Anaheim's Defence

Francios beauchmin- Scott Niedermayer
Mathieu Schneider - Chris Pronger
Sean Od'donnel - Kent Huskins


anyone got anything different.

I'd think if O'Donnell stays he'll continue playing with Pronger. That said, Schneider would be a very pricey 3rd liner. Solution = trade him. :sarcasm:

god why do people want to trade schneider?

A) With Schneider on the roster Nieds doesn't have to play nearly as much and we get big players on both PP lines. We also are garunteed to have the most talented defense in the league by a large margin.

B) Niedermayer probably won't come back next season. Then what do we do, no Schneider , no Niedermayer. We've already seen what that's like.

god why do people want to trade schneider?

A) With Schneider on the roster Nieds doesn't have to play nearly as much and we get big players on both PP lines. We also are garunteed to have the most talented defense in the league by a large margin.

B) Niedermayer probably won't come back next season. Then what do we do, no Schneider , no Niedermayer. We've already seen what that's like.

Agreed. Although, I think the first pairing and second pairing should be swapped, Pronger/Schneider as the top and Nieds/Beauch as the second because I'm not too sure what kind of shape Scott will be in.

agreed. lets keep schneider, and just dump marchant. that defense is AWESOME.

I think that at least for the first few games back Nieds should be eased in with huskins on the third pairing. After a few games I think the permanent lines should be:

Pronger/Schneider
Niedermayer/beauchemin
Huskins/O'donnell

I think these combos will be absolutely killer. It pairs a puck moving defenseman with a stay at home defenseman. A continuous line of Pronger/Schneider will be seriously killer, Niedermayer/Beauchemin will be exactly what it was last year, and then O'donnell will provide a big lift over whoever was playing with Huskins previously.

I just don't see enough minutes for that kind of defense. It seems like inefficient use of cap. I'd really prefer a good defenseman be flipped for a good forward. The team should be stronger that way.

I just don't see enough minutes for that kind of defense. It seems like inefficient use of cap. I'd really prefer a good defenseman be flipped for a good forward. The team should be stronger that way.

What needs to be considered is the special teams play. We'd be able to roll much stronger PP and PK teams, not to mention that we'd have a defensive rotation with much more energy throughout the game. And to be honest our special teams have been our weakest point so far. This will provide a definite boost.

A puck mover/stay at home defenseman in every pairing is going to equate to better offense. Not to mention that Bertuzzi and Mac seem to be putting together some chemistry. I'm not too worried about acquiring a winger as long as we keep this defense set up.

I think when Neids comes back there will be more Hnidy and less Huskins because he is more stay at home.


Neids-Beauch
OD-Pronger
Hnidy-Schneider

Like it or not folks one of Schneider, Beauchemin or O'Donnell is going to be traded. Burkie said he needs to move one of them for cap purposes in regards to next year and one of them has to go.

Now I know what you're thinking right away: Trade OD. He's the least talented out of the three and will be missed the least. Well he also has the smallest pay check and the least trade value. Schneids makes a lot of money and would be the most ideal to move cap wise. Franky has incredible value and could get an amazing return. But the sounds of it Scotty is coming back for next season too otherwise why worry about next year's cap? If that's the case than I can definitely see Franky moved. It would make things better for the team if Schneider is moved but he has a hefty contract and that will be tough without taking back a big contract. My money is on Burkie trying hard to move Schneids but ends up with Frankie instead. I'd hate to see him go but it's a business and Burke has to get the best return possible.

But one of those three will be traded.

Like it or not folks one of Schneider, Beauchemin or O'Donnell is going to be traded. Burkie said he needs to move one of them for cap purposes in regards to next year and one of them has to go.

Now I know what you're thinking right away: Trade OD. He's the least talented out of the three and will be missed the least. Well he also has the smallest pay check and the least trade value. Schneids makes a lot of money and would be the most ideal to move cap wise. Franky has incredible value and could get an amazing return. But the sounds of it Scotty is coming back for next season too otherwise why worry about next year's cap? If that's the case than I can definitely see Franky moved. It would make things better for the team if Schneider is moved but he has a hefty contract and that will be tough without taking back a big contract. My money is on Burkie trying hard to move Schneids but ends up with Frankie instead. I'd hate to see him go but it's a business and Burke has to get the best return possible.

But one of those three will be traded.

or we dump marchant and any one of DiPenta and Hnidy.

Just because we need to make room doesn't mean we need to give up one of our good D men.

I think when Neids comes back there will be more Hnidy and less Huskins because he is more stay at home.


Neids-Beauch
OD-Pronger
Hnidy-Schneider

Huskins is 1000X better than Hnidy. Just because Hnidy fights doesnt make him better.

or we dump marchant and any one of DiPenta and Hnidy.

Just because we need to make room doesn't mean we need to give up one of our good D men.

No one is going to take Marchant otherwise he would have been traded long ago. We also will have one too many d-men. Burke won't pay over 1 mil for a 3rd pairing d-man that I can assure you. One of them will be traded, Burke said himself a trade is coming.

But the sounds of it Scotty is coming back for next season too otherwise why worry about next year's cap?

Nope. Scott has committed to coming back this year only, with no comment on whether he'll play next year. Next year's cap is a complicated CBA issue. The gist of it is they don't want you exceeding the cap next year when making a roster move involving players signed past this year. However it's way more complicated than that (and isn't calculated anything like how you'd expect based on the premise).

But the practical ramifications is Niedermayer can't come back until the Ducks clear ~1 million dollars.

But I agree a Dman will go. Although it is possible it's a lesser defenseman and it's a forward who goes to clear salary.

But the sounds of it Scotty is coming back for next season too otherwise why worry about next year's cap?

You worry about it because the CBA says you have to. It doesn't imply anything one way or the other about Niedermayer playing next season.

god why do people want to trade schneider?

A) With Schneider on the roster Nieds doesn't have to play nearly as much and we get big players on both PP lines. We also are garunteed to have the most talented defense in the league by a large margin.

B) Niedermayer probably won't come back next season. Then what do we do, no Schneider , no Niedermayer. We've already seen what that's like.


Add my voice to the chorus of "agreed", especially for point B. If we trade Schneider, we'll simply find ourselves in the same situation that necessitated signing him in the first place. Scotty won't be back next year (I'm guessing) and then we'll need to go out and replace him again.

This may be considered blasphemy, but perhaps the trade bait we should be looking at is Andy McDonald. I love the guy and I'd miss him, but he has a healthy price tag that he's not exactly earning this year (although that assist to Bertuzzi last night was a masterpiece). Just putting it out there for discussion's sake.

Like it or not folks one of Schneider, Beauchemin or O'Donnell is going to be traded. Burkie said he needs to move one of them for cap purposes in regards to next year and one of them has to go.

Now I know what you're thinking right away: Trade OD. He's the least talented out of the three and will be missed the least. Well he also has the smallest pay check and the least trade value. Schneids makes a lot of money and would be the most ideal to move cap wise. Franky has incredible value and could get an amazing return. But the sounds of it Scotty is coming back for next season too otherwise why worry about next year's cap? If that's the case than I can definitely see Franky moved. It would make things better for the team if Schneider is moved but he has a hefty contract and that will be tough without taking back a big contract. My money is on Burkie trying hard to move Schneids but ends up with Frankie instead. I'd hate to see him go but it's a business and Burke has to get the best return possible.

But one of those three will be traded.


Scotty has a contract for next season whether he plays or not (he won't). Look up "tagging".

Someone has to be moved before Nieds can even suit up.

I think its quite obvious that OD is the most likely to get dealt. He's only a top 4 at this stage because he's paired with Pronger. He's a solid 3rd pairing, but not at his salary. I do think we will miss his toughness but we could do without the penalties and is not in our long term plans. I think theres atleast a couple teams that would give a 2nd/3rd for him.

According to Bob Mckenzie at TSN, The Ducks will have to clear approx 3 Million in Salary before Scotty can come back.

Pronger - Niedermayer
Schneider - Beauchemin
O'Donnell - Huskins

Trade Marchant (if possible) and put Hnidy on waivers...

I think when Neids comes back there will be more Hnidy and less Huskins because he is more stay at home.


Neids-Beauch
OD-Pronger
Hnidy-Schneider

paying schneider that much and having him in a 3rd pairing makes no sense to me... imo but, he would also see pk and pp time... but, i see him being moved or playing in a higher pairing.

Pronger - Niedermayer
Schneider - Beauchemin
O'Donnell - Huskins

Trade Marchant (if possible) and put Hnidy on waivers...

But whoever replaces Marchant is going to have a salary. Even if it is a guy at league min I still don't think you've cleared up enough room.

Marchant wouldn't have many takers. Maybe the Coyotes would take pity. You think.

Our D is awesome.

According to Bob Mckenzie at TSN, The Ducks will have to clear approx 3 Million in Salary before Scotty can come back.
And according to David McNab, the Ducks' assistant GM in charge of cap stuff, it's roughly 1 million. Who do you trust more? McNab's statement is apparently where the Register and Times got the figure of 1 million that they published today.

And according to David McNab, the Ducks' assistant GM in charge of cap stuff, it's roughly 1 million. Who do you trust more? McNab's statement is apparently where the Register and Times got the figure of 1 million that they published today.

I trust that the right thing will be done.

And according to David McNab, the Ducks' assistant GM in charge of cap stuff, it's roughly 1 million. Who do you trust more? McNab's statement is apparently where the Register and Times got the figure of 1 million that they published today.

My guess: If just over one million is needed to clear, O'Donnell is traded. If it's over 3 million, Schneider is gone.

if a player is waived, can the club save his salary (cap-wise)?

And according to David McNab, the Ducks' assistant GM in charge of cap stuff, it's roughly 1 million. Who do you trust more? McNab's statement is apparently where the Register and Times got the figure of 1 million that they published today.

well according to http://salaries.hockeyanalysis.com/teams/anaheim.php, the Ducks have approx 53,232,000 tagged for next year. The cap is 50,300,000. So it looks like 3 million to me.

well according to http://salaries.hockeyanalysis.com/teams/anaheim.php, the Ducks have approx 53,232,000 tagged for next year. The cap is 50,300,000. So it looks like 3 million to me.

Yeah but you can also be 5% over the cap until the start of the season I believe. So with Scotty retiring at the end of the year that won't be a problem. It will be a problem re-signing Perry though.

well according to http://salaries.hockeyanalysis.com/teams/anaheim.php, the Ducks have approx 53,232,000 tagged for next year. The cap is 50,300,000. So it looks like 3 million to me.

Possible to be gone.
Todd Marchant 2,500,000
Travis Moen 912,500 sad
Shane Hnidy 757,500
Joe Dipenta 700,000

Yeah but you can also be 5% over the cap until the start of the season I believe. So with Scotty retiring at the end of the year that won't be a problem. It will be a problem re-signing Perry though.

You can't use that with tagged salaries because you don't know what the 08/09 cap will be yet.

Problem with trading OD and/or Marchant is nobody wants them. Every GM knows Burkie has to shed salary and won't take his bottom-tier players. Schneider is a likely candidate because he is talented, is scoring a lot this year and makes almost as much as Scotty. If not him than definitely Frankie because teams will definitely want the league's ice-time leader who only makes 1.5 mil.

It's a business folks. These guys will be nothing but cap-casualties. What's best for the team right now is getting Scotty in the lineup and that means somebody has to go and teams want the good players. Nobody is going to do Burke any favors to get one of the best d-men in the league back on his team.

well according to http://salaries.hockeyanalysis.com/teams/anaheim.php, the Ducks have approx 53,232,000 tagged for next year. The cap is 50,300,000. So it looks like 3 million to me.
Entirely true. Now read the CBA and find out what the definition of tagged salary is. It's expiring salary - new acquisitions. According to my calculations it should be 1.3 million acording to nhlnumbers.com and 850k by nhlscap (the 500k is due to salary discrepency of Hiller's salary in the 2 sites).

I think the difference between 3 million and 1 million is due to savings from Niedermayer's suspension, where he doesn't count in in terms of "tagging" because he's not an expiring or extended contract.

Possible to be gone.
Todd Marchant 2,500,000
Travis Moen 912,500 sad
Shane Hnidy 757,500
Joe Dipenta 700,000

I just don't think you want to empty out the cupboard like that just to keep Schneider. I think trying to pick up a good defensemen during the summer would be a better alternative. Maybe it's just me though.

I just don't think you want to empty out the cupboard like that just to keep Schneider. I think trying to pick up a good defensemen during the summer would be a better alternative. Maybe it's just me though.
What do I know Thats why I said possible.
It's seems pointless to get rid of him.

Entirely true. Now read the CBA and find out what the definition of tagged salary is. It's expiring salary - new acquisitions. According to my calculations it should be 1.3 million acording to nhlnumbers.com and 850k by nhlscap (the 500k is due to salary discrepency of Hiller's salary in the 2 sites).

I think the difference between 3 million and 1 million is due to savings from Niedermayer's suspension, where he doesn't count in in terms of "tagging" because he's not an expiring or extended contract.

If I understand your thought (which I might not I'm a little tired today) I don't think the current year savings on Neids prorated salary change his tagged salary for next year. The Hockey News has Anahiems Tagged salary for next year is also 53,232,000.00.

Entirely true. Now read the CBA and find out what the definition of tagged salary is. It's expiring salary - new acquisitions. According to my calculations it should be 1.3 million acording to nhlnumbers.com and 850k by nhlscap (the 500k is due to salary discrepency of Hiller's salary in the 2 sites).

I think the difference between 3 million and 1 million is due to savings from Niedermayer's suspension, where he doesn't count in in terms of "tagging" because he's not an expiring or extended contract.


Obo, I think you're wrong on this. The tagging issue deals entirely with the Cap number. There is no savings from Niedermeyer's suspension with respect to the Cap for either this year or next year's tagged numbers. So I think McKenzie's number of $3 million is closer to the truth.

or we dump marchant and any one of DiPenta and Hnidy.

Just because we need to make room doesn't mean we need to give up one of our good D men.
It either has to be Schneider or Marchant + a lower priced D man

No one will take Marchant at $2.5, so...your prolly smart enough to figure what's the most likely choice.

Don't forget Perry is a RFA after this year, and your cap space is tighter then a virgin's *****.

If I understand your thought (which I might not I'm a little tired today) I don't think the current year savings on Neids prorated salary change his tagged salary for next year. The Hockey News has Anahiems Tagged salary for next year is also 53,232,000.00.

well who cares about next year right now?

If I understand your thought (which I might not I'm a little tired today) I don't think the current year savings on Neids prorated salary change his tagged salary for next year. The Hockey News has Anahiems Tagged salary for next year is also 53,232,000.00.
Yeah I have no idea why tagged salary is 1 million and not 3 million, I'm too lazy to really go through the comparison to find out. The other possibility is because the Ducks are over cap now with Hiller's bonuses, but I don't think that's it because Hiller is an expiring salary.

The key to note is that the Ducks roster right now, including Niedermayer, is OVER the cap if they had played all 82 games as such. The sum of the 23 players in Anaheim as of today is 52.9 million. It's allowed to be such because a) some of that is 2.4 million of Hiller's bonuses and b) Niedermayer was suspended for roughly 1/3 of the year, saving roughly 2 million.

I'll preface the rest of the post by saying I'm not 100% sure on the following because the CBA referring to this issue is incredibly dense. If you don't believe me read the first post http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=450630.

As far as I can figure the definition of tagged salary is NOT the salary that is owed next year, it is the salary of a) multiyear UFAs signed after Dec 1st b) multiyear players acquired through trade/waivers c) contract extensions. The amount of tagged salary has to be less than the amount of expiring contracts.

The Ducks have 9 million in tagged salary (Kunitz + Getzlaf). They have roughly 8 million in expiring salary (Hiller, Sutherby, Miller, Perry, Kunitz, Getzlaf, Wright buyout). Expiring salary is different depending on the sites. Thus to comply to the tagging rule they need to shed roughly 1 million. Feel free to do the calculations with whatever numbers you have for salary.

All the media, as far as I can tell, are taking tagged salary to mean "next year's commitments." The concept of tagging is to prevent the teams from committing over the cap, but it's definition is something slightly different.

well who cares about next year right now?

It's not a matter of me caring one way or the other. Next years tagged salary (whatever it is) can not exceed the current years Salary Cap. Therefore the Ducks must move Salary out prior to Scotty coming back because their tagged salaries for next year exceed this years cap.

Add my voice to the chorus of "agreed", especially for point B. If we trade Schneider, we'll simply find ourselves in the same situation that necessitated signing him in the first place. Scotty won't be back next year (I'm guessing) and then we'll need to go out and replace him again.

This may be considered blasphemy, but perhaps the trade bait we should be looking at is Andy McDonald. I love the guy and I'd miss him, but he has a healthy price tag that he's not exactly earning this year (although that assist to Bertuzzi last night was a masterpiece). Just putting it out there for discussion's sake.
Andy is not going to be traded, when/if Selanne comes back McDonald will finally have a goal scorer to pass too, just have to be patient with him.

Marchant wouldn't have many takers. Maybe the Coyotes would take pity. You think.

Our D is awesome.

Wouldn't they just wave Marchant anyways?
I doubt many teams out there would want to spend 2.47m this year and 2.66m next on Marchant anymore even if it's off waivers.

It's not a matter of me caring one way or the other. Next years tagged salary (whatever it is) can not exceed the current years Salary Cap. Therefore the Ducks must move Salary out prior to Scotty coming back because their tagged salaries for next year exceed this years cap.

Thatis a pretty strange rule. you know?

Huskins is 1000X better than Hnidy. Just because Hnidy fights doesnt make him better.


Really 1000x :amazed:

Obo, I think you're wrong on this. The tagging issue deals entirely with the Cap number. There is no savings from Niedermeyer's suspension with respect to the Cap for either this year or next year's tagged numbers. So I think McKenzie's number of $3 million is closer to the truth.

McKenzie has since retracted that statement. Tagged salary is apparently the single most confusing aspect of any major sporting league I've ever seen. Somehow, because of prorated salaries, including Mowers getting waived and Bryz getting claimed by Phoenix and Hiller playing, Anaheim gets some sort of tagging room bonus, so they only have to cut $800k or so,

I don't get it either, but apparently Dave McNab does, so that's good enough for me.

Really 1000x :amazed:

Yeah...

But it's not a linear scale.:sarcasm:

Possible to be gone.
Todd Marchant 2,500,000
Travis Moen 912,500 sad
Shane Hnidy 757,500
Joe Dipenta 700,000

Darren Dreger has this out on TSN (from a couple of days ago):

"Scott Niedermayer's return to the Ducks creates a cap issue next season that has to be dealt with to facilitate his leap back to the NHL.

Veteran defenceman Mathieu Schneider is rumoured to be the target and according to management sources, there is a market for the 38-year-old who's making $5.5 million this year and $5.75 million next year."

Burke was also quoted in the Register saying he expects no issue making a trade and there is plenty of interest. Obviously no details beyond that.

Don't forget that aside from working around the tagging issue, he's got to create cap space for Perry. Probably the only good way to do both is trading Schneider.

Don't forget that aside from working around the tagging issue, he's got to create cap space for Perry. Probably the only good way to do both is trading Schneider.

Yup. There's going to be a huge cap problem next year. While people couldn't correctly calculate the tagging space needed for next year, they were correct in that the club has 53 million committed for 18 players next year. Burke will have to move some moajor salary eventually.

Although besides trading Schneider, it's possible Niedermayer retires for real next season.

Although besides trading Schneider, it's possible Niedermayer retires for real next season.

If I could get decent value for Schneider, I'd take that risk. Any delay in signing Perry because of uncertainly about Niedermayer is a can worms that doesn't need to get opened.

If I could get decent value for Schneider, I'd take that risk. Any delay in signing Perry because of uncertainly about Niedermayer is a can worms that doesn't need to get opened.

I agree. And by decent value I mean a mid level pick/prospect.

Huskins has been great and stepped up a bit. I would much rather have him than O'donnell or Hnidy.

Schnieder needs to stay. But if Teemu is to return and we are to sign Perry, he will have to go.

Im holding my breath and hoping that Burke pulls a rabbit out of his hat.

Huskins has been great and stepped up a bit. I would much rather have him than O'donnell or Hnidy.

Schnieder needs to stay. But if Teemu is to return and we are to sign Perry, he will have to go.

Im holding my breath and hoping that Burke pulls a rabbit out of his hat.
Last game when Hnidy was paired was Schneider was imo evidence that Hnidy would get the nod before Huskins
OD-Pronger will not be broken up
Neids-Beuch will not be broken up
that leaves Schneider - and it would be stupid to pair him with another offensive minded D-man like Huskins
Huskins will probably be the one who gets traded and Joey D as 7th D-man.
If Teemu signs it will only be 1 year

Last game when Hnidy was paired was Schneider was imo evidence that Hnidy would get the nod before Huskins
OD-Pronger will not be broken up
Neids-Beuch will not be broken up
that leaves Schneider - and it would be stupid to pair him with another offensive minded D-man like Huskins
Huskins will probably be the one who gets traded and Joey D as 7th D-man.
If Teemu signs it will only be 1 year

haha don't count on it. Plus I really doubt that we pay a guy 5 million dollars to be on our bottom pairing. And no way does Huskins get the nod over Hindy.

IDK, I hope we keep Schnieder.

I really like the way Huskins has been carrying the puck and keeping his head up out there. Hnidy has been ok lately but was horrid early on. I think Huskins has a real chance of being GOOD in a few years.

Agreed. Although, I think the first pairing and second pairing should be swapped, Pronger/Schneider as the top and Nieds/Beauch as the second because I'm not too sure what kind of shape Scott will be in.

Scott was arguably the best defenseman in the league last year... OK, at least top 3. What makes you think he won't be again this year? I expect the same performance from him.

Last game when Hnidy was paired was Schneider was imo evidence that Hnidy would get the nod before Huskins
OD-Pronger will not be broken up
Neids-Beuch will not be broken up
that leaves Schneider - and it would be stupid to pair him with another offensive minded D-man like Huskins
Huskins will probably be the one who gets traded and Joey D as 7th D-man.
If Teemu signs it will only be 1 year

O'D and Pronger will be broken up if Schneider stays. It will be:

Niedermayer - Beauchemin
Pronger - Schneider
O'D - Huskins

(Of course this depends on who gets traded)

O'D and Pronger will be broken up if Schneider stays. It will be:

Niedermayer - Beauchemin
Pronger - Schneider
O'D - Huskins

(Of course this depends on who gets traded)

Schneider wouldn't be on the same pairing. Carlyle will spread them out.

Schneider wouldn't be on the same pairing. Carlyle will spread them out.

Schneider on the third pairing... sounds like a bad idea to me.

O'D and Pronger will be broken up if Schneider stays. It will be:

Niedermayer - Beauchemin
Pronger - Schneider
O'D - Huskins

(Of course this depends on who gets traded)

agreed. Although I still think OD will be the one traded. But I do think that Pronger and Schneider will be the 2nd pair. I know many of you want to spread the talent out, but trust me you don't pay a guy 5 million dollars to be on your last D pairing. He may take a few shifts on the last pairing but the majority of it will be on the 2nd pairing with Pronger.

I know many of you want to spread the talent out, but trust me you don't pay a guy 5 million dollars to be on your last D pairing. He may take a few shifts on the last pairing but the majority of it will be on the 2nd pairing with Pronger.

And many of you in the other camp seem to think that if Schneider was on the third pairing that he'd only get third pairing minutes. I'm pretty sure the idea would be to reduce the workload on the top two pairings so all six defensemen are better rested come April.

Either way, I'm sure we'll be fine.

And many of you in the other camp seem to think that if Schneider was on the third pairing that he'd only get third pairing minutes. I'm pretty sure the idea would be to reduce the workload on the top two pairings so all six defensemen are better rested come April.

Either way, I'm sure we'll be fine.

Our 3rd liners would be any otherclubs first liners:biglaugh:

Youre right, no matter how they spin it, if we keep Schneider we will have one of the best defensive teams of all time.

haha don't count on it. Plus I really doubt that we pay a guy 5 million dollars to be on our bottom pairing. And no way does Huskins get the nod over Hindy.

Actually all D units will be playing similar minutes so everyone is rested. And theres no point in breaking up 2 D pairing that work. Huskins has more trade value then OD and we dont need 5 offensive D-men in the lineup at once.

And many of you in the other camp seem to think that if Schneider was on the third pairing that he'd only get third pairing minutes. I'm pretty sure the idea would be to reduce the workload on the top two pairings so all six defensemen are better rested come April.

Either way, I'm sure we'll be fine.

In a perfect world yes that's the idea. However, there is no way that happens. Carlyle has shown that he rides his best players hard, and doesn't hesistate to barely play his less talented players. I think the 3rd pair will be much better then last years no matter who is traded. Therefore I think we should keep a top four of Niedermayer, Beauchemin, Pronger, and Schneider (unless he's traded). The 3rd pairing can take more minutes then last year so we won't have to have them on the ice 30 minutes a game.

In a perfect world yes that's the idea. However, there is no way that happens. Carlyle has shown that he rides his best players hard, and doesn't hesistate to barely play his less talented players. I think the 3rd pair will be much better then last years no matter who is traded. Therefore I think we should keep a top four of Niedermayer, Beauchemin, Pronger, and Schneider (unless he's traded). The 3rd pairing can take more minutes then last year so we won't have to have them on the ice 30 minutes a game.

If all pairing are equal Randy won't know. ooops:sarcasm:

Whenever I see this topic with the "defence" I get this uneasy feeling in the pit of my stomach. :D

If all pairing are equal Randy won't know. ooops:sarcasm:

um.. what?

Whenever I see this topic with the "defence" I get this uneasy feeling in the pit of my stomach. :D

I am glad I am not the only one that feels that way.

I am glad I am not the only one that feels that way.

Isn't that how you spell it well it is singular.

schneider/huskins third pairing is amazing as huskins is easily the most improved player on the team. He starts to do some Neidermeyeresque moves, like spinning of the half boards and carrying the puck all the way into the teams offensive zone. Now, don't freak out im away huskins is no where close to Neidermeyer, but by playing with him i believe he is becoming a very solid option, as beauchemin did. In my opinion its perfect having schneider on the 3rd line, he is old flat out and by cutting his minutes we can keep him fresher longer. He is an amazing powerplay defenseman and could possibly play all 2 minutes of every powerplay because carlyle does like to ride his top 2 defensemen. and IMO, carlyle would be dumb to split up Neidermeyer/Beauchemin, or Pronger/OD, they have played together for a long time and Pronger/OD are an elite shut down defense pairing.

we all know about OD, Pronger, Schneider, Neidermayer so lets talk about the rest.

Beauchemin - IMO he has struggled at times this seasontrying to do too much. Perhaps feeling the weight of Neidermayer's loss? Anyone's numbers will go down surely with the loss of he best defenseman in the league along side him but Beauchemin was a -9 going in to Scotty's return. He is +1 in the 6 games Scott has played but still has not registered a point since the 7th. We need him to regain his confidence from last year for a run at the cup cuz he was a big part of our success last year as we all know.

Huskins - Most improved player?? him or parros definitely our most improved defenseman as he is leading the team in +/-. He looks great, came back from the injury strong and is playing im sure the best hockey of his career. He is still what 28/29? could we have found a top 4 defenseman for the future after Scott's departure and with the age of Schneider and OD?

Best defense in sports!

Best defense in sports!

http://members.cox.net/chexxum/bloggo2-dfence.jpg

D FENCE!

could we have found a top 4 defenseman for the future after Scott's departure and with the age of Schneider and OD?

wouldn't say that

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't defence British, while defense is American?

I'd say Beauchemin's numbers have struggled partly because he doesn't have Niedermayer, but also partly because he was partnered with some bad partners. He was playing prime minutes without the benefit of a steady partner. Pronger got OD, while Beauchemin got to play with Hnidy/DiPenta.

Huskins might become a top 4 defenseman, but don't expect him to come anywhere near replacing Schneider or Scotty. We're still well short of having any blue-chip 2 way defense prospects. Mitera seems like a possible top pairing stay at home guy, but I'm not sure anyone else has top-pair potential.

What is your take on B. Salcido?

when I watched Salcido during the preseason he looked good. Really good. He has a lot of potential, granted he might have looked so good because if I remember correctly he was playing with Pronger.

Yeah, I remember talking to soap about Salcido in the preseason...

I don't remember anything "stunning" about him, but he looked pretty solid for sure. I'd say he has good potential to come up and play... if only we didn't have such a ridiculously stacked D at the moment.

What is your take on B. Salcido?

hes currently our #1 offensive dman. im surprised, but he has really surpassed mikkelson. its great watching this kid flourish.

he is TEARING UP the A. #1 in points for a Dman.

he has really surpassed mikkelson.

Interesting thought.
I'm obviously thinking about the next Top 20 for HF (I believe it's scheduled for February) and Salcido is a guy that has been very impressive this season. However, Salcido is also a player who is two years senior compared to Mikkelson (not counting the missed year of development that Mikkelson endured). So I think they're at different points in their career path. Not to mention that Salcido is in his second year of professional hockey, whereas Mikkelson is still learning the pro game. Look at how much of a change Salcido had from last season to this year.

As mentioned, this is one of the main discussion points I can foresee coming into (and coming out of) the upcoming Top 20, but it's worth noting that not all prospects are at equal parts in their development. Salcido's achievements this year are extremely impressive and he is no doubt much closer to contributing at the NHL level compared to Mikkelson, but the long-term potential is something completely different.

ya Salcido has followed up on a rather poor offensive year last year to say the least. He looks solid, but i think its good we have a stacked D. It forces us to let those kids develop in the minors and not take chances on when we "think they are ready".

And by no means am i saying Huskins will replace Schneider or Scotty, I'm just saying with their departure do we have someone who could possibly step in and do a sold job as a defenseman on the 2nd pairing?

Schneider on the third pairing... sounds like a bad idea to me.

sounds like a great idea to me, he is older and we can really use him for the full 2 minutes on the PP to give neidermayer and pronger a rest by playing them 1 minute each, it allows them to stay fresher as well cuz schneider wont be on the PK much. IT will spread the minutes around more

Mitera should be top 4 defenseman right?

ya Salcido has followed up on a rather poor offensive year last year to say the least. He looks solid, but i think its good we have a stacked D. It forces us to let those kids develop in the minors and not take chances on when we "think they are ready".

And by no means am i saying Huskins will replace Schneider or Scotty, I'm just saying with their departure do we have someone who could possibly step in and do a sold job as a defenseman on the 2nd pairing?
Maybe I just have low expectations, but 27 points as a rookie seems like a pretty good season to me. It's not "this kid is going to be something special" good, but I couldn't reasonably expect more from any rookie defenseman. He had a very good season in college before going pros too.

I haven't really seen him or heard much about him, so I don't want to compare him to any other prospects, but my gut says I'm more excited about him than Mikkelson, who I'm kind of down on.

This feature (http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app?articleid=347781&page=NewsPage&service=page) from nhl.com might interest some people. I'm certainly rooting for him because he's a local kid.