US team announced

Goalies:
Schneider
Frazee

Defensemen:
Chorney
J.Johnson
Butler
E.Johnson
Lee
Niskanen
Mitera

Forwards:
Oshie
Fritsche
Ryan
Davis
Porter
Paukovich
Wheeler
Schremp
Gerbe
Skille
Mueller
Kessel
Bourque

link??

link??

Go to usahockey.com and click on NEWS on the left side.

It's on TSN also.


Congratulations Bobby Ryan, Americna fans will love him.

That is one heck of a team.

Very impressive group of youngsters! Now let's just see if they can put it all together as a team.

http://www.usahockey.com/usa_hockey/news/main/n236/news_06junior_120505/

Is the general feeling down south that there will be an open competition for the #1 goalie spot, or is it Schneider's to lose?

http://www.usahockey.com/usa_hockey/news/main/n236/news_06junior_120505/

RR, In the other thread you mentioned you believed the following guys from outside the NCAA would make the team;
Mike Sauer
Bobby Ryan
Rob Schremp
Adam Pineault
Matt Lashoff
A.J. Thelen
Brandon Dubinsky
Peter Mueller
Keith Yandle
Chris Bourque

Only 4 of those guys ended up making it. Are you happy with that team? I'm personally pretty disappointed that Keith Yandle wasn't named because I really wanted to get a good look at him because I drafted him in my Sim league. He has apparently been possibly the best defenseman in the Q this year, so him being left off has to be a surprise, especially since hes such a great skater.

That is one heck of a team.

Yep, no doubt. On paper, definetly the best team in the tourney. But I'm still reluctant (let my bias be noted :)) to consider them anything more than a co-favourite at this point. They are playing in Canada, a definite advantage for the home side, and despite turnover, there is still something to be said about defending a championship. That said, the loss of Brule is really going to hurt Canada I think. He might have been the best player in the tournament this year, especially in his hometown.

It should be a fun tournament, as always. And I certainly wouldn't be surprised in the least if another team besides the U.S./Canada wins it. Other than those rare years where one team is simply that much better than everyone else (ie. Canada last year), this tournament can be so unpredictable.

Paukovich made it, eh?

RR, In the other thread you mentioned you believed the following guys from outside the NCAA would make the team;
Mike Sauer
Bobby Ryan
Rob Schremp
Adam Pineault
Matt Lashoff
A.J. Thelen
Brandon Dubinsky
Peter Mueller
Keith Yandle
Chris Bourque

Only 4 of those guys ended up making it. Are you happy with that team? I'm personally pretty disappointed that Keith Yandle wasn't named because I really wanted to get a good look at him because I drafted him in my Sim league. He has apparently been possibly the best defenseman in the Q this year, so him being left off has to be a surprise, especially since hes such a great skater.


I really thought Lashoff would make it. I kinda thought Yandle would too. The thing I'm MOST suprised about is not taking TWO returning players, Pineault and Weller. Kyle must have felt that Geoff Paukovich and Nate Davis could fill those roles better.

I would have probably gone with Lashoff or Yandle over Mitera, but I can live with that. Strong team, as expected.

Any thoughts on line combinations? who the 13th forward and 7th defensemen are? Captains?

Oshie.I'd heard his name bandied about but it did'nt sound like anyone thought he was a favourite to make the team.Anyone surprised?

Brandon Dubinsky is a top 10 scorer in the WHL and Michael Sauer deserves to be on the team.Ridiculous :shakehead

I thought the idea was to pick the best American players,not the best eligible American college kids :madfire:

Brandon Dubinsky is a top 10 scorer in the WHL and Michael Sauer deserves to be on the team.Ridiculous :shakehead


Top 5 Scorer in the WHL. 1st in the league in Points per Game ratio.

Sauer is better then some of the defensmen picked. What a joke.

Politics, politics, politics. :shakehead

Oshie.I'd heard his name bandied about but it did'nt sound like anyone thought he was a favourite to make the team.Anyone surprised?

After his start at ND, I don't think anyone should be surprised.

After his start at ND, I don't think anyone should be surprised.
What's his numbers like there so far?

I'm glad to see Geoff Paukovich make the team, didn't think he would

Top 5 Scorer in the WHL. 1st in the league in Points per Game ratio.

Sauer is better then some of the defensmen picked. What a joke.

Politics, politics, politics. :shakehead


Have you actually seen ALL of the players invited to Team USA evaluation camp play and spoken to everyone involved in the selection process? How do you know it's politics? Just curious

Top 5 Scorer in the WHL. 1st in the league in Points per Game ratio.

Sauer is better then some of the defensmen picked. What a joke.

Politics, politics, politics. :shakehead

Dubinsky has been in the WHL for 4 years!!! He should be in the top 5 scoring in the league. Who would you have taken him ahead of?

Keith Yandle should be on this team.

He is by far the top scoring dman in the Q and he is dominating in all 3 zones.

Do you think they black balled him for coming up to the Q??

Dubinsky has been in the WHL for 4 years!!! He should be in the top 5 scoring in the league. Who would you have taken him ahead of?


Paukovich. 3 Assists in 16 games? Wow. Take a look at all 4th year players in the WHL, are they a top 5 scoring in the WHL? :shakehead

Like Bob McKenzie says they are definitely the Gold Medal favorites going in. They have some serious firepower and a great defense. They should be a treat to watch.

It has to be dissapointing for Shawn Weller to not be there, after making the team last year and improving noticeably this year, at least offensively.

Lee and Yandle on the 1st PP would have been scary. :)

I guess Niskanen isnt bad either.

US had a plethera of puck moving PP types to pick from. Niskanen, Lee, Yandle, Lashoff, etc.

Paukovich. 3 Assists in 16 games? Wow. Take a look at all 4th year players in the WHL, are they a top 5 scoring in the WHL? :shakehead

So, you think that ALL players who are the top scorers should be on the team regardless, right?

Hmmmm, I seem to recall a player on Team USA's roster a couple of years ago named Jake Dowell. Not a big time scorer and to this day still isn't but guess what he won a gold medal with Team USA. Not bad for some guy who is more of "supoorting role" player on a team.

So, you think that ALL players who are the top scorers should be on the team regardless, right?

Hmmmm, I seem to recall a player on Team USA's roster a couple of years ago named Jake Dowell. Not a big time scorer and to this day still isn't but guess what he won a gold medal with Team USA. Not bad for some guy who is more of "supoorting role" player on a team.

Well goodie for Dowell, this is a short tournament and each team brings the best they have. This isn't a 3 week Olympics where a few role players wouldn't hurt. And is even Paukovich a role player? Or are this what your saying because he obviously has limited offensive talent?

Well goodie for Dowell, this is a short tournament and each team brings the best they have. This isn't a 3 week Olympics where a few role players wouldn't hurt. And is even Paukovich a role player? Or are this what your saying because he obviously has limited offensive talent?

So youd rather have Andy Delmore on your team than Adam Foote??

Good to know.

Points arent the be all end all.

Paukovich. 3 Assists in 16 games? Wow. Take a look at all 4th year players in the WHL, are they a top 5 scoring in the WHL? :shakehead

I'll agree, I'm not thrilled with the Paukovich pick but I can some what understand it. The US team is LOADED with skill and scoring. While this years team is a little bigger than lasts, it didn't really have any punishing, intimidating hitters - in come Paukovich. Obviously he won't be counted on to put up numbers but if he plays his role and punishes the other teams defense than I have no problem with him.

So, you think that ALL players who are the top scorers should be on the team regardless, right?

Hmmmm, I seem to recall a player on Team USA's roster a couple of years ago named Jake Dowell. Not a big time scorer and to this day still isn't but guess what he won a gold medal with Team USA. Not bad for some guy who is more of "supoorting role" player on a team.


Agree wholeheartedly. This is just rationalization as to why prospects from their favorite teams weren't picked. The "NCAA over CHL-politics" argument doesn't fly, this year. Much of the team is from the CHL. It could be that the guys USA brass felt were best for the team were selected, and they had reasons for not picking the others. As I said, the only thing I personally would have changed was Lashoff or Yandle over Mitera or MAYBE Chorney.

So youd rather have Andy Delmore on your team than Adam Foote??

Good to know.

Points arent the be all end all.

Who is talking defensemen? I'd easily have a defensive dman over a offensive dman because the offense is suppose to provide the offense, where the defense provides the defense.

Why didn't they name a 3rd goalie and have it a 23 man roster, isn't that what its supposed to be anyways?

Dubinsky has been in the WHL for 4 years!!! He should be in the top 5 scoring in the league.

I don't really understand what this has to do with anything. I believe the team is suposed to be composed of the best American players under 20, period. Are you saying that a less succesful player should be picked ahead of Dubinsky because he's younger?

I'm not saying that Dubinsky should have been picked, but I don't know how you can look at the number of NCAA guys on this roster and the number of CHL guys and say that there was absolutly no bias towards one or the other (and I say this as a big college hockey fan.)

I'll agree, I'm not thrilled with the Paukovich pick but I can some what understand it. The US team is LOADED with skill and scoring. While this years team is a little bigger than lasts, it didn't really have any punishing, intimidating hitters - in come Paukovich. Obviously he won't be counted on to put up numbers but if he plays his role and punishes the other teams defense than I have no problem with him.
i thought Jack Johnson was a punishing intimidating hitter?

That's what he's been billed as around here for the last year anyway :dunno:

Who is talking defensemen? I'd easily have a defensive dman over a offensive dman because the offense is suppose to provide the offense, where the defense provides the defense.

You also need kids who will PK and check.

You dont take the 14 most talented forwards and see what happens.

You need the Maltby's and the Drapers of the world.

Forwards need to play defense too. Do you know how hockey works??

Well goodie for Dowell, this is a short tournament and each team brings the best they have. This isn't a 3 week Olympics where a few role players wouldn't hurt. And is even Paukovich a role player? Or are this what your saying because he obviously has limited offensive talent?

First off, what are basing your assumptions about Paukovich on? If all you're basing it on is what is on the stat sheet, then you are totally missing the boat on what Paukovich can or can't do. I think you're underestimating him as a player.

I'm happy with anyone that was picked from Team USA's evaluation camp list because regardless who got chosen, they're all excellent players and each brings something unique and special to the team. That said, there are also many good players who got left off for one reason or another as well. What this shows is the depth that the Americans have and I, for one, am glad to see that the US, regardless of what league they play in/for, can produce some of the best young hockey players in the world.

Agree wholeheartedly. This is just rationalization as to why prospects from their favorite teams weren't picked. The "NCAA over CHL-politics" argument doesn't fly, this year. Much of the team is from the CHL. It could be that the guys USA brass felt were best for the team were selected, and they had reasons for not picking the others. As I said, the only thing I personally would have changed was Lashoff or Yandle over Mitera or MAYBE Chorney.


Seriously, do a little work before making comments. ONLY 3 out of 22 players are from the CHL.

i thought Jack Johnson was a punishing intimidating hitter?

That's what he's been billed as around here for the last year anyway :dunno:

Sorry, I forgot. Johnson has been known to throw a hit or two! ;)

You also need kids who will PK and check.

You dont take the 14 most talented forwards and see what happens.

You need the Maltby's and the Drapers of the world.

Forwards need to play defense too. Do you know how hockey works??

Canada did this at the 1998 Olympics in Nagano, naming the likes of Rob Zamuner to the club.

Canada opted to take the best 13 forwards they had at the 2002 Olympics in Salt Lake City.

Certainly just one instance, but if you look at the way 1998 went compared to 2002 in terms of building strategy, I think Gretzky might disagree.

Sorry, I forgot. Johnson has been known to throw a hit or two! ;)
That's what i thought,o.k. :)

RR, In the other thread you mentioned you believed the following guys from outside the NCAA would make the team;
Mike Sauer
Bobby Ryan
Rob Schremp
Adam Pineault
Matt Lashoff
A.J. Thelen
Brandon Dubinsky
Peter Mueller
Keith Yandle
Chris Bourque

Only 4 of those guys ended up making it. Are you happy with that team? I'm personally pretty disappointed that Keith Yandle wasn't named because I really wanted to get a good look at him because I drafted him in my Sim league. He has apparently been possibly the best defenseman in the Q this year, so him being left off has to be a surprise, especially since hes such a great skater.


I'm surprised by some of the omissions, but don't feel that will diminish the quality of the team. I actually think this is a stronger DEFENSIVE group than I originally envisioned. Guys like Lashoff, Thelen, and Yandle are great transition players, but Mitera, Chorney, Butler, and Niskanen are excellent in their own zone, which is what this team needs, especially with how loaded this team is up front.

Seriously, do a little work before making comments. ONLY 3 out of 22 players are from the CHL.

I was counting players like Bourque that were supposed to play in the CHL this year, altogether giving me 5.

Could it be that maybe...just maybe...no bias was involved, and rather, your favorite team's prospects weren't the best for the job? Maybe they're not as good as you think they are?

I was counting players like Bourque that were supposed to play in the CHL this year, altogether giving me 5.

Could it be that maybe...just maybe...no bias was involved, and rather, your favorite team's prospects weren't the best for the job? Maybe they're not as good as you think they are?

I think the U.S. brass learned it's lesson from last year's fiasco. Instead of going with an all-out offensive club, much more balance is being brought to the table. I love the defense, and the offense is top-notch, No complaints out of me.

Agree wholeheartedly. This is just rationalization as to why prospects from their favorite teams weren't picked. The "NCAA over CHL-politics" argument doesn't fly, this year. Much of the team is from the CHL. It could be that the guys USA brass felt were best for the team were selected, and they had reasons for not picking the others. As I said, the only thing I personally would have changed was Lashoff or Yandle over Mitera or MAYBE Chorney.

The USA brass has really earned the benefit of the doubt :shakehead

Last year,they chose Brian Lee over Jack Johnson.Lee was a deer in headlights when he was on the ice which wasn't often

The problem with USA Hockey's approach begins with the organizational flowchart -- from president Ron DeGregorio, to executive director Doug Palazzari and senior directors Art Berglund and Jim Johansson, there isn't one person who's clearly in charge of the team.

"There's a lack of clear leadership," said one Western Conference NHL team's pro scout familiar with USA Hockey. "You can't be consistent when there's so much confusion at the top."

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=1959790&type=story

I was counting players like Bourque that were supposed to play in the CHL this year, altogether giving me 5.

Could it be that maybe...just maybe...no bias was involved, and rather, your favorite team's prospects weren't the best for the job? Maybe they're not as good as you think they are?


Wow, a mod trying to bait people? Tisk tisk. You got caught in your false info statement, suck it up.

Canada did this at the 1998 Olympics in Nagano, naming the likes of Rob Zamuner to the club.

Canada opted to take the best 13 forwards they had at the 2002 Olympics in Salt Lake City.

Certainly just one instance, but if you look at the way 1998 went compared to 2002 in terms of building strategy, I think Gretzky might disagree.

They didnt take the best 15 forwards at all. They took grinders as well.

The USA brass has really earned the benefit of the doubt :shakehead

Last year,they chose Brian Lee over Jack Johnson.Lee was a deer in headlights when he was on the ice which wasn't often



http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=1959790&type=story

I think if you're a reasonable person, you'll agree that the correct approach is being taken this year when it comes to picking the team.

I think if you're a reasonable person, you'll agree that the correct approach is being taken this year when it comes to picking the team.

I like the team, but do you really think that no biases was given to college players? 3 to 19 is just two wide of gap for me to conclude that there was no prefferance given for to the NCAA guys.

Why doesn't the U.S. hold a selection camp in December?Canada does it.Most of the other countries do it

A quote from Hurricanes head scout Sheldon Ferguson who was head scout for Hockey Canada from 1992-95, winning gold three times

"There are kids they miss because they only get a look at them at their summer camp. That's a long time at this age group from August to December," he said.

http://www.londonknights.com/press/display_news.asp?news=293

Michael Sauer missed the evaluation camp in the summer recovered from his hip surgery.Did Hockey USA even watch Sauer play this season for Portland? :shakehead

I like the team, but do you really think that no biases was given to college players? 3 to 19 is just two wide of gap to conclude that there was no prefferance given for to the NCAA guys.

I don't know that you can make that claim... the fact is that most of the top US players go the NCAA, and the opposite is true for Canada, where I would guess only 4 NCAA players are chosen.

Top Canadian players choose CHL more often than not.
Top American players choose NCAA more often than not.

I think if you're a reasonable person, you'll agree that the correct approach is being taken this year when it comes to picking the team.

Are they same the people picking the team this year?YES

Are they same the people picking the team this year?YES

Are they the same people that picked the team when we won gold? Yes, with the exception of Walt Kyle.

Wow, a mod trying to bait people? Tisk tisk. You got caught in your false info statement, suck it up.


I'm not baiting you. I think you're being unreasonable and bitter because your prospects weren't picked, when no one else seems bothered by their omission. Sauer is someone I could see being picked next year, but if you look at the rosters that people were throwing out as guesses, Dubinsky wasn't really on many's radar.

I don't know that you can make that claim... the fact is that most of the top US players go the NCAA, and the opposite is true for Canada, where I would guess only 4 NCAA players are chosen.

Top Canadian players choose CHL more often than not.
Top American players choose NCAA more often than not.

There's lots of American talent in the CHL that got left of the team that you could make a very good argument for being on the team. Go look at the thread about non-NCAA guys that posters expected to make the team. My point is that there was COMPARABLE (read, not necisarily better) talent available in the CHL and they chose to go with the camparable NCAA guys. I'm not unhappy with this, as I said: I like the team. But I think there is definatly a bias towards NCAA players that factored into some of these decisions.

I'm not baiting you. I think you're being unreasonable and bitter because your prospects weren't picked, when no one else seems bothered by their omission. Sauer is someone I could see being picked next year, but if you look at the rosters that people were throwing out as guesses, Dubinsky wasn't really on many's radar.

All im saying is look at the people picked from the CHL, all pretty much future star players in the NHL(Schremp, Ryan, and Mueller(maybe not so much a sure thing with him yet)) , it seems like all they did was pick those few players and the rest went to the NCAA and the USA Junior team.

All im saying is look at the people picked from the CHL, all pretty much future star players in the NHL(Schremp, Ryan, and Mueller(maybe not so much a sure thing with him yet)) , it seems like all they did was pick those few players and the rest went to the NCAA and the USA Junior team.


but that's just it. those that made it impossible NOT to pick them...were picked. the rest were at least close with NCAA\USNTDP kids...and in the end, familiarity won. I don't think that going with a known commodity is a bad idea. In fact, it might be a little safer than a high risk\high reward guy.

It's normal that the US team will be biased toward NCAA players. As it's normal the team Canada will favorise CHL guys.

Russia do it too with guys in the CHL too, you can't appreciate players you almost never see.

I am suprised that Thelen didn't get his chance. His game is starting to evolve and he is adjusting to the WHL style of play. When he first came into the league he didn't play in his end very well but now he is probably the Raiders best rounded D-man.

Walt Kyle knows both the NCAA, the CHL, the AHL and NHL because he's coached in all these places as well as coaching in this tournament on multiple occassions with all kinds of different US teams- he is not playing politics, folks. He's trying to win a medal, preferrably gold, to quote a recent hockey movie - he's "not looking for the best players, he's looking for the right ones."

Walt Kyle obviously wants more than 22 most talented or best-known US players - he wants a team with defined roles for each player to play - scorers, grinders, hitters, puck carriers, passers, grit, etc. This is something Canada has done well for years, and he only has a short time to put the team together so he needs to build team chemistry and players who know each other already. He's obviously putting together a team for the small ice sheet in Vancouver. Had the tourney been in Europe this year, you'd see a lot of different faces, but it's in Canada this year so he wants a team that will be focused on the task and won't be distracted by by the large Canadian media presence, and will able to play on the small sheet.

As to NCAA/CHL bias, I don't really think that plays big role in the process. Canadian Hockey often selects CHL players over comparable NCAA players because the Canadian coaches know these players better - not because the players are really better than one another. They are looking to build chemistry. So does Team USA. Accordingly there is probably an element in USA Hockey that prefers the college players over a CHL player if the abilities and roles are similar. But unlike some US coaches in the past who don't know much about the CHL, Kyle does - he's been a head coach in the WHL, so if anyone can appreciate talent levels in American coaching, Kyle knows.

My point here is that this is not a best talent collection, nor do they pick the guys with best stats. They are trying to build a TEAM.

I am suprised that Thelen didn't get his chance. His game is starting to evolve and he is adjusting to the WHL style of play. When he first came into the league he didn't play in his end very well but now he is probably the Raiders best rounded D-man.


ya, a little surprised here too...oh well, AJ...enjoy that bus ride to Brandon :sarcasm:

Nice, pass up the guy who's second in the W in points per game and can fill a grinder role. :shakehead
Dubinsky generates energy and offense out of nothing.

The US does not hold an in-season evaluation camp because they don't want the college players (the majority of the US pool) to miss any more classes than they already do with regular season travel, and weekends are out becuase that's when most colleges play games. With only 35 games each year, college coaches don't want players to miss them, because each game means so much.

The USA holds an evalution camp in August (in non-school time) for the top 40-45 prospects and then scouts the ones they are considering for the team as the season progresses. The US pool is still smaller than the Canadian pool, so this system works for them.

I've got to admit that I'm a little confused by adding Paukovich... and he's even an Oiler prospect. I've not seen him play at all, but it was my impression that he was a huge disappointment this year. Am I wrong (people whove actually seen him play)? The only thing I hear about him is either him not scoring, or him injuring people.

Pretty disappointed to see Yandle miss out - he made a big effort to show a two-way game and as well as being the highest scoring defenseman in his league, he owns the best plus-minus too. There was a lot of competition though and they seem to have gone with the NCAA guy every time its close.

I don't think you can be overly critical of the team. This is one year where the US is in the enviable position of turning away some tremendous players. This is similar to the debate that follows the selection of every Canadian national team. It is simply an outstanding year for US born players. This is something we should be celebrating!

It is easy to criticize but when you look at the roster it becomes hard finding someone, who was selected to play, to leave off. Ultimately the success of the selection process can be judged by the medal the team wins, or does not.

PAKO :shakehead :biglaugh:

I've got to admit that I'm a little confused by adding Paukovich... and he's even an Oiler prospect. I've not seen him play at all, but it was my impression that he was a huge disappointment this year. Am I wrong (people whove actually seen him play)? The only thing I hear about him is either him not scoring, or him injuring people.


Paukovich has been disappointing this year as an offensive scorer for Denver, but that won't be his role with Team USA. Kyle certainly picked Paukovich to play a physical, hitting role to create space for other Team USA snipers on the small ice sheet in Vancouver. In that role, Paukovich's selection makes perfect sense. Paukovich probably wouldn't make this team if the tournry was in Europe on the big ice, but Kyle will need physical presence to stand up to Canada in Canada, and he's counting on Paukovich to play that role.

Anyone have thoughts on line combinations? Any players they'd like to see play with each other??

Is anyone surprised at the two players that made last years team and are still eligible for this years team that were not selected; Adam Pineault, and Shawn Weller

Anyone know reasons for Pineault not being selected? Did injury play a part?

Walt Kyle knows both the NCAA, the CHL, the AHL and NHL because he's coached in all these places as well as coaching in this tournament on multiple occassions with all kinds of different US teams- he is not playing politics, folks. He's trying to win a medal, preferrably gold, to quote a recent hockey movie - he's "not looking for the best players, he's looking for the right ones."

Walt Kyle obviously wants more than 22 most talented or best-known US players - he wants a team with defined roles for each player to play - scorers, grinders, hitters, puck carriers, passers, grit, etc. This is something Canada has done well for years, and he only has a short time to put the team together so he needs to build team chemistry and players who know each other already. He's obviously putting together a team for the small ice sheet in Vancouver. Had the tourney been in Europe this year, you'd see a lot of different faces, but it's in Canada this year so he wants a team that will be focused on the task and won't be distracted by by the large Canadian media presence, and will able to play on the small sheet.

As to NCAA/CHL bias, I don't really think that plays big role in the process. Canadian Hockey often selects CHL players over comparable NCAA players because the Canadian coaches know these players better - not because the players are really better than one another. They are looking to build chemistry. So does Team USA. Accordingly there is probably an element in USA Hockey that prefers the college players over a CHL player if the abilities and roles are similar. But unlike some US coaches in the past who don't know much about the CHL, Kyle does - he's been a head coach in the WHL, so if anyone can appreciate talent levels in American coaching, Kyle knows.

My point here is that this is not a best talent collection, nor do they pick the guys with best stats. They are trying to build a TEAM.

Thank you for the excellent post and helping to clarify my earlier point.

I'll add one thing here. Just because the US camp is held in August doesn't necessarily mean that's the end of the team evaluation process because if that were the case, we'd have all heard/read the announcement back in September. These kids are evaluated from the camp through to almost the day the team is announced in December. This is how the selection process (as I understand it) works for Team USA, and it doesn't matter WHICH side of the border the player is playing on. If they've been invited, they're looked at and studied.

I like this team, although I have to admit to being a bit surprised about Paukovich's selection myself. Nevertheless, I think he's a wonderful addition and hopefully will be a big contributor.

They didnt take the best 15 forwards at all. They took grinders as well.

Who would you define as grinders from the 2002 Olympic Team?

Who would you define as grinders from the 2002 Olympic Team?

Peca was definately a grinder.

Apart from that, IIRC there weren't many. I think Shanahan, Smyth, and Nieuwendyk were added for their grit... not that they weren't good forwards, but I think there were forwards skipped with more offensive pop for them.

Who would you define as grinders from the 2002 Olympic Team?

Peca off the top of my head.

Wow. talented team on paper. Our offense could be lethal.
Only weak points could be in goal and a pretty young defense (only 2 '86s and even an '88 made it).

Peca off the top of my head.

A big reason Peca was selected was because of his Face off ability. I believe that had more pull over him being a grinder.

A big reason Peca was selected was because of his Face off ability. I believe that had more pull over him being a grinder.

That and pk... which I would definately consider choosing forwards. Ability to pk has little correlation to offensive flair... but I'm not sure whether these American junior players selected ahead of offensive players are good at pk.

A big reason Peca was selected was because of his Face off ability. I believe that had more pull over him being a grinder.

You can be a grinder and be good at face offs.

You can be a grinder and be good at face offs.

I didnt say you couldnt. I said I felt a bigger reason he was on the team was because of his face off skills and not so much as they just wanted a grinder on the team.

Pineault was out with a pulled groin plus a hip pointer and missed a number of games. He returned a few weeks ago and is doing well.
16games- 9g, 11a = 20 pts.

Are they the same people that picked the team when we won gold? Yes, with the exception of Walt Kyle.

If Marc Andre Fleury doesn't implode in the third period and Al Montoya doesn't stand on his head to even keep the game close going into the third,Canada wins the gold

Montoya wasn't going to be the #1 goaltender but Jimmy Howard was unable to play w/his injury

Brandon Dubinsky has been one of the top players in the WHL since the middle of last season.Dubinsky is a tenacious player.A leader on his team

Michael Sauer is quality player

Walt Kyle shouldn't expect a Christmas gift this year from his old boss in Edmonton and New York-Glen Sather ;)

There's lots of American talent in the CHL that got left of the team that you could make a very good argument for being on the team. Go look at the thread about non-NCAA guys that posters expected to make the team. My point is that there was COMPARABLE (read, not necisarily better) talent available in the CHL and they chose to go with the camparable NCAA guys. I'm not unhappy with this, as I said: I like the team. But I think there is definatly a bias towards NCAA players that factored into some of these decisions.

The USA Team historically picks the team mostly from the NCAA. Playing in the CHL doesn't mean a player is any less American and should be given the same chance to play for the USA. Picking 2 - 88's over other exceptional players is questionable.

A big reason Peca was selected was because of his Face off ability. I believe that had more pull over him being a grinder.

Peca was taken for his grinding defensive play.

Nieuwendyk was the guy that they took to specialize in face-offs.

really disappointed that dubinsky and sauer didn't get picked, but i'll admit there is bias there being they are ranger prospects. i can ***** all i want about 'politics' and how they tend to not pick CHL guys. and true or not, the reality is if it were other guys bump and ranger prospects added i wouldn't complain...

overall pretty solid team

The USA Team historically picks the team mostly from the NCAA. Playing in the CHL doesn't mean a player is any less American and should be given the same chance to play for the USA. Picking 2 - 88's over other exceptional players is questionable.

These coaches are team building, not necessarily picking the best players.

On Team USA, If a CHL player is demonstrably better than any NCAA player for a given role, the US will take the CHL player without question. The 'problem' comes when you have players of very comparable skills and abilities - that's where you are likely to see the NCAA player get the nod over the CHL player, and usually its because the coach knows the NCAA player better or they think the team chemistry will be better by having a majority of players who know each other well.

The same thing happens on Team Canada in reverse. The NCAA player had better be demonstrably better than the CHL player, or the NCAA player isn't going to be picked. When the a CHL player and a NCAA player are equal, Canada is going to take the CHL player, for the same reasons that the US coach is likely to take a college player.

Both Team Canada and Team USA often pick a very young player or two that will see little ice time, but who they think may be a future leader in their programs in future years.

just to note, they are a fairly old team (by wjc standards), up front the only guys eligible to return next year are kessel, skille, ryan, and gerbe and of those 4 good chance that kessel and ryan will be in the nhl and therefore not available...in net this is schneider's final year. the blueline is much younger and chris butler is the only guy that won't be eligible next year (although they could easily lose jack johnson and brian lee to the nhl)...so in other words team usa has to take care of business and get the job done NOW because there won't be a next year for this squad. things will look a lot different next year.

even though paukevich is a good choice as a big role player, i still find it surprising. he hasnt been effective imo at all this year - not really as a role player even. i dont know if the bina thing is still bothering him or what, but he hasnt been himself this year. even if he was scoring, he wouldve only made the team as a checker. he can definitely be effective in that role, hopefully being on that kind of stage gets him going.

even though paukevich is a good choice as a big role player, i still find it surprising. he hasnt been effective imo at all this year - not really as a role player even. i dont know if the bina thing is still bothering him or what, but he hasnt been himself this year. even if he was scoring, he wouldve only made the team as a checker. he can definitely be effective in that role, hopefully being on that kind of stage gets him going.


Paukovich is getting better each weekend, although it isn't showing up on the scoresheet yet. He is still struggling to shoot well and score goals, but his skating, smart physical play and sense of discipline are improving rapidly. He had a very effective weekend series last weekend against Colorado College where he made a lot of things happen for his teammates, and if he can bang and create space for Team USA, that's all he needs to do. I think playing for Team USA should help him improve as well.

Is anyone surprised at the two players that made last years team and are still eligible for this years team that were not selected; Adam Pineault, and Shawn Weller

Anyone know reasons for Pineault not being selected? Did injury play a part?
Strange, especially considering Weller is having a MUCH better season this year than last.

Wow. talented team on paper. Our offense could be lethal.
Only weak points could be in goal and a pretty young defense (only 2 '86s and even an '88 made it).

I would say I'm glad that Team USA didn't take guys like Thelen, Lashoff, Dubinsky, Yandle, etc. Definitely an advantage for the other countries.

I don't understand some of Team USA's thinking, but I guess they still have some excellent talent up from that they are going to have to really rely on. Team USA is still going to be one of the younger teams at the tourney as year after year they seem like they just have to bring along a bunch of 17 and 18 yr olds! I am not totally impressed with the overall team as some real good players(Dubinsky is good) were left off for some youngsters. I mean remember last year with Brian Lee, he was like a deer in headlights out there and had like maybe 2 shifts all tourney! Erik Johnson get ready!

Overall, the forwards look good, I am not sure about the Defence, especially if they get an injury or two, I just think they could have had more depth and the goaltending, well, Schneider sucked last year and I think Frazee was pretty good at the U18's and he could be the guy! They could suffer at this position, but should have enough offence to get by in most games.

Peca was definately a grinder.

Apart from that, IIRC there weren't many. I think Shanahan, Smyth, and Nieuwendyk were added for their grit... not that they weren't good forwards, but I think there were forwards skipped with more offensive pop for them.

Peca had 60 points that year. Zamuner had 26 the year he was selected. I think they were a different breed of player.

This team should knock the stuffing out of the Canadian team. The Americans are getting better every year. Look at the projected top players in the draft. Most are Americans.

According to McKeen's the top 4 defensemen in the draft in the 06 draft are American.

I'm not upset really about Dubinsky missing out.

More about Sauer who I definately feel is better than most of the USA defense at this stage in his career.

I would say I'm glad that Team USA didn't take guys like Thelen, Lashoff, Dubinsky, Yandle, etc. Definitely an advantage for the other countries.

I don't understand some of Team USA's thinking, but I guess they still have some excellent talent up from that they are going to have to really rely on. Team USA is still going to be one of the younger teams at the tourney as year after year they seem like they just have to bring along a bunch of 17 and 18 yr olds! I am not totally impressed with the overall team as some real good players(Dubinsky is good) were left off for some youngsters. I mean remember last year with Brian Lee, he was like a deer in headlights out there and had like maybe 2 shifts all tourney! Erik Johnson get ready!

Overall, the forwards look good, I am not sure about the Defence, especially if they get an injury or two, I just think they could have had more depth and the goaltending, well, Schneider sucked last year and I think Frazee was pretty good at the U18's and he could be the guy! They could suffer at this position, but should have enough offence to get by in most games.

No offense, but I think your confusion stems from a lack of familiarity with many if not most of the U.S. players from the NCAA. I don't expect you to know guys like Nate Davis, Chris Butler, Mark Mitera, or Matt Niskanen, but I can tell you they are every bit as capable as the guys you named. Besides, much of this team played together on the U.S. U18 team, a pattern that led to great success for the U.S. two years ago. Again, this is a TEAM optimally-suited for a short tournament, not an All-Star squad, although the fact there's 18 NHL draft picks, many of them in the first round, and several more (Kessel, Mueller, Johnson, Mitera) that will be top 15 NHL draft picks this year which seem to indicate a fairly talented roster.

As for the goaltending, I'm not sure why Schneider continues to get lambasted. He was the back-up last year, and while he didn't fare well that has no bearing on how he'll do this year. He's also playing well at the moment (with the exception of his last start), and with such a strong defense in front of him should be just fine.

This team should knock the stuffing out of the Canadian team. The Americans are getting better every year. Look at the projected top players in the draft. Most are Americans.

According to McKeen's the top 4 defensemen in the draft in the 06 draft are American.

You could be right, but remember, Canada doesn't have its two best players, who already made their NHL club, and would most certainly be impact players in this tourney.

This is the problem with the WJC, it never actually has the best U20's, its a shame.

I'm not upset really about Dubinsky missing out.

More about Sauer who I definately feel is better than most of the USA defense at this stage in his career.


I would have liked to see Dubinsky on the team as well, but let's be honest, is his absence all that critical? No. Is he playing all that better than a guy like Nate Davis (who has had a great year at Miami)? No. As for Sauer, it's the same story. He's played well (while in the line-up), but durability is a question and again, guys like Butler and Niskanen are playing just as well.

People miss chemistry in the selection too. Johnson, Johnson, Mueller, Skille, Kessel all played together. The last years a guy like Stafford gets picked over Earl. Earl is way better offensivly. Stafford is a team player. He will jell much quicker with any 2 forwards out there. Earl if his timing is off, is not nearly as good. In a short tournament you want players like Stafford.

And wasn't there some coach that won a big game some years back that said " I am not looking for the best players, i am looking for the right players." :dunno:

Well goodie for Dowell, this is a short tournament and each team brings the best they have. This isn't a 3 week Olympics where a few role players wouldn't hurt. And is even Paukovich a role player? Or are this what your saying because he obviously has limited offensive talent?
come on, you have to be one of the dumbest people ive ever seen post.

you dont pick the team based on stats.

you dont just pull out a stat sheet from every league and highlite the guys with the most points. do you?

if you did, why are their camps and tryouts, etc?

you pick the team based on the best COMBINATION, best MAKEUP, what you think will work the best on the ice and off it. what you think will create the best CHEMISTRY?

do you think every top scorer played on the miracle team?

People miss chemistry in the selection too. Johnson, Johnson, Mueller, Skille, Kessel all played together. The last years a guy like Stafford gets picked over Earl. Earl is way better offensivly. Stafford is a team player. He will jell much quicker with any 2 forwards out there. Earl if his timing is off, is not nearly as good. In a short tournament you want players like Stafford.

And wasn't there some coach that won a big game some years back that said " I am not looking for the best players, i am looking for the right players." :dunno:

Well put, I've quoted Herbie a few times on here about the same thing, because this tournament is so short you have to have good chemistry. Think about this, Porter, Davis, Fritsche, Paukovich, Schneider, J. Johnson, Gerbe, Skille and Kessel all took silver in the U-18's two years ago. They lost to a VERY good Russian team that included Malkin. Last year Kessel, Skille, J.Johnson, Mitera, E.Johnson, Mueller, Frazee and Gerbe all won gold at the U-18's. It's tough to argue with that success.

Defenseman Michael Sauer returned from nursing his bruised shoulder Nov. 12 and Portland went on its best streak (five wins in row) of the year. Coincidence? No. The steady 18-year-old from Minnesota is the Hawks’ pillar on the blue line. He had two goals Sunday against Tri-City and has a plus-10 rating, tied with Jannik Hansen for the team lead

http://www.portlandtribune.com/archview.cgi?id=32870

This team should knock the stuffing out of the Canadian team. The Americans are getting better every year. Look at the projected top players in the draft. Most are Americans.

According to McKeen's the top 4 defensemen in the draft in the 06 draft are American.

They may indeed win and are the favourites but it would seem you are seriously underestimating the Canadian team (or overestimating the Americans). I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see the Americans lose to Canada or Russia.

This team should knock the stuffing out of the Canadian team. The Americans are getting better every year. Look at the projected top players in the draft. Most are Americans.

According to McKeen's the top 4 defensemen in the draft in the 06 draft are American.
This is the stuff i love to hear...............your teams achilles heel exposing itself.

Come and get it darth,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we're waiting right here for you and your whole team of can't lose favourites.

Glad there's no anti-Bourque Backlash this year.

Glad there's no anti-Bourque Backlash this year.

I see Bourque being one of the captains.

can't wait for all the "ray bourque's kid" bs on american stations

http://www.portlandtribune.com/archview.cgi?id=32870


and?

nowhere in the article does it say "...and would be better than anyone else Team USA could choose for their blueline."

No one said Sauer's not a good prospect, but the committee picking obviously didn't feel he was the best option. It's not, and nothing is, worth getting this worked up about.

and?

nowhere in the article does it say "...and would be better than anyone else Team USA could choose for their blueline."

No one said Sauer's not a good prospect, but the committee picking obviously didn't feel he was the best option. It's not, and nothing is, worth getting this worked up about.

I pretty much guarantee you it was because he was injured for the summer camp and not because of his play.

As a fan of team Canada I am happy to see that team USA is not as good as it could be. :clap:

This team should knock the stuffing out of the Canadian team. The Americans are getting better every year. Look at the projected top players in the draft. Most are Americans.

According to McKeen's the top 4 defensemen in the draft in the 06 draft are American.
And there's been many of times when the top 4 players let alone defencemen were Canadian and we weren't yapping, Canada is ALWAYS a threat and we have produced the best players in the world, the United States probaly will win the gold, but every time Canada and the US have both had competitive teams Canada has always had the better team, the year you guys won the gold medal we had a better team, a fluke goal won it for you guys that year I still think either our team is underrated or you're team is overrated it's either one of the two but I for sure don't see you guys "beating the stuffing" out of us.

As a fan of team Canada I am happy to see that team USA is not as good as it could be. :clap:


Says who? This, to me, looks like the best team imaginable. Any changes would have been mostly lateral...

As a fan of team Canada I am happy to see that team USA is not as good as it could be. :clap:
:biglaugh: :biglaugh:

As a fan of team Canada I am happy to see that team USA is not as good as it could be. :clap:

Your happiness is misplaced. This team is about as good as it gets.

And there's been many of times when the top 4 players let alone defencemen were Canadian and we weren't yapping, Canada is ALWAYS a threat and we have produced the best players in the world, the United States probaly will win the gold, but every time Canada and the US have both had competitive teams Canada has always had the better team, the year you guys won the gold medal we had a better team, a fluke goal won it for you guys that year I still think either our team is underrated or you're team is overrated it's either one of the two but I for sure don't see you guys "beating the stuffing" out of us.
...so it begins :)

I dont know if he was eligible or not, but if he was, I would return Jeff Likens to the team. :biglaugh:

and?

nowhere in the article does it say "...and would be better than anyone else Team USA could choose for their blueline."

No one said Sauer's not a good prospect, but the committee picking obviously didn't feel he was the best option. It's not, and nothing is, worth getting this worked up about.

You are one getting worked up.I just wanted to point out Sauer was born in Minnesota and there are quality American kids who decide to go the major junior route instead of college hockey.Michael is a better player than most of the defensemen on the US team

I pretty much guarantee you it was because he was injured for the summer camp and not because of his play.

The injury which knocked out Sauer of the summer evaluation camp was a hip surgery to repair a birth defect.It was something beyond his control

That is one crazy team! though I dunno if it's better than the 2004 edition. I still think it could have been better. But the defense is woah. Having two guys under 5-8 might hurt in the finals though.

As a fan of team Canada I am happy to see that team USA is not as good as it could be. :clap:

They have an extremely strong team imo.

Reading some Americans' analysis, it seems like the '86 CHL guys such as Thelen, Lashoff, Dubinsky etc...wouldn't be that much of an improvement. I have to say I don't follow the NCAA too closely so at first glance it looked like they were missing those CHL guys, but I'm sure those NCAA guys will do fine. I'm sure they were close in talent, but things like chemistry etc...came into play.

My first instinct was to say they screwed up on those CHL prospects, but I don't follow the NCAA closely enough to know how good guys like Butler, Mitera, Davis etc...will be. Again, reading some comments though, it doesn't seem as though those CHL kids would have offered significant advantages.

Listening to the press conference, you can tell that a ton of deliberation goes on with a lot of very qualified hockey people before a coach makes a final decision on a player. Kyle has said over and over again that he doesn't care where a player plays during the season as much as what they bring to the team he's trying to build. With the depth of the talent pool he's got now, he will, by design, be leaving excellent hockey players off the team. In the early 90s when Kyle was a coach with this program, it was an absurd idea that the US would cut a first-round draft pick. Today, the pool is so much deeper, and he's got many options for each role he's trying to fill, so it's not all that surpising that some excellent players aren't going to make the team.

"Skill package" is just one of the components that the Kyle is looking for when they evaluate a guy - they aren't really looking at stat sheets very much, They are looking for guys that are playing well now, and they look for work ethic, ability to grasp concepts quickly, leadership, experience, chemistry, off-ice personality, and how they play during the season. Ultimately, though, the proof is on the ice when the pressure is on....

You are one getting worked up.I just wanted to point out Sauer was born in Minnesota and there are quality American kids who decide to go the major junior route instead of college hockey.Michael is a better player than most of the defensemen on the US team


According to you. You'll notice that no one that isn't a Ranger fan has a problem with Sauer being left off. In fact, some Ranger fans are fine with it, too. You have nothing to base the statement that he's "better than most of the defenseman on the US team." If he was, he would have been picked.

According to you. You'll notice that no one that isn't a Ranger fan has a problem with Sauer being left off. In fact, some Ranger fans are fine with it, too. You have nothing to base the statement that he's "better than most of the defenseman on the US team." If he was, he would have been picked.

This is one of the few times I completely disagree.

Sauer would've been one of the best d-men on the team most likely. He's perfectly fine in the hip department since it was surgically repaired and he is at 110%. It's a shame he was left off. I guarantee it was because of his surgery in the summer and his lack of exposure since then to the guys running the team. If it's not, then they are downright retarded.

Regarding Sauer, here's a comment from ushr.com...

"Micheal Sauer of the Portland Winter Hawks (WHL) was another candidate whose chances were hurt by injury, though he also didn't play particularly well when watched."

His stats look very good so far this year but I'll take thier word on it as I'm sure they spoke to people who were direstly involved in putting the team together.

I posted it awhile back on how I felt that the US team does have a CHL bias, and I still feel that way. When Bobby Ryan, Matt Lashoff, and A.J. Thelen were not chosen last year, it definitely made me wonder. But, they also didnt select Jack Johnson for that team, so you have a valid argument there. After reading all the posts on this I really do have to say some of the CHL kids got screwed because some were more talented. I gave a pre-lim roster a few weeks back on this team, and most of my guys are on this team with 2 big omissions: Matt Lashoff, and Michael Sauer. I am sure Chris Butler is a fine kid, but he is a surprise, as well as both Niskanen and Chorney, I felt only Niskanen would be picked. We can go on and on about this, but there is a bias, but it is not that bad of a thing.

I read an earlier post that said we should be happy and proud about the fact that this country is finally starting to put out a ton of talented players each year. I couldnt agree more. We are really starting to produce some players here, and we are finally catching up to Canada when it comes to top notch prospects for the draft. Competition is the best thing for this team and our hockey future, and this years WJC team is a prime example of it. Somebody had to be left off this team, and unfortunately it was mainly the CHL kids who really dont get to play with the majority of the team. Chemistry is the big issue here, and as long as Dubinsky, Lashoff, Yandle, Thelen, Collins, Sauer, etc. play in another league, they wont get chosen for this tourney.

How many Canadian kids playing in the NCAA get picked for their team? There are a solid group of Canadians in the NCAA right now, and maybe 1 or 2 might get picked for this team. The point is chemistry. I am a little upset about a few guys being left off, but nowhere near upset as I was compared to last years horrible picking process. This is a great team, probably our best ever, we really need to support them and just enjoy what they have a chance at doing this year. Go get em boys, it is going to be a tough fight!

And there's been many of times when the top 4 players let alone defencemen were Canadian and we weren't yapping, Canada is ALWAYS a threat and we have produced the best players in the world, the United States probaly will win the gold, but every time Canada and the US have both had competitive teams Canada has always had the better team, the year you guys won the gold medal we had a better team, a fluke goal won it for you guys that year I still think either our team is underrated or you're team is overrated it's either one of the two but I for sure don't see you guys "beating the stuffing" out of us.


Canadians not brag about their hockey players?? :biglaugh: You brag in your answer above. "Canada is ALWAYS a threat and we have produced the best players in the world" The year USA won we had superior defense and outstanding goaltending. Isn't that what wins in NHL playoffs? I'm not bragging just trying to push the buttons of the Canadian fans. I knew you Canadian fans would take that "stuffing" comment personally. Nothing like a good ole rivalary to get the juices flowing. Drop the puck and let 'em play.

Canadians not brag about their hockey players?? :biglaugh: You brag in your answer above. "Canada is ALWAYS a threat and we have produced the best players in the world" The year USA won we had superior defense and outstanding goaltending. Isn't that what wins in NHL playoffs? I'm not bragging just trying to push the buttons of the Canadian fans. I knew you Canadian fans would take that "stuffing" comment personally. Nothing like a good ole rivalary to get the juices flowing. Drop the puck and let 'em play.
oh definately,drop it.Crows a good dish too.

Let the games begin.

Apparently the St. Louis Blues website has an article where Kyle talks about a (presumably first) line of Oshie-Kessel-Schremp. I've seen a little of Oshie, and he may be a great fit here. He's relentless. He'll hit, and he'll win the puck and move it to these guys who can score.

Right now I'm listening to the radio broadcast for the NMU-WMU game and they have a Walt Kyle interview between periods concerning the USA WJ team. Here were some of the main points:
-traning camp in Victoria
-needs goaltending and chemistry in order to win the short tournament
-Russia is a strong team, Canada always good
-good opportunity to win gold
-headed to B.C right after the game today