What is your preference when it comes to our huge stock pile of draft picks in the next 2 drafts? I prefer to keep most if not all of the high picks rather than waste them on 1 year of someone like Ilya Kovalchuk. I'd rather use a 2nd and a prospect to get someone like Frolov than get rid of any of our 1st round picks in the next 2 drafts!!!! i'd prefer to keep the picks and draft though...use 3rd and lower with "prospects" at the deadline like we did in recchi / noke trades.
I should note that considering Frolov and Hamhuis 2nd tier is merely stating they aren't top flight 1st line/combo guys in a league wide comparison...however they are high end, lower cost guys.
Last edited by BallroomBitz: 10-19-2009 at 04:13 PM.
To trade those picks on Kovalchuk would be great and I would be happy but it would also have to be done with an extension.Look at the Pens,Hossa played yes they made it out of the East 2 years ago but the conference wasn't that strong with the Habs finishing 1st that year.They lost 2 roster players,1st rounder and Esposito.If we are to trade picks then it's gotta be for a player that will be around for a while IMO
I think something that is VERY important (something San Jose has been doing very well lately as well as Detroit) is spreading out your talents. If you're a good team, there is no NEED to load up for a 2-3 year window and obviously if you build through the draft now you may be stuck in a Chicago type situation where you have a limited window because players salaries.
I'd say keep most of the draft picks to give Boston a second wave of great talent for the next 3-5 years. Then years after that just keep pumping in the solid 20th-30th overall first round talents to keep Boston a competitor for years after that. This way you're not ever rushing young talent. Sometimes if you bring guys in early it really makes no difference than if you groom him for a couple years in lower levels, however you can definately ruin a guy by bring him up too fast (never heard about ruining a prospect by keeping him down a couple seasons).
THIS is the new way to build a dynasty and the only way to start it off is with a good team as well as a deep prospects pool. Not many teams can get there but Brian Burke has given Boston the chance to be good for many many years.
To trade those picks on Kovalchuk would be great and I would be happy but it would also have to be done with an extension.Look at the Pens,Hossa played yes they made it out of the East 2 years ago but the conference wasn't that strong with the Habs finishing 1st that year.They lost 2 roster players,1st rounder and Esposito.If we are to trade picks then it's gotta be for a player that will be around for a while IMO
here's my problem with this...we could have kept kessel at likely 2-3 million less who plays a comparable game...so why get kovalchuk...it's a matter of personal preference i guess, but kovi takes off more shifts than kessel does in my opinion!
if marchand and sobotka are full timers next year, our prospect depth is going to be hurting (esp in providence)...i'd rather draft a few guys in the top rounds to increase the chances of keeping the team competitive when our current top line guys become too expensive to retain. hopefully by then some of our 2nd liners develop to first liners (wheeler / krejci) and the rotation continues.
i voted for getting a guy like frolov with some of the picks and then drafting the others to stock pile talent. id love to get kovalchuk but if at the deadline your doing it purely as a rental i would not want to give up torontos first plus other picks and prospects. tell me hes negotiating an extension with us and id do it but as long as toronto sucks i want that pick to turn into a superstar on an entry level deal the most.
anytime you can get a superstar on entry level contract you have to do it because it can turn you into a year in year out contender or even a dynasty for a team that is already a contender like boston. there looks to be about 3 or 4 bonified superstars in this years draft. those are damn good odds with torontos pick.
here's my problem with this...we could have kept kessel at likely 2-3 million less who plays a comparable game...so why get kovalchuk...it's a matter of personal preference i guess, but kovi takes off more shifts than kessel does in my opinion!
if marchand and sobotka are full timers next year, our prospect depth is going to be hurting (esp in providence)...i'd rather draft a few guys in the top rounds to increase the chances of keeping the team competitive when our top line guys become too expensive to retain.
Kessel IMO is not even close of being in the same class as Kovalchuk
just posted this on the Chiarelli thread but applies here.
If this was baseball, I say go for Kovalchuk; but with a Cap, no way. Use it to resign Savard who is a UFA; and keep own RFAs....I'd be surprised if they move them, although Kovalchuk is a S-T-U-D. Superstar!!!! but if Atlanta loses him they might as well move to Calgary
What he said was these picks can be used to bundle- and that is what I believe happens.
Who is in the front office as top aids? Jim Benning (who built the outstanding Buffalo teams before UFA losses did them in), Scott Bradley- considered a gem in the scouting world, who was on duty when Bergeron, Lucic, Krejci, Sobotka, Hunwick, Bitz, and Marchand were all grabbed after the first round.
Don Sweeney is a huge draft and develop guy as well.
I don't expect them to treat these picks as chump change. They may deal one, and bundle a couple of others, but I expect 5 or 6 of these 9 to actually be selected, and at least one or two others to be packaged with others to move up.
You may also see a Patriots like working, where PC trades an early second (especially the second of Toronto) for a first next year. (so we can say we got three firsts for Kessel)
That is actually may scenario- PC trades (hopefully) the 31st pick next June to a decent team (on paper) for their first in 2011 or even 2012.
Kessel IMO is not even close of being in the same class as Kovalchuk
they are comparable at the least...my point was, why spend the extra 2-3 million. you can't argue that kessel is more than 2-3 million bucks worse stats wise when comparing the two players. what i mean by that is that 10 goals isn't equal to 2-3 million dollars. (not that i see kessel as that guy)
i didn't mean to argue the fact that they are equally good...just similar.
i'm not a kessel guy in the least...it's mostly a hypothetical argument.
My default answer is that we should keep all of the picks. We are in a great position to be highly competitive for the next decade. We can constantly replace expensive talent with young talent on ELCs, which is the single greatest resource a team has (aside from a megastar). Given what we've done with our second round picks in the past (add Sauve, Cross, and Alexandrov to the list of potential successes) we could really add a lot of depth to this team.
I didn't vote because none of the options applied.
I would trade any pick except Toronto's 1st in 2010. Preferable to keep 1 pick in each round for the next two years.
That leaves Boston's 1st in 2010 and 2011, Toronto's 2nd in 2010, TB's second in 2010, Boston's 2nd in 2010 and 2011 and Minn's 2nd in 2011 all available.
That could land some very significant players.
Kovalchuk is NOT coming here though. Everywhere I read that he stays in Atlanta or goes back to Russia. I would not want a rental Kovalchuk. If somehow Chia can get him signed, then sure...
they are comparable at the least...my point was, why spend the extra 2-3 million. you can't argue that kessel is more than 2-3 million bucks worse stats wise when comparing the two players. what i mean by that is that 10 goals isn't equal to 2-3 million dollars. (not that i see kessel as that guy)
i didn't mean to argue the fact that they are equally good...just similar.
i'm not a kessel guy in the least...it's mostly a hypothetical argument.
Ya but dude kessel had only a 10 goal difference this year where-as kovalchuk has been a 40-50 goal scorer his whole career
Sometimes you gotta think for the future, if the Maple Leafs are one of the bottom three teams in the league come the trade deadline we have to keep the pick. Proven players are nice but the only guy worth the pick is Kovalchuk and it would have to be long term imo. If the Bruins were to trade it for someone else I think the Bruins are better off taking the risk with the chance of getting one of the top 4 prospects.
I think they have to keep a good number of those 9 top 2 round picks.
Erfus used the phrase "pure talent" and we need a whole new batch of those guys. Should be able to get some serious help on the blueline and at forward with those picks. Given that most of those draft picks won't arrive until about 2012-2015, you'll be saying goodbye to players like Savard, Chara, Thomas, Ryder, etc. Gotta restock. Only way to win in at the cap game.
I didn't vote because none of the options applied.
I would trade any pick except Toronto's 1st in 2010. Preferable to keep 1 pick in each round for the next two years.
That leaves Boston's 1st in 2010 and 2011, Toronto's 2nd in 2010, TB's second in 2010, Boston's 2nd in 2010 and 2011 and Minn's 2nd in 2011 all available.
That could land some very significant players.
Kovalchuk is NOT coming here though. Everywhere I read that he stays in Atlanta or goes back to Russia. I would not want a rental Kovalchuk. If somehow Chia can get him signed, then sure...
i only used kovalchuk as an example...you could substitute someone like scott neidermeyer, dion phaneuf, shea weber if you want...that's what i meant in the bracketed (big ticket)
Not really sure how it's possible to answer this question at this point in the season.
Fact is I think the organization would be foolish to decide, right now or any time in the near future, whether to keep or deal these picks based on some organizational philosophy. If they are a true contender and find themselves in need of an upgrade befoe the deadline, those picks should be sufficient currency to work with. On the other hand if they're not in such a position, they should certainly consider holding onto them for a draft-time deal, a selection, or a swapping of picks.
In short, post this question closer to the deadline, or when a big name player becomes available. Right now it's clear they will hold onto the picks and let the team dictate the best direction.
Note: This is also why I think discussion of extending Savard at this point is also foolish. You wait to see how this team looks after a large enough sample size, then you decide whether to make a significant commitment that could essentially preclude you from using your bevy of picks to acquire another impact player. As much as I like Savvy, I view extending him right now at anything over a huge discount as shortsighted. Those picks are huge. Don't reduce your leverage.
Keep the picks. You have to have young talent in your system in todays cap era. Also if you have more than two players on the big club making over 5 mil it destroys your depth and you become Tampa Bay or Ottawa.
I like four good lines! I hated watching the Neely era Bruins. You just kept waiting for Neely and Janney to get back into the game.
I consider established commodities as having more value than draft picks because of the poor pay-off rate of picks below mid first round. The firsts from Toronto should be the only picks not eagerly traded--besides those? Get established players with known strengths & weaknesses, and a track record in the league or at least in the levels just below the league.
Yes, second round picks hit every once in awhile, but compile 10 years of 2 rounders, then figure out what percentage were flops, scrubs, decent, good, and very good players, and you'll see how bad of a bet 2nd round (and lower) picks are.
I didn't answer because I'm fine with any of the three, it all depends on what is available and what all they have to give with the picks. All three options are very good, and it all depends on how things work out from now til then.
Btw, I still say that LA is going to make the playoffs and won't trade Frolov.
I didn't vote, but I think sending out the picks on a guy like Kovalchuk is just a waste of picks. We couldn't afford to resign him if he wanted to stay.
I consider established commodities as having more value than draft picks because of the poor pay-off rate of picks below mid first round. The firsts from Toronto should be the only picks not eagerly traded--besides those? Get established players with known strengths & weaknesses, and a track record in the league or at least in the levels just below the league.
Yes, second round picks hit every once in awhile, but compile 10 years of 2 rounders, then figure out what percentage were flops, scrubs, decent, good, and very good players, and you'll see how bad of a bet 2nd round (and lower) picks are.
Just my take.
While I don't totally disagree with you, you're reasoning could used to make a case towards keeping most of the picks. For all the misses, there are always 2nd/3rd/4th round hits in every draft, and that's not debatable. So increasing the amount of picks in those rounds is likely going to increase the odds that you hit on a player or two in those rounds. More picks, higher likelihood that you're the team that gets one of those non-1st round hits.
Additionally, if you're the Bruins and you know you have a gaggle of picks in the first 4 rounds this year, don't you amp up your scouting this season to unprecedented levels? Don't you spend a little extra money and get eyes in every arena in Europe and North America to make sure that you're as prepared as you've ever been to make a list of your top 120 players? I do, and I'm sure Chia is addressing it as well.
Personally, I have no problem with moving any of the picks (other than Toronto's 1st) so long as they're used wisely. My biggest fear is that the deadline is going to come and extra picks will get tossed in deals just because they have them. If this team is a player or two away from being a cup contender, then by all means move some assets to give us hope. But don't start trading 1sts and 2nds for the Dominic Moore' and Nik Antropov's of the world. I'd rather roll the dice on one of those pesky 2nd round picks.
