109 Seconds

Well, that hurts. Just 109 seconds from the Finals. :banghead:

As hard as I try, I can't find the heart to be all that upset, though. It was too good a game not to enjoy. Hopefully, this just adds to the drama of the championship run. :D

Its TB's on fault, thats what happens when you sit back, and IMO its going to cost them a trip to the final, now way with phillys experience do they lose the Game 7.

Yep, 109 seconds, and I was absolutely gutted. We did sit back too much but I thought we had it done. However Philly must have used all their luck with the Hockey Gods. For Primeau to kick it (if it was deliberate even?) and it go across the crease and straight to him was a fluke, and then even for the winner their were two misdirected plays that land straight on Gagne's stick. It was definately a wraparound attempt. In fairness however Philly had the momentum in OT and may well have gone on to score the winner anyway!

Game 7, and surely its our turn for some real fortune. (Maybe we have to fan on the shot for it to go in!)

Step up Martin St Louis. It's showtime.

Go Bolts.

No kidding. That really sucks and I was about to go to bed thinking they had won this game! :banghead:

Luck is most often the product of hard work. That has been the case for most of the "lucky" bounces in this series, but the stars certainly seem to be aligned for "The Legend" in a way I haven't seen in a long time. He'd fall into a bucket of cheesesteaks eaten by hitchc-ock two days ago and come out smelling like a rose.

it was truly a great game, but the flyers had every chance to win. At times during the 3rd period i thought i was watching the philly wrestling federation- i have never seen so much holding, holding the stick etc. it was down right pathetic and took away from a great game. i fully understand that the refs will let them play but when primeau-donna got away with taking out boyle by going after his knee and not getting a call- well that was just pathetic. yeah I saw Marty's slash on Zhamnov, but marty was being tackled all night, and he had just got punched in the face before he slashed Zhamnov. Yes, we did sit back and yes if we had been more agressive during the 3rd we might have won the game- philly was really pushing. Yet, when philly got close, Frasier calls time-out so they can review and see if they scored, yet when the bolts got close - i think in OT they were not treated the same. So yeah great game but at least put a stop to some of the more obvious holding and grabbing the stick, and dang watch primeau-donna and at least call him on his trips- of andy, and trying to take out someones knee.

it was truly a great game, but the flyers had every chance to win. At times during the 3rd period i thought i was watching the philly wrestling federation- i have never seen so much holding, holding the stick etc. it was down right pathetic and took away from a great game. i fully understand that the refs will let them play but when primeau-donna got away with taking out boyle by going after his knee and not getting a call- well that was just pathetic. yeah I saw Marty's slash on Zhamnov, but marty was being tackled all night, and he had just got punched in the face before he slashed Zhamnov. Yes, we did sit back and yes if we had been more agressive during the 3rd we might have won the game- philly was really pushing. Yet, when philly got close, Frasier calls time-out so they can review and see if they scored, yet when the bolts got close - i think in OT they were not treated the same. So yeah great game but at least put a stop to some of the more obvious holding and grabbing the stick, and dang watch primeau-donna and at least call him on his trips- of andy, and trying to take out someones knee.

I don't want to troll but please be honest there were tons of non calls on both teams.

They actually went upstairs to see if the net was off the crease...directly from the mouth of Gord Miller on TSN.

How about watching Martys High sticks...there were at least 5 from him alone in the last 2 games that were not called. There were also 2 obvious occasions that TB could have been called for to many men on the ice. So don't make it seem so 1 sided because it isn't.

it was truly a great game, but the flyers had every chance to win. At times during the 3rd period i thought i was watching the philly wrestling federation- i have never seen so much holding, holding the stick etc. it was down right pathetic and took away from a great game. i fully understand that the refs will let them play but when primeau-donna got away with taking out boyle by going after his knee and not getting a call- well that was just pathetic. yeah I saw Marty's slash on Zhamnov, but marty was being tackled all night, and he had just got punched in the face before he slashed Zhamnov. Yes, we did sit back and yes if we had been more agressive during the 3rd we might have won the game- philly was really pushing. Yet, when philly got close, Frasier calls time-out so they can review and see if they scored, yet when the bolts got close - i think in OT they were not treated the same. So yeah great game but at least put a stop to some of the more obvious holding and grabbing the stick, and dang watch primeau-donna and at least call him on his trips- of andy, and trying to take out someones knee.





Cue the fiddle...Philly and Tampa fans have more in common than we'd like to admit.
Good luck in game 7...this is where your regular season streak should pay big dividends for you. This is where our "useless experience," should work for us. All in all, excellent series. Terrible reffing but at least it's bad both ways. :)

Reffing has sucked both ways especially in overtime when both teams had guys breaking in for scoring chances (Brako not gonna attempt that last name was tripped and Marty breaking in was pulled down from behind). No one can really beef about the refs being one sided, but I think everyone can agree its been brutal.

Reffing has sucked both ways especially in overtime when both teams had guys breaking in for scoring chances (Brako not gonna attempt that last name was tripped and Marty breaking in was pulled down from behind). No one can really beef about the refs being one sided, but I think everyone can agree its been brutal.

Agreed very brutal both ways. We call Branko "Radio" because most of us can't spell it either. ;)

Reffing has sucked both ways especially in overtime when both teams had guys breaking in for scoring chances (Brako not gonna attempt that last name was tripped and Marty breaking in was pulled down from behind). No one can really beef about the refs being one sided, but I think everyone can agree its been brutal.







They actually put the whistles away and let them play, after Rusty's 2nd goal maybe?

(Brako not gonna attempt that last name was tripped and Marty breaking in was pulled down from behind).

Spell Radivojevic :D

It's all good, I memorised it after we got him. That one is a hell of alot harder than Fedotenko, which is frequently butchered.

Once the whistle got put away, there was plenty of football like tackles on both sides. The refs were brutal last night, but the atrosities extended to both benches.

The refs were brutal. I even couldn't believe some of the things that weren't called on Philly and I am the ultimate homer.

:bow: Preems :bow:

Hey Guy's reat game last night, sorry your team came up short. However, I'm looking forward to game 7. Also have a question, for the last two 3rd periods and last nights overtime, the Bolts seem to have gone in a protective mode. As a Devils fan, I'm much more used to watching our team play this style late in games with a lead, however, I thought the Bolts always attacked no matter the situation. I'm I mistaken, or has coach Tortorella change the teams style with a lead for the playoffs or is it just the Flyers causing problems for the Bolts in the third? Good luck tomorrow night. Hope your team wins or I'll have root for Calagary!

yes, yes and yes... the reffing was brutal and there were a bunch of non calls on both sides, and i did mention marty's slash and yes there have been about 5 of them- although, not to belabor the point when you are being tackled or just held so much sooner or later you will retaliate and the Flyers have really stifeled marty. I just hate it when hockey is reduced to clutching and grabbing- especially when G6 was a really great game in many respects. I have no problem with letting the teams play- I just have a problem with the clutching and grabbing that goes on-while good defense is one thing, holding a guy to prevent him from shooting or taking his feet out are penalties and should be called- even in overtime. Not to sound too much like a homer, but it appeared to me that philly got away with more than the bolts- but that is my perception and it was my perception even during the regular season. partially that is because of reputation and history and the rest is because of the type of players each team has. In no way am I trying to take away from philly's efforts or say that the bolts are blameless for losing a game they had control of- it is just an area of complaint. LOL- yes there are many similarities between the fans also.

The Flyers in fact probably did get away with a lot more than the Bolts. Every time I saw Primeau hit someone, I was expecting some type of call. The reffing is really strange this time of year. The only penalty that would have been called in overtime would have been a high-stick.

Welcome to the playoffs. Thats just the way it is. The players play with more intensity, which the league likes, because the games are more exciting to watch. So they let them battle and swallow the whistles. Its why guys like Bobby Holik and Claude Lemieux thrive this time of year. You cant tell me that the only missed calls were against Philadelphia, or that there was even a significant differential between the number of non calls.

Welcome to the playoffs. Thats just the way it is. The players play with more intensity, which the league likes, because the games are more exciting to watch. So they let them battle and swallow the whistles. Its why guys like Bobby Holik and Claude Lemieux thrive this time of year. You cant tell me that the only missed calls were against Philadelphia, or that there was even a significant differential between the number of non calls.

Of course they weren't just against the Flyers. But the calls that weren't made against them seemed, in some instances, to simply be for more flagrant infractions.

Letting them play is one thing -- but the stuff after the whistle is what bothered me, i.e., a punch to Sarich's face, Roenick shooting the puck into the Lightning bench.

Be that as it may, swallowing the whistle and letting them play is one thing. Completely losing control of the game is another thing entirely, and this game was totally out of control from very early on. Let's face it -- the Lightning were, I believe, the least penalized team in the league this regular season. They're just not used to a game on which the outcome depends on who can get away with the most infractions.

Call me a stupid non-traditional market fan, but I'd rather see the Stanley Cup won by a team playing good hockey, not one that's simply better at cheap-shotting the opposition. :dunno: ( Note: that's true to all teams, not just yours and ours.)

-Sharon

Reffing has sucked both ways especially in overtime when both teams had guys breaking in for scoring chances (Brako not gonna attempt that last name was tripped and Marty breaking in was pulled down from behind). No one can really beef about the refs being one sided, but I think everyone can agree its been brutal.


It is not oneside it is just like you said brutal.

IMO gm6 was a travesty of officiating and a prime example of how it should NOT be done. There is NOWHERE in the rulebook a section that says anything below manslaughter is not a penalty in playoffs.

Guess they will write it off with the typical mumbo-jumbo called game management which is the typical excuse for garbage officiating. Call the game by the rule book and we will have one heck of a playoff. Fail to call it by the book and you create a feeling of this would be so much better if the refs actually knew the rules.

Of course they weren't just against the Flyers. But the calls that weren't made against them seemed, in some instances, to simply be for more flagrant infractions.

Letting them play is one thing -- but the stuff after the whistle is what bothered me, i.e., a punch to Sarich's face, Roenick shooting the puck into the Lightning bench.

Be that as it may, swallowing the whistle and letting them play is one thing. Completely losing control of the game is another thing entirely, and this game was totally out of control from very early on. Let's face it -- the Lightning were, I believe, the least penalized team in the league this regular season. They're just not used to a game on which the outcome depends on who can get away with the most infractions.

Call me a stupid non-traditional market fan, but I'd rather see the Stanley Cup won by a team playing good hockey, not one that's simply better at cheap-shotting the opposition. :dunno: ( Note: that's true to all teams, not just yours and ours.)

-Sharon

Nor should you be. Infractions are infractions since they are NOT legal per the rule book. the rulebook describes what is a penalty etc etc and those rules needs to be followed from game 1 of the preseason to 7887th OT in game 7 of the cup final. It is the refs job to make sure those rules are enforced. And when the ref fails to do so he is also letting the great game of hockey down.

Last night the league would have been much better off without having any refs since they would have saved some $$ on it. I mean whats the point of having 2 officials if they dont want to do there work?

Welcome to the playoffs. Thats just the way it is. The players play with more intensity, which the league likes, because the games are more exciting to watch. So they let them battle and swallow the whistles. Its why guys like Bobby Holik and Claude Lemieux thrive this time of year. You cant tell me that the only missed calls were against Philadelphia, or that there was even a significant differential between the number of non calls.


That point doesnt matter. What matters is Why does the refs think they are above the rulebook and that the rulebook contains some appendix 947274H(III) that says anything below manslaughter is not called. Having officiating like this does NOT make the game better. It takes AWAY from the game. If i want to see garbage entertainment i can watch WWF or something. This time of the year you want to watch HOCKEY but the way it gets called the game isnt hockey anymore it is something that has a resemblance of a hockey game with mix in of i dont know what but it sure as hell isnt hockey

Did people really expect teams to get power plays in a game that had featured 7 goals through 40 minutes? everyone complains when the refs make a call and "decides the game" and now people are complaining there wasn't any calls (and I realize Flyer fans are here saying TB got jobbed as well, I agree with this). We know what the rules are and we know what the precident is. Only 2 non-concurrent penalties get called in playoff overtime, or the 3rd period on a consistent basis...4-minute high sticks and too many men on the ice.

I understand that disregarding the rule book come the playoffs and particularly in the latter stages of those games is an NHL tradition (a stupid one, but that's just my opinion), but can anyone explain how this perversion of calling games came to be?

Can you imagine if the three major sports operated in this fashion? No pass interference, holding or personal fouls in football? A repeat of Gregg's disgusting strike zone that handed the Marlins their first championship? I haven't watched a punk-ball game in 15 so I have no point of reference.

All of us hockey fans must be 'rasslin fans at heart to accept what passes for officiating in the NHL playoffs. Could be a factor in the declining popularity of the sport.

If Theodore Long could skate, he'd be a step up from Kerry Fraser and his sprayed on helmet.

I understand that disregarding the rule book come the playoffs and particularly in the latter stages of those games is an NHL tradition (a stupid one, but that's just my opinion), but can anyone explain how this perversion of calling games came to be?

An excellent question. I know a lot of people like this "let 'em play" business, but not me. I don't like seeing guys get brutalized and/or held, that's not what I'm watching hockey for, and it just got worse as the game went on. The OT was absolutely ridiculous, there was probably a tripping every 30 seconds by both teams. I don't expect them to call it then, but this kind of crap could have been avoided had the refs actually called the infractions early on. It became clear pretty early that they weren't going to call squat, so by the end it was a free-for-all.

Congrats on post 100 Flycoon! :handclap:

I agree wholeheartedly Flycoon -- it drives me crazy that penalties that would be called in the regular season are not called in playoffs, or that what would be a penalty in the first period is not called in the third. In that respect, I like football better - if it's a foul in the first week of the season, it's a foul in the Superbowl. If the refs starting calling everything, the players would learn what is and isn't accptable (perhaps the hard way).

Having said that, both teams were the beneficiaries/victims of the refs putting their whistles away in the third period and OT last night.

I dunno, the Patriots got away with a lot of mugging of receivers in the NFL playoffs. The Colts game was a prime example and there was a lot of *****ing about it afterwards. The better thing about the NFL is, they actually RESPOND to these complaints though and really DO emphasize areas that they have been weak at calling in the past. I fully expect them to crack down on that next season, whereas with NHL officiating we all know the "crackdown" lasts about a month.

Letting them play is one thing -- but the stuff after the whistle is what bothered me, i.e., a punch to Sarich's face,

Sarich did get punched in the face, right after he punched Handzus in the stomach. Woops.

There is a reason players like it when Fraser calls a game, you know how it will be called. Everyone can agree that this was a great game to watch, so obviously it didn't hurt the entertainment value. You didn't see many players complain about noncalls, because they knew it wasn't goign to be called. I'd put money down that if you interviewed all the players and coaches that game, they'd support the officiating crew in how they called it that game. Hitchcock went out of his way to say that Fraser called a hell of a game, and that is saying a lot.

Sarich did get punched in the face, right after he punched Handzus in the stomach. Woops.

There is a reason players like it when Fraser calls a game, you know how it will be called. Everyone can agree that this was a great game to watch, so obviously it didn't hurt the entertainment value. You didn't see many players complain about noncalls, because they knew it wasn't goign to be called. I'd put money down that if you interviewed all the players and coaches that game, they'd support the officiating crew in how they called it that game. Hitchcock went out of his way to say that Fraser called a hell of a game, and that is saying a lot.


Coming from Hitchcock it has no relevance since he have proven already this playoff year he is a clueless yuppie behind the bench.

If that is good officiating than you need to actually see a GOOD officiated game where the refs let the players play HOCKEY to decide the outcome of the game. I am sure he is happy about the non calls since his teams powerplay stinks more than a million lbs of dung while tampa can light up the red lamp at will on the powerplay

Sarich did get punched in the face, right after he punched Handzus in the stomach. Woops.

Was that before or after the whistle? I didn't see the Sarich punch when it happened or on replay, which was dedicated to the shot to Sarich's mug. I was outside the arena with about 2,000+ people watching a 20' screen TV that didn't have the best of pictures, so I very well may have missed it. If Cory punched Handzus after the whistle, then that evens out. And both would be wrong.

Did any Lightning player shoot the puck into the Flyers' bench after a stoppage in play? :)

There is a reason players like it when Fraser calls a game, you know how it will be called.

I think the more accurate terminology would be "how it will not be called."

I'd put money down that if you interviewed all the players and coaches that game, they'd support the officiating crew in how they called it that game. Hitchcock went out of his way to say that Fraser called a hell of a game, and that is saying a lot.

I don't know, I did hear the ESPN crew comment that the Tampa Bay coaching staff was... what word did they use? Oh, yes, "livid" with the officiating...

I guess it all comes down to what one wants to see, thuggery or skilled hockey. I'll take the latter, thanks very much, with no dissing whatsoever of those who prefer the former. It just drives me crazy that the entire season is pretty much based on, well, playing hockey, but the playoffs are based on how much one team can beat up the other one. I guess that could be "entertaining," although I personally find a nice goal that puts the water bottle about 6' in the air far more entertaining than watching a player (on any team) get smacked in the face with a hockey stick. To each his or her own.

-Sharon

Having said that, both teams were the beneficiaries/victims of the refs putting their whistles away in the third period and OT last night.

But, not calling the game as intended benefits the Flyers more than the Bolts. They get away with more hooking and grabbing and that does everything in slowing the Bolts down.

Games should be called the same way in game one of the regular season to the last game in the Stanley Cup championship, period. And saying the refs don't want to cause a team to lose is rediculous. Not calling the game as intended will do the same thing.

Was that before or after the whistle? I didn't see the Sarich punch when it happened or on replay, which was dedicated to the shot to Sarich's mug. I was outside the arena with about 2,000+ people watching a 20' screen TV that didn't have the best of pictures, so I very well may have missed it. If Cory punched Handzus after the whistle, then that evens out. And both would be wrong.

Did any Lightning player shoot the puck into the Flyers' bench after a stoppage in play? :)



I think the more accurate terminology would be "how it will not be called."



I don't know, I did hear the ESPN crew comment that the Tampa Bay coaching staff was... what word did they use? Oh, yes, "livid" with the officiating...

I guess it all comes down to what one wants to see, thuggery or skilled hockey. I'll take the latter, thanks very much, with no dissing whatsoever of those who prefer the former. It just drives me crazy that the entire season is pretty much based on, well, playing hockey, but the playoffs are based on how much one team can beat up the other one. I guess that could be "entertaining," although I personally find a nice goal that puts the water bottle about 6' in the air far more entertaining than watching a player (on any team) get smacked in the face with a hockey stick. To each his or her own.

-Sharon

It was after the whistle, directly before the shot to the face. So yes, it all evens out.

I'm pretty sure they ment to say Tampa RADIO and not coaching staff, but I may be wrong.

I don't think anyone can say that the overtime was thuggery, not skilled play. It was great action, and complaining about it is just sour grapes.

Was that before or after the whistle? I didn't see the Sarich punch when it happened or on replay, which was dedicated to the shot to Sarich's mug. I was outside the arena with about 2,000+ people watching a 20' screen TV that didn't have the best of pictures, so I very well may have missed it. If Cory punched Handzus after the whistle, then that evens out. And both would be wrong.

Did any Lightning player shoot the puck into the Flyers' bench after a stoppage in play? :)



I think the more accurate terminology would be "how it will not be called."



I don't know, I did hear the ESPN crew comment that the Tampa Bay coaching staff was... what word did they use? Oh, yes, "livid" with the officiating...

I guess it all comes down to what one wants to see, thuggery or skilled hockey. I'll take the latter, thanks very much, with no dissing whatsoever of those who prefer the former. It just drives me crazy that the entire season is pretty much based on, well, playing hockey, but the playoffs are based on how much one team can beat up the other one. I guess that could be "entertaining," although I personally find a nice goal that puts the water bottle about 6' in the air far more entertaining than watching a player (on any team) get smacked in the face with a hockey stick. To each his or her own.

-Sharon


Skilled hockey is a pure think of beauty to watch and enjoy, thuggery and gooning is just a plain travesty of hockey. And the way Mr 2 Lbs of hairgel called it, the game have no resemblance of hockey anymore. that is pretty sad when those words have to be used to describe the level of lack of officiating that takes place.

I have a feeling too many enjoy this goonery thugs style of hockey since they have never gotten used to see highly skilled technical players on a regular basis since they all have been buried under the thugs and goons level that seems to be a must to maintain in hockey for certain fans to find it enjoyable.

Thugs and goons is what you need to do to maintain any kind of chance to survive in a game where you are outtalented in every aspect of the game. When it is too fast for you, you automatically turn into the trippings the slashing and the clutch and grab boring hockey that is ruining the game.

The refs just needs to call the game by the book. I mean give a decent excuse for why you shouldnt follow the rulebook of a sport just because it is playoff time. I personally can not find one. So please someone let us know why the rulebook have no value anymore and why that is good.

I dunno, the Patriots got away with a lot of mugging of receivers in the NFL playoffs. The Colts game was a prime example and there was a lot of *****ing about it afterwards. The better thing about the NFL is, they actually RESPOND to these complaints though and really DO emphasize areas that they have been weak at calling in the past. I fully expect them to crack down on that next season, whereas with NHL officiating we all know the "crackdown" lasts about a month.

if that long. this year i would say the slashings that they where to call lasted about 3 weeks tops.

The coaches knows it the GM's knows it the players knows it. EVERYTHING that is getting the crackdown on label will only be called for a couple weeks or so in October and once November rolls in it is probably forgotten already.

Perhaps the league should try the call it by the book approach from game 1 of the regular season and do it the whole year. That would frankly be a very new thing for hockey and it would probably help the game a lot. I mean why have rules if you dont enforce them.

Same is in the public socitity if you make laws that you dont enforce it, the law have no meaning. u make a speed limit of 55mph but if you never check the speeding it is a pointless speedlimit rule. where you can say max 55 mph but if you go 100 noone will do anything against it. Thats the current state of hockey officiating they have the 55mph limit in the books but they dont call those that run at 100 which makes the limit become a free for all state of the game

And the way it got called in game 6 the refs could not call a single penalty in the later part of the game regardless of what happened since BOTH teams would scream FOUL if they called anything since the refs had let it all get out of hand so bad that they could not get it back anymore

I'm pretty sure they ment to say Tampa RADIO and not coaching staff, but I may be wrong.

Not sure how the ESPN crew would know what was going on with the Tampa radio broadcast... I've got the tape going, if I last to that point, I'll let you know what they said.

I don't think anyone can say that the overtime was thuggery, not skilled play. It was great action, and complaining about it is just sour grapes.

Not at all. We didn't play our game, we tried to play defense for 40 minutes. That's never worked for us & why they fell into that is beyond me. We got exactly what we deserved, which was the loss. We had the win and gave it back to your team. I didn't like the loss but I blame no one but the Tampa Bay Lightning for it. No sour grapes here.

-Sharon

I dunno, the Patriots got away with a lot of mugging of receivers in the NFL playoffs. The Colts game was a prime example and there was a lot of *****ing about it afterwards. The better thing about the NFL is, they actually RESPOND to these complaints though and really DO emphasize areas that they have been weak at calling in the past. I fully expect them to crack down on that next season, whereas with NHL officiating we all know the "crackdown" lasts about a month.






Total agreeance here...I'm also a disgruntled Colts fan. :banghead: I'd almost forgotten the "Hold Me Bowl." :banghead:

Not sure how the ESPN crew would know what was going on with the Tampa radio broadcast... I've got the tape going, if I last to that point, I'll let you know what they said.



Not at all. We didn't play our game, we tried to play defense for 40 minutes. That's never worked for us & why they fell into that is beyond me. We got exactly what we deserved, which was the loss. We had the win and gave it back to your team. I didn't like the loss but I blame no one but the Tampa Bay Lightning for it. No sour grapes here.

-Sharon





You never had a win...that's determined after 60 or more minutes not 59. Too much skill sucks...we have enough. No offense but you were pinned in your own end by a heavy forecheck that your players weren't capable of handling for fear of making a mistake or getting pasted. You were only in game 6 because Esche let you...that's better than thinking the Lightning deserved to win...cause the Flyers owned them when Tampa should have been coming hard. Gonna be a great game 7. :)

You never had a win...that's determined after 60 or more minutes not 59.

OK, let me rephrase -- the win was ours for the taking but in playing not to lose, we accomplished exactly the opposite.

that's better than thinking the Lightning deserved to win...

Hmmm. I said: We got exactly what we deserved, which was the loss.

I guess the "thinking the Lightning deserved to win" was actually directed to someone else?

:)

-Sharon

Had Sydor and/or Sarich shown up for that game, we would have seen a different result. Neither goaltender played well, and Philly deserved to win the game. Game 7 ought to be one hell of a battle.

I refs had some sort of vendetta against the Lightning. There were so many non calls that gave Philly prime scoring chances, and minor stuff that was called on the Lightning, it was ridiculous. Michken was right on the money when he said the officials took the momentum away from the Lightning and gave it to the Flyers when they scored those 2 goals to before the first intermission.

And as soon as the Lightning finally do get a miracle PP they score...so right back to the letting Philly **** the Bolts. This cue has got to stop in game 7 if Lightning are to get to the Finals.

I refs had some sort of vendetta against the Lightning.

There's no referee conspiracy against Tampa Bay.

It has always been the case that the officials will swallow their whistles in the playoffs, particularly during the third period and OT, particularly in games that could potentially decide a series.

This, of course, has the effect of punishing teams who rely heavily on speed and skill while rewarding teams who rely heavily on tight checking and physical play.

Unfortunately for us, Tampa falls in the former category, Philly in the latter. It's nothing personal.

I know you all don't like hearing this, but play nice please, or this is getting closed.

There's no referee conspiracy against Tampa Bay.

It has always been the case that the officials will swallow their whistles in the playoffs, particularly during the third period and OT, particularly in games that could potentially decide a series.

This, of course, has the effect of punishing teams who rely heavily on speed and skill while rewarding teams who rely heavily on tight checking and physical play.

Unfortunately for us, Tampa falls in the former category, Philly in the latter. It's nothing personal.


^^
My thoughts exactly.

I can't tell you how pleased I am that the legacy of the 2004 TB Playoffs will not be "109 Seconds," much like the Titans 2000 Super Bowl run is known as "One More Yard."

Huge, huge, huge mental fortitude to put Game 6 behind them and come out strong tonight.

Re: REFS...

Feaster was on WDAE tonight about 30 minutes after the win talking about stuff like the decision to go with 7 dmen, etc.

Then the subject of the refs came up.

As has been mentioned here, he doesn't agree that "letting the players decide it" is really letting the players decide it. He was talking about how if a team is based on skill and skating, then how is letting the other team clutch, grab, pick, etc letting BOTH teams play? It caters to one style. If penalties aren't called, the skill team is pretty much out of luck.

I thought those were pretty good comments.

This is probably served for the game thread, but I thought the Flyers had the best forecheck I've ever seen in this series. TB has been great all year in gaining the puck along the wall and getting the puck out. And it wasn't just the Flyers big guys, it was guys like Amonte and Recchi, too. The fact that TB overcame that was absolutely unbelievable.

This is probably served for the game thread, but I thought the Flyers had the best forecheck I've ever seen in this series. TB has been great all year in gaining the puck along the wall and getting the puck out. And it wasn't just the Flyers big guys, it was guys like Amonte and Recchi, too. The fact that TB overcame that was absolutely unbelievable.

The differenece in the game tonight IMO.

The Flyers had nothing left in the tank tonight. No legs to get in and establish the forecheck and punish the Tampa defense.

The tank was completely emptied in the 3rd period and OT of game 6.

Only chance they had tonight was to score early and play with the lead, because there wasn't enough energy left to mount another comeback.

Good post john and you could tell that by the lack of jump the Flyers had and the push the Bolts had at the end of the game. the Bolts kept pushing the puck up and the Flyers were on their heels. in terms of the refs- they must be consistent and give the skilled players the opportunity to show their talent- hockey is a beautiful sport that combines speed grace and skill, and thuggery just wastes the thrill of hockey. i really hate the clutching and grabbing and just wish the refs would call it that would help put an end to it. There were some interesting calls tonight that could have had a real impact on the game but the last one was the one that should have Flyer fans up in arms- the call on sydor and Amonte- hooking and diving- we were stunned that the ref made that call- we thought Sydor would get 2 for hooking but the equalizer to Amonte just stunned us.From our vantage point it appeared that Amonte dove as soon as he had control of sydor's stick- that is what it looked like in the replay. But that call could just have easily been a non-call on amonte.

Only chance they had tonight was to score early and play with the lead, because there wasn't enough energy left to mount another comeback.

Yeah, Philly late in Game 6 and Philly late in Game 7 were two different Philly's. TB had a little something to with that, but IMO, that was indeed a big factor.

Tampa still had energy, which brought back memories of my trip to training camp this year (aka Camp Torture-ella) and watching every player skate for a ... well, torturous ... amount of time, then do more skating drills, then more laps and sprints and more laps. Guys legs were like jello, players gasping for air, but if not for that, who knows if TB has anything left after getting pounded in Game 6?

Let's not forget Torts was rotating all 4 lines in Game 6, too, whereas the Flyers were basically down to their top 2 in desperation.

Good post Hoek, yeah Torts not only rotated well to keep people fresh, but using 7 d-men last night was a stroke of genius. They did not get burned out and were able to match philly's intensity early and have energy for late in the game when we needed it. The play of dinger and roy was really energetic and dinger really played his best game of the series last night. Both of them added a lot of energy when it was needed, especially in the 3rd. It was real interesting to see philly slow down during parts of the 2nd period and then in the 3rd they just did not have the energy to mount a comeback. In fact primeau was invisible for parts of the game. other than his breakawy he did not do a lot. We noticed that after his breakaway he did not play much until the 3rd. i wonder if he hurt his head or back when he crashed into the net? Kuby's play there was exceptional, he threw primeau offbalance just enough to help Khabby make the stop.

Let's not forget Torts was rotating all 4 lines in Game 6, too, whereas the Flyers were basically down to their top 2 in desperation.

The Flyers played 4 lines as much as Tampa did in game 6. For the most part the Flyers are much more of a 4 line team than Tampa, who goes with three lines for the most part.

The freshness factor went in Tampa's favor for a few reasons:

#1. Health.

#2. Scoring first, so that they were playing with the lead for much more than the Flyers were. Mounting comebacks is far more tiring than protecting a lead.

The freshness factor went in Tampa's favor for a few reasons:

#1. Health.
As was brought up on another board, Tampa's players are less healthy than people seem to think. We'll hear more about this in a week or two.

#2. Scoring first, so that they were playing with the lead for much more than the Flyers were. Mounting comebacks is far more tiring than protecting a lead.
That was much more of a factor IMO. If Tampa hadn't managed to score first, things might have been very different. Philly is a killer with the lead, it seems to me. Esche was brilliant, BTW, he made some sick sick saves at the end, definitely a keeper for you guys, and still not at a goalies' "peak" years.

As was brought up on another board, Tampa's players are less healthy than people seem to think. We'll hear more about this in a week or two.


Nobody is healthy this time of year, but in comarison the Bolts are far healthier than the Flyers.

It's not a knock on the Bolts, just a fact. You need some breaks to win the Cup, and staying healthy is among the most important.

Nobody is healthy this time of year, but in comarison the Bolts are far healthier than the Flyers.


No question the Bolts were healthier. I'm not sure I'd say they were far healthier, though.

No question the Bolts were healthier. I'm not sure I'd say they were far healthier, though.

I would.

Desjardins our #1 defenseman missed the entire series.
Ragnarsson our #3 defenseman missed games 4-7
Johnsson our #2 defenseman playing with a broken hand.
Markov our #4/5 defenseman playing with a broken foot.

Seidenberg our #8 defenseman at about 70% returning from a broken leg.

Somik - 4th liner - missed games 5-7 with a broken hand.
Roenick suffered a concussion in game 4, should not have been playing.

Zhamnov & Recchi also suffering from undisclosed - "upper/lower body injuries"

Tampa

Cullimore your 3rd/4th defenseman missed games 1-6
Lukowich your 5th defenseman missed 2 games

I'm sure that a number of your players are also playing hurt, as all teams have at this time.

Bottom line is that the Flyers, especially the blueline was far more banged up.

Evidently, one thing we did better than the Flyers is keep the identity of those with broken bones secret. As I have said, wait and you shall see.

Evidently, one thing we did better than the Flyers is keep the identity of those with broken bones secret. As I have said, wait and you shall see.

Either way they were able to play.

The difference being able to play, and not being able to play is a rather large.

I would.

And you'd be wrong.

Cullimore, our top-pair defenseman, missed all but 12 minutes of the entire series with a broken wrist.
Sarich, our top-pair defenseman, clearly struggling with one of those mysterious "upper-body injuries."
Lukowich, our 4/5 defenseman, missed 2 games and wasn't the same after a concussion.
Neckar, our 7th defenseman, at about 75% coming off a groin injury.
Stillman, our second leading scorer, badly hobbled to the point of ineffectiveness by a hip injury.

And then there are others (including to key players) that have not been disclosed, so I won't mention them here.

I'd say your forwards were more banged up, not your blueline.

But not far more banged up.

And you'd be wrong.

Cullimore, our top-pair defenseman, missed all but 12 minutes of the entire series with a broken wrist.
Sarich, our top-pair defenseman, clearly struggling with one of those mysterious "upper-body injuries."
Lukowich, our 4/5 defenseman, missed 2 games and wasn't the same after a concussion.
Neckar, our 7th defenseman, at about 75% coming off a groin injury.
Stillman, our second leading scorer, badly hobbled to the point of ineffectiveness by a hip injury.

And, apparently, there are others that have not been disclosed.

I'd say your forwards were more banged up, not your blueline.

But not far more banged up.

I disagree wholeheartedly, and we'll leave it at that.

Good Luck in the Finals.

I believe that Tampa will win, as IMO the Eastern Conference is clearly the stronger conference in the NHL again.

Neckar, our 7th defenseman,

And with Cully's return, Nechar becomes our 8th defenseman - YES!!!

I disagree wholeheartedly, and we'll leave it at that.

Cool.


Good Luck in the Finals.


Thanks.


I believe that Tampa will win, as IMO the Eastern Conference is clearly the stronger conference in the NHL again.

Agreed. The ECF was really the SCF, IMO.

Good luck fellas, TBay played tremendously...full marks to your squad. That goes from Top of the organization down all the way to the fans. That home ice seemed big and you earned it for game 7...we posed the problems for you that many of us thought we could but your team was gutty and survived and even dished back on the way. I'd say your team grew tremendously through this series in particular...but beware Calgary...Buzzsaw.

There's no referee conspiracy against Tampa Bay.

It has always been the case that the officials will swallow their whistles in the playoffs, particularly during the third period and OT, particularly in games that could potentially decide a series.

This, of course, has the effect of punishing teams who rely heavily on speed and skill while rewarding teams who rely heavily on tight checking and physical play.

Unfortunately for us, Tampa falls in the former category, Philly in the latter. It's nothing personal.

How about during the first period? Game 6, first period; it sure seemed like it was the latter. Maybe the speed/skill assesment had something to do with it, but come on. Lets not be too objective, im usually the first to admit that the referees call the game both ways...and if they did, they sure missed alot of calls against the Lightning that were screaming for a whistle.

Unbiased (I like to think so anyway) observer........I've seen things that could have been called either way but weren't..........on the one hand its good because its playoff time........and lets just let them play. The problem with this is that there really is no consistency whatsoever. One ref is of the "good ole boy" school who will let em hack, slash, trip obstruct...etc..etc...cuz its the playoffs, but then the ref for the next game.......hell oftentimes its the other ref during the same game...or even the 1st ref (who's had a inexplicable change of mind) who calls every little thing? The players for the most part don't know what's a penalty from one game to the next...or even from one minute to the next. :dunno:

The players for the most part don't know what's a penalty from one game to the next...or even from one minute to the next. :dunno:
I think you've hit the problems with the officiating squarely on the head. :)