My 2 cents on the Russians' taunting.

The other thread is full of crap, and I want to discuss this matter in a civilized fashion.. or at least try to..

Anyways, I'll start off by saying that I have not watched the game yet, and will only do so tomorrow when TSN *finally* shows it. I did however listen to the radio feed, and TSN has shown highlights from the game, so I came to some conclusions.

When the game started, Dowell (I think) took a run at Radulov who didn't even have the puck.. that was the first or 2nd penalty of the game (sorry, I don't remember for sure).. then a little later, Dowell again took a run at a Russian player, but this time it was from behind on Ovechkin.

Then as the game went on, somebody from the crowd threw a pink balloon on the ice, and chances are it wasn't a Russian fan considering most if not all of the arena was filled with Americans.

TSN then showed Shirokov listening to the fans after scoring his goal which btw was an amazing shot but that's not the point here, and I also saw Malkin taunting the American bench.

Now, while I'm extremely embarassed for these guys as I hate taunting and showboating, I think the Russians may not be as cocky as they are being shown up by the North American media. It seems to me that there have been some incidents prior to the Russian taunting that might've struck a nerve or two with the Russian players who paid back with taunting. Perhaps there have been more than a few dirty plays by the American players during the game that ticked off the Russian guys, and if that's the case, then I must say these guys came pretty close to taking the high road here.

Somebody in the US-Russia thread made a great point saying that it's better to taunt like this rather than go and break someone's neck like Bertuzzi did last season.

Lastly, Russia played 5 games so far in the tournament, scored 28 goals in these games. These guys obviously had plenty of opportunities to showboat and taunt other teams and players, but the only time such a thing happened is tonight. Maybe there was a reason for this? Maybe the US team did something to trigger this?

Ofcourse you could all just close our eyes and bash the Russians because a lot of you hate the team and the country and were raised to do so by the likes of Don Cherry.. it's just easier that way.. but watch the game tomorrow, and let's see that maybe the Russians aren't the only bad guys in this game.

Just my $0.02

I don't think anyone can really defend it. It was pretty lame, and it seemed like it was coaches orders considering how everyone was participating.

Watch the game, then tell us what you think. I do expect you'll defend your country, but if you see it objectively you'll see it was in very poor taste.

Dowell took a run at him? Believe me... there was no intent to injure or anything like that. It was just an average bodycheck that was away from the puck. I don't know what the call was, but it was your average interference/roughing penalty.

Pink balloon? What is that an assasination attempt? It was probably a little kid or a college guy like myself just drinking a bit too much and getting a little too rowdy. It happens in every sporting event. Beach balls in baseball, octopus in the Red Wings arena, rats in the Panthers arens. C'mon it halted play for 10 seconds at most. That was no sign of 'disrespect.'

Noone hates the Russians. After the Americans, they are probably my favorite team... or were. I personally respect that teams talent, but I lost a lot of respect for them as players. (I'm not saying I don't respect Russians - just those players on the team who laughed at, and taunted the Americans.) I have the utmost respect for Russian hockey, but wait til you see the dives every other shift. The Americans played undisciplined, but then you have players flopping all over the ice and then laying down til they saw their was no penalty then jumped right back up and rejoined the play. I would think those players would take some pride in their play.

There is no reason to try and embarass a team like that, it was just out of hand. Isn't a 6-2 win good enough? They'll show up the Americans then your AO, Malkin, and Radulov will come and make MILLIONS in the NHL. Bet they wont complain then. You should show some respect to the opposing team. I think the US deserved that much.

I don't think anyone can really defend it. It was pretty lame, and it seemed like it was coaches orders considering how everyone was participating.

And maybe it seemed like it was the coach's orders for the US players to start running the Russians early on in the game?

I didn't see anybody "running" anyone.

The worst thing was the Russian Player who pushed the net off in order to get a whistle when USA had a scoring chance.

That was pathetic.

The worst thing was the Russian Player who pushed the net off in order to get a whistle when USA had a scoring chance.

That was pathetic.

That was just a hockey play that shoulda been called. I don't blame that at all.

It was the taunting and disrespect that I didn't like.

It didnt bother me... The US played dumb, dirty hockey...

Watch the game, then tell us what you think. I do expect you'll defend your country, but if you see it objectively you'll see it was in very poor taste.

Dowell took a run at him? Believe me... there was no intent to injure or anything like that. It was just an average bodycheck that was away from the puck. I don't know what the call was, but it was your average interference/roughing penalty.

Pink balloon? What is that an assasination attempt? It was probably a little kid or a college guy like myself just drinking a bit too much and getting a little too rowdy. It happens in every sporting event. Beach balls in baseball, octopus in the Red Wings arena, rats in the Panthers arens. C'mon it halted play for 10 seconds at most. That was no sign of 'disrespect.'

Noone hates the Russians. After the Americans, they are probably my favorite team... or were. I personally respect that teams talent, but I lost a lot of respect for them as players. (I'm not saying I don't respect Russians - just those players on the team who laughed at, and taunted the Americans.) I have the utmost respect for Russian hockey, but wait til you see the dives every other shift. The Americans played undisciplined, but then you have players flopping all over the ice and then laying down til they saw their was no penalty then jumped right back up and rejoined the play. I would think those players would take some pride in their play.

There is no reason to try and embarass a team like that, it was just out of hand. Isn't a 6-2 win good enough? They'll show up the Americans then your AO, Malkin, and Radulov will come and make MILLIONS in the NHL. Bet they wont complain then. You should show some respect to the opposing team. I think the US deserved that much.


Well then you have 2 different schools of thought here. In North America, where tough hockey is customary, it's perfectly fine to take a few interference/roughing penalties.. In Russia it may be different.

In Russia, and the rest of Europe on the other hand, it's not out of place for players to dive, and they don't look at it as something extraordinary, instead they look at it as a way to get an edge on the other team through the ref..

To me, both are wrong. I in no way defend the taunting, I can't stand it. But taking runs at players without the puck, or shoving sticks up players' mouths is not very nice in my books neither.

And maybe it seemed like it was the coach's orders for the US players to start running the Russians early on in the game?

Seriously watch the game. Noone ran anybody. The 3 times anyone even got close to a bodycheck on AO they were the ones who hit the ground. The only intent to hurt anyone was Callahan right at the end who was probably humiliated, and was trying to stick up for him and his team.

The other thread is full of crap, and I want to discuss this matter in a civilized fashion.. or at least try to..

Anyways, I'll start off by saying that I have not watched the game yet, and will only do so tomorrow when TSN *finally* shows it. I did however listen to the radio feed, and TSN has shown highlights from the game, so I came to some conclusions.

When the game started, Dowell (I think) took a run at Radulov who didn't even have the puck.. that was the first or 2nd penalty of the game (sorry, I don't remember for sure).. then a little later, Dowell again took a run at a Russian player, but this time it was from behind on Ovechkin.

Then as the game went on, somebody from the crowd threw a pink balloon on the ice, and chances are it wasn't a Russian fan considering most if not all of the arena was filled with Americans.

TSN then showed Shirokov listening to the fans after scoring his goal which btw was an amazing shot but that's not the point here, and I also saw Malkin taunting the American bench.

Now, while I'm extremely embarassed for these guys as I hate taunting and showboating, I think the Russians may not be as cocky as they are being shown up by the North American media. It seems to me that there have been some incidents prior to the Russian taunting that might've struck a nerve or two with the Russian players who paid back with taunting. Perhaps there have been more than a few dirty plays by the American players during the game that ticked off the Russian guys, and if that's the case, then I must say these guys came pretty close to taking the high road here.

Somebody in the US-Russia thread made a great point saying that it's better to taunt like this rather than go and break someone's neck like Bertuzzi did last season.

Lastly, Russia played 5 games so far in the tournament, scored 28 goals in these games. These guys obviously had plenty of opportunities to showboat and taunt other teams and players, but the only time such a thing happened is tonight. Maybe there was a reason for this? Maybe the US team did something to trigger this?

Ofcourse you could all just close our eyes and bash the Russians because a lot of you hate the team and the country and were raised to do so by the likes of Don Cherry.. it's just easier that way.. but watch the game tomorrow, and let's see that maybe the Russians aren't the only bad guys in this game.

Just my $0.02

You didn'y even watch the game, but you're giving you 2 cents? What is wrong with you? That ball was on the ice when the Americans had the puck and going down ice.

I don't think anyone can really defend it. It was pretty lame, and it seemed like it was coaches orders considering how everyone was participating.

I only watched the 10 last minutes. When your team captain does it, the rest of the players will probably see it as a green light. (That being said, maybe they were taunting before Ovechkin did so, I didn't see the rest of the game).

I don't really think a coach would "order" such a thing but that being said, it's been many years of Russian cockiness and I think they aren't brought right as far as sportsmanship goes.

Not that I particularly care. Those things do not offend me but I think it hurts them in the grand scheme of things. As far as I'm concerned, it just adds to the drama. As long as it doesn't go overboard and the game can still be watched by children and nobody gets hurt, they can do whatever they want.

My $0.02 is that if Russia did this to say, Switzerland; you would all be raving about how entertaining Russia is to watch.

The simple fact is, the Americans played a very dirty game (O'Sullivan's high stick at the end was intentional), and deserved all that they got.

It will probably benefit many of these players who think they are on top of the world playing for their respective teams in Juniors and NCAA. Maybe they will get a reality check.

The biggest problem I have with it is that, as Russians, that's something they're going to carry with them for a while. An example would be Kovalev's "performance" in the playoffs, followed by the media dragging out the story from that game where Kovalev took a dive in the playoffs 10 years ago.

The simple fact is, the Americans played a very dirty game (O'Sullivan's high stick at the end was intentional), and deserved all that they got.



No, it wasn't intentional, and even if it was, Russia still got the 4 min power play. If the US got a pp for when the russian player cover the puck up in the crease or for knocking his own net off or diving then I probably wouldn't care. I hope #20 has to eat through a straw the next 2 months.

I watched everything BUT the last ~4 minutes. Dammit, the game was *over*, and I hadn't seen that particular Law & Order re-run before... but up to that point, the situation was clear: the Russian team definitely deserved to win. It was not a dirty game. There was the usual BS in an intense game (an "accidental" net dislodged, and an "accidental" high stick to the head), but it was within the usual boundaries.

Lastly, Russia played 5 games so far in the tournament, scored 28 goals in these games. These guys obviously had plenty of opportunities to showboat and taunt other teams and players, but the only time such a thing happened is tonight. Maybe there was a reason for this? Maybe the US team did something to trigger this?


I haven't seen the game. And among a great number of angry posts I have yet to see one that would attempt to address this point. The taunting indeed is in poor taste. I would not go as far as declare it classless. IMO it is more like a lack of proper manners, sorta like eating with your hands :D. That said, I have yet to see anybody trying to address the above point raised by Mr. MOGiLNY. Why did they do it in this of all games? Those who have seen the game, or better yet, been there, perhaps could shed some light on this.

My $0.02 is that if Russia did this to say, Switzerland; you would all be raving about how entertaining Russia is to watch.

I think of it the other way around. People would still be whining if Russia did it to the Swiss. However, if USA did that to Russia(assuming USA won), I know for a fact we'd see, "Hahhaah did j00 see Kessel do that cool dance move after scoring that goal?! Man he's so sweet! Kessel > Crosby" ...Followed by alot of :handclap: and :yo:

My $0.02 is that if Russia did this to say, Switzerland; you would all be raving about how entertaining Russia is to watch.

The simple fact is, the Americans played a very dirty game (O'Sullivan's high stick at the end was intentional), and deserved all that they got.

It will probably benefit many of these players who think they are on top of the world playing for their respective teams in Juniors and NCAA. Maybe they will get a reality check.

LoL, yea right. The Americans are putting on pressure to tie the game and a smart player like O'Sullivan is going to hit someone in the face with his stick? Not to mention it was a follow through, he was swinging his stick back down to the ice to get back into the play after he threw the puck in the zone.

Think they are on top of the world? :shakehead Who were the ones taunting? The US played hard. They knew the two best players in the tourney were on the the other team. Noones saying they were perfect, but that was totally out of hand.

I don't think anyone can really defend it. It was pretty lame, and it seemed like it was coaches orders considering how everyone was participating.

No, no one can defend it. They are, but it's ridiculous.

wait til you see the dives every other shift. The Americans played undisciplined, but then you have players flopping all over the ice and then laying down til they saw their was no penalty then jumped right back up and rejoined the play. I would think those players would take some pride in their play.

There is no reason to try and embarass a team like that, it was just out of hand. Isn't a 6-2 win good enough? They'll show up the Americans then your AO, Malkin, and Radulov will come and make MILLIONS in the NHL. Bet they wont complain then. You should show some respect to the opposing team. I think the US deserved that much.

I completely agree. Excellent post. I'd love to see them try and pull that bs in the NHL, they'd be choking on their teeth, as they should be.

And maybe it seemed like it was the coach's orders for the US players to start running the Russians early on in the game?

What about the run at one of our players with like a minute left? I can't remember the exact time but it was at least a minute or two left, and the score was already 7-2. And what about that second empty netter, was it really necessary?

How pathetic is it when a COACH is doing taunting as well? It's one thing when it's 17 and 18 year olds, even at that age you should know better than to act like a child, but a coach that's supposed to be an adult? Man. :shakehead

My $0.02 is that if Russia did this to say, Switzerland; you would all be raving about how entertaining Russia is to watch.

I don't know how anyone can defend it against any team. It's ridiculous.

No, it wasn't intentional, and even if it was, Russia still got the 4 min power play. If the US got a pp for when the russian player cover the puck up in the crease or for knocking his own net off or diving then I probably wouldn't care. I hope #20 has to eat through a straw the next 2 months.

No, it wasn't. And you bring up great points about the nets being purposely knocked off. That happened at least twice didn't it? No call.

I think of it the other way around. People would still be whining if Russia did it to the Swiss. However, if USA did that to Russia(assuming USA won), I know for a fact we'd see, "Hahhaah did j00 see Kessel do that cool dance move after scoring that goal?! Man he's so sweet! Kessel > Crosby" ...Followed by alot of :handclap: and :yo:

Oh, you know for a "fact" do you? Look around the board and you'll see differently.

I completely agree. Excellent post. I'd love to see them try and pull that bs in the NHL, they'd be choking on their teeth, as they should be.
I hear this response a lot. "I'd love to see them try that in the NHL, they'd get knocked out." I've seen Kovalchuk taunt players before, and he's still breathing.

Oh, you know for a "fact" do you? Look around the board and you'll see differently.

Yes, I do know for a "fact" because there are more than enough "Kessel Homers" and "USA homers" that give me "more than enough" "evidence" to "throw out" this "prediction" upon which my "fact" was "based" on.

Yes, I do know for a "fact" because there are more than enough "Kessel Homers" and "USA homers" that give me "more than enough" "evidence" to "throw out" this "prediction" upon which my "fact" was "based" on.



" " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " "

there ya go, just in case you run out.

Taunting's not really a problem if it's done at the right time and not excessively - i.e. I saw no problem with Shirokov scoring that penalty shot back in the first game and showboating in front of the crowd; a lot of kids would do that. That's called satisfaction from a very strong adrenaline rush after you score a goal. That celebration after his third goal also wasn't that out of place - it was indeed a great play.

But when it's so blatantly overdone it gets pretty stupid. Russia was having a three goal lead... No need to rub it in and agitate. Obviously the other team will get disappointed (understatement intended :)).

As far as diving is concerned - well, it's a plague out there in Europe. Nothing new here, and even though it's a problem, I don't think it's that much of a cancer to the game as some people think. Exaggerating penalties is common on every level now and is considered to be an advantage with all the borderline contact and annoying small hooks and grabs that became oh-so-prevalent on every level of hockey in the past ten years or so..

One thing I disagree with is comments like this: "If these [Russian] players ever want to make it to the NHL, they'll have to get some class." This **** is being said about the Russians on every WJ tournament - and yet there hardly is any problem when some of the more talented ones integrate into the NHL. Right now they might look distant and alien to the Canadian and American nat. teams, North American fans, broadcasters, and reporters - since they play on the other side of the world, but when they arrive here, they assimilate without a problem. A few years back Kovalchuk was looked at as a cocky, arrogant Russki from another planet (yes, that "oh, those Russians" austere mysteriousness) - but he seemed to have no problem once he got into the league and brought some of his likeable energy. (It took him a couple of diving penalties in the first few games to get that point, as well..) So don't sweat it, they are just kids playing hockey..

Pink balloon? What is that an assasination attempt? It was probably a little kid or a college guy like myself just drinking a bit too much and getting a little too rowdy. It happens in every sporting event. Beach balls in baseball, octopus in the Red Wings arena, rats in the Panthers arens. C'mon it halted play for 10 seconds at most. That was no sign of 'disrespect.'
The original poster may have believed the pink balloon was a political statement.

Heck, it may have been Don Cherry who threw it. :D

No, it wasn't intentional, and even if it was, Russia still got the 4 min power play. If the US got a pp for when the russian player cover the puck up in the crease or for knocking his own net off or diving then I probably wouldn't care. I hope #20 has to eat through a straw the next 2 months.

That last line is real classy :shakehead

I saw the hi-lites and checked the game stats and from what I saw, Ovechkin's goal made it 5-2, which sealed the deal and ensured Russia would face Canada for Gold, so his celebration of jumping into the bench is ok IMO.

Now, with the game 5-2 with 2:14 left, is there really a point in pullling Montoya again? But, given that this is the game to get into the Gold Medal game, I can understand that Sandelin didn't want to give up hope with 2:10 left, but still, 3 goals in 2 minutes?

As for Malkin's taunting, didn't like it. Again, seeing the hi-lites and game stats, I saw that Ryan Suter was assessed a slashing penalty at the time of the goal. He did take a pretty good two hander to Malkin's ankle. While, I hate to see taunting for any reason, I can understand Malkin wanting to vent after taking that whack from Suter. But, the best way to vent is to celebrate with your teammates and let the other team see that you're moving on and they aren't.

One thing I disagree with is comments like this: "If these [Russian] players ever want to make it to the NHL, they'll have to get some class." This **** is being said about the Russians on every WJ tournament - and yet there hardly is any problem when some of the more talented ones integrate into the NHL. Right now they might look distant and alien to the Canadian and American nat. teams, North American fans, broadcasters, and reporters - since they play on the other side of the world, but when they arrive here, they assimilate without a problem. A few years back Kovalchuk was looked at as a cocky, arrogant Russki from another planet (yes, that "oh, those Russians" austere mysteriousness) - but he seemed to have no problem once he got into the league and brought some of his likeable energy. (It took him a couple of diving penalties in the first few games to get that point, as well..) So don't sweat it, they are just kids playing hockey..

The reason that is though because most of these kids will never play in a tournament like this again. After this tourney most players will soon join NHL Teams after the lockout and then grow older and learn not to pull any of that crap. If any player Russian American or Canadian does this in any NHL Game they know that the next shift they take they will have an opposing player following the whole next shift. The point is you don't do. The easiest way to get players pissed off is to taunt you and then taunt your fans. Because then those players have to stick up for the fans the ones that aren't out. And thats how you get the drunken fans throwing items at players. Shirokov was like this in Game 1 of the Tourney and this past game. It's disrespectful but that is also what is going to get your ass kicked.

The reason that is though because most of these kids will never play in a tournament like this again. After this tourney most players will soon join NHL Teams after the lockout and then grow older and learn not to pull any of that crap. If any player Russian American or Canadian does this in any NHL Game they know that the next shift they take they will have an opposing player following the whole next shift. The point is you don't do. The easiest way to get players pissed off is to taunt you and then taunt your fans. Because then those players have to stick up for the fans the ones that aren't out. And thats how you get the drunken fans throwing items at players. Shirokov was like this in Game 1 of the Tourney and this past game. It's disrespectful but that is also what is going to get your ass kicked.

Don't exaggerate all this "policeman following you on the next shift" stuff. Yes, certain players get retribution from other certain players not "accidentally" - but that's as much likely to happen for being too rough and borderline-dirty out there on the ice rather than showboating. Besides, superstars usually got their backs covered within their teams. Guys like Jagr and Kovalchuk (and many others, even the aborigines) can taunt and salute all they want - nobody's going to touch them. Why? Because occasional taunting's fine. It might be "disrespectful" - but a lot of things out there on the hockey rink are disrespectful. If it's in the general realms of decency and not in the excess, nobody usually has any problem with it.

I think of it the other way around. People would still be whining if Russia did it to the Swiss. However, if USA did that to Russia(assuming USA won), I know for a fact we'd see, "Hahhaah did j00 see Kessel do that cool dance move after scoring that goal?! Man he's so sweet! Kessel > Crosby" ...Followed by alot of :handclap: and :yo:

Its funny because it's prolly true!

:lol

I hear this response a lot. "I'd love to see them try that in the NHL, they'd get knocked out." I've seen Kovalchuk taunt players before, and he's still breathing.

Not that I want to defend him, but I haven't seen him do what those guys did tonight. I've seen him taunt but nothing like tonight. I have never seen a team do that.

Yes, I do know for a "fact" because there are more than enough "Kessel Homers" and "USA homers" that give me "more than enough" "evidence" to "throw out" this "prediction" upon which my "fact" was "based" on.

Oh we have a smart aleck on our hands, do we? Yeah, there a lot of Kessel fans on the board and U.S. homers, I don't know why there wouldn't be, isn't that called a fan? But like I said look around and you'll see plenty of people saying they couldn't defend what the Russians did if it was their team. I've said it already and I'll say it again, I would be mortified if that was my team. I see no need for it to go to the extent they brought it to.

Heck, it may have been Don Cherry who threw it. :D

I wonder what he thought of their disgraceful acts tonight. He's not too found of Europeans right? :joker:

Bad karma will hit the Russians when they play canada for the Gold medal. The Canadians will mop up the floor with the cocky Russians.

Oh we have a smart aleck on our hands, do we? Yeah, there a lot of Kessel fans on the board and U.S. homers, I don't know why there wouldn't be, isn't that called a fan? But like I said look around and you'll see plenty of people saying they couldn't defend what the Russians did if it was their team. I've said it already and I'll say it again, I would be mortified if that was my team. I see no need for it to go to the extent they brought it to.

I'd be mortified if the Russians swung their sticks Barry Bonds style or took off their skates and tried to stab the Americans a la Happy Gilmour. Chirping? Tugging your jersey? Showing someone your nameplate? Hardly mortifying. Oh and "my" team was Germany, we were done a longgggg time ago.

Don't exaggerate all this "policeman following you on the next shift" stuff. Yes, certain players get retribution from other certain players not "accidentally" - but that's as much likely to happen for being too rough and borderline-dirty out there on the ice rather than showboating. Besides, superstars usually got their backs covered within their teams. Guys like Jagr and Kovalchuk (and many others, even the aborigines) can taunt and salute all they want - nobody's going to touch them. Why? Because occasional taunting's fine. It might be "disrespectful" - but a lot of things out there on the hockey rink are disrespectful. If it's in the general realms of decency and not in the excess, nobody usually has any problem with it.

Taunting and Saluting are 2 different things. I don't think anyone on either team is offended when Jagr scores and does his Salute. I don't care if someone scores and does a little dance. When Kovalchuk scored and said something to the Oilers bench it obviously pissed the Oilers off. Now you have to remember the NHL also has this stupid rule called the Instigator which causes problems. Now if I remember right not sure if it was the same game but I do remember Kovalchuk getting into a fight with Mike Comrie. There is a line between celebrating a goal and taunting. When Shirikov scores and puts his hand to his ear. Thats taunting. If he scores put his arms up jumps into his teammates arms thats celebrating.

Taunting and Saluting are 2 different things. I don't think anyone on either team is offended when Jagr scores and does his Salute. I don't care if someone scores and does a little dance. When Kovalchuk scored and said something to the Oilers bench it obviously pissed the Oilers off. Now you have to remember the NHL also has this stupid rule called the Instigator which causes problems. Now if I remember right not sure if it was the same game but I do remember Kovalchuk getting into a fight with Mike Comrie. There is a line between celebrating a goal and taunting. When Shirikov scores and puts his hand to his ear. Thats taunting. If he scores put his arms up jumps into his teammates arms thats celebrating.


Exactly. There is a difference between celebrating for a goal and taunting. Taunting is DIRECTED at the opposition and is basically a chance to rub it in. What Jagr and Kovalchuk do is not directed at the other team. Remember, when Kovalchuk fought Comrie, it was because Kovalchuk skated by the Oil's bench after scoring and pointed at his stick. That was taunting, and it pissed off a lot of Oilers. Ovechkin and Malkin taunted the US when the game was over, and there was no need to do this. Granted, I'm sure there were some words exchanged between the two teams that may have caused these taunts, but Shirokov did it in the 1st game as well. It is pretty disrespectful, and for anyone who has played hockey, you know what it's like when the opposing team taunts you after a goal or near the end of a game.

Personally I think Shirokov needs to change up his celebration to look more like Hulk Hogan's: spin the hand a few times, and lean in when cupping it to the ear.

Taunting and Saluting are 2 different things. I don't think anyone on either team is offended when Jagr scores and does his Salute. I don't care if someone scores and does a little dance. When Kovalchuk scored and said something to the Oilers bench it obviously pissed the Oilers off. Now you have to remember the NHL also has this stupid rule called the Instigator which causes problems. Now if I remember right not sure if it was the same game but I do remember Kovalchuk getting into a fight with Mike Comrie. There is a line between celebrating a goal and taunting. When Shirikov scores and puts his hand to his ear. Thats taunting. If he scores put his arms up jumps into his teammates arms thats celebrating.
True about the instigator (haven't watched the NHL in a while, forgetting things) - but regardless of that, what harm was there for Kovalchuk to skate by the Oilers' bench and stir it up a little? While his fight with Comrie was hardly a spectacle, it still was a part of that whole energy buildup which was so drenched in the atmosphere of that arena. The same might work for Shirokov - when he did it the first time, nobody had a problem. Why? Celebrating by getting a little cocky is okay. Especially at our age.. Fans don't like it, but fans aren't on the ice. Fans like winning, but fans don't really win themselves. Fans like pretty goals, but your average fan doesn't skate alone on a goalie fullspeed and score with 17,000 people watching him or her.. All the small things on the ice, all the competitiveness, all the rivality gets magnified 100 times in the eyes of the players who are actually participating in all this impulse-driven euphoria. What they do is what most of the fans in the stands will never get..

Exactly. There is a difference between celebrating for a goal and taunting. Taunting is DIRECTED at the opposition and is basically a chance to rub it in. What Jagr and Kovalchuk do is not directed at the other team. Remember, when Kovalchuk fought Comrie, it was because Kovalchuk skated by the Oil's bench after scoring and pointed at his stick. That was taunting, and it pissed off a lot of Oilers. Ovechkin and Malkin taunted the US when the game was over, and there was no need to do this. Granted, I'm sure there were some words exchanged between the two teams that may have caused these taunts, but Shirokov did it in the 1st game as well. It is pretty disrespectful, and for anyone who has played hockey, you know what it's like when the opposing team taunts you after a goal or near the end of a game.

Well ofcourse taunting is directed at someone.. that's why it's taunting..

But would you rather the Russians celebrate their goals quietly but then cheap shot Kessel and end his career early? Sounds to me like these guys were putting up with ******** all night long, but they won the game, and they won it deservedly.. they then taunted the other team instead of attacking them with sticks..

and you know what, Ovechkin and Malkin are pretty big guys, big enough to flatten anybody on the US team.. they could've taken the dirty way out, and painted the boards with O'Sullivan's and Dowell's faces...

lastly, I've read that some people just hate it when their country is embarassed like this.. but it seems that almost everyone has forgotten that US got embarassed during the game long before all the taunting.. I think that is the real problem for the US hockey, not what kind of bad person Ovechkin is..

Personally I think Shirokov needs to change up his celebration to look more like Hulk Hogan's: spin the hand a few times, and lean in when cupping it to the ear.


If he's going to do that, he might as well go all the way, and start shaking his head frantically whenever someone tries to hit him.

Exactly. There is a difference between celebrating for a goal and taunting. Taunting is DIRECTED at the opposition and is basically a chance to rub it in. What Jagr and Kovalchuk do is not directed at the other team. Remember, when Kovalchuk fought Comrie, it was because Kovalchuk skated by the Oil's bench after scoring and pointed at his stick. That was taunting, and it pissed off a lot of Oilers. Ovechkin and Malkin taunted the US when the game was over, and there was no need to do this. Granted, I'm sure there were some words exchanged between the two teams that may have caused these taunts, but Shirokov did it in the 1st game as well. It is pretty disrespectful, and for anyone who has played hockey, you know what it's like when the opposing team taunts you after a goal or near the end of a game.
Why limit it to hockey? While it's unquestionably annoying in other walks of life other than sports, in sports there always instances where you can't help it :). And even if the other team gets pissed off - so what? Of course, doing it excessively, like was done today, is definitely unnecessary, but usually, from time to time, it's fine.

I think that 90% of the people who are "disgusted" with it just didn't like the outcome of the game. The ESPN commentators were particularly blunt - that's because they were rooting for the convenient USA-Canada final all the way.. Remember Kovalchuk in 2001 celebrating before finishing the game off into the empty net? Then every self-respectful Canadian fan was appalled - but why? His celebration wasn't directed at anybody, it wasn't taunting, it wasn't anything that falls under your definition. The kid was just happy to win. And Canadians weren't that happy to lose.

Well ofcourse taunting is directed at someone.. that's why it's taunting..

But would you rather the Russians celebrate their goals quietly but then cheap shot Kessel and end his career early? Sounds to me like these guys were putting up with ******** all night long, but they won the game, and they won it deservedly.. they then taunted the other team instead of attacking them with sticks..

and you know what, Ovechkin and Malkin are pretty big guys, big enough to flatten anybody on the US team.. they could've taken the dirty way out, and painted the boards with O'Sullivan's and Dowell's faces...

lastly, I've read that some people just hate it when their country is embarassed like this.. but it seems that almost everyone has forgotten that US got embarassed during the game long before all the taunting.. I think that is the real problem for the US hockey, not what kind of bad person Ovechkin is..

Personally, I would have rather seen Ovechkin throw a solid hit (like in his higlight reel hit on Tootoo) or score another goal. There isnt a need to act like a showboat on the world stage, especially when the game was over.

No, it wasn't intentional, and even if it was, Russia still got the 4 min power play. If the US got a pp for when the russian player cover the puck up in the crease or for knocking his own net off or diving then I probably wouldn't care. I hope #20 has to eat through a straw the next 2 months.
Okay, I didn't see the game, and I didn't see any of the high-lights. But looking at this unsportsmanlike behaviour (ie covering up the puck and knocking off the net) objectively, it's really the ref that dropped the ball. Like Barnaby said, "[it] was just a hockey play that shoulda been called."

I believe the covering of the puck in the crease should be a penalty shot. I think it's supposed to be the same for an intentional dislodging of the net on a clear cut goal.

Don't get mad at the Russians...I'm not condoning what they did, nor am I condemning them, but those two issues are the result of the ref's misjudgement.

Personally, I would have rather seen Ovechkin throw a solid hit (like in his higlight reel hit on Tootoo) or score another goal. There isnt a need to act like a showboat on the world stage, especially when the game was over.

there you go:

http://images.sportsline.com/u/gettyimages/photos/51880736JV004_Rus_USA010300_lower.jpg

But would you rather the Russians celebrate their goals quietly but then cheap shot Kessel and end his career early?

Would you rather me just beat the hell out of you instead of killing you?

A pretty crappy argument. It doesn't change the fact that it is WRONG.

Would you rather me just beat the hell out of you instead of killing you?

A pretty crappy argument. It doesn't change the fact that it is WRONG.

What is wrong? Responding to dirty play with taunting?

You guys honestly thought O'Sullivans hit was intentional. It made no sense. It was as he was bringin his stick back down. It was obviously unintentional. Callahan at the end of the game. That was intentional ;)

Somebody in the US-Russia thread made a great point saying that it's better to taunt like this rather than go and break someone's neck like Bertuzzi did last season.


I stopped here.

Why the hell does this have to be brought up in seemingly every topic relating anything at all to hockey?

The Russian U20 team has a reputation for poor sportsmanship. When Russia won Gold on home ice against Canada a few years back, more than one Russian player spit at Canadian players and they all decided to have their big celebration right in front of the Canadian bench. No coincidence there.

The US Announcers of course is going to be bias considering the Color man played for the US in the WJC and most likely they are paid on a game to game basis and if the USA Made the final they would have been on ESPN and probably made more money. So they just lost a paycheck as of right now I don't see ESPN2 covering Tuesdays Bronze Medal Game.

The Russians are also known for taking the net off as it was done 3 years ago as I remember Don Cherry complaining about it on Coachs. The Refs were bad. And the Russians are known for doing that. The Russian U20's do show no respect by their taunting.

O'Sullivan's play was careless no doubt about it. What was he doing with he stick like that he shoulda been controling his stick. He was not intenting to injure the Russian player. And like stated before the European game has a lot of diving so it's hard to say sometimes was is legitimate or not.

My 2 cents.
1st cent - Don't want to see him celebrating, don't let him score or win
2nd cent - Vae Victus!

What is wrong? Responding to dirty play with taunting?

Yes.

Why not show some class and not knock yourself down to their level?


1st cent - Don't want to see him celebrating, don't let him score or win


It's one thing to celebrate, but it is a whole different story when you taunt your opponents. That is not celebrating, that is showing a complete lack of sportsmanship.

What is wrong? Responding to dirty play with taunting?

2 wrongs don't make a right?

Why not show some class and not knock yourself down to their level?


Man, you guys have to remember that these are kids in a high pressure, adrenalized (tm) atmosphere. You seem to want these kids to show the composure of a Joe Sakic whose had years and years of experience winning and playing in high pressure situations. For a lot of these kids, this game was the biggest of their career and you better believe they'd be excited to score a goal or win it. If they felt the Americans were being even a little chippy, given the politics of our day I'm surprised you can't understand why the Russians would showboat a bit...you're embarassing the US Empire's team right in the middle of their country.

I know it's probably hard to understand but there are people outside the US that genuinely really do not like your country and blame all the world's ills on it. Whether or not that's a legitimate belief is not a debate to be had here but it's true nonetheless; it doesn't help that Russia is your old enemy. You get into an adrenaline packed situation in front of tens of thousands of people and you score a goal, you're not going to think carefully through the situation with a "what's the most sportsmanlike action here?" kind of mentality.

Their coaches in the NHL will condition them against this kind of behavior. In time. They're 17-18-19 year's old for Christ's sake. There are grown men in the NHL that do this kind of thing from time to time (Satan's phone call against Toronto anyone?)

Mountain out of a molehill. Sheesh.

Could never understand some North Americans' view on hockey... The game is played by humans who have emotions, not some robots. This kind of celebration is regular in other sports. Just take football (soccer) as an example. In hockey, however, you must not try to hurt anyones feeling... Try to hurt him physically if you like (US vs Belarus), but mentally - no no. Because the opponent won't be able to sleep at night because of that...

Anyways, the final is tomorrow. I dread to think what will happen if we, Russians, win. I am sure the media and Canadians will find many excuses for Canadians to lose and many faults with the way Russians played, behaved, looked, picked their noses...

What are you *****ing about here? Did someone's feelings get hurt by the taunting, maybe? Do they need a feeling surgery? Does this explain the humiliating defeat?

Even if they were not given a reason to taunt in this game, you must remember this was their second match against each other, who knows what the Americans said to the Russian players after winning the first game or anywhere anytime for that matter.

And who needs a reason anyway. Taunting is just as much a part of the game as slashing and hitting players who don't have the puck and hitting goalies behind the net and all that stuff. It's not forbidden and I don't see what the big deal is. It's not like they were spitting on the Americans or anything like that or doing anything that could actually hurt them.

2 wrongs don't make a right?


No, but it creates a balance. Balance is important.

I don't like taunting. I believe that in a perfect world, you respect your opponent. Larry Robinson would have never cupped his hand in front of Terry O'Reilly and it wasn't out of fear. While this was going on, I swithched over to watch my beloved NY football Giants. Some 3rd string safety got up and pounded his chest and pointed to himself when he made a tackle, a good play, but one he is paid to make. Paul McGuire observed that he wasn't pointing to himself the 3 times he was beaten earlier in the game. I hesitate to get too vocal about taunting because #1 it's generational, but #2, in North America, it gets racial. I'll admit that I don't like the culture of self promotion, but I'm not sure more than that. I like it when it's based on humor, don't like it when it's meant to show someone up. It seemed to me last night that there were no good guys. If the attitude shown by Malikn and Ovechkin is considered the norm, well I'm starting to not like the norm. If the constant diving and play acting is considered a tactic, I don't like the idea behind accepting this as acceptable. OTOH, if anyone thinks the US reaction to losing, and that's what I believe it was, was OK because of some punk going NYahh,Nyahh,Ne, Nyahh,Na, grow up. Cross checks of of faceoffs,high sticks etc., you all saw it, they lost their cool.

I would commend both teams for one thing though, they both attacked, moved the puck and played good offensive hockey. I haven't seen that in watching mainly the Canadian games because the opposition played a 1967 post expansion 4 man on the blueline trap, making any play off the rush impossible.

I think that 90% of the people who are "disgusted" with it just didn't like the outcome of the game. The ESPN commentators were particularly blunt - that's because they were rooting for the convenient USA-Canada final all the way.. Remember Kovalchuk in 2001 celebrating before finishing the game off into the empty net? Then every self-respectful Canadian fan was appalled - but why? His celebration wasn't directed at anybody, it wasn't taunting, it wasn't anything that falls under your definition. The kid was just happy to win. And Canadians weren't that happy to lose.

Attrocious sportsmanship is something that doesn't seem like a big deal until it's directed at you. Like when the American golfers and their wives stampeded across the green at the Ryder Cup while the European golfer was trying to line up his shot, it wasn't inexcusable or appalling, it was just "exuberance". When swimmer Dana Torres horked a loogie into Inge De Bruijn's lane before a race at the 2000 olympics, it wasn't disgusting, it was "ooooh, she's thrown down a gauntlet!" and "showing her competitive side." Or something. According to NBC, anyway. When it's the other guy, you complain about sportsmanship and class; when it's your guy you rationalize it with talk about exuberance and competitive fire. It's low class, but it's not like it's never been seen before. The stuff the Russians did would pass for normal in an NBA game, wouldn't it?

And yes, before somebody asks, of course I'll be pissed if the Russians win the gold and taunt the Canadians afterward. I was also pissed at the end of the 2002 Grey Cup when the Alouettes players taunted the crowd after beating the home team. Go ahead and be pissed, I would be too. Just don't have a public temper-tantrum over it. Some of the members here are making themselves look as immature as the Russian players.

Extra thought:

Remember when Miroslav Satan did the cell-phone thing after scoring a goal on HNIC last season?

You know who looked a little immature? Miroslav Satan.
You know who looked a whole lot immature? Craig Millen, for *****ing and crying about it in the broadcast booth.

After the American's cheapshots during the game, they almost deserved it. On the other hand, this isn't the first time Russians have done this lame taunting they did against Canada 3 years ago after winning, believe it was kovalchuck, not sure if they did it again in Halifax but there was some taunting in the Remax challenge when they beat the Q, so it's not like a 1 time thing for them theres a history of it and I think it's completly classless. Alot of the argument here form the Russian fans is that this stuff happens in all pro sports and that is true but i've followed Canada through alot of internatioal hockey tournaments and I can't recall them ever taunting the other team after a victory to rub it in there face, so it's not like it's a common thing in Hockey and every team does it like in football, it's rare in hockey and kind of disrespectful i think, but thats just me.

I wonder what he thought of their disgraceful acts tonight. He's not too found of Europeans right? :joker:

He probably shouted something at the tv about back in Boston this and Terry O'Reily that.

I loved it.

If he's going to do that, he might as well go all the way, and start shaking his head frantically whenever someone tries to hit him.

That would make him...




quite possibly the greatest player ever!

I loved it.


You would...... :p: Seriously though, I'd probably be laughing my head off if this was Moscow and the U.S. team (Robbie Schremp perhaps?) showboated after an empty netter and played air guitar on his stick by the Russian bench.

The US Announcers of course is going to be bias considering the Color man played for the US in the WJC and most likely they are paid on a game to game basis and if the USA Made the final they would have been on ESPN and probably made more money. So they just lost a paycheck as of right now I don't see ESPN2 covering Tuesdays Bronze Medal Game.

The Russians are also known for taking the net off as it was done 3 years ago as I remember Don Cherry complaining about it on Coachs. The Refs were bad. And the Russians are known for doing that. The Russian U20's do show no respect by their taunting.

O'Sullivan's play was careless no doubt about it. What was he doing with he stick like that he shoulda been controling his stick. He was not intenting to injure the Russian player. And like stated before the European game has a lot of diving so it's hard to say sometimes was is legitimate or not.




I wouldn't call Andy Brickley's objectivity into question here. He called a spade a spade the whole tournament.

You would...... :p: Seriously though, I'd probaly be laughing my head off if this was Moscow and the U.S. team (Robbie Schremp perhaps?) showboated after an empty netter and played air guitar on his stick by the Russian bench.I always love it when I see hockey players gloat.

If you can't beat them in the 60 minutes, keep your mouth shut if they choose to celebrate.

Game's over. Time to be tough, IMO. Tough like this article describes:

http://overspeed.info/article.php?story=20041207232055263

I watched the whole game.


And I'll say this, the Americans (I'm American, and was rooting for them) did earn some of what they got. They were taking bonehead penalties, and going after the big two (AO/Malkin) more than needed. While playing physical with Malkin and Ovechkin might be a strategy, and it seemed to work somewhat (for a period or so) some of the stuff was borderline... I also know some of the other hits and penalties were a bit over the edge as well. Schremp's slash is a prime example of what the Russians could have percieved as slights and even dirty play.


I don't want to say the Americans did anything wrong with that, because, hey, roughing up on the other team's stars is just hockey, but a team is going to strike back when they feel something like that is occuring.


I thought a little bit of the Russian stuff took it too far, especially the Malkin showboat, but I don't think it got beyond anything worth talking about. I mean, teams aren't supposed to like one another, and rivalries are a good thing.

Though, Shirokov's mess is going to get old fast.

This argument can go on forever, but realistically, we don't know what was happening on the ice or what was being said. I watched the game on ESPN and listened to it on the FAN590 (can't stand Andy Brickley) and the commentators on the FAN590 kept saying during the last 2 minutes "that the Americans have sent on their "blue missilies" and they're all over the ice so the Russian's definately will have to keep their heads up." The Americans sent on their big hitters already down 5-2 and the game out of reach. In the last 10 minutes in the game, the US had 4 penalties - one of which was a 5 minute major, and a game misconduct. The Russians had no penalties in the 3rd.

So instead of retaliating by "Phaneufing" the USA players as some of you say, the Russians got under their skin in a smarter way - "mentally." If someone is going to slash, hack, highstick you to try to hurt you/stop you with the game already out of reach and you end up scoring, then you'll definately want to rub it into them. The US were frustrated by being the defending Champions, playing at home and having a poor tournament so you can imagine all the talk that was going on.

If you're a US fan, you hate to see it. If you're a Russian fan, you can understand why this is happening. In anycase, for those people who can't wait for Phanuef to "break heads" in the Gold medal game, be honest with yourself that he doesn't care what happened last night and that he could care less about defending the US's pride. It's a Gold Medal game and that's the most important thing right now. If he goes headhunting, Canada will be in penalty trouble and won't be a smart move for a player who's looking to win a Gold Medal.

Good luck to both teams in the final. Should be a good one.

You would...... :p: Seriously though, I'd probably be laughing my head off if this was Moscow and the U.S. team (Robbie Schremp perhaps?) showboated after an empty netter and played air guitar on his stick by the Russian bench.


Nice of you to admit it.

How can you not root for canada now.

If the Russians want to act like arrogant jerkoffs and kick people while they are down, let them. Its within the rules, maybe not proper eticate, but it is allowed.


This is one fan who never thought he would be hoping for Canada to roll their opponent for gold this year. Light the lamp boys.

They had a right to act like "arrogant jerkoffs".. These guys played their heart out and were the better team... The Americans were the ones who were roughing it and playing recklessly after the game was down the gutter for them...

And maybe it seemed like it was the coach's orders for the US players to start running the Russians early on in the game?
Were you watching the same game the rest of us were watching?


Was it the coach's orders to keep diving and flailing all over the ice when the game was 5-2 and 6-2? To taunt fans and USA Team members after scoring empty net goals? I have no respect for some of these guys, including Ovechkin and Malkin. You have to be a good winner as well as a good loser and Russia was not a good winner, they showed no class in victory, and they showed that they are just a bunch of children.

How can you not root for canada now.

It's easy. Just do it.

they showed that they are just a bunch of children.


Children who humiliated adults or children who humiliated other children?

This argument can go on forever, but realistically, we don't know what was happening on the ice or what was being said.

Absolutely true, and an important point.

So instead of retaliating by "Phaneufing" the USA players as some of you say, the Russians got under their skin in a smarter way - "mentally." ..

Nothing personal, but this is a really lame rationalization. There's nothing smart about it. If you believe the Canadian team won't be thinking about not being mocked, you're wrong. They may not admit it, but it will be there. Not that they need any additional motivation.

Class is class and sportsmanship is sportsmanship, regardless of circumstance. I've pretty-much stopped watching the NFL because of all the showboating and crap, I despise it in the NHL (and have little use for Kovalev), and it horrifies me to see it happening in an Under-20 tournament. As a U.S. fan, I would have been deeply embarassed had Kessel or Fritsche done any such thing.

The double minor against Callahan looked like a good call. I agree things got ugly at the end, and the U.S. bears responsibility for that. (Note: I resist the temptation to turn your argument around and say "Callahan was just responding to being taunted?" Because class is class ....)

Children who humiliated adults or children who humiliated other children?

Mostly children who humiliated themselves, and their nation.

again, to me the worse thing was the the players and coaches on the benches turning around to taunt the spectators. You can't justify that, no matter how hard you try.

again, to me the worse thing was the the players and coaches on the benches turning around to taunt the spectators. You can't justify that, no matter how hard you try.

Why not? What if the fans behind them were calling them names? Maybe even yelling something racist? I clearly heard "go home you commie ********" at least once. Who knows what else did they have to endure during the game.

It's not like they did the Nylanders.

again, to me the worse thing was the the players and coaches on the benches turning around to taunt the spectators. You can't justify that, no matter how hard you try.
While I agree with you, isn't that pretty common in the NFL ?

Mostly children who humiliated themselves, and their nation.

Yes, let's just forget the score of the game. It has nothing to do with a hockey game anyway.

And how did they humiliate their nation? Only an American could think like that.

Enough with the petty bickering, to both sides. Drop it already. Discuss it like civilized adults or don't bother posting at all.

Consider yourselves warned.

You know I'm going to go against the grain here and say I think its just a bunch of fans that can't accept losing and are looking for any grace in the loss.

Lets face it's popular American culture to "rub it in while ahead". Touchdown celebrations and slam dunks in the other players face when the game is out of hand.

It was not nice of the Russians to lay it on a little thick, but did anything or anyone get hurt but a little American pride? I'd be more concerened about the high sticks and running of players once the game got out of hand personally.

You lost to a very good team, get over it

You know I'm going to go against the grain here and say I think its just a bunch of fans that can't accept losing and are looking for any grace in the loss.

Lets face it's popular American culture to "rub it in while ahead". Touchdown celebrations and slam dunks in the other players face when the game is out of hand.

It was not nice of the Russians to lay it on a little thick, but did anything or anyone get hurt but a little American pride? I'd be more concerened about the high sticks and running of players once the game got out of hand personally.

You lost to a very good team, get over it
considering noone got ran or high stuck intentionally....

Did you watch the game?

The high stick was a follow through.

While I agree with you, isn't that pretty common in the NFL ?
I've never seen it, and I've been to a ton of games. If Jeff Fisher acted like that to the fans, I'd want him fired.

Small jabs through the media at a rival is one thing, the Russian bench took it to a new level.

considering noone got ran or high stuck intentionally....

Did you watch the game?

The high stick was a follow through.

Uh huh sure it was. More like the oldest trick in the hockey book. But I don't care as another poster said in another thread. What about the end of the Belarus game>

Did Belarus taunt the Americans just to be beat up at the end of the game?

And ya I watched it and other than a few players on both teams was not at all impressed by either team. I think they are just going to be fodder for Canada, but we will see

I've never seen it, and I've been to a ton of games. If Jeff Fisher acted like that to the fans, I'd want him fired.

Small jabs through the media at a rival is one thing, the Russian bench took it to a new level.
I remember cringing when Shockey did it in SF a few years back in SF [that worked out well for him] and got the idea that itwas pretty common for players to pull that.

I remember cringing when Shockey did it in SF a few years back in SF [that worked out well for him] and got the idea that itwas pretty common for players to pull that.
as individuals it is, but again I've never seen coaches and players as a group do it.

People are acting as if it's the first time they see taunting in the world juniors.

I distinctively remember a certain Alexandre Daigle taunting the hell out of the Czechs after scoring the clinching goal... hmmm..

as individuals it is, but again I've never seen coaches and players as a group do it.
By extension then, I just can't see a coach urging teenagers to act like that. In the end, it was smart ass kids acting like smart ass kids, not some organized strategy. I didn't see anyone on either side making themselves look too classy as this one wound down. I'm pretty sure that Sutter will be stressing what to ignore in his meetings today though.

The worst thing was the Russian Player who pushed the net off in order to get a whistle when USA had a scoring chance.

That was pathetic.
The ESPN announcers made it out like O'Sullivan had a wide open net in the slot with the goalie in the corner when the guy pushed it off. The US had their shot and it went into the corner where Russia was skating it out when the guy came in. Didn't stop a scoring chance for the US.

BTW, Shirokov is terrible for taunting. :shakehead

What was Ovechkin doing after he scored the one goal. Was he rubbing it in the fans face???? Or was he just celebrating with his coach as he like pointed to himself with his gloves pumping his arms and then turned around and pointed to his name so I think that must have been taunting as well.

Taunting IMO is pretty uncalled for, but not as bad like that time Kovalchuk skated by both FLA and EDM benches in different games after getting illegal curve penalties and brushing off the snow. That way it was subtle, but stuff like last night is messed up. They were asking the USA to start a brawl. Don't taunt the fans, that's the worst thing to do.

Yes, let's just forget the score of the game. It has nothing to do with a hockey game anyway..

In my opinion, losing is not, in and of itself, humiliating - even losing by a lopsided score on home ice. It's depressing and frustrating and a whole bunch of other things, but not humiliating. It's a game - sometimes you win, sometimes you lose.


And how did they humiliate their nation?.

By displaying a lack of class and maturity. (In my opinion, of course.)

Only an American could think like that.

Generalize much? Why do you assume I am an American? (In point of fact, I am a Yank, and damn proud of it, but that has nothing to do with me thinking such taunting - by any player, in any sport, from any nation - is crap which should have no place in sports.

One of the reasons hockey has always been my favorite sport is that it usually does not tolerate prima donna's and showboating, that while the action and the fighting on the ice can look uncivil at times it is considered part of the game and respect is still showed to your opponent. But these taunting actions by the Russians are something I expect Terrell Owens or Latrell Sprewell to pull off in their sport and that hockey was someplace I could expect would be free of these antics. Sadly now it's not.

Shouldn't hockey still seperate itself from the other major sports as one that is free of individualism and showboating are shall we become part of the ESPN "It's all about me" culture that makes me sick everyday?

By displaying a lack of class and maturity. (In my opinion, of course.)

Yes, but how does that humiliate the whole nation. I can see how it shames the player or maybe even the team (even though I don't even agree with that), but I don't see how it shames the nation. It's not like everyone in the country is like that, and if people think like that after they see a few Russians taunting, they are not very smart then, are they?


Generalize much? Why do you assume I am an American? (In point of fact, I am a Yank, and damn proud of it, but that has nothing to do with me thinking such taunting - by any player, in any sport, from any nation - is crap which should have no place in sports.

I assumed you were an American because you talked in such a patriotic way and I didn't mean it had anything to do with your opinion on taunting, but your opinion on "humiliating the whole nation". That just sounded really American to me, I don't really know why.

There are certain things that usually reveals someone as an American, but it doesn't always work, of course.

Some of them are:

1. Using the word offensive or offend seriously
2. Using the word nation in a certain way
3. Using the word pride in a certain context
4. Using the word justice in weird sentences

It's hard to explain really, and these aren't really rules or anything, but they have worked really often. I hope no one takes this in a negative way since that was not my meaning, simply answering the question presented.

I think people should have to pass a mental and emotional IQ test before posting on these boards....seriously!

How many times do we watch a thread get completely hosed because of a handful of morons?! All it takes is one to say something stupid and then the otherside "quotes" that one and applies it as if that is how everyone who shares the same nationality must feel. Oh and lets not forget about the black and whiteness of it all. Nothing is ever allowed to be contextual. It really is amazing...almost as amazing as the fact that I keep coming back which proves I wouldn't be even be able to pass the test I proposed. :shakehead

And maybe it seemed like it was the coach's orders for the US players to start running the Russians early on in the game?

U didnt even see the game and your acting like you did. Running into the players? Its called a contact sport. And anything they did illegal was called.

Let Malkin and Ovechkin do what they like, their payback is coming. Oh yes, it is.

They have to play for Pittsburgh and Washington, that's the worst payback I can think of for 2 guys like that. :lol:

U didnt even see the game and your acting like you did. Running into the players? Its called a contact sport. And anything they did illegal was called.

alright then, and since Ovechkin and Malkin didn't get called for showboating, then they did nothing illegal.

alright then, and since Ovechkin and Malkin didn't get called for showboating, then they did nothing illegal.

its on video...

like the game, you should check it out!

its on video...

like the game, you should check it out!

yep.. tsn is showing it tonight.

emotional IQ test

I think that would be impossible. And it wouldn't work unless it's done before every single post.