Anyway, Tolly is a huge upgrade compared to Jones, don't even think about it.
He's an upgrade when you don't consider salary, but in terms of all-around game, Jones is better than OKT.
OKT is a fringe NHL dman, Jones is a capable 6th defenseman -- maybe a 5th dman at his best.
A parent-jones bottom pair, with both of them healthy, would be the best pairing we could field. Unfortunately, the salary cap and injuries won't let that happen.
The last few posts kind of embody why I started this post. OKT and Syvret are at best 6th D-men. OKT is a big physical guy and I like his style of play and Syvret has a nice offensive upside, but if there is a serious injury to anyone on the blueline, we are screwed. Syvret and OKT playing together (or split up like someone suggested in an earlier post) would make our defense worse off than it was last year. I seriously think we should trade an AHL D-man, Cote/Asham/Carcillo, and even a draft pick for a solid D-man to play with Parent. That way if someone goes down, the final pair of Parent/New Guy with OKT or Syvret (I would say send Syvret down and keep OKT as the 7th D-man) would still be a solid final pairing.
So you actually say OKT, in his fifth season in this league, is useless. Then I find it hard to believe that he was offered a contract from teams like the Pens, Bruins and Flyers.
He's more than good enough as a 6th defenseman. He's only had 12 minutes of play, you know little or nothing about him. But that will change, Stevens said OKT-Syvret on the 3rd will play a lot more now until Parent is back because we're facing several games a week, and we don't want to kill our top four D.
There is absolutely no need to look for an expensive veteran D, OKT is already the 7th defenseman, that means Syvret must be sent down. What has he done to deserve that? Nothing.
Oh...I really do suspect quite a lot of Euro hatred around here
So you actually say OKT, in his fifth season in this league, is useless. Then I find it hard to believe that he was offered a contract from teams like the Pens, Bruins and Flyers.
He's more than good enough as a 6th defenseman. He's only had 12 minutes of play, you know little or nothing about him. But that will change, Stevens said OKT-Syvret on the 3rd will play a lot more now until Parent is back because we're facing several games a week, and we don't want to kill our top four D.
There is absolutely no need to look for an expensive veteran D, OKT is already the 7th defenseman, that means Syvret must be sent down. What has he done to deserve that? Nothing.
Oh...I really do suspect quite a lot of Euro hatred around here
What has Syvret done to deserve staying in the lineup? Nothing. Tolly has been a little better but barely.
It's got nothing to do with prejudice. No one cares where a guy is from as long as he can play. If Tolly shows he can play, he can stay awhile. I'm not holding my breath.
A trade for a Dman to play with Parent is evitable before the deadline. We can't risk having these guys on the ice in the playoffs.
Mmmm, Toronto has loads of excess and has been putting Exelby in the stands....
So you actually say OKT, in his fifth season in this league, is useless. Then I find it hard to believe that he was offered a contract from teams like the Pens, Bruins and Flyers.
He's more than good enough as a 6th defenseman. He's only had 12 minutes of play, you know little or nothing about him. But that will change, Stevens said OKT-Syvret on the 3rd will play a lot more now until Parent is back because we're facing several games a week, and we don't want to kill our top four D.
There is absolutely no need to look for an expensive veteran D, OKT is already the 7th defenseman, that means Syvret must be sent down. What has he done to deserve that? Nothing.
Oh...I really do suspect quite a lot of Euro hatred around here
It's not Euro hate around here. I'm the one who suggested a package of Coburn and others for Volchenkov. I also like Kimmo Timonen who's, get this, European.
OKT sucks. That's all what it is. The only thing he does well is hit, but even when he does that, he takes himself out of position in order to make the big hit. You said it best - he's been in the league now for five seasons. After five seasons, you'd think he'd grasp the concept of choosing his spots better, but he hasn't.
It's not my fault that you have a man crush on OKT and obviously can't see that he's a borderline NHL player at best. At this point, I'd have rather that the Flyers use someone like Bartulis or even Marshall in the seven spot. They at least offer something......
It's not Euro hate around here. I'm the one who suggested a package of Coburn and others for Volchenkov. I also like Kimmo Timonen who's, get this, European.
OKT sucks. That's all what it is. The only thing he does well is hit, but even when he does that, he takes himself out of position in order to make the big hit. You said it best - he's been in the league now for five seasons. After five seasons, you'd think he'd grasp the concept of choosing his spots better, but he hasn't.
It's not my fault that you have a man crush on OKT and obviously can't see that he's a borderline NHL player at best. At this point, I'd have rather that the Flyers use someone like Bartulis or even Marshall in the seven spot. They at least offer something......
I don't know about that last part. At this point, Syvret and OKT are our best options, I know Parent is only out for a short time, but it is inevitable that at some point in the season another D-man will go down, possibly for longer. Syvret or OKT should be an option as a 7th D-man, not the 6th and 7th D-man.
BobbyClarkeFan16...Welcome to my ignore list, your posts are ridiculous.
You might have to ignore half of Flyers board soon. As most people know, we are not *******s but we dont take kindly to blind "love" people(not really blind for you since you know him but you know what I mean). What I mean is people who say a player does no wrong and is the best, not based off of his play but because of personal reasons (Like that Carle fan). Look. There is no need to get all angry. We here think that OKT is a 7th man, at times 6th man. Some of us have been fans of this team a long time, and know what ****** defenders we went through. A 3rd pairing of Syvret-OKT is NOT a solid 3rd pairing line. It just isnt.
Oh an I like Syvret as a 6th guy. I dont see anything that he has done wrong the games he has played. I noticed accouple nice passes, but other then that I havent noticed getting cut up by another player or getting outplayed.
__________________ Death is struck, and nature quaking,
all creation is awaking,
to its Judge an answer making.
Oh...I really do suspect quite a lot of Euro hatred around here
Yep, Flyers' fans despise those Euros....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfy
BobbyClarkeFan16...Welcome to my ignore list, your posts are ridiculous.
Each of his posts about OKT have been pretty accurate. Whatever relationship you have with OKT has blinded you to the fact that he's a fringe 6th defenseman in the NHL. There's nothing wrong with that; it just is what it is. If you can't handle criticism of your favourite player, you've probably joined the wrong board.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfy
Oh yeah, I forgot. He's a special Jones fan.
The irony in this post is almost too much for me to handle.
I have no problems with sensible criticism. OKT is not a skill player, we all know that. He's an energy player and handles the 6th spot just fine, that's why Homer signed him to replace Jones.
But what I see here is not criticism, it's pure bashing of a guy who hasn't even played yet, maybe one game. That is totally unnecessary, what a way to welcome new players
BobbyClarkeFan16...Welcome to my ignore list, your posts are ridiculous.
not the first time I've been put on an ignore list. Probably won't be the last either. My posts are always a little over the top. However, most on this board will tell you that I'm probably one of the most passionate and die hard Flyers fans there is. Quite proud of that too.
I have no problems with sensible criticism. OKT is not a skill player, we all know that. He's an energy player and handles the 6th spot just fine, that's why Homer signed him to replace Jones.
He signed him to be a cheap depth defenseman. That's it. Didn't sign him to specifically replace Jones, because, hey look he was a healthy scratch to start the year.
Quote:
But what I see here is not criticism, it's pure bashing of a guy who hasn't even played yet, maybe one game. That is totally unnecessary, what a way to welcome new players
Look dude, at some point you need to stop being a pathetic OKT fanboy and start engaging in real hockey talk if anyone is going to take you seriously. Constantly agitating for us to field the gooniest lineup we can make (which hasn't been a smart decision for years), especially when talking about playing high skill teams like the Pens (because wastes of time like Godard are going to beat us up!) just makes you look silly. Acting like someone pissed in your cornflakes because people say negative things about a guy that is, objectively, a completely fringe player in the NHL...
OKT did not receive good minutes in Columbus because he isn't very good. He's receiving less minutes on a better team because he isn't very good. Them the facts.
I have no problems with sensible criticism. OKT is not a skill player, we all know that. He's an energy player and handles the 6th spot just fine, that's why Homer signed him to replace Jones.
But what I see here is not criticism, it's pure bashing of a guy who hasn't even played yet, maybe one game. That is totally unnecessary, what a way to welcome new players
What Jester said. He's a fringe NHL d-man and, at best, a 7th d-man. He was never specifically brought in to replace Jones. He was brought in for cheap defensive depth and a solid 7th d-man.
Get over it. He wasn't thought highly of in Columbus and likely won't be highly thought of here.
Don't tell me to change my opinions, I will never cut my support to the physical part of the game.
And OKT played the usual 10-15 minutes as 6th in Columbus before the knee injury. Again, he must have something to contribute with when he's wanted by several teams in the league. That just doesn't happen if he belongs on a lower level.
Let's just agree to disagree, because this is obviously a locked case.
Oh, and the best part of it...I know why he was signed and what their future plans are, you don't have to tell me
Don't tell me to change my opinions, I will never cut my support to the physical part of the game.
And OKT played the usual 10-15 minutes as 6th in Columbus before the knee injury. Again, he must have something to contribute with when he's wanted by several teams in the league. That just doesn't happen if he belongs on a lower level.
Let's just agree to disagree, because this is obviously a locked case.
Ivanens and Hollweg manage to keep finding work, but that doesn't mean they're good.
Nobody is telling you to change your opinion, we're just asking you to talk reasonably and to stop ignoring facts.
None of us said he belongs in the AHL either. We just all admit that he's a 7th d-man who's best asset is hitting (which often compromises his position).
Quote:
Oh, and the best part of it...I know why he was signed and what their future plans are, you don't have to tell me
Isn't saying stuff like that without proof not allowed?
Don't tell me to change my opinions, I will never cut my support to the physical part of the game.
You say this as if Flyer fans don't support or enjoy the "physical part of the game." That's not what you agitate for. You make it out like the NHL is like the movie Slapshot, when that is decidedly not the case. You portray the Penguins as some rough and tumble team that we have to be overly concerned about in the physical side of the game and suggest that throw Cote in as if he's of any real worth on the ice...
Of course, the real issue is that if OKT was a small skill guy, I very much doubt you would be making the arguments you are at all...which goes right to the heart of the issue, you don't have much credibility because you come off as a pure fanboy, rather than a hockey fan. Look, you're conversing with real Flyer fans, not folks who give two licks about OKT...it's about the Flyers winning and being a good team, not OKT getting ice time.
Quote:
And OKT played the usual 10-15 minutes as 6th in Columbus before the knee injury. Again, he must have something to contribute with when he's wanted by several teams in the league. That just doesn't happen if he belongs on a lower level.
Let's just agree to disagree, because this is obviously a locked case.
Yes, a slew of cap stricken teams that were looking for cheap players to fill out his roster. No one is saying he doesn't deserve a contract in the NHL, but it's pretty clear he isn't that highly regarded or he'd be going to places where he wouldn't be looked at as a 6/7 and fighting for that spot (would have been the case with any of those teams). If he was that highly thought of, he'd be getting paid more and brought in by teams looking for someone to play further up the lineup.
Quality defenseman -- even mediocre ones -- are of high demand in the NHL...OKT wasn't all that demanded.
Of course, then you go and play the anti-Euro card, which is just beyond absurd.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfy
Oh, and the best part of it...I know why he was signed and what their future plans are, you don't have to tell me
No matter what they told OKT, and what he's told you...it's unlikely that OKT has a significant future in the Flyers long-term plans on D. Pronger and Timonen are signed to extended contracts, so is Carle (but he is expendable), and Coburn will likely be locked up to another deal between now and next offseason. Then you have Parent, who is absolutely in their long-term plans and a few guys on the Phantoms they hold in high esteem.
