Bottom Line and Replays Replacing Tradition

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/27/sports/hockey/27hockey.html?_r=1&ref=hockey&oref=slogin

After 90 years, goal judges were moved for two reasons:

¶With instant replay available and a second referee next to the goal, goal judges are not exactly judges. They still push a button to turn on a light to let the crowd know a goal was scored, but they and the referees can be overruled by conclusive replay evidence. “People want to see the right calls made,” Mike Murphy, a former player and coach who is the N.H.L.’s vice president for hockey operations, said in a recent telephone interview from his office in Toronto.

¶The second reason, not surprisingly, was money. The booths took up space that could be filled with seats — choice seats that can fetch high prices. At Prudential Center, for instance, the Devils can sell six extra front-row tickets at $200 each.

They need to be able to contest penalties too. Have video review to see if a hook was really a hook or just looked like it from one angle.

They need to be able to contest penalties too. Have video review to see if a hook was really a hook or just looked like it from one angle.

As much as I hate stupid penalties, that's a horrible idea. Every other call would get contested, it undermines the refs authority on the ice and they would never stand for it and it just takes away from the game.

I think NOT calling half the **** they have been is the more viable option.

As much as I hate stupid penalties, that's a horrible idea. Every other call would get contested, it undermines the refs authority on the ice and they would never stand for it and it just takes away from the game.

I think NOT calling half the **** they have been is the more viable option.

Ughh... Amen. The LAST thing I'd want to see is an extra 5 or 6 two minute stopages to review penalties. They already review too many no brainer situations when it obviously was/wasnt a goal.

As for the original intent of the thread, the goal judges serve absolutely no purpose anymore, so I support the NHL's decision. The goal judge box blocked the view of other decent seats in some barns too, in addition to taking up space that could result in extra sold seats.

As for the original intent of the thread,.

original intent?


No "intent" here.....I simply posted an article from the NYTs for discussion..

not a big deal.

original intent?


No "intent" here.....I simply posted an article from the NYTs for discussion.. not a big deal.

I meant that the thread was being off topic from your bottom line and goal judge title.

The bottom line is that those judges used to call the goals, now they really aren't necessary. The point I was trying to make is that we could use a little less linesmen on the ice blocking the play and have replays and reviews to track penalties better. Nothing I hate more than a badly called penalty.

Yes the stoppage in play is attrocious, but I think they should be able to review these in under 1 min. Also, I don't think you should be able to contest every penalty, just a limited amount. Like they do in football with the decline blah blah.

I meant that the thread was being off topic from your bottom line and goal judge title.



fair enough and understood....

That's a tradition I won't be missing any time soon. Goal judges have become pretty irrelevant.

Of all the things wrong with this sport, this guy picks goal judges being removed as a necessary article.

Now that I have NHL Network, and thanks to all those Classic Series and Defining Moments shows, I again get to see hockey played the way it should be, not this garbage that this league has become.

Write an article on that instead.

Of all the things wrong with this sport, this guy picks goal judges being removed as a necessary article.

Now that I have NHL Network, and thanks to all those Classic Series and Defining Moments shows, I again get to see hockey played the way it should be, not this garbage that this league has become.

Write an article on that instead.

I saw a game from the 90's a couple days ago and there was so much hooking and holding it was disgusting. I'm glad that was removed. Now players that actually have talent can make it into a line-up no matter their size.

Of all the things wrong with this sport, this guy picks goal judges being removed as a necessary article.

Now that I have NHL Network, and thanks to all those Classic Series and Defining Moments shows, I again get to see hockey played the way it should be, not this garbage that this league has become.

Write an article on that instead.

My girlfriend couldn't understand why I wanted to watch all of Game 2 from the 95 Finals last night. She said, "Sure, I'll watch the highlights any day of the week,but the entire thing when you know what happens is kind of silly." I sat her down and said, "Okay then do this, play referee and try to call this game as they would these days" She gave up after about five minutes and she understood. To her defense she didn't watch much hockey when we started dating.

But hey that was four years ago and now we have season tickets so I guess I'm doing a good job at converting her.

I saw a game from the 90's a couple days ago and there was so much hooking and holding it was disgusting. I'm glad that was removed. Now players that actually have talent can make it into a line-up no matter their size.

Give me a break Mr. Bettman, or are you Mr. Forsberg?

They've gone waaaay too far with it. You so much as touch a guy with your stick and bam you get a hooking call. Back then you actually had to do something to impede the play of an opponent, now if you even come close to doing so you're called. It's a joke.

You want to talk about size and talent? Ask Pat Verbeek, he was small and just as scrappy as anyone back then. He did alright.

Give me a break Mr. Bettman, or are you Mr. Forsberg?

They've gone waaaay too far with it. You so much as touch a guy with your stick and bam you get a hooking call. Back then you actually had to do something to impede the play of an opponent, now if you even come close to doing so you're called. It's a joke.

You want to talk about size and talent? Ask Pat Verbeek, he was small and just as scrappy as anyone back then. He did alright.

They have definitely gone way to far with it but something had to be done. You should be able to just hold onto to someone the whole time they are in front of the net like they did back then. Plus players would skate by and they would be tugged and tugged by the defense men by his stick with no call at all. That's ridiculous. You almost need to fall down just to get a call. No wonder diving is so prevalent.

They have definitely gone way to far with it but something had to be done. You should be able to just hold onto to someone the whole time they are in front of the net like they did back then. Plus players would skate by and they would be tugged and tugged by the defense men by his stick with no call at all. That's ridiculous. You almost need to fall down just to get a call. No wonder diving is so prevalent.

Funny you bring up diving, they handled that in the worst possible manner too. I still don't understand how in any ref's mind that a player was hooked, interfered, cross-checked, high sticked enough to warrant a penalty, but the player being hooked, interfered with cross checked or high sticked had too severe a reaction and you're getting a diving call.

You can't have your cake and eat it too - either the player was actually penalized, or he wasn't and was trying to draw a call.

They have definitely gone way to far with it but something had to be done. You should be able to just hold onto to someone the whole time they are in front of the net like they did back then. Plus players would skate by and they would be tugged and tugged by the defense men by his stick with no call at all. That's ridiculous. You almost need to fall down just to get a call. No wonder diving is so prevalent.

Of course, I mean, without these rule changes we wouldn't have Cindy Criesby would we? We all know there is no NHL without her, er...him. :sarcasm:

Not sure if a thread was posted about this 2 and half weeks ago, but Chere did 3 internet pages on this topic.

http://www.nj.com/devils/ledger/index.ssf?/base/sports-0/1194672930157180.xml&coll=1

We need to bring back Clutching and Grabbing. Then let women join the NHL. Then we'll have some real hockey :sarcasm:

They've gone waaaay too far with it. You so much as touch a guy with your stick and bam you get a hooking call. Back then you actually had to do something to impede the play of an opponent, now if you even come close to doing so you're called. It's a joke.

I originally supported the change 100%, but it's absolutely ridiculous at this point. The problem is the attempt at the "changes" or (NHL version 2.0) they called penalties until March, then stopped for March/April and the playoffs, which was very frustrating. Then it seemed they got serious about it and I think you had about a little while where it worked essentially well. But THIS YEAR??!!?? :amazed: Colin Campbell has gone absolutely biserk. I dont want to see this sport turn into soccer where if you get lightly tapped you fall and grap your knees and roll into fake agony.

1) Lets return to days when Hooking actually meant a tug, not just light brushing
2) Triple or quadruple the # of diving penalties called. It's needed and it's humiliating in hockey to receive a diving call. That should help police it out a bit.
3) I dont even understand "interference" anymore. Seems like almost anything qualifies.

I originally supported the change 100%, but it's absolutely ridiculous at this point. The problem is the attempt at the "changes" or (NHL version 2.0) they called penalties until March, then stopped for March/April and the playoffs, which was very frustrating. Then it seemed they got serious about it and I think you had about a little while where it worked essentially well. But THIS YEAR??!!?? :amazed: Colin Campbell has gone absolutely biserk. I dont want to see this sport turn into soccer where if you get lightly tapped you fall and grap your knees and roll into fake agony.

1) Lets return to days when Hooking actually meant a tug, not just light brushing
2) Triple or quadruple the # of diving penalties called. It's needed and it's humiliating in hockey to receive a diving call. That should help police it out a bit.
3) I dont even understand "interference" anymore. Seems like almost anything qualifies.

I agree, but moreover, what was really the biggest problem in the "NHL Beta 1.5" when the clutching and grabbing was allowed a bit? Diving.

I'm not trying to start a fire here with my second comment about it, and it seems a bit as if he's toned it down, but if Cindy Criesby isn't an infamous diver do they go and acknowledge it? I mean in recent past there was talk about fines, 1 game suspensions , etc...but nothing ever came of it. Now lets face it, Criesby is the new face in the NHL, he's the guy that's supposed to put ***** in the seats wherever he goes and how well would that go with marketing if he's getting fined out the wazoo or suspended for diving? Not too well. So I can't help but think he's part of the reason almost nothing has been done to stop it.

Think about most dives that happen now, BOTH players still get called on it. Honestly, what is the purpose of that?

Heres my take:

Form a specific committee for in-game penalties consisting of all but maybe 1 former player. Have them review the plays because they know best. If a player accumulates more than 1 dive, he's suspended for 1 game, if an official believes it was a blatant dive (not just an embellishment on a clear penalty) then the player should be given 4 minutes + a game misconduct and no call on the player who supposedly committed the "penalty." It's definitely harsh, but after a while it would likely become meaningless because no one wants to be the guy that exaggerates, gets tossed, possibly suspended, and giving up a 4 minute PP.

To me, that's one thing that really needs to get weeded out of the game. Every time someone dives, whether it's our players or on another team, I wanna spit in their face because it's pathetic.

Overall I don't have a problem with being a little more strict on the hooks and grabs and such...but I think it's way overdone. Plus there are times you'll see a guy blatantly hold or interfere all game and maybe get called once for it. (See: Mike Commodore 05 playoff run) I feel like the implementation is so distorted at this point it's making it all ridiculous and too subjective.

They'll call stupid penalties but still let goaltenders get run....go figure.