ducks top 5 pick starting to turn into a 8-10 pick

not long ago the ducks were in position to get a top 5 pick in the draft. now that edmonton is going on a little run the pick is getting lower and lower. im not one to complain because 10th overall is still good. but i remember brian burke saying that there are 7 cant miss guys and after them there is a severe drop off. if anaheim gets (for example) the 10th pick. do you think that he will trade the pick or take the best player availible?

not long ago the ducks were in position to get a top 5 pick in the draft. now that edmonton is going on a little run the pick is getting lower and lower. im not one to complain because 10th overall is still good. but i remember brian burke saying that there are 7 cant miss guys and after them there is a severe drop off. if anaheim gets (for example) the 10th pick. do you think that he will trade the pick or take the best player availible?

I think a top-10 pick is better than nothing. Normally we have a pick not better than top-20. I think behind the top-5 prospects are also really great talents (Boedker or Luke Schenn).

If the same Duck scouting infrastructure that found Getzlaf at 19th and Perry at 28th is in place, you guys will be fine. As Burke said, this draft has several can't-miss types near the top, but after that there are a ton of players in that 2nd tier group whereby good scouting will make the difference (and based on recent history, the Ducks have a decided edge in that regard).

not long ago the ducks were in position to get a top 5 pick in the draft. now that edmonton is going on a little run the pick is getting lower and lower. im not one to complain because 10th overall is still good. but i remember brian burke saying that there are 7 cant miss guys and after them there is a severe drop off. if anaheim gets (for example) the 10th pick. do you think that he will trade the pick or take the best player availible?

Burke said, the draft is 7 players deep, right. That does not mean that those players will be off the board if we draft at spot 8-10. There are obvious ones like, Stamkos, Doughty, Pietrangelo but everything behind it is not so clear. Schenn for example can fall to spot 8. So can Bogosian. IMO out of the players that can fall to 8-10, just look at the TSN midseason rankings. If we really have a spot between 8 and 10 IMO Burke will trade down if he is sure he can land Tyler Myers.

Again, 7 players deep by our scouts does not mean that they will go 1-7 in the draft.

You're a top contender, and you'll still probably get a top-10 draft pick. Not a bad deal if you ask me.

either way it sounds like a sweet deal! But ya, i mean a lot more people are high on the russian kid filatov(sp?) and i doubt burke even considered him in the top 7.

I think Beach could fall to the 8-10 range with his attitude and skating deficiencies. I wouldn't mind taking him, seeing as the organization has a history of straightening out skating and attitude problems.

I think Beach could fall to the 8-10 range with his attitude and skating deficiencies. I wouldn't mind taking him, seeing as the organization has a history of straightening out skating and attitude problems.

I dunno if you can classify this kid as just having "attitude problems"

From the looks of things he needs some serious therapy.

The Oilers have 4 top players still out and a brutal homestretch against 4 divisional rivals all playing balls out for playoff positioning.

Don't count out a top 5 just yet.

I dunno if you can classify this kid as just having "attitude problems"

From the looks of things he needs some serious therapy.

Yeah, I dont think even Burke would be too keen on taking him.

I dunno if you can classify this kid as just having "attitude problems"

From the looks of things he needs some serious therapy.

Then serious therapy it is! The kid's so talented that I think it would be a huge mistake to pass on him if he's still there at 8-10.

Then serious therapy it is! The kid's so talented that I think it would be a huge mistake to pass on him if he's still there at 8-10.

Talent makes you a first round pick.

What's between the ears makes you a star in the NHL.

I hope we don't touch this kid

Talent makes you a first round pick.

What's between the ears makes you a star in the NHL.

I hope we don't touch this kid

That's exactly what I heard about Getzlaf in '05, and look how that turned out. It's easier to put a fire out than it is to start one.

It's easier to put a fire out than it is to start one.

Er, I understand what you are trying to say. But that's just not true. Unless if your fire and my fire are different.

That's exactly what I heard about Getzlaf in '05, and look how that turned out. It's easier to put a fire out than it is to start one.

Yeah there is a huge difference between what kind of guy Getzlaf was perceived to be and this guy.

Also a huge difference in on the ice incidents.

It's easier to put a fire out than it is to start one.
one of the only sports related proverbs that doesn't make me fly into angry fits of rage. its very true

ikNmGbS2EqQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yby8PD0AVkI

I'm not sure I expect Edmonton to continue doing this well. They're really being led by young guys, can you really count on them to continue to do well against playoff teams? I'd expect it to end up borderline top 7.

Penner for the 10th pick in this draft still sounds like a sweet deal(even better when you add the 2nd and 3rd rounder)

Er, I understand what you are trying to say. But that's just not true. Unless if your fire and my fire are different.

It's a sports saying. Of course it's completely the opposite if you're talking about a real fire.

Yeah there is a huge difference between what kind of guy Getzlaf was perceived to be and this guy.

Also a huge difference in on the ice incidents.

Still, I think stuff like that can be outgrown, or at the very least managed. You've gotta remember that this kid is barely 18. You can't expect every 18 year old to be mature and level-headed.

if edmonton ***** the bed in the final games and drops way down.
this is burke on draft day
sends up kevin lowe
*kevin lowe* on behalf of the Oilers organization the Anaheim Ducks proudly select _____(insert future star in the draft)
my life would be complete hahahhahahhahahahhaa

It's a sports saying. Of course it's completely the opposite if you're talking about a real fire.

Oh ok, now it makes sense lol. I thought you were directly comparing with a fire. But yes, in that case it's easier to put a fire out.

I don't really care where the pick is anymore, at least we got one. Chances are it is out of the top 10

Anaheims draft board always seems to be different than popular opinion. For instance not many people have Tyler Myers in their top 7 but he's a guy who I think the Ducks would be very happy to pick...and there are still plenty of games left for that pick to go top 5.

Best case we end up with Doughty, more likely we end up with Beach/Boedker/Myers...not bad consolation prizes.

I'm still holding out for Edmonton to start falling. They don't have a favorable schedule to end the season. But, they beat San Jose today. Hopefully that was a one-time occurance.

Either way, though, this should net a decent 'spect. Despite us seemingly needing a more offensive dman, I'd love to add Colten Teubert. I think he could be a monster for years to come.

there's no way doughty is still there. He'll be gone by the 3rd pick

there's no way doughty is still there. He'll be gone by the 3rd pick

Who said we'd get Doughty with an 8-10 pick?

Anaheims draft board always seems to be different than popular opinion. For instance not many people have Tyler Myers in their top 7 but he's a guy who I think the Ducks would be very happy to pick...and there are still plenty of games left for that pick to go top 5.

Best case we end up with Doughty, more likely we end up with Beach/Boedker/Myers...not bad consolation prizes.

He did

He did

That doesn't say anything about taking him at 8-10. Edmonton's pick could technically still be first overall.

if edmonton ***** the bed in the final games and drops way down.
this is burke on draft day
sends up kevin lowe
*kevin lowe* on behalf of the Oilers organization the Anaheim Ducks proudly select _____(insert future star in the draft)
my life would be complete hahahhahahhahahahhaa


as an oiler fan that is what i have been fearing since day one. oiler fans are jumping for joy. I am still predicting the ducks get a top 5 pick and a future superstar with who they draft

Eh, I don't really care where this pick ends up. The great thing about our organization right now is we finally are at a stage to not on our first rounders anymore. We've built a team that is young and strong. Our first rounder from three years ago still doesn't have a concrete spot (more out of depth) and our most recent first rounders don't even have contracts yet. That's the sign of a great team. Wherever this pick lands is just gravy. In fact if it is a 8-10 pick than I wouldn't be opposed at all to see Burkie trade it. I've never liked this pick unless it ended up being a great pick. It still could but the way Edmonton is playing right now I've given up worrying about it.

Eh, I don't really care where this pick ends up. The great thing about our organization right now is we finally are at a stage to not on our first rounders anymore. We've built a team that is young and strong. Our first rounder from three years ago still doesn't have a concrete spot (more out of depth) and our most recent first rounders don't even have contracts yet. That's the sign of a great team. Wherever this pick lands is just gravy. In fact if it is a 8-10 pick than I wouldn't be opposed at all to see Burkie trade it. I've never liked this pick unless it ended up being a great pick. It still could but the way Edmonton is playing right now I've given up worrying about it.

I disagree. There are holes in the system, especially when you look at this team post-Selanne and Niedermayer. A stud defenseman, winger, or center would look very nice in the stable. I'd be fine with trading it if it brings in a player who's going to be part of the solution around here for the next five or so years. But, you stay at the top by keeping your system flush with NHL-talent. It could be a pivotal selection for this franchise.

Burke said, the draft is 7 players deep, right. That does not mean that those players will be off the board if we draft at spot 8-10. There are obvious ones like, Stamkos, Doughty, Pietrangelo but everything behind it is not so clear. Schenn for example can fall to spot 8. So can Bogosian. IMO out of the players that can fall to 8-10, just look at the TSN midseason rankings. If we really have a spot between 8 and 10 IMO Burke will trade down if he is sure he can land Tyler Myers.

Again, 7 players deep by our scouts does not mean that they will go 1-7 in the draft.

Especially if LA drafts ahead of you. They'll take some potential 3rd round pick ahead of Stamkos. :D

I disagree. There are holes in the system, especially when you look at this team post-Selanne and Niedermayer. A stud defenseman, winger, or center would look very nice in the stable. I'd be fine with trading it if it brings in a player who's going to be part of the solution around here for the next five or so years. But, you stay at the top by keeping your system flush with NHL-talent. It could be a pivotal selection for this franchise.

What holes? Our top-6 consists by next season will consist of no less than three players under the age of 23 and another that's 28. Pronger, Frankie, and Husky have a ton of good years left. Jiggy is solid and under contract for three more years and Hiller is looking good and is only 26. As far as prospects go we have Salcido and Mikkelson waiting in the wings with Mitera only a year or two behind them. Carter, Miller and Wirtanen all could be full-time NHLers next season and Levassuer is only 21. Plus we have guys like MacMillian, Swan, Belesky, Tangradi and even Pesonen down the pipeline.

But regardless of all that, this team is built through trades and free agency anyway. I'm more interested in seeing which college prospect McNab is going to sign this spring than the pick we are going to take. I expect this team to start to move into the Detroit/New Jersey mold of building a team: Not caring too deeply on first rounders and scouting late round picks heavily. Free agents want to play in Anaheim. Burkie knows how to make big trades. We already have a bunch of young players and a number of on the cusp prospects. There is no demand for a high flight prospect right now. It would be nice but it's not critical by any means.

Now, from what I understood from Burke, it's not that the draft is only 7 players deep, but that the first 7 are special talents, and he's probably right. I don't know who his 7th guy is, but there is a franchise center, potentially 4 franchise defenseman, and a potential elite first like center. But, after that, it's not like the rest are second rounders. From what I can gather, the top 12 or so are all pretty decent players, and even some after that could also be pretty decent. So, we'll just have to trust Burke and see what he does on draft day. If the pick is in the top 7, then we know we're getting one of those "special players", so we can only pray.

What holes? Our top-6 consists by next season will consist of no less than three players under the age of 23 and another that's 28. Pronger, Frankie, and Husky have a ton of good years left. Jiggy is solid and under contract for three more years and Hiller is looking good and is only 26. As far as prospects go we have Salcido and Mikkelson waiting in the wings with Mitera only a year or two behind them. Carter, Miller and Wirtanen all could be full-time NHLers next season and Levassuer is only 21. Plus we have guys like MacMillian, Swan, Belesky, Tangradi and even Pesonen down the pipeline.

But regardless of all that, this team is built through trades and free agency anyway. I'm more interested in seeing which college prospect McNab is going to sign this spring than the pick we are going to take. I expect this team to start to move into the Detroit/New Jersey mold of building a team: Not caring too deeply on first rounders and scouting late round picks heavily. Free agents want to play in Anaheim. Burkie knows how to make big trades. We already have a bunch of young players and a number of on the cusp prospects. There is no demand for a high flight prospect right now. It would be nice but it's not critical by any means.

It depends on your theory for building a team. I believe that if you plan on staying competitive for the long-term, the vast majority of your building has to come from within. That allows you to cherry pick free agents who are the "perfect fit", rather than picking up talented guys at inflated prices, because they may fill a role in the best case senario.

None of the guys you mention in the pipeline are locks to become full-time NHLers, let alone part of the core. The Ducks are in a great position right now with having youth forming a good part of the core. But, if you have the opportunity to add a blue chip prospect, you have to grab it. Especially considering that, if this franchise continues to be competitive in the near future, opportunities for top-10 talent is going to be very rare.

You can't make good trades without solid assets in your prospect base, and trying to maintain the current level through free agency is a unwise. I understand what you're saying, but I just don't see it that way.

What holes?

Besides the lack of a second line center and a true first line LW, there aren't a whole lot.

as an oiler fan that is what i have been fearing since day one. oiler fans are jumping for joy. I am still predicting the ducks get a top 5 pick and a future superstar with who they draft

The Ducks have a better chance at getting the 30th overall pick rather than a top 5 pick right now.

Besides the lack of a second line center and a true first line LW, there aren't a whole lot.

How about three, four, or five years down the line? Because thats the time-frame we ought to be discussing with high picks.

The Ducks have a better chance at getting the 30th overall pick rather than a top 5 pick right now.

You fail 4th grade math? Unpossible.

The Ducks have a better chance at getting the 30th overall pick rather than a top 5 pick right now.

Yeah, about that..........

How about three, four, or five years down the line? Because thats the time-frame we ought to be discussing with high picks.

Well, seeing as we don't have anyone in the pipeline right now that has the potential to fill those roles (I'm not very high on MacMillan), I'd say those are holes. And we don't have to use that pick. I'd easily trade it and other assets for a top-line goal scoring LW, pending our cap situation at the time. I could see the lack of offense from our D-men being a concern in the future, too. Salcido's got decent offensive skill and I guess Mikkelson can put up points too, but I'm sure what kind of players they will be at the NHL level.

What holes? Our top-6 consists by next season will consist of no less than three players under the age of 23 and another that's 28. Pronger, Frankie, and Husky have a ton of good years left. Jiggy is solid and under contract for three more years and Hiller is looking good and is only 26. As far as prospects go we have Salcido and Mikkelson waiting in the wings with Mitera only a year or two behind them. Carter, Miller and Wirtanen all could be full-time NHLers next season and Levassuer is only 21. Plus we have guys like MacMillian, Swan, Belesky, Tangradi and even Pesonen down the pipeline.

But regardless of all that, this team is built through trades and free agency anyway. I'm more interested in seeing which college prospect McNab is going to sign this spring than the pick we are going to take. I expect this team to start to move into the Detroit/New Jersey mold of building a team: Not caring too deeply on first rounders and scouting late round picks heavily. Free agents want to play in Anaheim. Burkie knows how to make big trades. We already have a bunch of young players and a number of on the cusp prospects. There is no demand for a high flight prospect right now. It would be nice but it's not critical by any means.
What holes? There's lots of holes. Especially since you're the first to beat the "Perry will be gone" drum.

Top line: We have a center (Getzlaf), a LW (Kunitz), and maybe a RW (Perry), who you claim will be gone. 2nd line: We have no LW, no C, and possibly a RW (Ryan), who I'm not convinced will even pan out to fill that role. Beleskey may be a 2nd line LW, and MacMillan may fill C. MAY. None of the other guys seem to even have 2nd line potential.

D is majorly lacking. Beauchemin is an UFA in 2 years, he might not be back. In fact, I'd guess that he's more likely to be gone than Perry by the beginning of 2009-2010. And even if he stays, there's serious question marks about whether he can even anchor a 2nd pairing. He certainly hasn't shown that ability this year. I've been told I'm overly optimistic about Huskins, and I only think he might be a #4. Pronger's still here for 3 years, so we're good there. But there's also no prospects projected to be a #1, and only 1 guy who might be a #2 (Mitera). All the rest of the guys might be 2nd pairing dmen. In fact I'd say defenseman is our biggest prospect gap.

We're still feeling effects from the Pronger trade. You can't rely on trades like that over and over. We need to stock up the pipeline now. Although if the pick nets a long term asset that's fine too. You just can't count on trades like that long term.

As to college guys, I've also said before my theory that we're not going to be able to count on them anymore. Undrafted college guys tend to be of the small, skilled type (Kunitz, Shannon, Dingle, McDonald), that's why they haven't been drafted. But as we've seen with McDonald, Burke's been changing the makeup of the team such that those types of players are finding it harder to have success. Now physical guys like Kunitz, Penner, and Carter seem to be doing OK, but I think those types are rarer than a Krog, Shannon, Dingle, McDonald, etc. I'm worried that our success with our team blueprint will cut us off from one of the very things that's helped us to success.

As to later round picks, have you seen our record with picks? Sure it seems better recently, but historically we've been pretty bad. Heck, even our 2nd rounders don't seem to be that good, I believe the league average is for about 50% to become NHL players. From 93 to 2003 (10 picks... we didn't have one in 03), we've had 4 guys play more than 100 games, only 3 who are currently in the NHL (Cullen, Bryz, Leopold).

The Ducks have a better chance at getting the 30th overall pick rather than a top 5 pick right now.

last year the oilers went down like the titanic---looking at there schedule--the wheeks are abuot to fall off and the slot will improove in short order

last year the oilers went down like the titanic---looking at there schedule--the wheeks are abuot to fall off and the slot will improove in short order

Are you kidding? You think they are going to be caught by one of the bottom 5 teams right now? A bottom 5 team would have to go 8-0 and have the Oilers go like 3-5 to pass them.

Are you kidding? You think they are going to be caught by one of the bottom 5 teams right now? A bottom 5 team would have to go 8-0 and have the Oilers go like 3-5 to pass them.

Ok we get it, you love Edmonton, they are amazing and will go 8-0 their last 8.

Now go away or contribute to the issue at hand, which is who to take and what holes to fill at our current draft position.

Now as an outsider I think the ducks needs should draft d with 2 out of the three picks they got from the oilers--I am bias and I like D--Pronger will be around for awhile. But Nieds and Schneider are looking at the door already or will be in the next few years and the ducks need to get guy in the system before it is too late. I know the ducks have two guys that look to be good, but I look at the guys who are after them in the depth chart and get concerned. Ducks could land one of the top d-men in the draft--looks like teams are eyeing the fw's and a d-man could slip through. Ducks have some very gifted FW on the team and I think the long term d(beyond 5 years) need to be addressed

What holes? There's lots of holes. Especially since you're the first to beat the "Perry will be gone" drum.

COULD be gone. Could be. His injury changes a lot.

Top line: We have a center (Getzlaf), a LW (Kunitz), and maybe a RW (Perry), who you claim will be gone. 2nd line: We have no LW, no C, and possibly a RW (Ryan), who I'm not convinced will even pan out to fill that role. Beleskey may be a 2nd line LW, and MacMillan may fill C. MAY. None of the other guys seem to even have 2nd line potential.

Those are holes (hole actually, only a second line center needs to be filled) that won't be addressed via the draft. You don't make picks for holes in your lineup. You make picks for pieces for the future. Yeah we needed a top line center and winger in 03 and happened to draft Getzlaf and Perry but than Fedorov and Prospal were signed. Our pipeline is pretty good right now. Not great and we're still going to draft someone I'm sure. But we have solid prospects in each area. Maybe not all-star quality but pretty good.

D is majorly lacking. Beauchemin is an UFA in 2 years, he might not be back. In fact, I'd guess that he's more likely to be gone than Perry by the beginning of 2009-2010. And even if he stays, there's serious question marks about whether he can even anchor a 2nd pairing. He certainly hasn't shown that ability this year. I've been told I'm overly optimistic about Huskins, and I only think he might be a #4. Pronger's still here for 3 years, so we're good there. But there's also no prospects projected to be a #1, and only 1 guy who might be a #2 (Mitera). All the rest of the guys might be 2nd pairing dmen. In fact I'd say defenseman is our biggest prospect gap.

So Frankie can't be re-signed in two years? Is it foolish to think Huskins can at least continue how he's playing for at least a few more years? Have we not acquired each and every member of our blueline through trades and free agency not the draft? We may not have a stud defensive prospect in the pipeline but Salcido, Mikkelson and Mitera all could be solid. Pronger could be here for a decade and another stud d-man can be acquired.

We're still feeling effects from the Pronger trade. You can't rely on trades like that over and over. We need to stock up the pipeline now. Although if the pick nets a long term asset that's fine too. You just can't count on trades like that long term.

How so? I mean I can see the effects every game with Prongs on the ice obviously. But we have a better player in Perry taking Lupes' spot. The solid d-line in the league for which Smid would find no space. And both our picks that Edmonton has had/will have were higher than where we drafted/will draft. I don't see any ill effects at all? Unless that big silver thing we won last June is a bad thing.

As to college guys, I've also said before my theory that we're not going to be able to count on them anymore. Undrafted college guys tend to be of the small, skilled type (Kunitz, Shannon, Dingle, McDonald), that's why they haven't been drafted. But as we've seen with McDonald, Burke's been changing the makeup of the team such that those types of players are finding it harder to have success. Now physical guys like Kunitz, Penner, and Carter seem to be doing OK, but I think those types are rarer than a Krog, Shannon, Dingle, McDonald, etc. I'm worried that our success with our team blueprint will cut us off from one of the very things that's helped us to success.

I have faith in him. Dingle might not turn out to be much but neither was Penner in his first pro year. Carter took a while too. I think he'll make a good pickup in the college ranks.

As to later round picks, have you seen our record with picks? Sure it seems better recently, but historically we've been pretty bad. Heck, even our 2nd rounders don't seem to be that good, I believe the league average is for about 50% to become NHL players. From 93 to 2003 (10 picks... we didn't have one in 03), we've had 4 guys play more than 100 games, only 3 who are currently in the NHL (Cullen, Bryz, Leopold).

I look at the last few drafts as a measuring stick for that and unfortunately most of our picks haven't gotten to the big show yet. But a lot are looking really favorable like Salcido, Mikkelson, Belesky, Wirtanen, Swan and Tangradi. Again Pesonen might find a spot on this roster next year and he was a 9th round pick. But this is how elite teams operate. They fill holes through free agency and trades and make smart picks. The Ducks are going to make a lot of picks to fill the needs of this organization. It just that no one we pick in June NEEDS to turn out to be anything for a couple of years and we won't be banking on them to studs. That's all.

COULD be gone. Could be. His injury changes a lot.
(bleh, I lost my original post and had to retype)
Well I was of the impression that you thought more strongly than that. My mistake.

I will say that I think circumstances like injury have much less effect than most people think, or like it would to me if I were a GM. Just look at how Bertuzzi got a 2 year, guaranteed contract, or Forsberg's trade return.
Those are holes (hole actually, only a second line center needs to be filled) that won't be addressed via the draft. You don't make picks for holes in your lineup. You make picks for pieces for the future. Yeah we needed a top line center and winger in 03 and happened to draft Getzlaf and Perry but than Fedorov and Prospal were signed. Our pipeline is pretty good right now. Not great and we're still going to draft someone I'm sure. But we have solid prospects in each area. Maybe not all-star quality but pretty good.
No, it's holes plural. #2 center, #2 LW, and 1 or 2 top 6 RWs (Perry may be gone, Ryan may bust). And I'm not sure the prospects we have are much different than any other team has. I don't think the pipeline is "pretty good." I don't necessarily mean we need to fill the holes directly with the picks, but it's certainly cheaper (trade value and/or cap-wise) to fill the holes internally.

(OT)As to holes and picks, I really think people who shout "BPA!!!" are underestimating the role that position plays. Yes it would be dumb to say "we need a defenseman" and look exclusively at defensemen. But I suspect that many other factors go into choosing who a team thinks will be the "best player." Such as: playing style (Ducks forechecking), personality/work ethic, and position. If a team really needed a defenseman (and not at the NHL level, but in terms of the prospect pool), I think that any defensemen would get a few extra points compared to forwards when determining who will make the biggest impact.
So Frankie can't be re-signed in two years? Is it foolish to think Huskins can at least continue how he's playing for at least a few more years? Have we not acquired each and every member of our blueline through trades and free agency not the draft? We may not have a stud defensive prospect in the pipeline but Salcido, Mikkelson and Mitera all could be solid. Pronger could be here for a decade and another stud d-man can be acquired.
Of course Frankie could be re-signed. But it'd be foolish to not at least consider the possibility that he could go to UFA. And like I said, even if he did stay, he hasn't shown this year to be anything more than a #4 (complementary 2nd pairing guy), so there's certainly some question marks. And Huskins continuing how he's been playing would mean a #6. Not exactly cornerstones for our D. A stud Dman will certainly not be cheap to trade for. That's probably the hardest thing to get on the trade market.
How so? I mean I can see the effects every game with Prongs on the ice obviously. But we have a better player in Perry taking Lupes' spot. The solid d-line in the league for which Smid would find no space. And both our picks that Edmonton has had/will have were higher than where we drafted/will draft. I don't see any ill effects at all? Unless that big silver thing we won last June is a bad thing.
I mostly meant that we're still missing draft picks in this draft because of the trade. But also there are some effects in that we haven't had our 1st round picks for the past 2 seasons. The only reason we got picks is because we traded or "traded" 2 big parts of the original future plan. And just look at how hard up we are for an NHL-ready Dman or forward right now. We're lacking in prospect depth, especially NHL ready guys and in top-end guys.

I'm with Ken. I think a team in the cap world needs a constant stream of good NHL talent, either to fill in for guys who get too expensive to keep, or as chips in making a trade.
I have faith in him. Dingle might not turn out to be much but neither was Penner in his first pro year. Carter took a while too. I think he'll make a good pickup in the college ranks.

Yeah we'll see. It's just a hypothesis.
I look at the last few drafts as a measuring stick for that and unfortunately most of our picks haven't gotten to the big show yet. But a lot are looking really favorable like Salcido, Mikkelson, Belesky, Wirtanen, Swan and Tangradi. Again Pesonen might find a spot on this roster next year and he was a 9th round pick. But this is how elite teams operate. They fill holes through free agency and trades and make smart picks. The Ducks are going to make a lot of picks to fill the needs of this organization. It just that no one we pick in June NEEDS to turn out to be anything for a couple of years and we won't be banking on them to studs. That's all.
Sure the recent drafts look good so far. But so did say Mark Popovic, or Michael Holmqvist, or even Chistov. I've long learned not to count my chickens before they're hatched. I'm optimistic that our drafting has improved, but I'll wait until they make the NHL before I declare things are better. I also think the days of being able to reliably get a Lidstrom, a Datsyuk, or a Zetterberg late in the draft are gone. Detroit was a pioneer in scouting guys in Europe, now all teams look there much more intensely. Also, the 2 year rule in the new CBA will REALLY limit the ability to draft raw guys late and have them blossom.

As to "a lot of picks," we don't have a lot of picks. Burke's been trading away a lot of them. For example, a 3rd (rumored to be Edmonton's) for MAB, or both of our 7ths. If we don't have a lot of the low probability type picks, it'd be really nice if we got a good asset with the Edmonton picks.

Ok we get it, you love Edmonton, they are amazing and will go 8-0 their last 8.

Now go away or contribute to the issue at hand, which is who to take and what holes to fill at our current draft position.

I was talking about topic at hand. That is the thread title. I do NOT think the Oilers go to the playoffs, I do NOT think they go 8-0 in there last 8. They will probably go 4-4 and you will get probably the 10th pick in the draft. I was just stating that there is a BETTER chance of getting the 30th pick than the 5th pick. If anyone wanted to wager on that, I would. I wasnt here talking trash. I/WE know who the better team is and thats the Ducks, just because I am an Oilers fan doesnt mean I cant DISCUSS something. Good luck to you.

Ok we get it, you love Edmonton, they are amazing and will go 8-0 their last 8.

Now go away or contribute to the issue at hand, which is who to take and what holes to fill at our current draft position.

So as a question to a moderator, it's ok for the first guy to say the Oilers are going to start sinking...but it's not ok for someone to respond back, saying it would take a lot of losses to sink that bad? As a moderator you need to have a level of regularity.

So as a question to a moderator, it's ok for the first guy to say the Oilers are going to start sinking...but it's not ok for someone to respond back, saying it would take a lot of losses to sink that bad? As a moderator you need to have a level of regularity.


yeah--- as if mods on the oiler board don't toss an elbow every so often and cause some posters to run crying home to mummy. This is the ducks board and oiler fans who want troll over here--the mods will be the ones doing the fighting--t save the duck fans from fighting a silly battle.

So as a question to a moderator, it's ok for the first guy to say the Oilers are going to start sinking...but it's not ok for someone to respond back, saying it would take a lot of losses to sink that bad? As a moderator you need to have a level of regularity.

All to often this season if there was mere mention of Edmonton playing poorly and Anaheim subsequently getting a top 5 pick from it, 25 edmonton fans would come over here and start a war.

Such events have left me sour towards you and your fans. SO this is the reaction you get. I am sure Duck fans have gone over to the Oilers board to troll and talk about the pick/Penner, but my job is to handle these boards.

So you guys are going to have to excuse me when I jump to conclusions. Pretty much anytime I see an Oiler post here, no matter what, I try to get them out as quick as possible so I don't have to shut down a thread like I have done so many times before.

So as a question to a moderator, it's ok for the first guy to say the Oilers are going to start sinking...but it's not ok for someone to respond back, saying it would take a lot of losses to sink that bad? As a moderator you need to have a level of regularity.
You don't think a post like...
The Ducks have a better chance at getting the 30th overall pick rather than a top 5 pick right now.
...was trolling?

Defend their honor!
http://www.laceysarabians.com/images/stallions/Vader-rear-250.jpg

Defend their honor!
http://www.laceysarabians.com/images/stallions/Vader-rear-250.jpg

Sometimes I wonder about you...

Its very simple,
The edmonton trolls are gonna come over here, just as the duck trolls have come to the oiler board..

There very simple to handle..
Ignore function....

The mod who wrote that comment, come on.... your a mod, you represent the ducks board, and reading stuff like that, regardless of how warrented it is, is not right... Not saying anything bad about you, but seeing how cloned runs out board, he does a VERY good job, and still does, even with the trolls, more less, leaving sour grapes in his mouth..

now to why I’m posting,
i come over and read what you guys think of the pick, to really find what the few knowledgeable people have to say, do i want you to get a top pick? no... will you get a top pick? two months ago i would have said yes.... but now its not looking as such, and I’m curious to see what the best course of action is gonna be for the ducks?

history says you have drafted well, even late, but this is still mostly the fruitation of brian murrays team... i personally think burke is over rated, especially after seeing him run the nucks', and an arguement can be made about the moves he did make.

So what should be done with the pick? i dont know if burke will keep it if its outa the top 7. If he does trade it, who does he trade it to? and what do you get?

I really think when the ducks didnt have sel or neids, it exposed alot of weakness’s, would it make sense to go for hossa, and trade the pick(s) to get another top end puck moving d?

not a troll, just really curious to what you think you should do with our picks...

So as a question to a moderator, it's ok for the first guy to say the Oilers are going to start sinking...but it's not ok for someone to respond back, saying it would take a lot of losses to sink that bad? As a moderator you need to have a level of regularity.

It is not that, if you look at the quote it is just plain ol' illogical.

OK, there is only a super small chance the Oilers are going to win the Cup this year, so there is only a super small chance of the Ducks getting the 30th pick. Unless he was talking about the Ducks pick if we win the Cup a 2nd time.

There is a 50/50 chance that our draft pick that we got from you will be in the top 5. For if the Oilers end up in the bottom 9 teams, with the lottery, we can move up to a top 5 pick.

So for him saying we have a BETTER chance picking 30th than the top 5 is incorrect. Not saying it 'cant' happen, but 'better' is just not true, no matter how much of a homer you are.

SoB

Its very simple,
The edmonton trolls are gonna come over here, just as the duck trolls have come to the oiler board..

There very simple to handle..
Ignore function....

The mod who wrote that comment, come on.... your a mod, you represent the ducks board, and reading stuff like that, regardless of how warrented it is, is not right... Not saying anything bad about you, but seeing how cloned runs out board, he does a VERY good job, and still does, even with the trolls, more less, leaving sour grapes in his mouth..

now to why I’m posting,
i come over and read what you guys think of the pick, to really find what the few knowledgeable people have to say, do i want you to get a top pick? no... will you get a top pick? two months ago i would have said yes.... but now its not looking as such, and I’m curious to see what the best course of action is gonna be for the ducks?

history says you have drafted well, even late, but this is still mostly the fruitation of brian murrays team... i personally think burke is over rated, especially after seeing him run the nucks', and an arguement can be made about the moves he did make.

So what should be done with the pick? i dont know if burke will keep it if its outa the top 7. If he does trade it, who does he trade it to? and what do you get?

I really think when the ducks didnt have sel or neids, it exposed alot of weakness’s, would it make sense to go for hossa, and trade the pick(s) to get another top end puck moving d?

not a troll, just really curious to what you think you should do with our picks...

Yeah, you're gonna make a lot of people happy with that. How is it up on your horse?

Yeah, you're gonna make a lot of people happy with that. How is it up on your horse?


its actually quite nice...... :D :yo:


but seriously, are you gonna give me your thoughts?

history says you have drafted well, even late, but this is still mostly the fruitation of brian murrays team... i personally think burke is over rated, especially after seeing him run the nucks', and an arguement can be made about the moves he did make.

So what should be done with the pick? i dont know if burke will keep it if its outa the top 7. If he does trade it, who does he trade it to? and what do you get?

The role of the GM in the draft process is sometimes overstated. If anything, it seems like the GM is more or less the moderator between all the scouts and other player development personnel. As I understand it, the guys in charge of the Ducks' drafts are basically the same guys who did it before Burke was hired?

The general manager's focus is on the NHL team, so I doubt many of the GMs around the league really get to catch many of the junior players outside of the major tournaments and maybe a spot viewing on an offday in Canada or something.

It's impossible to tell now what the Ducks might do. The draft order is still in flux. But I'd expect the Ducks to come out with a decent prospect one way or another.


I really think when the ducks didnt have sel or neids, it exposed alot of weakness’s, would it make sense to go for hossa, and trade the pick(s) to get another top end puck moving d?

not a troll, just really curious to what you think you should do with our picks...

Any team is going to show "weakness's" when they don't have a potential Norris trophy guy on D and their leading scorer from the previous season.

Hossa probably doesn't fit since the Ducks will have to give Corey Perry quite a nice pay raise as is. Ideally you're trying to build a prospect pipeline to replace guys who get older. You can't really replace a Teemu Selanne, but you can hope Bobby Ryan can be a productive 2nd liner in the near future.

by the way, what is the news on bobby ryan? i am not too familiar on him?

i heard all the hype leading up to him?

are the ducks taking him slow? or is he a little over hyped for what he can bring? is he your robbie schremp? lol

i would have though he would be in the show by now.

by the way, what is the news on bobby ryan? i am not too familiar on him?

i heard all the hype leading up to him?

are the ducks taking him slow? or is he a little over hyped for what he can bring? is he your robbie schremp? lol

i would have though he would be in the show by now.

The Ducks are taking him slow, because they can afford to. He's been behind Selanne and Perry in the depth chart for a scoring-line position.

He's "in the show" presently, and displays good tools. He needs to develop the mental part of his game, and figure out how to apply his incredible skill set at the pro-level against men. I wouldn't say he was "overhyped". He got attention for being selected after Crosby, but I don't think there was any hype that actually compared him to that level a player.

by the way, what is the news on bobby ryan? i am not too familiar on him?

i heard all the hype leading up to him?

are the ducks taking him slow? or is he a little over hyped for what he can bring? is he your robbie schremp? lol

i would have though he would be in the show by now.
You come into this thread whining, insulting ducks fans, insulting our moderator, and are not willing to use the search button?

You are a class act.

You come into this thread whining, insulting ducks fans, insulting our moderator, and are not willing to use the search button?

You are a class act.


Not once did i whine, but thank you.. This goes to further my "few" comment, dont have anything productive to add?, i am sure there is something you could better your efforts towards :D :yo:


But the reason i asked, It ties into the oilers pick. Would the ducks be interested in moving ryan and the oilers pick for a more proven player? I was a little surprised not to see him stick around at the begining of the year, when there was no teemu...

When will ryan make that jump on the curve?, players of his calibour, unless staying in college, are usually playing the year after there drafted....

Is he gonna be worth holding on to? or do you trade him and get players now, and make it worth while, well the ducks are still a force, and push to win a few cup in a row?

Not once did i whine, but thank you.. This goes to further my "few" comment, dont have anything productive to add?, i am sure there is something you could better your efforts towards :D :yo:
Sure you did, you whined about a mod using sarcasm against a troll. Too bad, get over it. As far as calling me unknowledgeable, you are being a bit of a troll in this thread to make such claims.

But the reason i asked, It ties into the oilers pick. Would the ducks be interested in moving ryan and the oilers pick for a more proven player? I was a little surprised not to see him stick around at the begining of the year, when there was no teemu...

When will ryan make that jump on the curve?, players of his calibour, unless staying in college, are usually playing the year after there drafted....

Is he gonna be worth holding on to? or do you trade him and get players now, and make it worth while, well the ducks are still a force, and push to win a few cup in a row?
There is still a search engine that will tell you what Duck fans think of Ryan as there have been many threads and hundreds of posts about him and his playing. To summarize them all because you are too lazy to use the search engine is not my job. If you wish to make a point about him you can do your own research. I will tell you that I gave my thoughts about his recent playing in another thread...today.

As Burke has said all along, if there is a good hockey deal for the pick or Ryan he will do it, if it is not a good hockey deal then he will not do it. We can not really comment about a trade without seeing the whole trade.

Not to defend the guy, but is search working for people? Keyword search has been broken for me since they re-enabled search. For example, when I try to search for "Ryan" in the Ducks boards, it returns "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms."

I know searching for posts by a user works fine. It's just key word search I have problems with.

Anyone feel like trying it out and seeing if we need to contact somebody?

by the way, what is the news on bobby ryan? i am not too familiar on him?

i heard all the hype leading up to him?

are the ducks taking him slow? or is he a little over hyped for what he can bring? is he your robbie schremp? lol

i would have though he would be in the show by now.
Bobby Ryan has never been overhyped, there have been far more critics of him on this board than backers. So far he's shown flashes of great hands and vision, his play in the defensive zone is 10 times better than it was at the beginning of the year, which shows the guy has a good work ethic...which many said he lacked.

Also even if this pick ends up 8/9/10 that is still really good value for a guy who has 42 points right now.

Not to defend the guy, but is search working for people? Keyword search has been broken for me since they re-enabled search. For example, when I try to search for "Ryan" in the Ducks boards, it returns "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms."

I know searching for posts by a user works fine. It's just key word search I have problems with.

Anyone feel like trying it out and seeing if we need to contact somebody?

Last time I heard, the search bar was down. It isn't working for me either.

Anyway, not all of us Oiler fans are bad. I was a member of ALLDUCKS.COM and Marshy's (Adam, not sure what his name is on ALLDUCKS anymore) original board with Pixie_Dawn.

Some of us are actually good people and are just here to talk hockey. :yo:

Not to defend the guy, but is search working for people? Keyword search has been broken for me since they re-enabled search. For example, when I try to search for "Ryan" in the Ducks boards, it returns "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms."

I know searching for posts by a user works fine. It's just key word search I have problems with.

Anyone feel like trying it out and seeing if we need to contact somebody?
A general search for "Bobby Ryan" works for me, just not the search of just the Ducks board. But since he is not talked about by many teams it is not that bad.

I will say that I think circumstances like injury have much less effect than most people think, or like it would to me if I were a GM. Just look at how Bertuzzi got a 2 year, guaranteed contract, or Forsberg's trade return.

Yeah but those are vets who have much more proven track records with either the teams or GMs who signed them. I think also how much Perry cooled off right before his injury will affect the situation too. We'll see.

No, it's holes plural. #2 center, #2 LW, and 1 or 2 top 6 RWs (Perry may be gone, Ryan may bust). And I'm not sure the prospects we have are much different than any other team has. I don't think the pipeline is "pretty good." I don't necessarily mean we need to fill the holes directly with the picks, but it's certainly cheaper (trade value and/or cap-wise) to fill the holes internally.

No, hole. Just a second line center. Kunitz and Bertuzzi are your top two LWs. Perry (or whomever he'd be traded for) and Ryan will be the top two RW's if Teemu retires. The only hole is filling Doug Weights spot. That could be filled through free agency or someone moves up in the lineup. Regardless, even if we draft a center he's at least two years away from being an everyday player and maybe three from being a top line player if ever. I imagine Burkie will go with the best player available that fits in his system.

Of course Frankie could be re-signed. But it'd be foolish to not at least consider the possibility that he could go to UFA. And like I said, even if he did stay, he hasn't shown this year to be anything more than a #4 (complementary 2nd pairing guy), so there's certainly some question marks. And Huskins continuing how he's been playing would mean a #6. Not exactly cornerstones for our D. A stud Dman will certainly not be cheap to trade for. That's probably the hardest thing to get on the trade market.

But that's how Burkie builds his team. He signed Schneider last summer. Whose to say he can't do it again summe after next? Plus I think Pronger is going to be a Duck for a decade. He relocated his family here permanently and we'd be crazy not to lock him up for the long haul. We've had the luxury of having two all-world d-men but having just one is still more than fine.

I mostly meant that we're still missing draft picks in this draft because of the trade. But also there are some effects in that we haven't had our 1st round picks for the past 2 seasons. The only reason we got picks is because we traded or "traded" 2 big parts of the original future plan. And just look at how hard up we are for an NHL-ready Dman or forward right now. We're lacking in prospect depth, especially NHL ready guys and in top-end guys.

Top end guys maybe but we're stacked with NHL ready or near NHL ready prospects. I think Carter, Miller and Wirtanen could all be regulars next season. Salcido and Mikkelson could see a lot of games next year. We have top end talent all-ready in the lineup whom are really young. I have no problem retocking the cupboard but we're not in any trouble though. Also our pick last year and this year may have been lost but they were both replaced by better picks. I don't see any problem here. Considering how good we've been the last two seasons it's amazing the positions we've been able and will be able to draft at.

Sure the recent drafts look good so far. But so did say Mark Popovic, or Michael Holmqvist, or even Chistov. I've long learned not to count my chickens before they're hatched. I'm optimistic that our drafting has improved, but I'll wait until they make the NHL before I declare things are better. I also think the days of being able to reliably get a Lidstrom, a Datsyuk, or a Zetterberg late in the draft are gone. Detroit was a pioneer in scouting guys in Europe, now all teams look there much more intensely. Also, the 2 year rule in the new CBA will REALLY limit the ability to draft raw guys late and have them blossom.

I mentioned the players from the last few drafts because they were drafts under Burke's watch. I feel his guidance is stocking our ranks with better prospects than we've ever had. But yeah we'll have to see.

As to "a lot of picks," we don't have a lot of picks. Burke's been trading away a lot of them. For example, a 3rd (rumored to be Edmonton's) for MAB, or both of our 7ths. If we don't have a lot of the low probability type picks, it'd be really nice if we got a good asset with the Edmonton picks.

Which just goes to show how Burke feels about draft picks and I agree with him which really brings me to my whole point. If you can improve your roster NOW by trading picks than do it. Only rebuilding teams have to desperately rely on draft picks. We are a winner and don't have to rely on young players. That's why Bobby Ryan is only being inched along right now. We don't have to rush him at all.

We have guys to replace the Robbie Niedermayers, Travis Moen's, Todd Marchant's and Sammy Pahlsson's waiting in the wings. We also have top end guys like Getzlaf, Perry, Kunitz and Ryan all very young. We also have a GM that makes great trades and free agent signings. The one area where this team doesn't have to make tough decisions is in the draft. And thank God for that.

Its very simple,
The edmonton trolls are gonna come over here, just as the duck trolls have come to the oiler board..

There very simple to handle..
Ignore function....

The mod who wrote that comment, come on.... your a mod, you represent the ducks board, and reading stuff like that, regardless of how warrented it is, is not right... Not saying anything bad about you, but seeing how cloned runs out board, he does a VERY good job, and still does, even with the trolls, more less, leaving sour grapes in his mouth..

now to why I’m posting,
i come over and read what you guys think of the pick, to really find what the few knowledgeable people have to say, do i want you to get a top pick? no... will you get a top pick? two months ago i would have said yes.... but now its not looking as such, and I’m curious to see what the best course of action is gonna be for the ducks?

history says you have drafted well, even late, but this is still mostly the fruitation of brian murrays team... i personally think burke is over rated, especially after seeing him run the nucks', and an arguement can be made about the moves he did make.

So what should be done with the pick? i dont know if burke will keep it if its outa the top 7. If he does trade it, who does he trade it to? and what do you get?

I really think when the ducks didnt have sel or neids, it exposed alot of weakness’s, would it make sense to go for hossa, and trade the pick(s) to get another top end puck moving d?

not a troll, just really curious to what you think you should do with our picks...

First of all let me say that our mods do a VERY GOOD job as well. The Ducks, along with the Flyers, have definitely been the most criticized team this year. We have constant trolls coming here and the mods have done a great job handling it. Also, I for one do not like to use the ignore buttton. Occasionally it causes confusion when reading a post and its not worth ignoring a number of people. I'm not saying I won't use it, but one thread is not going to make me use it. If we ignored the numerous amount of trolls coming to our boards, then we would not be able to read 1/8th of the post on HFboards.

Most of us like to hear other fans opinions as well, as long as they are in reason and are not just mouthing off. This is the Ducks board so when we're extremely heated about something, we're going to vent here. Don't criticize the mods, because honestly I wouldn't blame them for closing the thread the second an oiler fan mouths off, because like the Prof said, it turns into a war. Keep it civil and the conversation will be fine. There's a few "bad apples" here, but like you said, there is on every team's board.

As for your question: Right now it's impossible to even guess what the Ducks are going to do. The big reason again is because of Selanne and S.Niedermayer. If Scotty stays then Schneider will be dealt for sure and the Ducks would just use the pick, no matter where the pick was. Honestly I believe the Ducks will hold onto the pick even if Selanne and Scotty both call it quits next year. This would be the lineup with out the two next year:
Bertuzzi-Getzlaf-Perry
Kunitz-FA-Ryan
Moen-Pahlsson-R.Niedermayer
Carter-Marchant-Parros/May

Pronger-O'Donnell
Beauchemin-Schneider
Huskins-Bergeron (FA if MAB is let go)

Jiggy
Hiller

The Ducks will pick up a second line center in free agency. I fully expect B.Ryan to be starting on our 2nd line next year. Burke will trade for a player if he struggles, although I expect him to do well there.

Lastly: You said the team was exposed with out S.Niedermayer and Selanne. Like someone else said, when you lose arguably the best defensmen in the game, and a 40 goal scorer, you're going to be exposed in those areas.

Not once did i whine, but thank you.. This goes to further my "few" comment, dont have anything productive to add?, i am sure there is something you could better your efforts towards :D :yo:


But the reason i asked, It ties into the oilers pick. Would the ducks be interested in moving ryan and the oilers pick for a more proven player? I was a little surprised not to see him stick around at the begining of the year, when there was no teemu...

When will ryan make that jump on the curve?, players of his calibour, unless staying in college, are usually playing the year after there drafted....

Is he gonna be worth holding on to? or do you trade him and get players now, and make it worth while, well the ducks are still a force, and push to win a few cup in a row?

The main things for bobby ryan have been his skating, his defense and his confidence level.

They've worked on his defense a lot this year in Portland, his skating is getting better, but the main thing holding him back in my opinion is his level of confidence. He appears nervous a lot on the ice and I think that the Ducks are mainly waiting for him to feel comfortable playing in the NHL.

Also a large part has to do with how much depth we have right now. The organization can afford to take their time with him, because we don't have a vital need for him outside of injuries. My guess is that he will be playing in the NHL full time in a season or two, if not with us, with another team.

No, hole. Just a second line center. Kunitz and Bertuzzi are your top two LWs. Perry (or whomever he'd be traded for) and Ryan will be the top two RW's if Teemu retires. The only hole is filling Doug Weights spot. That could be filled through free agency or someone moves up in the lineup. Regardless, even if we draft a center he's at least two years away from being an everyday player and maybe three from being a top line player if ever. I imagine Burkie will go with the best player available that fits in his system.
Wrong kind of hole. I'm talking about long term holes. Bertuzzi will be with the team next season, then he's an UFA and may leave. And I want him gone when that contract is up, possibly even before that. Yes we need a UFA for next season's top 6, not the pick. But long term we have lots of holes in the system.
But that's how Burkie builds his team. He signed Schneider last summer. Whose to say he can't do it again summe after next? Plus I think Pronger is going to be a Duck for a decade. He relocated his family here permanently and we'd be crazy not to lock him up for the long haul. We've had the luxury of having two all-world d-men but having just one is still more than fine.
Burke built his defense through free agency simply because the Ducks have never had a top defensive prospect come through the system. Who's the best guy we've EVER drafted? Tverdovsky has the most upside. Other than that it's Salei or Havelid. That's downright pathetic.

I think you're pointing at what Burke had to do as evidence of what Burke would like to do. And yes, you can fill in some D spots with free agents and trades. But there's only a certain fraction of the team that it's feasible to fill with UFAs (too expensive), and acquiring proven talent through trades costs many pieces (for example if we want 1 proven defenseman, it'll cost say 3 prospects/picks who could have filled multiple holes long term). Especially if you think we're going to start filling in forward holes (#2 center) with UFAs, it'll make it extremely difficult to also fill in the holes on defense with UFAs.

And you know what's preventing Burke from getting another "Schneider"? The cap. As it is we don't have enough cap space to retain our team next season. It's going to take some serious juggling to fit a UFA #2 center in. And that's assuming we can spend to the cap, which I think is a flawed assumption.
Top end guys maybe but we're stacked with NHL ready or near NHL ready prospects. I think Carter, Miller and Wirtanen could all be regulars next season. Salcido and Mikkelson could see a lot of games next year. We have top end talent all-ready in the lineup whom are really young. I have no problem retocking the cupboard but we're not in any trouble though. Also our pick last year and this year may have been lost but they were both replaced by better picks. I don't see any problem here. Considering how good we've been the last two seasons it's amazing the positions we've been able and will be able to draft at.
We're not stacked with NHL-or near NHL-ready guys for all positions. We have 0 guys who can contribute offensively (just see how hard it's been all season to find some secondary scoring with Ebbett, Platt, Bochenski, Miller, King, Mowers, and Ryan all trying and failing. This may just be your optimism vs my pessimism, but I think our cupboard is pretty bare. You seem to think we're flush with guys.

The picks were "replaced" by better picks. But at what cost? We got those picks by moving Penner and O'Brien. I'd say it comes out roughly even, and it doesn't come close to losing the assets lost for the Pronger trade.
Which just goes to show how Burke feels about draft picks and I agree with him which really brings me to my whole point. If you can improve your roster NOW by trading picks than do it. Only rebuilding teams have to desperately rely on draft picks. We are a winner and don't have to rely on young players. That's why Bobby Ryan is only being inched along right now. We don't have to rush him at all.

We have guys to replace the Robbie Niedermayers, Travis Moen's, Todd Marchant's and Sammy Pahlsson's waiting in the wings. We also have top end guys like Getzlaf, Perry, Kunitz and Ryan all very young. We also have a GM that makes great trades and free agent signings. The one area where this team doesn't have to make tough decisions is in the draft. And thank God for that.
Yes we're in a position where we're, as a whole, willing to move some picks/prospects to improve the current roster. Because we're in a competitive phase of rebuilding. But if you continue to do that you're damning yourself to a long rebuild phase afterward, as well as shortening your window of success. But the best case scenario is to have a consistently competitive team. If we don't make really good use of the Edmonton picks, that just may not be possible. There's nothing wrong with trading the picks away for long term pieces, but we had better be getting great value, or else be prepared to relive the mid 90s-early 2000s.

I know a lot of this team has been built on UFAs but I am not really sure how long any team can sustain that in this post salary cap era. It is just really hard to support a few $5M+ players without having a horde of first-contract players or scrubs on the team as well. And last year the Senators showed why you need more then one line of good players to win the cup. Their 1 great line + 3 weak lines fell apart once they met a team with a solid checking line like the Ducks.

So basically what I am saying, is that in this hockey era we need those Perrys, Getzlafs and Penners and hopefully Carters/Ryans/Miteras/other prospects we have to fill out a good roster and be competitive. Having good players on your roster on their first contract is more important then ever in the NHL.

Two years ago, we were considered a young team. Remember when we had 8 rookies in our lineup two years ago. Our roster today is looking quite old. The Ducks are going to need to keep some of our young talents like Perry, Carter, Ryan, etc. You can't build a team on UFAs not in this cap system.

Wrong kind of hole. I'm talking about long term holes. Bertuzzi will be with the team next season, then he's an UFA and may leave. And I want him gone when that contract is up, possibly even before that. Yes we need a UFA for next season's top 6, not the pick. But long term we have lots of holes in the system.

Okay I see what you're saying but that's a hole for a later time. Bertuzzi might be re-signed, he might be replaced right away. Who knows? That's a problem more than a year for now. You could use that pick to take a kid that might take his spot or a center or what have you. But the draft is such a crap shoot, especially the first round. As far as offensive players are concerned the Ducks have only draft four bona fide top-6 forwards (Kariya, Lupul, Getzlaf and Perry) where the likes of Kilger, Holmqvist, Smirnov and Chistov were busts or trade bait. Ryan may or may not fit on this team and I'm not sold on MacMillan to be an offensive threat. You really just have to go with the best player available.

Burke built his defense through free agency simply because the Ducks have never had a top defensive prospect come through the system. Who's the best guy we've EVER drafted? Tverdovsky has the most upside. Other than that it's Salei or Havelid. That's downright pathetic.

So what are you saying, a d-man prospect has to be a stud or he's a bust? Salei, Havelid and Vishnevski were all solid. They may not have been world-class or anything but they put in a lot of good years with this team. There's not a Pronger or Niedermayer in every draft. In fact they are few and far between.

I think you're pointing at what Burke had to do as evidence of what Burke would like to do. And yes, you can fill in some D spots with free agents and trades. But there's only a certain fraction of the team that it's feasible to fill with UFAs (too expensive), and acquiring proven talent through trades costs many pieces (for example if we want 1 proven defenseman, it'll cost say 3 prospects/picks who could have filled multiple holes long term). Especially if you think we're going to start filling in forward holes (#2 center) with UFAs, it'll make it extremely difficult to also fill in the holes on defense with UFAs.

But draft picks take so long to be effective players. Only the top of the top picks can jump in right away and we aren't getting a pick like that. Draft picks take at least two-three years to develop if at all. In the mean time we need to stay competitive. Detroit and New Jersey, whom have claim six of the last twelve Stanley Cup championships, operate with that mentality. Trade picks if you need to and be real thorough with the ones you pick. I mean, we still will pick a number of players in this draft and the next one and so on. You don't need ALL of them, first rounders included.

And you know what's preventing Burke from getting another "Schneider"? The cap. As it is we don't have enough cap space to retain our team next season. It's going to take some serious juggling to fit a UFA #2 center in. And that's assuming we can spend to the cap, which I think is a flawed assumption.

Well than he'll acquire a d-man that isn't as expensive. Or he'll let some the kids like Salcido, Mikkelson and eventually Mitera take a stab in the lineup. D-men take even longer to develop so assuming any replacement for Schneider should be taken in this draft, which you're not necessarily saying, is foolish.

We're not stacked with NHL-or near NHL-ready guys for all positions. We have 0 guys who can contribute offensively (just see how hard it's been all season to find some secondary scoring with Ebbett, Platt, Bochenski, Miller, King, Mowers, and Ryan all trying and failing. This may just be your optimism vs my pessimism, but I think our cupboard is pretty bare. You seem to think we're flush with guys.

I acknowledged that we don't have any top-end offensive prospects. But bottom six guys we have. But again, we will acquire the offensive players through free agency and trades. I'm sure Burkie will draft a forward because yes we do not have any other top-end offensive prospects after Ryan. But that kid won't be relied upon for a number of years.

The picks were "replaced" by better picks. But at what cost? We got those picks by moving Penner and O'Brien. I'd say it comes out roughly even, and it doesn't come close to losing the assets lost for the Pronger trade.

Assets weren't lost, they were traded. We have one of the top three d-men in the entire league because of trading those assets. O'Brien was a good young player but Huskins is a ton more effective. I'm not sold on MacMillan but you never know. He may end up being another Steve Rucchin but with better hands.

Yes we're in a position where we're, as a whole, willing to move some picks/prospects to improve the current roster. Because we're in a competitive phase of rebuilding. But if you continue to do that you're damning yourself to a long rebuild phase afterward, as well as shortening your window of success. But the best case scenario is to have a consistently competitive team. If we don't make really good use of the Edmonton picks, that just may not be possible. There's nothing wrong with trading the picks away for long term pieces, but we had better be getting great value, or else be prepared to relive the mid 90s-early 2000s.

We still have a number of our picks from the last two drafts that can very well pan out. Also we had the tendency to hold onto a lot of those picks in the early years how well did that turn our for us?

Not to go further off topic but I am not all that convinced Selanne in particular is going to retire.

It is not that, if you look at the quote it is just plain ol' illogical.

OK, there is only a super small chance the Oilers are going to win the Cup this year, so there is only a super small chance of the Ducks getting the 30th pick. Unless he was talking about the Ducks pick if we win the Cup a 2nd time.

There is a 50/50 chance that our draft pick that we got from you will be in the top 5. For if the Oilers end up in the bottom 9 teams, with the lottery, we can move up to a top 5 pick.

So for him saying we have a BETTER chance picking 30th than the top 5 is incorrect. Not saying it 'cant' happen, but 'better' is just not true, no matter how much of a homer you are.

SoB


Hey guys, I am here in peace. I am just talking % chances here. There is NO WAY that its a 50/50 shot of the Ducks getting a top 5 pick. The Oilers are at 10th worst right now and if it ended it would be impossible to finish that high. Now my debate is they could move up or down a few spots, correct? So lets say they get that 8th playoff spot, what are there chances at winning the cup? Maybe 20-1? 5% than. (They did make the cup 2 years ago in that spot. Lets say they finish with the 8th worst record...looking at this chart they have a 4% chance of getting top 5. So really everyone would have to agree the chance of top 5 or 30th overall are BOTH VERY VERY unlikely. I was just stating what I thought was a fact, if you want to argue about 2 or 3 % that is fine. Chart is from 2 years ago, but % is still the same.

The Draft Drawing is a weighted system to give the teams that finished with the fewest points during the regular season the greatest chance of having their combination selected. The Blues, who finished the regular season with the fewest points (57), were assigned the greatest number of combinations, representing a 25% likelihood that their combination would emerge. The Pittsburgh Penguins were assigned 18.8% of the combinations, followed by the Chicago Blackhawks (14.2%) and the Washington Capitals (10.7%). The remaining teams had the following chances: 8.1%, 6.2%, 4.7%, 3.6%, 2.7%, 2.1%, 1.5%, 1.1%, 0.8% and 0.5%.

the oilers seem to be a lost cause...even with all the injuries...i guess us ducks fans can take solace in the fact that w/e comes out of this will b > penner.

Hey guys, I am here in peace. I am just talking % chances here. There is NO WAY that its a 50/50 shot of the Ducks getting a top 5 pick. The Oilers are at 10th worst right now and if it ended it would be impossible to finish that high. Now my debate is they could move up or down a few spots, correct? So lets say they get that 8th playoff spot, what are there chances at winning the cup? Maybe 20-1? 5% than. (They did make the cup 2 years ago in that spot. Lets say they finish with the 8th worst record...looking at this chart they have a 4% chance of getting top 5. So really everyone would have to agree the chance of top 5 or 30th overall are BOTH VERY VERY unlikely. I was just stating what I thought was a fact, if you want to argue about 2 or 3 % that is fine. Chart is from 2 years ago, but % is still the same.

The Draft Drawing is a weighted system to give the teams that finished with the fewest points during the regular season the greatest chance of having their combination selected. The Blues, who finished the regular season with the fewest points (57), were assigned the greatest number of combinations, representing a 25% likelihood that their combination would emerge. The Pittsburgh Penguins were assigned 18.8% of the combinations, followed by the Chicago Blackhawks (14.2%) and the Washington Capitals (10.7%). The remaining teams had the following chances: 8.1%, 6.2%, 4.7%, 3.6%, 2.7%, 2.1%, 1.5%, 1.1%, 0.8% and 0.5%.

since the original post edm have won a couple. it was a valid post at the time. Currently it appears (http://www.sportsclubstats.com/NHL/Western.htm) you have a 1 in 3 chance of a bottom 5 finish in the conference and a 1 in 6 chance of making the playoffs. if we assume that the two conferences end with very similar points for each position (idealistic and untrue i know) then the pick being in the top ten is much more likely than you making the post season and knocking it past 14th.

the most likely is that you will finish 9th/10th in the conference and give us a pick around the 12 region

so granted itis not a 50/50chance of us getting a top 5 pick however i would take issue with you thinking that there is a 1 in 20 chance of winning the cup if you got in the playoffs. granted you got to the final a couple of years ago. but there are 16 teams in the playoffs. saying you have a 1 in 20 chance means you believe you have nearly as good a chance as every other team and i don't think many people will believe that that is true. there will be many bookies happy if you want to bet on the oilers at 20-1 to win the cup once they're in the playoffs. nothing against you but those odds would be laughed at

i guess us ducks fans can take solace in the fact that w/e comes out of this will b > penner.
What makes you say that? The odds of the Ducks getting a player better than Penner aren't exactly stellar if they're picking outside of the top 10. It is certainly possible but go through the draft history and you'll see that the odds of selecting a top line forward diminish greatly once you start picking outside of the top 5.

What makes you say that? The odds of the Ducks getting a player better than Penner aren't exactly stellar if they're picking outside of the top 10. It is certainly possible but go through the draft history and you'll see that the odds of selecting a top line forward diminish greatly once you start picking outside of the top 5.

agreed, but we're not allowed to admit that maybe, just maybe we won't get even value for what we lost. however this does begin to get too close to the beat the dead donkey subject that is penner vs the picks

since the original post edm have won a couple. it was a valid post at the time. Currently it appears (http://www.sportsclubstats.com/NHL/Western.htm) you have a 1 in 3 chance of a bottom 5 finish in the conference and a 1 in 6 chance of making the playoffs. if we assume that the two conferences end with very similar points for each position (idealistic and untrue i know) then the pick being in the top ten is much more likely than you making the post season and knocking it past 14th.

the most likely is that you will finish 9th/10th in the conference and give us a pick around the 12 region

so granted itis not a 50/50chance of us getting a top 5 pick however i would take issue with you thinking that there is a 1 in 20 chance of winning the cup if you got in the playoffs. granted you got to the final a couple of years ago. but there are 16 teams in the playoffs. saying you have a 1 in 20 chance means you believe you have nearly as good a chance as every other team and i don't think many people will believe that that is true. there will be many bookies happy if you want to bet on the oilers at 20-1 to win the cup once they're in the playoffs. nothing against you but those odds would be laughed at

What do you say, 50-1 than? So instead of 5% it would be 2% either way its about the same. Compared to the 50% stated before and the 4% reality. Also since my original post to the post 4 hours ago the Oilers lost to Vancouver and beat Colorado, so really they went 1-1 and didnt improve or get worse.....now they just won again however so really we dont need to get into it anymore anyways.

The Ducks did well with this whole situation considering they were blindsided anyways. Considering you get a 9th-14th overall pick and a 2nd + 3rd for a guy you couldnt afford to sign isnt a bad deal. The way you guys draft that should set you up pretty well and in all reality you wouldnt been able to keep Penner and Perry so really you guys ended up pretty well off.

Brian Burke is an absolute classic! I think his quotes were hilarious talking about Lowe and the Oilers and he has done a great job of turning that team around. He got lucky with the Pronger trade but 28 other GM's could have gotten him but Burke won out and he should get all the credit in the world for that. Oilers fans are/were just upset with Pronger and rightfully so but it shouldnt effect the way they feel about Anaheim as a whole, and the Penner deal just added fuel both ways. its funny how the whole "rivalry" is all based on stuff that has happened OFF the ice and not on it.

What makes you say that? The odds of the Ducks getting a player better than Penner aren't exactly stellar if they're picking outside of the top 10. It is certainly possible but go through the draft history and you'll see that the odds of selecting a top line forward diminish greatly once you start picking outside of the top 5.

Penner isn't exactly a great player sure he had a great season but who knows how many teams will pass on stamkos(no one).

What makes you say that? The odds of the Ducks getting a player better than Penner aren't exactly stellar if they're picking outside of the top 10. It is certainly possible but go through the draft history and you'll see that the odds of selecting a top line forward diminish greatly once you start picking outside of the top 5.

of course i was basing this on assuming that the OILERS lose most of the rest of their games =) :sarcasm:

There is now way you get top 5 pick not even top 10.

There is now way you get top 5 pick not even top 10.

many thanks for the wonderful insight and value you have added to the topic. there is a chance of us getting a top 10 pick. it's called the lottery. the chances of the oilers making the playoffs is still only 22% which means that we still have a 78% chance of being in the lottery for a top ten pick. thus there is 'a way'

There is now way you get top 5 pick not even top 10.

Meh, I'd still give up Penner for a #10-15 pick along with a #40-45 pick and a #70-75pick. Especially with his salary and the Ducks cap/rfa/ufa position right now.

As much as I hate the oilers, I really have to give them props for their play down the stretch. They have come together as a team and playing great. If they keep it up they will probably be in the playoffs which is shocking to everyone given where they were at the trade deadline. However, like many teams before, there is just as much chance they will fall apart. Only time will tell.

Although if they do make the playoffs, I am going to very much enjoy watching them get their butts handed to them.

I am still trying to figure out how the hell they are doing it.........

ducks pick will be around 10th overall--still a good player going back to the ducks

As much as I hate the oilers, I really have to give them props for their play down the stretch. They have come together as a team and playing great. If they keep it up they will probably be in the playoffs which is shocking to everyone given where they were at the trade deadline. However, like many teams before, there is just as much chance they will fall apart. Only time will tell.

Although if they do make the playoffs, I am going to very much enjoy watching them get their butts handed to them.

I wouldn't count on that, if they do make the playoffs they could (and I hope they do) take out the Wings, they will have a ton of momentum, every year there is a Cinderella team and the Oil just might be them.

I wouldn't count on that, if they do make the playoffs they could (and I hope they do) take out the Wings, they will have a ton of momentum, every year there is a Cinderella team and the Oil just might be them.
My psychic powers tell me that the Oilers do not have a chance to beat the Ducks, Dallas, or SJ in a best of 7 playoff series.

I am just not sure who I would wish to lose more...the Wings or the Oil. Since it would be a huge upset, I kinda hope the Wings would lose and then the Oil lose the following round.

My psychic powers tell me that the Oilers do not have a chance to beat the Ducks, Dallas, or SJ in a best of 7 playoff series.

Meh, the Oilers have beaten much better teams than them in the past.

Hey guys, I am here in peace. I am just talking % chances here. There is NO WAY that its a 50/50 shot of the Ducks getting a top 5 pick. The Oilers are at 10th worst right now and if it ended it would be impossible to finish that high. Now my debate is they could move up or down a few spots, correct? So lets say they get that 8th playoff spot, what are there chances at winning the cup? Maybe 20-1? 5% than. (They did make the cup 2 years ago in that spot. Lets say they finish with the 8th worst record...looking at this chart they have a 4% chance of getting top 5. So really everyone would have to agree the chance of top 5 or 30th overall are BOTH VERY VERY unlikely. I was just stating what I thought was a fact, if you want to argue about 2 or 3 % that is fine. Chart is from 2 years ago, but % is still the same.

The Draft Drawing is a weighted system to give the teams that finished with the fewest points during the regular season the greatest chance of having their combination selected. The Blues, who finished the regular season with the fewest points (57), were assigned the greatest number of combinations, representing a 25% likelihood that their combination would emerge. The Pittsburgh Penguins were assigned 18.8% of the combinations, followed by the Chicago Blackhawks (14.2%) and the Washington Capitals (10.7%). The remaining teams had the following chances: 8.1%, 6.2%, 4.7%, 3.6%, 2.7%, 2.1%, 1.5%, 1.1%, 0.8% and 0.5%.

Remember that I wrote that on 3/20. 7 days changes ALOT. After that time you have won 2 games against teams above you in the standings. Had you lost those 2, you would be 8th from bottom with 79 pts and the 3 teams below you would be within 3 points AND games in hand. So easily 50/50 when I wrote it.

But yes now, a week later, it does look like the lottery would be the only way to get into the top 5.

Plus remember that the whole thing started with a guy saying you had a better chance at winning the cup then us getting a top 5 pick, and at that time it was silly.

There is now way you get top 5 pick not even top 10.

Wow. How lucky have we been to be blessed with such knowledgeable visitors to our boards lately?

many thanks for the wonderful insight and value you have added to the topic. there is a chance of us getting a top 10 pick. it's called the lottery. the chances of the oilers making the playoffs is still only 22% which means that we still have a 78% chance of being in the lottery for a top ten pick. thus there is 'a way'

to be in the lottery you have to be in bottom 5, not bottom 15. or bottom 10.
but thnx for the great insight.

to be in the lottery you have to be in bottom 5, not bottom 15. or bottom 10.
but thnx for the great insight.
Flat out wrong. Bottom 14 are in the lottery. kthxbai.

Flat out wrong. Bottom 14 are in the lottery. kthxbai.
Just to expand on this... all teams that are not in the playoffs are in the lotter. However, only the worst 5 teams have a shot at #1 overall.

to be in the lottery you have to be in bottom 5, not bottom 15. or bottom 10.
but thnx for the great insight.

you clearly don't understand what is being said. or don't read what has been put. The lottery isn't just for the bottom 5 teams. it applies to at least the 14 non playoff teams (not sure how it works once the playoffs come into play).

that means that if the oilers aren't in the playoffs then we will always have a shot at a top ten pick. the best you can be if you aren't in the playoffs is 14th last overall. as the lottery allows you to move up a maximum of 4 places that pick could get to 10th

so lets go back to the original statement 'There is now way you get top 5 pick not even top 10.'

as far as i am concerned the 10th overall pick is inside the top 10

Just to expand on this... all teams that are not in the playoffs are in the lotter. However, only the worst 5 teams have a shot at #1 overall.

yes.

You could try to explain the oh-so-complicated "all non-playoff teams are in the lottery to move up 4 picks" rules to the troll, but I'm pretty sure it's a lost cause.

jim: it is only the last 14 teams. The weirdness with playoff teams just affects seeding, but they're still not a part of the lottery. As far as I understand it, playoff teams are grouped into the round they lose, then seeded based on regular season standings.

Meh, I'd still give up Penner for a #10-15 pick along with a #40-45 pick and a #70-75pick. Especially with his salary and the Ducks cap/rfa/ufa position right now.

As a Duck GM I would give up too. That is just mathematics. But as an Oil GM I would have sent offer sheet too because Oilers were in the need of big power forward to replace Smyth. I am believing also that Penner will produce more points than Smyth in his five seasons in oil uniform.

you clearly don't understand what is being said. or don't read what has been put. The lottery isn't just for the bottom 5 teams. it applies to at least the 14 non playoff teams (not sure how it works once the playoffs come into play).

that means that if the oilers aren't in the playoffs then we will always have a shot at a top ten pick. the best you can be if you aren't in the playoffs is 14th last overall. as the lottery allows you to move up a maximum of 4 places that pick could get to 10th

so lets go back to the original statement 'There is now way you get top 5 pick not even top 10.'

as far as i am concerned the 10th overall pick is inside the top 10

so as of today you would have a 0.8% chance of moving up a position in the draft. the lottery is ment for the bottom 5, the chance of 6-14 moving isn't even worth talking about.

so as of today you would have a 0.8% chance of moving up a position in the draft. the lottery is ment for the bottom 5, the chance of 6-14 moving isn't even worth talking about.

read up on stuff before spouting crap.

once 1-9 have been selected then 94.0% of the ball combinations that are used will have gone. if you have a 0.5% of the original ball combinations (from finishing 14th worst) and there are only 6% of the combinations remaining relating to clubs that finished 10-14 then your chance of miving up to 10th is 8.3%, or pretty much EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE ODDS OF MOVING UP FROM 5TH TO 1ST

now go back to whichever board you came from

obobo: cheers, thought that was roughly how it worked but couldn't find much anywhere

read up on stuff before spouting crap.

once 1-9 have been selected then 94.0% of the ball combinations that are used will have gone. if you have a 0.5% of the original ball combinations (from finishing 14th worst) and there are only 6% of the combinations remaining relating to clubs that finished 10-14 then your chance of miving up to 10th is 8.3%, or pretty much EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE ODDS OF MOVING UP FROM 5TH TO 1ST

now go back to whichever board you came from

obobo: cheers, thought that was roughly how it worked but couldn't find much anywhere


I thought they draw 5 balls, look at the number it makes and decide who wins from a pre-determined teams numbers. I'm lost now.

read up on stuff before spouting crap.

once 1-9 have been selected then 94.0% of the ball combinations that are used will have gone. if you have a 0.5% of the original ball combinations (from finishing 14th worst) and there are only 6% of the combinations remaining relating to clubs that finished 10-14 then your chance of miving up to 10th is 8.3%, or pretty much EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE ODDS OF MOVING UP FROM 5TH TO 1ST

now go back to whichever board you came from

obobo: cheers, thought that was roughly how it worked but couldn't find much anywhere

Wow, that first sentence is quite ironic. Only one combination of balls is chosen and the team assigned that combination is the only team to decrease its draft position (or stay the same if they are 1st).

The lottery has never had a winner higher than 8th overall, you guys are dreaming if you think you'll win in the 10-15 spot

read up on stuff before spouting crap.

once 1-9 have been selected then 94.0% of the ball combinations that are used will have gone. if you have a 0.5% of the original ball combinations (from finishing 14th worst) and there are only 6% of the combinations remaining relating to clubs that finished 10-14 then your chance of miving up to 10th is 8.3%, or pretty much EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE ODDS OF MOVING UP FROM 5TH TO 1ST

now go back to whichever board you came from

obobo: cheers, thought that was roughly how it worked but couldn't find much anywhere

so only 2 teams have won the lottery in the 6-15 position in 13 years. maybe u should learn to read and maybe some math while your gettin schooled.

Seriously. Who cares? Maybe we'll get the 30th overall pick. Whatever. I'm more interested in how we do in the playoffs. The draft can wait until after the season is over.

Man, Oilers fans are annoying.

Seriously. Who cares? Maybe we'll get the 30th overall pick. Whatever. I'm more interested in how we do in the playoffs. The draft can wait until after the season is over.

Man, Oilers fans are annoying.

Um, isn't that kinda what the whole point of this topic is? To talk about the pick?

If you're worried about the playoffs there's other threads to talk about that in. If you can't stand the oiler fans, there's always an ignore feature on this site. We're allowed to post here

so only 2 teams have won the lottery in the 6-15 position in 13 years. maybe u should learn to read and maybe some math while your gettin schooled.

granted. i was wrong. i apologise. i was going by something i read elsewhere but i'm going to go with the opinion on here as it appears far more knowledgeable on the whole.

i'd kindly like to know what is wrong with my reading and maths skills though

Um, isn't that kinda what the whole point of this topic is? To talk about the pick?

If you're worried about the playoffs there's other threads to talk about that in. If you can't stand the oiler fans, there's always an ignore feature on this site. We're allowed to post here
No, actually. It's not to talk about what exact place the pick is, or how Penner was totally worth/not worth the pick, or about how an Oiler fan came trying to sound knowledgeable when he actually had no clue how the lottery works. We were talking about the possibility of trading the pick or what kind of holes we should consider filling with the pick. And the thread had died a natural death until someone decided to dredge it up based on the inaccuracy of a statement now that the Oilers have gone on a winning streak. Feel free to post anything relevant to the actual topic.

Isn't it so that the worst five teams will be lottering for the draft position #1-5 with the worst team getting five balls, the second worsest team four balls and so on (which gives the worst team a 33.3% chance of clinching the #1 pick).

Then the teams who ended up 6-10 in the standings get to do the same for draft picks #6-10. And so the teams who ended up 11-15 will be lottering for picks #11-15.

And then the first eight teams to get eliminated from the playoffs gets the next eight picks decided by their position in the regular season. And so the same with the next PO round and the next... Which means the Stanley Cup winner can have a #29 pick as best, depending if they ended up with more/less points in the regular season than their final opponent.

who cares...as long as we add to the pipeline....our team will get old fast

All 14 teams that are eliminated from the playoffs participate in the draft lottery. However, the most a single team's position can increase is 4 positions, so only teams seeded at 1-5 actually have change to receive the #1 pick.

There is only single lottery, with total number of 1.000 combinations (actually 1.001, but the odd one if discounted and the drawing is immediately redone if the odd one is drawn). The combinations are assingned to teams as follows, based on the team's position at the end of season:

30th........... 25.0% (250 combinations)
29th........... 18.8% (188 combinations)
28th........... 14.2% (142 combinations)
27th........... 10.7% (107 combinations)
26th.............8.1% (81 combinations)
25th.............6.2% (62 combinations)
24th.............4.7% (47 combinations)
23rd.............3.6% (36 combinations)
22nd............ 2.7% (27 combinations)
21st.............2.1% (21 combinations)
20th.............1.5% (15 combinations)
19th.............1.1% (11 combinations)
18th.............0.8% (8 combinations)
17th.............0.5% (5 combinations)

The team winning the lottery will move four slots up in draft (naturally 2nd, 3rd and 4th can only move up to 1st). The teams passed by the winning team are then moved one slot down.

Worst team have 48,20 % change of getting the #1 pick, and 51,8 % of getting the #2 pick (and can't get worse pick than that).

As of today, Edmonton is located 19th in the standings, so if the season would end today, Anaheim would receive follwing pick
12th overall (97,60 % change)
13th overall (1,30 % change)
8th overall (1,10 % change)

As comparison, if Edmonton fall's 5 slots (24th in standings), the pick would be:
7th overall (85,40 % change)
8th overall (9,90 % change)
3rd overall (4,70 % change)

^^^^ so it's not nba style lottery?

@ Bobby Smash

No, unlike in NBA, only the worst 5 teams have change to end up with 1st overall pick (in NBA theoretically all 14 non-playoff teams have change to finish within top-3).

Also in NHL team's position can decrease only by one at worst (from 1st to 2nd), whereas in NBA team can fall up to 3 places (from 1st to 4th).

The only similarity between NBA and NHL draft is that both use same 1.001 combinations (4 balls out of 14), but even the distribution of combinations are different (although last team receive same number of combinations in both drafts).

In NHL, the team finishing last overall is in unique position, because it can receive the 1st overall pick in two differect situations:
1.) That teams combination is drawn in the lottery (250 out of 1001)
2.) Combination of team that finished 14th - 25th in league is drawn in the lottery (232 combinations out of 1001 in total).

In NHL lottery, team's position is affected only in two situations:
1.) Team wins the lottery (with exception of last overall team), whereby team gains up to 4 spots.
2.) Team within 4 spots of the team wins the lottery, whereby team decreases 1 slot (as the team behind them gains 4 spots).

In all other situations teams draft pick ends up to correspond to their locations in standings at the end of the season.

All 14 teams that are eliminated from the playoffs participate in the draft lottery. However, the most a single team's position can increase is 4 positions, so only teams seeded at 1-5 actually have change to receive the #1 pick.

There is only single lottery, with total number of 1.000 combinations (actually 1.001, but the odd one if discounted and the drawing is immediately redone if the odd one is drawn). The combinations are assingned to teams as follows, based on the team's position at the end of season:

30th........... 25.0% (250 combinations)
29th........... 18.8% (188 combinations)
28th........... 14.2% (142 combinations)
27th........... 10.7% (107 combinations)
26th.............8.1% (81 combinations)
25th.............6.2% (62 combinations)
24th.............4.7% (47 combinations)
23rd.............3.6% (36 combinations)
22nd............ 2.7% (27 combinations)
21st.............2.1% (21 combinations)
20th.............1.5% (15 combinations)
19th.............1.1% (11 combinations)
18th.............0.8% (8 combinations)
17th.............0.5% (5 combinations)

The team winning the lottery will move four slots up in draft (naturally 2nd, 3rd and 4th can only move up to 1st). The teams passed by the winning team are then moved one slot down.

Worst team have 48,20 % change of getting the #1 pick, and 51,8 % of getting the #2 pick (and can't get worse pick than that).

As of today, Edmonton is located 19th in the standings, so if the season would end today, Anaheim would receive follwing pick
12th overall (97,60 % change)
13th overall (1,30 % change)
8th overall (1,10 % change)

As comparison, if Edmonton fall's 5 slots (24th in standings), the pick would be:
7th overall (85,40 % change)
8th overall (9,90 % change)
3rd overall (4,70 % change)KX5jNnDMfxA

lmao homesick you summed it up perfectly....and now I want to go watch that movie

Now that we will pic around 10-13 what do you think. A lot of experts think that Michael Del Zotto (my 2nd prefered prospect after Schenn we had a real chance at.) will fall so low that we could easily pic him there. Honestly I really love the way he plays and I think he would be the perfect partner for Mitera in the future.

Thanks god we are in the situation where we can wait one or two seasons longer than with other prospects. I really think that Del Zotto is a little bit risky but he has the highes upside of all D prospects.

Josh Bailey would also be great as well. I'm not sold on Myers.

Beach?

Beach?

IMO at that range it seems like he would have the most potential. That said, i don't know too much about the player that will go 10-15.

With the Sabres up 2-0, and needing a point to move past Edm, it looks like we are guaranteed the 12th pick. We need to root for the Canucks tonight, as well as the Hawks tomorrow to get at least a point. Then we will most likely pick 10th.

Seriously. Who cares? Maybe we'll get the 30th overall pick. Whatever. I'm more interested in how we do in the playoffs. The draft can wait until after the season is over.

Man, Oilers fans are annoying.

I find this comment interesting. Since the first half of this season you were on our board an awful lot. Talking about how we were screwed with our RFAs in the coming years and arbitrators would be biased and were going to hose us etc... etc... I even recall one post that was pretty rude and that post and responses to it had to be fairly heavily moderated (the offending bits, were erased in the original post and replies, by a mod as I recall).

We need to root for the Canucks tonight, as well as the Hawks tomorrow to get at least a point. Then we will most likely pick 10th.

The Canucks got blown out by Calgary tonight. I thought it was classy after the game though, led by Iginla, the whole team lined up to shake Trevor Linden's hand in honour of his career (as he is retiring of course).

I find this comment interesting. Since the first half of this season you were on our board an awful lot. Talking about how we were screwed with our RFAs in the coming years and arbitrators would be biased and were going to hose us etc... etc... I even recall one post that was pretty rude and that post and responses to it had to be fairly heavily moderated (the offending bits, were erased in the original post and replies, by a mod as I recall).



The Canucks got blown out by Calgary tonight. I thought it was classy after the game though, led by Iginla, the whole team lined up to shake Trevor Linden's hand in honour of his career (as he is retiring of course).
Picking 1 spot after Vancouver seems to be good luck...go hawks.

So the pick will be 11th or 12th. Not quite what we hoped but should be a good pick anyway in this year's draft.

I find this comment interesting. Since the first half of this season you were on our board an awful lot. Talking about how we were screwed with our RFAs in the coming years and arbitrators would be biased and were going to hose us etc... etc... I even recall one post that was pretty rude and that post and responses to it had to be fairly heavily moderated (the offending bits, were erased in the original post and replies, by a mod as I recall).



The Canucks got blown out by Calgary tonight. I thought it was classy after the game though, led by Iginla, the whole team lined up to shake Trevor Linden's hand in honour of his career (as he is retiring of course).

You do remember the constant Oiler trolls coming over here and ripping Burke on our board. I felt sorry for the mods those days. I'm sure there were a few Duck fans coming to the Oiler board, but I guarantee you there were much more Oiler fans coming over here. Although, that's primarily because there are a lot more Oiler fans on HF boards.

Anyway, basicly we're tired of hearing about the draft pick from other boards. There's been numerous people asking the same questions and trolling the same way. Most of us are to the point now where we don't care what the pick is now. It's going to be a lot better then if it would have been our own, and that's fine with us.

would you guys rather have had mats sundin or the 11th/12th overall pick?

If the same Duck scouting infrastructure that found Getzlaf at 19th and Perry at 28th is in place, you guys will be fine.

I would have find Getzlaf at #19 and Perry at #28 at that time also. Even without seeing one full game of them...it was just their luck hat other GM's/scouts were too stupid to take them before.

Meh, I'd still give up Penner for a #10-15 pick along with a #40-45 pick and a #70-75pick. Especially with his salary and the Ducks cap/rfa/ufa position right now.

Me too. It was the right decision from Burke to let him go.

would you guys rather have had mats sundin or the 11th/12th overall pick?

No! I believe we will get Del Zotto, Mayers or Bailey. All will be here for a long time and I think we will draft the right player (as I said before, Del Zotto ;) )

would you guys rather have had mats sundin or the 11th/12th overall pick?

If we would have known it would have been the 12th pick, then I think a lot of us would probably have traded Sundin straight up for the pick, but it's still not a given. There's a lot of talent in the draft so the pick could still be a great player.

"With the Edmonton Oilers 12th overall pick I am very happy to select..."

Finish the sentance.

My (somewhat) realistic wishlist (some trading up maybe):
1.Schenn
2. Beach
3.Boedker
4. Myers
5. Del Zotto

"With the Edmonton Oilers 12th overall pick I am very happy to select..."

Finish the sentance.

...Joshua Bailey.
So glad it is only the 12th pick. A few weeks ago it looked like the 3rd pick (no Pietrangelo, Doughty, Schenn, Bogosian, Beach, Hodgson or Wilson for you) :p: ;)

...Joshua Bailey.
So glad it is only the 12th pick. A few weeks ago it looked like the 3rd pick (no Pietrangelo, Doughty, Schenn, Bogosian, Beach, Hodgson or Wilson for you) :p: ;)

Technically, there's still a chance the pick could go as high as 8th, or as low as 13th.

Technically, there's still a chance the pick could go as high as 8th, or as low as 13th.

Yeah, but very low chances.
Don't become to greedy. You should already thank god for Lowe...

WHo cares, your a top team fighting for a back to back Cup, and you have a top pick in the draft! You have a bunch of great prospects, your team is just sick!

WHo cares, your a top team fighting for a back to back Cup, and you have a top pick in the draft! You have a bunch of great prospects, your team is just sick!


really?

Technically, there's still a chance the pick could go as high as 8th, or as low as 13th.

Its about a 1% chance each way, but 1%>0% if it makes you feel better.

If we end up with Schenn, I would jump all over the place like a kid.

You do remember the constant Oiler trolls coming over here and ripping Burke on our board. I felt sorry for the mods those days. I'm sure there were a few Duck fans coming to the Oiler board, but I guarantee you there were much more Oiler fans coming over here. Although, that's primarily because there are a lot more Oiler fans on HF boards.

Anyway, basicly we're tired of hearing about the draft pick from other boards. There's been numerous people asking the same questions and trolling the same way. Most of us are to the point now where we don't care what the pick is now. It's going to be a lot better then if it would have been our own, and that's fine with us.

Indeed. Good for the Oilers for picking up the pace, but Ducks fans can't really be that down because there is nothing this franchise could have done to slow Edmonton. The Ducks had to focus on winning their own games, and they did well enough to earn home-ice in the 1st round of the playoffs. Sure, we'd all like a lottery pick, but I'm still glad our pick will be much better than if it were ours (it will already be better than last year's pick Burke traded for, as well).

From the main board thread, it seems as if most Oiler fans are overjoyed with being 19th in the league. I don't get the "eat that Ducks fans" commments when it's our Ducks going into the playoffs 4th overall, again being favorited by many to win it all again. You'd think it was the Ducks in the 19th spot, and Oilers in 4th w/ some of those comments. I highly doubt Burke is even thinking about the pick right now. If anything, it's just a minor disappointment that it wasn't a bit higher, and there's still a great chance he'll move this pick.

Every one has seemed to forget Mr. Bugg's "Merry Christmas Anaheim" thread, in which there were several predictions that Edmonton would finish ahead of Anaheim :naughty:

Indeed. Good for the Oilers for picking up the pace, but Ducks fans can't really be that down because there is nothing this franchise could have done to slow Edmonton. The Ducks had to focus on winning their own games, and they did well enough to earn home-ice in the 1st round of the playoffs. Sure, we'd all like a lottery pick, but I'm still glad our pick will be much better than if it were ours (it will already be better than last year's pick Burke traded for, as well).

From the main board thread, it seems as if most Oiler fans are overjoyed with being 19th in the league. I don't get the "eat that Ducks fans" commments when it's our Ducks going into the playoffs 4th overall, again being favorited by many to win it all again. You'd think it was the Ducks in the 19th spot, and Oilers in 4th w/ some of those comments. I highly doubt Burke is even thinking about the pick right now. If anything, it's just a minor disappointment that it wasn't a bit higher, and there's still a great chance he'll move this pick.

Every one has seemed to forget Mr. Bugg's "Merry Christmas Anaheim" thread, in which there were several predictions that Edmonton would finish ahead of Anaheim :naughty:

Yes, I will admit I thought the Oilers would finish ahead of the Ducks. But I did not think Neids or Teamu would be back, they played pretty crappy without them. I hated the Penner signing though, and still do not like the money we are paying him. 12th overall will most likely not be a better player then he is, but he is nowhere near worth the money.

Looking towards next year. Good luck guys in the playoff's. I like this matchup and will watch all the games.

I posted this on allducks too:

Does anyone remember that there was a rumor PHX will help us somehow because we gave up Bryz for nothing to them? Now they got their #1 goalie and I think it will be fair that the following will happen:

To ducks #1 pic of PHX 8th overall
To PHX #1 pic + low level prospect.

I can really see something like this. If PHX will win the lottery it won't happen. What do you think.

Btw. does anyone beside me think that Del Zotto will fall to us and that he would be an awesome pic?

Btw. does anyone beside me think that Del Zotto will fall to us and that he would be an awesome pic?

I think there are definitely more "safe" picks that we could make, but if he reaches the great offensive potential he has shown in Oshawa, Del Zotto would be a perfect compliment to our two top dman prospects (Mitera, Mikkelson) who both play a more two-way style.

I posted this on allducks too:

Does anyone remember that there was a rumor PHX will help us somehow because we gave up Bryz for nothing to them? Now they got their #1 goalie and I think it will be fair that the following will happen:

To ducks #1 pic of PHX 8th overall
To PHX #1 pic + low level prospect.

I can really see something like this. If PHX will win the lottery it won't happen. What do you think.

Btw. does anyone beside me think that Del Zotto will fall to us and that he would be an awesome pic?

No, anyone who thinks there is some handshake deal is kidding themselves. I seriously doubt we make any kind of deal with Phoenix on draft day.

If there were any kind of handshake deal, it would have been cashed in long ago, either with clearing cap space for Niedermayer, or in lieu of one of our many other trades (MAB, Leach, Aubin, dealing Hnidy).

Even when I thought there would be some kind of favor due, I certainly never expected anything of real value. Moving up from 12 to 8 would require roughly a 2nd round pick, there's no chance we get that. The only other possibility I could see is maybe Phoenix might take a cheap dead-weight salary away from us to help clear some tagging room (Bergeron, May, etc) after the season's over. In essence, low value "future considerations."

Number 12 pick last 10 years:

Ryan McDonagh (prospect)
Bryan Little (2nd line center for Atlanta next year)
Marc Staal (Defensive defensman with high upside, NHL regular)
AJ Thelen (bust)
Hugh Jessiman (bust, though this is an outlier for this draft)
Steve Eminger (7th defensman, serviceable)
Dan Hamhuis (Good offensive defensman for Nashville)
Alex Smirnov (bust)
Denis Shvidki (bust)
Alex Tanguay (perennial 70+ point player other than this year)
Marian Hossa (Two way winger with 90+ point potential)

Obviously a lot of hits and misses here, but you'll find that everywhere in the draft. Almost every single one of these players has at least seen the NHL however, and with this draft being touted as almost as strong as 03 I think we can get someone fairly productive if our scouts do their homework. However, the question is what is Burke looking for? Last year he went off the board to select Logan Mac because of his intangibles, will he do the same at #12 or take the best player available?

Another thing to watch for is the possibility of a trade either up or down. I wouldnt be surprised to see a guy like either Schneider or Beauchemin traded along with the pick to move up in the draft as well as for cap relief, or see him package the pick along with a roster player to get a 2nd line center.

Its about a 1% chance each way, but 1%>0% if it makes you feel better.

We still have a chance but I think that pick will be good during the draft. No matter where our pick is.

Does anyone remember that there was a rumor PHX will help us somehow because we gave up Bryz for nothing to them? Now they got their #1 goalie and I think it will be fair that the following will happen:

To ducks #1 pic of PHX 8th overall
To PHX #1 pic + low level prospect.


If it was a normal trade I could see similar future considerations.

Unfortunately due to the special circumstances that landed Phoenix Bryzgalov, in addition to both teams being in the same division, this scenario is highly unlikely.

"With the Edmonton Oilers 12th overall pick I am very happy to select..."

Finish the sentance.

Boychuk or Kyle beach

Boychuk or Kyle beach

Beach :yo:

My money is on Kyle Beach. IMO, with our prospect development crew, he will become a very good player.

I seriously doubt that Beach will drop that low

With the Edmonton Oilers 12th overall pick I am very happy to select...

Michael Del Zotto :handclap:

With the Edmonton Oilers 12th overall pick I am very happy to select...

Michael Del Zotto :handclap:

What's the deal with Del Zotto, I've seen some people hype this guy pretty highly. Burkeish player?

What's the deal with Del Zotto, I've seen some people hype this guy pretty highly. Burkeish player?

Found this thread from a while back on him:

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=463551&

Seems like he possesses some of the most offensive potential out of the dmen in the upcoming draft but carries a higher risk-factor than others that are generally ranked ahead of him. In some other threads, several people have predicted him to be the still of the draft.