trust yet to be put in, in these type of games. For all the talent he has, he is still so raw, especially in terms of team play and team defence. He'll get there but I think Valverde knows he needs a lot more work than they probably anticipated.


----------



## kov

Halladay said:


> You were saying? Great goal by the player who should have been sent off.




Great strike by Bale but the space was created by Benzema and the pass was excellent. RM are anything but a one many army.


----------



## Corto

kov said:


> Great strike by Bale but the space was created by Benzema and the pass was excellent. RM are anything but a one many army.




Their play is one thing. It's a team of world class players, 9 out of 11 are certainly top 1-2 in their positions (Benzema and Isco/Asensio are not IMO). They also have fantastic depth (though nowhere near last year with James, Morata and Danilo gone)

But their scoring IS Ronaldo. Without him, they just don't look as dangerous and they don't score. They hardly even look like scoring.


----------



## Corto

Also, I forgot to mention, but Rakitic's had a phenomenal year in his new role (a slightly more offensive Busquests-role) and has probably been the most important member after Messi (though MaTS had an amazing year as well) - and tonight was no different, he was great.


----------



## Ivan13

All in all this was a clown show as per usual in these games. A lot of despicable characters on both teams and these games bring out the worst in them all. I hope one day football players will act the same way rugby players do when talking to the ref.


----------



## les Habs

Not that Sergio Ramos is to be taken seriously in the first place, but he's claiming Messi had a real go at the ref in the tunnel. He also claimed that there wasn't an incident between Pique and Nacho in the tunnel because something like "Spanish NT players get along and they wouldn't do that." Well in the case of the former, even though I wouldn't be surprised, there's nothing to show that. In the case of the latter however there was a clear exchange between Pique and Nacho.

I have yet to see the match and it's proving difficult to find a good replay, but I have seen the first twenty minutes and Varana pushed Sergi over in the box with no call and I'd have booked Rakitic earlier. I don't doubt the ref made mistakes that affected both sides as is always the case, but the key is the amount and the level of degree.



Corto said:


> Also, I forgot to mention, but Rakitic's had a phenomenal year in his new role (a slightly more offensive Busquests-role) and has probably been the most important member after Messi (though MaTS had an amazing year as well) - and tonight was no different, he was great.




He's not been the most important player after Messi. Probably not even top five. That's not to slight him or his performances as he's been better this season and more consistent, but other players have been more important and it's also a result of many players having excellent seasons.



Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Also Dembele is in the dog house for Valverde. He's completely lost his trust




I think it's more of a tactical decision, one I don't agree with, but I will say it's somewhat difficult with the talent we have to make it work the way I want.



Corto said:


> Their play is one thing. It's a team of world class players, 9 out of 11 are certainly top 1-2 in their positions (Benzema and Isco/Asensio are not IMO). They also have fantastic depth (though nowhere near last year with James, Morata and Danilo gone)




9 out of 11? No. They do have very good depth though. Still some of their depth players have some proving to do.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Well first Madrid have to settle on a starting 11... I'm assuming Bale is not included? If so, then definitely not 9 out 11.

There's Navas,Casemiro,Benz, Ramos,Kroos and Bale?Isco?


----------



## Corto

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Well first Madrid have to settle on a starting 11... I'm assuming Bale is not included? If so, then definitely not 9 out 11.
> 
> There's Navas,Casemiro,Benz, Ramos,Kroos and Bale?Isco?




Assuming everyone's healthy, it is (and has been for 2 years now):

Navas - Carvajal, Varane, Ramos, Marcelo - Modric, Casemiro, Kroos - Ronaldo, Benzema, Isco/Bale

If Isco is in, it's a 4-4-2.


----------



## Evilo

9 out of 11 are top 2 at their position? What?
Navas, Varane, Ramos, Casemiro, Kroos, Benzema, Isco. Those are not top 2 by any means. That's already 7 that are not top 2.
You're left with Carvajal, arguable given the lack of depth, but is a decent case.
Marcelo, I agree.
Modric, likely.
Ronaldo OK.

At best 4 are top 2 at their position.


----------



## Corto

Evilo said:


> 9 out of 11 are top 2 at their position? What?
> Navas, Varane, Ramos, Casemiro, Kroos, Benzema, Isco. Those are not top 2 by any means. That's already 7 that are not top 2.
> You're left with Carvajal, arguable given the lack of depth, but is a decent case.
> Marcelo, I agree.
> Modric, likely.
> Ronaldo OK.
> 
> At best 4 are top 2 at their position.




Meh, top-2 was silly wording as I should've known better... My mistake.

Fine, lets rephrase it from "top-2" to "absolute world class, top-tier players".

Navas... Actually I don't know. He ranges from "surely Madrid could do better" to "holy crap, those are the best reactive saves I've ever seen".
You're probably right, on the whole, there are goalkeepers out there who are just that little tier above him.

Varane and Ramos are, for my money, the best CB pairing in the world - especially if you take into consideration how high the fullbacks play. No other pairing (IMO) is as complete, and what makes them so good is their mobility, among other things. Varane is stupidly fast for his size and Ramos (who was originally a RB) is almost as fast. Both great in the air, both good with the ball, both great instincts, great positioning, etc.

Modric is widely regarded as the best midfielder in the world for the last 4-5 years. There's nothing "likely" about it.
Kroos is absolute world class, the brains behind so much success for Bayern, Germany and Madrid, winning everywhere and everything, but he plays a quiet game - and he'll always have his nay-sayers because of it. The only other midfielder other than Modric who I might take over him at this point is KdB. Defensively underrated and stupidly consistent, but he'll rarely get the credit for it.

Casemiro is a top DM - but there are more compete players out there. His biggest flaw is his play under pressure, but Real mostly deal with that with rarely giving him the ball in pressure situations as Modric and Kroos open passing lanes. His long balls are underrated, are are his offensive instincts when he pushes forward. He's no peak Busquets, but he is a top DM.
Are there better players, more complete, in his role? Not many, but yeah. But I don't think many (if any) would necessarily work better with Modric and Kroos.

Carvajal and Marcelo are the world's best fullbacks, I really don't see any real competition.

So, I'd say, "absolute world class top tier" - 7/11 (without counting Casemiro, who I think is underrated):
Carvajal, Varane, Ramos, Marcelo, Modric, Kroos, Ronaldo


----------



## les Habs

I pretty much agree with Evilo here. Very concise yet well worded. 

Changing from "Top 2" to "absolutely world class, top-tier players" is convenient, but the latter is still a matter of definition if you ask me. I personally have a difference between "World Class" and "Top Tier". I don't equate them and out of the seven left I don't see all of them as "Top Tier".


----------



## Ivan13

Modrić likely? 

I'd like to hear how he isn't a top midfielder in the world.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

All elite teams have world class players...


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> Modrić likely?
> 
> I'd like to hear how he isn't a top midfielder in the world.




He said likely to be 1st or 2nd best midfielder... not a top midfielder. It makes more sense.


----------



## Ivan13

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He said likely to be 1st or 2nd best midfielder... not a top midfielder. It makes more sense.



The point is that he is a surefire top 1 or 2 midfielder in the world. Likely means that there is something to argue there, do tell who in their right mind is going to argue against Modrić not being at worst the 2nd best in the world?


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> The point is that he is a surefire top 1 or 2 midfielder in the world. Likely means that there is something to argue there, do tell who in their right mind is going to argue against Modrić not being at worst the 2nd best in the world?




Now were just arguing semantics but you said top midfielder and that's not what Evilo was referring to. That's all I'm saying. 

Also Ascacibar and Paredes boom 2 midfielders better than Modric.


----------



## Evilo

Ivan13 said:


> The point is that he is a surefire top 1 or 2 midfielder in the world. Likely means that there is something to argue there, do tell who in their right mind is going to argue against Modrić not being at worst the 2nd best in the world?



Yes it's likely, as in the majority of cases. Some people will like more offensive players (KDB) or more defensive players (Busquets).
So yeah, except for Messi and Ronaldo I think it's very possible someone doesn't rate a player top 2. Nothing outlandish in that.


----------



## maclean

Roberto given a four-game ban for the Marcelo tap. Barcelona is appealing


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

maclean said:


> Roberto given a four-game ban for the Marcelo tap. Barcelona is appealing



It's appalling... Ramos had something similar with greater intent and got nothing.

Messi has to be subbed off there's nothing else to play for. Come on man!


----------



## kov

Real Madrid FC have clearly locked up all their fucks safely away back home.

Nobody gives any at el Sanchez Pizjuan tonight.


----------



## les Habs

Finally caught up with the Clasico. Very pleased with the team's performance all things considered. It barely looked as though they were down a man for half the match. 

As for the post match drama, despite Ramos' bullshit laden narrative, I don't doubt for a second that Messi had a go at the ref during halftime. More power to him and Messi was right to do so considering the refs performance. Messi isn't afraid to call out the bullshit refereeing. Hilarious how Messi not only emasculated Ramos on the pitch yet again but also now off of it as well. Proud as always of Pique as well for calling it like it is. 


Sadly didn't get a chance to see today's match (yet). I did take a look at the goals though and Dembele looked well involved. Thrilled to see him on the score sheet and he essentially assisted Coutinho. Nice golazo from Dembele too. 

Madrid match looks very interesting on paper. Madrid down 3-0. Ramos, who has been sent off how many times in his career and who should have been sent at least twice as much as that figure, gets his first yellow card. Now whether or not that really should have been his first or his fifth, I don't know. He then scores an own goal. The Madrid score, but they also get a penalty in the 94th minute that he scores. Again, didn't see the match, but you've got to love it on paper and I can only imagine what went on.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

Dembele having a bad season was one of the dumbest takes in European football this season. Glad those people are now stepping back from that ludicrous take.


----------



## les Habs

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> Dembele having a bad season was one of the dumbest takes in European football this season. Glad those people are now stepping back from that ludicrous take.




I never said this. I'd also add the speculation of him going to Liverpool is quite ridiculous.


----------



## Pavel Buchnevich

les Habs said:


> I never said this. I'd also add the speculation of him going to Liverpool is quite ridiculous.




I named no names.


----------



## les Habs

Pavel Buchnevich said:


> I named no names.




I know you didn't. Just putting it out there that I've always been behind the player thus far.


----------



## YNWA14

Dembele is one of my favourite talents on the planet. I like him more than Mbappe actually, though it remains to be seen if he can fulfill it anyone giving up on him at this stage seems pretty silly to me. If Barcelona truly would let him go to Liverpool (sounds completely fabricated) that would be welcomed with open arms. Dembele will be a top 5 player in the world at some point in the near future, IMO.


----------



## Evilo

Wow, you never praised him that much until today.
Must be the Liverpool link


----------



## YNWA14

Evilo said:


> Wow, you never praised him that much until today.
> Must be the Liverpool link



Pretty sure I've always had nice things to say about Dembele (except maybe in how he handled leaving Dortmund). I also know he's not coming to Liverpool.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

I sincerely doubt he'll ever be top 5... and Mbappe is clearly better right now. I don't envision that changing.


----------



## Evilo

He can be a top 5 because he has the tools. Will some coach make him more consistant? That's the question. The other question is does he have the brains to take that next step?
Mbappe has all of this. Mbappe will dominate. If placed as striker, he'll beat some other records.


----------



## PansCyans

Unbeaten season in major jeopardy


----------



## Live in the Now

Yeah it's done.


----------



## BKIslandersFan

If Real Madrid wins Champion's League, then its unquestionable Real still ended up having a better year.


----------



## Paulie Gualtieri

I've watched two of the most fun games this season today.


----------



## Bryanbryoil

Who beat Barcelona? Sorry for the ignorance, but my son has gotten into soccer in a big way so I am trying to learn what I can.


----------



## BKIslandersFan

Yikes. Levante needs to hold on here.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

BKIslandersFan said:


> If Real Madrid wins Champion's League, then its unquestionable Real still ended up having a better year.



Lmao no


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

But seriously wtf is this match


----------



## bluesfan94

They almost brought it back


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

It was a nice ride but wow is this ever sad. Without Messi you can't hold it for one game LOL.


----------



## Live in the Now

Yerry Mina was terrible btw. Belongs nowhere near Liverpool that's for sure.


----------



## Power Man

Levante!


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Live in the Now said:


> Yerry Mina was terrible btw. Belongs nowhere near Liverpool that's for sure.




He would fit in well with Lovern though? I don't understand the signing just yet but I'll reserve my judgement later on.



Power Man said:


> Levante!




Scored more goals against barca in today's game than MadridX2 did all season. 

Enjoy being 5th in the league.


----------



## Power Man

^
Lmao


----------



## Cassano

BKIslandersFan said:


> If Real Madrid wins Champion's League, then its unquestionable Real still ended up having a better year.



Champions League is bigger than La Liga, but La Liga is still harder to win. I don't think it's unquestionable.

Real Madrid have been garbage this season objectively speaking. Everyone on their team are having poor seasons except Ronaldo.


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> He would fit in well with Lovern though? I don't understand the signing just yet but I'll reserve my judgement later on.




Nah he would more fit in with a different team entirely. Lovren had a few awful games but I don't think he ever played that bad.


----------



## YNWA14

Lovren's shortcomings have always been overstated. He was made to look a lot worse than he was by the team, and even still his play was better than given credit for.


BKIslandersFan said:


> If Real Madrid wins Champion's League, then its unquestionable Real still ended up having a better year.



Eh...the CL is the biggest trophy but Barcelona dominated LL and won the Copa. I'd say Barca still had the better year.


----------



## les Habs

I've said very little at all about the unbeaten run this season. Even had we done it I think there would have been some context around it. We'd have seen better seasons where the team hadn't been unbeaten. The fact that they'd have had at least 9 draws in the process. Madrid not putting up a challenge. I'm not saying it wouldn't have been noteworthy. It's an impressive feat this day and age and especially in La Liga. Still winning the league is the point and as I noted we've seen more impressive wins than this. That said, when you've got two matches left you take care of business. I've sort of gone from not really caring much at all to being somewhat annoyed that they lost it at this stage. And let me be clear here with whom I'm annoyed. It's Valverde, again. Unless he's hurt, and I don't think he is, you put Messi in the team. It shouldn't have mattered and the players are certainly also accountable, but you put Messi in the squad at the very least. And Valverde is supposedly angry (his words) about losing the unbeaten run.

About the unbeaten run being over played, I'll say what I said about Arsenal back then. They drew 12 matches, which was almost a third of their matches. We've scored almost 25 more goals with a home match still left to be played. We have almost as good a goals against figure (which would be better had they not opened the flood gates for Levante today). It just wasn't as impressive as it was made out to be and had we finished this season unbeaten it probably would have ended up overrating this team relative to it's level by way of performance.



bluesfan94 said:


> They almost brought it back




Yeah, at least they brought it back a bit. That could have been awful. You have to wonder though if Messi had simply been in the team, not necessarily even starting, could they have brought it back?



Live in the Now said:


> Nah he would more fit in with a different team entirely. Lovren had a few awful games but I don't think he ever played that bad.




I would think he'd be a better fit for your lot than us. Either way, per your first post about him, I'd say the jury is still out. He's been a mixed bag. The thing is though he's hardly played. He's played less than 300 minutes in La Liga and probably not much over 300 minutes overall (unless you're factoring in the Copa Catalunya which I think was only one match for him). Yet Pique, who's been playing hurt since at least early February, can't even be rested the majority of the time. Not that it matters because Yerry doesn't even make the squad that much.


----------



## Live in the Now

les Habs said:


> I would think he'd be a better fit for your lot than us. Either way, per your first post about him, I'd say the jury is still out. He's been a mixed bag. The thing is though he's hardly played. He's played less than 300 minutes in La Liga and probably not much over 300 minutes overall (unless you're factoring in the Copa Catalunya which I think was only one match for him). Yet Pique, who's been playing hurt since at least early February, can't even be rested the majority of the time. Not that it matters because Yerry doesn't even make the squad that much.




I think if the player is supposed to play and develop he should be nowhere near either team. Liverpool also does have CB's who I am very comfortable with. I saw a backup who is extremely out of form due to not playing which is what would happen to him at Liverpool. Meanwhile Liverpool has a backup in Klavan who can go months without playing, come back into the team and play well.

There is a team in Liverpool that should take him but it isn't ours. He'd start there too and we'd immediately know if he's good or not.


----------



## les Habs

Live in the Now said:


> I think if the player is supposed to play and develop he should be nowhere near either team. Liverpool also does have CB's who I am very comfortable with. I saw a backup who is extremely out of form due to not playing which is what would happen to him at Liverpool. Meanwhile Liverpool has a backup in Klavan who can go months without playing, come back into the team and play well.
> 
> There is a team in Liverpool that should take him but it isn't ours. He'd start there too and we'd immediately know if he's good or not.




I agree about the playing time and development bit. That's what is so hard with us for example. So many matches that you can't "have a week off" if you will. Like I said in the Premiership, normally it'd be the perfect scenario to call up Alena start Mina, but not today and not with Vermaelen. Anyway, like I said, he's essentially played three matches worth of minutes which isn't enough.


----------



## JeffreyLFC

Yerry Mina was more than awful. He was all over the place and very poor timing. He is big and strong and somehow still looked weak.

Vermaelen is still wih Barca?


----------



## Hadoop

Just found out about the Levante result through my PVR. Wanna thank TSN for this bit of amusement amongst the nonstop hockey coverage.


----------



## Savi

Disgusting tackle on Dembele. Should have been a straight red without a doubt. Could have been a really bad injury as well


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Last game for the best Spanish player from the last 20 years anyway.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

My goodness what a golazo by Couts... out of no where. He's head and shoulders above Dembele, change my mind.


----------



## Live in the Now

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> My goodness what a golazo by Couts... out of no where. He's head and shoulders above Dembele, change my mind.




He's underrated here for some reason. Which is especially odd because he played in the league that usually leads to everyone becoming overrated.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Iniestaaaaa 

_ thought it would be a 90th min sub... I wanted more time. _


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Camp Nou also gave a standing ovation to Xabi Prieto for his last game. Class.


----------



## les Habs

Live in the Now said:


> He's underrated here for some reason. Which is especially odd because he played in the league that usually leads to everyone becoming overrated.




Despite our disagreement about him compared to Dembele, I quite rate Coutinho. He has to come up in more big matches going forward and I'd like to see him be more consistent over the course of 90 minutes, but you really have to respect the season he's had. I mean take what he did for Liverpool out of it, to slot into Barça like that and contribute 11 goals and 6 assists from midfield in half a season without playing in Europe is kind of crazy.


----------



## DatsyukOwns

Demeble has a sprained ankle.

Hopefully he doesn't miss any time with France.


----------



## Live in the Now

les Habs said:


> Despite our disagreement about him compared to Dembele, I quite rate Coutinho. *He has to come up in more big matches going forward* and I'd like to see him be more consistent over the course of 90 minutes, but you really have to respect the season he's had. I mean take what he did for Liverpool out of it, to slot into Barça like that and contribute 11 goals and 6 assists from midfield in half a season without playing in Europe is kind of crazy.




Don't worry because he's going to. He's never really been a 90 minute player but you can pretty much count on him doing something in the big moments. Scored against Arsenal, City, and Everton too many times to count, scored big goals in those United and Dortmund ties, bossed must win games last season...I think he had five or six goals against City or something ludicrous like that, while never playing striker in any of those games. Could even be more

It's not only the goals but with few exceptions he was influential in every big game Liverpool played. The only thing that has changed with Liverpool is more the fact that they seemed to not need his influence as the team is better with everyone playing a part, which is pretty weird all things considered. The only real weakness he has and you can see it on today's goal is that sometimes he holds onto the ball for way too long. When it ends up like that nobody will notice though.


----------



## les Habs

Live in the Now said:


> Don't worry because he's going to. He's never really been a 90 minute player but you can pretty much count on him doing something in the big moments. Scored against Arsenal, City, and Everton too many times to count, scored big goals in those United and Dortmund ties, bossed must win games last season...I think he had five or six goals against City or something ludicrous like that, while never playing striker in any of those games. Could even be more
> 
> It's not only the goals but with few exceptions he was influential in every big game Liverpool played. The only thing that has changed with Liverpool is more the fact that they seemed to not need his influence as the team is better with everyone playing a part, which is pretty weird all things considered. The only real weakness he has and you can see it on today's goal is that sometimes he holds onto the ball for way too long. When it ends up like that nobody will notice though.




Yeah, that's what I'm expecting going forward actually. I think it'll be more difficult with Messi in the side, but he'll have plenty of opportunities. He's already in a good position with the transfer happening in the January window as he can hit the ground running next season. Exactly how he's been for us too in terms of coming up with a big moment.


----------



## Islesfan22

Ivan13 said:


> The point is that he is a surefire top 1 or 2 midfielder in the world. Likely means that there is something to argue there, do tell who in their right mind is going to argue against Modrić not being at worst the 2nd best in the world?



Anyone who would argue Modric not being best midfielder in the world last few years is clueless to football. Lots of stat watching fan boys who have no idea how good Modric is. Or Barca hating fans but most respect how good luka is.


----------



## spintheblackcircle

Just something cool


----------



## Albatros

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> Iniestaaaaa
> 
> _ thought it would be a 90th min sub... I wanted more time. _




He took the time for himself, Camp Nou after 1 AM:


----------



## YNWA14

Albatros said:


> He took the time for himself, Camp Nou after 1 AM:



Heartbreaking photo. Iniesta is and was an incredible player, and was a huge part of Barcelona being easily the best team in the world over the last decade. It must have been very emotional for him.

Coutinho will benefit a lot from the space he gets playing for Barca because of Messi and co. He's going to do well for Barcelona, but I don't think he's going to be someone they can rely on to fire them to continental trophies. Luckily they have Messi and Dembele though (potentiall Griezmann?). Really interested to see how they shape that team moving forward with Messi aging and Neymar gone now.


----------



## Corto

YNWA14 said:


> Really interested to see how they shape that team moving forward with Messi aging and Neymar gone now.




There's a meme going around with Busquets and Rakitic running themselves into the ground in a starting 11 featuring Messi, Dembele, Suarez, Coutinho and Griezmann.


----------



## S E P H

Good riddance that Barca lost. Would've been a complete travesty if they somehow had a defeat-less season considering how meaninglessly it would be compared to The Invincibles. Especially considering how it would've been due to only money and actually not due to anything else. Thankfully, however, they got beat a scrub club to keep the true Invincibles record a record.


----------



## les Habs

S E P H said:


> Good riddance that Barca lost. Would've been a complete travesty if they somehow had a defeat-less season considering how meaninglessly it would be compared to The Invincibles considering how it would've been due to money and actually not due to anything else. Thankfully, however, they got beat a scrub club to keep the true Invincibles record a record.




LOL. Jerry Lee says "whole lotta sephin' going on today."


Just because Arsenal didn't spend a lot on that side relative to what Barça has spent on this side, it doesn't mean they didn't bring in good players. In fact Arsenal have hardly been able to produce a worth-while homegrown player for a very long time and they're few and far between when compared to us. Messi, Busquets, Pique, Alba and Sergi all played big roles in winning the Double this season and that's not to mention Iniesta.
You can have your jammy "Invicibles" nonsense. I'll take a Double, and especially this one, over just an undefeated season all day long. Like I said then and like I've been saying now, for all the hype around the "Invicibles" there is very little by way of the trophy case to show for it.
Let's compare seasons shall we? Your precious "Invicibles" went undefeated, but had fewer wins, fewer points, fewer goals scored and only 3 fewer goals against. That's not to mention the 12 draws. Color me not that impressed as compared to the narrative. And again, that's not to mention the lack of a Cup. 
Yeah, shitty Levante who held Madrid to two points this season and who also took points off of Valencia and Sevilla. Lord only knows what they'd do to Arsenal.

I get it. You started supporting Arsenal when it looked like they would rule the World for a long time. You're not the only one as a lot of people did. So I understand desperately clinging to an undefeated season, which also just happens to be your last league win from 14 years ago, since your club has done nothing much of note since then. I also understand your jealousy of Barça as it too is a common trait of the Gooner. After all we took that Invicibles side and beat them in the CL Final. Your best "homegrown player" for a very long time just happened to be more a product of La Masia instead. A lot of your best players consistently dump you for a chance to play at Barça even though few are wanted or good enough despite being some of the best you've got. And Arsenal were somehow supposed to be what Barça actually were in the 2000s. So again, I get it. Still you should do yourself a favor and not spout such nonsense publicly.


----------



## Moncherry

S E P H said:


> Good riddance that Barca lost. Would've been a complete travesty if they somehow had a defeat-less season considering how meaninglessly it would be compared to The Invincibles. Especially considering how it would've been due to only money and actually not due to anything else. Thankfully, however, they got beat a scrub club to keep the true Invincibles record a record.




As if the reason Arsenal attracts foreign players, or any other Prem club for that matter, is for anything other than money.


----------



## S E P H

les Habs said:


> LOL. Jerry Lee says "whole lotta sephin' going on today."
> 
> Just because Arsenal didn't spend a lot on that side relative to what Barça has spent on this side, it doesn't mean they didn't bring in good players. In fact Arsenal have hardly been able to produce a worth-while homegrown player for a very long time and they're few and far between when compared to us. Messi, Busquets, Pique, Alba and Sergi all played big roles in winning the Double this season and that's not to mention Iniesta.



Jerry Lee? Is that the guy who played the old dude in Jurassic Park? Agreed, which is why Wenger was let go and Emery who has a great track record with young players from youth squads was hired.


> You can have your jammy "Invicibles" nonsense. I'll take a Double, and especially this one, over just an undefeated season all day long. Like I said then and like I've been saying now, for all the hype around the "Invicibles" there is very little by way of the trophy case to show for it.



Two trophies are always better than one, however Invincible was legendary and will continue due to the parity of the EPL at the time before money got involved. Barca simply overpower squads in La Liga with money alone and that factors in a lot with the aura and accomplishment. Winning in the parity of the 2000's is simply more meaningful than Barca doing the double. Excluding Barca fans nobody will remember Barcelona winning the double 15 years from now, but people will continue to remember the Invincible season.



> Let's compare seasons shall we? Your precious "Invicibles" went undefeated, but had fewer wins, fewer points, fewer goals scored and only 3 fewer goals against. That's not to mention the 12 draws. Color me not that impressed as compared to the narrative. And again, that's not to mention the lack of a Cup.



Sure all of those are accurate points you bring up, but again you're not factoring in the money. Football's parity was much prevalent back when Arsenal had their undefeated season. Barca just bought a bench player for like 103.50 million pounds based off the records by Transfermarkt. 103 ****ing million pounds for a freckin bench player. Your team might have sustained more wins, but as I said above, your club's budget simply overpowers the rest of the league. You can make the case that a win in the early 2000's is more meaningful than Barca raining 4-0 beat downs to the likes of Celta, Leganes, Las Palmas, and Malaga.


> Yeah, ****ty Levante who held Madrid to two points this season and who also took points off of Valencia and Sevilla. Lord only knows what they'd do to Arsenal.



I actually gotta give you guys some credit for not losing to Atletico, Real, or Valencia. Especially in that Godawful match at Camp Nou with the absurd red card and lack of one on Bale. That is quite impressive, but then losing to Levante the way you did sort of counteracts everything that was impressive on the season. Levante is a scrub club employing Moaninho tactics, you should've beat them.


> I get it. You started supporting Arsenal when it looked like they would rule the World for a long time. You're not the only one as a lot of people did. So I understand desperately clinging to an undefeated season, which also just happens to be your last league win from 14 years ago, since your club has done nothing much of note since then. I also understand your jealousy of Barça as it too is a common trait of the Gooner. After all we took that Invicibles side and beat them in the CL Final. Your best "homegrown player" for a very long time just happened to be more a product of La Masia instead. A lot of your best players consistently dump you for a chance to play at Barça even though few are wanted or good enough despite being some of the best you've got. And Arsenal were somehow supposed to be what Barça actually were in the 2000s. So again, I get it. Still you should do yourself a favor and not spout such nonsense publicly.



I actually didn't cheer for the Arsenal because of The Invincible, the first season I started routing for the Gunners was a Godawful team that had the likes of Djourou, Gallas, Bendtner, Arshavin, Vermaelen, Walcott, and Squillaci which eventually turned into Chamakh, Song, Santos, and Park (the legend himself). Only good players we had were a prime Rosicky, RvP, and Fabregas who was pretty much rumoured to go back to Barca every single season. You can call me a true fan who came in at probably the darkest time since that was the beginning of the end. I also didn't become a plastic fan like people choosing United because they had Ronaldo or Barca because they were a five star team in FIFA as some of you did. Furthermore, you're cutting out some of the context here, Arsenal's best players left because the club along with Wenger were too cheap to pay aging players more than a one year deal. So because of that, we did lose our Invincible side to pretty much the poachers of Europe who get money from tax payers, so they have endless streams of funds.


----------



## les Habs

S E P H said:


> Jerry Lee? Is that the guy who played the old dude in Jurassic Park? Agreed, which is why Wenger was let go and Emery who has a great track record with young players from youth squads was hired.




Not sure why you're so excited about Emery. Seeing Wenger finally go only to get Emery in as his replacement seems like a letdown to me.



> Two trophies are always better than one, however Invincible was legendary and will continue due to the parity of the EPL at the time before money got involved. Barca simply overpower squads in La Liga with money alone and that factors in a lot with the aura and accomplishment. Winning in the parity of the 2000's is simply more meaningful than Barca doing the double. Excluding Barca fans nobody will remember Barcelona winning the double 15 years from now, but people will continue to remember the Invincible season.




Like I said, it wasn't really legendary. We've seen better Premiership campaigns since then. And 12 draws? Before money got involved? Money was already involved back then.

To say we simply overpower squads in La Liga with money alone is really hypocritical considering Arsenal's squad compared to the majority of England. The Summer before the 03-04 season they spent a ton on Reyes. And as I already said, spending aside they had Henry, Vieira, Campbell (who they had to fork over a ton in wages for), Bergkamp, etc. They had World Class players compared to their opponents regardless of how much they spend to get them.

Fifteen years removed I don't just sit around and think about Arsenal's 03-04 season. I remember it in that I know it and lived it, but I generally need to be triggered to actually think about it. The only people who probably actually think about Arsenal's season are Arsenal supporters. And at the end of the day there's the context that there have been multiple better seasons, like Barça's this season, despite teams not being undefeated. Like I said, 12 draws.



> Sure all of those are accurate points you bring up, but again you're not factoring in the money. Football's parity was much prevalent back when Arsenal had their undefeated season. Barca just bought a bench player for like 103.50 million pounds based off the records by Transfermarkt. 103 ****ing million pounds for a freckin bench player. Your team might have sustained more wins, but as I said above, your club's budget simply overpowers the rest of the league. You can make the case that a win in the early 2000's is more meaningful than Barca raining 4-0 beat downs to the likes of Celta, Leganes, Las Palmas, and Malaga.




So when will you be posting in the CL thread that Madrid spent about 100 million on a bench player? Anyway, the league back then wasn't easier than La Liga this season. You didn't have to face a side remotely close to Madrid and quite frankly there probably wasn't a side as good as Atleti either. Those are the respective CL and Europa League winners for the record.



> I actually gotta give you guys some credit for not losing to Atletico, Real, or Valencia. Especially in that Godawful match at Camp Nou with the absurd red card and lack of one on Bale. That is quite impressive, but then losing to Levante the way you did sort of counteracts everything that was impressive on the season. Levante is a scrub club employing Moaninho tactics, you should've beat them.




LOL. So one loss which didn't prevent the club from winning a Double and where the club finished 17 points ahead of the CL winners and 14 points ahead of the Europa League winners "counteracts everything that was impressive on the season"??? Right. Well 12 draws, fewer points, fewer goals and fewer wins in a weaker league that didn't have the CL winner or the Uefa Cup winner easily puts Arsenal's undefeated season into context. 

Like I said, Levante who held Madrid to two points this season and who also took points off of Valencia and Sevilla. And when you compare Levante to sides in the 03-04 season, Spurs are quite comparable. Spurs. So that's how good the competition was in the Premiership that season.



> I actually didn't cheer for the Arsenal because of The Invincible, the first season I started routing for the Gunners was a Godawful team that had the likes of Djourou, Gallas, Bendtner, Arshavin, Vermaelen, Walcott, and Squillaci which eventually turned into Chamakh, Song, Santos, and Park (the legend himself). Only good players we had were a prime Rosicky, RvP, and Fabregas who was pretty much rumoured to go back to Barca every single season. You can call me a true fan who came in at probably the darkest time since that was the beginning of the end. I also didn't become a plastic fan like people choosing United because they had Ronaldo or Barca because they were a five star team in FIFA as some of you did. Furthermore, you're cutting out some of the context here, Arsenal's best players left because the club along with Wenger were too cheap to pay aging players more than a one year deal. So because of that, we did lose our Invincible side to pretty much the poachers of Europe who get money from tax payers, so they have endless streams of funds.




LOL. I've been supporting Barça for almost 20 years. When I started supporting the club they had 1 CL win. I've also lived through a lot of lean years and have actually been a paying supporter. 

You lost a lot of the undefeated side because a guy like Henry was tired of the club being incapable of winning the CL.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

les Habs said:


> LOL. Jerry Lee says "whole lotta sephin' going on today."
> 
> 
> Just because Arsenal didn't spend a lot on that side relative to what Barça has spent on this side, it doesn't mean they didn't bring in good players. In fact Arsenal have hardly been able to produce a worth-while homegrown player for a very long time and they're few and far between when compared to us. Messi, Busquets, Pique, Alba and Sergi all played big roles in winning the Double this season and that's not to mention Iniesta.
> You can have your jammy "Invicibles" nonsense. I'll take a Double, and especially this one, over just an undefeated season all day long. Like I said then and like I've been saying now, for all the hype around the "Invicibles" there is very little by way of the trophy case to show for it.
> Let's compare seasons shall we? Your precious "Invicibles" went undefeated, but had fewer wins, fewer points, fewer goals scored and only 3 fewer goals against. That's not to mention the 12 draws. Color me not that impressed as compared to the narrative. And again, that's not to mention the lack of a Cup.
> Yeah, ****ty Levante who held Madrid to two points this season and who also took points off of Valencia and Sevilla. Lord only knows what they'd do to Arsenal.
> 
> I get it. You started supporting Arsenal when it looked like they would rule the World for a long time. You're not the only one as a lot of people did. So I understand desperately clinging to an undefeated season, which also just happens to be your last league win from 14 years ago, since your club has done nothing much of note since then. I also understand your jealousy of Barça as it too is a common trait of the Gooner. After all we took that Invicibles side and beat them in the CL Final. Your best "homegrown player" for a very long time just happened to be more a product of La Masia instead. A lot of your best players consistently dump you for a chance to play at Barça even though few are wanted or good enough despite being some of the best you've got. And Arsenal were somehow supposed to be what Barça actually were in the 2000s. So again, I get it. Still you should do yourself a favor and not spout such nonsense publicly.




Savage


----------



## Hadoop

les Habs said:


> I've been supporting Barça for almost 20 years. When I started supporting the club they had 1 CL win. I've also lived through a lot of lean years and have actually been a paying supporter.




As Vasilevskiy correctly stated above you are savage, but this part of your post has gotta be some kind of sick joke. 'A lot of lean years'?? Barca has 10 La Liga titles, 10 appearances in the semi-finals of the Champions League and have finished first or second in the league 16 times in the last 20 years. You sir are the personification of entitlement.


----------



## les Habs

Hadoop said:


> As Vasilevskiy correctly stated above you are savage, but this part of your post has gotta be some kind of sick joke. 'A lot of lean years'?? Barca has 10 La Liga titles, 10 appearances in the semi-finals of the Champions League and have finished first or second in the league 16 times in the last 20 years. You sir are the personification of entitlement.




 I'm anything but savage. Especially at the moment. I think @Vasilevskiy meant it as a compliment (kids and their slang these days) or he was trying to give me a subtle nod as to who I should draft in the Wrestling draft. Little does he know, much like with Sergio Ramos I don't like the Macho Man. Still he's a big fan of mine. (OK, that sounds very Trumpesque. Hopefully the humor here is noted). Who else does he know that calls him a Madridista with any regularity much less at all? 

"A lot" was the wrong way to put it. Some would have been better. Perhaps it felt longer considering how bad the team was then relative to how good they should have been. Either way, 2000-03 were not very good seasons. 02-03 was quite dreadful in fact. Even Rijkaard's first season looked awful at the midway point of the season. Fortunately the club turned that one around. Thing is this was right after I realized Barça were my club and by the end of the 02-3 season I had seen more poor seasons than I had good ones. That's not to mention that van Gaal's first stint was unbeknownst to me at the time not even considered that good for the club despite the trophies. Fortunately I've had the pleasure of knowing Cules older than I and who supported the club before I did to help set me straight on what the team should look and play like. 

Entitlement? Nothing you quoted suggests that. Not sure if you understand it or not. As for the 10 league titles, really should be 13, but I've also had to see some titles taken away too.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Yeah, it was more like a compliment 

Been a few busy weeks in Germany for me, not much time to surf in the boards and I missed rhe arguments


----------



## Deficient Mode




----------



## les Habs

Deficient Mode said:


>




What's the problem? You were thinking it should be Ruiz? In all seriousness, we can commiserate. I mean he should have never been playing for BVB in the first place. At the end of the day I'm just happy for him.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Mind blowing that he is playing for betis.


----------



## PansCyans

Puyol said something similar on his Twitter too. Despite winning the domestic double double, its clear who a couple of Barca legends, and pros in general feel had the better season between Madrid and Barca, in a historical context. 

Madrid have a winning gene and Barca are asleep – Xavi


----------



## les Habs

Curious as to what others think about this and I am one who often times doesn't like messing with tradition, but the new head of the RFEF has mentioned the Supercopa going down a single match. My initial reaction is quite positive as I think the two-legged affair has a toll on it's participants. The only issue I see is finding a venue every year as there is no Wembley and when the Bernabeu should be hosting they're suddenly upgrading the urinals or what have you.


----------



## Savi

Watch them sell the thing like France or Italy and play the Supercopa in Qatar or something

in Belgium the champions host the cup winner and I always thought that was the best thing to do


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Watch them sell the thing like France or Italy and play the Supercopa in Qatar or something
> 
> in Belgium the champions host the cup winner and I always thought that was the best thing to do




Well he also bemoaned the spending, so hopefully it doesn't got down that road!

That's actually a fantastic idea.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

The idea of the super cup, world club cup and the other fake tournaments or preseason tournaments should be scraped. Please and thank you.


----------



## les Habs

Where is the damn Unlike button!  I like the Super Cups. I suppose I could do with the World Club Cup though.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

les Habs said:


> W*here is the damn Unlike button*!  I like the Super Cups. I suppose I could do with the World Club Cup though.




Agreed.

I can stomach the super cup but everything else is pointless. Especially the WCC going into another continent in the middle of the season to play 3 meaningless games. f***ing pointless and counterproductive.


----------



## Ivan13

Barca reportedly caught negotiating with Griezmann without Atletico's approval. They could land a transfer ban spanning over 5 transfer windows for their transgression. Barca is highly unlikely the only one doing this, but at least the others don't have a complete moron for a president who at his own volition admitted they spoke to Griezmann's agent without approval from his club.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Ivan13 said:


> Barca reportedly caught negotiating with Griezmann without Atletico's approval. They could land a transfer ban spanning over 5 transfer windows for their transgression. Barca is highly unlikely the only one doing this, but at least the others don't have a complete moron for a president who at his own volition admitted they spoke to Griezmann's agent without approval from his club.




Nope but other teams just make public statements apologizing for their actions regarding a transfer then pull the same crap the next window.

If this gets them FIVE windows banned it should be obvious as who's behind it.


----------



## les Habs

Duchene2MacKinnon said:


> If this gets them FIVE windows banned it should be obvious as who's behind it.




Clearly, but you can't fault them. I mean if you can't beat 'em even with the refs you've got to find some way.


----------



## les Habs

Alena will be out three months due to injury.


----------



## Hadoop

So Griezmann is staying at Atletico. WOOOO!!


----------



## KJS14

Anyone know how difficult it would be to get Supercopa final tickets in August? Currently planning a trip to Europe and Barcelona is on the list, so that would be awesome to see.


----------



## les Habs

KJS14 said:


> Anyone know how difficult it would be to get Supercopa final tickets in August? Currently planning a trip to Europe and Barcelona is on the list, so that would be awesome to see.




I would think it wouldn't be too difficult. A lot of good seats in the Camp Nou as well.


----------



## SegzKnightlySpoons

KJS14 said:


> Anyone know how difficult it would be to get Supercopa final tickets in August? Currently planning a trip to Europe and Barcelona is on the list, so that would be awesome to see.




It is easy getting tickets at Camp Nou to any game so long as they are not a Clasico or a Champions League knockout stage game. Do not overpay on third party sites, just be patient and purchase tickets on the official site (they may only release the days leading up to the match, but I can pretty much guarantee you will find good seats). 

Also, if you take the metro there be sure to also have a ticket for the way back or else you will be waiting for awhile in line to buy tickets.


----------



## les Habs

RFEF proposing a single match for the Super Cup, but Sevilla say they will only do it if it's at the Sanchez Pizjuan.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

KJS14 said:


> Anyone know how difficult it would be to get Supercopa final tickets in August? Currently planning a trip to Europe and Barcelona is on the list, so that would be awesome to see.




It is easy. Good tickets are expensive though


----------



## KJS14

Vasilevskiy said:


> It is easy. Good tickets are expensive though




I'll probably be trying to get as cheap as possible. The experience itself will just be cool, even if it's not the best seat. 



les Habs said:


> RFEF proposing a single match for the Super Cup, but Sevilla say they will only do it if it's at the Sanchez Pizjuan.




This could make things more difficult.


----------



## les Habs

Looks like the Super Cup will be a one-off match. Can't blame Sevilla for their frustration. If they're going to move to that format they need to put down the road at least a year to be fair. 



KJS14 said:


> Anyone know how difficult it would be to get Supercopa final tickets in August? Currently planning a trip to Europe and Barcelona is on the list, so that would be awesome to see.




Sounds like it could be played away from the Camp Nou as a result of the above.


----------



## robertmac43

Question for avid LA LIGA viewers. Does anyone here use DAZN and if so is it worth it?


----------



## Savi

Supercopa tonight.. Barça and Sevilla. In Morocco 

Anyways, lineups..

Barça going with MATS, Semedo, Pique, Lenglet and Alba; Busquets, Rafinha and Arthur; Dembele, Messi and Suarez
Cillessen, Umtiti, Juan Miranda, Vidal, Rakitic, Coutinho and Munir on the bench. Malcom left out.

Sevilla playing with Vaclik, Mercado, Kjaer, Sergi Gomez, Jesus Navas, Escudero, Banega, Roque Mesa, Vazquez, Sarabia and Muriel
Milan loanee Andre Silva is on the bench


----------



## les Habs

I think Malcom was left out because he'd be a fourth non-EU player. Shouldn't have mattered since the federation said it'd be alright, but Sevilla threatened a protest or something.


----------



## Evilo

No Coutinho now has portugese nationality.


----------



## Savi

They still have 4 though because of Marlon.


----------



## les Habs

Legit goal for Sevilla thanks to VAR. 

Wow, Dembele out on the left? Didn't think Valverde was on HFBoards.


----------



## Savi

Terrible defending from Lenglet.


----------



## Evilo

les Habs said:


> Legit goal for Sevilla thanks to VAR.
> 
> Wow, Dembele out on the left? Didn't think Valverde was on HFBoards.



Dembele can play on the left, right, center or even midfield.


----------



## les Habs

Not a bad first half. They look a bit slow out there though. Not sure why he started Messi, Suarez and Dembele. I think this is their first match back. Malcom should have started on the right and he's not even in the lineup but of course Munir is. Anyway, since they are playing, Messi and Suarez need to move off the ball. Too often just standing around watching. Dembele looking good on the left as he can help break though Sevilla who are 10-11 behind the ball, but he needs someone to pass it to. Valverde needs to get Rafinha making runs into the box too. And why have Suarez setting up to take the free kick when you know he isn't taking it? He can poach a loose ball. Fortunately Gerry did just that as we needed a goal going into the half.



Evilo said:


> Dembele can play on the left, right, center or even midfield.




Not sure why I'm reading this considering the post you quoted and the fact that I've been calling for Dembele to be played on the left since the day we signed him.


----------



## les Habs

And with all the pissing and moaning Sevilla did about the Supercopa not being two legs, I'd say it's working out quite well for them thus far.


----------



## Savi

Rafinha has been poor, can't see him having a real future at the club. He'd be a solid player for a Sevilla but he just doesn't have that.. I don't even know how to describe it, maybe extra gear or something, to be a player Barça can count on. 

Arthur has been a bit quiet as well, like he's afraid to make a mistake. However it's clear all ths tools are there.


----------



## les Habs

Savi said:


> Rafinha has been poor, can't see him having a real future at the club. He'd be a solid player for a Sevilla but he just doesn't have that.. I don't even know how to describe it, maybe extra gear or something, to be a player Barça can count on.
> 
> Arthur has been a bit quiet as well, like he's afraid to make a mistake. However it's clear all ths tools are there.




I don't think Rafinha's been poor. He's been mixed for me. Either way I'd say it's very clear he has a future at the club. He can play so many positions and he's better than the squad players we've had the past few years. 

Arthur has been safe, but he hasn't been bad. Look at where he's receiving the ball and look at who is in front of him. He has 10 Sevilla players in front of him most of the time and our players aren't making much by way of runs.

For me it's Messi and Suarez who haven't been impressing much.


----------



## Evilo

les Habs said:


> Not sure why I'm reading this considering the post you quoted and the fact that I've been calling for Dembele to be played on the left since the day we signed him.



Ah sorry missed that.


----------



## les Habs

Suarez's touch has been so heavy tonight. At least five plays where he's taken way too heavy a touch. That said it looked like he was fouled in the box.



Evilo said:


> Ah sorry missed that.




Not a problem. Just frustrating that Valverde played him on the right all the time last season.


----------



## les Habs

Dembele has to do better with that chance. Still a good player and another chance created.


----------



## les Habs

That's it. Get Suarez out of there.


----------



## Savi

Dembele 

He's deserved that


----------



## les Habs

Excellent goal by Dembele. So needed too.


----------



## TheLeastOfTheBunch

Holy hell that strike from Dembele. He’s been great today


----------



## les Habs

Thank God that was such a horribly taken penalty. 

Dembele was our best player if you ask me. Suarez or worst. Team is lacking fitness from some of the guys and hopefully Valverde isn't overdoing it with the guys who just returned.


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Dembele was fantastic.


----------



## Savi

Semedo was very good as well. 

But yeah plenty of stuff to work on. Especially the lack of movement that LH was talking about. Dembele and at times Semedo really the only ones causing panic in Sevilla's backline.


----------



## Corto

At some point, if Suarez continues to sink, Valverde's gonna have to man up and sit him, regardless of it potentially angering his BFF Messi.

On the bright side, Dembele was great. If he can keep this going (no reason why he shouldn't), he'll win himself a starting spot.

Rakitic Busquets Messi Coutinho Suarez

Are the 5 certain starters in midfield and attack, for now.
As it is, Dembele's got a strangle hold on that 6th spot.


----------



## Evilo

Amazing stat I read this morning :

Dembele's left foot
12 goals, 17 assists

Dembele's right foot 
16 goals, 16 assists


----------



## Vasilevskiy

Sunday's game was a prime example that he is great with both feet. So many different plays where he played the ball with both


----------



## Savi

Corto said:


> At some point, if Suarez continues to sink, Valverde's gonna have to man up and sit him, regardless of it potentially angering his BFF Messi.




Yeah the decline already set in last season so I imagine this will continue and it will probably Suarez' last season as the main striker. By next season he'll turn 33 and can be a decent backup to keep Messi happy. Summer 2019 should be about getting a new striker.


----------



## les Habs

Barça announced their captains for the upcoming season the other day:

Messi
Busquets
Pique
Sergi

Personally I would swap Messi with Pique or Busquets. Great to see Sergi on the list though.



Savi said:


> Yeah the decline already set in last season so I imagine this will continue and it will probably Suarez' last season as the main striker. By next season he'll turn 33 and can be a decent backup to keep Messi happy. Summer 2019 should be about getting a new striker.




He still had what overall I would call a very good season in the league. Anyway, it's his first match back so I'd say to cut him some slack. I agree though, next Summer we'll need to consider a replacement. I just don't think he'll stick around for a rotational role. He's too competitive.


----------



## SJSharks72

les Habs said:


> Barça announced their captains for the upcoming season the other day:
> 
> Messi
> Busquets
> Pique
> Sergi
> 
> Personally I would swap Messi with Pique or Busquets. Great to see Sergi on the list though.
> 
> 
> 
> He still had what overall I would call a very good season in the league. Anyway, it's his first match back so I'd say to cut him some slack. I agree though, next Summer we'll need to consider a replacement. I just don't think he'll stick around for a rotational role. He's too competitive.



Atletico did too.

Godín
Koke
Griezmann
Juanfran


----------



## les Habs

Alena back training with the first team.


----------



## Scouter

Looks to be a fair bit of love for Atletico taking the title this season, their starters are quite nice, but depth is an issue, not sure how they will hold up, this season though the Barca-RM hold may be broken by them or someone else.


----------



## Savi

Someone else??


----------



## Scouter

Savi said:


> Someone else??




Yes, Valencia, Villarreal, Real Betis and Sevilla all recruited strongly this summer.


----------



## Savi

Yeah but there's zero % chance one of those teams will be in the title race.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

Costa emasculates Ramos and Varane. What a goal


----------



## YNWA14

Figure I'll just post here since it's Real vs. Atletico anyway, but Diego Costa just scored a beauty 1 minute into the UEFA Supercup game. Both teams have put out really strong teams.


----------



## Duchene2MacKinnon

That messi chip was vintage Lio circa 2010.

Watching him is 90 minutes of euphoria.


----------



## BB88

Beautiful Bale  and Benzema scores.

Real's offense looks still scary, hopefully more versatile than before.


----------



## YNWA14

Really nice cross in from Bale on his right foot. Thought the keeper should have stopped the header but still a nice finish from Benzema.

Nice play from Asensio there...nearly a goal.


----------



## BB88

Bale's passing this pre season has been on fire.

If he keeps this up I need to raise my expectations for this season.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

BB88 said:


> Bale's passing this pre season has been on fire.
> 
> If he keeps this up I need to raise my expectations for this season.




Bale has been fire period during preseason. Hope he can carry this form into the season and... most importantly... STAY HEALTHY!

#TeamBale


----------



## BB88

Scandale du Jour said:


> Bale has been fire period during preseason. Hope he can carry this form into the season and... most importantly... STAY HEALTHY!
> 
> #TeamBale




They really look like a team that could be more versatile, better as a team.
Fresh looking team.


----------



## Savi

Costa again. Fun game.


----------



## DrMartinVanNostrand

BB88 said:


> They really look like a team that could be more versatile, better as a team.
> Fresh looking team.




I've written elsewhere that, in essence, I would find it fool-hardy and dangerous to suggest that they could be a better team without Ronaldo; I think that's just criminally underselling Ronaldo's contribution and his mentality that he brought to the squad. But, there will be bigger roles for some of their key players to step into. How they'll do in those roles will determine their ultimate outcome(s) this season.

This Real Madrid season, coming in, feels so similar to how Barcelona felt coming into last season, to me. And all Barca did last year was win a domestic double without breaking a sweat. I don't think for one second Real Madrid has the same likelihood to do that, but I do expect them to win one trophy from the Copa/Liga/UCL competitions.

--

Atleti ties it as I write this. Good timing.


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## Vasilevskiy

Marcelo is so f***ing good, but he has brainfarts. Sometimes costly ones. 

This was one of them


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## Savi

Woah, Saul


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## DrMartinVanNostrand

Not one of Ramos' better moments there.


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## Power Man

Shit

Nice gol


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## Savi

Saul only scores brilliant goals.


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## Power Man

Our D is amazing





I lied


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## BB88

DrMartinVanNostrand said:


> I've written elsewhere that, in essence, I would find it fool-hardy and dangerous to suggest that they could be a better team without Ronaldo; I think that's just criminally underselling Ronaldo's contribution and his mentality that he brought to the squad. But, there will be bigger roles for some of their key players to step into. How they'll do in those roles will determine their ultimate outcome(s) this season.
> 
> This Real Madrid season, coming in, feels so similar to how Barcelona felt coming into last season, to me. And all Barca did last year was win a domestic double without breaking a sweat. I don't think for one second Real Madrid has the same likelihood to do that, but I do expect them to win one trophy from the Copa/Liga/UCL competitions.
> 
> --
> 
> Atleti ties it as I write this. Good timing.




I have 0 Cup expectations right now.

Losing Ronaldo hurts of course, he was the king inside the box, but healthy prime Bale can be one of the best in the World as well, with him it's though important another guy like Asensio is ready to step up as well.
Bale has shown he can be better, more versatile player outside the box today than Ronaldo 16-17, there's no 1 player Real will look for in every attack.

Who knows how good they can be in a long regular season because of it, in Champions league losing Ronaldo hurts more.


Defense has been absolutely terrible since my post, and I don't like how Vinicius has gotten 10 mins of game time in the last 2 games combined, the kid needs to play and hopefully he'll get regulat minutes once the regular season starts.


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## Live in the Now

Lol at Chelsea getting rid of Costa.


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## Corto

Why couldn't Varane play like this in the WC final?


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## Power Man

It's going to be a long season


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## Cassano

Atletico is just simply better IMO. They have a chance at winning La Liga or UCL. 

RM replaced one of the best scorers ever with nobody.


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## DrMartinVanNostrand

All Might said:


> Atletico is just simply better IMO. They have a chance at winning La Liga or UCL.
> 
> RM replaced one of the best scorers ever with nobody.




In no small part because a Ronaldo replacement didn't exist. The ones who could weren't for sale. The ones for sale would cost too much and not be good enough. No amount of money was going to create that player into existence. Flo and Madrid were better off saving that money for another transfer window.

--

I'm in a prediction league on another website. I predicted Atletí to win the Champions League. All the pieces are in place for a multifaceted approach. They're loaded.


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## Cassano

They're going into the season with a washed up Benzema as their only striker. They could easily been more aggressive with their approach for a Cavani, Icardi, Aubameyang, etc.


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## BB88

All Might said:


> Atletico is just simply better IMO. They have a chance at winning La Liga or UCL.
> 
> RM replaced one of the best scorers ever with nobody.




I thought there were good amount of times when Real was better.

They just got killed by their defensive collapses tonight.


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## John Pedro

Live in the Now said:


> Lol at Chelsea getting rid of Costa.




better than chosing FRED over him


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## DrMartinVanNostrand

All Might said:


> They're going into the season with a washed up Benzema as their only striker. They could easily been more aggressive with their approach for a Cavani, Icardi, Aubameyang, etc.




Cavani or Lewandowski would've been excellent short-term options before trying to make another push for Mbappe in a few years, I do agree. But neither of their clubs were willing to sell them, and their clubs have the same goals in their leagues and Europe that Real Madrid does. 

Icardi is Inter's captain and Inter finally made it back to the Champions League this year. I don't think Icardi would've felt like leaving. That said, he did have a 110M Euro release clause up until 7/15, and Real Madrid didn't exercise it even though Ronaldo had left a week or so before that release clause expired. They could've pushed their luck when Inter had no control. They didn't. That's a fair enough point. I still would be of the belief that Icardi would've stuck it out with Inter, finally being where they want to be after spending so many years (the club and Icardi personally) plucking away at getting there.

I don't imagine Auba would've been sold one transfer window after Arsenal paid big to get him. Even if they were, Real has never had much interest in him. It's one of his heartbreak's, really; he's always wanted to go to Madrid, but for one reason or another, they've just never rated him as being the type of striker they either need or feel would fit their set-up. Now that he's closing to 30 and has always been someone who relied heavily on their pace, something that wanes with age, he's probably too old for their interest even if he did fit what they wanted to do.

--

But we did see today that when Benzema is either out of the game and/or out of form, they're up a creek. They don't have center forward depth organically. If Mayoral is the backup #9, that's a problem, because even if he is an academy product and everyone loves those, the guy just isn't Real Madrid quality in any way whatsoever. Blame it on injuries, poor loan spells hampering development, or never being good enough in the first place (or a combination of all three...it's usually a combination of them all) but he's not gonna cut it. Mariano Diaz would've come in handy real well right about now, but he and Lyon have a good thing going there so there goes that option.


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## GeorgeLeafer12

Would it be OK to predict Real Madrid dropping outside top 4?

1. Atletico Madrid*
2. Barcelona
3. Valencia
4. Villareal

_____________

5. Real Madrid

* It would be so right (and cool) if Los Rojiblancos wins the La Liga this season.


----------



## les Habs

While everyone else was wasting their time watching the European Super Cup some of us were working. Then when some of us settled in for the evening we watched the Trofeo Gamper. 

Overall an entertaining match from a Cule perspective. The team played well both halves and like other preseason matches there were plenty of substitutions and thus plenty of players got minutes. Of course why Valverde didn't play an expected starting XI together only he knows. Generally we were in control of the match though and should have at least two more goals, but Boca finished the first half pretty strong and should have had a goal or two of their own (one of which I would given via the spot as I thought Miranda fouled one of their players in the box early in the second half). A few notes:


They presented the first team. No Puig and no Miranda, yet both played. However they included Samper, but he was the only player without a number. Not sure what that was all about.
If Munir can play 60 minutes (Lord knows why), then Samper should get some minutes. Also, then WTF is Alcacer doing in the team? Just get rid of the guy already. If Munir makes this team...
Messi was back on his game and scored an excellent goal. 
Malcom played well despite being on the left for the majority of his time on the pitch. His goal should have been saved, but he got an unexpected shot off quick and it had some force behind it. Either way he played well.
Umtiti was excellent. Some excellent defending and a nice goal line save. Looks like he's picking up right where he left off from last season's form. 
Rakitic at DM was so-so. Coutinho was coming deep to get the ball at times, somewhere you don't want him, and Rakitic made a poor pass which should have resulted in a Boca goal.
Puig looked good again. A couple of really nice plays that just makes him look beyond his years, metaphorically speaking of course. He should have scored a goal too. What's really amazing is the physical abuse he gets from the opposition (every match now) and yet he gets right up and plays. Kid looks like he's having fun out there, doesn't remotely look out of his depth and the experience he's getting is great.
Suarez looked notably better. Struck up a nice understanding with Rafinha.
Lenglet-Vermaelen was fine, but I still don't trust that as a pairing in a meaningful match. I guess we'll have to wait and see.
That just leaves the Man of the Match. Everybody has their price, but if Rafinha doesn't make this team it will be criminal. That said all signs point to him doing so. An underrated player by some distance. He's got vision, he can pass, he can dribble, he puts in the work, he can protect the ball... He'll be able to cover multiple positions, but just as a midfielder once again you have to question the Vidal signing a bit. Anyway, on one play he completely embarrassed a Boca player and the guy laughably was trying to chase him down and finally hacked him from behind (ala Sergio Ramos). Also, he scored a real golazo and even had his shirt pulled in the process. 
I don't know how we're going to line up this year, but a bench of Malcom, Rafinha, Arthur, Semedo, Lenglet and Cillessen alone is looking good.


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## les Habs

I'll go against the grain on Benzema. I think he'll have a better season this term with Ronaldo gone. Bale certainly will as will Asensio. 



GeorgeLeafer12 said:


> Would it be OK to predict Real Madrid dropping outside top 4?
> 
> 1. Atletico Madrid*
> 2. Barcelona
> 3. Valencia
> 4. Villareal
> 
> _____________
> 
> 5. Real Madrid
> 
> * It would be so right (and cool) if Los Rojiblancos wins the La Liga this season.




No and no. 

Some... "interesting" predictions in this thread. I wouldn't expect any surprises in terms of who the top three sides are. You can debate the order, which it seems is ripe for debate, but Madrid for example aren't going to finish outside of the top three.


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## Corto

I was expecting overreaction, but some of this is hilarious.

The game itself turned on Casemiro's subsitution and Lopetegui bringing on Dani instead of Llorente.
Well, that and the the best back four in the game in the last 3-4 years playing like amateurs.
Marcelo had one massive brain fart but was otherwise decent, but the other 3 were shocking.
Madrid look like they were cruising and then they just buried themselves with horrible defensive lapses.

So, to write off the whole season or to write off this Madrid team based on that game, when you had top players obviously playing some of their worst football... Is a non-starter.

I also saw a couple of posts hating on Benzema, and I'll just repeat what I've been saying for years now.
He's fantastic at what he's asked to do, and even though his finishing isn't what it used to be, he's got a spot in this Madrid squard regardless of ho comes on. His role is not to pile on goals, but to work, take part in the build up (best striker in the game at this) and enable others to get into scoring areas and score.
What remains to be seen is if having a Bale-enabler is even worth it, because having a Ronaldo-enabler definitely was.
Benzema has been huge for Real, even if most of the football media don't see it because his goal totals are low.
And this game, in no way, was on Benzema.

There are issues with this team with so many important players from 16-17 gone, but Benzema is not one of them.

...

And I'll repeat what I said earlier. While last year, in the middle of their injury-plagued La Liga crisis people were writing them off, I still saw a CL beast in there once the players got back... But this season?

The depth is gone. Ronaldo, Kovacic, Morata, James, Danilo... Players gone in the last 2 years and the only new players brought in have been young Spaniards with potential - but nowhere near ready yet (and some might simply never become the players that the Spanish media wants them to become - I'm far from being sold on Llorente and Ceballos, myself).
Their depth, their "team B", won them La Liga two seasons ago, now it's costing them games.

Transfer complacency. Having a wage structure is to be commended and lauded, and not buying big players for years works if you have a top team already, but if the players are leaving, for whatever reason, you cannot just stockpile young talent to grow while supporting the starts... At some point these youngsters are asked to bite off more than they can chew and the side can no longer contend for big trophies.
At the same time, refusing Mbappe due to (ridiculously high) wage demands doesn't sound great right now lol...

Also, the Modric saga is not done yet.
Isco can't hold a candle to that man in the midfield, and if Modric is gone Madrid's chances to doing anything significant this season plummet further.


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## Corto

Atletico OTOH, played... Okay. I didn't think they were great, they created very little for the majority of the game and then got gifted some goals.
Costa looks in great form, he absolutely destroyed Carvajal, Ramos and Varane; I haven't seen Costa this good in a while. And he brought his usual high levels of sh*thousery. Costa, Ramos, Suarez, Vidal... What a league.

Lemar was very good defensively in the first half, and got better as the game went on, but it'll take time for him to get used to the system and play his best.

Greiz looked like a guy who won the WC and was on vacation until a week ago. 

Godin and Savic were excellent, and Godin is so, so... Soooo good.
(that said, he's hardly played in a an offensive system, I don't think he'd do THAT well in VVD's place at Liverpool, but in the systems he plays in... He's perfect)


----------



## Evilo

Corto said:


> At the same time, refusing Mbappe due to (ridiculously high) wage demands doesn't sound great right now lol...



Vasiliyev says Perez is still made at him for selling Mbappe to PSG rather than Real.

Seems like Monaco accepted the player's will, which means it was never a salary problem.


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## Corto

Evilo said:


> Vasiliyev says Perez is still made at him for selling Mbappe to PSG rather than Real.
> 
> Seems like Monaco accepted the player's will, which means it was never a salary problem.




Oh I don't mean Mbappe went against his will etc., just that Perez flat out refused the wage demands because of Madrid's wage structure (and possibly Cristiano getting mad over an 18-year old getting a huge salary, not to mention everyone else).
At the time, Madrid was still carrying the best 23-man roster in the game, it made sense. Now though, none of the players have been replaced, and game changers like Mbappe don't exactly grow on trees.


----------



## Scandale du Jour

Power Man said:


> It's going to be a long season




It is one over-glorified exhibition game against a great team, calm down.


----------



## BB88

GeorgeLeafer12 said:


> Would it be OK to predict Real Madrid dropping outside top 4?
> 
> 1. Atletico Madrid*
> 2. Barcelona
> 3. Valencia
> 4. Villareal
> 
> _____________
> 
> 5. Real Madrid
> 
> * It would be so right (and cool) if Los Rojiblancos wins the La Liga this season.




Isn't this a bit of a overreaction to bad 2nd half of a game?


----------



## Scandale du Jour

BB88 said:


> Isn't this a bit of a overreaction to bad 2nd half of a game?




Last year people said we would destroy Barca and win La Liga by a mile after beating them easily in Supercopa. Overreaction is the norm.


----------



## BB88

Scandale du Jour said:


> Last year people said we would destroy Barca and win La Liga by a mile after beating them easily in Supercopa. *Overreaction is the norm*.




That's 1 thing I've learned from NHL pre seasons, haven't followed the talk as much in previous years in football.

Modric didn't play a full game last night, they made 4 changes on the 2nd half-, haven't still seen Courtois and lost on defensive collapses.
It's pointless to laugh at the Ronaldo trade as the reason for last nights loss, he wouldn't have fixed those defensive mistakes they made, they were pretty big ones when they made them. This game neither showed they should be ranked 4th or 5th for La Liga next season.

If anything they showed if they can put it together they can be a strong team and maybe better team in La Liga than last year. They can compete with Atletico.

But I feel if Isco& Benzema are getting regular minutes in big games that's where the issue is.


----------



## Evilo

Corto said:


> Oh I don't mean Mbappe went against his will etc., just that Perez flat out refused the wage demands because of Madrid's wage structure (and possibly Cristiano getting mad over an 18-year old getting a huge salary, not to mention everyone else).
> At the time, Madrid was still carrying the best 23-man roster in the game, it made sense. Now though, none of the players have been replaced, and game changers like Mbappe don't exactly grow on trees.



Well that doesn't seem to be the case. Otherwise, Perez wouldn't be mad at Vasiliyev, would he?


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## Vasilevskiy

Lemar was very good. To play that way in a complicated system as Atletico's is not common at all. The guy is going to be a force


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## SJSharks72

Vasilevskiy said:


> Lemar was very good. To play that way in a complicated system as Atletico's is not common at all. The guy is going to be a force




He seemed to get better when Griez came off


----------



## Savi

SJSharks39 said:


> He seemed to get better when Griez came off




Yeah I agree

I also thought Partey was really good, in the past I never really rated him very highly but Simeone has done an amazing job developing him


----------



## Vasilevskiy

SJSharks39 said:


> He seemed to get better when Griez came off




Lemar off the ball was superb all game long. With the ball he got better as game went on, I agree.


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## Kovalev27

i didn't even know this La Liga board existed here! awesome. looking forward to a great season for FCB. Was a great opener to start. looking forward to posting with you guys in here.


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