"If things don't work out (with the Sharks), I'll come back here, take on a leadership role and work on my skills," said Couture, who suffered two concussions last season, but has been given a clean bill of health by several doctors, including those of the Sharks. "I want to play in the NHL, so I'll do anything to get there."
Because I can't remember the status of every prospect from recent times, I was wondering if anyone can remember which of the players listed "in the system" on the Sharks site are no longer with the team.
Their list is conflicting with a version that they had posted earlier. Guys I know with the team are not listed (several goalies) but there are also players I know are no longer with the team (like James Delory)
The combination of the lists I've come up with (plus 08 picks) is:
Riley Armstrong
Nick Bonino
Drew Daniels
Justin Daniels
P.J. Fenton
Carter Lee
Tony Lucia
John McCarthy
Jamie McGinn
Frazer McLaren
Mike Morris
Ashton Rome
Jonathan Tremblay
Craig Valette
Tommy Wingels
Patrick Zackrisson
Steven Zalewski
Justin Braun
Will Colbert
Jason Demers
Julien Demers
Brennan Evans
Sam Groulx
Christian Jensen
David MacDonald
Brian O'Hanley
Nick Petrecki
Brad Staubitz
Taylor Dakers
Thomas Greiss
Harri Sateri
Alex Stalock
Timo Pielmeier
Tyson Sexsmith
Who is on that list that shouldn't be? Who am I missing?
Thanks.
(this is for something. Don't want to give it away until it's done though)
__________________ "Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent."
Jonathan Tremblay
Craig Valette
David MacDonald
Brian O'Hanley
Who is on that list that shouldn't be?
Tremblay signed with AHL Iowa. Valette is UFA VI (and currently unsigned AFAIK). MacDonald retired (after handful of AHL games). O'Hanley became UFA when unsigned by 8/15.
(Nem, perhaps checking my site is a good first step? )
Tremblay signed with AHL Iowa. Valette is UFA VI (and currently unsigned AFAIK). MacDonald retired (after handful of AHL games). O'Hanley became UFA when unsigned by 8/15.
(Nem, perhaps checking my site is a good first step? )
I can never remember the URL (even though it's so simple) and I'm lazy with bookmarks.
Thanks for the help. Hopefully I'll be done what I'm working on this afternoon.
It certainly exposes scouting biases in the Sharks. Obviously there is very little to be taken from the western US, but it is surprising what a lack of prospects there are from Ontario on west (considering that Ottawa is right on the Quebec border) and in Europe.
It certainly exposes scouting biases in the Sharks. Obviously there is very little to be taken from the western US, but it is surprising what a lack of prospects there are from Ontario on west (considering that Ottawa is right on the Quebec border) and in Europe.
Part of not seeing western Canada is that most of the prospects are up or traded, Wishart, Seto, and McLaren. I am sure they haven't abandoned western Canada entirely.
What I want to see going forward is what they do in the US northeast as they lost two scouts from that area this summer.
Part of not seeing western Canada is that most of the prospects are up or traded, Wishart, Seto, and McLaren. I am sure they haven't abandoned western Canada entirely.
What I want to see going forward is what they do in the US northeast as they lost two scouts from that area this summer.
True. Still, those prospects that have moved up/been traded mostly represented high end picks (well, not McLaren, but Seto/Wishart were 1st rounders)
At the very least this shows that when it comes to making picks out of the 1st round (the times you truly have to lean on your scouting department), the team is much more comfortable going with kids from back east.
What I want to see going forward is what they do in the US northeast as they lost two scouts from that area this summer.
Wouldn't be at all surprised to see 1-2 new scouting guys hired. Especially if there are 1-2 former NHL coaches that might want to "do" more than collect salary from old team. (Seems like they're never announced, just new names show up in media guide. )
Not sure where Marchment did his scouting last year.
Wouldn't be at all surprised to see 1-2 new scouting guys hired. Especially if there are 1-2 former NHL coaches that might want to "do" more than collect salary from old team. (Seems like they're never announced, just new names show up in media guide. )
We are counting on you LS. They got two or so in Europe last year. You might want to keep a head count, year to year (something the org probably doesn't want to say up front).
Quote:
Not sure where Marchment did his scouting last year.
Toronto area, so I would assume mostly OHL and possibly that area of the USHL and Buffalo area.
Nem,
I know Burke does the overview and flies to most of the areas, but IIRC, he did some of the grunt work for western Canada.
It is interesting in that Buffalo is ostensibly using more video and less warm bodies for their scouting. My take is that both are useful and the warm bodies should be better used to get more info about personality rather than just what they see in games. They also have computer stat databases with accompanying video which can be purchased by the various NHL orgs.
The Sharks didn't lose any amateur scouts this year, just scouts at the professional level.
That said, here is a new article on how the Sharks scouting staff works. I was able to speak with a few of them over the year and grab some intel on how they work. I also asked around the league to find out what the rest of the NHL's group of scouts think of the Sharks.
The Sharks didn't lose any amateur scouts this year, just scouts at the professional level.
That said, here is a new article on how the Sharks scouting staff works. I was able to speak with a few of them over the year and grab some intel on how they work. I also asked around the league to find out what the rest of the NHL's group of scouts think of the Sharks.
Excellent article Max. You got some details that I was interested to hear. The two additions from last year were European and from your article, that must mean that they are part time.
By the stats, you reinforce what I said which was that they had a low bust rate and that they are good in the later rounds. On the goalies, where the data is fairly lean and pushing statistical significance, you are right that they do draft a lot of goalies. Their conversion rate for goalies does not stand out, but the skill of those that do convert does stand out. The other thing on goalies is that they are not using high picks to get who they want. I will stick by my statement that statistically they stand somewhere between #5 and #8 for scouting and development, including goalies. In fact including goalies puts them closer to #5 than #8.
This took several hours between last night and this morning, and it's only for NA draft picks, but:
There you go, every player the Sharks have taken from a North American developmental org from 1991 through the most recent draft. All players are listed by the place they were drafted from, not necessarily their most important developmental org. So, for example, Douglas Murray was drafted from a team called New York Applecore in a league not unlike the USHL. So he is listed from there rather than from Cornell. For the record, Murray's star is the glowing blue one in the southern-most part of New York.
And there is a heavy, heavy bias towards New England/New York area players. It's hard to see all the stars that are overlapping on one another. If I have the ambition, I might make a piece that blows up to show that in more detail.
I am working on one for Europe, but the map I have doesn't include all of Russia and misses some of the southern former USSR states (particularly there's a giant chunk of Kazakhstan missing) so I might have to go with 2 maps on that one.
Last edited by The Nemesis: 08-31-2008 at 10:31 PM.
This took several hours between last night and this morning, and it's only for NA draft picks, but:
There you go, every player the Sharks have taken from a North American developmental org from 1991 through the most recent draft. All players are listed by the place they were drafted from, not necessarily their most important developmental org. So, for example, Douglas Murray was drafted from a team called New York Applecore in a league not unlike the USHL. So he is listed from there rather than from Cornell. For the record, Murray's star is the glowing blue one in the southern-most part of New York.
And there is a heavy, heavy bias towards New England/New York area players. It's hard to see all the stars that are overlapping on one another.
I am working on one for Europe, but the map I have doesn't include much in the way of Russia/former USSR states, and I can't find a similarly styled map of that region. So it'll probably look radically different.
Nemesis you are one unbelievable son of a gun. This image deserves a thread of its own.
Also, please check back on the site for Prospects Week, which will start on Monday September 8th. During the week a new article will be released every day on different Sharks prospects.
New Sharks Prospects Ranking
Also, please check back on the site for Prospects Week, which will start on Monday September 8th. During the week a new article will be released every day on different Sharks prospects.
Max , Really liked your ranking , IMO , better , so far, than the voted one on the HF SJ site..
only considerations to your list I would give .. is
I have watched Bonino and he has more upside and talent than Mike Moore and the group after him .. have you seen him play LW much -- IMO , he is more a C --his defense has improved substantially but still needs to work on his skating.. solid O talent which Sharks prospects lack.. potentially a 2nd line player
IMO , Stalock is more talented than Sexsmith even though Sexsmith always comes through so I would have place Stalock before Sexsmith ( and Pielmeier )
Braun , from watching him, is a less physically mature and experienced Joslin but , IMO, he will be a Joslin in 2 years --I think Joslin is too high but Braun is too low probably late mid teens.
I watched McLaren carefully , at last yr's camp and was impressed with his speed ans skill for his size as well as his improvement in scoring this year.. IMO, he is the prototypical next generation enforcer type -- can play 3rd line , chip in and do the heavy lifting.. so I have him in the mid-teens..
Mike Morris is a wildcard depending on how his health impacts your rating -- He is either top 8 talent or bottom of the list .
In reviewing your list and the HF SJ voted list .. what concerns me is the rapid drop off of talent after the top 3. How thin the pickings for a 2nd line or 2nd pairing potential players are.
I do not see a 2nd pairing dman in the prospects list..
the only players with even an ghost of a chance of playing 2nd line are Bonino, Jones, Daniels, McGinn, Morris, Kaspar.
what concerns me is the rapid drop off of talent after the top 3.
Nail on the head right there. Aside from superb goaltending depth (Sateri has me excited while the rest are legitimate for NHL service), their group of prospects is underwhelming to say the least. Even favorites of mine like McGinn, Zalewski, and Morris (stay healthy please) should ideally be ranked, at best, around the bottom top 10 in a balanced system. Role players are very useful but it concerns me that the Sharks consistently go after these safe picks over the home runs or when they do take the big swing (Kaspar and Bernier), they develop them into safe players.
While I like what players such as Pavelski and Mitchell bring on the ice, I also expect more offensive production with the roles they are given. Will they? Well, I'd like to be optimistic but I have my reservations.
Nail on the head right there. Aside from superb goaltending depth (Sateri has me excited while the rest are legitimate for NHL service), their group of prospects is underwhelming to say the least. Even favorites of mine like McGinn, Zalewski, and Morris (stay healthy please) should ideally be ranked, at best, around the bottom top 10 in a balanced system. Role players are very useful but it concerns me that the Sharks consistently go after these safe picks over the home runs or when they do take the big swing (Kaspar and Bernier), they develop them into safe players.
While I like what players such as Pavelski and Mitchell bring on the ice, I also expect more offensive production with the roles they are given. Will they? Well, I'd like to be optimistic but I have my reservations.
I do think they are going to have to open up their drafting slightly in the years to come, they just arent going to be getting any top end picks unless players are moved. They are going to have to take a chance here or there and hope for a home run.
)
Nemesis you are one unbelievable son of a gun. This image deserves a thread of its own. 
