Was the habs' last season simply a blip on the screen? Where everything seemed to fall apart at the same time? Were those Habs the same speedy goal scoring machine of the year prior which simply did not live up to expectations?
OR
Was last year simply the Habs playing to their potential. The year prior was a tremendous fluke where everything seemed to gel and injuries to other teams enabled the habs to take 1st place.
OR Somewhere in the middle.
This question I think is relevant because of players like the Flying Kostitsyn Brothers, Plekanec, and Price. What is their true potential?
I sure hope you all enthrall me with your acumen. Discuss!
Lousy defence. That was the root of all the problems last year. Bob failed to improve the D between 07/08 and 08/09. He did the proper improvements this off-season.
Lousy defence. That was the root of all the problems last year. Bob failed to improve the D between 07/08 and 08/09. He did the proper improvements this off-season.
So you're saying the habs stunk last year because we lost Streit. That is the sole reason why we were a laughingstock...
The Habs' problem has always been inability to outscore 5-on-5, which they seem to have solved quite nicely in 07-08 -- not so much that they were an elite ES team, but they were well above average and combined with a top-flight PP that put them over the top. This improvement was in large part due to the emergence of Plekanec and AK46 as excellent 5-on-5 players, and it was them that turned the Habs into a first-place team (while Kovalev, with his PP excellence, prevented any special teams dropoff from the previous year).
The Habs' marked decline as a 5-on-5 team were due to injuries to top 5-on-5 players (Tanguay, Koivu, Lang) as well as serious slumps by Plekanec and Kostitsyn, the two key players from the previous year. In fact, before the injuries started hitting the team hard they were well above water despite the problems with Plekanec and Kostitsyn; Tanguay, being an elite 5-on-5 player and ably assisted by Lang and Koivu, ensured that the Habs were well above water in that area, and kept the team afloat despite struggles on the power play.
But with Tanguay and Lang out and with Schneider in the team was exactly what it was in 06-07 -- a team with a fantastic PP but a poor even-strength play, and combined with the collapse of the defensive system this led to a truly dismal second half.
The 09-10 team promises to be improved, possibly even over the 07-08 team. Make no mistake, losing Tanguay will hurt as he was the best ES player the Habs have had in a long while by far. But Gomez and Gionta are very strong 5-on-5 players, and Cammalleri is an elite PP producer and a better 5-on-5 player than Kovalev. Just as importantly, Gomez is a first line center with the ability to generate offense and puck possession even against top lines, something Koivu struggled with; this frees up Plekanec to face weaker opposition. The prospect of using Latendresse, one of the team's better and more consistent 5-on-5 players, in an increased role can't hurt either.
The Habs look like they have the tools to produce a top 5 PP unit while they have the players to stay above watter 5-on-5, even before factoring in any improvements due to Martin. If Martin can get these tools together, and Plekanec and Kostitsyn return to 07-08 form, this team will be a top team. That's a lot of ifs, but the 09-10 Habs do have a very high ceiling.
Lousy defence. That was the root of all the problems last year. Bob failed to improve the D between 07/08 and 08/09. He did the proper improvements this off-season.
He has a star next to his name, his opinion must be true
The Habs' problem has always been inability to outscore 5-on-5, which they seem to have solved quite nicely in 07-08 -- not so much that they were an elite ES team, but they were well above average and combined with a top-flight PP that put them over the top. This improvement was in large part due to the emergence of Plekanec and AK46 as excellent 5-on-5 players, and it was them that turned the Habs into a first-place team (while Kovalev, with his PP excellence, prevented any special teams dropoff from the previous year).
The Habs' marked decline as a 5-on-5 team were due to injuries to top 5-on-5 players (Tanguay, Koivu, Lang) as well as serious slumps by Plekanec and Kostitsyn, the two key players from the previous year. In fact, before the injuries started hitting the team hard they were well above water despite the problems with Plekanec and Kostitsyn; Tanguay, being an elite 5-on-5 player and ably assisted by Lang and Koivu, ensured that the Habs were well above water in that area, and kept the team afloat despite struggles on the power play.
But with Tanguay and Lang out and with Schneider in the team was exactly what it was in 06-07 -- a team with a fantastic PP but a poor even-strength play, and combined with the collapse of the defensive system this led to a truly dismal second half.
The 09-10 team promises to be improved, possibly even over the 07-08 team. Make no mistake, losing Tanguay will hurt as he was the best ES player the Habs have had in a long while by far. But Gomez and Gionta are very strong 5-on-5 players, and Cammalleri is an elite PP producer and a better 5-on-5 player than Kovalev. Just as importantly, Gomez is a first line center with the ability to generate offense and puck possession even against top lines, something Koivu struggled with; this frees up Plekanec to face weaker opposition. The prospect of using Latendresse, one of the team's better and more consistent 5-on-5 players, in an increased role can't hurt either.
The Habs look like they have the tools to produce a top 5 PP unit while they have the players to stay above watter 5-on-5, even before factoring in any improvements due to Martin. If Martin can get these tools together, and Plekanec and Kostitsyn return to 07-08 form, this team will be a top team. That's a lot of ifs, but the 09-10 Habs do have a very high ceiling.
The Habs' problem has always been inability to outscore 5-on-5, which they seem to have solved quite nicely in 07-08 -- not so much that they were an elite ES team, but they were well above average and combined with a top-flight PP that put them over the top. This improvement was in large part due to the emergence of Plekanec and AK46 as excellent 5-on-5 players, and it was them that turned the Habs into a first-place team (while Kovalev, with his PP excellence, prevented any special teams dropoff from the previous year).
The Habs' marked decline as a 5-on-5 team were due to injuries to top 5-on-5 players (Tanguay, Koivu, Lang) as well as serious slumps by Plekanec and Kostitsyn, the two key players from the previous year. In fact, before the injuries started hitting the team hard they were well above water despite the problems with Plekanec and Kostitsyn; Tanguay, being an elite 5-on-5 player and ably assisted by Lang and Koivu, ensured that the Habs were well above water in that area, and kept the team afloat despite struggles on the power play.
But with Tanguay and Lang out and with Schneider in the team was exactly what it was in 06-07 -- a team with a fantastic PP but a poor even-strength play, and combined with the collapse of the defensive system this led to a truly dismal second half.
The 09-10 team promises to be improved, possibly even over the 07-08 team. Make no mistake, losing Tanguay will hurt as he was the best ES player the Habs have had in a long while by far. But Gomez and Gionta are very strong 5-on-5 players, and Cammalleri is an elite PP producer and a better 5-on-5 player than Kovalev. Just as importantly, Gomez is a first line center with the ability to generate offense and puck possession even against top lines, something Koivu struggled with; this frees up Plekanec to face weaker opposition. The prospect of using Latendresse, one of the team's better and more consistent 5-on-5 players, in an increased role can't hurt either.
The Habs look like they have the tools to produce a top 5 PP unit while they have the players to stay above watter 5-on-5, even before factoring in any improvements due to Martin. If Martin can get these tools together, and Plekanec and Kostitsyn return to 07-08 form, this team will be a top team. That's a lot of ifs, but the 09-10 Habs do have a very high ceiling.
So did Pleks, The flying Kostitsyns and Price overachieve in 07/08 or underachieve in 08/09? Or somewhere in the middle?
The Habs' problem has always been inability to outscore 5-on-5, which they seem to have solved quite nicely in 07-08 -- not so much that they were an elite ES team, but they were well above average and combined with a top-flight PP that put them over the top. This improvement was in large part due to the emergence of Plekanec and AK46 as excellent 5-on-5 players, and it was them that turned the Habs into a first-place team (while Kovalev, with his PP excellence, prevented any special teams dropoff from the previous year).
The Habs' marked decline as a 5-on-5 team were due to injuries to top 5-on-5 players (Tanguay, Koivu, Lang) as well as serious slumps by Plekanec and Kostitsyn, the two key players from the previous year. In fact, before the injuries started hitting the team hard they were well above water despite the problems with Plekanec and Kostitsyn; Tanguay, being an elite 5-on-5 player and ably assisted by Lang and Koivu, ensured that the Habs were well above water in that area, and kept the team afloat despite struggles on the power play.
But with Tanguay and Lang out and with Schneider in the team was exactly what it was in 06-07 -- a team with a fantastic PP but a poor even-strength play, and combined with the collapse of the defensive system this led to a truly dismal second half.
The 09-10 team promises to be improved, possibly even over the 07-08 team. Make no mistake, losing Tanguay will hurt as he was the best ES player the Habs have had in a long while by far. But Gomez and Gionta are very strong 5-on-5 players, and Cammalleri is an elite PP producer and a better 5-on-5 player than Kovalev. Just as importantly, Gomez is a first line center with the ability to generate offense and puck possession even against top lines, something Koivu struggled with; this frees up Plekanec to face weaker opposition. The prospect of using Latendresse, one of the team's better and more consistent 5-on-5 players, in an increased role can't hurt either.
The Habs look like they have the tools to produce a top 5 PP unit while they have the players to stay above watter 5-on-5, even before factoring in any improvements due to Martin. If Martin can get these tools together, and Plekanec and Kostitsyn return to 07-08 form, this team will be a top team. That's a lot of ifs, but the 09-10 Habs do have a very high ceiling.
Very well thought out reply. I also look for Price to play better. I know that the defense was suspect at times, but there were times that he didn't make the big save. I think the game that Lucic beat the heck out of Komi was a bit of a blow to the team in my mind anyway. I found that Komi was a different players after that (Possibly from the injury). He just seemed different to me, I got moved to a different shift and didn't get to see much of the second half of the season but it just seemed like that game was a big blow for the Habs. I know one game doesn't define a season, but I think we got beat BAD in every aspect of the game against the B's that night. We lost like 6-1 I think and it just seemed different after that to me.
Very well thought out reply. I also look for Price to play better. I know that the defense was suspect at times, but there were times that he didn't make the big save. I think the game that Lucic beat the heck out of Komi was a bit of a blow to the team in my mind anyway. I found that Komi was a different players after that (Possibly from the injury). He just seemed different to me, I got moved to a different shift and didn't get to see much of the second half of the season but it just seemed like that game was a big blow for the Habs. I know one game doesn't define a season, but I think we got beat BAD in every aspect of the game against the B's that night. We lost like 6-1 I think and it just seemed different after that to me.
I think your right.
It may even extend a little earlier in the season. Remember that first game against the Bruins where we had their number in the first two periods, and then all of a sudden they came surging out in the third, and got the game tying goal with less then a minute to go when the puck somehow shot out from the boards right into the front of the net and Savard put it in while Price was out to play it? I remember this moment like it happened 5 minutes ago. Even though we went on to win that game in a SO, we barely won it... It seemed to really take the wind out of Price's sails.
I do think the Bruins success against us this year, be it on the scoreboard (can anyone light up Price like Kessel?), on the fight card (Lucic POUNDING Komi), really seemed to derail our team spirit and chemistry.
January 17, 2009... our record was 27-11-6 for goddsakes. Even if we were having problems that were slowly coming to the surface, that's not really a bad record to have. It more like, how bad was All-Star game-->mid April. Real ****ing bad. It's makes our entire season look pathetic.
I thought we were coming out of it, going 5-0-1... then Markov got injured and the team basically gave up.
In a way it's similar to the 07-08 Sens... difference is we were never in 1st place and we blew the team right the **** up after the season.
I think that the 07-08 team played more or less to potential...
that includes the playoffs, where we went to 7 games with the 8th seed, and got taken out in the 2nd round.
We weren't the best all around team in the conference, but got "lucky" injury-wise which allowed us to take that spot.
I think realistically we were in the 4-6 group in the conference, and the playoff results somewhat highlight that.
We added 2 big components but lost an even bigger one going into the 08-09 season... So I'd say we underachieved, but not by a huge margin.
We should have been an easy playoff team (instead of squeaking in in the final days), but we also weren't built to be a true conference heavy weight...
In 07-08 a lot of players had near career best years, and with that we finished first, but it was unrealistic to think that we could put together back-to-back seasons like that, where so many players play up to/above potential and the team suffers almost no injuries.
I think looking at this year's roster, we are pretty close, talent-wise, to what we've had the past two seasons. We have more overall toughness which should help come playoff time, but depending on injuries and players playing up to potential, we're still a team that will need everything to go right to be in the top of the conference... then again, we'd also need a ton to go bad for us to end up on the outside looking in.
2007/08 was no fluke. We had allot of depth that year and we had a good mix of young and veteran fowards. we stayed out of injury problems wich was a recipe for success that year. Every one had had us not making the playoffs but Ive allways like are depth that year compare to other teams in the east. The east is weak and we can very well get back to the 2007 2008 season. We addid more depth this year and I like are chances. The east is anyone to take in my opinion. Last year injuries played a big part of the habs downfall. When I predict were we are going to finish I all ways like to look at what other teams do and not just what the habs did. The teams that missed the playoffs last year really dident add much except for the leafs and even they did not address a weakness from there previous year wich was that they needid scoring help. Most teams that missed the playoffs dident really make any significant changes except for adding a player here and there wich in most cases was to patch a hole left by another player leaving. And even a few teams that did make the playoffs stayed with pretty much the same roster. Looking at the big picture are chances at finishing among the best are as good as anyone and health will be a key factor like it is in any season
So you're saying the habs stunk last year because we lost Streit. That is the sole reason why we were a laughingstock...
That is exactly what I am saying. Seems to me that Philadephia beat the Habs by overpowering their defensive zone coverage. Adding Lang and Tanguay in the off-season was nice, but I think Gainey was assuming that this would be sufficient to keep the puck in the oppositions zone most off the time, which proved not to be the case. Letting Streit go proved to be fatal.
