P.Martin

At some point, Larry was comparing Paul to Neids.

You guys think he will reach that kind of a peak?

no



martin is developing into a great player, but he will never be on the level of nieds.

At some point, Larry was comparing Paul to Neids.

You guys think he will reach that kind of a peak?


Martin is very good defensively right now....As a matter of fact, I would in good faith say he is much better defensively than Niedermayer was after two seasons under both of their belts.

Martin is no where near the skater Niedermayer is.

And We don't know what Martin will do offensively, but we have seen an increase in production . 37 points in his second year is very encouraging.

Remember though Niedermayer was never a big point getter. He was a 40 point (average) a year defensemen for most years in NJ.....Basically, what Martin did this year.

no

he will never be on the level of nieds.

:dunno:


What level? Defensively Martin has been awesome.........Offensively Compare Martin's Second years number with MOST of Niedermayers years......Why will martin never be on Niedermayers level???

And this is Second Team Powerplay Time.



2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37



1992-93 NJ 80 11 29 40 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare

1993-94 NJ 81 10 36 46 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare

1994-95 NJ 48 4 15 19 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

1995-96 NJ 79 8 25 33 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

1996-97 NJ 81 5 30 35 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

1997-98 NJ 81 14 43 57 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Do Not Compare

1998-99 NJ 72 11 35 46 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare

1999-00 NJ 71 7 31 38 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - 1 point difference

2000-01 NJ 57 6 29 35 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

2001-02 NJ 76 11 22 33 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

2002-03 NJ 81 11 28 39 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare 2 points difference

2003-04 NJ 81 14 40 54 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Do Not Compare



I see NO reason why Martin can not have a career as good as Niedermayer's

you dont think i want him to be better?


all im saying is that its silly to compare martin to a guy thats one of the top 5 defenseman in the game probably, thats all

He doesnt skate nearly as well as Neids, but IMO he is just about as good at everything else. Not quite the puck handler Nieds is either.

He is a slower slightly bigger version of Neids JMHO

Martin will never hit the peak Niedermayer has (01-present), but he is and will be a solid #2 dman with very good offensive output and very solid defense for a long time. I don't think he'll be a franchise dman like Nieder, but he also shouldn't be a #2 pairing guy for as long as Nieder was (mainly due to his defensive lapses).

:dunno:


What level? Defensively Martin has been awesome.........Offensively Compare Martin's Second years number with MOST of Niedermayers years......Why will martin never be on Niedermayers level???

And this is Second Team Powerplay Time.



2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37



1992-93 NJ 80 11 29 40 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare

1993-94 NJ 81 10 36 46 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare

1994-95 NJ 48 4 15 19 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

1995-96 NJ 79 8 25 33 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

1996-97 NJ 81 5 30 35 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

1997-98 NJ 81 14 43 57 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Do Not Compare

1998-99 NJ 72 11 35 46 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare

1999-00 NJ 71 7 31 38 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - 1 point difference

2000-01 NJ 57 6 29 35 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

2001-02 NJ 76 11 22 33 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare - Martin Outscored

2002-03 NJ 81 11 28 39 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Compare 2 points difference

2003-04 NJ 81 14 40 54 2005-06 NJ 80 5 32 37 Do Not Compare



I see NO reason why Martin can not have a career as good as Niedermayer's

Because Scott Niedermayer is the best all around d-man in the NHL..and Paul Martin never will be. That's why.

Because Scott Niedermayer is the best all around d-man in the NHL..and Paul Martin never will be. That's why.

How do you know? I'm not saying he will but Larry did say it. But on what information do you base your thoughts which results in you knowing that Martin will never reach that kind of peak and be able to get compared with Neids?

How do you know? I'm not saying he will but Larry did say it. But on what information do you base your thoughts which results in you knowing that Martin will never reach that kind of peak and be able to get compared with Neids?

Listen..it's simply talent. Scott Niedermayer skates like the wind....has the ability to stop any forward in the NHL one on one....carries the puck up the ice consistently...breaks the trap....and has the ability to control the game. I respect Paul Martin as a defenseman..but his talents don't compare to Scott Niedermayer

nothing against martin..........but the answer is no, you are comparing marting to the best defensman in the league and a guy who won a norris and 3 cups.

martin is good but neidermayer is a unique once in awhile type player; martin is developing very nicely but he is no neids in my opinion

nothing against martin..........but the answer is no, you are comparing marting to the best defensman in the league and a guy who won a norris and 3 cups.

martin is good but neidermayer is a unique once in awhile type player; martin is developing very nicely but he is no neids in my opinion


Hmmmm Niedermayer in the League for 13 years.............


12 years No Norris Trophy.......


Paul Martin becomes his Partner = Norris Trophy ;) :handclap: :biglaugh:

Martin doesn't have the physical attributes Nidermayer has to be able to control the flow of a game like Niedermayer does. He could definitely become a Wade Redden level defenseman though.

Martin is overated by most devil fans. I do think he's better suited to the new NHL than say, Darien Hatcher? Martin doesnt take the body near as well as nieds. He's an ok 4th d-man. Grit, he does not have my brethren.

Martin is overated by most devil fans. I do think he's better suited to the new NHL than say, Darien Hatcher? Martin doesnt take the body near as well as nieds. He's an ok 4th d-man. Grit, he does not have my brethren.

An ok 4th d-man? You are out of your mind if you honestly think that. He just turned 25 years old, is in his second season, and is consistently going up against the Jagr's and Forsberg's of the league and doing well. The fact that Lou is putting Martin on the top pairing shows you what kind of d-man Paul is.

I know Paul Martin was the iron man for the gophers, a series of tests in strength and endurance. His body stats do not show it. But the guy is built solid. I always thought and from what i see he has enough grit as needed. His strength and what makes him able to play lots of minutes his is ability to make tough plays easy. Saving energy and able to play more.

Neidermyer though has a careeer behind him. I am always one that takes what has been done way over what might be.

Will love watching the Devils. Tallackson, Martin, DeMarchi and Frazee. And i guess Gionta, Parise and Zajac. Got to love those NCAA guys.

Martin is overated by most devil fans. I do think he's better suited to the new NHL than say, Darien Hatcher? Martin doesnt take the body near as well as nieds. He's an ok 4th d-man. Grit, he does not have my brethren.
:shakehead I think Martin is one of the up and coming stars for the new NHL

I think a lot of people are failing to realize that the position of defense is like pitching in baseball. I said it before and I will say it a million times over...there is an adjustment period for defenseman. Nobody in their right mind can step up and make an immediate impact on the blueline.

Paul Martin is NO WORSE then Scott Niedermayer wass at this point of his career. This does not by any means insinuate that Martin is better then Niedermayer or ever will be, but just the fact he is compared to him by a lot of hockey analysts and personnel goes a long way.

Paul Martin has progressed tremendously and he become a cog on the devils blueline and will be for years to come. HE is tremendous positionally, has increased in point production totals in two seasons and has really improved his game in all aspects. To find anything negative about a defneseman yet to play 5 full seasons in the league is beyond me. Forwards break in qucikly. Defenseman take time. He has been better then most I have seen in his short tenure of time on the NHL level.

I'm glad Martin played better down the stretch. For a while it looked as if he still had problems from the Hollweg hit on him.

Loved him in college and he's a great prospect and seems like a great kid.

2005-2006 Paul Martin = 1991-1992 Eric Weinrich.

Paul Martin is NO WORSE then Scott Niedermayer wass at this point of his career. This does not by any means insinuate that Martin is better then Niedermayer or ever will be, but just the fact he is compared to him by a lot of hockey analysts and personnel goes a long way.




That is exactly what I was trying to say...........If people compared Niedermayer to the Best of the NHL in 1993 or 1994 People woulda laughed you right out of the Room.

As a matter of fact as recently as the late 1990's people where talking about Niedermayer as "Missed Potential".

Now after 13 years in the League and a Norris Trophy he is considered by most one of the best in the league.....Who can really tell where anyone of us will be 10 years from now in our careers.

But for a second year player I think Martin has displayed a ton.

2005-2006 Paul Martin = 1991-1992 Eric Weinrich.


1991-92 Eric Weinrich 76 7 25 32

Weinrich 91-92 - 3rd year with Devils - 4th Defensemen in scoring 11th overall on the team behind Stevens, Driver and Kasatonov


2005-05 Paul Martin 80 5 32 37
Martin 2005-06 - 2nd year with the Devils - 2nd in Defensive scoring 7th overall on the team only behind Rafalski.

Eric Weinrich Never had more points in the NHL than 38-- In his Rookie season!


That seems like a silly comparision.

That is exactly what I was trying to say...........If people compared Niedermayer to the Best of the NHL in 1993 or 1994 People woulda laughed you right out of the Room.

As a matter of fact as recently as the late 1990's people where talking about Niedermayer as "Missed Potential".

Now after 13 years in the League and a Norris Trophy he is considered by most one of the best in the league.....Who can really tell where anyone of us will be 10 years from now in our careers.

Nieds was saddled with the dreaded "the next Bobby Orr" tag, something that more recently didn't do Bouwmeester any favors either.

Nieds was saddled with the dreaded "the next Bobby Orr" tag, something that more recently didn't do Bouwmeester any favors either.


I remember Niedermayers early Career Very Well.........I fallowed him closely during his WJ Championship along with Eric Lindross........NO ONE Ever tagged him as the Next Bobby Orr...Ever. Many people said he was just an offensive D-man and not very good defensively.


As a matter of fact there was quite a bit of chatter weeks before the draft that Scott LaChance was the Best D-man in the Draft.

Lachance had a very good World Junior tournement for Team USA.......LaChance was so highly Tauted by USA hockey that he and Keith Tkachuk were the only teenagers to make the Olympic team for Team USA in Albertville in 1992

Yeah, i remember LaChance...shows how defencemen could be unpredictable. That's why i prefer to draft FW with the mid first round picks.

Nieds was saddled with the dreaded "the next Bobby Orr" tag, something that more recently didn't do Bouwmeester any favors either.

Jay sure picked it up offensivly in his last 30 games or so. I don't know what level he will reach but I'm sure he is on the rise: 46pts & going up!

Back to Martin.

The idea of this post was to see if a comparison between Martin and Neids, at a same age, if you guys thought they were still about even as indicated by Larry and to see if you thought this would keep going for a while.

Yeah, i remember LaChance...shows how defencemen could be unpredictable. That's why i prefer to draft FW with the mid first round picks.
Well, you got to draft some at some point!

I'm not sure Paul Martin will ever reach the Norris peak of Niedermayer, but he will be on the Devils' top pair for years to come. I don't think the 2000 prediction of a Hale-Martin top pair anchoring the Devils' blueline is too far off. Martin is already the Devil's No. 2 defenseman behind Rafalski IMO, and Hale is developing nicely. I think he will consistently put up 45 pt seasons starting next year, but I don't think he'll reach the 55+ point peak of Niedermayer. I think CJMurph's prediction of Martin's possibility as a Redden type is pretty accurate.

That is exactly what I was trying to say...........If people compared Niedermayer to the Best of the NHL in 1993 or 1994 People woulda laughed you right out of the Room.

As a matter of fact as recently as the late 1990's people where talking about Niedermayer as "Missed Potential".

Now after 13 years in the League and a Norris Trophy he is considered by most one of the best in the league.....Who can really tell where anyone of us will be 10 years from now in our careers.

But for a second year player I think Martin has displayed a ton.

less we forget neids came into the nhl when he was 18 yrs old; comparing martin to neidermayer is foolish, you are entitled to your opinion but i think you are out of your mind big time

less we forget neids came into the nhl when he was 18 yrs old; comparing martin to neidermayer is foolish, you are entitled to your opinion but i think you are out of your mind big time

This still means nothing in relevance to the point that Scott NIedermayer was no better after his 2nd full season in the NHL then Paul MArtin was.

less we forget neids came into the nhl when he was 18 yrs old; comparing martin to neidermayer is foolish, you are entitled to your opinion but i think you are out of your mind big time


I think you need to re-read the thread.........I never claimed Martin to be the next Niedermayer or made any claim to his potential.

Read Again.

I simply said I would not put any restrictions on Martins limitation so early in his career.

I think you need to re-read the thread.........I never claimed Martin to be the next Niedermayer or made any claim to his potential.

Read Again.

I simply said I would not put any restrictions on Martins limitation so early in his career.


then i agree with you, although i dont think martin will be as good as neids i think he will be and is already on his way to being a premier defensman and i think the salary the devils offer him this offseason will be proof of the what the organization feels about him.