Devils fans should be hanging their head in shame

Could not even sell out a playoff game against one of your biggest rivals.

I have a feeling this thread is going to turn...oogly! :eek:

Its really comical to me. I might be in the minority, or it could just be my Ranger bias.........but I think I would rather have sucked like we have the past 7 years than have no fan support and play a dreadfully boring style of hockey. I mean I would love to win, but I wouldn't sell my soul to the Devil (pun intender) ,in the form of their suffocating trap ,to win. It's kind of like me wanting to watch a Mike Tyson fight over the prospects of watching a Lennox Lewis fight.

It truely is disgusting that a recent 3 time Cup Champ can't even sell out a F'in playoff game vs the Flyers of all teams, their 2nd biggest rival.

And what's even more sad is that at least a couple of thousand fans in attendance were FLYER fans.

All that BS about the place being so hard to get to and nonsense about the traffic are exposed for the BS they are b/c that may fly for an excuse in a regular season game but last night shows that nobody gives a sh%^ about the Devils.

I dunno, I feel bad for the Devils in a sense. They have built a great organization, and no-one shows up for them. Then again, I have a bunch of friends who are Devils fans, and most of them are pretty die-hard.

I also would hate to see the Rangers play a pure trap; however, while I can't stand a pure clutch-and-grab hockey team, a team that plays an efficient, disciplined, well coached, defensive system can be a joy to watch. There's a difference between a skilled defensive team, and a team of scrubs hooking and holding because that's all they can do. I actually find the Wild and the Devils interesting teams to watch sometimes. I recall that when Jacques Lemaire was first coaching the Devils, everyone was talking about his "Montreal system" of defensive hockey, not the "trap".

OK, that's enough defending the Devils--I'm going to go and wash my mouth out with soap...

Its really comical to me. I might be in the minority, or it could just be my Ranger bias.........but I think I would rather have sucked like we have the past 7 years than have no fan support and play a dreadfully boring style of hockey. I mean I would love to win, but I wouldn't sell my soul to the Devil (pun intender) ,in the form of their suffocating trap ,to win. It's kind of like me wanting to watch a Mike Tyson fight over the prospects of watching a Lennox Lewis fight.

Thats ok...... I could deal with a few empty seats, and a somewhat boring style of hockey if it meant a few Stanley Cups, and a team that has the ability to win every given year.

It truely is disgusting that a recent 3 time Cup Champ can't even sell out a F'in playoff game vs the Flyers of all teams, their 2nd biggest rival.

And what's even more sad is that at least a couple of thousand fans in attendance were FLYER fans.

All that BS about the place being so hard to get to and nonsense about the traffic are exposed for the BS they are b/c that may fly for an excuse in a regular season game but last night shows that nobody gives a sh%^ about the Devils.


i agree....no excuses for not selling out a playoff game. Its a shame because i find their fans to be pretty learned and intense, just not enough of them though. :shakehead

Thats ok...... I could deal with a few empty seats, and a somewhat boring style of hockey if it meant a few Stanley Cups, and a team that has the ability to win every given year.


I agree…

In one hand you have boring hockey, questionable fan support, 3 Cups since ’95 and generally an odd on favorite to win it every year since, when, the ‘93-‘94 season?

Now in the other hand you have boring hockey, unquestionable fan support, 7 consecutive miserable seasons, 4 Cups in 80 years, and the undisputed champs as one of the most embarrassing, most disgraceful franchises in sports history.

Hmmm…I’ll take the Devils, thanks.

Its really comical to me. I might be in the minority, or it could just be my Ranger bias.........but I think I would rather have sucked like we have the past 7 years than have no fan support and play a dreadfully boring style of hockey. I mean I would love to win, but I wouldn't sell my soul to the Devil (pun intender) ,in the form of their suffocating trap ,to win. It's kind of like me wanting to watch a Mike Tyson fight over the prospects of watching a Lennox Lewis fight.


Have you actually watched the Devils lately? Patrik Elias, Gomez and gionta have formed an extremely exciting line to watch...Niedermayer skates like the wind...and the best goalie in the world..I don't find that too boring...

Anyway, not looking for a fight...what I don't understand is how the Devils sellout the last two games of the year and then don't sell out the first game of the playoffs?? I'll never understand the fans in NJ...It was fun last night at the game..with lots of up and down action.

Jersey - horrible public transportation, horrible roads, Meadowlands is a horrible location, the Devs have never really reached out to all of Jersey. Lots of reasons why they don't sell tickets for that team. It's a shame, like the Devs fan pointed out - they have/had great players and one of the best goalies & D-men ever, but even near a major market like NYC, sports fans hardly know about them.

Just imagine what the attendance would be if they missed the playoffs for a couple of years..... 6500 ???

Jersey - horrible public transportation, horrible roads, Meadowlands is a horrible location, the Devs have never really reached out to all of Jersey. Lots of reasons why they don't sell tickets for that team. It's a shame, like the Devs fan pointed out - they have/had great players and one of the best goalies & D-men ever, but even near a major market like NYC, sports fans hardly know about them.


Was thinking the same things. Location plays a big role. Moving to Newark isn't going to help them.

MSG is smack in the middle of all the hustle and bustle of Manhattan. Also, for 9 bucks you can hop on a train and get delivered right into the basement of the damn place.

Was thinking the same things. Location plays a big role. Moving to Newark isn't going to help them.

MSG is smack in the middle of all the hustle and bustle of Manhattan. Also, for 9 bucks you can hop on a train and get delivered right into the basement of the damn place.

Yes, the location sucks ... and yet, the Jets and Giants manage to sell out every game with about 70,000 people. So I think people could get there if there is interest. The issue is they don't have the fan base.

For the defending Stanley Cup champs, to not sell out there first playoff game against a big rival (especially when the rival fans probably bought 2000-3000 tickets) is unexcusable.

Thats ok...... I could deal with a few empty seats, and a somewhat boring style of hockey if it meant a few Stanley Cups, and a team that has the ability to win every given year.
Well they dont win it every year, they won 3 times. Yea thats great and certainly a good accomplishment but it has to be an empty feeling when you realize that no one cares. As a NJ resident I can attest to the fact that the support for the Devils is sooo weak it's ridiculous. No one cares about them. Kids would come to school in Ranger jerseys, and this is in New Jersey. That's like a high school kid wearing a Yankee Jersey in Boston, it shouldnt happen. There is only one person that I can recall who wore a Devil jersey to school and actually followed the team. I'm sorry, winning is fabulous and swell but it mean nothing to me if you dont have the respect and support from the people that you are supposedly representing. I'll gladly accept the futility and agrivation of being a Ranger fan, just as those Cub fans and those Red Sox fans do. Do you think any of them would trade their franchise to that of the Diamondbacks or that of the Angels? I think not. What matters to me is loyalty, comraderie, and the passion that goes along with my team. Winning isnt always everything.

Yes, the location sucks ... and yet, the Jets and Giants manage to sell out every game with about 70,000 people. So I think people could get there if there is interest. The issue is they don't have the fan base.

For the defending Stanley Cup champs, to not sell out there first playoff game against a big rival (especially when the rival fans probably bought 2000-3000 tickets) is unexcusable.

You can't compare the Devils games to Once a week Football games(8 home games per year) .

But yes, since they are the defending Champs, a sellout for the first home playoff game is a must, anything less reflects badly on the franchise.

Well they dont win it every year, they won 3 times. Yea thats great and certainly a good accomplishment but it has to be an empty feeling when you realize that no one cares. As a NJ resident I can attest to the fact that the support for the Devils is sooo weak it's ridiculous. No one cares about them. Kids would come to school in Ranger jerseys, and this is in New Jersey. That's like a high school kid wearing a Yankee Jersey in Boston, it shouldnt happen. There is only one person that I can recall who wore a Devil jersey to school and actually followed the team. I'm sorry, winning is fabulous and swell but it mean nothing to me if you dont have the respect and support from the people that you are supposedly representing. I'll gladly accept the futility and agrivation of being a Ranger fan, just as those Cub fans and those Red Sox fans do. Do you think any of them would trade their franchise to that of the Diamondbacks or that of the Angels? I think not. What matters to me is loyalty, comraderie, and the passion that goes along with my team. Winning isnt always everything.

And in Central Jersey the hockey fans are mostly Flyer diehards.

And in Central Jersey the hockey fans are mostly Flyer diehards.

hey!! watch that! i'm central jersey!
:eek: i will say there are alot of devils fans and flyer fans in my area as there are alot of ranger fans too! what the devils need to do is move the team to a more central location like new brunswick and they would sell out every night! i know if i was a devil fan and having to drive the turnpike to exit 16 would suck! i know i wouldn't drive that every night they have a home game!

Its really comical to me. I might be in the minority, or it could just be my Ranger bias.........but I think I would rather have sucked like we have the past 7 years than have no fan support and play a dreadfully boring style of hockey. I mean I would love to win, but I wouldn't sell my soul to the Devil (pun intender) ,in the form of their suffocating trap ,to win.

Then you must be one happy camper. :lol

You have "better" fans, a more "exciting" style...and nothing to show for it whatsoever.

Fan apathy in NJ (a valid criticism) should not be confused with style of play, which, in turn, should not be used to diminish accomplishment. It's so petty and illogical.

(And before you jump on me JR :), I'm ripping NYI "fans" today for tanking on their team last night after the team was down 2-0, with 50 minutes left in the game! Weak.)

Saying that no one cares is a little ridiculous....Averaging 15,000 per game in the swamp...Obviously hockey is a second tier sport and it gets less coverage...but as Mike Lupica said " If the Rangers left NY, about 20,000 people would care"

What's really hard to figure out is not only that they are not selling out but that they are not selling out against the Flyers (for who's fans it would not be a very long trip to make). And they are advertising tickets on TV and radio!

hey!! watch that! i'm central jersey!
:eek: i will say there are alot of devils fans and flyer fans in my area as there are alot of ranger fans too! what the devils need to do is move the team to a more central location like new brunswick and they would sell out every night! i know if i was a devil fan and having to drive the turnpike to exit 16 would suck! i know i wouldn't drive that every night they have a home game!

Sick, I've lived in West Windsor, East Windsor, Princeton, Mercerville..... all over that place, and I played in Men's league there. Yes, there are ALOT of Ranger fans there, but mostly Flyers fans, no contest.

Sick, I've lived in West Windsor, East Windsor, Princeton, Mercerville..... all over that place, and I played in Men's league there. Yes, there are ALOT of Ranger fans there, but mostly Flyers fans, no contest.

you lived in east windsor? wow i grew up, basiclly, in twin rivers! yeah, i guess your right on that! maybe i just don't associate myself with them, barring flyers26!

Could not even sell out a playoff game against one of your biggest rivals.they couldn't sell out the SFC finals last year till game day

Then you must be one happy camper. :lol

You have "better" fans, a more "exciting" style...and nothing to show for it whatsoever.

Fan apathy in NJ (a valid criticism) should not be confused with style of play, which, in turn, should not be used to diminish accomplishment. It's so petty and illogical.

(And before you jump on me JR :), I'm ripping NYI "fans" today for tanking on their team last night after the team was down 2-0, with 50 minutes left in the game! Weak.)
Don't get me wrong, I would love to win and I do envy the success that New Jersey has garnered. But I would rather have gone through periods of losing and frustration with a pinnacle of success here(94) and hopefully there in the near future, all the while having a committed and broad fan base. To me it just makes the victories that much sweeter. I mean, would it be more exciting to be an Angels fan when they won the Series or would it be more exciting to be a Red Sox fan or a Cubs fan when they finally end their suffering. I dont know, it just feels more rewarding to suffer for a while and then rise to the top. I swear that the atmosphere in my area was more electric and intense during the Rangers '97 Conferance Finals appearance than it was last year when the Devils won the Cup. I agree that the Devils are a fantastic franchise with a good group of intelligent and passionate fans, and it is a shame that so much of New Jersey has not opened up to the team, but the fact remains that the atmosphere surrounding the Devils pales in comparisson to that of the of the Rangers.

As for the Devils problem towards attracting fans............part of this could be attributed to the Continental's location, I think some could even be attributed to FSNY's charges, but I also believe that the style and philosophy of the team has effected it's fan base. First off, whenever a channel charges to watch sporting events the exposure of that team will be limited. We all remember the huge YES network and Cablevision battle. As for the location, obviously this would affect the central and southern part of the state more.

Back in 2000-01, asked a Devils fan friend of mine, "If a goal is scored in the Meadowlands, and nobody is there to see it, is it really a goal?"

He responded badly, i.e., by telling me that Brian Leetch can't play defense. This indicated to me that hockey was not a sport he followed very closely. If he were in East Rutherford right now, I doubt he'd buy a ticket, but if you said anything bad about the Devils, he threw a hissy fit.

but as Mike Lupica said " If the Rangers left NY, about 20,000 people would care"

you are ignoring a major detail...lupica is an idiot and knows nothing about hockey lol

to be honest, while failing to sell out a playoff game is never good, IMO it is a bigger joke when attendance jumps from 16,000 to 19,000 instantly like it will for the finals...

its those bandwagon fans that give devil fans a bad name, and i would rather see the 17,000 true fans who have been there all year with 2,000 empty seats then to see a bunch of bandwagon fans who decided to become devil fans last week...

i respect the real fans, it is the bandwagon jumpers that are the joke

they couldn't sell out the SFC finals last year till game day
That is a flat out lie. I tried to get tickets the day they went on sale and I couldn't get them.

Although it is a pain to get to CAA. Especially if there is traffic which there usually seems to be. It's an hour and a half ride for me, two hours with traffic.

you are ignoring a major detail...lupica is an idiot and knows nothing about hockey lol

agreed 100%....I believe I referred to him with derogatory term...He also refuses to cover the NHl at all....I just get very bitter when people seem to harp on the negative about the devs...

who cares about the Devils.....honestly

who cares about the Devils.....honestly


People who read the NY Rangers team forum and help a devils thread grow to three pages long??

you are ignoring a major detail...lupica is an idiot and knows nothing about hockey lol

Just the "Lupica is an idiot" part will do lol. I absolutely DESPISE that little.

Have you actually watched the Devils lately? Patrik Elias, Gomez and gionta have formed an extremely exciting line to watch...Niedermayer skates like the wind...and the best goalie in the world..I don't find that too boring...
There's nothing exciting about a team of robots. Even in the offensive zone, there is virtually no creativity.

It's a great organization and a borderline dynasty, but they're definitely not fun to watch.

There's nothing exciting about a team of robots. Even in the offensive zone, there is virtually no creativity.

It's a great organization and a borderline dynasty, but they're definitely not fun to watch.

Yeh the 2 hottest scorers in the league in 2004 bore the hell out of me.

If stats columns excite you, so be it.

Ever hear the saying: "Don't throw rocks, if you live in a glass house?"

That is a flat out lie. I tried to get tickets the day they went on sale and I couldn't get them.

Although it is a pain to get to CAA. Especially if there is traffic which there usually seems to be. It's an hour and a half ride for me, two hours with traffic.
not a lie at all, i saw it myself on ticketmaster and it was even written about in one of the papers but apparently that was a "false rumor" :innocent:

Ever hear the saying: "Don't throw rocks, if you live in a glass house?"


I don't care how good the Devils are, I think they should be contracted because no matter how much they win, there aren't enough fans to support it and they dillute the league of marketable talent AND management.

They should go along with either Tampa/Flordia (Flordia needs only one team), Atlanta (market won't sustain hockey for a long period of time), Columbus (a joke from the start), Phoenix (umm... yeah the desert), one of the Cali teams (three teams south of LA? i say Anahiem goes), Carolina (do i need to justify this one?), Buffalo (right in the middle of NYC, Toronto, and Montreal, can't compete), and Nashville (I've spent time in Tennesse).

These teams (expansion) are HURTING the league. The only two teams that has been added recently make sense, thats Minnesota and Ottowa... places that are great hockey markets. The league puts these teams in places with no fan base. Hockey is closer to a niche sport than any of the other major sports. Imagine the talent of these teams (players, coaches, and GMs) like Kovalchuk, Heatly, Bouwmester, Horton, Luongo, Nash, Kelsa, Zherdev, Doan, Derek Morris, Federov, Giggy, Eric Staal, Jeff Oneil, Erick Cole, Kevin Weekes, Lupul, Ryan Miller, Chris Drury, Derek Roy, ect. ect. were spread out and the teams like Edmonton, Chicago, LAm Pitts, St. Louis, Van, Calgary, Minny and most importantly NEW YORK (both us and the Isles). The game would be so much better off and would be much more popular.

The league flooded the market again.

and saturation of four teams in essentially the Devils' market doesn't help either. The analogy to the Jets and Giants isn't fair, though. If hockey had eight home games, all on Sunday, maybe one Saturday or Monday night, I think the Devils too may be able to sell-out those games. It's not easy to get a crowd for 41 games, often during the week around 7-7:30, when people get off work and you have to deal with loads of traffic.

Add to that that a portion of the population comes from Central Jersey, South Jersey and North Jersey (even though a good portion of the population is arund the Meadowlands, you're not going to find a lot of fans in the Oranges, Newark and Elizabeth - unlike the Isles, which are situated in a dense area with more hockey fans). And it ain't like the Garden, which is on the way home for many and the access is quite easy via public transportation. Further, many do not have to leave too early to get to a 7PM game during the week.

I don't care how good the Devils are, I think they should be contracted because no matter how much they win, there aren't enough fans to support it and they dillute the league of marketable talent AND management.

They should go along with either Tampa/Flordia (Flordia needs only one team), Atlanta (market won't sustain hockey for a long period of time), Columbus (a joke from the start), Phoenix (umm... yeah the desert), one of the Cali teams (three teams south of LA? i say Anahiem goes), Carolina (do i need to justify this one?), Buffalo (right in the middle of NYC, Toronto, and Montreal, can't compete), and Nashville (I've spent time in Tennesse).

These teams (expansion) are HURTING the league. The only two teams that has been added recently make sense, thats Minnesota and Ottowa... places that are great hockey markets. The league puts these teams in places with no fan base. Hockey is closer to a niche sport than any of the other major sports. Imagine the talent of these teams (players, coaches, and GMs) like Kovalchuk, Heatly, Bouwmester, Horton, Luongo, Nash, Kelsa, Zherdev, Doan, Derek Morris, Federov, Giggy, Eric Staal, Jeff Oneil, Erick Cole, Kevin Weekes, Lupul, Ryan Miller, Chris Drury, Derek Roy, ect. ect. were spread out and the teams like Edmonton, Chicago, LAm Pitts, St. Louis, Van, Calgary, Minny and most importantly NEW YORK (both us and the Isles). The game would be so much better off and would be much more popular.

The league flooded the market again.

Why is Columbus a joke? They are drawing very well....

If I were you I'd want the Devils contracted too....Maybe if the league still had 16 teams make the playoffs and there were only 20 in the league the Rangers would have a solid chance of making one of the last few spots...I think you should write the league a letter.

not a lie at all, i saw it myself on ticketmaster and it was even written about in one of the papers but apparently that was a "false rumor" :innocent:


The story was started by an Ottawa writer and printed in the Sun as well as tsn.ca..It was proven to be a lie and a retraction and official apology was printed on the website and in the paper...Good try though...It's nice to see the made up part about ticketmaster as well..You are only about a year late with this false story

Ever hear the saying: "Don't throw rocks, if you live in a glass house?"
You mean because the people being critical of the Devils are fans of teams that aren't very good?

Stupid argument. Nobody here is affiliated with any team.

You mean because the people being critical of the Devils are fans of teams that aren't very good?

Stupid argument. Nobody here is affiliated with any team.


My first post got deleted about this..but the fact remains that Pens fans (who also play the trap..and very poorly I might add) really should be relegated to an AHL discussion. You already ripped on the Devils..no need to start a fight with barnaby too.

Why is Columbus a joke? They are drawing very well....

If I were you I'd want the Devils contracted too....Maybe if the league still had 16 teams make the playoffs and there were only 20 in the league the Rangers would have a solid chance of making one of the last few spots...I think you should write the league a letter.

The Devils have had undeniable success over the last 10 yrs BUT what is also undeniable is the fact that the Devils are the poster children for what has been totally killing this great game and sucking the life and excitment out of it and that is system 1st, 2nd and 3rd styles of hockey and that is why despite 3 cups in 10 yrs nobody still gives 2 sh%ts about them and they can't even sellout vs their 2nd biggest rival who also happen to come up and buy thousands of tix themselves, and why your beloved Captain try to bolt the 1st chance he got after being dragged to NJ kicking and screaming after being awarded for compensation for Shanny, and why McMullen has looked to move you guys multiple times.

My first post got deleted about this..but the fact remains that Pens fans (who also play the trap..and very poorly I might add) really should be relegated to an AHL discussion. You already ripped on the Devils..no need to start a fight with barnaby too.
I also gave them a lot of credit. I'm clearly not trying to start a fight with anybody. This is a discussion board and I'm voicing my opinion.

Contaction talk about the Devils is ridiculous. Noone can argue that the Devils are one of the best run teams in hockey, if not in all of the four major US sports.

If you want to discuss moving them, then you could certainly make a valid argument. If you were to put them in even a mediocre environment, then they would sell out 3 times as many games.

As much as I hate the Devils, they do need to do something about their attendance whether it be a move to a different part of NJ or something else. The Devils are as someone else put it a "borderline dynasty." If they can't draw people now then what happens when they eventually go through a correction and start missing the playoffs? Stevens and Brodeur have to retire some day, and without them that organization obviously takes an enormous hit.

Sorry guys!! I was totally wrong. Won't happen again.

Contaction talk about the Devils is ridiculous. Noone can argue that the Devils are one of the best run teams in hockey, if not in all of the four major US sports.

If you want to discuss moving them, then you could certainly make a valid argument. If you were to put them in even a mediocre environment, then they would sell out 3 times as many games.

As much as I hate the Devils, they do need to do something about their attendance whether it be a move to a different part of NJ or something else. The Devils are as someone else put it a "borderline dynasty." If they can't draw people now then what happens when they eventually go through a correction and start missing the playoffs? Stevens and Brodeur have to retire some day, and without them that organization obviously takes an enormous hit.

Good post.

And moving to Newark is not the answer IMO. Hockey is far and away the #4 sport in New York (Jersey). And there are three teams. There are not three baseball or football teams. There is just not the fan base.

However, that does not explain the lack of turn out for playoff games. We're not talking about about a Wednesday night game against the Flames in February here. We're talking the 3-6 playoff matchup against a divisional foe who is only 90 minutes to the south. Small fan base or no, that building should be full IMO.

The story was started by an Ottawa writer and printed in the Sun as well as tsn.ca..It was proven to be a lie and a retraction and official apology was printed on the website and in the paper...Good try though...It's nice to see the made up part about ticketmaster as well..You are only about a year late with this false story
it is relevant to the topic so how am i late? doesn't even make sense

amazing how devil fans get so easily offended when the proof is there, everyone's sisters mothers cousin knows the devils don't draw, i mean crap it is something that has been well known for years

it is relevant to the topic so how am i late? doesn't even make sense

amazing how devil fans get so easily offended when the proof is there, everyone's sisters mothers cousin knows the devils don't draw, i mean crap it is something that has been well known for years

I know that the Devils don't draw well...I took offense at the lie you told abut ticketmaster and that you didn't know the story was retracted...Us Devil fans have enough problems fending off attendance issues without made up stories to feed the fire....

The Devils have had undeniable success over the last 10 yrs BUT what is also undeniable is the fact that the Devils are the poster children for what has been totally killing this great game and sucking the life and excitment out of it and that is system 1st, 2nd and 3rd styles of hockey and that is why despite 3 cups in 10 yrs nobody still gives 2 sh%ts about them and they can't even sellout vs their 2nd biggest rival who also happen to come up and buy thousands of tix themselves, and why your beloved Captain try to bolt the 1st chance he got after being dragged to NJ kicking and screaming after being awarded for compensation for Shanny, and why McMullen has looked to move you guys multiple times.

Did you really bring up scott Stevens? The man who wouldn't even go on the market for his last two contracts...especially where he accepted well below market value for 4 yrs 16 million to stay in NJ...Stevens was not brought here voluntarily..but he absolutely has wanted to saty for the last 8 years...You are right that the Devils, because of their success, have become the whipping boys of the defensive system...but I guarantee that if the rags won the Cup playing the same system (which they do) they would not take the same abuse...

Good post.

And moving to Newark is not the answer IMO. Hockey is far and away the #4 sport in New York (Jersey). And there are three teams. There are not three baseball or football teams. There is just not the fan base.

However, that does not explain the lack of turn out for playoff games. We're not talking about about a Wednesday night game against the Flames in February here. We're talking the 3-6 playoff matchup against a divisional foe who is only 90 minutes to the south. Small fan base or no, that building should be full IMO.

Absolutely agree that there is no excuse for not being full against the Flyers...

[QUOTE=jerseydevil]Did you really bring up scott Stevens? The man who wouldn't even go on the market for his last two contracts...especially where he accepted well below market value for 4 yrs 16 million to stay in NJ...Stevens was not brought here voluntarily..but he absolutely has wanted to saty for the last 8 years...
/QUOTE]

Scott signed that St Louis offer so fast to get out of NJ that it made Lou's head spin and Lou proceeded w/tampering charges as a result so I don't understand how you could say he was so dedicated to staying with the Devs.

[QUOTE=jerseydevil]Did you really bring up scott Stevens? The man who wouldn't even go on the market for his last two contracts...especially where he accepted well below market value for 4 yrs 16 million to stay in NJ...Stevens was not brought here voluntarily..but he absolutely has wanted to saty for the last 8 years...
/QUOTE]

Scott signed that St Louis offer so fast to get out of NJ that it made Lou's head spin and Lou proceeded w/tampering charges as a result so I don't understand how you could say he was so dedicated to staying with the Devs.

I said the last 8 years and the last 2 contracts.....Not when he first came over...I believe my post said that Scott did not come voluntarily....but he chose to not even test the market the last two contracts because he loved NJ.

[QUOTE=jerseydevil]Did you really bring up scott Stevens? The man who wouldn't even go on the market for his last two contracts...especially where he accepted well below market value for 4 yrs 16 million to stay in NJ...Stevens was not brought here voluntarily..but he absolutely has wanted to saty for the last 8 years...
/QUOTE]

Scott signed that St Louis offer so fast to get out of NJ that it made Lou's head spin and Lou proceeded w/tampering charges as a result so I don't understand how you could say he was so dedicated to staying with the Devs.
Great job on completely ignoring his last two points.

I said the last 8 years and the last 2 contracts.....Not when he first came over...I believe my post said that Scott did not come voluntarily....but he chose to not even test the market the last two contracts because he loved NJ.
Ok great, we know that Stevens wants to be a Devil for the rest of his tenure in the NHL. Seriously, who wouldnt with that system and a HOF goaltender? The Devils made Stevens' career that much more prolific and successful. But the fact that he initially did not want to be a Dev does tell a story as to where the franchise was and would be before Lemaire and his system made it's impact in the team.

Yes, the location sucks ... and yet, the Jets and Giants manage to sell out every game with about 70,000 people. So I think people could get there if there is interest. The issue is they don't have the fan base.

For the defending Stanley Cup champs, to not sell out there first playoff game against a big rival (especially when the rival fans probably bought 2000-3000 tickets) is unexcusable.

Flawed logic. Football plays ONCE a week and is a much more "American" sport than hockey ever will be, so that's why the attendance is there. Plus, being in an outside stadium is much different than being in the lowly Meadowlands Arena.

As for not having a fan base, that is incorrect as well. They have one, but it's a small one. The Devils don't do any type of promotion to sell their product, regardless of how good that product is or how good it's been. Lou Lamoriello doesn't care about fan base, attendance, or anythign related. What he cares about is winning.

I love the Devils and hockey in general, but I can't get my dad to watch a game, even though he watches (TiVoes, no less), FISHING. He just thinks hockey is boring no matter who it is. I think that is the generally consensus with New Jersey fans. If you're a long-time hockey fan, you're probably a Rangers fan. Trying to get new fans to watch a team that is not too exciting, doesn't have a true "superstar" (Elias is close), and plays in an old arena that is a chore to get to and costs $300 for one night out...it's tough.

I hate that they don't sell out, esp. against the Flyers. But with Yankee baseball starting and many more things to spend $300 on for one night, it's easy to see why.

Ok great, we know that Stevens wants to be a Devil for the rest of his tenure in the NHL. Seriously, who wouldnt with that system and a HOF goaltender? The Devils made Stevens' career that much more prolific and successful. But the fact that he initially did not want to be a Dev does tell a story as to where the franchise was and would be before Lemaire and his system made it's impact in the team.

I'm not sure I understand your point? Are you saying that because the Devils are a great franchise with a winning system...and that is the sole reason Scott wanted to stay? I would have to agree...that is the equivalent of saying that players want to go to the Rangers and the Red Wings because they get huge contracts..It's a no brainer..

So what happens if the Devils have a really bad couple of years? How many people show up then?

So what happens if the Devils have a really bad couple of years? How many people show up then?
It'll be blamed on the pollution in the Meadowland area

All the while the Giants will be selling out with my boy Eli tossing TD's in the playoffs.

I also gave them a lot of credit. I'm clearly not trying to start a fight with anybody. This is a discussion board and I'm voicing my opinion.

Stop backpedaling. You're a Penguins fan knocking the Devils for lack of fan support and saying they should be dissolved.

Again, YOU'RE A PENGUINS FAN. Worst building in the NHL, worst team on the ice, worst management, and one of the worst cities in all of the world. Yet I still believe you have a right to put that lousy product on the ice, don't show up to the games, get killed 9-0, and then ***** that your team needs a new arena but nobody wants to pay for it.

But it's just my opinion.

So what happens if the Devils have a really bad couple of years? How many people show up then?


See..this discussion has been brought up before...The Devils have averaged between 12,000 and 17, 500 per year since 1982....Whether they win or lose they don't vary much from 15.000 per game which they averaged this year...I know it's very strange but it is true...The Devils have a very loyal (but small) fan base

So what happens if the Devils have a really bad couple of years? How many people show up then?

That's a very big "if." But I shudder to think of it.

And let's not forget, the Devils have one of the bigger arenas in the NHL, seating over 19,000. Their average (15,000) is a near-sellout for many squads. I'd like to see a 15,000-seat arena built, maybe 16,000. I truly believe you'd see people at the games then, esp. if it's in Newark or another easily accessible area where suits can attend.

That's a very big "if." But I shudder to think of it.

And let's not forget, the Devils have one of the bigger arenas in the NHL, seating over 19,000. Their average (15,000) is a near-sellout for many squads. I'd like to see a 15,000-seat arena built, maybe 16,000. I truly believe you'd see people at the games then, esp. if it's in Newark or another easily accessible area where suits can attend.

Not that big of an "if."

Brodeur and Stevens have to retire eventually.

That's a very big "if." But I shudder to think of it.

And let's not forget, the Devils have one of the bigger arenas in the NHL, seating over 19,000. Their average (15,000) is a near-sellout for many squads. I'd like to see a 15,000-seat arena built, maybe 16,000. I truly believe you'd see people at the games then, esp. if it's in Newark or another easily accessible area where suits can attend.

That makes a lot of sense. Major league soccer looks much better in full 16 000 seat soccer-only arenas than it does in empty 70 000 seat venues. The atmosphere in the building would be much better, and the experience would be more pleasant (the ex-Brendan Byrne Arena is not a very welcoming place for fans even when it's full -- too concrete-block).

I'm unimpressed with the idea of Newark, however. While that town deserves some sort of a boost, who really thinks that moving the Devils there would help the franchise? The socio-economic demographics in that city hardly say "hockey fan", and is it really much more accesible?

Not that big of an "if."

Brodeur and Stevens have to retire eventually.

More than that, Lou Lamoriello won't be around forever, either...

Newark... is it really much more accesible?

I don't know. I don't know where the Devils think there fan base is coming from. Part of the thinking, and I believe it is flawed, is that fans will come from NYC. I don't see people in NYC hopping on the PATH to go see the Devils in Newark.

Why is Columbus a joke? They are drawing very well....

If I were you I'd want the Devils contracted too....Maybe if the league still had 16 teams make the playoffs and there were only 20 in the league the Rangers would have a solid chance of making one of the last few spots...I think you should write the league a letter.


Hahaha, thats actually one of the funniest rebuttals I've ever read because it is kinda true.

Bottom line on the Devils is they can't sell out a home playoff game (except if its game 7 of the finals). They can't even sell out a home game in a series against your biggest rivals. Its weak dude. The Isles own LI so they will always have a moderate fan base. Keep in mind, hockey is the #4 sport in the area and we are talking about 3 teams here. Philly owns south jersey. And the Rangers have debatably the biggest fan base WHEN THEY ARE WINNING. I understand they have none right now, but the past shows win they are winning the fan base is awesome and this losing has to change eventually (they can't lose forever). The Rangers have tradition and they play in MSG not a swamp. I'd guestimate that only half of the North and Central jersey pop. are Devils fans. But the Rags pull from the city, southern Connecticutt, north of the city all the way to upstate NY, a few from LI, and half the people from Jersey, like myself.

Columbus takes fans away from the big time teams in the Midwest like Detroit, St. Louis, and Chicago.

Dont get so offended that I put the Devils on that list. Look at some of those teams. The ducks were in the finals last year. Carolina the year before that. Tampa won the East. Nashville, Atlanta, and Columbus are up-and-coming teams.

WOW, did you hear that roar when the Flyers scored?! I swear it sounds like there are as many Flyer fans as there are Devils fans there.

Columbus takes fans away from the big time teams in the Midwest like Detroit, St. Louis, and Chicago.

Dont get so offended that I put the Devils on that list. Look at some of those teams. The ducks were in the finals last year. Carolina the year before that. Tampa won the East. Nashville, Atlanta, and Columbus are up-and-coming teams.

Chicago, St. Louis and Detroit have good fanbases, and don't need to worry (except for the Hawks, they need to worry about their owner...:shakehead ).

Columbus was the best (recent) expansion move by the NHL: it's a big town with no professional sports which looks to compete with Cincinatti and Cleveland. As much as they love their college football in Columbus, there was definitely room for pro sports. In addition, I understand that the team have a great arena. Instead of poach fans from other midwest teams, I would wager that the foundation of the BJ's is the one thing that the NHL has done recently to actually create new hockey fans.

Flyers didnt sell out game 1 either. the league sucks

More than that, Lou Lamoriello won't be around forever, either...

Neither will the NHL. Including the NY Rangers. If there is a a lockout, it will destroy the NHL, INCLUDING THE NY RANGERS.

Neither will the NHL. Including the NY Rangers. If there is a a lockout, it will destroy the NHL, INCLUDING THE NY RANGERS.
Eventually Ranger fans will be back. I honestly don't know if Devils fans will. And this is not an insult to Devils fans, but it seems that most of them pretty much don't care either. All in all there is about 6 other franchises that will fold before the Devs.

Flyers didnt sell out game 1 either. the league sucks

Semanitcs. The Flyers were about a 100 seats shy of a sellout in Game One.

Rangers pull a little more than a few fans from LI. Check yourself!!!

Neither will the NHL. Including the NY Rangers. If there is a a lockout, it will destroy the NHL, INCLUDING THE NY RANGERS.

OK, fine, fair logic. The Earth itself isn't going to last more than another 5 billion years, either: we're all doomed!! :eek:

I was trying to point out that he deserves the most credit for the Devils' success, more than any individual player (even Stevens and Brodeur), and alluding to the rumours going around last offseason that Lou was looking for a new challenge. Such things happen -- afterall, Sather left Edmonton.... :shakehead

So what happens if the Devils have a really bad couple of years? How many people show up then?

The same number of people that show up now. Check the attendance records from when NJ was really, really bad and you'll find that they weren't quite as good but are comprable to what NJ brings in at the moment. Don't be surprised by that - there aren't that many Devils fans, but they are extremely fanatical, diehard fans.

Eventually Ranger fans will be back. I honestly don't know if Devils fans will. And this is not an insult to Devils fans, but it seems that most of them pretty much don't care either. All in all there is about 6 other franchises that will fold before the Devs.

You obviously don't know many real Devil fans. Every Devil fan I know lives and dies with NJ, and I know quite a few.

More importantly, if you walk around northern NJ and even NYC to an extent, you see many, many kids, aged 5-12, wearing Devils apparel. Lots of it. Jackets, hats, backpacks, it's increadible. NJ may not have a huge fan base right now, but if the NHL still exists in ten-fifteen years it will be gigantic. The fact that they've won as much as they have is a huge attraction to kids, and something about NJ just breeds fanatics. Fans like me, who became fans between 1992-1997 are getting close to being of age to take themselves to games, and there are a lot of us.

Plus, the Devils make a lot of money off of merchandise. The whole attendance thing hurts financially, but not as much as one might assume. The lack of sellouts is also somewhat of a deception as the CAA is a very large arena, with about 19,000 seats. In just about any other arena in the NHL the fans NJ gets for playoff games would be the equivalent to a sellout.

You obviously don't know many real Devil fans. Every Devil fan I know lives and dies with NJ, and I know quite a few.

More importantly, if you walk around northern NJ and even NYC to an extent, you see many, many kids, aged 5-12, wearing Devils apparel. Lots of it.
Apparently most of these so-called fans choose not to go to the Stanley Cup finals last year. Nor were they seen during the playoffs this year.

You obviously don't know many real Devil fans. Every Devil fan I know lives and dies with NJ, and I know quite a few.

More importantly, if you walk around northern NJ and even NYC to an extent, you see many, many kids, aged 5-12, wearing Devils apparel. Lots of it. Jackets, hats, backpacks, it's increadible. NJ may not have a huge fan base right now, but if the NHL still exists in ten-fifteen years it will be gigantic. The fact that they've won as much as they have is a huge attraction to kids, and something about NJ just breeds fanatics. Fans like me, who became fans between 1992-1997 are getting close to being of age to take themselves to games, and there are a lot of us.

Plus, the Devils make a lot of money off of merchandise. The whole attendance thing hurts financially, but not as much as one might assume. The lack of sellouts is also somewhat of a deception as the CAA is a very large arena, with about 19,000 seats. In just about any other arena in the NHL the fans NJ gets for playoff games would be the equivalent to a sellout.
Haha, I'd love to know what part of New Jersey you live in. I know everyone in Summit (northern NJ) and have a beach house in the Southern part of NJ, and I can tell you that their is almost no one who follows the Devils. Like I said before, last year about 12 kids wore Ranger jersey's to school on opening night alone, while maybe one or two Devil jerseys were seen all school year. There soooo many more Ranger fans in that town than Devil fans. Maybe it is because much of the town works in the city and many have corporate season tickets, I dont know. When I lived down the shore in Rumson in 94, the whole area was obsessed with the Rangers, I remember hearing fog horns going off everytime the Rangers scored in the Cup Finals, but I just dont see that at all with the Devils. Maybe I just live in the wrong areas.

You want to talk about empty seats? Just watch a replay of the final 5-10 minutes of game 5 b/w the Habs & Bruins :D

You want to talk about empty seats? Just watch a replay of the final 5-10 minutes of game 5 b/w the Habs & Bruins :D
Those are the types of games that I think Ranger fans would stick around for, if only for the sole purpose of booing. I know I would

I got to this thread late so I really haven't time to read every post but I have an idea what most of them say and I'm not suggesting they are negative because I find the Ranger posters to be some of the most truthfull and un-bias around.

But if anybody wants to blame the style of hockey on the attendance problems, that they play the trap and they are boring to watch and of course they don't sell out first round in the playoffs, if that's your theory that the NJ fans are bored with them how do you explain the Nets, their partner at CAA, same schedule, but according to demographics a bigger fan base when it comes to basketball verse hockey. I mean the Nets are hands down one of the most exciting NBA teams in the league with Superstar Jason Kidd, and emerging Superstars Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson and have been in the NBA Finals two years running, yet they get worst attendance figures than the Devils and this was all before the moving the team to Brooklyn.

My thought is that New Jersey shouldn't be treated as a two team location as other major cities are. I'm a Nets fan but I feel that a move to New York that would leave the Devils as the only winter pro team area would benfit them greatly. Look how many teams in the NHL have a competing NBA team to deal with. Are better yet look at the teams that don't. Pittsburgh, Nashville, Columbus, Anehiem, San Jose, Tampa Bay, Montreal, Edmonton, Vancouver, Calgary, Ottawa......they are all the same as New Jersey, small market but the difference is that they don't have the competion that the Devils have in the area for the marketing dollar, ten pro teams (I'm kinda cheating, counting the MetroStars), New York City, Atlantic City, the Jersey shore....etc...

Ranger fans who live in NJ know that we are a loyal bunch and not as small as one might think going by the attendance figures, but I have to admit after listing all the reasons why IMO the first round games don't sell out, it still pisses me off to see empty seats at playoff games.

I got to this thread late so I really haven't time to read every post but I have an idea what most of them say and I'm not suggesting they are negative because I find the Ranger posters to be some of the most truthfull and un-bias around.

But if anybody wants to blame the style of hockey on the attendance problems, that they play the trap and they are boring to watch and of course they don't sell out first round in the playoffs, if that's your theory that the NJ fans are bored with them how do you explain the Nets, their partner at CAA, same schedule, but according to demographics a bigger fan base when it comes to basketball verse hockey. I mean the Nets are hands down one of the most exciting NBA teams in the league with Superstar Jason Kidd, and emerging Superstars Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson and have been in the NBA Finals two years running, yet they get worst attendance figures than the Devils and this was all before the moving the team to Brooklyn.

My thought is that New Jersey shouldn't be treated as a two team location as other major cities are. I'm a Nets fan but I feel that a move to New York that would leave the Devils as the only winter pro team area would benfit them greatly. Look how many teams in the NHL have a competing NBA team to deal with. Are better yet look at the teams that don't. Pittsburgh, Nashville, Columbus, Anehiem, San Jose, Tampa Bay, Montreal, Edmonton, Vancouver, Calgary, Ottawa......they are all the same as New Jersey, small market but the difference is that they don't have the competion that the Devils have in the area for the marketing dollar, ten pro teams (I'm kinda cheating, counting the MetroStars), New York City, Atlantic City, the Jersey shore....etc...

Ranger fans who live in NJ know that we are a loyal bunch and not as small as one might think going by the attendance figures, but I have to admit after listing all the reasons why IMO the first round games don't sell out, it still pisses me off to see empty seats at playoff games.
Very good points and I tend to agree that NJ just doesnt have the fan base to have its own professional sports franchises. Its a shame because the state is filled with die-hard fans and sports enthusiats but I just dont think a professional sports team can really succeed with the competion in the North from the NY teams, and then the competition in the South from Philadelphia. I'm not a big basketball guy, I tend to root for NJ just because it is the local team, but I think it is good for the Nets to move to Brooklyn because now they can finally get the attention that they deserve. I dont even think that the subtraction of the Nets will benifit the Devils. By and large the hockey fan population is not the same as the basketball fan population, I dont think that there is much crossover in those sports. Personally I think a move for the Devils would be good for the franchise but I really dont think I would want it to happen, just because the small base of loyal fans that they do have definately deserve better.

Very good points and I tend to agree that NJ just doesnt have the fan base to have its own professional sports franchises. Its a shame because the state is filled with die-hard fans and sports enthusiats but I just dont think a professional sports team can really succeed with the competion in the North from the NY teams, and then the competition in the South from Philadelphia. I'm not a big basketball guy, I tend to root for NJ just because it is the local team, but I think it is good for the Nets to move to Brooklyn because now they can finally get the attention that they deserve. I dont even think that the subtraction of the Nets will benifit the Devils. By and large the hockey fan population is not the same as the basketball fan population, I dont think that there is much crossover in those sports. Personally I think a move for the Devils would be good for the franchise but I really dont think I would want it to happen, just because the small base of loyal fans that they do have definately deserve better.
I feel that NJ can support a pro team as such the Devils, my point is that they can't handle two during the same season. If the Nets leave town as it looks like it will happen the Devils will benifit but not to the point of sellouts but more corporate seats and bigger crowds, but not sellouts. I was suggesting that the NJ market is more like the Nashville, Pittsburgh and the others I suggested before, one team cities. And building a arena in Newark with mass transit being a key proponent will help, many people will take the train to the game rather than driving in like we have to do for the meadowlands. There is a bigger Devil fan base along the shore line than people realize that would love to take the train rather than deatin with an hour and fifthteen minutes on the parkway and turnpike.

I got to this thread late so I really haven't time to read every post but I have an idea what most of them say and I'm not suggesting they are negative because I find the Ranger posters to be some of the most truthfull and un-bias around.

But if anybody wants to blame the style of hockey on the attendance problems, that they play the trap and they are boring to watch and of course they don't sell out first round in the playoffs, if that's your theory that the NJ fans are bored with them how do you explain the Nets, their partner at CAA, same schedule, but according to demographics a bigger fan base when it comes to basketball verse hockey. I mean the Nets are hands down one of the most exciting NBA teams in the league with Superstar Jason Kidd, and emerging Superstars Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson and have been in the NBA Finals two years running, yet they get worst attendance figures than the Devils and this was all before the moving the team to Brooklyn.

My thought is that New Jersey shouldn't be treated as a two team location as other major cities are. I'm a Nets fan but I feel that a move to New York that would leave the Devils as the only winter pro team area would benfit them greatly. Look how many teams in the NHL have a competing NBA team to deal with. Are better yet look at the teams that don't. Pittsburgh, Nashville, Columbus, Anehiem, San Jose, Tampa Bay, Montreal, Edmonton, Vancouver, Calgary, Ottawa......they are all the same as New Jersey, small market but the difference is that they don't have the competion that the Devils have in the area for the marketing dollar, ten pro teams (I'm kinda cheating, counting the MetroStars), New York City, Atlantic City, the Jersey shore....etc...

Ranger fans who live in NJ know that we are a loyal bunch and not as small as one might think going by the attendance figures, but I have to admit after listing all the reasons why IMO the first round games don't sell out, it still pisses me off to see empty seats at playoff games.

Interesting points.

Couple of things. San Jose is close to San Francisco and the Golden State Warriers play in Oakland (I believe). The Ducks are in Anaheim but they are a stone's throw from LA with the Kings AND the Lakers (oh yeah, and the Clippers :rolleyes: ) Both those teams manage to draw. And, like I said earlier, this is not a Wednesday night game against the Flames in mid February. It is a playoff game against the Flyers a rival team (maybe the Devs second biggest rival team). I'm amazed that the game was not sold out because of the proximity to Philly.

The biggest thing, IMO, is the Devils are the defending Cup champs. They have a legend between the pipes. They are a team that is worth rooting for. Its hard to believe that fans aren't showing up for these games.

A lot of it is about the experience, I feel. Going to a Devils game just doesn't *feel* that special. I'm not talking about the product on the ice, but the arena is sterile and concrete, the surroundings are bland, and the tickets are expensive. Anaheim is another suburban team, and my freshman-year roommate in college was a big Ducks fan. He said that going to the Pond was a great time, in part because he thought it was a terrific arena. Sprucing up the place would help, though the Meadowlands in winter aren't exactly southern California...

A lot of it is about the experience, I feel. Going to a Devils game just doesn't *feel* that special. I'm not talking about the product on the ice, but the arena is sterile and concrete, the surroundings are bland, and the tickets are expensive. Anaheim is another suburban team, and my freshman-year roommate in college was a big Ducks fan. He said that going to the Pond was a great time, in part because he thought it was a terrific arena. Sprucing up the place would help, though the Meadowlands in winter aren't exactly southern California...

i have to agree. one of my favorite parts of the night (especially this dreadful season) was hanging out in the bars with other fans before stepping into the garden. this is not an option at the meadowlands.

A lot of it is about the experience, I feel. Going to a Devils game just doesn't *feel* that special. I'm not talking about the product on the ice, but the arena is sterile and concrete, the surroundings are bland, and the tickets are expensive. Anaheim is another suburban team, and my freshman-year roommate in college was a big Ducks fan. He said that going to the Pond was a great time, in part because he thought it was a terrific arena. Sprucing up the place would help, though the Meadowlands in winter aren't exactly southern California...

Good point. And The Pond is a great place to go to a game. There is a fair ammount of bells and whistels but you can tell that the Ducks try to make the games an experience.

It has to a lot to do with the surrounding areas (eg. bars, and palces to eat) around the arena as well as the atmosphere, which is why MSG is such a great venue.
Athletes as well as famous music acts love to perform at the Garden. There's an intangible vibe.
The electricity in the air doesn't get much better when the Garden gets going.
Having said that, didn't the original thread title read that Jersey fans "...should be hanging their heads in shame." Are you joking? Are you aware of the hockey team that calls MSG their home ice?
As a Ranger fan, my head had been hung and beaten over with for years. It was not only until the recent dismantling and rebuilding plan that my head is now being raised. Just a little.

Wow, just on cue, today on Pardon the Interruption they were debating bringing the Expos to Northern Virginia or Las Vegas. Bob Ryan started commenting about how Northern Virginia would be a terrible place for the Expos because the region lacks fan support and exposure, he stated ,"it would turn into a situation like with the Nets and the Devils". Looks like we are not the only ones to realize the situation with New Jersey sports teams.