You could make an argument that Drew Doughty has been one of the most impressive defensemen in the entire league so far this season. He has been a stud for LA, playing 25+ mins a night in his sophomore season
In addition to being defensively responsible he has 20 points in 24 games and is a +4 with 16 PIMs.
Will he make Team Canada's 2010 Olympic roster? Paired with someone like Pronger on the point, Canada's powerplay would be deadly. At the same time, he is very young and this is really his "breakout" season, so there may be questions about his experience.
maybe if he was american, but then bogosian has almost no shot either and they are very close skill wise.
i checked only in case of several injuries
In my mind, there is absolutely no question he'd make Team USA... and be their best d-man. So far I'd say the "locks" on the US defense are E. Johnson, Martin, Suter, Rafalski, and J. Johnson. Doughty is better than any of those guys, at least so far this season... just look at him compared to his teammate Jack Johnson!
Canada's defensive depth is, IMO, their biggest asset going into these Olympics.
That said, I voted "7th dman" because I think Yzerman will be a bit concerned that he is only 20 and has very little international experience.
In my mind, there is absolutely no question he'd make Team USA... and be their best d-man. So far I'd say the only real "locks" on the US defense are E. Johnson, Martin, Suter, and Rafalski. Doughty is better than any of those guys, at least so far this season.
Canada's defensive depth is, IMO, their biggest asset going into these Olympics.
Note where I said "at least so far this season". Of that list who do you think has played better in both ends of the ice? Doughty has been invaluable to LA. EJ has been the best of the bunch offensively but still trails Doughty by 8 points. Martin is an underrated stud but his injury has moved him down the list. Rafalski is a great, experienced d-man but he lacks size and still hasn't performed as well as Doughty offensively.
Edit: Just noticed your comment above about Bogosian. He has been very good, you're right, so I don't know why he has "no shot". Inexperience? Team USA could use his size and skills. I think my picks for USA would be EJ, Whitney, Martin, Rafalski, Bogosian, and Suter.
doughty is a great player and will be on numerous team canadas but i dont think he will make it this year unless there are a number of injuries
This.
If Mike Green is on the bubble, then Doughty has got to be behind him. Doughty had 27 points and posted a -17 last season. Not Team Canada numbers, that's for sure. This season, he's been incredible... but it has only been 24 games. That's a little more than nothing. It would really help if he at least had some NHL playoff experience but he doesn't. He's got a lot more to prove if he wants to penetrate Canada's top 6.
Mike Green truly does not get enough credit in this debate. He's got the best PPG out of any Canadian d-man by far (followed by Pronger, Keith, then Boyle). He's a +4 and has proven he can log big minutes. But I digress.
I'd like to see Doughty considered if one of our PP kings go down.
Mike Green truly does not get enough credit in this debate. He's got the best PPG out of any Canadian d-man by far (followed by Pronger, Keith, then Boyle). He's a +4 and has proven he can log big minutes. But I digress.
The knock on Green is obviously his defensive ability. Don't get me wrong, his defensive shortcomings are probably exaggerated by most people on this forum, but I think this is the reason Green is on the bubble.
When the opposing team has Kovalchuk, Malkin, Ovehckin, Gonchar, and Markov on the ice.... do you really want Mike Green on your back end? The other names on Canada's "most likely" list are all more sound than he is defensively.
I'm certainly not saying Mike Green wouldn't be a very valuable contribution to Canada's roster, there are just question marks about his reliability on the back end. With Doughty you get less question marks about defense and - apparently - outstanding offense, too. Of course with Doughty comes the concern of inexperience, youth, etc... which are all very valid.
Although he very well may be, if Green isn't going to be in the top 6 guys, then I'd rather see Doughty take the seventh spot. Green is more one-dimensional so I'd rather have him as a regular roster player than a potential fill-in for an injury to someone like Pronger. Doughty is more of a "do it all" guy and could step in to any role.
Doughty is better than any of those guys, at least so far this season... just look at him compared to his teammate Jack Johnson!
What are you trying to say here? If you are talking defense first, I would take Johnson all day long. Doughty has made up for a lot of his giveaways with his offensive production, but it doesn't take away from the fact that he is one of the league leaders in defensive giveaways while Johnson is one of the leagues best.
People really need to watch a few more LA games to recognize how rock solid Johnson is becoming.
What are you trying to say here? If you are talking defense first, I would take Johnson all day long. Doughty has made up for a lot of his giveaways with his offensive production, but it doesn't take away from the fact that he is one of the league leaders in defensive giveaways while Johnson is one of the leagues best.
People really need to watch a few more LA games to recognize how rock solid Johnson is becoming.
I admit that I don't get to watch Kings games very often, but you make it sound like Doughty's skills in his own end are downright awful. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe he has basically been defensively sound, although perhaps not brilliant, all year.
Stats certainly aren't everything, but I'll take Doughty's +4 and 20 points over Johnson's -11 and six points any day, even if he does give the puck up more often.
Anyway, I wasn't trying to suggest that Johnson was a bad player by any means, just that if you were to pick one for the Olympic roster it would almost certainly be Doughty over Johnson.
The knock on Green is obviously his defensive ability. Don't get me wrong, his defensive shortcomings are probably exaggerated by most people on this forum, but I think this is the reason Green is on the bubble.
When the opposing team has Kovalchuk, Malkin, Ovehckin, Gonchar, and Markov on the ice.... do you really want Mike Green on your back end? The other names on Canada's "most likely" list are all more sound than he is defensively.
I'm certainly not saying Mike Green wouldn't be a very valuable contribution to Canada's roster, there are just question marks about his reliability on the back end. With Doughty you get less question marks about defense and - apparently - outstanding offense, too. Of course with Doughty comes the concern of inexperience, youth, etc... which are all very valid.
Although he very well may be, if Green isn't going to be in the top 6 guys, then I'd rather see Doughty take the seventh spot. Green is more one-dimensional so I'd rather have him as a regular roster player than a potential fill-in for an injury to someone like Pronger. Doughty is more of a "do it all" guy and could step in to any role.
Good post, but if a guy like Robyn Regehr is considered to be on Team Canada (an all out shutdown d-man with minimal offensive abilities), then what's to say the complete opposite of the spectrum, Mike Green, be not be considered for situational purposes?
Say what you will about his apparent defensive abilities (or inabilities), but he was a +24 last year... the highest out of any Washington Capital. His offensive upside trumps any questions regarding his defence, so far.
If Team Canada is down 3-1 against Team Russia, and Team Russia is playing their "shutdown line," throw in Mike Green. He's the best offensive d-man in the NHL.
I admit that I don't get to watch Kings games very often, but you make it sound like Doughty's skills in his own end are downright awful. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe he has basically been defensively sound, although perhaps not brilliant, all year.
He's still a giveaway machine. Doughty projects to be much better than Green defensively, for sure, but I see little difference between them right now.
Good God I do not want Regehr or anyone like him near the Taxi Squad, let alone the actual team.
For now, Doughty should get a good hard look. He seems like he has been mostly stellar overall and, since he will be a cornerstone going forward, he should get some exposure sooner rather than later. However, the competition is fierce. The only lock I can see is Pronger; I wouldn't even say Scotty is a lock. Having vets is nice but Canada needs to get on with it and start giving our youngsters the responsibility they deserve.
I wouldn't mind Doughty being there, provided he keeps it up. Will he be there? Probably not.
PS: Green should also be there, his unique skill set could prove essential. No one in the league is as dynamic as him offensively, IMO.
Good God I do not want Regehr or anyone like him near the Taxi Squad, let alone the actual team.
Quoted for the truth, sir.
I absolutely hate Regehr, but for some reason his name keeps popping up. Team Canada is good enough that they can get a shutdown d-man that can get more than 8 points a season (last year, Regehr had 8 assists, 0 goals, and posted a staggering +10 in 75 games).
Possibly the most overrated Canadian d-man in our game. He's not in my Team Canada - I hope Yzerman agrees.
Decision, decisions. But I swear... If Duncan Keith isn't on Team Canada, I will blow up a small animal with C4. Kbai.
Agreed, and I don't think you'll have to blow up the small animal. Given his play at this point I can't see how Keith could be left off. Along with Pronger, Weber and Boyle I think he's a definite must-have for the Team Canada brass.
As with the poster above me, I most certainly do not want to see Regehr on the team. Like you said, he's one-dimensional and imo he just doesn't measure up to bubble players like Doughty and Seabrook.
I think the lineup you posted - with Seabrook or Doughty as the seventh.
Another possiblity if Green is to make the lineup:
Pronger - Boyle
Weber - Green
Keith - Bouwmeester
Niedermeyer
I don't think Niedermeyer should be a lock to make the team just because he's been around forever. Not that he's play poorly this season, but from what I've seen he seems to have lost a step from previous years. This way he still makes the team and plays, but isn't in such a prominent role.
I absolutely hate Regehr, but for some reason his name keeps popping up. Team Canada is good enough that they can get a shutdown d-man that can get more than 8 points a season (last year, Regehr had 8 assists, 0 goals, and posted a staggering +10 in 75 games).
Possibly the most overrated Canadian d-man in our game. He's not in my Team Canada - I hope Yzerman agrees.
Your hate shows and is probably a bit unjustified. At one point a few years back he was one of the league's premier shutdown guys, and his ability to neutralize the opposing team's top forwards outweighed his offensive ineptitude.
Now, though, he's slower and on the downhill. I agree that if he somehow made the team I would be shocked and dismayed, because it would be only based on his previous resume rather than his actual skillset nowadays. That's precisely what Yzerman said he wouldn't do, so there is pretty much no chance he makes it, and yet another small animal is safe from harm.
I'll say this about Nieds: if Canada is protecting a one goal lead with a minute to go in the third during the gold medal game, I'd feel a lot safer if Nieds and Pronger were on the ice... more so than any other d-man on that roster.
That being said, I don't think he's a lock either, but his experience is invaluable.
I'll say this about Nieds: if Canada is protecting a one goal lead with a minute to go in the third during the gold medal game, I'd feel a lot safer if Nieds and Pronger were on the ice... more so than any other d-man on that roster.
That being said, I don't think he's a lock either, but his experience is invaluable.
Really? I'd be fine with any of them, perhaps aside from Green and Boyle. Keith, Weber, and Bouwmeester all get a vote of confidence from me.
I guess it depends how much you value experience. Nieds is very experienced but you also can't ignore his age and play of late.
I'll say this about Nieds: if Canada is protecting a one goal lead with a minute to go in the third during the gold medal game, I'd feel a lot safer if Nieds and Pronger were on the ice... more so than any other d-man on that roster.
That being said, I don't think he's a lock either, but his experience is invaluable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipole
Really? I'd be fine with any of them, perhaps aside from Green and Boyle. Keith, Weber, and Bouwmeester all get a vote of confidence from me.
I guess it depends how much you value experience. Nieds is very experienced but you also can't ignore his age and play of late.
It seems to me, ever since his hold out, Niedermayer has been mostly just playing because he can. I don't fully believe his heart is in it anymore and that if he weren't getting paid so much, he'd be retired. He might have experience on his side but I want people who would kill to be on Team Canada and bring that passion and intensity with them.
I admit that I don't get to watch Kings games very often, but you make it sound like Doughty's skills in his own end are downright awful. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe he has basically been defensively sound, although perhaps not brilliant, all year.
Stats certainly aren't everything, but I'll take Doughty's +4 and 20 points over Johnson's -11 and six points any day, even if he does give the puck up more often.
Anyway, I wasn't trying to suggest that Johnson was a bad player by any means, just that if you were to pick one for the Olympic roster it would almost certainly be Doughty over Johnson.
Nice to see your honesty. I wouldn't call Doughty a liability or anything, because he certainly is not.
Johnson just seems to be evolving into a more defensive dman which seems more and more apparent since TM has been playing Johnson on the pk instead of Doughty.
My feeling is the defense will be what most people expect. I think it would take a lot of guts for Yzerman to make some drastic changes. Even though some players (not just on defense) will make the team based on their past and not how they are playing this season. Veterans are safer and will probably get the nod over youth, but players like Doughty and Stamkos would be refreshing.
Doughty is playing very well and should at least be on the taxi squad. Get some young guys in there for the future. Doughty played extremely well in the World Championships.
To make the team he competes against Pronger, Niedermayer, Green, Boyle, Bouwmeester, Phaneuf, Weber, Keith, Seabrook. If Doughty makes the top 6 I'll be very surprised.
In my mind, there is absolutely no question he'd make Team USA... and be their best d-man. So far I'd say the "locks" on the US defense are E. Johnson, Martin, Suter, Rafalski, and J. Johnson. Doughty is better than any of those guys, at least so far this season... just look at him compared to his teammate Jack Johnson!
Canada's defensive depth is, IMO, their biggest asset going into these Olympics.
That said, I voted "7th dman" because I think Yzerman will be a bit concerned that he is only 20 and has very little international experience.
You haven't watched Erik Johnson this year. Just as good if not better. I'd say better but I'm sure you'd lie and say you have watched a ton of Blues hockey and think Doughty is better.
Having said that, I will say that I thought people were nuts when they said Doughty was in the same league as Erik. EJ is still a little better, but theres no question right now that Doughty is up their with him. I can eat a little crow for that.
If he isn't in Canada's starting lineup, he definately has to be the 7th guy. That's what I voted.
Having Doughty on the bus team may not be such a bad idea.
He's shaping up to be Canada's future top d-man; it might be beneficial, for the future, to expose him to as much of this kind of stuff as possible in case LA doesn't go too far anytime soon.
