[Football] League Draft official thread

OK now we need the name of the teams for the following guys (and please confirm you want to play, and if you want to be a judge, say so).

These are 8 teams. We can make "two GMed" teams if people want, it worked well last time.

I'll repeat to Strizzi, Kov, Frolov, and plenty of other footie fans that they are welcomed to be either GM, judge or both.

We also have to agree on the number of leagues.
My proposal : EPL, Calcio, Liga, L1, Bundesliga and a league for the "best of the rest".

Once all the teams are set, we'll use a snake draft for each league. The order will be determined by a draw I'll give to me 6 year old daughter (of course you guys have to trust me not to cheat and ask her for the first pick :D ).

Participants in EPL draft (judges : GoM, Juni, GB, Belgian Fan, Rage, Flyhigh) :
Evilo
O=S/Bakos
Belizarius
PK
Les Habs

Participants in Calcio draft (judges : PK, Helicecopter, Bubbles, GB) :
Evilo/Rage
O=S/Bakos
Belizarius/Flyhigh
GoM
Les Habs

Participants in Liga draft (judges : Les Habs, Belgian Fan):
Evilo/Rage
O=S/Bakos
Belizarius/Flyhigh
PK
GoM

Participants in L1 draft (judges : Evilo, Belizarius, GB) :
O=S/Bakos
PK
GoM
Les Habs
The Rage
Flyhigh

Participants in Bundesliga draft (judges : Bakos, Karpa32, GB) :
Evilo/The Rage
O=S
Belizarius/Flyhigh
PK
GoM
Les Habs

Participants in "best of the rest" draft (judges : O=S, Belgian Fan) :
Evilo/The Rage
Bakos
Belizarius/Flyhigh
PK
GoM
Les Habs

And as I said, the more the merrier, we can have two GMs per team if we have more than 8 GMs.

GM+Judge "Best of the rest league"..

I´m in.

GM + Bundesliga judge.

Teamname: Red Devils of Neustadt.

:)

Ah ofcourse, this way I can't draft in the best of the rest league. Ok, instead, I'll be a judge of the L1. I've been following it exclusively the past few months..

Ah ofcourse, this way I can't draft in the best of the rest league. Ok, instead, I'll be a judge of the L1. I've been following it exclusively the past few months..
I understand your frustration, but it would be a tad easy for you to pick dutch league players in the "rest of the world" draft, don't you think?
You'd have an advantage (which is why I think nobody should be a GM in its "own" league).

I understand your frustration, but it would be a tad easy for you to pick dutch league players in the "rest of the world" draft, don't you think?
You'd have an advantage (which is why I think nobody should be a GM in its "own" league).

I stand corrected..

I'm in but I'm going to need a lot of explanations of how it's going to work... :)
I'm not following a lot the other leagues but I don't mind trying, it's going to help me to know them better. :)

I'm in but I'm going to need a lot of explanations of how it's going to work... :)
I'm not following a lot the other leagues but I don't mind trying, it's going to help me to know them better. :)
Feel free to fire the questions, I'll try to answer.
What is it that you don't understand?

Aye, I'm in too, but still a bit confused about all of this

Do I draft players in the French, German, Dutch leagues, etc, while judging other people on their English teams?

Count me in as a GM and as a La Liga judge. I have one question though. Is "best of the rest" for the rest of Europe or the rest of the World?

Aye, I'm in too, but still a bit confused about all of this

Do I draft players in the French, German, Dutch leagues, etc, while judging other people on their English teams?

You'll have a Serie A team that you pick, a La Liga team that you pick, a Ligue 1 team that you pick and a Bundesliga team that you pick. So you will participate in 4 different drafts. You will also be EPL judge.

Ill be a GM in the EPL and Rest of the World. I could have been a judge for the EPL or Rest of the World but obviously I cant judge the League Im a judge in.

Ill be a GM in the EPL and Rest of the World. I could have been a judge for the EPL or Rest of the World but obviously I cant judge the League Im a judge in.

OK, so you're going to judge what exactly?

I dont have to be a judge.

And for these guys, please confirm if you're interested or not (and in which capacity, judge+GM, judge only, GM only?)

Once all the teams are set, we'll use a snake draft for each league. The order will be determined by a draw I'll give to me 6 year old daughter (of course you guys have to trust me not to cheat and ask her for the first pick :D ).

Your daughter? Is she more like you or your wife? If she's more like you, then I don't trust her! :sarcasm: No, that's cool. Good choice.

I have a few questions though about the draft:

1 What is a "snake draft"? Do you mean just a normal draft?

2 What about this, which I suggested before:

Pick Team
1 Team A
2 Team B
3 Team C
4 Team C
5 Team B
6 Team A
7 Team A
8 Team B
9 Team C
10 Team A
11 Team B
12 Team C

and it keeps going A,B,C the rest of the way. The only reason I suggest it is because it makes it a bit more interesting and sort of gives B + C more of a chance since A got the first pick.

3 Can we trade our picks? Say I offer to trade my second and third picks for another guys first pick and he agrees.

I dont have to be a judge.

Oh, I get what you were saying.

for now I'll judge the England one, might participate in a draft if I have time, I'll let you know over the weekend or something.

I'll be a judge for the EPL, don't have enough time to be a gM though since I started my new job.

You'll have a Serie A team that you pick, a La Liga team that you pick, a Ligue 1 team that you pick and a Bundesliga team that you pick. So you will participate in 4 different drafts. You will also be EPL judge.

Aiight, sounds good :D

*whispers so Evilo won't hear me...

time to pay attention to French football...

French football...

Err... what's "French" football dude?

i'd like to join the EPL, LA Liga and Calcio drafts please.

And for these guys, please confirm if you're interested or not (and in which capacity, judge+GM, judge only, GM only?) :
Peter Bondra, Karpaa 32, Bubbles, Helicecopter, Belgian Fan, Flyhigh, The Rage.I will be a judge for serie A if needed.

I'm ready to be a Bundesliga judge. :)

BTW, oh the irony. It was during the last stages of the last draft, when I broke my leg and I still haven't recovered 100%, but I'm getting there. :jump:

I really have little time right now. I'm volunteering to judge in leagues that I feel I can be of use in case of a shortage of judges (EPL, La Liga, Best of the Rest)

Aye, I'm in too, but still a bit confused about all of this

Do I draft players in the French, German, Dutch leagues, etc, while judging other people on their English teams?
Yes.

Count me in as a GM and as a La Liga judge. I have one question though. Is "best of the rest" for the rest of Europe or the rest of the World?
I'd say rest of the world.

Ill be a GM in the EPL and Rest of the World. I could have been a judge for the EPL or Rest of the World but obviously I cant judge the League Im a judge in.

i'd like to join the EPL, LA Liga and Calcio drafts please.

I'll ask all GMs to participate in all drafts except their own judged one.
That way we can make a ranking after all the drafts.

So could both of you confirm which role you want to take?
Ideally, each team would be GM in 5 drafts and judge in one. We can have more judges, but ideally every team should be ranked 5 times in order to determine the final ranking.

Your daughter? Is she more like you or your wife? If she's more like you, then I don't trust her! :sarcasm: No, that's cool. Good choice.

I have a few questions though about the draft:

1 What is a "snake draft"? Do you mean just a normal draft?

2 What about this, which I suggested before:

Pick Team
1 Team A
2 Team B
3 Team C
4 Team C
5 Team B
6 Team A
7 Team A
8 Team B
9 Team C
10 Team A
11 Team B
12 Team C

and it keeps going A,B,C the rest of the way. The only reason I suggest it is because it makes it a bit more interesting and sort of gives B + C more of a chance since A got the first pick.

3 Can we trade our picks? Say I offer to trade my second and third picks for another guys first pick and he agrees.

Snake draft means that the one that picks last in the first round picks first in the second, last in the third, first in the fourth, etc...
So it's what we all propose.
I don't like the trading of picks. Especially since we will all have 11 picks. It makes things much more difficult to follow. Keep in mind we have 88 picks per league (if we have 8 teams), with 6 leagues : 528 picks.

Oh and all of these that volunteered to judge, I'm taking you all.
I think the more judges we have, the most unbiased the result will be (like a Chelsea fan, an Arsenal fan and a ManU fan will have different opinions on players and will give a better result mixed up).

Snake draft means that the one that picks last in the first round picks first in the second, last in the third, first in the fourth, etc...
So it's what we all propose.
I don't like the trading of picks. Especially since we will all have 11 picks. It makes things much more difficult to follow. Keep in mind we have 88 picks per league (if we have 8 teams), with 6 leagues : 528 picks.

That's cool. I'll assume this response also means no subs.

When do we start?!???!! :propeller

BTW, this draft may take a while for some of us. I have to work again tomorrow, but I'll check first thing when I get home.

Err... what's "French" football dude?

Dunno...something about neverending forfeits :dunno::D

I can be an EPL judge--don't really have the experience to judge anything else.

I can help judge EPL and I could probably draft in EPL (if I don't judge), La Liga, and Serie A.

I can help judge EPL and I could probably draft in EPL (if I don't judge), La Liga, and Serie A.
Same as the others, it'd be better if you could participate in all the drafts except the EPL one (that means also L1, Bundesliga and rest of the world).
If you feel a bit short, you can always team up with another EPL judge (GoM?).

Les Habs, yes I think adding subs is too much.

Flyhigh, Rage, I add you as EPL judges no matter what.

I can be an EPL judge--don't really have the experience to judge anything else.

I can help judge EPL and I could probably draft in EPL (if I don't judge), La Liga, and Serie A.

Nice lads. We need you as judges AND in the drafts. FH, if you can do one league draft you can do 'em all.

Les Habs, yes I think adding subs is too much.

OK, but my thing is we may need more than 11 rounds per draft. Why? Because somebody (not just myself, but myself included) could draft too many strikers say and then they can't put a formation together. So my thing is can we drop somebody we drafted AFTER the draft is done to bring in somebody else who hasn't been drafted? Sorry, not trying to be a *** but I can see this happening to somebody potentially.

OK, but my thing is we may need more than 11 rounds per draft. Why? Because somebody (not just myself, but myself included) could draft too many strikers say and then they can't put a formation together. So my thing is can we drop somebody we drafted AFTER the draft is done to bring in somebody else who hasn't been drafted? Sorry, not trying to be a *** but I can see this happening to somebody potentially.

I think the easy solution would be not to draft too many strikers :propeller

I'll volunteer to be a judge only, either or both of La Liga or Serie A I can be relatively unbiased. :sarcasm:

I'll volunteer to be a judge only, either or both of La Liga or Serie A I can be relatively unbiased. :sarcasm:
I add you for Serie A, we already have 6 judges for the EPL.

OK, but my thing is we may need more than 11 rounds per draft. Why? Because somebody (not just myself, but myself included) could draft too many strikers say and then they can't put a formation together. So my thing is can we drop somebody we drafted AFTER the draft is done to bring in somebody else who hasn't been drafted? Sorry, not trying to be a *** but I can see this happening to somebody potentially.
Well, I wouldn't be against it, but the thing is, you have to draft according to your formation. So you don't draft 5 strikers in the first 5 rounds, it serves no purpose.

I think the easy solution would be not to draft too many strikers :propeller
Hey #16, your inbox was full, I couldn't PM you.
Wanna join?

And as I sad many times, if you feel you're short on knowledge and/or time, just team up with someone else and thus it'll be doable.
I know last time we did this, I teamed up with Tom (Karpa32) and I think having two GMs is very good to avoid all biases (even though he wouldn't let me draft Cris!)

If someone is interested in teaming up, i´d be willing to team up with someone for the drafts :)

O=S and Bakos are teaming up for the drafts :)

For 'Best of the Rest' i´m drafting solo then, right ? Atleast i´d like to participate in that draft.

O=S and Bakos are teaming up for the drafts :)

For 'Best of the Rest' i´m drafting solo then, right ? Atleast i´d like to participate in that draft.

Yeah, and I'm drafting solo for the Bundesliga. That way we draft a team out of every league.

meh, I must say I'm not too fond of this... :)
Seriously, how can you judge your own team without bias?
How can the others be sure you don't exchange PMs on who to take?

We'll have to trust a german and a dutch.
How is that going to happen? ;)

meh, I must say I'm not too fond of this... :)
Seriously, how can you judge your own team without bias?
How can the others be sure you don't exchange PMs on who to take?

We'll have to trust a german and a dutch.
How is that going to happen? ;)

Perhaps we aren't allowed to cast a vote to our own team then? Just an idea. Or let me vote in the BOTR league with an 1.5 factor (the other judges count for a full 2.0).. same for Bakos and the Bundesliga..

'My' Bundesliga team could be judged by Kärppä32 for example.

So there´s no bias towards my own team and i won´t help out with PMs. It´s just the same teamname, but i´m not involved in choosing players or describing or whatever, if that´s okay.

If you're short of judges for the Bundesliga, French LI and Serie A I'd be willing to do that as well.

'My' Bundesliga team could be judged by Kärppä32 for example.

So there´s no bias towards my own team and i won´t help out with PMs. It´s just the same teamname, but i´m not involved in choosing players or describing or whatever, if that´s okay.
We'll work something out.

If you're short of judges for the Bundesliga, French LI and Serie A I'd be willing to do that as well.
OK, thanks!

Anybody want a partner?

Anybody want a partner?

I'm sorry, long distance relationsships never work.. ;)

Anybody want a partner?
I'm open for a partner as well.
If you feel like it... PM me...

BTW guys, I've been thinking about how things would work and after all, I'm not against judges giving some advices through PMs (which would simplify the "GM-judge in the same team" case).
So if X is not sure of a position or something, he can ask a judge through PM (or for any other advice).
Still in that case, I feel a GM-judge team should not have a vote for that team. For instance, Bakos won't vote for his team in the Bundesliga, but can still help O=S if he wants to.

BTW guys, I've been thinking about how things would work and after all, I'm not against judges giving some advices through PMs (which would simplify the "GM-judge in the same team" case).
So if X is not sure of a position or something, he can ask a judge through PM (or for any other advice).
Still in that case, I feel a GM-judge team should not have a vote for that team. For instance, Bakos won't vote for his team in the Bundesliga, but can still help O=S if he wants to.

Sounds alright and a wise choice to get competitive teams from everybody ! :)

When do we get started?

Anybody want a partner?

Might not have the credentials, but if you want a partner, I'm game.

I could use a partner as well for Bundesliga, L1, and etc. I won't be here all of tomorrow though and I'll be in and out for the next couple weeks (visiting universities).

Hey #16, your inbox was full, I couldn't PM you.
Wanna join?

Thanks, but I'll pass. I don't follow club football nearly as much as I used to. I'll just provide the smartass remarks from the sidelines here and there ;)

OK ;)

In other news, The Rage and myself will be partners.
I'm still waiting for Peter Bondra and some others to decline or join, and some partnership to form and we'll get started. Hopefully today or tomorrow.
Please guys hurry up.

Also, I think we should have a 24 hours wait at most for each pick. However if team X doesn't pick in 24 hours, then team Y can pick, but team Z will have to wait 24 hours to make its pick so that team X doesn't see 5 teams pick before it.

I´ll be skiing from wednesday to saturday.
Just for your information :)

Which means you're disqualified...




















Because I'm jealous. :)

My decision after thinking about it a little is that Ill pass. Ill be like #16 and will be looking at the draft but I dont have time to research/think about my line-up.

Cone on guys!
Make your partnership and let's go!

And for guys like Strizzi who lurk now and then, please take part!

We don't have to do this partner thing, right?

No we don't. But some guys seem to look for partners (Belizarius, Flyhigh?).

Yes it could... :)
I don't follow a lot several leagues and I think I'm going to finish dead last without help! :D

So can we get started, TODAY?!?

Well I'll give everyone a deadline.
If in 24 hours all teams are not made and all posters haven't joined, my daughter will do the draw.

Yes it could... :)
I don't follow a lot several leagues and I think I'm going to finish dead last without help! :D

Just don't pick any French players away from Ligue 1 (like Guily) and you'll be fine. :sarcasm:

It'll be fun. I have to do a little homework on a few players and to a lesser extent leagues, but that's why I like this idea.

Well I'll give everyone a deadline.
If in 24 hours all teams are not made and all posters haven't joined, my daughter will do the draw.

Cool. The sooner the better. Like I said earlier, I work all week on and off (weird schedule). Still I'll be checking every day.

Just don't pick any French players away from Ligue 1 (like Guily) and you'll be fine. :sarcasm:
Yeah, let's avoid the Henry, Trézéguet or Gallas of the world.... :D

Trézéguet

Never heard of him. :sarcasm:

So can we set the deadline?

I'll team with FlyHigh. :)

OK, the draw will be made in the upcoming hours.
I suggest no team can pick first overall in more than one league draft.
Is everyone OK with that?

OK, the draw will be made in the upcoming hours.
I suggest no team can pick first overall in more than one league draft.
Is everyone OK with that?

More than fair.. Now tell your little girl to quit playing around as there are plenty of guys waiting on her! ;)

OK, first pot, there are 6 tickets with a league on each one.
So the first league we'll draft is....

Ligue 1!!!!

Rigged!

And the order of the draft will be :

1- Les Habs

2- The Rage

3- Flyhigh

4- Pk

5- O=S/Bakos

6- GoM

That's it, I'll start a new thread with the draft order and we can set the clock as soon as Les Habs has picked.

Good luck boys!

Second draw...
The second league will be....

Best Of The Rest!

And the first pick will go to....

1- Bakos!

2- Pk

3- Evilo/The Rage

4- GoM

5- Flyhigh/Belizarius

6- Les Habs

1- Bakos!

Ok, meaning we won't start this until sunday when Bakos gets back.. Unless I'm allowed to pick for him (we both worked on lists)..

Ok, meaning we won't start this until sunday when Bakos gets back.. Unless I'm allowed to pick for him (we both worked on lists)..
I know it can be hypocritical, but I think Bakos should be picking.

I know it can be hypocritical, but I think Bakos should be picking.

I feel the same way.. but it would mean waiting 3/4 more days.. Ah well..

Picking first in this league sucks anyway. Wouldn't mind trading it if that's allowed..

Wel Les Habs switched picks with GoM. However, it would have to be Bakos that agrees with the switch... :D

For me there are things that I hope the judges will considering. Things like formationNo doubt, for any judge i think.
non-traditional attributes..aka?

..and current form (last season or this season). Are you worried about the current form not be factored enough or being counted too much?
Imo worries should be there about the latter.

Those are things that I'm worried will get overlooked.As a judger (serie A) there is one thing that bothers me and that could BOTHER me when the time to judge will come.
Is the consistency matter, or the average performance/top performance argument.
I mean, should i judge players for how good they usually are along a season (hence heavily considering the percentage of good games players usually have) or should i judge them for how good they are when on top of their games? Or maybe for how good they usually are in BIG games (kind of playoff performers) ?
:help:

I think this should be discussed as soon as possible as the draft goes on, cause that could affect a lot of choices by partecipants too.


Another thing, just an individual announce:
PERSONALLY i don't like the advice-by-judgers rule as i don't find it fair and it slightly decreases my interest in the draft as the curiosity for who someone will pick is affected by knowing he could(have) ask(ed) advice.
Btw, one thing is to ask which player among some candidates is better in the judger's opinion, another one just asking which position exactly that player better fits.
Maybe the advice rule could be regulated establishing the available extent of the takeable help and the number of advices each partecipant could ask for (one?) along one draft.
Anyway, the only sure consequence out of this is that i for one won't give any advice to anyone about serie A players. I hope to not be considered an *** for that.

Trying to be nicer..
considering the overall draft (btw, BOTR?? :huh: oh wait, best of the rest? i'm improving BF!!) the most interesting but also the most difficult to be properly judged, if you think more judgers would be particularly helpful in that one i could try to give my opinion on that as well. The try is there cause i can't know at the moment how many hours i will be working in the days when that draft will be completed, so in any case i could not assure i would be able to do it eventually.

I also think we needs other BOTR judges...
As for the "advices", I agree, but there are things to consider :
1- Some posters have expressed a lack of thorough knowledge about a league. I don't think they should be penalized too much for it.
2- If a partnership has one GM and one judge, I think it's too unethical to have one "specialist" on a team compared to the others.

This is why I've given some hints in the L1 draft, so that everyone could take advantage, even though the result of The Rage will influence our overall ranking (and thus it is in MY best interest that the others don't select good players).
Giving advices to anyone that asks solve this matter.

So yes, it hurts the competition a bit, but I think most of us will agree that the interest of such drafts is NOT the competition, but rather the opportunity to learn a lot from the leagues around us.

Great points by Helice.

1 From the start, I've not liked the whole "partners" segment of the draft. I especially don't like it since these partners are judges of drafts that their other partners are participating in. In one of these cases, the actual judge will now be making choices. Either way, it was a bad decision from the start.

2 I too do not like the advice from judges. For one thing, it's pretty much foreshadowing what picks should be made and what players they think should be taken. This IMO is having an effect on who is being drafted and will continue to do so.

3 I would LOVE it if Helice judged BOTR. Until that is officially announced, I will be sending him 10 pages of questions/hypotheticals. :D

4 Helice, I'm actually worried about current form not being considered enough. By current form though, I mean the past 2-3 seasons. I'll give you an example. There is a player who is considered one of the best of his generation and is going to be a legend of the game. However, this particular player's form has dipped/dropped fairly considerably for at least two years now. Injuries played a small part, but largely they've been lacklustre. My problem is that I can see this guy getting selected and then see him being defended over players who are currently better who have yet to forge as distinguished an overall career. I don't want to name him and it's the not the dude we discusses via PM recently, but rather one of his teammates if you can't guess. So by current form, I'm talking about somebody who's been good for say the last 2 years/seasons who looks likely to continue and how they stand up next to somebody who used to be great who has now deteriorated considerably.

5 In terms of judging a players performance, I would hope that all of the factors you mentioned come into play. IMO it should be weighted more on what they would do for an entire season. In fact I would go a step further and say that it should be looked on as though we've started a club and are drafting our very first side. Now that should discourage drafting the right veterans, but it should all come together. I just don't wanna be judged wrongly because I didn't pull a Florentino Perez and draft all Mediaticos.

6 Non-traditional attributes such as are they a gamewinner, are they a captain/leader (BTW, we should all have to designate captains for our sides), are they versatile, do they have upside. These things shouldn't be the first considerationg but rather secondary considerations.

7 I think the teams need to be laid out at the end and that a formation should be chosen. Then maybe the judges could ask questions about what they think a particular players role would be. For example, if I chose Puyol in the La Liga draft but had him as a RB then the judge would ask me why. Judges could even ask if they agree with a decision just to see if our take is the same.

8 I agree with Evilo that this is more about fun and learning (at least for me, though the L1 draft nearly gave me an anxiety attack and I never get those), yet to that point I think the advice portion along with the partnerships take away from that a bit. Notice I said "a bit".

Anyway, it's been interesting so far.

I´m back and i´ll start to pick in the BOTR draft :)

Good picks.. Two of the three best strikers, as wel as the best midfielder have been taken so far.

as wel as the best midfielder have been taken so far.
I disagree. I have two midfielders better than Sneijder available on my list.

Oh btw, picking Kuijt was Bakos' own decision. I adviced him it would probably be better to take Tevez seeing he has a bigger name. But in retrospect, I think Kuijt's a legit #1 pick and a much, much better team player than Tevez. Both are still below superstardom though..

Well I disagree as well.
Tevez is a superstar. It's just that he's not playing in Europe.
He's a much much better player than Robinho for instance.

Well I disagree as well.
Tevez is a superstar. It's just that he's not playing in Europe.
He's a much much better player than Robinho for instance.

My definition of a superstar is not as wide as yours then. Robinho for instance isn't even close of being one according to my definition. In fact, IMO there are perhaps 10/15 superstars in the world. Tevez and Kuijt sure ain't two of them.

Tevez is more skilled, but he's a very one sided goalgetter. A strong and consistent one though but Kuijt simply does more for his team then anyone else who was available.

Well, there's really no point in getting into extra posts about this, I feel Tevez is a superior player to Kujt.
Is he a top 10 striker in the world? Maybe not, but very close to it at worse.

Too bad one of the judges disagrees with me... :D

Well, there's really no point in getting into extra posts about this, I feel Tevez is a superior player to Kujt.
Is he a top 10 striker in the world? Maybe not, but very close to it at worse.

Too bad one of the judges disagrees with me... :D

Certainly. I don't see how Tevez is a superior player to Kuijt in any way, shape or form. There are no such things as superior players among the first 10 picks. It's all very, very close. And I've been following Tevez ever since Piet de Visser adviced him to PSV 3 years ago. To put it in a better perspective, Kuijt is been seen as good as van Ruud van Nistelrooij. Now I have my doubts, as Ruud has been scoring the lights out in one of the toughest competitions in the world, but it gives people a rough estimation how people think about Kuijt around Europe.

Ceiling: Tevez
Skills: Tevez
Goalscoring: Equal
Playmaking: Kuijt
Perseverance: Kuijt
Defense: Kuijt
Leadership: Kuijt
Consistency: Equal/edge Kuijt
Clutchness: Kuijt
Versatality: Kuijt

Anyway, both were fine picks. But people forget to look past one's players skillset.

You're selling Tevez short.
Tevez is a better finisher, and is very consistent, as well as clutch.

I think you're going with the player you know better. Me who knows both around the same (I don't get more dutch games than brazilian games), I feel Tevez is the better player.

I guess I'll have to pick players from the dutch league to be better ranked... ;)
Too bad my top 4 aren't from the dutch league...

I disagree. I have two midfielders better than Sneijder available on my list.

I have two comparable ones. Edged Sneijder due to outstanding play for the National team.

You're selling Tevez short.
Tevez is a better finisher, and is very consistent, as well as clutch.

I think you're going with the player you know better. Me who knows both around the same (I don't get more dutch games than brazilian games), I feel Tevez is the better player.

I guess I'll have to pick players from the dutch league to be better ranked... ;)
Too bad my top 4 aren't from the dutch league...

Kuijt's a player you have to know and follow well or else he will not impress you as much. That's the main beef I have with him.

To say Tevez is a better finisher is a lack of watching Kuijt. It's the best part of his game. Either way, both are completely different strikers who provide other things for their teams. I don't really have one in higher regards than the other, but when someone says either one is superior, it's pretty darn unaccurate.

3 I would LOVE it if Helice judged BOTR. Until that is officially announced, I will be sending him 10 pages of questions/hypotheticals. :D
Then i'm going to make clear that since there is a very good chance i will judge the BOTR draft i quotationally won't give any advice about it either. :D

4 Helice, I'm actually worried about current form not being considered enough. By current form though, I mean the past 2-3 seasons. I'll give you an example. There is a player who is considered one of the best of his generation and is going to be a legend of the game. However, this particular player's form has dipped/dropped fairly considerably for at least two years now. Injuries played a small part, but largely they've been lacklustre. My problem is that I can see this guy getting selected and then see him being defended over players who are currently better who have yet to forge as distinguished an overall career.Mmh..i smell Zidane here..:snide:..

I don't want to name him and it's the not the dude we discusses via PM recently, but rather one of his teammates if you can't guess. So by current form, I'm talking about somebody who's been good for say the last 2 years/seasons who looks likely to continue and how they stand up next to somebody who used to be great who has now deteriorated considerably.and i'm somehow smelling Eto'o now.. so maybe the other one was Raul!? (going by positions..) :D

Anyway, i think the past 2, 2.5 seasons are the right period to evaluate a player's status, if it's not an upcoming youngster we are talking about..cause we can't held on him the fact he has yet to play consistently well for two seasons if it is the first one he is getting first stage exposure..

5 In terms of judging a players performance, I would hope that all of the factors you mentioned come into play. IMO it should be weighted more on what they would do for an entire season. In fact I would go a step further and say that it should be looked on as though we've started a club and are drafting our very first side. Now that should discourage drafting the right veterans, but it should all come together. I just don't wanna be judged wrongly because I didn't pull a Florentino Perez and draft all Mediaticos.

6 Non-traditional attributes such as are they a gamewinner, are they a captain/leader (BTW, we should all have to designate captains for our sides), are they versatile, do they have upside. I think the draft will be judged for current value (last seasonS) only. Drafting to start a club, thus taking FUTURE upside into consideration is not exactly what i think these (and previous) drafts are about. Let me know if i am wrong guys.
As for versatility, it should help while drafting and show when putting down (and looking at) the formation already.

IMO it should be weighted more on what they would do for an entire season.People should decide about this sooner rather than later. Let me know folks :help:


7 I think the teams need to be laid out at the end and that a formation should be chosen. Then maybe the judges could ask questions about what they think a particular players role would be. For example, if I chose Puyol in the La Liga draft but had him as a RB then the judge would ask me why. Judges could even ask if they agree with a decision just to see if our take is the same. That was common during previous drafts' judgement. And no doubt theorical formations on the pitch will have to be chosen and will be what will be evaluated.

As for your previous point about subs, i completely agree at least for the top three leagues. Only five teams for those leagues means we would have 55 players drafted out of England, Italy and Spain. Considering the big rosters the top teams have, that means almost only top teams' players will be selected, something that wouldn't met the main advertised intent of this project: to know more about the less known. So i think at least for those three leagues adding subs would make things more interesting and could ease their evaluation (encouraging differences between teams). Then again, that's a thing that must be liked by the partecipants.. better to stay with the starters only than to not be able to complete the draft.

Then i'm going to make clear that since there is a very good chance i will judge the BOTR draft i quotationally won't give any advice about it either.

Mmh..i smell Zidane here..:snide:..

and i'm somehow smelling Eto'o now.. so maybe the other one was Raul!? (going by positions..) :D

Anyway, i think the past 2, 2.5 seasons are the right period to evaluate a player's status, if it's not an upcoming youngster we are talking about..cause we can't held on him the fact he has yet to play consistently well for two seasons if it is the first one he is getting first stage exposure..

I think the draft will be judged for current value (last seasonS) only. Drafting to start a club, thus taking FUTURE upside into consideration is not exactly what i think these (and previous) drafts are about. Let me know if i am wrong guys.
As for versatility, it should help while drafting and show when putting down (and looking at) the formation already.

People should decide about this sooner rather than later. Let me know folks :help:

That was common during previous drafts' judgement. And no doubt theorical formations on the pitch will have to be chosen and will be what will be evaluated.

As for your previous point about subs, i completely agree at least for the top three leagues. Only five teams for those leagues means we would have 55 players drafted out of England, Italy and Spain. Considering the big rosters the top teams have, that means almost only top teams' players will be selected, something that wouldn't met the main advertised intent of this project: to know more about the less known. So i think at least for those three leagues adding subs would make things more interesting and could ease their evaluation (encouraging differences between teams). Then again, that's a thing that must be liked by the partecipants.. better to stay with the starters only than to not be able to complete the draft.

1 Of course I was kidding about the advice bit. You'd probably recommend the "next Robinho" or something. :D

2 I won't comment any anything you "smell". :D I'll be a judge too you know. I will comment on one "smell" though. Eto'o's been performing at a high enough level for more than two years. Anyway, I think prospects are fine too, to an extent. I can think of one player who's a "rookie", but is pretty much a guarantee to be the real deal. I guess for me I'm viewing it like this at the end of the day: It's as if this is an expansion draft and we get to take whoever we want (so long as they haven't been drafted). So we're sort of building our "franchise" right now. OK, this isn't coming off the right way, but I know you get my drift.

3 I'm glad somebody else wants subs. I think we could do it like I said ealier, one defender, one midfielder, one striker, one keeper and either one prospect or one whoever you want. OR we could just pick whatever five players we want as subs and be judged on our choices. I like the latter actually.

Well, I PMed every participant regarding subs and here are the results :
For subs : 2 teams (3 votes : 1GM and 2 co-GMs)
Against subs : 4 teams (6 votes : 2 GMs and 4 co-GMs)

So we aren't going to make subs. We still have plenty of picks to do though. We're only half way our first two drafts, and we have 6 drafts to make, including the three deepest.

FlyHigh is going to miss the next 2-3 days and he gave me a list... I'm going to make his pick fo the L1 and we have a common list for the BOTR. :)

Yes he is. Very good.

Is Simao any good?

I keep hearing Jose wants to get rid of Robben for Simao.

Robben is better and Simao is overrated.

Robben is better, I agree, but I disagree about Simao being overrated.
Well, obviously, it depends on how you consider him rated in the first place.

Robben is better, I agree, but I disagree about Simao being overrated.
Well, obviously, it depends on how you consider him rated in the first place.

I think Simao is good, but he's definately not in the top tier. Cristiano Ronaldo for example is much better.

I'd say Simao right now is more steady, more consistant and more complete than Ronaldo. That said, Ronaldo has much more potential when he puts it together in the near future.

I'd say Simao right now is more steady, more consistant and more complete than Ronaldo. That said, Ronaldo has much more potential when he puts it together in the near future.

More steady and more consistent probably, but Ronaldo is already better. Ronaldo is more complete than Simao. Ronaldo is proving himself in one of the biggest leagues which Simao has yet to do and Ronaldo has done better with Portugal since he's joined the NT.

Ronaldo is more complete than Simao.
Well I disagree. In the future, I'd agree, but right now, Ronaldo has a lot of holes in his game that Simao doesn't have.

Well I disagree. In the future, I'd agree, but right now, Ronaldo has a lot of holes in his game that Simao doesn't have.

Simao doesn't have holes, he's just got one big hole.

Simao doesn't have holes, he's just got one big hole.
:shakehead

i've seen both play well over 30 times each and say that ronaldo on any given night can be better, but you don't know what is going to happen. Simao, is similar in that he is also inconsistent(not as much), and scores in bunches, but he is also more mature, and passes the ball more effectively. They both play similarly and can both be shut down, or can explode on any given night. Simao might be better just because he makes better decisions right now. However, Ronaldo's game-to-game potential is greater.

Simao -
negatives - weak left foot, constantly cutting back for effective crosses
poor strength
and like every Portuguese player can argue a lot and be thrown off his game

Ronaldo - not as fluid a passer yet
missing from entire games some times
poor decision making

All in all i would play them both over Figo in WC if Figo can't make his runs down the wings in Game 1, therefore i have solved nothing :D

I have an important question regarding the drafts. I'll give you an example.

A If we're doing a Scottish Premier League draft and there is a player owned by a Scottish club who is loaned out to a side in Belgium, can we draft that player for the Scottish draft?

and conversely

B If we are having a Belgian draft, can we draft that player for the Belgian draft?


Which is allowed, A or B?

Absolutely.
We draft player where they play RIGHT NOW.
Not 6 months ago, not 3 months from now, and not from the league their original team belongs to (in case of a loan).
Otherwise, Bruno Cheyrou couldn't have been drafted in the L1 draft.

Absolutely.
We draft player where they play RIGHT NOW.
Not 6 months ago, not 3 months from now, and not from the league their original team belongs to (in case of a loan).
Otherwise, Bruno Cheyrou couldn't have been drafted in the L1 draft.

OK, a simple A or B would have been sufficient. :shakehead

OK, a simple A or B would have been sufficient. :shakehead
Oh sorry... :shakehead

I have a suggestion for judges.

We could make a ranking at each position...
Example : 6 teams (6 posters)
For GK, we rank the 6 players chosen from 1 to 6. The 1st earn 6 pts, the 2nd, 5 pts... to 1 point.
Same for CB, LB, RB...

We cumulate the points. Each judge makes his ranking, and we cumulate the points from eavery judge. The more points won the draft... I hope my idea is clear! What do you think?

I have a suggestion for judges.

We could make a ranking at each position...
Example : 6 teams (6 posters)
For GK, we rank the 6 players chosen from 1 to 6. The 1st earn 6 pts, the 2nd, 5 pts... to 1 point.
Same for CB, LB, RB...

We cumulate the points. Each judge makes his ranking, and we cumulate the points from eavery judge. The more points won the draft... I hope my idea is clear! What do you think?

I do like that idea and that would be a great feedback for every player you´ve chosen.

I have a suggestion for judges.

We could make a ranking at each position...
Example : 6 teams (6 posters)
For GK, we rank the 6 players chosen from 1 to 6. The 1st earn 6 pts, the 2nd, 5 pts... to 1 point.
Same for CB, LB, RB...

We cumulate the points. Each judge makes his ranking, and we cumulate the points from eavery judge. The more points won the draft... I hope my idea is clear! What do you think?
We could do that, but it would imply that the players have the same value regardless of their position.
Which would have influenced the way we picked.
Plus, how do you rank the DMs or CBs against one another (since you have two usually)?

I'm much more for a full ranking with comment.
For instance, I'd rank a team X 1st, and give a full scouting report on its weaknesses and strenghs (according to me obviously).

I don't like this method because there's too much bias IMO. And it comes down to rank a team higher because of 1-2 players, without taking the weakness in account...
By ranking each players by position, there's no bias... and we can rank CB and DM from max 12 (6+6) to mini 2 (1+1) if you prefer... (if it's 6 posters, I didn't verify)... As each judge makes it's own list, with a comment, by adding the whole rankings you eliminate the bias...

That's the way I see the thing but I have a hard time to explain it in english! :D

But again, if there's a big gap between player A and player B, it should holld more importance than a small gap between player C and player D who are about equal.
With your system, it counts the same.

As I said, by making thorough comments about your choices you eliminate the bias.

But again, if there's a big gap between player A and player B, it should holld more importance than a small gap between player C and player D who are about equal.
With your system, it counts the same.

As I said, by making thorough comments about your choices you eliminate the bias.

I think it's creating a bias. By saying there's a gap between A and B, what criteria do you use? team, experience, injury...?? And the comment is also a bias because nobody will judge on the same criterias... :)

But with multiple judges, biases will go away.
Again, the difference between Clerc and Reveillere is not big, but the difference between say... Ronaldinho and Deco (no offense to Deco) is huge. Yet they could be one point different in your rankings, which could be the same as Clerc and Reveillere.
Judging the whole team means avoiding such problems.
And to boot, you also have to judge the organizations (if you play with three strikers, how do you compare them with an offensive midfielder from another team that plays a 4-5-1 for instance?), the balance of each team, etc...

Sorry, I completely disagree with your proposal.
Now if majority wants to make it this way, I'll bow down, but until then I find this idea very bothering.

How about that:

Taking each position and making a list (GK, CB, LB, RB, DM, etc) and handing out points. From 10 (top choice) to 1 (pretty useless). You´re able to hand out 10 points twice if you do think (as a judge) that there have been two top choices at GK for example. You don´t have to hand out a 9,8,7,6 if all other GKs are really far apart from those top 2 for example.

That system would give a real report (or listing of the strength the team picked).

I don't like the idea of adding points.
Once again, if strikers is the deepest position, then you absolutely have to get 3 or 4 strikers to get more points than someone who plays a 4-4-2.

I'm fine with adding marks to each pick, a mark for organization and balance in the comments, but I think we should stick to a regular ranking of all 6 teams.

The suggested partial judgements could be done to provide info, opinions, reports, whatever.. but should not be the ultimate way to decide the rankings imo. I think Evilo's determents are due. On top of that, rankings by positions couldn't count in how a player would fit in that particular position and system, nor how a team would look as a whole..

As for bias on players, that would be inevitably involved anyway.
I guess what you are referring to and fearing is an unconscious bias towards/versus teams (owners); if that bias was conscious in fact, you couldn't do anything about that (it would still be there judging each teams' player).

If it's unconscious, maybe a mere sum of rates by positions would partially (the judger still knows who each players belongs to..) help, but imo it would be potentially way more detrimental than useful for proper judgement .

I think we can all trust the multiple judges top avoid any dumb bias, either towards the players, the teams of the players, the Gms, etc...

I mean, I'm a PSG fan, and I'm very high on Ribéry for instance.

We're all intelligent persons that will try to be as objective as possible.
However, I feel I should not rank The Rage's team on my list. I'll only have 5 teams. Same for Beli, he should not rank Flyhigh's team.
Seems only fair and logical.

I'm with Evilo on this one. Besides, somebody could use bias in ranking the players anyway and then the points would factor the bias in for sure.

I agree with Evilo on this one, I think we should just rank on teams. I also agree that Beli shouldn't judge my team. He's been really helpful to me considering my less than stellar knowledge of L1.

I'll give you a real life example of why we shouldn't use this player ranking system: Real Madrid. Just because somebody has the best or a lot of the best players doesn't mean they always fit together into a team.

I'll give you a real life example of why we shouldn't use this player ranking system: Real Madrid. Just because somebody has the best or a lot of the best players doesn't mean they always fit together into a team.

of course, Chelsea would be a reason why we should. :D

of course, Chelsea would be a reason why we should. :D

Oh, I didn't know we basing these ranking on transfer fees. :sarcasm:

Ok no problem :)
It was just a suggestion and I follow the majority. ;)

I follow the majority. ;)

:shakehead Republicans. ;)

I'm thinking of pulling out guys....I've been in a bit of a cram hell lately, with more to come, and after that, I go to England for a month (including a Villa-Sunderland match...should be a blast), so not only will I miss drafting for Germany, Spain, etc, I'll likely end up missing judging the EPL. As much as I want to keep up with it, it'd be pretty retarded of me to, as I won't be able to from the UK. I don't know what we should do, I didn't exactly think of that when I signed up, and I don't know if anyone's waiting int he wings..but..that's my thoughts on it

ouch.
We have to find you a replacement.
Belgian Fan?
Juni?
Strizzi?
Someone?

I'm thinking of pulling out guys....I've been in a bit of a cram hell lately, with more to come, and after that, I go to England for a month (including a Villa-Sunderland match...should be a blast), so not only will I miss drafting for Germany, Spain, etc, I'll likely end up missing judging the EPL. As much as I want to keep up with it, it'd be pretty retarded of me to, as I won't be able to from the UK. I don't know what we should do, I didn't exactly think of that when I signed up, and I don't know if anyone's waiting int he wings..but..that's my thoughts on it

Well it does sound like you're busy. Think you can at least finish up the BOTR and L1 drafts since they're already started? L1 is nearly done and BOTR is moving along quickly enough. Then we can just take you off for the rest of the drafts (not because we want to mind you).

Well it does sound like you're busy. Think you can at least finish up the BOTR and L1 drafts since they're already started? L1 is nearly done and BOTR is moving along quickly enough. Then we can just take you off for the rest of the drafts (not because we want to mind you).

that sounds best...i'll make up whatever picks I've missed after my exam im leaving for :p

that sounds best...i'll make up whatever picks I've missed after my exam im leaving for :p

Thanks for sticking it out man! :thumbu:

Not to jump the gun, but since the L1 draft is close to being done, what's the next one?
My daughter will make the draw as soon as we're done with the L1 draft (hopefully in the next couple of days).

Come on guys, we're almost done and we'd be able to start some other leagues.

I think I might have the time to spare to take part in the Calcio one if a spot opens.

I think I might have the time to spare to take part in the Calcio one if a spot opens.
Well, we'd like to replace GoM, who says he doesn't have enough time.
For that however, you'd have to participate in the 4 remaining drafts.
If you're OK with that, I think you can go and make the remaining BOTR and L1 picks he has to make.

I tend to agree with you.
It's getting painful.
If nobody has an objection, we'll wait 24 hours and then it's free for all.
After all, you can always send a list to a judge and that's it.

OK, let's get it done, everyone can make their pick and forget about the delayed 24 hours.

I'm not certain about taking over his picks mid-draft, wouldn't be comfortable, but possibly for all the others. I'll make a call when I know which draft is next.

Alright

Im back from Finals

Kind of worried how many picks I have to make...sorry guys

edit: Juni, you can go right ahead too...i have no list, no idea who to pick, and no point since im gone soon anyway....so...I have no problem if you wan tto do it, unless you really don't

You can make 2 L1 picks and 2 BOTR picks.

Btw, so everyone knows, I give Juni all my permission to draft in BOTR and L1 if he wants..if not, I'll finish it, but whenever he gets this...s'all yours if you want :)

So guys who takes over?
We need someone to replace GoM for the last 4 drafts (3 since he dosn't compete in the EPL draft), and it'd be great if the last BOTR and L1 picks could be made as well.

So guys who takes over?
We need someone to replace GoM for the last 4 drafts (3 since he dosn't compete in the EPL draft), and it'd be great if the last BOTR and L1 picks could be made as well.
Doesnt his post above yours give the answer?

Well, I haven't heard from Juni, so...

So guys who takes over?
We need someone to replace GoM for the last 4 drafts (3 since he dosn't compete in the EPL draft), and it'd be great if the last BOTR and L1 picks could be made as well.

We can just do without replacing GoM in the three drafts I would think.

We can just do without replacing GoM in the three drafts I would think.
Too bad he wasnt in the EPL draft. I would have replaced him there.

We can just do without replacing GoM in the three drafts I would think.I would disagree, only four drafting teams sucks big time..

Did anyone PM Juni?

I did, obviously. No answer yet.

I'll provisionally take over everything, sure, although I'll need a little bit this afternoon/evening to work out who's available to be drafted and what needs drafting in L1/BOTR.

L1 picks are already done Juni, just keep an eye on the BOTR draft.
If you don't want to finish that draft, O=S will do it, and you'll start drafting in the last 3 drafts.

And since the L1 draft is complete (we only lack GB's list), my daughter will make another draw right now.

And the league will be... EPL!

And the first pick goes to...

hehe, me!

I'd rather have the first pick in la Liga, but...
The order :
1- Evilo
2- PK
3- O=S/Bakos
4- Belizarius
5- Les Habs

What about letting 12# Peter Bondra to take part even if he won't have a team in the other drafts?

I'm not against it, but it would ruin the final rankings (with all leagues).
However, he could team up with Juni and thus we'd have a 6th team in the EPL draft.

However, he could team up with Juni and thus we'd have a 6th team in the EPL draft.I guess it would be the best solution.
I'm not against it, but it would ruin the final rankings (with all leagues).Otherwise, he would qualify for the EPL rankings only and you could still have the overall ranking (not ruined) for the teams taking part in every draft.

I PMed both asking if they'd like to team up.
I'll wait for their answer before starting the EPL draft.
If they agree, my daughter will draw a number from 1 to 6 to know where they'll draft.

PM-ed about 5 min ago.

I'd prefer to just judge the EPL one really.

You'd judge the EPL, but participate in all 3 other drafts.
Peter Bondra would handle your team in the EPL draft (so you wouldn't judge his team).

So Peter will take over GoM's team for the EPL, and Juni for the Calcio/Liga/Bundesliga, is everyone OK?

My daughter drew number 6, so Peter will draft in 6th (and 7th) place in the draft.

My daughter drew number 6, so Peter will draft in 6th (and 7th) place in the draft.
Your daughter doesnt like me :(.

Anyway, its good for me as I can pick 2 in a row so nobody will have to wait for me.

6th and 7th is arguably nearly as good as 1st and 12th.
Only in the spanish league is it worth it to have the 1st overall.

6th and 7th is arguably nearly as good as 1st and 12th.
Only in the spanish league is it worth it to have the 1st overall.

It's definately worth it in the EPL draft too as you've with your first overall pick.

But the second overall isn't a bad player either. He's nearly on par with the first.
In the spanish league, there's a drop off after the first pick.

But the second overall isn't a bad player either. He's nearly on par with the first.
In the spanish league, there's a drop off after the first pick.

I'd hardly say it's a massive drop off, more of a baby step, perhaps a toddler's fall to the floor away from the first player.

But the second overall isn't a bad player either. He's nearly on par with the first.
In the spanish league, there's a drop off after the first pick.

Well that depends on who you're talking about as the second pick. IMO there is one guy is pretty much on par (especially when you consider what position he plays). However I can see an entirely different guy go second and this isn't even the "brickie" draft. :D We'll talk more AFTER the picks are made.

I can't comment on Spain. Loose lips sink ships.

Since the BOTR draft is pretty much over (only the rankings need to be done), my daughter will make another draw...
I remind everyone that Juni (L1), Rage/myself (EPL) and Bakos/O=S (BOTR) can't have the first pick.

So the league will be...

The
Bundesliga (ouch, that one will hurt me)!

The first pick will go to...

Flyhigh/Belizarius!

Draft order :
1- Flyhigh/Belizarius
2- Juni
3- PK
4- O=S/Bakos
5- Les Habs
6- The Rage/Evilo

Hey guys, something's not right with our orders.
Since we can't pick twice 1st overall (and that's IMO fair), nobody should pick 2nd or 3rd too many times while someone shouldn't pick 6th too many times.

I was looking at where everyone's drafted so far :
Fly/Beli : 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th -> haven't picked 2nd and 6th yet.
O=S/Bakos : 1st, 3rd, 5th, 4th -> haven't picked 2nd and 6th yet.
Juni/GoM/PB : 1st, 2nd, 4th, 6th -> haven't picked 3rd and 5th yet.
Evilo/TR : 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 6th -> haven't picked 4th and 5th yet.
So all goes well, no team has picked twice in the same spot for these 4 teams.
However :
PK : 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th -> will get a 1st overall in the Liga since he doesn't draft in the Calcio draft. ->kind of unfair in his favour

Les Habs : 5th, 5th, 6th, 6th -> sure he refused the 1st overall in the L1 draft, but still he has been abused by the draws so far. He'll get a 1st overall in the Calcio since he judges the Liga draft.

So what I propose is that rather than a full draw, my daughter will choose for the next draft where ech team picks out of the spots they've never been drafting. That way for the 4 teams that haven't picked twice at the same spot.

Since we have only 5 teams for the two drafts left, the order would be :
Calcio :
1- Les Habs
2- O=S/Bakos or Flyhigh/Beli
3- Juni
4- Evilo/The Rage
5- O=S/Bakos or Flyhigh/Beli

Liga
1- PK
2- O=S/Bakos or Flyhigh/Beli
3-Evilo/The Rage
4-Juni
5-O=S/Bakos or Flyhigh/Beli

My daughter would only have to draw who gets the second and 5th pick in each draft.

Still we'll have to remember that PK got a bit of an advantage, and Les Habs got a bit of a disadvantage.
Which means that IMO, if with the overall standings we get a tie involving one of these teams, we should rank them accordingly.
For instance, if team A is tied in points with Les Habs, then Les Habs should have the tiebreaker and if team B is tied in points with PK, then Team B should have the tiebreaker.

Fair to everyone?

Who, that's becoming serious...
Ok to me! :)

BTW, when we're done with the draft, why don't we all make up a collective All-Star squad of players you selected throughout all the drafts?

BTW, when we're done with the draft, why don't we all make up a collective All-Star squad of players you selected throughout all the drafts?Nice idea (if i am not supposed to judge the resulting teams!!)

BTW, when we're done with the draft, why don't we all make up a collective All-Star squad of players you selected throughout all the drafts?

Count me out. If I can't get anybody from Barça, forget about it.

My daughter drew Calcio!

And she drew Flyhigh/Beli the second pick.

Meaning we have this order :
1- Les Habs
2- Flyhigh/Beli
3- Juni
4- Evilo/The Rage
5- O=S/Bakos

I'm creating the thread right now.

:lol:

Oh man, I'm conflicted now... First pick, that's an awful lot of pressure. Who am I going to pick?

Let's hope I don't **** this up. :D

Normally I don't care who is drafted when in terms of how I view the final team, but if you f this up I may have to reconsider. :teach: :D

I have a suggestion. How about a World Cup draft? I know it's been suggested. A few rules that I would suggest though:

1 No more than three players from one NT.
2 A bench of 5 subs.

I have a suggestion. How about a World Cup draft? I know it's been suggested. A few rules that I would suggest though:

1 No more than three players from one NT.
2 A bench of 5 subs.


I'm in!




By the way, could I join the Liga draft?

as someone's partner yes.

Don't we only have 5 guys for the La Liga draft? I think there's room for Captain Conservative to draft a team seeing as how we haven't even drawn the draft order yet. Actually in fairness though I could see making him go last, but IMO there's still room for him.

Same thing as Alexander the Great. He needs a partner.

Same thing as Alexander the Great. He needs a partner.

Oh yeah, because of the OVERALL standings thing. Forgot.

PK and I will be teaming up to run the table in the Liga draft. :D

I have a suggestion. How about a World Cup draft? I know it's been suggested. A few rules that I would suggest though:

1 No more than three players from one NT.
2 A bench of 5 subs.Sounds good, did you guys start the EPL draft, I don't see it anywhere.

Here are the rankings so far :

Bundesliga :
1st: Evilo/The Rage 5 points average of 1.66
2nd: Juni 6 points average of 2
3rd: O=S/Bakos 6 points average of 3
4th: PK 12 points, average of 4
T5th:
Fly High/Belizarius 14 points average of 4.66
Les Habs 14 points average of 4.66

EPL :
1- Les Habs
2- Evilo
3- PK
4- O=S/Bakos
5- PB
6- Belizarius

BOTR :
T1- Evilo/The Rage 2nd, 2nd, 2nd average : 2
T1- Les Habs 4th, 1st, 1st average : 2
3- PK 1st, 3rd, 3rd average : 2.33
4- Flyhigh/Belizarius 4th, 4th, 4th average : 4
5- Bakos 5th, 5th average : 5
6- GoM 5th, 6th, 6th average : 5.66

L1 :
1- The Rage (1st, 1st) Average : 1.00
2- PK (1st, 2nd, 4th) Average : 2.33
3- O=S/Bakos (3rd, 3rd, 2nd) Average : 2.66
4- Les Habs (5th, 2nd, 3rd) Average : 3.33
5- Flyhigh (4th, 5th) Average : 4.5
6- GoM (5th, 6th) Average : 5.5

Here are the rankings so far :

Bundesliga :
1st: Evilo/The Rage 5 points average of 1.66
2nd: Juni 6 points average of 2
3rd: O=S/Bakos 6 points average of 3
4th: PK 12 points, average of 4
T5th:
Fly High/Belizarius 14 points average of 4.66
Les Habs 14 points average of 4.66

EPL :
1- Les Habs
2- Evilo
3- PK
4- O=S/Bakos
5- PB
6- Belizarius

BOTR :
T1- Evilo/The Rage 2nd, 2nd, 2nd average : 2
T1- Les Habs 4th, 1st, 1st average : 2
3- PK 1st, 3rd, 3rd average : 2.33
4- Flyhigh/Belizarius 4th, 4th, 4th average : 4
5- Bakos 5th, 5th average : 5
6- GoM 5th, 6th, 6th average : 5.66

L1 :
1- The Rage (1st, 1st) Average : 1.00
2- PK (1st, 2nd, 4th) Average : 2.33
3- O=S/Bakos (3rd, 3rd, 2nd) Average : 2.66
4- Les Habs (5th, 2nd, 3rd) Average : 3.33
5- Flyhigh (4th, 5th) Average : 4.5
6- GoM (5th, 6th) Average : 5.5

Wouldn't it make more sense to give as many points as your place? IE first place gets one point.

Exactly what I did.
Example :
"2nd: Juni 6 points average of 2"
Juni racked up 6 points by three judges : average of 2.
The reason why I put averages is because some of us didn't get judged by the same number of judges as others (in case of a partner judging).

Exactly what I did.
Example :
"2nd: Juni 6 points average of 2"
Juni racked up 6 points by three judges : average of 2.
The reason why I put averages is because some of us didn't get judged by the same number of judges as others (in case of a partner judging).

So I get 4 points for the L1 draft then right?

So I get 4 points for the L1 draft then right?
Oh you mean for the overall rankings?
Yes we'll get points according to our rank (1-2-3-4-5-6), but I'll do that when all drafts are done.

Oh you mean for the overall rankings?
Yes we'll get points according to our rank (1-2-3-4-5-6), but I'll do that when all drafts are done.

OK. So then based on your tiebreaker rule don't forget to give me sole possession of first place in BOTR and sole possession of fifth place in the Bundesliga draft.

Then I assume at the end we add up the total of our places and divide by the number of drafts we participated in, right?

Yeah, don't forget that. :D

Don't remind me. That wasn't a pleasant draft. :(

Don't remind me. That wasn't a pleasant draft. :(

:biglaugh:

Just because of the past three post, and also because of your acumen in the EPL draft, I am going to read the bundesliga draft thread.

OK. So then based on your tiebreaker rule don't forget to give me sole possession of first place in BOTR and sole possession of fifth place in the Bundesliga draft.

Then I assume at the end we add up the total of our places and divide by the number of drafts we participated in, right?
I was thinking rather of the tiebreaker as an overall tiebreaker.
Like if you're tied for second for instance over the 6 drafts, you'll have the second place and not the third.
That's because your disadvantage was overall (and PK's advantage was overall as well). That would be a bit unfair for instance to give you the tiebreaker in the Serie A draft since you pick first.
The reasonning behind the tiebreakers was regarding the overall rankings.

As for the overall standings, we'll indeed divide since two teams will only have played 5 drafts.


So far (without averages since all teams have 4 drafts) :
1- Evilo/The Rage 5 points (1+1+2+1)
2- Les Habs 11 points (1+5+1+4)
3- PK 12 points (4+3+3+2)
4- O=S/Bakos 15 points (3+4+5+3)
5- Juni/GoM/PB 19 points (5+2+6+6)
6- Flyhigh/Beli 20 points (5+6+4+5)

We're waiting for the following rankings to close out the 6 chapters draft :
Bubbles, Helicecopter and GB (Serie A).
Les Habs, Belgian Fan (Liga).

Here are the rankings so far :

Bundesliga :
1st: Evilo/The Rage 5 points average of 1.66
2nd: Juni 6 points average of 2
3rd: O=S/Bakos 6 points average of 3
4th: PK 12 points, average of 4
T5th:
Fly High/Belizarius 14 points average of 4.66
Les Habs 14 points average of 4.66

EPL :
1- Les Habs
2- Evilo
3- PK
4- O=S/Bakos
5- PB
6- Belizarius

BOTR :
T1- Evilo/The Rage 2nd, 2nd, 2nd average : 2
T1- Les Habs 4th, 1st, 1st average : 2
3- PK 1st, 3rd, 3rd average : 2.33
4- Flyhigh/Belizarius 4th, 4th, 4th average : 4
5- Bakos 5th, 5th average : 5
6- GoM 5th, 6th, 6th average : 5.66

L1 :
1- The Rage (1st, 1st) Average : 1.00
2- PK (1st, 2nd, 4th) Average : 2.33
3- O=S/Bakos (3rd, 3rd, 2nd) Average : 2.66
4- Les Habs (5th, 2nd, 3rd) Average : 3.33
5- Flyhigh (4th, 5th) Average : 4.5
6- GoM (5th, 6th) Average : 5.5

Liga :
1. Juni 2 points
2. PK/CC 4 points
T3. Evilo/The Rage 7 points
T3. O=S/Bakos 7 points
5. Flyhigh/Beli 10 points

We only lack the Calcio rankings (Bubbles and GB).

We still need GB's calcio standings to close out this draft.
I've PMed him, but I guess he's busy.

Well I don't know about you guys, but I think we should get this things wrapped up, and so we should forget about GB's rankings, as he seems to busy these days.

Anyway, here are the Serie A rankings :
1- Evilo/The Rage 5 points (2+2+1)
2- FlyHigh/Beli 6 points (1+3+2)
3- les Habs 7 points (1+3+3)
4- Juni 12 points (4+4+4)
5- Ott/Bakos 15 points (5+5+5)

Final rankings :
1- Evilo/The Rage average of 1.5
2- Les Habs 2.8 (wins the tie breaker)
3- PK 2.8 (loses the tie breaker)
4- Juni/PB/GoM 3.5
5- O=S/Bakos 3.83
6- Flyhigh/Beli 4.5

Congrats to all, it was fun and a good learning (at least for me).
A special congratulation to Juni who took over a team that had ranked 6th, 6th and 5th (though it must be said that there were the hardest drafts for most people), and managed to get his own team ranked 2nd, 1st and 1st in the remaining three drafts.

Thanks all, and we should to this once a year IMO, so see ya next year for this game.