Now with Koivu signed, we currently have 14 forwards who could take the 12 forward spots.

Koivu
Ryan
Getzlaf
Perry
Selanne
Lupul
Brown
Christensen
Nokelainen
Marchant
Miller
Parros
Ebbett
Carter

How would you build the Ducks forward lines with those names?

Ryan/Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Lupul/Ryan - Koivu - Selanne

those makes sense for our top six, if you don't want to spread out the scoring even more and maybe put Lupul on the 3rd. I guess my bottom six would be:

Christensen - Ebbett - Carter
Nokelainen - Marchant - Brown

If EC steps up his game a notch, it would also be possible switching him with Lupul, letting Lupes play his natural RW position and let Carter play the LW. But that is if EC can find back to his game he once had in Pittsburgh.

lupul - getzlaf - perry
perry - koivu - selanne
pj axelsson (ufa) - marchant - nokia
parros - carter - brown

lupul - getzlaf - perry
Ryan - koivu - selanne
pj axelsson (ufa) - marchant - nokia
parros - carter - brown

Fixed Ryan for you

Lets get creative.

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Christensen - Koivu - Selanne
Marchant - Ebbett - Lupul
Brown - Carter - Parros

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Selanne-Koivu-Lupul
Miller-Ebbett-Nokelainen
Carter-Marchant-Brown
Parros-Christensen

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry was dominant in the playoffs. I think Carlyle should keep them together.

Trade Ebbett, Miller & Christensen for whatever they can get, sign a physical vet grinder and let Bodie, Beleskey and MacMillan fight for the remaining 4th line spot.

Ryan-Getzy-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Teemu
Vet-Marchant-Brown
X-Carter-Parros
Nokie

Lets get creative.

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Christensen - Koivu - Selanne
Marchant - Ebbett - Lupul
Brown - Carter - Parros

That was kind of what I suggested if EC could step up his game a notch. Parros needs to step up too in order to make the team, he just wasn't the same since getting his new paycheck.

Lets get creative.

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Christensen - Koivu - Selanne
Marchant - Ebbett - Lupul
Brown - Carter - Parros

:shakehead

2 scoring lines:

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Miller - Marchant - Nokia
Brown - Carter - Parros

3 scoring lines:

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Christensen - Ebbett - Marchant
Brown - Nokia - Parros

Trade Ebbett, Miller & Christensen for whatever they can get, sign a physical vet grinder and let Bodie, Beleskey and MacMillan fight for the remaining 4th line spot.

Ryan-Getzy-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Teemu
Vet-Marchant-Brown
X-Carter-Parros
Nokie

Trading Ebbett and Christensen doesn't make much sense... EC just re-signed and Ebbett is cheap as ****. Both are cheap and both have offensive upside. I'd be all for getting rid of Miller though, doesn't have any offensive skill and isn't effective in his role as a checking winger because of his small stature.

I'm utterly curious - can you see your abundance of young bottom-6 forwards returning a good veteran Dman to bolster the defense, or do you see any UFA still on the market more fitting?

Lupul - Getz - Perry (Lupul should score 30 goals here)
Ryan - Koivu - Teemu (Ryan adds some size and skill)
Brown - Carter - Moen/Kostopolous/Pettinger/Bodie (fast hard hitting checking line)
Bodie or Nok/Marchant/Parros (preserving Marchant for down the stretch)

I'm utterly curious - can you see your abundance of young bottom-6 forwards returning a good veteran Dman to bolster the defense, or do you see any UFA still on the market more fitting?

I expect Murph to trade for a top 4 defenseman.

Fixed Ryan for you

:) thanks
i meant ryan

I'd like to go with the option line-up. If we need offense, we go with:


Perry-Getzlaf-Lupul
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/UFA-Marchant-Nokelainen
Ebbett-Carter-Christensen


And if we need a more agitating line-up, we go with:


Perry-Getzlaf-Lupul
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/UFA-Marchant-Nokelainen
Brown-Carter-Parros

I'd like to go with the option line-up. If we need offense, we go with:


Perry-Getzlaf-Lupul
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/UFA-Marchant-Nokelainen
Ebbett-Carter-Christensen


And if we need a more agitating line-up, we go with:


Perry-Getzlaf-Lupul
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/UFA-Marchant-Nokelainen
Brown-Carter-Parros

I was thinking of something similar

Perry-Getzlaf-Lupul/Ryan - scoring line 1
Lupul/Ryan-Koivu-Selanne - scoring line 2
Brown-Marchant-Nokelainen - checking/energy line

Ebbett-Carter-Christensen/Parros - 3rd scoring line

Miller definitely not in the lineup, but what about guys like Bodie/Belesky.

Defensively I think Niedermayer/Wiz go against other team's top lines.

Whitney will have juggling teamates ala pronger last year. Sometimes we'll want a defensive minded guy out there, sometimes developing a young guy like Sbisa/Mikkelson.

The 3rd pairing will be slop.

Ducks are looking good. A line of Lupul, Koivu ,Selanne on the 2nd really puts them in contention.

I was pretty surprised with some of their deadline pickups

great job building the team

Ebbett and christensen should never be on the ice together. To be honest, I don't see a roster spot for Ebbett on the big club. Christensen will most likely be a fourth line player who specializes on the 2nd pp unit and shootouts.

My lineup:

Ryan/lupul-getz-perry
Ryan/lupul-koivu-teemu
Carter/noke-marchant-brown
Christensen/bodie-noke/carter-parros

We could also go with an all-international top 9(somewhat stolen from ALLDUCKS):


Perry-Getzlaf-Lupul
Carter-Marchant-Ryan
Nokelainen-Koivu-Selanne

Carlyle has gone with three scoring lines before (when he had the personnel), and he loves the player pairs. Getzlaf/Perry obviously, and he's had success with Lupul/Marchant in the past.

()-Getzlaf-Perry
()-Koivu-Selanne
()-Marchant-Lupul

Ryan can float as Carlyle sees fit as the new Kunitz "line jumpstarter", and we have passable options in guys like Carter, Belesky (a true LW), and maybe Miller or Bodie to round that out. Then the energy line can be just what it is. Every line has the ability to bury the weaknesses of weak link guys while keeping the attack rolling and maintaining chemistry even while Carlyle goes nuts with the 3rd guy.

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-Ebbett
Brown-Christensen-Parros

healthy scratches: Miller, Nokia

Niedermayer-UFA (Mara, De Vries, Seidenberg, Morris..etc)
Wiz-Whitney
Sbisa-Brookbank

healthy scratch: Salcido

Mikkelson, Festerling, Mitera in AHL.

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Miller-Marchant-Nokelainen/Carter
Brown-Christensen/Carter-Parros

Honestly I don't see how Ebbett fits on this team anymore. Considering he's still on a two-way deal he can go to the minors or be traded. Losing Robbie means we need to have Miller in a checking role. He was terrific during the playoffs. Carter is an enigma. He's not really a center, not really an offensive player. He's good in a checking role but he doesn't seem to like it. I figure he'll be in the lineup but he's all over the place in my mind.

But one things for sure. We're done with signing forwards. We have no room for any more.

Well if we are gonna be a little creative... maybe this will work:

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ebbett - Koivu - Selanne
Christensen/Carter - Carter/Christensen - Ryan
Brown - Marchant - Nokelainen/Parros

Getzlaf, Koivu and Ryan can all carry their own line. Both Getzlaf and Ryan have proven they can make their linemates better, maybe it would help both Lupul and EC. Koivu maybe doesn't make his linemates much better, but he has Selanne. Ebbett, EC and Lupul who on paper are our worst forwards defensively, would be on seperate lines, which also should be a good thing.

And if we can't get another top 4 defenseman... Maybe Getzlaf can go back playing D on the PP.

PP1
Selanne - Koivu - Perry
Getzlaf - Niedermayer

PP2
Lupul - Christensen - Ryan
Wisniewski - Whitney

would that be so bad? :)

But one things for sure. We're done with signing forwards. We have no room for any more.

Agreed. I'd like Murray to add more grit with someone like Nichol. But it's not going to happen.

Let's be boring

Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Brown-Marchant-Nokelainen
Christensen-Carter-Parros/Miller

Carlyle has gone with three scoring lines before (when he had the personnel), and he loves the player pairs. Getzlaf/Perry obviously, and he's had success with Lupul/Marchant in the past.

()-Getzlaf-Perry
()-Koivu-Selanne
()-Marchant-Lupul

Ryan can float as Carlyle sees fit as the new Kunitz "line jumpstarter", and we have passable options in guys like Carter, Belesky (a true LW), and maybe Miller or Bodie to round that out. Then the energy line can be just what it is. Every line has the ability to bury the weaknesses of weak link guys while keeping the attack rolling and maintaining chemistry even while Carlyle goes nuts with the 3rd guy.

I like this idea a lot, I'd like to see Carter given a chance on one of those wings

Agreed. I'd like Murray to add more grit with someone like Nichol. But it's not going to happen.We just have to trade then to get some grit :D

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Christiansen-Brown
Nokia-Marchant-Parros

If we have two scoring lines:

Lupul/Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Lupul/Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Bodie/Miller - Marchant - Nokelainen
Brown - Ebbett/Carter - Parros

Ebbett/Carter and Miller/Bodie are scratched, Christensen can go play in Russia.

If Carlyle wants three scoring lines:

Carter - Getzlaf - Perry
Nokelainen/Marchant - Koivu - Selanne
Ryan - Ebbett - Lupul
Brown - Marchant/Nokelainen - Parros/Bodie/Miller

Parros/Bodie/Miller can rotate being scratched.

I hope Ebbett still manages to figure into the lineup. Fingers crossed.

I'm going to go with 3 scoring lines.

Some thoughts: Christensen has to be at center, he sucks at wing. I want someone responsible on the bottom line to babysit whoever's on there. That's why I'd like Brown down there, although Marchant could work. Also with a 3rd scoring line being sheltered, we might even be able to work Beleskey in.

Lupul-Getz-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/Nokelainen-Marchant-UFA(Grier)/Brown/Nokelainen
Ebbett-Christensen-Brown/Parros

The problem is there's too many RWs. Brown, Parros, Selanne, Perry, Lupul, Ryan. Geez. Nokelainien shoots right, what wing does he play? The other problem is I'd prefer putting Lupul on the RW since he wasn't good at left, but who else do we have to pass to him?


Hmm.... option 2:
Carter-Getz-Perry
Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Marchant-Lupul
Miller/Parros-Nokelainen-Brown

yikes those forwards look real good. But all of a sudden that world class ducks d looks a little shaky imho. A top 3 defensive tough guy would be very ideal.

I know we'll see the top 2 scoring lines in the third period often if the Ducks are behind.

Here's a proposal for a 3 scoring lines

Carter-Getz-Perry (power line)
Ebbett-Koivu-Teemu (speed line?)
Ryan-Christensen/Kontiola-Lupul (flair line)
Nokes-Marchant-Parros/Nieds (shutdown line?)

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Lupul - Koivu - Selanne
Christensen - Nokia - Carter
Brown - Marchant - Parros

It seems we have a glut of kids in the line up.

I've seen posts about trading Ebbett, Miller, EC, Carter, Mikkelson, Festerling, etc, but can we really afford to get rid of them?

Ebbett, as much as I would like to punch him, he does have SOME talent, as do the others but can we afford letting these guys sit out a lot of games?

They are considered our future in some form or another when Teemu, & Koivu, Scott aren't here anymore.

What would you guys do with them all? Trade them, sit them????

As for the top six, I'd rather have Ryan on the second line with Koivu-Teemu because at least we know that Ryan will backcheck and hit. I haven't seen Lupul play since his departure, but when he was here that's something he doesn't do.

Although... Ryan likes to cycle and Lupul doesn't (or hasn't). So... hmmm... wow it's going to be fun to find out this season offensively!

Lupol- Getzlaf- Perry
Ryan- Koivu- Selanne
Moen- Marchant- Grier
Brown- Carter- Parros
Beleskey- Christensen

Rest of the forwards jettison to other worthy teams

Perry-Getzlaf-Ryan
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Ebbett-Marchant-Carter
Parros-Nokelainen-Brown
Players that move in the lineup for some games - Christensen,Miller

I think it's stupid to trade the young kids now...Selanne / Koivu will probably not be Ducks anymore next season and it would be nice to have one of the younger Ducks to step up.

Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter/Miller-Marchant-Ebbett
Brown-Nokke/Christensen-Parros

S.Niedermayer-Boynton
Whitney-Wiz
Sbisa-Brookbank/Salcido

Jiggy/Hiller

If the current roster is set, then Nokke and Christensen will rotate, and I'm sure Carlyle will find some reason to get pissed at Carter and rotate him and Miller.

I would like to see the Ducks add another big guy like Moen or Grier too, but that would require a trade. I don't like the idea of trading Ebbett because he's cheap and Koivu is hurt all the time. If a trade happens it will be either Carter or Nokke. Hopefully Nokke. I don't think Miller goes anywhere because Carlyle loves the guy.

Did Wisniewski sign with the Ducks? or is he an RFA?

Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter/Miller-Marchant-Ebbett
Brown-Nokke/Christensen-Parros

S.Niedermayer-Boynton
Whitney-Wiz
Sbisa-Brookbank/Salcido

Jiggy/Hiller

If the current roster is set, then Nokke and Christensen will rotate, and I'm sure Carlyle will find some reason to get pissed at Carter and rotate him and Miller.

I would like to see the Ducks add another big guy like Moen or Grier too, but that would require a trade. I don't like the idea of trading Ebbett because he's cheap and Koivu is hurt all the time. If a trade happens it will be either Carter or Nokke. Hopefully Nokke. I don't think Miller goes anywhere because Carlyle loves the guy.

Out of curiosity, what is the point of ebbett on the third line? He hardly produced much of anything with selanne so I don't see him starting anything with cater/marchant/miller, and he doesn't do anything else remotely well enough to warrant a spot in the lineup. If he isn't surrounded by players who are competent offensively he is a waste of a spot, and becauseof that I really don't see a spot for him on the team.

However, if Carlyle chooses the pair setup like booger alluded to, he may work in at LW with koiuv/teemu or lupul/marchant, but I think putting him on a defensive line is counterproductive and just setting him and the line up for failure.

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry

Probably could put up a combined 235 points. Play against oppositions second and fourth line as much as possible.

Lupul-Koivu-Selanne

Maybe an 80 goal line.Send out against opposing checkers.

Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant

Better then average third line.Use when second and first line are tired. Time to see if Ebbett can carry a line.

Miller-Carter-Noeklainin

Checkers. Use against opposing first line.

(Brown)(Parros) Switch with Christenson/Ebbett for a hitters third line. Probably best to soften a good checking line that the second line is likely to see.

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry

Probably could put up a combined 235 points. Play against oppositions second and fourth line as much as possible.

Lupul-Koivu-Selanne

Maybe an 80 goal line.Send out against opposing checkers.

Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant

Better then average third line.Use when second and first line are tired. Time to see if Ebbett can carry a line.

Miller-Carter-Noeklainin

Checkers. Use against opposing first line.

(Brown)(Parros) Switch with Christenson/Ebbett for a hitters third line. Probably best to soften a good checking line that the second line is likely to see.

That third line will get annihilated by opposition lines, they're not good enough offensively to do anything and Marchant is the only one who can be considered a defensive foward. Ebbett and Christensen are passengers, they won't generate much offense by themselves and neither is anywhere near good enough defensively to do anything remotely useful on a line with Marchant.

If the Ducks want to roll 3 scoring lines they'll have to spread the offense and put two competent top 6 fowards with one borderline top 6 foward on each line. A third scoring line of Ebbett - Christensen - whoever simply won't work because they're not good enough to create chances for themselves, they need a Ryan/Getzlaf/Koivu on their line to succeed.

That third line will get annihilated by opposition lines, they're not good enough offensively to do anything and Marchant is the only one who can be considered a defensive foward. Ebbett and Christensen are passengers, they won't generate much offense by themselves and neither is anywhere near good enough defensively to do anything remotely useful on a line with Marchant.

If the Ducks want to roll 3 scoring lines they'll have to spread the offense and put two competent top 6 fowards with one borderline top 6 foward on each line. A third scoring line of Ebbett - Christensen - whoever simply won't work because they're not good enough to create chances for themselves, they need a Ryan/Getzlaf/Koivu on their line to succeed.

No you don't know that for sure at all. Ebbett played extremely well. Not in the playoffs I know that's another arguement for another time. Anyone who thinks Ebbett was anything but great in the regular season last year is kidding themselves. We have seen the flashes of Christensen's talent from time to time, and if he can step it up, Ebbett and Christenson might be surprsingly good. They will not get "annihilated". Having a very good first two lines and an ok third line is a lot better then having 3 ok scoring lines.

Saying there not good enough to create chances for themselves is just foolish. This line obviously isn't going to log big minutes, but if they can play 10 minutes a game and have Ebbett and Christenson put up 35-40 points each with Marchant making sure nothing goes the other way, then they get the mission accomplished. There not going to get more ice time then line 4, the checkers, but they will be used. If they do struggle to do anything, Brown and Parros can hook up with Marchant to set up a hitting line.

Ebbett played extremely well. Not in the playoffs I know that's another arguement for another time. Anyone who thinks Ebbett was anything but great in the regular season last year is kidding themselves.

He was good but the majority of the time he was playing with either Ryan and or Selanne, without those two he likely puts up 15-20 points in 48 games.


Saying there not good enough to create chances for themselves is just foolish. This line obviously isn't going to log big minutes, but if they can play 10 minutes a game and have Ebbett and Christenson put up 35-40 points each with Marchant making sure nothing goes the other way, then they get the mission accomplished. There not going to get more ice time then line 4, the checkers, but they will be used. If they do struggle to do anything, Brown and Parros can hook up with Marchant to set up a hitting line.

Expecting 35-40 points for either Ebbett and Christensen is a huge reach unless they're playing with other productive players. Even if they play against the other teams fourth line they will likely struggle to do anything as they will be outmuscled and in Christensens case outworked on a consistent basis.

I'm all for having a skilled centre on the fourth line between Brown and Parros/whoever to give the line some offensive talent to go with our grinders but to have two soft one dimensional guys who don't have the talent to overcome their deficiencies without strong linemates will be a big risk.

I think Ebbett should be on the third line. Who would be better then him that is on the active roster or already on the first or second line? Its doubtful anyone that we have could have done any better then Ebbett did when playing with Selanne in the playoffs.

Ryan Getzlaf Perry
Lupul Koivu Selanne
Nokie Marchant Brown
Ebbett Carter Parros
Beleskey Christenson Bodie

Out of curiosity, what is the point of ebbett on the third line? He hardly produced much of anything with selanne so I don't see him starting anything with cater/marchant/miller, and he doesn't do anything else remotely well enough to warrant a spot in the lineup. If he isn't surrounded by players who are competent offensively he is a waste of a spot, and becauseof that I really don't see a spot for him on the team.

However, if Carlyle chooses the pair setup like booger alluded to, he may work in at LW with koiuv/teemu or lupul/marchant, but I think putting him on a defensive line is counterproductive and just setting him and the line up for failure.

He should have a spot on this team because Koivu is injury prone. Ebbett is the perfect backup plan. I think people judge Ebbett way to negatively because of his poor playoff performance. The guy gives it his all and plays through injuries. He's not a great offensive player, but definitely capable of producing with Carter on occasion IMO. When I was making the line combos I couldn't decide between two sets of how I want the bottom two line combinations to go. Here's what they were:

Carter-Marchant-Ebbett
Parros-Nokke/Christensen-Brown

or

Carter-Marchant-Nokke
Parros-Ebbett/Christensen/-Brown

The second of that group would be Carlyle common "shutdown line". However, since I know that Carlyle hates Carter most of the time, Miller will sub for him often, which would be the worst possible option IMO.

I don't understand not putting Ebbett in the lineup. He may not have proved he's a top 6 player, but I think he proved he is a capable NHL player who earned his spot this upcoming season.

I don't understand not putting Ebbett in the lineup. He may not have proved he's a top 6 player, but I think he proved he is a capable NHL player who earned his spot this upcoming season.

He isn't a useful bottom six player, however. If ebbett barely produces with offensive players, why would you think he is going to produce with defensive players? He doesn't do anything else well enough to stay in the lineup. He's too small to be physical and he isn't good defensively, so what is he adding? Just a waste of a spot.

He should have a spot on this team because Koivu is injury prone. Ebbett is the perfect backup plan. I think people judge Ebbett way to negatively because of his poor playoff performance. The guy gives it his all and plays through injuries. He's not a great offensive player, but definitely capable of producing with Carter on occasion IMO. When I was making the line combos I couldn't decide between two sets of how I want the bottom two line combinations to go. Here's what they were:

Carter-Marchant-Ebbett
Parros-Nokke/Christensen-Brown

or

Carter-Marchant-Nokke
Parros-Ebbett/Christensen/-Brown

The second of that group would be Carlyle common "shutdown line". However, since I know that Carlyle hates Carter most of the time, Miller will sub for him often, which would be the worst possible option IMO.

He can be a backup plan just as well in the minors as on the big club, and his sporadic offense doesn't overcome his weaknesses elsewhere in his game if he is going to be in a bottoms six role. That bottom six is just too easy to play against.

Ebbett will be a great 3rd line offensive winger and backup 2nd line player. He is definitely one guy I don't want to see traded.

I really wonder if Carlyle splits up his offense. I think we may see some weird combinations in the 2nd and 3rd line since we really don't have a true checking line anymore.

Something like

RPG
Nokia Koivu Selanne
Lupul Marchant Ebbet/Christensen
Brown Carter/Miller Parros

If Murray does get another big checking winger (like a Grier or Rob Niedermayer), I can see it going to our traditional line up.

Will be interesting to see how our powerplay units end up. With Pronger he could play line alone leaving Scotty to roam around and Getzy to run the pp from the point. Can Whitney do that? Maybe, probably not. Might have to go with a more traditional PP.

The second unit will see precious few minutes which is a shame as Koivu-Lupul-Ryan might be an excellent unit with Wis and probably Sbisa playing the points.

He can be a backup plan just as well in the minors as on the big club, and his sporadic offense doesn't overcome his weaknesses elsewhere in his game if he is going to be in a bottoms six role. That bottom six is just too easy to play against.

Our defense is going to be half as good as last year's at best. IMO, we need as much scoring in the lineup as possible, which is exactly why Murray resigned Christensen. He doesn't have a "role" either, but as Murray has stated, scoring was the problem last season, and it will be the priority this season. Ebbett did pretty well in the regular season, he just struggled in the playoffs when he was hurt. He's no offensive demon or anything, but he's a solid player. Obviously if RC continues to use his common 2 scoring lines, 1 shutdown line, and 1 energy line then it will be hard to find him a lineup. However, since scoring seems to be priority now that are defense won't be as solid, I think placing Ebbett in the lineup would be smart. I have a bad feeling that we're still going to see a crappy shut down line though, most likely being Miller-Marchant-Nokke. Get used to seeing more of Miller if RC uses a shutdown line. Maybe he'll add Grier, since Moen is no longer an option. It'd be a smart move to add someone with size and grit if we go with a shutdown line again. A trade will be needed though if that happens.

Mine is:

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry

The RPG line...they'll play against opponent's best


Selanne - Koivu - Lupul

Selanne moves to the left because Lupul sucks on that side...Koivu is an underrated two-way forward...


Nokia - Marchant - Brown

The checking line...some offensive skill, but can also make life miserable for opponents


Christensen - Ebbett - Parros

The fourth line...Christensen is still dressed to take shootouts (though he likely loses his 2nd PP spot), Ebbett is our 2nd line centre backup, and Parros is the looker (j/k)

Thing is, Parros can be subbed off to double shift any of Ryan, Getzlaf, Selanne, Perry, Lupul, or Koivu that is going good any given night to create a 3rd really good offensive line...


Defensively, I see

Nieds - Sbisa

The kid will likely play with Scott...that seems to be Carlyle's way


Wisniewski - Boynton

Two tough stay at home D...Wiz brings more offense


Whitney - Brookbank

The 2nd best D plays with the 6th best to create a more balanced approach

Mine is:

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry

The RPG line...they'll play against opponent's best


Selanne - Koivu - Lupul

Selanne moves to the left because Lupul sucks on that side...Koivu is an underrated two-way forward...


Nokia - Marchant - Brown

The checking line...some offensive skill, but can also make life miserable for opponents


Christensen - Ebbett - Parros

The fourth line...Christensen is still dressed to take shootouts (though he likely loses his 2nd PP spot), Ebbett is our 2nd line centre backup, and Parros is the looker (j/k)

Thing is, Parros can be subbed off to double shift any of Ryan, Getzlaf, Selanne, Perry, Lupul, or Koivu that is going good any given night to create a 3rd really good offensive line...


Defensively, I see

Nieds - Sbisa

The kid will likely play with Scott...that seems to be Carlyle's way


Wisniewski - Boynton

Two tough stay at home D...Wiz brings more offense


Whitney - Brookbank

The 2nd best D plays with the 6th best to create a more balanced approach

I don't know about Selanne playing on the left wing, I don't remember him being very good in that position. Granted Lupul is not great either, but I think Lupul will be placed in the LW. I am very tempted to put Ryan with Koivu and Selanne. Bobby adds size to that line, but he did play very well with Getzlaf and Perry down the stretch so keeping him with them would work as well. I am interested to see what Carlyle does with our surplus of RW in the top lines.

Ryan/Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry

Lupul/Ryan - Koivu - Selanne

Miller - Marchant - Christensen

Carter - Nokelainen - Brown/Parros

I kind of wonder what would be best for Sbisa, playing on the 3rd pairing with Brookbank or playing with Scotty. I mean, we don't want to rush him. But what would be more rushing really? Being the better D-man on his pairing, knowing that it's a pairing we don't trust very much, or being paired with one of the best in the game? I'm starting to think that, playing with Scotty would mean less responsibility, regardless if it means more icetime.

Beauch had around 20 games of experience before being paired with Niedermayer. He had a lot more minor league seasoning, but still. Not unprecedented.

I like Wiz with Nieds personally cuz they were pretty damn good together, but I'm sure Wiz would do good with Whitney as well and sbisa with nieds to at least start, our boynton and brookbank would be a ver very solid 3rd pairing and could possibly play upwards of 15 mins a night IMO and be effective.

He isn't a useful bottom six player, however. If ebbett barely produces with offensive players, why would you think he is going to produce with defensive players? He doesn't do anything else well enough to stay in the lineup. He's too small to be physical and he isn't good defensively, so what is he adding? Just a waste of a spot.

Its not a waste of a spot if theres no one to replace him. Hes ahead of anyone that would be suited on the 3rd line right now IMO.

I think Ebbett would be a good depth offensive winger, just like Christensen.

Carter/Nokia should be the 4th line center since they have more size, defensive awareness.

Bobby Ryan - Ryan Getzlaf - Corey Perry
Joffrey Lupul - Saku Koivu - Teemu Selanne
Drew Miller - Todd Marchant - Mike Brown
Erik Christensen - Petteri Nokelainen - Andrew Ebbett / Ryan Carter / George Parros

Scott Niedermayer - James Wisniewski
Ryan Whitney - Lucas Sbisa
Nick Boynton - Sheldon Brookbank

Jonas Hiller
Jean-Sebastien Giguere

Is what I'd do. ;)

Ok after some hard work.

Chirstenson had 9 pts in 17 games in the regular season with the Ducks. Over 82 games this comes to about 43 points. Here is a very detailed report of who he played with for these points.

His top scoring pairing was with Parros and Brown. Ha! I bet no one saw that coming. Not in the center-wing format just names.

Parros-Brown 1G+2A=3Pts
Ebbet-Perry 0G+2A=2Pts
Getzlaf-Perry 0G+1A=1Pt
Noeklainin-Ryan 0G+1A=1Pt
Ryan-Ebbett 0G+1A=1Pt
Ebbett-Selanne 1G+0A=1Pt

He had 2 pts in 8 games in the playoffs. Which is about as half as productive as he was in the regular season but were not talking playoffs here people.

Looks like to me in the regular season it didn't matter who he played with it just mattered on when he made the play.

Looking off of that it looks like it doesn't matter who he plays with

Ok after some hard work.

Chirstenson had 9 pts in 17 games in the regular season with the Ducks. Over 82 games this comes to about 43 points. Here is a very detailed report of who he played with for these points.

His top scoring pairing was with Parros and Brown. Ha! I bet no one saw that coming. Not in the center-wing format just names.

Parros-Brown 1G+2A=3Pts
Ebbet-Perry 0G+2A=2Pts
Getzlaf-Perry 0G+1A=1Pt
Noeklainin-Ryan 0G+1A=1Pt
Ryan-Ebbett 0G+1A=1Pt
Ebbett-Selanne 1G+0A=1Pt

He had 2 pts in 8 games in the playoffs. Which is about as half as productive as he was in the regular season but were not talking playoffs here people.

Looks like to me in the regular season it didn't matter who he played with it just mattered on when he made the play.

Looking off of that it looks like it doesn't matter who he plays with

I'm not defending EC or anything, because frankly I don't understand why we resigned him, but all that proves is how inconsistent the lines were last year. As long as he stays away from our top 2 lines I'm happy. It will be interesting to see what Carlyle does though. We have the players to dress 3 scoring lines, but Carlyle has always gone with a checking line and an energy line for the 3rd and 4th lines. If he continues that trend I expect one of Ebbett or Christsensen to be moved because they don't have much purpose on an energy line or checking line.

Looking off of that it looks like it doesn't matter who he plays with

17 games is way too small a sample size to justify that conclusion.

17 games is way too small a sample size to justify that conclusion.

I don't see how it is to small. It's like 20% of the season.

I'm not defending EC or anything, because frankly I don't understand why we resigned him, but all that proves is how inconsistent the lines were last year. As long as he stays away from our top 2 lines I'm happy. It will be interesting to see what Carlyle does though. We have the players to dress 3 scoring lines, but Carlyle has always gone with a checking line and an energy line for the 3rd and 4th lines. If he continues that trend I expect one of Ebbett or Christsensen to be moved because they don't have much purpose on an energy line or checking line.


I honestly don't think we have the talent for a top of the line checking line. Brown is way overrated around here, it seems his hits(namely the hudler one) make the impression of an amazing defensive player. He is solid defensively, but I think it is safe to say he has more in common with Parros then Pahlson

Will Christensen produce equally well paired with the bench? :sarcasm:

Ryan-Getz-Perry
Carter/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/Nokie-Marchant-Lupul
Parros/Nokie-Christensen-Brown/Carter

Scotty-Sbisa
Whitney-Wiz
Brookbank-Boynton

I honestly don't think we have the talent for a top of the line checking line.Agreed. I've been advocating another veteren acquisiton for the 3rd line just because.

Brown is way overrated around here, it seems his hits(namely the hudler one) make the impression of an amazing defensive player. He is solid defensively,How is Brown overrated if you yourself agree he is solid defensively? Nobody has said more than that. Solid defensively is good enough.

Oh, and not giving us a lot of credit up there in your ivory tower of hockey viewing greatness, i see.


but I think it is safe to say he has more in common with Parros then PahlsonSpeaking of overrated...

I honestly don't think we have the talent for a top of the line checking line. Brown is way overrated around here, it seems his hits(namely the hudler one) make the impression of an amazing defensive player. He is solid defensively, but I think it is safe to say he has more in common with Parros then Pahlson

I don't either, but that's just Carlyle's way. We didn't have the talent last year IMO either, but he found a way to make one, and that line of miller,marchant, and R.Niedermayer were 2nd in ice time only to the Getzlaf line. If we made a checking line it would be made up of 3 of the following players: Nokke, Marchant, Miller, or Carter.

I don't see how it is to small. It's like 20% of the season.

It is too small because he did play what 2-3 games with Getzlaf and Perry. You can't draw and conclusions based on that.

How much do you think Grier is asking for? He would be an excellent addition to our third line.

How much do you think Grier is asking for? He would be an excellent addition to our third line.

I'm not sure but I wouldn't pay him anything more than 750k a year.

How much do you think Grier is asking for? He would be an excellent addition to our third line.
Grier is roughly on par defensively with Pahlsson. He made as such last year (1.775 vs 1.4 million).

However he's slowing down a little, and he's 34 (almost 3 years older than Pahlsson). He's also a wing and not a center, which may or may not affect his salary. I do know I prefer defensive centers to defensive wingers since you need somebody to take draws on the PK (Grier only had 43 draws last season and only won 34.9% of them).

I would imagine that he might point to Pahlsson and ask for 2.3 or so. I'd only want to give around 1.8. I don't think this team has the money to go even that much.

Agreed. I've been advocating another veteren acquisiton for the 3rd line just because.

How is Brown overrated if you yourself agree he is solid defensively? Nobody has said more than that. Solid defensively is good enough.

Oh, and not giving us a lot of credit up there in your ivory tower of hockey viewing greatness, i see.


Speaking of overrated...

I meant the overachieving Pahlson in 07. I know it's no secret that the entire checking line took a nose dive after that year.

What I mean by Brown being solid defensively is you can use him like a Parros against the oppositions lower lines. If you expect him to go out there and stop the Thornton's and Kopitar's he's going to be -50 by the break unless he's out there with Niedermayer.

I don't either, but that's just Carlyle's way. We didn't have the talent last year IMO either, but he found a way to make one, and that line of miller,marchant, and R.Niedermayer were 2nd in ice time only to the Getzlaf line. If we made a checking line it would be made up of 3 of the following players: Nokke, Marchant, Miller, or Carter.

Looking at that there's 3 young guys in Miller,Carter,Noeklainin. Maybe if Carlyle coaches them up and they get some chemistry going they can be the checking line for years to come.

Looking at that there's 3 young guys in Miller,Carter,Noeklainin. Maybe if Carlyle coaches them up and they get some chemistry going they can be the checking line for years to come.

Hopefully not...


As for Grier... If Murray called his agent and asked what he's looking for, and he said 1.8 million; I hope that Murray would laugh and hang up. Personally I think Moen is better then Grier, and Moen is overpaid right now. I'd offer Grier 1 year 1 million contract. Anything over 1-1.5 is just ridiculous and dumb.

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry (Bobby plays like crud with the twins)
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Miller - Marchant - Nokelainen
Brown - Carter - Parros

Niedermayer - Wiz
Whitney - Boynton
Sbisa - Brookbank


Hiller
Giguere

Not Bad...

SoB

Hopefully not...


As for Grier... If Murray called his agent and asked what he's looking for, and he said 1.8 million; I hope that Murray would laugh and hang up. Personally I think Moen is better then Grier, and Moen is overpaid right now. I'd offer Grier 1 year 1 million contract. Anything over 1-1.5 is just ridiculous and dumb.
Maybe this gets into some difference in opinion in how good Grier is (where I said before that I think he's just a half step below Pahlsson), but if Pahlsson got 1.4 on his previous contract (which many have said was a discount), and Pahlsson's previous contract was a few years ago (ie many millions of dollars lower cap), then how can you say Grier shouldn't even get 1.5?

Maybe this gets into some difference in opinion in how good Grier is (where I said before that I think he's just a half step below Pahlsson), but if Pahlsson got 1.4 on his previous contract (which many have said was a discount), and Pahlsson's previous contract was a few years ago (ie many millions of dollars lower cap), then how can you say Grier shouldn't even get 1.5?

I guess we just have different values of Grier then. I watched the Sharks playoffs games last year, and Moen was clearly better. Grier is slow and doesn't forecheck very well anymore. His strength is the PK, but that's pretty much all he does well.

Ok after some hard work.

Chirstenson had 9 pts in 17 games in the regular season with the Ducks. Over 82 games this comes to about 43 points.

That's simply too small a sample size to pro-rate to a season. There's way too much random activity to get a reliable number in 20% of the season. Going from his rookie season

Year | Team(s) | Games | Points | Points per game | Even strength points per 60 minutes
2005-06 | Pittsburgh | 33 | 13 | 0.39 | 1.27
2006-07 | Pittsburgh | 61 | 33 | 0.54 | 2.43
2007-08 | Pittsburgh - Atlanta | 59 | 24 | 0.41 | 1.50
2008-09 | Atlanta | 47 | 19 | 0.40 | 1.61

If you look through his career at the time he was traded to Anaheim I'd say he was a consistent 0.40 points per game player who'd had an outlier of a sophomore season. The trend is flat in terms of his points per game the last two seasons and his EVSPts/60 have decreased since his sophomore season

Now compare pre and with Anaheim stats

| Games | Points | Points per game | Even strength points per 60 minutes
Pre Anaheim | 200 | 89 | 0.45 | 1.71
With Anaheim | 17 | 9 | 0.53 | 2.19

And you can see why such a small sample size can give misleading results. Based on the 200 games he played before coming here I'd have said that he was good for about 7 points but by scoring 2 more (and 2 is certainly a small enough number to be caused by random effects such as a wicked deflection or a goalie letting one through that he'd normally stop) it allows pro rating to say he's good for 43 points over the season whereas I'd have said that number is about 33 based on his history

The Lines (as I see it):

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Carter/Miller - Marchant - Christensen/Ebbett
Brown - Nokie - The Stache

S.Nieds - Sbisa
Whitney - Wisniewski
Boynton - Brookbank/Mitera/Festerling/Salcido/Mikkelson

Jiggy
Hiller

Of course, the Lines don't really matter since RC loves to mix and match. But hopefully the Fins create magic that RC cannot break up.

Check out the blog on anaheimducks.com. It has some comments from Carlyle talking about how he wants to still make defense the priority. He didn't come out and say that he will still use a checking line, but it's looking more and more likely that he will. I don't see him spreading all the offense out either, so I think he'll use these lines:

Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Miller/Carter/Marchant/Nokke
Parros-Ebbett/Christensen-Brown

the 3rd line is brutal ugh its useless. Wondering why Murray didnt go harder after Kostopolous or Moen. Miller + Ebbett + EC are not NHL caliber players and have no business on a team that is looking to contend. I know Murray is hoping Bodie becomes the next Travis Moen so we'll see.

Lupul - Getz - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Teemu
Bodie - Nok - Carter/Brown
Carter/Brown - Marchant - Parros

Neids/Boynton
Wiz/Whitney
Sbisa/Mitera/Brookbank

AHL/Released/Cut -Miller,Ebbett,EC

the 3rd line is brutal ugh its useless. Wondering why Murray didnt go harder after Kostopolous or Moen. Miller + Ebbett + EC are not NHL caliber players and have no business on a team that is looking to contend. I know Murray is hoping Bodie becomes the next Travis Moen so we'll see.

Lupul - Getz - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Teemu
Bodie - Nok - Carter/Brown
Carter/Brown - Marchant - Parros

Neids/Boynton
Wiz/Whitney
Sbisa/Mitera/Brookbank

AHL/Released/Cut -Miller,Ebbett,EC

:facepalm:

:facepalm:

Im inclined to take his side on this one. Those three players are all borderline useless. Andrew Ebbett managed to score two even strength goals in 48 games in the 2nd line center role. Even if you want to argue that he wasnt in that role for the entirety of his 48 games, two even strength goals is awful.

the 3rd line is brutal ugh its useless. Wondering why Murray didnt go harder after Kostopolous or Moen. Miller + Ebbett + EC are not NHL caliber players and have no business on a team that is looking to contend. I know Murray is hoping Bodie becomes the next Travis Moen so we'll see.

Lupul - Getz - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Teemu
Bodie - Nok - Carter/Brown
Carter/Brown - Marchant - Parros

Neids/Boynton
Wiz/Whitney
Sbisa/Mitera/Brookbank

AHL/Released/Cut -Miller,Ebbett,EC

Carlyle was quoted in the Register today as saying that Nieds would be paired with Sbisa.

I didn't see that. I thought they were doing the line combo thing tomorrow?

:facepalm:
You are actually face palming me? The same person who's 3rd line is
"Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant" 2 midgets and the softest laziest player on this team? That is the checking line you recomend?

Oh wait there's more, how about a nice intimidating 4th line consisting of:
"Miller-Carter-Noeklainin"
This is a serious post right?

Actually WATCH hockey for a couple years and spend less time playing you're XBOX then post. Are you even older than 13? Because that would explain a lot. Does mommy know you post here?

Carlyle was quoted in the Register today as saying that Nieds would be paired with Sbisa.


Didnt see that but i doubt that actually happens

You are actually face palming me? The same person who's 3rd line is
"Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant" 2 midgets and the softest laziest player on this team? That is the checking line you recomend?

Oh wait there's more, how about a nice intimidating 4th line consisting of:
"Miller-Carter-Noeklainin"
This is a serious post right?

Actually WATCH hockey for a couple years and spend less time playing you're XBOX then post. Are you even older than 13? Because that would explain a lot. Does mommy know you post here?

Even when I take your side you still manage to piss me off. Ease up on the guy, he didnt hurt anyone by posting an opinion.

Carlyle was quoted in the Register today as saying that Nieds would be paired with Sbisa.
I could see it. I really think Sbisa will be a stud. Maybe not this season though

As long as he works hard in the offseason to bulk up, I think he could be the #2 like Beauchemin was. Although his style of play might fit in better with Pronger than Niedermayer.

Still can't find that quote.

Perry - Getzlaf - Lupul
Perry and Getzlaf stay together that pretty much a given. Lupul gets a chance to play with the twins and learn from their ability to feed off each other. Maybe perhaps he shakes of his streakiness. IF he doesn't succeed there he could get moved down with Koivu and Selanne and learn to "finnish."
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Ryan gets to play with two of the most noble hockey players I have even known about. Ryan will gain much experience learning from these two experts. Selanne and Koivu Must play together.
Marchant - Nokalainen - Brown
Two out of the three can take face offs and two out of the three can lay a check down on each other. I dare you to show me a better checking line.
Parros - Carter - Christensen
Now I only give Christensen a roster spot no one else worked. Carter is a gem and never has not fallen from my expectations. Parros lets hope you can do even better than last year.
Niedermayer - Salcido
Salcido will learn from the master and as everyone has said niedermayer also makes his partner look better so we wont be unimpresssed. Salcido needs to be proven so we can lock him up and this is a safe bet.
Whitney - Wiznewski
Give em a shot.
Boyton - Sbisa
Not much of a liability on third pairing minutes.
Giguere
Regains his glory Book it e35 Seriously he will bounce back.
Hiller
Goalie 1 b

I like Lupul on the top line, Perry has always been a better playmaker than scorer IMO and we all know Getzlafs abilities. also, Carlyle seems to like young guys paired with Nieds recently so I expect Sbisa to be paired with Nieds at least in preseason to see what the kid can do.

the 3rd line is brutal ugh its useless. Wondering why Murray didnt go harder after Kostopolous or Moen. Miller + Ebbett + EC are not NHL caliber players and have no business on a team that is looking to contend. I know Murray is hoping Bodie becomes the next Travis Moen so we'll see.

Lupul - Getz - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Teemu
Bodie - Nok - Carter/Brown
Carter/Brown - Marchant - Parros

Neids/Boynton
Wiz/Whitney
Sbisa/Mitera/Brookbank

AHL/Released/Cut -Miller,Ebbett,EC

We wouldn't resign EC just to cut him before the season starts. I'm all for either cutting Miller or sending him down to the AHL. I don't want him near the roster either. I think we should keep Ebbett though. He can fill in well on the top lines in case of injury. If RC is going to go with a checking line again, his comments make it seem almost certain, then you're right he should have added another big defensive player like Moen or Grier. I think we're stuck with the current roster though. I'm going to do one more set of line combos for what we have. The first one is with a shutdown line, since it's pretty apparent that RC is going to use one. The second group will be ones that RC could use against teams that a shutdown line isn't really needed.

With shutdown line:
Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-Nokke
Parros-Ebbett/Christensen-Brown

With out shutdown line:
Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Christensen/Ebbett-Marchant-Carter
Parros-Christensen/Ebbett/-Brown
Sit Nokke against teams that we don't need a shutdown line. Miller is needed on either set so cut his ass.

Still can't find that quote.
It was in the physical newspaper (July 14th, page 3). There isn't an exact version of it online. It comes from an interview with Carlyle.

These 2 stories have some of the same quotes (same interview), but no mention of Sbisa.

http://ducks.freedomblogging.com/2009/07/13/carlyle-reacts-to-ducks-makeover/16143/
http://ducks.freedomblogging.com/2009/07/15/ducks-carlyle-considers-line-combinations/16167/

In the newspaper it just said that Carlyle expects Sbisa to get a good look with Niedermayer to begin the year, sort of like Beauchemin (I think that was the writer that mentioned Beauch not Carlyle). Carlyle also calls him kid like 50 million times in a couple sentences.

Didnt see that but i doubt that actually happens

You're right... what difference would Carlyle's opinion make on who is paired together.

Anyone read the register today. Carlyle had comments about line combinations.

Basically said Getz & Perry will start together and Koivu/Selanne (big surpise).

What he did say that was interesting, is that Lupul is not a lock on the 2nd line and he may spread the offesne around to 3 lines (ala Redwings).

I just hope Christensen/Miller are no where near the top 2 lines.

You are actually face palming me? The same person who's 3rd line is
"Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant" 2 midgets and the softest laziest player on this team? That is the checking line you recomend?

Oh wait there's more, how about a nice intimidating 4th line consisting of:
"Miller-Carter-Noeklainin"
This is a serious post right?

Actually WATCH hockey for a couple years and spend less time playing you're XBOX then post. Are you even older than 13? Because that would explain a lot. Does mommy know you post here?

I suppose you were one of the people who thought Getzlaf/Lupul/Perry/Penner were border line awful when they were having rough times in 03-04 and 05-06 seasons. Nice to see how those non NHL talents turned out.

Ebbett is NOT nhl caliber? :handclap: he would play on the majority of teams around. Marchant is lazy? :laugh: Right,Right and you were the one telling me to get off the XBOX correct? Your right Ebbett probably won't even see that 6'1 205 pound midget Christenson. We should get the Fin, what's his name, can you help me out here? (Runs to Xbox) Oh yes, Selanne to play with him. What,wait,how? Christenson is bigger then Selanne?? Probably just my Xbox telling me lies.

Who would you rather have in those roles Brown and Parros? If your going to say Ebbett is not an NHL player how the HELL can you say Brown is? Brown has never been able to play an entire NHL season and you want him to be on the checking line?

And another thing I did NOT want a Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant checking line. I do not know how well your reading skills are but I think it states quite clearly that it is not my checking line. My Fourth line is a checking line but I think Miller should switch with Marchant after thinking about it. You would rather have an intimidating fourth line huh? Well we can send Brown and Parros out there and nick name that the GAPG. Has nothing to do with last names, but still gives them an accurate name.

Now for my fandom. I was a casual fan from 7-2 (I think) against Detroit through the 7 game comeback against the Yotes (Did they have a whiteout that year?) and then getting 4-0'd by Detroit a couple times. I became a hardcore fan when the team went on the run in 02-03. Since then in the 03-04,05-06,06-07,07-08,08-09 seasons I have caught probably 95% of Ducks games. I have also been to my share of them, but I live in the Inland Empire so it is kind of hard to get there some times. Sadly I don't get KDOC so when the game is on that channel, I kind of get screwed over.

Didnt see that but i doubt that actually happens

Brilliant. Let's go against everything our HEAD COACH has done in the past and is saying now.

Anyone read the register today. Carlyle had comments about line combinations.

Basically said Getz & Ryan will start together and Koivu/Selanne (big surpise).

What he did say that was interesting, is that Lupul is not a lock on the 2nd line and he may spread the offesne around to 3 lines (ala Redwings).

I just hope Christensen/Miller are no where near the top 2 lines.

Based on that, how about

Ryan Getz Carter = 2 scorers and checker
Teemu Saku Marchant = 2 scorers and checker
Lupul EC Perry = to scorers and EC
Parros Noki Brown = solid checking line

A little odd pairings, but three scoring lines.

I think if Lupul goes to third line, his center will be Marchant. OK, maybe not for sure, but that will be first look. They had success alongside one another when Lupul was last here and to start, that would seem to be a starting point for a pairing to anchor a scoring third line if Carlyle wants to go in that direction.

I think if Lupul goes to third line, his center will be Marchant. OK, maybe not for sure, but that will be first look. They had success alongside one another when Lupul was last here and to start, that would seem to be a starting point for a pairing to anchor a scoring third line if Carlyle wants to go in that direction.

Agreed. With Ryan and Lupul on the wings they'll need a defensive presence on the line. They'd also need some kind of beef on the second line in that scenario.

meant Getz & Perry, not ryan, sorry.

I think Kevin is right on, we'll see:

Getz Perry - interchangeable part
Koivu Sellane - interchangeable part
Marchant Lupul - interchangeable part
Brown Parros - interchangeable part

If behind, late in games, we can shorten our bench and get 2 or 3 great lines.

I don't like putting Koivu and Marchant together because both are pretty gifted defensively, and they are 2 best faceoff guys. Marchant would be best suited leading the bottom 6 role.

Ryan can go on any of the top 3 lines, which will be real nice. Any team that tries to play the matchup game with us will have to deal with him getting an easy matchup.

The question is who else would want in the top 6? Personally I'd like to see Nokia and Carter because they bring more of a physical game, than Ebbett/Christensen. Heck I wouldn't even minding giving Parros a short w / Getz & Perry. That would be a lot of mustard.

I hope Miller gets bumped to the AHL. I don't ebbett would be a bad choice w/ Lupul/Marchant too. If Ryan in on the top 2 lines, you could let Christensen/Ebbett fight for that spot.

I suppose you were one of the people who thought Getzlaf/Lupul/Perry/Penner were border line awful when they were having rough times in 03-04 and 05-06 seasons. Nice to see how those non NHL talents turned out.

Ebbett is NOT nhl caliber? :handclap: he would play on the majority of teams around. Marchant is lazy? :laugh: Right,Right and you were the one telling me to get off the XBOX correct? Your right Ebbett probably won't even see that 6'1 205 pound midget Christenson. We should get the Fin, what's his name, can you help me out here? (Runs to Xbox) Oh yes, Selanne to play with him. What,wait,how? Christenson is bigger then Selanne?? Probably just my Xbox telling me lies.

Who would you rather have in those roles Brown and Parros? If your going to say Ebbett is not an NHL player how the HELL can you say Brown is? Brown has never been able to play an entire NHL season and you want him to be on the checking line?

And another thing I did NOT want a Christenson-Ebbett-Marchant checking line. I do not know how well your reading skills are but I think it states quite clearly that it is not my checking line. My Fourth line is a checking line but I think Miller should switch with Marchant after thinking about it. You would rather have an intimidating fourth line huh? Well we can send Brown and Parros out there and nick name that the GAPG. Has nothing to do with last names, but still gives them an accurate name.

Now for my fandom. I was a casual fan from 7-2 (I think) against Detroit through the 7 game comeback against the Yotes (Did they have a whiteout that year?) and then getting 4-0'd by Detroit a couple times. I became a hardcore fan when the team went on the run in 02-03. Since then in the 03-04,05-06,06-07,07-08,08-09 seasons I have caught probably 95% of Ducks games. I have also been to my share of them, but I live in the Inland Empire so it is kind of hard to get there some times. Sadly I don't get KDOC so when the game is on that channel, I kind of get screwed over.



Brilliant. Let's go against everything our HEAD COACH has done in the past and is saying now.



1) hahahah did you just compare Getzlaf and Perry to Ebbett and EC??? Wow you are a retarded mongoloid :laugh:

2)I said Ebbett is not an NHL caliber player on a team trying to win a cup and last playoffs proved it, he was a stop gap fill in. No different than a Ryan Shannon.

3)Parros and Brown are tough but hardly intimidating players but yes 4th lines needed muscle, hitting and some type of enforcement for our skilled players, the 3rd line needs at least one muscle player as well. Neither of the lineups you contains that. In fact you listed a full wuss lineup. Thats you're opinion and i should not have attacked you for it.

4)I questioned you're "Fandom" based on you leaving out any ounce of toughness which goes against everything Carlyle stands for and the image this team tried to build to get away from the soft Disney image that made this team unwatchable for years. Again its not my business to question that but when i see i supposed Duck fan post things like that it angers me. Lets go back to a team that gets cheapshotted, pushed around and injured :sarcasm:

5)Where did i go against the head coach? To put it more simply what i meant was I'll believe it when i see it. I find it hard to believe he will put a skinny young kid and use him as our #1 D unit. I would think he will give him some proper seasoning but hey noone knows what will happen until the season starts.

Based on that, how about

Ryan Getz Carter = 2 scorers and checker
Teemu Saku Marchant = 2 scorers and checker
Lupul EC Perry = to scorers and EC
Parros Noki Brown = solid checking line

A little odd pairings, but three scoring lines.

That third line would be absolutely terrible IMO. Unless it's a powerplay, I don't want Lupul and EC on the ice at that same time at all. Both kind of float around. I still think RC will use some kind of shutdown line, but if he wants to spread the offense around, which I also doubt happens, I'd do it like this:

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry (Carter showed last playoffs that he could handle himself here.)

Christensen/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne (might be a liablity defesnively, but i'd like to see it experimented with.)

Ryan-Marchant-Lupul (Ryan is the playmaker, Lupul is the sniper, and Marchant is the defensive guy. I actually think this line would do very well.)

Parros-EC/Ebbett/Nokke-Brown

Is anyone else wondering why Nokke is on the team? He's decent at faceoffs at best, and IMO Carter is better in every way. He was supposed to be Pahlsson's replacement, but Marchant was brought back to do that role.

Noke played well to start off with then kind of faded (not used to the ice time?) and was hurt. He is better than Miller and more useful than Christensen and Ebbett in a bottom six role. Hes kind of my candidate for our breakout role player for next year.

That third line would be absolutely terrible IMO. Unless it's a powerplay, I don't want Lupul and EC on the ice at that same time at all. Both kind of float around. I still think RC will use some kind of shutdown line, but if he wants to spread the offense around, which I also doubt happens, I'd do it like this:

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry (Carter showed last playoffs that he could handle himself here.)

Christensen/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne (might be a liablity defesnively, but i'd like to see it experimented with.)

Ryan-Marchant-Lupul (Ryan is the playmaker, Lupul is the sniper, and Marchant is the defensive guy. I actually think this line would do very well.)

Parros-EC/Ebbett/Nokke-Brown

Is anyone else wondering why Nokke is on the team? He's decent at faceoffs at best, and IMO Carter is better in every way. He was supposed to be Pahlsson's replacement, but Marchant was brought back to do that role.

I was basing it off of an earlier post that said Ryan and Getz on the same line and Teemu and Saku on a line with Lups on the 3rd.

While I agree with you about the 3rd line, I would like RC to mix up the scoring a bit.

Noke played well to start off with then kind of faded (not used to the ice time?) and was hurt. He is better than Miller and more useful than Christensen and Ebbett in a bottom six role.

IMO he played well in the beginning because he was doing everything he could to show Boston what a mistake they made. However, I don't think he's really more usefull on the 4th line then Ebbett and EC. Definitely the 3rd line, but he's behind Marchant and Carter in that role IMO, and since RC is now suggesting that he's going to spread the offense around, there's not much room for him. IMO he's a clone of Carter, who is a tiny bit behind Carter in talent, but makes more then him. The only place for him IMO is the 3rd line if we use a shutdown line. If we do use one then it would probably be Carter-Marchant-Nokke. I think it would be better just to trade Nokke and add someone who brings more size and grit to the position.

He isn't needed on the 4th line IMO. I'd rather have EC there, because wasn't the 4th line's best string of games when it was Parros-EC-Brown? At least EC would be good on the 2nd powerplay unit and in shootouts. I realize what's been posted about RC saying about spreading the offense around, but I just dont think that will happen. In the end he will use the 2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, and 1 energy line formula like he always does. Trade Nokke and sign a bigger more physical winger to play on the checking line.

Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-FA
Parros-EC-Brown
Ebbett

I was basing it off of an earlier post that said Ryan and Getz on the same line and Teemu and Saku on a line with Lups on the 3rd.

While I agree with you about the 3rd line, I would like RC to mix up the scoring a bit.

Calimad edited that post before I read this thread so I see where you're coming from. I wouldn't mind seeing RC try to spread the offense around, but I just don't see him doing it, and if he does do it, it won't be for long. I full expect him to use his standard formula, 2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, and an energy line.

1) hahahah did you just compare Getzlaf and Perry to Ebbett and EC??? Wow you are a retarded mongoloid :laugh:

2)I said Ebbett is not an NHL caliber player on a team trying to win a cup and last playoffs proved it, he was a stop gap fill in. No different than a Ryan Shannon.

3)Parros and Brown are tough but hardly intimidating players but yes 4th lines needed muscle, hitting and some type of enforcement for our skilled players, the 3rd line needs at least one muscle player as well. Neither of the lineups you contains that. In fact you listed a full wuss lineup. Thats you're opinion and i should not have attacked you for it.

4)I questioned you're "Fandom" based on you leaving out any ounce of toughness which goes against everything Carlyle stands for and the image this team tried to build to get away from the soft Disney image that made this team unwatchable for years. Again its not my business to question that but when i see i supposed Duck fan post things like that it angers me. Lets go back to a team that gets cheapshotted, pushed around and injured :sarcasm:

5)Where did i go against the head coach? To put it more simply what i meant was I'll believe it when i see it. I find it hard to believe he will put a skinny young kid and use him as our #1 D unit. I would think he will give him some proper seasoning but hey noone knows what will happen until the season starts.

Well even though I am a retarded mongoloid, I will put up an argument. You are comparing Ebbett to the current Getzlaf. Do you not remember how Getzlaf started? He was about on the same pace as Ebbett (56 point pace that year) and struggled in the playoffs much the same way. He put up 7 points in 16 games in the playoffs that year while facing much weaker teams. If your gonna try and say the Flames,Avalanche, and Oilers that year were as good as the Sharks and Wings this year I'm just not even going to listen.

The next year Getzlaf had the same pace as the year before but played the entire year. He then played outstanding in the playoffs and the playoffs of that year was really his coming out party.

I'm not trying to say Ebbett will be as good as Getzlaf, but if you are saying Ebbett doesn't deserve to be on the team, you most certainly must have said the same about Getzlaf.

Comparing Ebbett to a Ryan Shannon is just an insult to his play. Ebbet is way better of a hockey player then him.

Please explain why we "need" a muscle player on a line? Kunitz-McDonald-Selanne did pretty well didn't they. We definitely need to have size in our line up, but we don't need it on every single line. A full wuss lineup? Aside from the EC-Ebbett-Miller line I suggested, every one of my lines has someone with size to it. We can have guys that do nothing but stand there and be big and tough or we can use people that can actually do a damn thing in their place and have our huge Forwards and Defensemen be the ones who are big and tough WHILE being useful as a hockey player.

I'm not turning this line-up into 5'11 European line up it was before, and you questioning my dedication as a fan because you say I am, frankly, is a joke.

You are saying that you don't believe what our head coach said he is going to do. How is that not going against what he said? Beauchemin,Salcido,Festerling, and Mikkelson all had Pronger or Niedermayer as playing partners at one point or another.

Noke played well to start off with then kind of faded (not used to the ice time?) and was hurt. He is better than Miller and more useful than Christensen and Ebbett in a bottom six role. Hes kind of my candidate for our breakout role player for next year.

I agree w/ Static on this one. I think Nokia has some potential. If he can use his size/get pucks out of the corner, he'd be a good compliment on the 2nd line.

Selanne and Koivu play small games, as he said in the article, they need some beef.

Putting Carter on line 1 and Nokia on line 2, makes a very intersting 4th line of:

ebbett
Christensen
Miller
Carter
Parros

Noke never hits! I hate him!

The reason i don't want to see Christensen or Ebbett being on the bottom-6 is not a lack of size or defensive ability, it's the lack of quality of our other bottom-6 guys. Marchant is a good defensive center/winger, Brown is a great 4th liner and Parros one of the best enforcers around but other than that there really isn't much quality. Miller, Carter, Noke are serviceable at best. If we had a better bottom-6, a guy like EC or Ebbett would be fine in there.

And it's not like those are some kids still developing. Carter, EC and Ebbett are 26, Miller 25. Only Noke could still be considered a prospect.

The reason i don't want to see Christensen or Ebbett being on the bottom-6 is not a lack of size or defensive ability, it's the lack of quality of our other bottom-6 guys. Marchant is a good defensive center/winger, Brown is a great 4th liner and Parros one of the best enforcers around but other than that there really isn't much quality. Miller, Carter, Noke are serviceable at best. If we had a better bottom-6, a guy like EC or Ebbett would be fine in there.

And it's not like those are some kids still developing. Carter, EC and Ebbett are 26, Miller 25. Only Noke could still be considered a prospect.
Well you only need 1 more. Ebbett AND Christensen makes 2 bottom 6 scorers. We already have 6 more scorer types in Getzlaf, Perry, Lupul, Selanne, Koivu, and Ryan. Maybe in that role Miller can do it? Miller was a decent scorer in college and the AHL, but he's focused mainly on defense with the big club. Maybe he can complete the line in a sheltered 3rd scoring line role? Although that would put Parros in a checking role for the presumed checking line.

Having both EC and Ebbet would just compound the problem as they're both awful defensively. I'd be ok with one of them in there if we had a 3rd line of, say, Marchant-Malhotra-Grier. Then i'd be ok with EC centering Brown and Parros on the 4th.

Ignoring names, the best "defensive ability" bottom-6 i can come up with using our guys is:

average-good-average
decent-average-poor

Having one or even two of those averages changed to poors or awfuls isn't going to work.

Bottom line is, IMO, that an average defensive player can't cover for a poor defensive player.

We need a 3rd liner.

That third line would be absolutely terrible IMO. Unless it's a powerplay, I don't want Lupul and EC on the ice at that same time at all. Both kind of float around. I still think RC will use some kind of shutdown line, but if he wants to spread the offense around, which I also doubt happens, I'd do it like this:

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry (Carter showed last playoffs that he could handle himself here.)

Christensen/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne (might be a liablity defesnively, but i'd like to see it experimented with.)

Ryan-Marchant-Lupul (Ryan is the playmaker, Lupul is the sniper, and Marchant is the defensive guy. I actually think this line would do very well.)

Parros-EC/Ebbett/Nokke-Brown

Is anyone else wondering why Nokke is on the team? He's decent at faceoffs at best, and IMO Carter is better in every way. He was supposed to be Pahlsson's replacement, but Marchant was brought back to do that role.

If Carlyle goes with 3 scoring lines, I agree that the best pairs would be Getzlaf-Perry, Koivu-Selanne, Lupul-Ryan. However I think putting Ebbett in between Lupul and Ryan would make more sense then using Marchant in that role. Marchant would be better used in a checking role and it would give Ebbett a chance to play and develop with good players.

Also I think Miller has more of an offensive game then Carter. He also has the defensive experience and could do well with the Fins. All in all here's my take on a balanced 3 line approach.

Christenson-Getzlaf-Perry
Miller-Koivu-Selanne
Lupul-Ebbett-Ryan

Noke never hits! I hate him!
Change your name to iHATEnoke17 and start a little club.

Maybe we should first concentrate on getting TWO good scoring lines before trying to get 3 of them.

http://ducks.freedomblogging.com/2009/07/16/opportunity-beckons-for-ducks-newcomer-sbisa/16177/


Here is a link stating Carlyle wants Sbisa with Nieds to start.

http://ducks.freedomblogging.com/2009/07/16/opportunity-beckons-for-ducks-newcomer-sbisa/16177/


Here is a link stating Carlyle wants Sbisa with Nieds to start.
Ryan Whitney and James Wisniewski, who came to the Ducks in separate deals before the March 4 trade deadline, are expected to play key roles. Boynton, extremely motivated to atone for a disappointing one-season stint with the Florida Panthers, is also slotted as a top-four performer, with holdover Sheldon Brookbank the front-runner for the other regular job.
Uh, what?

(Carlyle on Sbisa): With his body makeup and whatnot, he has a lot of work to do.
Calling Sean Skahan.


It's kind of interesting that these blogs and the newspaper article doesn't correlate 1-for-1. The newspaper had a big piece with most, but not all (I don't believe the paper talked much about Whitney, Wisniewski, or Boynton), of the blog things that have been coming out the past few days. I wonder if this is some way for the newspaper to try to differentiate the paper from the website, and to try to encourage people to get the paper?

If Carlyle goes with 3 scoring lines, I agree that the best pairs would be Getzlaf-Perry, Koivu-Selanne, Lupul-Ryan. However I think putting Ebbett in between Lupul and Ryan would make more sense then using Marchant in that role. Marchant would be better used in a checking role and it would give Ebbett a chance to play and develop with good players.

Also I think Miller has more of an offensive game then Carter. He also has the defensive experience and could do well with the Fins. All in all here's my take on a balanced 3 line approach.

Christenson-Getzlaf-Perry
Miller-Koivu-Selanne
Lupul-Ebbett-Ryan

First off I want Miller no where near the top 6, let alone the entire team. Second, you post suggests that our 4th line would be Brown-Marchant-Parros/Carter. Parros will play the majority of the games, and I don't think it would be smart to use Marchant between Parros and Brown. Plus can you imagine how bad defensively a line of Ebbet, Ryan, and Lupul would be? I would pray that line doesn't face any team's number one line. In your post you said that Marchant would be better used in a checking role? So it's better to put him on the 4th line between Brown and Parros playing 5 minutes of even strength time? Marchant was what 3rd or 4th in ice time for forwards last playoffs? He will never be a 4th line player. We wanted him to be a 4th line player last year, and he never was one. Him getting a two year extension and being one of the top forwards in ice time in the playoffs means he won't be one next year.

The reason i don't want to see Christensen or Ebbett being on the bottom-6 is not a lack of size or defensive ability, it's the lack of quality of our other bottom-6 guys. Marchant is a good defensive center/winger, Brown is a great 4th liner and Parros one of the best enforcers around but other than that there really isn't much quality. Miller, Carter, Noke are serviceable at best. If we had a better bottom-6, a guy like EC or Ebbett would be fine in there.

And it's not like those are some kids still developing. Carter, EC and Ebbett are 26, Miller 25. Only Noke could still be considered a prospect.

Forgive me but I don't understand what you're saying. You don't want EC or Ebbett on the bottom pairing lines. However, it's not because of their defense or inability to hit, but because of the other players? What do you want the bottom two lines to look like then?

I think people are really overrating the importance of the 4th line center position. Who ever plays that position needs to do one of the following: agitator, hit, or provide a bonus in other parts of the game (shootout, powerplay). Nokke doesn't hit, he doesn't fight, and he is decent at the PK at best. He's better defensively then EC and Ebbett but that's it.

Where Ebbett or EC fit in really depends on if RC will use a shutdown line or not. If he goes with three scoring lines, it may be better to use both in the lineup. If he uses a shutdown line, which he probably will, then only one of them is needed.

With checking line (since it's most likley going to happen.)
Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-Nokke (although it'd be better to replace Nokke with someone bigger)
Parros-EC-Brown (EC can contribute in shootouts and 2nd powerplay unit.)
Ebbett

With a checking line (we might see this for a few games until RC goes back to his bread and butter.)

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
EC/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Marchant-Lupul
Parros-EC/Ebbett/Nokke-Brown

Uh, what?


Calling Sean Skahan.


It's kind of interesting that these blogs and the newspaper article doesn't correlate 1-for-1. The newspaper had a big piece with most, but not all (I don't believe the paper talked much about Whitney, Wisniewski, or Boynton), of the blog things that have been coming out the past few days. I wonder if this is some way for the newspaper to try to differentiate the paper from the website, and to try to encourage people to get the paper?
I was wondering if Wood or the editor just decided it'd be a waste to post a huge article, and that he could generate more hits by breaking it up over a few days.

Change your name to iHATEnoke17 and start a little club.

Ey ******,you think you are tough?

First off I want Miller no where near the top 6, let alone the entire team. Second, you post suggests that our 4th line would be Brown-Marchant-Parros/Carter. Parros will play the majority of the games, and I don't think it would be smart to use Marchant between Parros and Brown. Plus can you imagine how bad defensively a line of Ebbet, Ryan, and Lupul would be? I would pray that line doesn't face any team's number one line. In your post you said that Marchant would be better used in a checking role? So it's better to put him on the 4th line between Brown and Parros playing 5 minutes of even strength time? Marchant was what 3rd or 4th in ice time for forwards last playoffs? He will never be a 4th line player. We wanted him to be a 4th line player last year, and he never was one. Him getting a two year extension and being one of the top forwards in ice time in the playoffs means he won't be one next year.

Why would you not want Miller but want Carter? Miller has outplayed Carter. I'm not saying use Marchant between Parros and brown, I'm saying use him between Nokelainin and Carter. Also I am not saying give the fourth/checking line 5 minutes of time, but if Carlyle uses 3 scoring lines it's hard to see the fourth line or checking line logging 20 minutes.

I don't think Lupul-Ebbett-Ryan would be bad defensively at all. Ebbett is better defensively then people might think and they often assume he's horrible defensively simply for his size. Ryan is good defensively and can use his body to win a lot of battles. Lupul is not as good as Ryan and Ebbett defensively, but he's not horrible defensively. I find it hard to believe that you can think that a line with those players will have a hard time keeping possession or back checking.

Ey ******,you think you are tough?

http://z.hubpages.com/u/272145_f496.jpg

Ey ******,you think you are tough?
Not really the response I was expecting.

Okay, yes, for the sake of argument, let's say I do think I am tough. Now what?

Ey ******,you think you are tough?

Looking through your post history you seem to be little more than a know it all troll

Not really the response I was expecting.

Okay, yes, for the sake of argument, let's say I do think I am tough. Now what?

I don't think it's worth it to be honest

For some reason I read his responses in a French accent. It seems oddly fitting.

Why would you not want Miller but want Carter? Miller has outplayed Carter. I'm not saying use Marchant between Parros and brown, I'm saying use him between Nokelainin and Carter. Also I am not saying give the fourth/checking line 5 minutes of time, but if Carlyle uses 3 scoring lines it's hard to see the fourth line or checking line logging 20 minutes.

I don't think Lupul-Ebbett-Ryan would be bad defensively at all. Ebbett is better defensively then people might think and they often assume he's horrible defensively simply for his size. Ryan is good defensively and can use his body to win a lot of battles. Lupul is not as good as Ryan and Ebbett defensively, but he's not horrible defensively. I find it hard to believe that you can think that a line with those players will have a hard time keeping possession or back checking.

So sit Parros and Brown? God I hope Dirk doesn't read your post. I do understand where you're coming from now though. However, I don't think we just gave Parros and Brown extensions just to sit them in the pressbox most nights. Parros played 74 games last season, and now he's making more money.

I just disagree about Miller. He hasn't outplayed Carter from what i've seen. He did a decent job on the checking line, but he seems like he always blows easy clearing oppurtunities. However, Miller plays more then Carter, so RC seems to agree with you so far. However, Miller needs to stay away from the Selanne and Getzlaf lines. Every time he's put on one of the top two lines, that line fails to do anything. Carter can at least hit, and he's got a pretty good shot.

As far as a Ryan-Ebbett-Lupul line... I guess it could work, but I think that line would be a liability honestly. Lupul and Ebbett are knocked off the puck way to easily, but I guess I wouldn't hate seeing it. Ebbett does get too much crap about his defensive game on here, but he's still decent at best. The main knock I had against your lines was Marchan't placement because I don't think the Ducks will ever sit both of Brown and Parros. I think if RC is going to spread the offense around he should put Marchant between Lupul and Ryan. Marchant is the grinder, Ryan is the playmaker, and Lupul is the sniper. Plus Marchant is very good defensively. We can discuss spreading the offense around all we want, but IMO it won't happen. Marchant was brought back to solidify the checking line, and RC always finds a way to make his shutdown line. The big question is who goes on the line. From what we have, I'd say Marchant, Carter, and Nokke. Unfortunately Miller could replace someone there. We need to add someone with more size and grit if we use a shutdown line IMO. Our cup year, our shutdown line didn't just shut top scorers down, they wore you down with hits. Maybe Bodie will get a shot. Just watch, RC may try to spread the scoring out for a while, but eventually we'll get back to the original formula he always uses.
Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter/Miller-Marchant-Nokke/FA/Bodie
Parros-EC/Ebbett-Brown

Book it...

Ey ******,you think you are tough?

haha wow...:shakehead:help:

Seriously, talking crap on a message board...? Really?

I'll kick your ass. I'm 6'0, 275 pounds. I'm a figther on occasion. Here's my address, come by any time. No matter what you type, you will not be feared. GET THAT THROUGH YOUR HEAD. That's the reason I came to HF years ago, to get away from stupid message boards that had that ****.

It amazes me that people really do this.

For some reason I read his responses in a French accent. It seems oddly fitting.
I heard Tony Danza.

Hahahahaha tough guys...

**** off!

LOL.

Nice.

Hahahahaha tough guys...

**** off!



Brilliant

Hahahahaha tough guys...

**** off!

Careful guys... he's a bad ass.

I heard Tony Danza.

Funny, I heard Curly from the 3 stooges, why I oughta!

http://www.lighterside.com/images/en_US/local/products/detail/p57286.jpg

Careful guys... he's a bad ass.

http://www.demotivateus.com/posters/ethug-thug-whooped-rep-demotivational-poster.jpg

So sit Parros and Brown?


agree that just silly talk


I just disagree about Miller.


again I agree. People who see something positive in Miller remind of me people who loved Joe Sacco or Brian Bellows.


As far as a Ryan-Ebbett-Lupul line... I guess it could work, but I think that line would be a liability honestly.


fail. Ebbet is terrible defensively, and its just because he's undersized. Obviously both Marchant and Ebbett will have problems with 6'4" 240 power forwards, but Marchant is like white on rice when it comes to silky move forwards in the league.

Have you considered putting Brown on the checking line? He's not huge but he plays a physical game. He may be the next Travis Moen.

But it is an interesting conundrum:

3 scoring lines/checking line?

3 scoring lines/energy line?

2 scoring lines/checking line/energy line?

I imagine Randy will get pressure from Murray to try one of the first two, but will eventually go back to the bread and butter.

Either that or Randy will be out of hair by Christmas.

agree that just silly talk



again I agree. People who see something positive in Miller remind of me people who loved Joe Sacco or Brian Bellows.



fail. Ebbet is terrible defensively, and its just because he's undersized. Obviously both Marchant and Ebbett will have problems with 6'4" 240 power forwards, but Marchant is like white on rice when it comes to silky move forwards in the league.

Have you considered putting Brown on the checking line? He's not huge but he plays a physical game. He may be the next Travis Moen.

But it is an interesting conundrum:

3 scoring lines/checking line?

3 scoring lines/energy line?

2 scoring lines/checking line/energy line?

I imagine Randy will get pressure from Murray to try one of the first two, but will eventually go back to the bread and butter.

Either that or Randy will be out of hair by Christmas.

Parros is a good marketing tool and good for fighting, I'm not saying he's going to see nothing because injuries are going to happen and he will play when RC thinks he is the best option, but for his skill as a hockey player, he could be replaced by more worthy players.

The thing that you guys don't seem to understand it that it is a SCORING line. Our THIRD one at that. Why would Randy put them out there against other teams top lines? I do agree that I don't think 3 scoring lines is ideal, but if it happens using Marchant as a center between Lupul and Ryan would waste there opportunities. If your going to put Marchant on that line you might as well turn them into a checking line. That is where the 3 scoring line idea seems to break. One of the scoring lines or the checking line is going to see minimal minutes and that would be a waste.

For Miller, I do not know why he is hated around here. Is it because he doesn't make the best of his chances? That is a lot better then generating nothing(Carter).

I simply don't see why Brown get's so much credit around here. He is very fast and likes to hit. He is average defensively at best and tends to get out of position to make those hits. We will see what RC does, but I just don't agree with that.


Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter/Miller-Marchant-Nokke/FA/Bodie
Parros-EC/Ebbett-Brown

Book it...

Actually were not to far off. The only things I would do is switch Lupul and Ryan(who knows really), and actually Carter-Marchant-Noke is the checking line I am in favor for. Just the thing we really disagree on in that line where Ebbett,EC,Miller,Brown, and Parros have to squeeze into. I put that line as my third line and the checking line as my fourth and every one seemed to freak out. Maybe I can make it more clear.

Need more offense:
Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry Scoring line 1 Carter-Marchant-Noeklainin Checking Line
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne Scoring line 2
Christenson-Ebbett-Miller Scoring line 3

Need more Defense:
Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry Scoring line 1 Carter-Marchant-Noeklainin Checking Line 1
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne scoring line 2 Parros-Miller-Brown Checking Line 2

I don't expect anyone of Parros,,Brown,Ebbett,Christenson to play all 82 games. All will be given a look and we will see how it plays out.

Is it because he doesn't make the best of his chances? That is a lot better then generating nothing(Carter).
Given a similar opportunity and icetime Carter produced much better than Miller.

Given a similar opportunity and icetime Carter produced much better than Miller.


Not true at all. If anything Carter was played in much more games then Miller.

Not true at all. If anything Carter was played in much more games then Miller.

the concepts of opportunity and icetime shouldn't be that difficult to understand.

In the playoffs Carter was given a limited opportunity to play on offensive lines and produced much better than Miller. Nevermind he's much more physical, aggressive and equal defensively.

Tell me, what does Miler do that warrants him a spot in the lineup? What quality in his game is NHL-caliber?

the concepts of opportunity and icetime shouldn't be that difficult to understand.

In the playoffs Carter was given a limited opportunity to play on offensive lines and produced much better than Miller. Nevermind he's much more physical, aggressive and equal defensively.

Tell me, what does Miler do that warrants him a spot in the lineup? What quality in his game is NHL-caliber?
Defensive positioning and anticipation. Getting his stick in the passing lanes. Makes him a decent PKer. But that's pretty much it. The problem is he'll be in the right position, but lose the puck anyways because he's so weak.

Miller's brain is far superior to his physical attributes, just not good enough to make him any more than a depth player.

The more I think about it, the more I am in favor of trying out three offensive lines. I like these lines:

Carter Getzlaf Perry (Carter can do the grunt work for the twins)
Ebbett Koivu Selanne (Speed kills and this line has it)
Ryan Nokelainen Lupul (Nokelainen can play defense. Ryan and Lupul can score)
Miller Marchant Brown (A true checking line that has speed and skill)

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry ( lupul is the sniper here, getzlaf dishes and drives the net and perry does everything )

Ryan - Koivu - Selanne ( chemistry between koivu and selanne should fire them up and ryan is the missing piece, creating space and finishing plays )

Carter - Ebbett - Christensen ( this line can score aswell, carter does the dirty work, ebbett and christensen try to make something happen in the offensive zone )

Brown - Marchant - Nokelainen ( you cant score against this line )

Parros ( throw him to the lineup if in need some fighting skillzz )

3rd and 4th lines get about equal minutes.

Parros is a good marketing tool and good for fighting, I'm not saying he's going to see nothing because injuries are going to happen and he will play when RC thinks he is the best option, but for his skill as a hockey player, he could be replaced by more worthy players.

The thing that you guys don't seem to understand it that it is a SCORING line. Our THIRD one at that. Why would Randy put them out there against other teams top lines? I do agree that I don't think 3 scoring lines is ideal, but if it happens using Marchant as a center between Lupul and Ryan would waste there opportunities. If your going to put Marchant on that line you might as well turn them into a checking line. That is where the 3 scoring line idea seems to break. One of the scoring lines or the checking line is going to see minimal minutes and that would be a waste.

For Miller, I do not know why he is hated around here. Is it because he doesn't make the best of his chances? That is a lot better then generating nothing(Carter).

I simply don't see why Brown get's so much credit around here. He is very fast and likes to hit. He is average defensively at best and tends to get out of position to make those hits. We will see what RC does, but I just don't agree with that.



Actually were not to far off. The only things I would do is switch Lupul and Ryan(who knows really), and actually Carter-Marchant-Noke is the checking line I am in favor for. Just the thing we really disagree on in that line where Ebbett,EC,Miller,Brown, and Parros have to squeeze into. I put that line as my third line and the checking line as my fourth and every one seemed to freak out. Maybe I can make it more clear.

Need more offense:
Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry Scoring line 1 Carter-Marchant-Noeklainin Checking Line
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne Scoring line 2
Christenson-Ebbett-Miller Scoring line 3

Need more Defense:
Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry Scoring line 1 Carter-Marchant-Noeklainin Checking Line 1
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne scoring line 2 Parros-Miller-Brown Checking Line 2

I don't expect anyone of Parros,,Brown,Ebbett,Christenson to play all 82 games. All will be given a look and we will see how it plays out.


This is the 1st time ive been tempted to actually use an ignore list feature, :shakehead
To summarize: EC + Ebbett = Getzlaf + Perry, Drew Miller is a shutdown high end Defensive specialist and a scorer, Parros and Brown are useless players and are only good for fighting and marketing and we need to go back to the days of spineless cowardly hockey Does that about cover it?
Really Detroit Red Wings had 7 fights last year along with hardly any big hits and emotionless hockey. Its perfect for people like you i dont think anyone here will really mind if you switched allegiances to a team that better suits your needs for friendly hockey. In case you missed it Randy Carlyle loves tough hockey and as Burkes assistant Murray also see's the need so he re-signs the players you want to see sit. They will play

Can you people please stop posting lineups with EC or Ebbet on the 4th line? They are not physical/energy players who play 8-10mins a night.

The more I think about it, the more I am in favor of trying out three offensive lines. I like these lines:

Carter Getzlaf Perry (Carter can do the grunt work for the twins)
Ebbett Koivu Selanne (Speed kills and this line has it)
Ryan Nokelainen Lupul (Nokelainen can play defense. Ryan and Lupul can score)
Miller Marchant Brown (A true checking line that has speed and skill)

Maybe I underate Koivu defensively, but I can't see that 2nd line dealing with anyone who has size. Thats the reason I see Nokia going there and Marchant going to the 3rd line.

That makes for a funny looking 4th line though.

Can you people please stop posting lineups with EC or Ebbet on the 4th line? They are not physical/energy players who play 8-10mins a night.


Why they are gonna score goals like crazy!! The skill players do not need any type of deterrent like Parros and i doubt they will ever get cheap shotted . Worst case if Boogard wants to hit Koivu through the glass Carter will get him :sarcasm:

Miller's brain is far superior to his physical attributes, just not good enough to make him any more than a depth player.
Players like that can have long, useful careers (bylsma, eg) but he'll need to get way stronger. The only time it's really acceptable to be weak is if you're putting up points.

Maybe I underate Koivu defensively, but I can't see that 2nd line dealing with anyone who has size.

You can have a small line as long as you protect them with the Getzlaf line. It worked when McDonald and Kunitz were paired with Selanne and I think it should work again in the new NHL. I really think we need to have four lines going if we want any success in the playoffs. It is important for us to get a third offensive line going and I think Ryan and Lupul can add a new dimension in our attack. Either we need one of our current centers to step up or Bob Murray needs to make a trade to shore up our depth problem up the middle.

You can have a small line as long as you protect them with the Getzlaf line. It worked when McDonald and Kunitz were paired with Selanne and I think it should work again in the new NHL. I really think we need to have four lines going if we want any success in the playoffs. It is important for us to get a third offensive line going and I think Ryan and Lupul can add a new dimension in our attack. Either we need one of our current centers to step up or Bob Murray needs to make a trade to shore up our depth problem up the middle.
McDonald, Kunitz, and to a lesser extent Selanne were capable of fighting for and winning their own ice. Ebbett isn't. And he's not quick enough to get there first.

This is the 1st time ive been tempted to actually use an ignore list feature, :shakehead
To summarize: EC + Ebbett = Getzlaf + Perry, Drew Miller is a shutdown high end Defensive specialist and a scorer, Parros and Brown are useless players and are only good for fighting and marketing and we need to go back to the days of spineless cowardly hockey Does that about cover it?
Really Detroit Red Wings had 7 fights last year along with hardly any big hits and emotionless hockey. Its perfect for people like you i dont think anyone here will really mind if you switched allegiances to a team that better suits your needs for friendly hockey. In case you missed it Randy Carlyle loves tough hockey and as Burkes assistant Murray also see's the need so he re-signs the players you want to see sit. They will play


Well if you like to argue by taking what I say, multiplying it by 50 and then acting like that is what I actually said, I would say just stop arguing because making things up and saying a person said them is getting quite irritating.

When did I say Getzlaf+Perry=Ebbett+Christenson? When? Are those the voices in your head? I never said Drew Miller was a defensive specialist? Wait let's read my posts( what a fine thing that is when you read and understand an argument before making replies) and what? I said the checking line should be made up of Noke,Marchant,Carter?

Your right. Having Parros and Brown out of the line-up makes the entire team cowards. Good god how would Getzlaf or Ryan be able to defend themselves! Better get those people who can fight in the line-up but let's hope every time we need them in a non-fighting situation they can succesfuly run around the ice for 30 seconds without taking a penalty or getting scored on.

Your argument is getting to be more and more of a joke as this goes on. I never said I wanted to make the team emotionless and I never said I didn't want the team to stand up for themselves. Surely though, without Parros and Brown, the Ducks stand no chance against the elite in the western conference. Players like McDonald will just plow through us like it is no tomorrow.

Here's some advice, try reading what people say, don't blow it out of proportion and don't make things up when your trying to have a debate. It just makes you look foolish.

Murray resigns the players I want to see play also. But for the love of god if a GM signs someone you KNOW that it means they are in the starting line-up. You know I think Salcido could really challenge Niedermayer for the #1 D spot this year :sarcasm:. And also with McCarthy he might be on the edge of losing his spot on the team :sarcasm:

EDIT:
the concepts of opportunity and icetime shouldn't be that difficult to understand.

In the playoffs Carter was given a limited opportunity to play on offensive lines and produced much better than Miller. Nevermind he's much more physical, aggressive and equal defensively.

Tell me, what does Miler do that warrants him a spot in the lineup? What quality in his game is NHL-caliber?

Carter is better then Miller defensively, I agree there, so use him on the checking line? I think it would be much more effective to have him on the checking line then using him in an offensive spot.

Well if you like to argue by taking what I say, multiplying it by 50 and then acting like that is what I actually said, I would say just stop arguing because making things up and saying a person said them is getting quite irritating.

When did I say Getzlaf+Perry=Ebbett+Christenson? When? Are those the voices in your head? I never said Drew Miller was a defensive specialist? Wait let's read my posts( what a fine thing that is when you read and understand an argument before making replies) and what? I said the checking line should be made up of Noke,Marchant,Carter?

Your right. Having Parros and Brown out of the line-up makes the entire team cowards. Good god how would Getzlaf or Ryan be able to defend themselves! Better get those people who can fight in the line-up but let's hope every time we need them in a non-fighting situation they can succesfuly run around the ice for 30 seconds without taking a penalty or getting scored on.

Your argument is getting to be more and more of a joke as this goes on. I never said I wanted to make the team emotionless and I never said I didn't want the team to stand up for themselves. Surely though, without Parros and Brown, the Ducks stand no chance against the elite in the western conference. Players like McDonald will just plow through us like it is no tomorrow.

Here's some advice, try reading what people say, don't blow it out of proportion and don't make things up when your trying to have a debate. It just makes you look foolish.

Murray resigns the players I want to see play also. But for the love of god if a GM signs someone you KNOW that it means they are in the starting line-up. You know I think Salcido could really challenge Niedermayer for the #1 D spot this year :sarcasm:. And also with McCarthy he might be on the edge of losing his spot on the team :sarcasm:

EDIT:


Carter is better then Miller defensively, I agree there, so use him on the checking line? I think it would be much more effective to have him on the checking line then using him in an offensive spot.

I suppose you were one of the people who thought Getzlaf/Lupul/Perry/Penner were border line awful when they were having rough times in 03-04 and 05-06 seasons. Nice to see how those non NHL talents turned out.....

I honestly don't think we have the talent for a top of the line checking line. Brown is way overrated around here, it seems his hits(namely the hudler one) make the impression of an amazing defensive player. He is solid defensively, but I think it is safe to say he has more in common with Parros then Pahlson

Another gem, so probably one of the fastest skaters on this team who also played on the #2 PK unit has more in common with a tall, slow enforcer. More wisdom from this supposed Duck fan.
Its becoming more and more obvious your are a DRW troll

Players like that can have long, useful careers (bylsma, eg) but he'll need to get way stronger. The only time it's really acceptable to be weak is if you're putting up points.

I think it's strange that the team hasn't put him on some big weight trainng program to help him bulk up, because size has been his main issue all through his pro career. It worked for Ryan, though obviously his frame is a lot larger. If miller got stronger and possibly grew balls he could turn into 2003 rob niedermayer, but thats probably too much to ask.

I think it's strange that the team hasn't put him on some big weight trainng program to help him bulk up, because size has been his main issue all through his pro career. It worked for Ryan, though obviously his frame is a lot larger. If miller got stronger and possibly grew balls he could turn into 2003 rob niedermayer, but thats probably too much to ask.


He just doesnt have the genetics nor sad to say the talent of a Rob Neidermayer. He is what he will always will be, a skinny, non physical, non NHL talent, somewhat defensive player who should be on an AHL team

Your right. Having Parros and Brown out of the line-up makes the entire team cowards. Good god how would Getzlaf or Ryan be able to defend themselves! Better get those people who can fight in the line-up but let's hope every time we need them in a non-fighting situation they can succesfuly run around the ice for 30 seconds without taking a penalty or getting scored on.
So more and more you are showing that you do not watch the game nor even bother to look at the box scores do you?

Your argument is getting to be more and more of a joke as this goes on. I never said I wanted to make the team emotionless and I never said I didn't want the team to stand up for themselves. Surely though, without Parros and Brown, the Ducks stand no chance against the elite in the western conference. Players like McDonald will just plow through us like it is no tomorrow.
So you want Getzlaf fighting Boogard,Stortini,Westgarth,Shelley,Mcgratton etc? Mcdonald? What point are you trying to make? My argument is becoming a joke? Who is the idiot taking out our toughness and any potential for fighting for Ebbett, EC and Miller? And at the same time has the nerve to say " I never said I wanted to make the team emotionless and I never said I didn't want the team to stand up for themselves"
So who do you think stands up against the players i mentioned?




Here's some advice, try reading what people say, don't blow it out of proportion and don't make things up when your trying to have a debate. It just makes you look foolish.

Murray resigns the players I want to see play also. But for the love of god if a GM signs someone you KNOW that it means they are in the starting line-up. You know I think Salcido could really challenge Niedermayer for the #1 D spot this year :sarcasm:. And also with McCarthy he might be on the edge of losing his spot on the team :sarcasm:

No thanks id prefer not to take advice from a closet Red Wing fan trolling a Duck message board and post the most ridiculous crap ive ever read

He just doesnt have the genetics nor sad to say the talent of a Rob Neidermayer. He is what he will always will be, a skinny, non physical, non NHL talent, somewhat defensive player who should be on an AHL team

He has what Rob never had, however, which is a brain. If he bulked up he could play the same role that Niedermayer played just as effectively. Will he? No. He could though.

He has what Rob never had, however, which is a brain. If he bulked up he could play the same role that Niedermayer played just as effectively. Will he? No. He could though.


He also has no sack whatsoever and due to his fear of getting hit gets out muscled, horrible clears when playing are coming in for a hit, throws no hits of his own and like Rob still takes bad penalties. His positioning is the only thing he has going for him which makes him AHL not IHL

He also has no sack whatsoever and due to his fear of getting hit gets out muscled, horrible clears when playing are coming in for a hit, throws no hits of his own and like Rob still takes bad penalties. His positioning is the only thing he has going for him which makes him AHL not IHL

Niedermayer lost his stones after his concussion in 2004; after that he was pretty finesse for a checking line forward. I think with more muscle Miller would be a little more courageous, its just taking that step thats the hard part.

I simply don't see why Brown get's so much credit around here. He is very fast and likes to hit. He is average defensively at best and tends to get out of position to make those hits. We will see what RC does, but I just don't agree with that.

:shakehead Then why is Brown on the PK? :amazed: Arguably our 2nd best PK guy next to Marchant. So that tells me he is one of the best defensive guys on the team, not 'average'.

He 'hits' when it is 5 on 5 and he is on the 'energy line'. That is his job, that is the whole concept of an energy line. Hit. So you are watching him in 4th line mode, but he can play D in the PK too. I don't see him out of position or doing hits then.

SoB

Re work them to my likeing and others opinions.

Nokelainen - Koivu - Selanne
Could a be A great duo while still beingr defensive or One awesome third line shutdown with a huge scoring threat.
Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
A first or second line.
Lupul - Marchant - Christensen
As mentioned before Lupul and Marchant have history and Christensen will see more minutes to ultimately prove himself to us.
Parros - Carter - Brown
Energy. Carter and Parros work great together. Brown can make his hits and them wimped out and have Parros fight the guy.

Niedermayer - Sbisa
Whitney - Wiznewski
Boyton - Brookbank/Salcido

Giguere
Hiller

so what do you think?

Nokelainen - Koivu - Selanne
Could a be A great duo while still beingr defensive or One awesome third line shutdown with a huge scoring threat.


Interesting.

They might try that out, but im not sure if Nokelainen is ready for such a big role.

Interesting.

They might try that out, but im not sure if Nokelainen is ready for such a big role.

I don't think he is either, but, he will be playing with two world class players, so who knows, it may work.

I don't think he is either, but, he will be playing with two world class players, so who knows, it may work.yayy for Finns. I really wish they try this lineup.

yayy for Finns. I really wish they try this lineup.

I have a feeling that we'll see a lot of different line ups at the beginning of the season.

love seeing these potential combos. i am almost as excited as Koivu for this season to start.

I don't know how many line combos have been proposed in this thread, but not too many of them made me cringe, some soft lines kind of do, but I was mostly looking at the scoring threats.

If they can gel together, we just might have some really deadly scoring this year. (hopefully).

:shakehead Then why is Brown on the PK? :amazed: Arguably our 2nd best PK guy next to Marchant. So that tells me he is one of the best defensive guys on the team, not 'average'.

He 'hits' when it is 5 on 5 and he is on the 'energy line'. That is his job, that is the whole concept of an energy line. Hit. So you are watching him in 4th line mode, but he can play D in the PK too. I don't see him out of position or doing hits then.

SoB
Perhaps that is why our PK was so bad. I'm not saying it's all Brown's fault but, you can say he's good defensively because he's on the PK, but our PK has to be good to complete that statement doesn't it?. Remember 06-07? Our special teams was rockin that year and was a big reason we won the cup, top 5 in both if i remember correctly.

Another gem, so probably one of the fastest skaters on this team who also played on the #2 PK unit has more in common with a tall, slow enforcer. More wisdom from this supposed Duck fan.
Its becoming more and more obvious your are a DRW troll

Right, Right. Our Pk was at what 79% and in the bottom third of teams in the regular season? And improved to a whopping 80% in the playoffs? He's a brick wall defensively. Carlyle obviously thought Brownn was the best defensive option behind Marchant at the time, but I think that will change.

You can think whatever you like in terms of my who I root for. But I can tell that it has,is, and always will be the Ducks. Just because I look at the team in an objective way and look for weaknesses and try to improve upon them doesn't make me a wings fan. Also, believe it or not just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean there not a fan of the same team.

Also so far you have called me a 10 year old kid, a retarded mongloid, not a fan of the team, and now a DRW troll. Seems to me that you are more interested in throwing out insults then actually using your melon to put up an argument.

So more and more you are showing that you do not watch the game nor even bother to look at the box scores do you?


So you want Getzlaf fighting Boogard,Stortini,Westgarth,Shelley,Mcgratton etc? Mcdonald? What point are you trying to make? My argument is becoming a joke? Who is the idiot taking out our toughness and any potential for fighting for Ebbett, EC and Miller? And at the same time has the nerve to say " I never said I wanted to make the team emotionless and I never said I didn't want the team to stand up for themselves"
So who do you think stands up against the players i mentioned?






No thanks id prefer not to take advice from a closet Red Wing fan trolling a Duck message board and post the most ridiculous crap ive ever read

Obviously, those are the type of games it would be more logical to have Brown and Parros in the line-up. Sweet Jesus you act like im sending Brown and Parros to the minors. Believe it or not, not every team plays the same fore-checking in your face style as the Ducks, and those games are when it would be better to use Ebbett and Christenson. One of the big things I can remember from 06-07 is that the team was able to play any style, they could shut you down, they could out score you etc.

I think it's strange that the team hasn't put him on some big weight trainng program to help him bulk up, because size has been his main issue all through his pro career. It worked for Ryan, though obviously his frame is a lot larger. If miller got stronger and possibly grew balls he could turn into 2003 rob niedermayer, but thats probably too much to ask.

It took Ryan what 3 or 4 years to find the right weight program? Perhaps Miller will follow suit.

I have a feeling that we'll see a lot of different line ups at the beginning of the season.
Considering it's Carlyle, you only think it'll be the beginning of the season?

Considering it's Carlyle, you only think it'll be the beginning of the season?

True, hopefully he finds good lines and keeps them.

For Miller, I do not know why he is hated around here. Is it because he doesn't make the best of his chances? That is a lot better then generating nothing(Carter).

I simply don't see why Brown get's so much credit around here. He is very fast and likes to hit. He is average defensively at best and tends to get out of position to make those hits. We will see what RC does, but I just don't agree with that.


Actually were not to far off. The only things I would do is switch Lupul and Ryan(who knows really), and actually Carter-Marchant-Noke is the checking line I am in favor for. Just the thing we really disagree on in that line where Ebbett,EC,Miller,Brown, and Parros have to squeeze into. I put that line as my third line and the checking line as my fourth and every one seemed to freak out. Maybe I can make it more clear.

Need more offense:
Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry Scoring line 1 Carter-Marchant-Noeklainin Checking Line
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne Scoring line 2
Christenson-Ebbett-Miller Scoring line 3

Need more Defense:
Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry Scoring line 1 Carter-Marchant-Noeklainin Checking Line 1
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne scoring line 2 Parros-Miller-Brown Checking Line 2

I don't expect anyone of Parros,,Brown,Ebbett,Christenson to play all 82 games. All will be given a look and we will see how it plays out.

I just don't think you will see a Ducks lineup with out one of Brown or Parros. Parros makes more than he did last year, and he played 74 games last season.

Miller absolutely ruined the top line when he was paired with Getzlaf and Perry. That line struggled. How do you expect an EC-Ebbett-Miller line to be good offensively? I can't stand Miller. He's smart defensively, but he's so weak and makes a lot of mental errors when it comes to clearing the zone. Plus he brings NOTHING offensively.

I think the only way this team rolls three scoring lines is if we do what Jerky suggested, make Brown part of the checking line.
Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
EC/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Nokke-Lupul
Brown-Marchant-Bodie/Miller

That's 3 lines that could definitely score and a shutdown line. This takes away the energy line, but it might be worth it to roll three lines that could consistently put points up. I still don't think it happens though, because I just don't see Parros sitting more nights then playing. However, it would be interesting to see this lineup.

Can you people please stop posting lineups with EC or Ebbet on the 4th line? They are not physical/energy players who play 8-10mins a night.

Other than Carter who is at center? It sure as hell isn't Nokke. I think people really misjudge the 4th line center position. Like I said in an earlier post, that position needs to either: be an agitator, physical player, or helpful in other areas of the game. Christensen can help the 2nd powerplay unit and in shootouts.

If RC uses what he always does, 2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, and 1 energy line, then EC doesn't have a spot except 4th line center. Plus the 4th line's best stretch last year was when EC was paired with Parros.

Other than Carter and Getzlaf, no one fits the traditional player for the 4th line spot. Carter can be used in better areas IMO, and no explanation needed for Getzlaf.

When we first resigned EC, I was puzzled cause I really didn't see a spot for him. Now it's apparent that the team is looking for more scoring. Putting him as the 4th line center between Parros and Brown makes a lot more sense then people realize.

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Nokelainen - Koivu - Selanne
Miller - Marchant - Lupul
Brown - Carter - Parros

Extra: Ebbett, Christensen

Boyton - Niedermayer
Sbisa - Whitney
Wiznewski - McCarty

Extra: Brookbank, Salcido

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Nokelainen - Koivu - Selanne
Miller - Marchant - Lupul
Brown - Carter - Parros

Extra: Ebbett, Christensen

Boyton - Niedermayer
Sbisa - Whitney
Wiznewski - McCarty

Extra: Brookbank, Salcido


Why to both of those? That line takes Lupul's offensive ability completely away. Plus that line would be way to soft.

As for McCarty... Why put him over Salcido and Festerling?

Ryan - Getzlaf - Perry
Nokelainen - Koivu - Selanne
Miller - Marchant - Lupul
Brown - Carter - Parros



Switch Lupul & Ryan and then you have "the country lines" Canadian, Finnish, American & American;)

The more I think about it the more I like a Ryan-Marchant-Lupul line. It's sort of a Kariya-Rucchin-Selanne lite line.

I gives us basically a top line and two second lines, plus it places our best defensive presence between the two wingers who need it most. I congratulate myself.

The more I think about it the more I like a Ryan-Marchant-Lupul line. It's sort of a Kariya-Rucchin-Selanne lite line.

I gives us basically a top line and two second lines, plus it places our best defensive presence between the two wingers who need it most. I congratulate myself.

It really does make a lot of sense. However, given how Carlyle's lineup choices have frequently baffled me for the past 4 seasons, I'm sure he'll come up with something else altogether.

The more I think about it the more I like a Ryan-Marchant-Lupul line. It's sort of a Kariya-Rucchin-Selanne lite line.

I gives us basically a top line and two second lines, plus it places our best defensive presence between the two wingers who need it most. I congratulate myself.

I like it to, but we'll have to see how well they work with each other.

Who do you like on the Koivu/Selanne and Getzalf/Perry lines then?

What kind of 4th line do you envision?

The only negative would be the amount of Marchant cursing going on because of his anti-finishing skills. He shouldnt be permitted into the offensive zone.

I like it to, but we'll have to see how well they work with each other.

Who do you like on the Koivu/Selanne and Getzalf/Perry lines then?

What kind of 4th line do you envision?

I'd still like someone with some bulk or some balls to play with Selanne and Koivu.

Warmbody-Getzlaf-Perry
Carter-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Marchant-Lupul
Brown-Nokelainen-Parros/Miller/Bodie

The only negative would be the amount of Marchant cursing going on because of his anti-finishing skills. He shouldnt be permitted into the offensive zone.

Well we'll always need some kind of hate lightning rod, Todd can take one for the team. Personally I'm going to try and give Lupul a little amnesty to start the season before I pick up where I left off when he was traded. I'm also pretty iffy on Nokelainen, and I'm having a childish anti-reaction to all the "Koivu is class personified" sentiment. There are good candidates out there.

I'd still like someone with some bulk or some balls to play with Selanne and Koivu.

Warmbody-Getzlaf-Perry
Carter-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Marchant-Lupul
Brown-Nokelainen-Parros/Miller/Bodie



I'm wondering if Parros can work on his puck control skills down low in the offensive zone, he might be a decent compliment to Perry/Getzalf. That would be a lot of beef to have to deal with.

I like Carter and Nokia on the 2nd line. Nokia has more beef, but Carter has a better shot.

Its tough to consider what to do with Ebbet/Christensen on this team. Neither seem good fits with Perry/Getzlaf... to small for the 2nd line and not physical enough for the 4th line.

The more I think about it the more I like a Ryan-Marchant-Lupul line. It's sort of a Kariya-Rucchin-Selanne lite line.

I gives us basically a top line and two second lines, plus it places our best defensive presence between the two wingers who need it most. I congratulate myself.

Sorry buddy, I was the first to use that line in one of my combos, so congratulate me.;)

The line makes sense, but I think it only happens if we don't use a checking line. If RC uses his patten checking line, then I seriously doubt Marchant isn't on it.

Carlyle has three options:
3 scoring lines, 1 checking line
3 scoring lines, 1 energy line (4th line)
2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, 1 energy line

2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, 1 energy line (most likely to happen IMO)
Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-Nokke/Miller/Bodie
Brown-EC-Parros

3 scoring lines, 1 checking line:
Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
EC/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Nokke-Lupul
Brown-Marchant-Bodie/Miller

3 scoring lines, 1 energy line
Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
Nokke-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Marchant-Lupul
Brown-EC-Parros

I really can't see RC using a checking line with out Marchant. He seems to always use a line with Marchant on it. I think that was a big reason Marchant was resigned as well.

I'm wondering if Parros can work on his puck control skills down low in the offensive zone, he might be a decent compliment to Perry/Getzalf. That would be a lot of beef to have to deal with.

I like Carter and Nokia on the 2nd line. Nokia has more beef, but Carter has a better shot.

Its tough to consider what to do with Ebbet/Christensen on this team. Neither seem good fits with Perry/Getzlaf... to small for the 2nd line and not physical enough for the 4th line.

I like them as reserve players in case of injury to one of our offensive guys. Better than any rookie we have available for callup but not good enough to crack the regular lineup.

As for Parros, as much as I appreciate the effort he has put in to bettering himself as a hockey player, he's no Fedoruk. While he gets up and down the wing well enough to factor on the forecheck, he's too cumbersome and lacking in agility to play 18 minutes a night on a scoring line. He'd always be trailing the play. George is best used in a hitting/energy role, with a steaming side of mustache enforcement.

Sorry buddy, I was the first to use that line in one of my combos, so congratulate me.;)

No ways. I created the bones of that lineup at post #19. I'm claiming it as my IP for all eternity.

OT rant. As for the scoring lines/checking lines thing....Bleh. The checking line thing is used to criticize Carlyle, which to me doesn't make sense, and sort of points to the canabalistic tendency of fanbases who have experienced success that I've alluded to before.

In 05-06 we had guys like Selanne, McDonald, Fedorov, Getzlaf, Perry, Lupul, and Penner in the lineup, along with Niedermayer, Pahlsson, Hedstrom, Fedoruk. Carlyle knew he had the pieces for more than two scoring lines and farted around with the lineup until he found them, and it worked after a while. Collectively the team lost Fedorov, Lupul, and Hedstrom, and Carlyle retooled again and found lightning in a bottle with his checking line / 2 scoring line team. To me, this is good coaching, maximizing talent at the proper position. Working with what you have and creating a game plan around it, rather than forcing misshapen pieces into your pre-conceived plan.

07-08 and 08-09 he stuck with the cup winning formula, which seemed to irk a lot of people as time went by and success was hard to come by at times. People grumble that Carlyle is obsessed with a checking line, is inflexible with his lineup philosophy, but I dare you to name 9 players out of which 3 scoring lines could be made the last 2 years. There's nothing there. There were times when we didn't even have one consistent scoring line. We overcommitted to and overpaid for our group of defensemen (which had its rewards) but if left us barren at forward.

There are some legitimate complaints about Carlyle - his shootout choices are absurd, the reasoning behind his method of distributing ice time between deserving young players and certain veterans is opaque, he can be too loyal at times to certain players perhaps to the detriment of the team - but I think it's ridiculous to criticize him for being attached to a certain way of coaching. I think he's the most adaptable coach we've had, and one of the best young(ish) coaches in the league.
/rant

No ways. I created the bones of that lineup at post #19. I'm claiming it as my IP for all eternity.

OT rant. As for the scoring lines/checking lines thing....Bleh. The checking line thing is used to criticize Carlyle, which to me doesn't make sense, and sort of points to the canabalistic tendency of fanbases who have experienced success that I've alluded to before.

In 05-06 we had guys like Selanne, McDonald, Fedorov, Getzlaf, Perry, Lupul, and Penner in the lineup, along with Niedermayer, Pahlsson, Hedstrom, Fedoruk. Carlyle knew he had the pieces for more than two scoring lines and farted around with the lineup until he found them, and it worked after a while. Collectively the team lost Fedorov, Lupul, and Hedstrom, and Carlyle retooled again and found lightning in a bottle with his checking line / 2 scoring line team. To me, this is good coaching, maximizing talent at the proper position. Working with what you have and creating a game plan around it, rather than forcing misshapen pieces into your pre-conceived plan.

07-08 and 08-09 he stuck with the cup winning formula, which seemed to irk a lot of people as time went by and success was hard to come by at times. People grumble that Carlyle is obsessed with a checking line, is inflexible with his lineup philosophy, but I dare you to name 9 players out of which 3 scoring lines could be made the last 2 years. There's nothing there. There were times when we didn't even have one consistent scoring line. We overcommitted to and overpaid for our group of defensemen (which had its rewards) but if left us barren at forward.

There are some legitimate complaints about Carlyle - his shootout choices are absurd, the reasoning behind his method of distributing ice time between deserving young players and certain veterans is opaque, he can be too loyal at times to certain players perhaps to the detriment of the team - but I think it's ridiculous to criticize him for being attached to a certain way of coaching. I think he's the most adaptable coach we've had, and one of the best young(ish) coaches in the league.
/rant

Yeah, but I was first to the put the three together so there:sarcasm:... just messin..

I'm not criticizing Carlyle's coaching, but I just think he's the type of coach that's going to do what he wants. Some have said Murray think it's time to get away from a traditional checking line, and using 3 scoring lines, which can also be proved by some of his signings (EC). However, I think RC doesn't care what the GM says. He's the type of guy that's going to coach the way he wants.

I agree about the team not having enough guys to use 3 scoring lines the last two years, but what makes me believe that he wil still use a checking line is his comment about how defense will still be priority in this team, and his often stubborn attitude about making neccesary changes (giving Ryan top line minutes, benching Morrison). Plus the last few seasons, he's always found some way to form some sort of checking line reguardless of who is injured. Granted, that could be because lack of options, but IMO all of these things lead me to believe that he will eventually go back to using what has worked so well for him in the past, a checking line. I predict that he will try using three scoring lines with out a checking line, but after a while he will go back to using one.

The most interesting idea that I've seen lately is using three scoring lines and a checking line with Brown involved.
Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
EC-Koivu-Selanne
Ryan-Nokke-Lupul
Brown-Marchant-Bodie/Miller
Ebbett

That lineup still has the shutdown line that RC loves so much and three lines that could produce. The problem is that we just signed Parros to more money, and he's always been a regular in the lineup. There wouldn't be a position he could rotate in and out of with this lineup. Other than that, this lineup IMO looks to have the most potential.

I don't understand why people are leaving Ebbett out of the lineup. The midget still put up 32 points in 52 games. ****** playoffs or not, that's pretty damn good for a rookie. He deserves a spot on the team. He can easily be a passenger on a second line or add some offense to the 3rd or 4th line.

I don't understand why people are leaving Ebbett out of the lineup. The midget still put up 32 points in 52 games. ****** playoffs or not, that's pretty damn good for a rookie. He deserves a spot on the team. He can easily be a passenger on a second line or add some offense to the 3rd or 4th line.

I can think of a few reasons:

1) He's on a 2 way contract - save roster/cap space

2) He's an undersized center - my response play him on a wing - but we have a LOT of options at wings, and not as many at center

3) Hard time finding a role on the team:

A) Can't see him w/ Perry & Getzlaf
B) Too small for Koivu/Selanne
C) Not exactly a shutdown/defensive guy
D) Not exactly a hard hitting

Because of the team's offensive depth, he probably have a hard time making the top 6 forward roles, so he'd be put at the bottom 6.

Many people are still gravatating towards a 2 scoring line/ checking/ energy line format. Ebbett doesn't fit that mold right now.

I'm thinking a line of him Christensen and Parros/Brown might be an interesting 4th... but I'm probably in the minority.

Getzalf/Perry w/ Nokia or Carter
Koivu/Selanne w/ Nokia or Carter
Lupul Marchant Ryan
Ebett Christensen Parros/Brown

I'd much rather see Ebbett in the lineup than Christensen.

I'd much rather see Ebbett in the lineup than Christensen.
+ 1 million.

I don't understand why people are leaving Ebbett out of the lineup. The midget still put up 32 points in 52 games. ****** playoffs or not, that's pretty damn good for a rookie. He deserves a spot on the team. He can easily be a passenger on a second line or add some offense to the 3rd or 4th line.

Calimad pretty much said everything, but I'll just add some to it.

Ebbett makes the Christsensen signing even more puzzling. Ebbett is about equal in talent, but EC helps in the shootout area. Still though, they are comparable in talent.

The biggest knocks on Ebbett right now are he's on a two way deal, and he doesn't have a definite spot on the team. Depending on how RC does the line formations, there seem to be two possible spots for one of EC or Ebbett, next to Selanne and Koivu, or 4th line center. I give the advantage to EC because: he was resigned (meaning the team still wants to get more out of him), EC could probably be more helpful on the 2nd PP unit, better in shootouts, and he had solid chemistry with Parros on the 4th line last year. For agruments sake, let's just say RC uses his regular line formula (2 scoring, 1 checking, 1 energy)
Lupul-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-Nokke
Parros-EC-Brown
Ebbett, Miller

I think EC would get the call in the 4th line center spot for reasons stated above. If RC spreads out the lines to have three scoring and 1 checking, then he has a better shot of cracking the lineup.
Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
EC/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Lupul-Nokke-Ryan
Brown-Marchant-Bodie/Miller

I still give the edge to EC simply because he's on a one way contract. However, this formula would give Ebbett a better chance at making the lineup.

I don't understand why people are leaving Ebbett out of the lineup. The midget still put up 32 points in 52 games. ****** playoffs or not, that's pretty damn good for a rookie. He deserves a spot on the team. He can easily be a passenger on a second line or add some offense to the 3rd or 4th line.

Two even strength goals in 52 games is why I wouldnt play him. If he isnt going to be on the PP (and he wont with the new offensive weapons we have acquired) he is completely useless.

Two even strength goals in 52 games is why I wouldnt play him. If he isnt going to be on the PP (and he wont with the new offensive weapons we have acquired) he is completely useless.

This will be Ebbett's first full year in the NHL so lets give the kid a chance. I remember the summer of 05 when many of us penciled Andy McDonald on the fourth line. Ebbett is getting a lot of the same treatment. For a kid who started in Iowa, Ebbett did pretty well coming onto the team and finding some chemistry with Teemu. I hope it was a learning experience and he can hold a top 6 position this year.

I think Ebbett is miles better than Christensen.

This will be Ebbett's first full year in the NHL so lets give the kid a chance. I remember the summer of 05 when many of us penciled Andy McDonald on the fourth line. Ebbett is getting a lot of the same treatment. For a kid who started in Iowa, Ebbett did pretty well coming onto the team and finding some chemistry with Teemu. I hope it was a learning experience and he can hold a top 6 position this year.

Ebett is already 26. 26 year old small finesse players usually don't suddenly blossom when they've shown so little up to that point.

AndMac was a superstar in college, and had been sporadically productive pre-concussion. There were at least signs of NHL scoring-line skills his first few years. His first semi-full season in the NHL, he made plenty of plays and flashed fairly high-level vision and passing skills. By the time he was Ebbett's age, he was at least a surefire NHL level player, and had shown he could be truly good on a scoring line for stretches (at least pre-concussion).

Ebbett has never at any comparable stage of his career been remotely in McDonald's class. His history is as a mediocre to poor goal scorer, and a player with good vision but not the hands to take advantage of what he sees. His passes are "almost" on target, his skating is "almost" good enough to scare people ... and he's "almost" talented enough to be on a scoring line for a good team in the NHL. But he's not. He's a former okay college scorer, and an okay AHL scorer. Guys like that are a dime a dozen.

When you're that small, you can't just be kinda skilled. You have to be exceptionally skilled to compensate, and have tons of courage. Ebbett has neither.

Say what you will about Andrew Ebbett, but none of the criticisms erase the fact that he was a solid .667 PPG with a good +/-. This puts him in a class with Shawn Horcoff, Jiri Hudler, Ryan Kessler, etc., and above others such as Scott Gomez, Chris Drury, Ollie Jokinen, etc. For 487k, that's a friggin' steal.

And if Carlyle is going to try to try to balance the scoring out among the lines a little better as he has alluded to, the most natural and proven pairing as the basis for a third scoring line is Ryan-Ebbett.

These are facts, not opinions. When someone says Ebbett is "a player with good vision but not the hands to take advantage of what he sees", how in the hell do they know that? Look in his eyes and see he is trying to go top shelf, but instead puts it in the goalie's breadbasket?

These are facts, not opinions.

Ah, one of those posters.

Say what you will about Andrew Ebbett, but none of the criticisms erase the fact that he was a solid .667 PPG with a good +/-. This puts him in a class with Shawn Horcoff, Jiri Hudler, Ryan Kessler, etc., and above others such as Scott Gomez, Chris Drury, Ollie Jokinen, etc. For 487k, that's a friggin' steal.

Say what you will about Ebbett, but none of this erases the fact he had 2 even strength goals and was a putrid .23 ppg against playoff opposition.

Say what you will about Ebbett, but none of this erases the fact he had 2 even strength goals and was a putrid .23 ppg against playoff opposition.

As a rookie.

These are facts, not opinions.

If you're interested in stats, have a look at where Ebbett ranks on Quality of Competition and Quality of Teammates. He played soft minutes with strong linemates and thus was successful.

The game situations he saw were quite different from those that the bevy of first and second liners you just compared him to played in.

Hell, if you're interested in stats, a larger sample size than Ebbett's 48 games might be nice before you compare him to 10-year NHL veterans. Ever hear of Scott Fraser?

None of us are saying that Ebbett is a terrible player (well maybe Spanky is). It's more a question of where he can fit on the team. He benefited greatly from being on the line he ended up with. Was it chemistry with Selanne or was it just Selanne being a player good enough to improve Ebbett's stats? We don't know for sure, and with the arrival of Koivu, he's already lost that spot. So where does he fit?

the most natural and proven pairing as the basis for a third scoring line is Ryan-Ebbett.

This is your solution on where he fits. I must say that the "most natural and proven pairing" is not Ryan-Ebbett, but more likely Marchant-Lupul (witness the 2006 playoffs). It's a well known fact that preference of Carlyle to work with "pairs" such as Getzlaf-Perry, the expected Koivu-Selanne and I believe comments have already been made by Anaheim acknowledging the Marchant-Lupul connection. Barring any huge surprises in training camp, I would expect that these three pairings would form the nucleus of the top three lines for the Ducks.

When someone says Ebbett is "a player with good vision but not the hands to take advantage of what he sees", how in the hell do they know that? Look in his eyes and see he is trying to go top shelf, but instead puts it in the goalie's breadbasket?

Again returning back to stats, if you look at his shooting percentage (including the missed shots), you get a 2.0%, placing him last amongst forwards.

I remain hopeful for Ebbett. I'm not sure where he'll fit in, but he may be able to successfully make the move to the wing and become a reliable contributor. I feel he's an NHL player and that if he can't find a spot on Anaheim, he should be able to on another team. He was a rookie, but he's also entering what should be the prime of his career. We can't expect an advancement akin to what we've seen in players like Lupul, Kunitz, Getzlaf and Perry in the past, although some improved play due to comfort and familiarity could be reasonably expected. But for now, if I were him, I'd start practicing playing left wing and hope for the best.

Oh and I got all my stats from Behind the Net.

Say what you will about Ebbett, but none of this erases the fact he had 2 even strength goals and was a putrid .23 ppg against playoff opposition.
And what were his opponents stats against him?

If he'd hurt the team that much, he's be sporting a much more significant negative +/-.

Ebett is already 26. 26 year old small finesse players usually don't suddenly blossom when they've shown so little up to that point.

When you're that small, you can't just be kinda skilled. You have to be exceptionally skilled to compensate, and have tons of courage. Ebbett has neither.

Age has very little to do with tapping your potential. It is more the level of competition that makes you a better player. I am not going to compare Ebbett's skill versus Andy Mac because they were used differently in college. McDonald was a scorer at Colgate and Ebbett was a third line checker on a deep Michigan team. Does Ebbett have the talent to play in a top 6 role? Only he will figure that out and I think this year will be a good indicator of his potential. He needs to go from surviving the roster cut to contributing to the team. My point is give the kid a chance. He didn't perform to the level we needed from him in the playoffs but not many players can do that against a talented Red Wings team. Look at Bobby Ryan. I think both Ebbett and Ryan will be much better players this year from their experience. With Ebbett, we can move him to the wing with Koivu in the mix and he can learn. He'll be a much better player and then we can decide what role he has on this team.

And what were his opponents stats against him?

If he'd hurt the team that much, he's be sporting a much more significant negative +/-.

Flawed +/- argument.
Plus/minus is such an incomplete stat that I wish it would never be brought up. It doesn't show the full story with anything, especially any one player's defensive ability. (case in point, Niedermayer's -8)

As I mentioned before, Ebbett played soft minutes against lower quality opposition, supplemented by higher quality linemates. Plus/minus offers none of this. Again, I encourage you to look through the stats provided on Behind the Net, where their advanced plus/minus stats are extremely useful.

He didn't embarass himself in his own end, as can be seen by other stats, but please don't bring in plus/minus as some sort of argument to defensive play.

Say what you will about Andrew Ebbett, but none of the criticisms erase the fact that he was a solid .667 PPG with a good +/-. This puts him in a class with Shawn Horcoff, Jiri Hudler, Ryan Kessler, etc., and above others such as Scott Gomez, Chris Drury, Ollie Jokinen, etc. For 487k, that's a friggin' steal.

I'm more interested in watching players play, than in looking at stats. Espen Knutsen had a 53 point season in 60-some games once ... but if you watched him play you'd still know he sucked.

Stat-crunching is fine for fantasy hockey, but a good fantasy hockey player doesn't necessarily make for an equally good player in real games.

These are facts, not opinions. When someone says Ebbett is "a player with good vision but not the hands to take advantage of what he sees", how in the hell do they know that? Look in his eyes and see he is trying to go top shelf, but instead puts it in the goalie's breadbasket?

No, but many times I saw him try to make the right pass, but it would end up off target. Clearly, he sees what he needs to do, but he can't quite do it. That's not rookie jitters (and frankly, if he's having jitters at age 26 then he's a mental wuss), that's just a player who's not super-skilled. Sure, he got some points ... but honestly, playing with Selanne he should have had more, and his not-quite-good-enough skills probably killed as many scoring chances as he created.

I have nothing against the guy, but he's simply not good enough as a scoring line guy for a team that hopes to go far. Not unless he makes some amazing strides during this offseason.

Carter/Ryan-getzlaf-Perry
Carter/Ryan-koivu-teemu
Ebbett-Marchant-Lupul
4th line of the rest

3 scoring lines and Lupul can play his normal position leaving the defensive responsibilities to Marchant in order to anchor that line in te defensive zone. Just an idea if we go with 3 scoring lines.

Flawed +/- argument.
Plus/minus is such an incomplete stat that I wish it would never be brought up. It doesn't show the full story with anything, especially any one player's defensive ability. (case in point, Niedermayer's -8)

As I mentioned before, Ebbett played soft minutes against lower quality opposition, supplemented by higher quality linemates. Plus/minus offers none of this. Again, I encourage you to look through the stats provided on Behind the Net, where their advanced plus/minus stats are extremely useful.

He didn't embarass himself in his own end, as can be seen by other stats, but please don't bring in plus/minus as some sort of argument to defensive play.
What statistic other than a +/- type do you suggest to look at that would reflect a player's responsibility level within the system he plays in? If nothing else, the stat shows that his coach knows how to use him.

Ebbett is playing under Carlyle and substantially doing what his coach is asking of him, as evidenced by his simple +/-. Rail on the stat all you want, but you neglect to explain why coaching staffs still use it. It's still an accurate reflection of how a player performs within his own system. Therefore, it is a perfectly valid stat to point to as Ebbett being good defensively for the role he is used in in Anaheim.

And as for your claim that a Marchant-Lupul pairing makes more sense, Randy Carlyle did not indicate that he had that in mind in recent comments (http://ducks.freedomblogging.com/2009/07/15/ducks-carlyle-considers-line-combinations/16167/#more-16167) when he said:“I know Koivu is going to start with Selanne, and Getzlaf is going to start with Perry,” Carlyle said. “As always, the other parts are interchangeable.”

With Ryan having joined Getzlaf and Perry to form a unit that was often dominant late last season, Lupul would seem to be a likely possibility to skate with Selanne and Koivu, though such a lineup would require Lupul to play on his off wing.

“We might need some meat on the left side,” Carlyle said. “Lupes has to come in and show he can play that position on a consistent basis.”
From what Carlyle has said, it looks as though he has Lupul in his mind as playing with the Koivu-Selanne pairing. That leaves Bobby Ryan as the player who would be half of another scoring pairing as Carlyle has also alluded to, and Andrew Ebbett seems to me to be the obvious one among Marchant, Carter, Nokelainen, and Christensen.

I'm more interested in watching players play, than in looking at stats. Espen Knutsen had a 53 point season in 60-some games once ... but if you watched him play you'd still know he sucked.

Stat-crunching is fine for fantasy hockey, but a good fantasy hockey player doesn't necessarily make for an equally good player in real games.



No, but many times I saw him try to make the right pass, but it would end up off target. Clearly, he sees what he needs to do, but he can't quite do it. That's not rookie jitters (and frankly, if he's having jitters at age 26 then he's a mental wuss), that's just a player who's not super-skilled. Sure, he got some points ... but honestly, playing with Selanne he should have had more, and his not-quite-good-enough skills probably killed as many scoring chances as he created.

I have nothing against the guy, but he's simply not good enough as a scoring line guy for a team that hopes to go far. Not unless he makes some amazing strides during this offseason.
I see what you're getting at, but who else on our roster, or another available player at 487k, would provide as much as Ebbett?

What's the alternative?

Age has very little to do with tapping your potential.It does in the sense that at 26-27 you are pretty much at the peak of you physical condition. If you're not strong by that time you will not develop to be any stronger.

I just realized I've neglected to offer my lines.

Here is what I anticipate our lines being with Carlyle's possible new thought of having scoring more spread throughout the lines (who knows how he'll split up the ice time, other than having Getz-Perry out there the most). I still think he maintains a checking line:

Carter/Nokelainen-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Parros-Ebbett-Ryan

Checking line: Miller-Marchant-Brown (with Nokelainen looming)

If Carlyle sticks with his usual scoring-scoring-checking-energy line format, in addition to the above checking line I expect to see:

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Nokelainen-Carter/Ebbett-Parros

Once Christensen gets healthy, I think he has to beat out either of Ebbett or Carter. In addition, I think Nokelainen has something to prove.

What statistic other than a +/- type do you suggest to look at that would reflect a player's responsibility level within the system he plays in?

There is no stat that does that. In the end, there's simply no substitute for watching the player play.

If +/- meant much, Marty McSorley wouldn't have been +48 on the same team that Rob Blake was a +3 on, and Sami Pahlsson wouldn't be a career -46.

I just realized I've neglected to offer my lines.

Here is what I anticipate our lines being with Carlyle's possible new thought of having scoring more spread throughout the lines (who knows how he'll split up the ice time, other than having Getz-Perry out there the most). I still think he maintains a checking line:

Carter/Nokelainen-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Parros-Ebbett-Ryan

Checking line: Miller-Marchant-Brown (with Nokelainen looming)

If Carlyle sticks with his usual scoring-scoring-checking-energy line format, in addition to the above checking line I expect to see:

Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul-Koivu-Selanne
Nokelainen-Carter/Ebbett-Parros

Once Christensen gets healthy, I think he has to beat out either of Ebbett or Carter. In addition, I think Nokelainen has something to prove.
By far the least effective use of our 3rd best forward. It also places the completely-lacking-versatility Lupul on the left side while ignoring Ryan's ability to thrive there, AND also placing an undue burden on the non-scoring Parros to effectively play an offensive role.

12 kinds of fail, means you were really trying. Nice.

What statistic other than a +/- type do you suggest to look at that would reflect a player's responsibility level within the system he plays in? If nothing else, the stat shows that his coach knows how to use him.

Ebbett is playing under Carlyle and substantially doing what his coach is asking of him, as evidenced by his simple +/-. Rail on the stat all you want, but you neglect to explain why coaching staffs still use it. It's still an accurate reflection of how a player performs within his own system. Therefore, it is a perfectly valid stat to point to as Ebbett being good defensively for the role he is used in in Anaheim.

+- is a terrible, useless statistic

If you want to commpare his play to the rest of the team then I'm much more interested in the two variants given from behindthenet (both are for 5v5 play only (which is a pretty sensible idea in my opinion))
First is +-ON/60 which is "Plus-Minus, (player) On Ice, per 60 minutes"
Second is +-OFF/60 which is "Plus-Minus, (player) Off Ice, per 60 minutes"
Take the difference in those two numbers and you get an idea as to the value of a player to his team. However you also have to figure in the quality of competition a player faced and the quality of linemates he played with

Ebbett for example has a +-ON/60 of 1.08 and a +-OFF/60 of -0.25 meaning the difference between these two numbers is +1.33, and to be fair to him that's pretty damn good. But factor in his quality of team mates is 0.118, ie he had the 5th best team mates amongst all Ducks forwards and that his quality of competition is -0.068, ie the third easiest opponents of all Ducks forwards and that number can be questioned

If you want to compare him defensively to the rest of the league then I'd suggest the least crude measure I've found (there's may be a better measure but I haven't found it yet) is again from behindthenet:
Look at a players GAON/60 number and divide by their COMPGFON/60 number. This gives a ratio as to how many goals a player concedes compared to the average for the opponents that player faced. A ratio of 1 would be average for the league, Ebbett comes in as 1.02 so he's slightly better defensively than the league average. Again given his quality of team mates and quality of opponents it's not a number to get too excited about

By far the least effective use of our 3rd best forward. It also places the completely-lacking-versatility Lupul on the left side while ignoring Ryan's ability to thrive there, AND also placing an undue burden on the non-scoring Parros to effectively play an offensive role.

12 kinds of fail, means you were really trying. Nice.

Second best :nod:.

By far the least effective use of our 3rd best forward. It also places the completely-lacking-versatility Lupul on the left side while ignoring Ryan's ability to thrive there, AND also placing an undue burden on the non-scoring Parros to effectively play an offensive role.

12 kinds of fail, means you were really trying. Nice.
Pull your head out and try reading what Carlyle said.

But that's asking you to do two things your apparently not capable of, so never mind.

+- is a terrible, useless statistic...

Then explain why Randy Carlyle, Bob Murray, and the rest of the coaches and GMs in the league use it to assess their own players.

Ah, one of those posters.

Sigh...............So it seems.................

Then explain why Randy Carlyle, Bob Murray, and the rest of the coaches and GMs in the league use it to assess their own players.

Short answer being that they don't. Or at least they don't put as much weight into it as you seem to be doing right now. Now I can't say that for sure, and this is where you'll come out with some obscure mention that Murray or Carlyle or someone else made to the media, but I'm fairly comfortable with my statement that they don't use it much to assess their players. Granted, I never had access to Murray or Carlyle, nor do I now with any NHL team, but I know for sure, on lower levels, namely the CHL, that teams employ statisticians to record data and interpret it in ways that are much more representative of an actual player's game and what he brings to the team. I have no reason to assume that a team like the Ducks, with a budget much larger than any CHL team and a considerably larger investment in players would use similar metrics to assess their players.

As I said before, plus/minus is an incomplete statistic that, on its own, is near useless for any comparisons or conclusions to be drawn from it. Others in this thread have gone on to explain even further why it does not paint an accurate picture of the player. Then I, along with many others, provided examples and links to much more valid information that offers a truer portrait, through stats like Quality of Teammates and Quality of Competition.

So here's further explanation by Behind the Net on the stats we were providing:
http://www.behindthenet.ca/about_stats.html

Pull your head out and try reading what Carlyle said.

But that's asking you to do two things your apparently not capable of, so never mind.

If you really think putting Bobby Ryan on a line with Ebbet and Parros is beneficial to either the team, or Ryan, you can't be helped.

Pull your head out and try reading what Carlyle said.

But that's asking you to do two things your apparently not capable of, so never mind.
Wow. You really are keeping it deep.

Carlyle's comments, all of them, have been discussed at length in this thread and others, which you probably didn't feel the need to read, since you're one of those posters.

Maybe read back through them and see what people had to say before posting 3rd grade lineups or childish arguments based on +/- or the awesome cost efficiency of Andrew Ebbett, Useless Extraordinaire.

Speaking of childish lineups, the Nsh-Ducks replay tonight showed at one time a power play hilariously featuring Selanne and Ryan on the points with Niedermayer in the crease and Pronger and Getzlaf on the half boards.

Is humility a forgotten concept these days? That or respectful debate.

Man I sound old.

Is humility a forgotten concept these days? That or respectful debate.

Man I sound old.
Well who thought Ebbett of all people would end up as such a polarizing figure.

Speaking of childish lineups, the Nsh-Ducks replay tonight showed at one time a power play hilariously featuring Selanne and Ryan on the points with Niedermayer in the crease and Pronger and Getzlaf on the half boards.

Opposite day!

Is humility a forgotten concept these days? That or respectful debate.

Man I sound old.

OT:

You're right though, and it's not just online. Talk radio/fast-news culture, particularly in sports and politics, has taken all the civil debate out of these conversations. Everyone's opinion is a bumper sticker, and if you can't say it loud and decisively within 15 seconds, you run the risk of being "hung up on".

As a Canadian in the southern US, I get the full brunt of this through both sports radio (TEEEEEEEEEBOW IS GAWD!!!!! GAAAAAATORS WILL GO 85-0!!!) and largely republican Hannity/Rush-style verbal diarrhea (HUSSSSSSSSSSEIN'S A SOCIALIST!!!! PATRIOTS VOTE REPUBLICAN!!!!) that pops up when you least expect it. (ps: I'm sure there is plenty of Democratic verbal diarrhea to go around as well. It's just not what I'm surrounded by).

I fear that less and less, people will be able to disagree, be it important matters (politics/religion) or unimportant (sports/music/pop culture), and remain friendly and civil. I don't know if it's an American issue or something more because I haven't spent much time back home in Canada in the past five years. It is probably what I've been most disappointed with during my stay here, though. It's an unfortunate trend.

Well who thought Ebbett of all people would end up as such a polarizing figure.

It's always the depth guys that seem to cause such a debate. Remember similar discussions about guys like Fedoruk, Shannon, Shawn Thornton and even Pahlsson, before he became God.

It's always the depth guys that seem to cause such a debate. Remember similar discussions about guys like Fedoruk, Shannon, Shawn Thornton and even Pahlsson, before he became God.

For the simple fact that they really don't have or didn't have a definitive place in the line up until they are proven in the spot they are supposed to play. (Does that even make sense?)

Or at least they don't put as much weight into it as you seem to be doing right now.
You are blowing my use of the simple +/- stat way out of proportion. If you'd reply to the post I directed at you, you would have to tell me how Randy Carlyle's use of Andrew Ebbett to get .667PPG out of him was flawed. My original contention was, and still is, that Ebbett was used by Carlyle to contribute .667 PPG to this team, without going behind on the scoreboard. That is better than any of the other centers he has tried on this roster, sans Getzlaf and the untried Koivu. If Carlyle is thinking about trying to put together a third scoring line as has been claimed (reference (http://ducks.freedomblogging.com/2009/07/15/ducks-carlyle-considers-line-combinations/16167/#more-16167)), it would stand to reason that Ebbett would be a prime candidate to center that line.

You also didn't address my referenced point that Carlyle has indicated that he has Lupul skating with Koivu and Selanne in mind, not Marchant as you suggest. Bobby Ryan is the only player left from the top six that he could split out to balance the scoring if he follows that path, and I again contend that Andrew Ebbett is the most natural and proven player to pair with Ryan.

I personally don't believe that Randy Carlyle is going to abandon having a checking line, as nothing he has said or done indicates that he would change this foundation of his. I believe that Todd Marchant will be the anchor of this line, and don't see Carlyle trying to use him in an offensive role instead. He's already tried that, and Ebbett worked better in that role for him.

Maybe to find a common ground, "I remain hopeful for Ebbett" as well. I honestly don't see any other spot for him other than centering an energy line, or being paired with Bobby Ryan if indeed Carlyle does split up the top six... but then I can't envision how the minutes would be split up, because Ryan sure as hell shouldn't be used on a fourth line ice time basis.

Short answer being that they don't...That's completely untrue.

Now I can't say that for sure, and this is where you'll come out with some obscure mention that Murray or Carlyle or someone else made to the media, but I'm fairly comfortable with my statement that they don't use it much to assess their players. Granted, I never had access to Murray or Carlyle, nor do I now with any NHL teamWell I can say it for sure. I have a close family member that has been an assistant coach in the NHL, and have had the opportunity to get to talk with his head coaches and fellow assistants on many occasions, as I have also with Randy Carlyle and Brian Burke, due to the latter's accessibility to SSH's during his tenure in Anaheim. And if you don't accept my word for it, you can dig up some "obscure mention that Murray or Carlyle or someone else made to the media" for yourself, because you do acknowledge they exist. But of course, all you would need to do is review some of the bitter arbitration cases from the past to see GMs using the stat.

As for NHL coaches using the simple +/- stat, they reference it with their own players to assess their own use of them. They don't need someone else's adjustments of the stat to take into consideration other variables, because they do that for themselves. After all, that is their job. They well might use those for players on other teams, but they don't for their own players.

But again, this +/- discussion isn't that important to my position. My contention is that Andrew Ebbett's .667 PPG stat proves him valuable because he still plays for Randy Carlyle, he still might be used to pair with an important player, and he still only costs us 487k cap dollars. Yeah he's small, yeah he's not all that slick with the puck, and yeah he most likely doesn't have a higher ceiling. But he can play for Randy Carlyle, and Carlyle has been able to get .667 PPG out of him.

Well I can say it for sure. I have a close family member that has been an assistant coach in the NHL, and have had the opportunity to get to talk with his head coaches and fellow assistants on many occasions, as I have also with Randy Carlyle and Brian Burke

Ah, one of those posters. There really is a lot of people on this site with these kinds of connections.

Ah, one of those posters. There really is a lot of people on this site with these kinds of connections.
And the closer the connection the greater the d bag.

And the closer the connection the greater the d bag.

He's talking about me :cry:

He's talking about me :cry:

Me ****ing too...:rant:

I'd like to think I can be a d-bag too, even without the connections!

He's talking about me :cry:

Aw, yours is ever so slight.

Me ****ing too...:rant:

Just being Canadian doesn't count as a hockey connection.

Just being Canadian doesn't count as a hockey connection.

I always figured pretty much every Canadian has at least one hockey connection.

Aw, yours is ever so slight.





Probably wouldn't say that if you knew about my Colorado Rockies connections. By your definition I would be the biggest D-bag around.

OT: I love the word ******-bag

This thread is starting to stink.













http://tinychoices.com/images/vinegar1.jpg

You also didn't address my referenced point that Carlyle has indicated that he has Lupul skating with Koivu and Selanne in mind, not Marchant as you suggest. Bobby Ryan is the only player left from the top six that he could split out to balance the scoring if he follows that path, and I again contend that Andrew Ebbett is the most natural and proven player to pair with Ryan.

I personally don't believe that Randy Carlyle is going to abandon having a checking line, as nothing he has said or done indicates that he would change this foundation of his. I believe that Todd Marchant will be the anchor of this line, and don't see Carlyle trying to use him in an offensive role instead. He's already tried that, and Ebbett worked better in that role for him.


Where has Carlyle addressed that Lupul would play with Koivu and Selanne? Do you have a link to that? I remember him saying that having Lupul would provide secondary scoring, but I never heard him say that he's going to play with those two. From the interview I heard, it sounded like he would toy with the idea of using 3 scoring lines, but would figure it out once camp began.

Personally I think it would be an extremely dumb move to put Ryan (our 2nd best forward ;)) on a line with Parros. Although RC makes some really dumb line choices and doesn't fix them until about three quarters of the way through the season, so it's still a possibility it happens. Ryan has the hands to be absolutely amazing with a sniper, similar to Getzlaf. I don't think Carlyle will abandon a checking line either.

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry (Carter has shown that he can handle playing with these guys)

EC/Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne (These two will probably rotate IMO)

Ryan-Nokke-Lupul (Nokke provides the defense on this line and enables Marchant to play on the checking line)

Brown-Marchant-Bodie/Miller (Our new checking line. Keeping Brown in the lineup will still bring a physcial presence to the team)

The downside to these lines is there is nowhere for Parros to rotate. I'd like to see these lines, but IMO RC will eventually return to his standard formula. In the end we will see these lines:
Lupul/Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry
Lupul/Ryan-Koivu-Selanne
Carter-Marchant-Nokke/Miller
Brown-EC/Ebbett-Parros

:shakehead

2 scoring lines:

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Miller - Marchant - Nokia
Brown - Carter - Parros

3 scoring lines:

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Christensen - Ebbett - Marchant
Brown - Nokia - Parros

Id like to have 3 scoring lines... but, that 3rd pairing is tiny. I was thinking>>>>

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Christensen - (Carter) - Marchant
Brown - Noks - Stash :yo:

Just being Canadian doesn't count as a hockey connection.

I told Gretz what you said and he laughed, and laughed, and laughed...

I told Gretz what you said and he laughed, and laughed, and laughed...

That's Ericnut bad.

Seriously, what's funny that all the canadians that come to europe say that they don't care about hockey. Or maybe that's why they come to Europe in the first place, go figure.

That's Ericnut bad.

Seriously, what's funny that all the canadians that come to europe say that they don't care about hockey. Or maybe that's why they come to Europe in the first place, go figure.

There are plenty of Canadians who don't care about hockey. 15% of 33 million is still a big number.

Typically in Canada, if one was involved in hockey relatively deeply at all, they'll have at least a second degree relationship with someone involved in the NHL. There just isn't that many people.

Since we're off-topic as hell anyways, my relationships are pretty slim. I had a few Jets as neighbors back in the day. I played with two guys who had short stints in the NHL. Through a younger hockey-playing family member I got to know four current NHL-ers, as well as a certain coach of a certain west-coast hockey team. None of these are relationships I'd brag about, or would suggest give me any supreme insight into how the game "really" works.

Now, I do have a close friend who was a head coach of an Ontario Hockey League team for quite a while, and who was a Canadian national under-17 coach. I enjoy picking his brain on things, but it still doesn't replace actually experiencing it or having that knowledge yourself. Working for a minor-league team for four years did give me an interesting look at how things work at that level, but I don't know that it has much relevance at the NHL level.

Bottom line for me is, there are knowledgable fans and idiotic fans, but we're still fans regardless. We'll never have any clue what's really happening in the offices, even if our best friend is Bob Murray. We'll never know how the coach is evaluating his team, unless we're sitting beside him watching film. Or become the equipment manager...those guys know all.

Where has Carlyle addressed that Lupul would play with Koivu and Selanne? Do you have a link to that? I remember him saying that having Lupul would provide secondary scoring, but I never heard him say that he's going to play with those two. From the interview I heard, it sounded like he would toy with the idea of using 3 scoring lines, but would figure it out once camp began.
I linked the article twice, in this post (http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=20507038&postcount=209) (where I quoted Carlyle), and again in my post you are responding to. Here's what was said:
“I know Koivu is going to start with Selanne, and Getzlaf is going to start with Perry,” Carlyle said. “As always, the other parts are interchangeable.”

With Ryan having joined Getzlaf and Perry to form a unit that was often dominant late last season, Lupul would seem to be a likely possibility to skate with Selanne and Koivu, though such a lineup would require Lupul to play on his off wing.

“We might need some meat on the left side,” Carlyle said. “Lupes has to come in and show he can play that position on a consistent basis.”

Id like to have 3 scoring lines... but, that 3rd pairing is tiny. I was thinking>>>>

Lupul - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Koivu - Selanne
Christensen - (Carter) - Marchant
Brown - Noks - Stash :yo:

See, I know that in theory Christiensen, Ebbett, and Carter are "scoring line players", but I just don't get the feeling that putting them together will result in...you know...scoring. Goes for Marchant as well, though I know he's more a versitile defensive conscience.

What I see here is still two scoring lines, an energy line, and a catch-all.

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Christensen-Marchant-Lupul
Brown-Nokeleinin-Parros/Miller

Is my favorite theoretical combo so far, acknowledging of course that...a) the second line is lible to get the **** kicked out of them, and b) the parts will be mixed and matched according to how the game ebbs and flows.

There are plenty of Canadians who don't care about hockey. 15% of 33 million is still a big number.

Typically in Canada, if one was involved in hockey relatively deeply at all, they'll have at least a second degree relationship with someone involved in the NHL. There just isn't that many people.

Since we're off-topic as hell anyways, my relationships are pretty slim. I had a few Jets as neighbors back in the day. I played with two guys who had short stints in the NHL. Through a younger hockey-playing family member I got to know four current NHL-ers, as well as a certain coach of a certain west-coast hockey team. None of these are relationships I'd brag about, or would suggest give me any supreme insight into how the game "really" works.

Now, I do have a close friend who was a head coach of an Ontario Hockey League team for quite a while, and who was a Canadian national under-17 coach. I enjoy picking his brain on things, but it still doesn't replace actually experiencing it or having that knowledge yourself. Working for a minor-league team for four years did give me an interesting look at how things work at that level, but I don't know that it has much relevance at the NHL level.

Bottom line for me is, there are knowledgable fans and idiotic fans, but we're still fans regardless. We'll never have any clue what's really happening in the offices, even if our best friend is Bob Murray. We'll never know how the coach is evaluating his team, unless we're sitting beside him watching film. Or become the equipment manager...those guys know all.
I'd bet that the actual percentage of Canadians who care about hockey is significantly less than 85%. I have nothing to base that on besides my own cynicism, though.

See, I know that in theory Christiensen, Ebbett, and Carter are "scoring line players", but I just don't get the feeling that putting them together will result in...you know...scoring. Goes for Marchant as well, though I know he's more a versitile defensive conscience.

What I see here is still two scoring lines, an energy line, and a catch-all.

Carter-Getzlaf-Perry
Ebbett-Koivu-Selanne
Christensen-Marchant-Lupul
Brown-Nokeleinin-Parros/Miller

Is my favorite theoretical combo so far, acknowledging of course that...a) the second line is lible to get the **** kicked out of them, and b) the parts will be mixed and matched according to how the game ebbs and flows.
Aww, you sent Bobby back to the Condors :(

Also, "ebbs and flows" should be the nickname of whatever line Ebbett is on.

I linked the article twice, in this post (http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=20507038&postcount=209) (where I quoted Carlyle), and again in my post you are responding to. Here's what was said:


That quote could be read so many different ways, especially depending how the reporter posed the question. The way I read it, it seems to point to Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry being the assumed top line and then the reporter asked if Lupul was going to play with Selanne and Koivu, to which Carlyle replied that Lupul would have to show he can play on the left side.

That quote could be read so many different ways, especially depending how the reporter posed the question. The way I read it, it seems to point to Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry being the assumed top line and then the reporter asked if Lupul was going to play with Selanne and Koivu, to which Carlyle replied that Lupul would have to show he can play on the left side.
That's how I read it. Way back when we talked about it.