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I know its not just that easy, but my point was the NHL (garry bettman) continues to place franchises in bad locations and keep teams away from the evil canadians.
AND the whole succeeding in a market is not happening with teams like TB, Phoenix (I dont have time to look for all of the NHL teams that a losing money). In a canadian market I believe team would be able to maintain die hard fan that will show up every night. And the most important part of succeeding is winning. Last time i checked preds, stars, TB, florida, phoenix, LA were all out of the playoffs. THEY DID NOT SUCCEED.
You realize you just blamed Gary Bettman for the failure of "southern teams" and then listed 6 teams, 5 of which Gary Bettman had nothing to do with the placement of, right?
By your logic is Edmonton a failure? Is Ottawa a failure? Neither of them made the playoffs last year.
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"[Langway] would not have won the Norris without the offensive numbers he had." - Fuhr86
This must be a little bit old. I was watching the highlights and the Thrashers had maybe 5,000 people at the game, even though they reported as 10,000.
Well I was in the building and there were clearly more than 5,000 people.
You realize you just blamed Gary Bettman for the failure of "southern teams" and then listed 6 teams, 5 of which Gary Bettman had nothing to do with the placement of, right?
By your logic is Edmonton a failure? Is Ottawa a failure? Neither of them made the playoffs last year.
You know the argument I was trying to make. The southern teams were more likely to be out of playoff historically. And I wasn't blaming Bettman for the placement of those team but rather for the attitude of wanting to keep those teams there. Canadian teams make up for 31% of ticket revenues. Thats 20% of the teams making up for 31% of the ticket revenue. The main reason is because there are many more fans that want to go to game (so there are frequent sell-outs) and they can charge upward of $400 for a playoff ticket. I'd like to see other teams in the south do that.
ESPN.com provided extensive pics of the game (6 pages of them) so people can judge on their own whether it appears there was a good turn out for the game. I suspect that you are correct and that there were at least or more than 5,000 fans in attendance. See here:
There are 6 pages of pics from the game at the ESPN.com link, not many of which show shots of the crowd, but some select pics can be seen in the below links which are of ESPN.com photo's from the Nov. 5th game:
As has been well documented in other threads, many fans of traditional markets, Canadian or otherwise, have not shown up during prolonged stretches of poor play. The only exceptions are Toronto and Montreal. Boston, Detroit, Edmonton, Vancouver, Chicago, Pittsburgh, Calgary, Ottawa, Minnesota (North Stars) and others have had very noticeable attendance slumps when play has dropped off.
But let me see if I understand your argument in the previous post - you're saying teams that don't win should be moved? And that attendance has a direct correlation to on-ice success? Have you heard of the Toronto Maple Leafs?
The Leafs and Canadians are the exceptions, rather than the rule, as you pointed out in your own post. A lot of teams have trouble when they struggle. But I agree, attendance isn't a 1:1 correlation to team success. The New Jersey Devils have been competitive for years but have struggled to sell out some playoff games in the past.
The Leafs and Canadians are the exceptions, rather than the rule, as you pointed out in your own post. A lot of teams have trouble when they struggle. But I agree, attendance isn't a 1:1 correlation to team success. The New Jersey Devils have been competitive for years but have struggled to sell out some playoff games in the past.
True, we have sold out all 7 playoff games at the Prudential Center, though, while enjoying the same amount of "success" as the first two years after the lockout.
The NY Times reported that NHL attendance is down league wide 1.1% through November 2nd for the same period last year. The Stars, through eight games, report total attendance at 135,648. Last season their number through eight games was 142,981. By my math that is a 5.13% decrease to an average of 16,956.
officially every game has been a "sellout" but anyone who has been to a game or watched a game on tv can say that they havent been selling out.. more empty seats down low.. pushing ticket packages on their website and tv like they havent done in the past.. the only reason they are probably making more money this year is because of all of the price increases they put onto the season ticket holders like me once again
officially every game has been a "sellout" but anyone who has been to a game or watched a game on tv can say that they havent been selling out.. more empty seats down low.. pushing ticket packages on their website and tv like they havent done in the past.. the only reason they are probably making more money this year is because of all of the price increases they put onto the season ticket holders like me once again
it's their right to announce them as sellouts, but they've been out there marketing, and when the Rangers are marketing (think the Czechmates commericals and Bobby Granger after the lockout), they normally have seats to sell.
pretty much everyone other than the Flyers fudge though, and the Flyers probably don't fudge because they're too cheap to buy the tickets.
from looking at boxscores for the last few weeks while I've been gone, it does look like attendance is slumping a bit around the league. Colorado had a bad midweek game recently, which was surprising because they've been much better than expected.... unless they just lost alot of STH's or something
Dallas is being hurt by a down local economy (much of the lower bowl is corporate seats, and those are the tickets that are taking some of the biggest beatings in terms of sales) and the team's ineptitude last year.
I would also think the sky-high prices at JerryWorld (i.e. Cowboys Stadium) hurt the other three teams in the area because those are the gold-standard of corporate tickets, and they're taking a significantly larger cut of the local market now.
From looking at boxscores for the last few weeks while I've been gone, it does look like attendance is slumping a bit around the league. Colorado had a bad midweek game recently, which was surprising because they've been much better than expected....unless they just lost alot of STH's or something
Considering that Colorado was the third worst team last season, had little reason to expect an improvement this season, was about to lose their biggest name and face of the franchise to retirement, still had one of the highest avg ticket prices, and was facing all that during a deep recession - I would guess they lost a lot of STHs.
This is a point that is missed by many here - attendance is (in many cases) as much a function of the teams performance the previous year as it is their current performance. STH are a significant driver of attendance - especially for those mid week games against less popular teams - and the decision to buy season tickets is made in the off season based on the least season's performance and next season's expectations.
Case in point - the San Jose Sharks. The Sharks have had one "bad" season attendance wise. It was not the year ('02-'03) when they crashed and burned (fired the coach and GM midseason, traded away their captain, and missed the playoffs) - it was the following season (when won their division and made the Western Conf finals).
That one bad year eroded the STH base - which had previously been capped at 14K with a waiting list. The lockout further eroded it. It wasn't until the second post-lockout year that it recovered to previous levels.
What I don't get is why people always talk about sell outs like they mean something. I have lived in Edmonton and now live in Vancouver. Both teams sell out almost every game and let's face it neither team has had much to brag about for a long while other then the 06 run by the Oilers. Yet they are also doing it selling nose bleed tickets for almost 50 dollars a ticket while some of the southern teams when they do sell out it's with the you get 2 tickets ,a meal, and beverages all included for 40 dollars. This is the reason sell outs don't mean anything in my opinion.
What I don't get is why people always talk about sell outs like they mean something. I have lived in Edmonton and now live in Vancouver. Both teams sell out almost every game and let's face it neither team has had much to brag about for a long while other then the 06 run by the Oilers. Yet they are also doing it selling nose bleed tickets for almost 50 dollars a ticket while some of the southern teams when they do sell out it's with the you get 2 tickets ,a meal, and beverages all included for 40 dollars. This is the reason sell outs don't mean anything in my opinion.
Exactly...
the blues just sold out on a Thursday...with ticket promos.
we are at like 98 percent capacity for the year with mostly sell outs.
Considering that Colorado was the third worst team last season, had little reason to expect an improvement this season, was about to lose their biggest name and face of the franchise to retirement, still had one of the highest avg ticket prices, and was facing all that during a deep recession - I would guess they lost a lot of STHs.
You would guess correctly (as usual).
And on top of all of those factors, toss in an implied (if not explicit) message from ownership that the primary focus of the summer would be salary dumping, and that competitiveness should not be expected for a few years, along with a Western Conference Finals appearance by the primary seasonal competitor for the local sports entertainment dollar--and Pepsi Center co-tenant... and you have a perfect storm for a ticket base erosion.
one thing people don't realize about the food/drink promos is how little the food and drink is actually worth to the teams.
I can't even imagine what the bulk price for soda or crappy hot dogs is for a huge sports arena. so, if you have a 2 seats, dogs and soda promo for $60, you could price the seats at $29 each, and the dogs and soda at 50 cents apiece, and the team is probably still turning a miniscule profit on both.
Now to find an excuse to go watch my favorite player Stamkos
