PGDT: Russia - Canada [Archive]

Makarov

01-02-2005, 11:51 PM

I dunno, Khobudin makes me really nervous, he seems to have poor rebound control and tends to get caught out of position at times...

He made some phenomenal saves today, but I don't think I am a beleiver YET...

The Russian defense was very sound today, not overly impressive but very functional; but in no way compares to the corp led by Captain Anton Volchenkov when he led his team to victory against Canada...

Evginy Malkin, what a amazing talent he is, the way he kept eliminating Kessel by merely using his stick was phenomenal...

Canada's too strong, regardless, 3-2 in favor of the Cunucks...

The Russians are a proud nation who certainly wear their heart on their sleeve, may get ugly at the end...

Sting

01-03-2005, 12:46 AM

Phaneuf is going to be ALL over Ovechkin. That is actually going to be funny to watch...Ovechkin won't look so cocky after Phaneuf nails him to the ground. :)

Malkin will be who we have to worry about...I was really hoping Coburn/Seabrook would be a little more physical this tournament. I think they can handle him too.

The russian defense can't handle Crosby's line...and no way in hell can they keep Carter under control.

I will predict a 4-2 Canada win.

gretzky99

01-03-2005, 01:26 AM

The way Canada has played, Russia stands no chance.

McDonald19

01-03-2005, 01:35 AM

Canada 10-2

Run up the score Canada!!!

Go Getz and Perry!!

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:13 AM

Well... the time has come... another world junior tourney is about to rap up and we're left with 2 teams who are no stranger of this game...

This will be the 4th time in 7 year these teams have met in the finals with Russia winning the previous 3.... But those Canadian teams were no where near as strong as this one we have together...

Russia is strong but I honestly think they have no chance against Canada... Canada needs to realize that when they have a lead they need to keep going...

The defence for Canada this year is just too strong and they match up well.. Phanuef and Weber will be ready for AO and company...

I think there will be a major feeling out period in the early going maybe followed by a Russian goal.. but after this I really can't see Russia doing anything else... Canada's just too strong and over due..

Prediction....
Canada 4 -- Crosby, Carter, Stewart, Dawes
Russia 2 -- Shirokov, Radulov

and if Russia does pull this one out... and they taunt like they did against the USA you might see a 1987 repeat and the USA or Czechs will get the gold..

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:14 AM

TSN's initial preview..

http://www.tsn.ca/world_jrs/news_story.asp?id=109845

The True Blue Crew

01-03-2005, 03:17 AM

a beauty
long-awaited for CANADA-RUSSIA final
can't go wrong !
either way
COME ON, TEAMS!
Let's see whacha got !

p.s. thank god there is some hockey during lock-out.

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:19 AM

a beauty
long-awaited for CANADA-RUSSIA final
can't go wrong !
either way
COME ON, TEAMS!
Let's see whacha got !

p.s. thank god there is some hockey during lock-out.

My Sentiments exactly.. just glad there's gonna be a hcokey game of any importance...

really though, this might be the first time out of the last 4 meetings between the teams that Canada are favorites...

PecaFan

01-03-2005, 03:57 AM

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm thinking 4-2 Russia.

Berkut

01-03-2005, 04:15 AM

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm thinking 4-2 Russia.
I hope you're right! ;)

Edler Statesman*

01-03-2005, 04:16 AM

Canada needs to realize that when they have a lead they need to keep going...

LOL

6-0
5-0
7-3
8-1
9-0

I think they got that goin for them..

Hiishawk

01-03-2005, 05:49 AM

Canada SHOULD win, given their play so far and the fact that this is the est Canadian team in a decade. BUTthe pressure will be on Canada tomorrrow, NOT on Russia. Can they handle it? Losing the final this time would cause hair-pulling all over the Great White North. In the past three years they haven't handled that pressure particularly well.

Talent is not my worry. The enormous pressure of being there as favourites AGAIN is. is.

wilka91*

01-03-2005, 06:25 AM

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 06:29 AM

Apparently, all the Russians have to do is taunt the Canadians a bit to win this game...

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 06:30 AM

I think they got that goin for them..

Not in the Czech game, though.

Devonator

01-03-2005, 07:25 AM

Well the 2 old foes of hockey meet yet again!!

Canada finally meets a tough team for the first time in this tourney!!

Even though I am pulling for the Russians, I still think Canada will win just
based on its great depth..............I'm thinking a nice close game
and Canada wins 3-2.

wilka91*

01-03-2005, 07:27 AM

Go Russia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lisenok

01-03-2005, 07:34 AM

It will be very interesting.
Do not overlook, Russian - bad! (c) Bobby Clarke

:D

Dr_Gonz0

01-03-2005, 08:15 AM

Dumb like streetcar?

no, i believe the saying goes "strong like bull, smart like tractor" :lol

.....on a side note, 6-5 Canada win i predict.

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 08:35 AM

Not in the Czech game, though.

In fairness, Canada dominated the Czech's in a way that did not compare to how the Russians performed against them. Canada conceded just 11 shots, mostly low grade chances, and had Marek Schwarz not had an oustanding game, the score would have been 7-1, or something much closer to a scoreboard blowout.

It may be safe to say that Canada's group was weaker, but it's also equally safe to say that Canada was just as dominant last night as they were in the 7, 8-0 type games they played in their own pool, perhaps even more so.

Macman

01-03-2005, 08:39 AM

Now that everybody knows that the group B, at the exception of Canada, totally sucked, and that Canada beat the Czech Republic 3-1, I believe Russia and Canada are evenly matched, but the Russians want the gold more, and will prevail!

The Czech game was close in score only. It was a blowout just like the rest of Canada's games. The Czechs managed only three shots on goal from within the Canadian line. Canada must bury its chances against Russia. They miss too many open nets and hit too many posts. It cost them against the U.S. last year and its a worrisome trait of Canadian hockey.

Canada 6-3.

johnnyboo

01-03-2005, 08:46 AM

Russia should win this one.

Now that everybody knows that the group B, at the exception of Canada, totally sucked, and that Canada beat the Czech Republic 3-1, I believe Russia and Canada are evenly matched, but the Russians want the gold more, and will prevail!

Canada outshot the Czechs 42-11 and if it wasn't for Schwarz it could of been 7 or 8-1
Russia outshot the Czech's 32-26 in their game

habs_24x

01-03-2005, 08:53 AM

Apparently, all the Russians have to do is taunt the Canadians a bit to win this game...

I see the tauting as part of the Russian strategy. Get the other team so upset, they start doing mental errors, take stupid penalties etc...
the thing with taunting, you need to score or have the lead so i dont see it coming into factor tomorrow night, Canada will keep the lead all night and win 5 - 2

Too much depth not to mention like half the team are captains in their own teams.
the attempted tauting will only lead to Canada laughing...they will not be fooled.

Broadway Brett

01-03-2005, 08:54 AM

Will this game be on ESPN? I heard that they were going to show the Gold Medal Game regardless, but it didn't sound like that yesterday.

And can someone sticky this thread?

I Hate You All*

01-03-2005, 08:54 AM

Canada outshot the Czechs 42-11 and if it wasn't for Schwarz it could of been 7 or 8-1
Russia outshot the Czech's 32-26 in their game

Yeah! Russia suxx0r!

(except for Ovee :))

neelynugs

01-03-2005, 09:08 AM

i'm sure this has been asked a thousand times already, but will ESPN be covering the gold medal game??

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 09:19 AM

Hiishawk

01-03-2005, 09:22 AM

I predict that a supporter of the winning team will gloat here. Then a supporter of the losing team will say how classless that is. Then the gloater will remind the critic of one of his own, earlier, boasts. This Socratic dialogue will involve massive, sweeping generalizations about Canadian and Russian fans and, possibly, Canadians and Russians in general. And so on.

And this exchange will take up 50-60 posts.

Rabid Ranger

01-03-2005, 09:25 AM

As long as Canada isn't overconfident I think they'll beat Russia, perhaps comfortably. The U.S. defense just couldn't handle guys like Ovechkin and Malkin, which I don't think will be as much of a problem for Canada's much bigger squad. As long as Glass doesn't fold like a cheap suit, and the special teams are in order, Canada should get it's first gold since 1997.

Bennysflyers16

01-03-2005, 09:36 AM

Finally the Russians stars will face an awesome defense and Canada's defense will face some awesome forwards, gonna be good.

Canada 5 - Crosby, Carter(2), Dixon, Dawes

Russia 4 - Ovechkin (2), Malkin (2)

Phanueuf and Weber are going to be deadly, keep your heads up !!!

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 09:43 AM

onice

01-03-2005, 09:49 AM

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 09:54 AM

I hate it when people give Schwartz the credit. The only reason Canada didn't score more goals is because they started SHOWING OFF. Circling around, passing from a scoring chance and making the scoring as difficult as possible for themselves. And whenever they got a chance there was no finishing at all, they fired straight at Schwartz who only had to stand or lay there.

I disagree.

The only reason Canada did not score more goals is because Marek Schwarz played outstanding positionally and demonstrated remarkable composure under the fire of extremely patient forwards who did precisely the opposite and did NOT force the issue and did not showboat at all, and waited for the goaltender to play himself out of position as so many do under duress. Schwarz's rebound control was suberb and he limited the amount of second chances that Canada had, which resulted in the score being what it ended.

go kim johnsson 514

01-03-2005, 10:06 AM

So is it safe to say that all of the American fans are cheering for Canada in this game after what happened at the end of the USA/Russia game?

Prediction: 6-2 Canada... Go Canada!

Oh yeah... We finally get to see the Crosby/Ovechkin matchup. I cant wait to see what happens :)

I would have been cheering for Canada regardless because they have 3 Flyers prospects.

7-3 Canada.

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 10:10 AM

Anyhow, as for the game itself, I think it's going to be a series of great matchups.

We will see which duo is the better offensive pairing (AO/Malkin vs Sid/Bergeron).

It will be a lot of fun to see how the Canadian defence is able to handle the highly skilled and speedy Russians. One matchup I expect we'll see a lot of is Shawn Belle vs Enver Lisin, depending on who Lisin lines up beside.

The Russians were able to pull a lot of stuff against the US that may end up with them on their backsides tomorrow. It'll be interesting to see how they adjust, or if they just play full steam ahead and hope to draw lots of penalties.

How will the checking line Canadian players do short handed against the might of the Russian powerplay?

And, what i'm most excited to watch is the Russian blueliners try to contain the Canadian forwards. Thus far the team has been dominant based largely on its forecheck and the complete inability of any team to recover loose pucks against them, knock them off the puck, etc. The Russians have some size on the blueline, but I'm not certain if it's much more than the Czech's had. It will be fun.

markov`

01-03-2005, 10:37 AM

Prediction : Ovechkin is gonna get PHANEUFED! :amazed:

sammy87

01-03-2005, 10:49 AM

i'm sure this has been asked a thousand times already, but will ESPN be covering the gold medal game??

No, ESPN was only going to show the game if USA advanced.

Canada: 5 (Bergeron 2, Crosby, Phanuef, Richards)
Russia: 3 (Lisin, Parshin, Vorobiev)

ALF AmericanLionsFan

01-03-2005, 10:55 AM

Canada 9 Russia 1
Crosby scores 5 Bergeron 3 and Carter
Phaneuf with 2 skull busters(Malkin and Oveckin)
Go CANADA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :handclap:

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 10:58 AM

I disagree.

I would post more, but since I seemed to get some sort of a warning and do not wish to get banned I will only say this:

You say Schwartz handled rebounds, I say he bounced the puck. A lot. Canadians were just unlucky to never be there in the rebounds when they happened. Once Schwartz even hit a Canadian player with his glove trying to catch the puck and ended up not even getting the puck. He looked nervous more and more towards the end and yet the Canadians failed to take advantage.

You say Canadians weren't showing off, I can only ask you these:

What do you call it then when you pass from a scoring chance and end up losing the puck? What do you call it when you circle around the goal 2-3 times and don't take a shot even though you have a chance and end up losing the puck? (I call this showing off, maybe because I don't know a better word for it in the English language, but this is what I meant anyway.)

What do you call it when all your shots are aimed at the center of the goal instead of the posts? (I call that poor finishing.)

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 11:01 AM

I must ask you to refrain from posting comments like this.

What should I do? Explain myself again, and again, and again, every time a new poster comes to the thread?

I'm sorry, but I have not lived in America, meaning I haven't received the proper training that would provide me with the necessary endurance to deal with that.

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 11:03 AM

:joker: Yeah they really lost their edge. The final score was 3-1 and the Czechs got no scoring chances after their lone goal.

Eh, again, I would ask you to read, but I guess that would be pointless. They lost their edge when it comes to scoring. Letting in one goal and not scoring any is just that.

pei fan

01-03-2005, 11:08 AM

Prediction : Ovechkin is gonna get PHANEUFED! :amazed:Yes,& Malkin is going to get Webered. :D These two are a force out there.
Will Sutter continue what he did yesterday playing them for the first time with
the CBP line.I think it's a good idea and makes the Canadian team harder to contain.
They go against the Ovechkin line and then the Russians will have a tough time
containing Carter Getzlaf and Ladd physically.Of course they will also play with Carter and Richards on special units.

Diaboli

01-03-2005, 11:08 AM

Canada will get hammered. 6-3 to Russia. Crosby does nothing on the ice, except surf around ;)

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 11:08 AM

You are not going to get banned. I am not a moderator. I just don't understand the necessity of claiming somebody was drunk or high or telling somebody to learn how to read simply because they disagree with you.

Berkut

01-03-2005, 11:12 AM

Keep talking about your Phaneuf...It's going to end up like Tootoo last time...Russia gold and Tootoo on his ass

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 11:17 AM

Keep talking about your Phaneuf...It's going to end up like Tootoo last time...Russia gold and Tootoo on his ass

Perhaps. The difference being, of course, that Dion Phaneuf is substantially larger than Jordin Tootoo, and as a defender, he has the advantage on AO because AO has to go into the corners at some point.

I'm interested in seeing how Phaneuf copes with AO's blend of skill and speed.

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 11:20 AM

You are not going to get banned. I am not a moderator. I just don't understand the necessity of claiming somebody was drunk or high

I got the warning from someone who is in fact a moderator.

PS. I didn't claim anything. It was simply a metaphor.

or telling somebody to learn how to read simply because they disagree with you.

Simply because I had written an answer to that three pages and ago once or twice later in the thread is more like it.

CSKA

01-03-2005, 11:24 AM

Keep talking about your Phaneuf...It's going to end up like Tootoo last time...Russia gold and Tootoo on his ass

:handclap:

This canadien fans dont even know HOW powerful that russian team is

Ha ha why talk about Phaneuf , Crosby ....Carter ? Man you have to stop Ovechkin an Malkin first ...........ohhh for 60 Min. ha ha

OUR VICTORY !!!!! ROSSIJAAAAAAAAAAA BPERÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖDDDDD !!!!

pei fan

01-03-2005, 11:34 AM

:handclap:

This canadien fans dont even know HOW powerful that russian team is

Ha ha why talk about Phaneuf , Crosby ....Carter ? Man you have to stop Ovechkin an Malkin first ...........ohhh for 60 Min. ha ha

OUR VICTORY !!!!! ROSSIJAAAAAAAAAAA BPERÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖDDDDD !!!!
Russia has 2 or 3 stars.Canada has a whole team of them.Russia has an outside chance if Khudobbin steals it.

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 11:42 AM

The puck control battle is going to be the main factor in this game I think. Both teams need to have control of the puck for long periods of time in order to be successful. The Russians like to play around with it a bit more, while the Canadian team is going to try to create chances off the boards I'm sure.

CSKA

01-03-2005, 11:43 AM

Russia has 2 or 3 stars.Canada has a whole team of them.Russia has an outside chance if Khudobbin steals it.

outside chance yeah like against the Usa ........ :lol

Berkut

01-03-2005, 11:51 AM

Perhaps. The difference being, of course, that Dion Phaneuf is substantially larger than Jordin Tootoo, and as a defender, he has the advantage on AO because AO has to go into the corners at some point.

I'm interested in seeing how Phaneuf copes with AO's blend of skill and speed.
Well Ovechkin was 17 when he knocked out Tootoo, now he's 19, he's bigger, faster, stronger. And Malkin is even bigger.

When Ovechkin hit Gonchar in the Russian League this year, Gonchar had a concussion and had to be transported to a hospital. Bring it on Phaneuf!

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 11:53 AM

If Canada focused on shutting down Ovechkin and Malkin, that would only be a good thing for Russia I think because then the other guys like Shirokov, Radulov, Pestunov, Lisin, Voloshenko etc would put on the defense..

and it's not a given that Pheneuf will shutdown Ovechkin neither..

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 11:54 AM

Russia has 2 or 3 stars.Canada has a whole team of them.Russia has an outside chance if Khudobbin steals it.

when was the last time Russia won anything because the goalie stole the game for them?

ZombieMatt

01-03-2005, 11:54 AM

Well Ovechkin was 17 when he knocked out Tootoo, now he's 19, he's bigger, faster, stronger. And Malkin is even bigger.

When Ovechkin hit Gonchar in the Russian League this year, Gonchar had a concussion and had to be transported to a hospital. Bring it on Phaneuf!

I understand entirely, and I think AO's physicality is sometimes under-appreciated. But Gonchar is not, physically, Dion Phaneuf. Phaneuf doesn't typically get hit in the open ice because of the style he plays. Whereas AO will be retrieving pucks from the corners and boards, where taking hits is necessary. I'm not saying that AO won't be able to handle it, in fact, I really don't know, that's why I'm so interested in seeing that battle take place.

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 12:01 PM

if that's the kind of dreams you get, you should see a doctor

Panopticon

01-03-2005, 12:02 PM

if that's the kind of dreams you get, you should see a doctor

I hope that poster got warnings for that post, that was way worse than any post I got warned for today.

bruins8152

01-03-2005, 12:03 PM

I think Khudoben will have to be unreal in the start of this game for Russia to have a chance. Canada is just way to strong offensivly. People forget that after two periods with the Czechs the shots were 28-3 for Canada with the Czechs failing to record a single shot in the second. Oh and btw, after 2 periods the scoring chances were 20-0 for canada. Thats just ****ed up :lol:

Schenn02

01-03-2005, 12:04 PM

Well I hope Canada wins the Gold...I won't be disappointed if they don't (unless it turns out like last year :cry: ) I predict 4-2

GO TEAM CANADA GO!!

Rick Middleton

01-03-2005, 12:04 PM

I hope that poster got warnings for that post, that was way worse than any post I got warned for today.
Post has been deleted.

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 12:04 PM

I hope that poster got warnings for that post, that was way worse than any post I got warned for today.

yeah really.. and these are the same people that complain that Russia didn't show them respect last night..

Vic Rattlehead

01-03-2005, 12:05 PM

Russia 6 - Ovechkin [3], Shirokov [2], Rykov
Canada 4 - Bergeron, Ladd, Stewart, Getzlaf

there is no way this turns into a defensive battle... neither goalie is that exceptional. russia is too powerful offensively.
Ahem, what about Canada?

Kane

01-03-2005, 12:09 PM

Canada 4 Russia 2

Canada: Bergeron, Carter, Getzlaf, Dawes
Russia: Radulov, Ovechkin

Camshaft77

01-03-2005, 12:09 PM

I see probably the best match-up between these two nations in a long time. Both teams have alot of power upfront with the canadian defense being a little more deep then the russians, but ill give the goaltending battle to the russian's because Glass has not faced more then 20 shots in a game and is relatively untested.

AO and Malkin im sure will play very well and will give the canadian defense everything they can handle.

Jeff Carter i think is the guy to watch if your russia he has been playing great in the tournament, and i believe that he will be the top player in the game.

Canada 5 carter(2), dawes, bergeron, syrvret
Russia 3 radulov (2) shirokov

players of the game carter and radulov

Vic Rattlehead

01-03-2005, 12:10 PM

Faaxinho

01-03-2005, 12:11 PM

I think Canada is going to win this one. I like Team Russia too, but this Canadian team is just so dominant. They were dominant against the Czechs too.
They have one big flaw though : they seem to "give up" if they get early lead. That could turn the game to Russians.
But I still think that Canada wins this one.

Canada - 4
Russia - 1

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 12:11 PM

Anyone can hit Gonchar. He gets knocked around too much. Nothing to be proud of. (Watched him as a Bruin, always gets knocked around)

he always gets knocked around by 19 year old teenagers?

Vic Rattlehead

01-03-2005, 12:13 PM

he always gets knocked around by 19 year old teenagers?
Doesn't matter what your age is. Plus, I hear non stop about Russians saying that "Ovechkin is a man playing in a mans league". Have Ovechkin trying to knock out someone like Phaneuf or Weber.

Vic Rattlehead

01-03-2005, 12:14 PM

The aftergame comments here are going to be horrible. :teach:

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 12:18 PM

Doesn't matter what your age is. Plus, I hear non stop about Russians saying that "Ovechkin is a man playing in a mans league". Have Ovechkin trying to knock out someone like Phaneuf or Weber.

the fact that Ovechkin is a man playing in mens league is only more evidence that he won't be a pushover for Phaneuf.. tomorrow we'll find out if it's the opposite in fact.

Berkut

01-03-2005, 12:25 PM

Can't wait to see Phaneuf "Ovechkined" :lol

hossy316

01-03-2005, 12:26 PM

High flyin' Habs*

01-03-2005, 12:32 PM

What time does it start?

Hemsky4PM

01-03-2005, 12:32 PM

Tootoo? Please. Let's not compare Phaneuf to Tootoo. Phaneuf has 5 inches and 30 pounds on Tootoo.

I don't think Phanuef needs to cream anybody (even though he will). Canada's defense has been the best bar none in this tournament. The Americans just backed off the Russians, Canada won't. This will be a great game and Canada will win by at least 3 goals.

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 12:32 PM

He knocked out Tootoo?? Well, I'd like to know when cause I certainly don't remember that!!

http://www.glue.umd.edu/~gdogum/ovechkin-tootoo.avi

Berkut

01-03-2005, 12:38 PM

The Russians were disgraceful last night and the Canadian team will have that in the back of their minds...not to mention bringing back the gold.
Why would Canada care? To avenge "their american brothers"? How cute...Like they can't defends themselves..
:lol

TORRUS

01-03-2005, 01:03 PM

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 01:08 PM

Russia has 2 or 3 stars.Canada has a whole team of them.Russia has an outside chance if Khudobbin steals it.

Alexander Ovechkin
Evgeny Malkin
Sergei Shirokov
Roman Voloshenko
Alexander Radulov
Denis Parshin
Enver Lisin

shall I go on ?

FlyersGuy69

01-03-2005, 01:11 PM

I like Canada 6-2.

espo

01-03-2005, 01:12 PM

I disagree.

The only reason Canada did not score more goals is because Marek Schwarz played outstanding positionally and demonstrated remarkable composure under the fire of extremely patient forwards who did precisely the opposite and did NOT force the issue and did not showboat at all, and waited for the goaltender to play himself out of position as so many do under duress. Schwarz's rebound control was suberb and he limited the amount of second chances that Canada had, which resulted in the score being what it ended.
Very true,that's why it ended 3-1 for sure.The Czechs were never even in this game and the scpere flattered them a great deal,Olesz? Basically a total non-factor all game....Canada was so strong defensively too....i think they could possibly have been on the pk or most of the game and still won,that's how strong our defenseive game is,not just the d-men but the forwards too,their positional play,puck support and backchecking is phenomenal.I've never see a team in this tournament as good defensively as this years squad.

HabLover

01-03-2005, 01:13 PM

Well Ovechkin was 17 when he knocked out Tootoo, now he's 19, he's bigger, faster, stronger. And Malkin is even bigger.

When Ovechkin hit Gonchar in the Russian League this year, Gonchar had a concussion and had to be transported to a hospital. Bring it on Phaneuf!

Knocked out Tootoo??? I don't know what game you were watching and btw, Tootoo is like 5'5, so that's something to really brag about! :bow:

As for the Ovechkin hit on Gonchar, it was nothing more than a perfectly placed shoulder to the head of Gonchar who was dangling with the puck and Ovechkin was just skating by and clipped him with his shoulder. It was nothing even close to a bone crunching open ice hit like some Russians were bragging it up to be! It was a head shot and Gonchar should be choked, but it was nothing like Phaneuf on Olesz last year! Ka Boom!!! :madfire:

Johnny

01-03-2005, 01:16 PM

Canadian keys to victory.

- Get pucks in deep, applying good pressure on the defence through the forecheck. A) Looking to break them down on the cycle B) Looking to create turnovers.

- Stay out of the box.

- Better execution on the PP then we seen against the Czech.. Going to have to make the most of the golden opportunites that present themself.

- Limit the amount of turnovers in the neutral zone.. If there is no play, dont try and force it, keep it simple and make the safe play.

- No getting trapped deep standing in, leading to odd man rushes. *cough cough, Seabrook* If not 100 % sure a play can be made, forget gambling.

- Limit their time and space with the puck at all times. Take away their plays to the middle of the ice in the offensive zone. If they want to beat you, force them to beat you down low, or along the boards by out battling you one on one.. As a Canadian fan, I'll take my chances when it comes to the one on one battles down low with the size of this defence. I'm not terribly concerned about the Canadian defence being unable to handle Russia's forecheck. However the Russians are quick, and if the Canadian defence attempts too much with the puck, rather then making the simple play, turnovers can be caused

Russia's best chance.

- Get good goaltending, keeping it tight. Hope to capitalize on pp oppotunites, which will not be easy with the way Canada can kill penalties. As well, hope to capitalize with their transition game, hoping to catch a few odd man rushes. Deadly if given time and space.

If both teams come out, and are at the top of their games, I'm going with a win Canada.

espo

01-03-2005, 01:18 PM

I understand entirely, and I think AO's physicality is sometimes under-appreciated. But Gonchar is not, physically, Dion Phaneuf. Phaneuf doesn't typically get hit in the open ice because of the style he plays. Whereas AO will be retrieving pucks from the corners and boards, where taking hits is necessary. I'm not saying that AO won't be able to handle it, in fact, I really don't know, that's why I'm so interested in seeing that battle take place.
Me too,clash of the titans between thoses two.....and Weber will get into it too.That guy has probably been just as much if not more physically dominating as Phaneuf right from the first game.Ovechkin will have to deal with both of them and it's a tough assignment even for a guy as talented as him.

espo

01-03-2005, 01:21 PM

I hope that poster got warnings for that post, that was way worse than any post I got warned for today.
I got warned yesterday and am still puzzled over what.It does make a guy wonder sometimes but what can you do? Sometimes i feel like a person that lived in a totalitarian society must have felt like.Sometimes the warnings seem to be over very little.Now i'm probably going to get warned againn for voicing questions about the moderators........totalitarian right?

LetsGOJackets!!

01-03-2005, 01:23 PM

power play... plus they just outworked the USA in general, but I will say the Canadians win 6-2, the Canadian team is far more talented than the USA.

espo

01-03-2005, 01:23 PM

he always gets knocked around by 19 year old teenagers?
the general consenus aeround these boards seems to be(especially thoses of the Russian variety) is that Ovechkin is so strong and such an unstoppable physical specimen that he knocks around everyone in his way.If this is true as they say his age means very little then.

Johnny

01-03-2005, 01:49 PM

http://www.glue.umd.edu/~gdogum/ovechkin-tootoo.avi

Is that suppose to be evidence that Ovechkin knocked out Tootoo. Tootoo took the worst of a hit he initiated. He was still right back up on his feet. Poor wording on behalf of those who claim Tootoo was knocked out.

Puckhead

01-03-2005, 02:01 PM

Alexander Ovechkin
Evgeny Malkin
Sergei Shirokov
Roman Voloshenko
Alexander Radulov
Denis Parshin
Enver Lisin

shall I go on ?Actually I would like you to go on...but you have already mentioned everyone of note on team Russia.

There is no doubting the amount of talent on the Russian team, but please don't try to compare it player for player with the Canadians, because if you were to be honest, you would have to admit as a team, Canada is deeper and more complete.

It will be no small task, and perhaps it can't be done, BUT if Canada can manage to shut down or atleast limit Ovechkin and Malkin's chances, Russia really has no chance. The Russians on the other hand cannot focus on one or two players on Canada to shut down, because they have all four lines that can hurt you.

The Russians have to hope that Canada gets into penalty trouble early, and that Khudobin has a Schwarz like game. While I am still skeptical of Glass in a tight game, this Canadian team and specifically the defense are rock solid. Everyone taks about how they steam rolled everyone, and then when it really counted they only scored three on the Czechs. The thing to keep in mind, is that they only allowed 11 shots against a team that is quite skilled in their own right. Schwarz was incredible. If he plays just great, Canada scores atleast three more goals, and then you could officially call it a steam roll.

As a fan of the game and what we have seen thus far in the tourney, you have to like this match up. These are the two best teams going for gold. Yes there may have been some upsets, but nothing that really made a big difference. The US was not seriously looked at to repeat and obviously they didn't. Having said all that, you have to like Canada's chances. The Russians are pretty much a one dimensional hockey team, that can only hurt you with their forwards, whereas Canada has incredible forwards, coupled with the strongest D corps in a long time, and a very capable keeper, who while he won't steal you a game, because of the team in front of him...he won't have to!

MOGiLNY

01-03-2005, 02:11 PM

the general consenus aeround these boards seems to be(especially thoses of the Russian variety) is that Ovechkin is so strong and such an unstoppable physical specimen that he knocks around everyone in his way.If this is true as they say his age means very little then.

if this is true, it also means that Phaneuf has his work cut out for him

Puckhead

01-03-2005, 02:12 PM

OK, time for my prediction!
1) The pressure is on Canada (a lot of pressure)
2) Khudobin>>Glass
3) Russia outplays Canada tacticly

The Russians are aware of Canadas strenght and talent and will play a smart game.
Canadian offence will be as good as Russian but Khudobin will be the difference. Canada hasn't faced real competition yet and when they see that it's no joke they will loose their heads (especially if they trail).
The difference will be in tactical approach and in goalkeepers.

More of the same: 3-2 Canada entering the 3rd and at the end 4-3 Russia.The Russians outplay Canada tactically? Where did that come from. I can understand that if that is your opinion, but usually opinion is based on some sort of fact, and what games have you been watching if you think Canada can be topped tactically. Besides the Russian players seem to be a little too busy trying to show up the opposition then to out think them. The only way Russia wins is to score early and often, and I highy doubt they will score that often. Canada will play a patient game, trying to limit Russia's chances and then pounce offensively when they get the chance. They know they can score so sooner or later the flood gates may open.

I was very impressed with how the Russians took care of the US, but the whooping it up, and trying to silence the crowd, and the Hulk Hogan hand to the ear thing is just over the top. There is no place for that, and you can be sure it will give Canada added fuel if they see any of that nonsense tomorrow night.

Bennysflyers16

01-03-2005, 02:18 PM

Who has Home ice advantage, ie. the last line change ?

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 02:24 PM

Actually I would like you to go on...but you have already mentioned everyone of note on team Russia.

Hey I can'T say I'm totally objective here but to me

Ovechkin > Crosby
Malkin > Bergeron
Shirokov > Carter
Radulov > Ladd
Khudobin > Glass
Voloshenkov > Dawes
Lisin > Stewart

The only way I can see a Canadian > Russian is on defense.

Puckhead

01-03-2005, 02:33 PM

Hey I can'T say I'm totally objective here but to me

Ovechkin > Crosby
Malkin > Bergeron
Shirokov > Carter
Radulov > Ladd
Khudobin > Glass
Voloshenkov > Dawes
Lisin > Stewart

The only way I can see a Canadian > Russian is on defense.
I can appreciate that, if that is the way you feel. However, this is not a one on one competition. This is Russia vs. Canada, and apart from the defense, you have discounted Getzlaf, Perry, and Richards, not to mention an incredible fourth line of MacCarthur, Dixon, and Fraser. These guys are going to give the Russian D fits all night long.

Going back to the depth issue. For Russia to win, obviously their best players have to be their best players. Whereas Canada can have any number of guys step up and deliver. Anthony Stewart has not lit it up this WJC, but lets not forget he was tied for the tournament lead last year. The Russians and specifically the D, can't let up for one second against any one of Canada's four lines, or they will find themselves in a hole, that Canada's D may not allow them to get themselves out of.

THE NEXT ONE #87

01-03-2005, 02:35 PM

:shakehead Hey I can'T say I'm totally objective here but to me

Ovechkin > Crosby
Malkin > Bergeron
Shirokov > Carter
Radulov > Ladd
Khudobin > Glass
Voloshenkov > Dawes
Lisin > Stewart

The only way I can see a Canadian > Russian is on defense.

espo

01-03-2005, 02:37 PM

if this is true, it also means that Phaneuf has his work cut out for him
of course it does.Ovechkin is what?6'2 and about 210 or 215? and has world class skills...so naturally it won't be walk in the park,it'll be his toughest assignment yet,that was'nt my point of course.Having said that......Ovechkin will have his toughest battle also tommorow and not just against Phaneuf. We'll see won't we?

deandebean

01-03-2005, 02:57 PM

Alexander Ovechkin
Evgeny Malkin
Sergei Shirokov
Roman Voloshenko
Alexander Radulov
Denis Parshin
Enver Lisin

shall I go on ?

If you even dare calling Radulov a star, buddy, you have a problem. The kid can't even be his team's best player in the Q.

THE NEXT ONE #87

01-03-2005, 03:01 PM

of course it does.Ovechkin is what?6'2 and about 210 or 215? and has world class skills...so naturally it won't be walk in the park,it'll be his toughest assignment yet,that was'nt my point of course.Having said that......Ovechkin will have his toughest battle also tommorow and not just against Phaneuf. We'll see won't we?

Crosby will also face his toughest battle tomorrow. He has something to prove..... If think Ovechkin will more than once crash the canadian defenense and score a hattrick. if not, russia will lose. the need a stellar goaltending, tough defense and a ovechkin.

deandebean

01-03-2005, 03:05 PM

Canada has the best defence, by a freaking mile. The Ruskies D is soft as they come. Most are pushovers.

You win by defence. Always been that way.

The Ruskies are potent one-on-one. If Canada can avoid one-on-one confrontations, the Ruskies stand no chance. Because the Ruskies cannot play as a unit anymore. They are individuals. They haven't played like a unit since the "great" Red Army/CCCP years.

This is Canada's tourney to lose. If, by any chance, the Ruskies come out with the win tomorrow, it will have been because Canada has been undisciplined. Can't see it other ways. Ruskies hockey has been all about individualism since the fall of the Soviet Empire.

Sorry, guys. But if Canada sticks to its gun and plays an "in-your-face", very tight game, no way in hell can the Ruskies even get 25 shots on net. Sure, they'll get the odd rushes, because their top 2 players are elite. The rest is irrelevant. That's how the pros have beaten them the last 20 years or so. That's how this team has to play to beat them. Simple as that.

deandebean

01-03-2005, 03:07 PM

Sting

01-03-2005, 03:07 PM

the fact that Ovechkin is a man playing in mens league is only more evidence that he won't be a pushover for Phaneuf.. tomorrow we'll find out if it's the opposite in fact.

You forget that Phaneuf is widely considered the best defenseman prospect in the world right now. Many people who have seen him play say he's Scott Stevens with more offense. Phaneuf would be playing in the NHL right now if there was no lockout..so he'd be in the top league in the world.

I'm not saying Ovechkin isn't big and doesn't hit hard...I'm just saying Phaneuf is both bigger and stronger and he will get the better of Ovechkin in the physical department.

Sting

01-03-2005, 03:14 PM

Hey I can'T say I'm totally objective here but to me

Ovechkin > Crosby
Malkin > Bergeron
Shirokov > Carter
Radulov > Ladd
Khudobin > Glass
Voloshenkov > Dawes
Lisin > Stewart

The only way I can see a Canadian > Russian is on defense.

I also couldn't let this one go by :) Here's my opinion:

Ovechkin = Crosby - Crosby is a better player, but a year younger means he hasn't developed as much

Malkin < Bergeron - Bergeron has NHL experience and was a force even there. No question here at this point.

Shirokov < Carter - If you disagree, it shows you haven't been watching this tournament.

Radulov = Ladd
Khudobin = Glass
Voloshenkov < Dawes
Lisin < Richards

Makarov

01-03-2005, 03:15 PM

Please tell me I can listen to the game online; freakin ESPN would rather show POKER of all things...

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:20 PM

LOL

6-0
5-0
7-3
8-1
9-0

I think they got that goin for them..

I mean based on the last couple years finals where they've had the lead in all three games

Nielson81

01-03-2005, 03:22 PM

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:22 PM

Not in the Czech game, though.

They outshot the Czechz 42-11.... they out chanced them 24-2

Glass let in a weak one... if it weren't for an incredible performance by Marek Scwartz it would have been 6 or 7-1

Russia will lose... and thats fine

Nielson81

01-03-2005, 03:24 PM

I also couldn't let this one go by :) Here's my opinion:

Ovechkin = Crosby - Crosby is a better player, but a year younger means he hasn't developed as much

Malkin < Bergeron - Bergeron has NHL experience and was a force even there. No question here at this point.

Shirokov < Carter - If you disagree, it shows you haven't been watching this tournament.

Radulov = Ladd
Khudobin = Glass
Voloshenkov < Dawes
Lisin < Richards

WRONG!

Ovechkin > Crosby....and Ovechkin is the better player.
Malkin = Bergeron
Carter > Shirikov...Canada wins this one easy.
Radulov > Ladd....Ladd has proven to me in this tournament his offensive upside is about the same as Ken Daneyko (Joking, but still)
Khubdobin > Glass
Dawes > Voloshenko
Richard > Lisin

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 03:24 PM

I can appreciate that, if that is the way you feel. However, this is not a one on one competition. This is Russia vs. Canada, and apart from the defense, you have discounted Getzlaf, Perry, and Richards, not to mention an incredible fourth line of MacCarthur, Dixon, and Fraser. These guys are going to give the Russian D fits all night long.

Going back to the depth issue. For Russia to win, obviously their best players have to be their best players. Whereas Canada can have any number of guys step up and deliver. Anthony Stewart has not lit it up this WJC, but lets not forget he was tied for the tournament lead last year. The Russians and specifically the D, can't let up for one second against any one of Canada's four lines, or they will find themselves in a hole, that Canada's D may not allow them to get themselves out of.

I could have talked about PArshin, Nikulin & Pestunov but why bother , people who never watched them would easily say that their canadians are better because they saw them in the CHL.

I agree that Canada's 4th line is NO MATCH with Russia's 4th line but at this point & on 1 GAME (not a best of 7) 3 lines & 5 D will be enough.

Mowzie

01-03-2005, 03:25 PM

This should be a good matchup, but I think as long as both teams play to their potential that Canada should take it. Canada must play disciplined hockey, because The Russian Squad has a very powerful powerplay. If Canada can stay focused then we should expect a win.

5-3 Canada
Perry, Ladd, Stewart, Crosby, Getzlaf
Ovechkin, Lisin, Radulov

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 03:25 PM

If you even dare calling Radulov a star, buddy, you have a problem. The kid can't even be his team's best player in the Q.

Well that doesn't mean anything. If stats is your only argument than Lisin must be very good because he played 1st line with full of NHLers in Kazan.

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:27 PM

I would post more, but since I seemed to get some sort of a warning and do not wish to get banned I will only say this:

You say Schwartz handled rebounds, I say he bounced the puck. A lot. Canadians were just unlucky to never be there in the rebounds when they happened. Once Schwartz even hit a Canadian player with his glove trying to catch the puck and ended up not even getting the puck. He looked nervous more and more towards the end and yet the Canadians failed to take advantage.

You say Canadians weren't showing off, I can only ask you these:

What do you call it then when you pass from a scoring chance and end up losing the puck? What do you call it when you circle around the goal 2-3 times and don't take a shot even though you have a chance and end up losing the puck? (I call this showing off, maybe because I don't know a better word for it in the English language, but this is what I meant anyway.)

What do you call it when all your shots are aimed at the center of the goal instead of the posts? (I call that poor finishing.)
He faced 23 GD scoring chances and only let in 3... thats pretty good in my books

Alex Kovalev

01-03-2005, 03:28 PM

5-3 Canada

Crosby (2), Bergeron, Dixon, Coburn

Malkin (2), Radulov

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:28 PM

outside chance yeah like against the Usa ........ :lol

Nope the USA wasn't as strong as last year... and their D were horrendous

Aaron Vickers

01-03-2005, 03:29 PM

For those of you who think Phanuef is such a monster and will physically dominate Ovechkin...WAKE UP CALL

Hockey DB Figures:

Phanuef - 6"2 - 200 LBS
Ovechkin - 6"1 - 212 LBS

The WHL Media Guide has Phaneuf listed at 6'3, 208 lbs, a figure taken before the season.

Ironically enough, they are the exact same figures that they have Shea Weber listed at, someone Ovechkin's certainly going to have to keep his head up for as well.

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 03:29 PM

I also couldn't let this one go by :) Here's my opinion:

Ovechkin = Crosby - Crosby is a better player, but a year younger means he hasn't developed as much

Malkin < Bergeron - Bergeron has NHL experience and was a force even there. No question here at this point.

Shirokov < Carter - If you disagree, it shows you haven't been watching this tournament.

Radulov = Ladd
Khudobin = Glass
Voloshenkov < Dawes
Lisin < Richards

NHL experience & RSL experience, does it matter ? Malkin is way more explosive than Bergeron

I've been watching all canada's game & if you don'T know Shirokov , then you only watched the Canada's game on The Subjective Network

Every year that the russians are going to the final , every Canadian fan underrate our goalie & it's not unusual again this year.

Richards got more leadership but not more offensive power than Lisin SORRY !

Again Voloshenko is a top 6 NHL material while Dawes will be an energy 3rd line player for the Rangers that says it all. I still like Dawes very much though.

Nielson81

01-03-2005, 03:30 PM

The WHL Media Guide has Phaneuf listed at 6'3, 208 lbs, a figure taken before the season.

Ironically enough, they are the exact same figures that they have Shea Weber listed at, someone Ovechkin's certainly going to have to keep his head up for as well.

I had a feeling 6"2 200 was a little low for Phanuef.....however Ovechkin is solid as hell....I don't see him getting flattened by either of them. Someone like Shirokov etc. but not one of the big boys.

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:31 PM

Alexander Ovechkin
Evgeny Malkin
Sergei Shirokov
Roman Voloshenko
Alexander Radulov
Denis Parshin
Enver Lisin

shall I go on ?

Denis Parshin
Enver Lisin
If these guys are STARS then 50 percent of the tournament is

Johnny

01-03-2005, 03:31 PM

For those of you who think Phanuef is such a monster and will physically dominate Ovechkin...WAKE UP CALL

Hockey DB Figures:

Phanuef - 6"2 - 200 LBS
Ovechkin - 6"1 - 212 LBS

Phanuef has been crunching kids in the WHL while Ovechkin has been known to knock a grown man senseless is Russia.

If anything I could see Ovechkin "Phaneufing" Phaneuf.

I'm sure if those figures are accurate but no matter what, they are close.

Unbiased Canadian

I think you should wake up. If Phaneuf catches Ovechkin with his head down, expect Ovechkin to be put on his ass. I dont care who you are, and where you play, if you get caught with your head down, you are going down. Phaneuf isn't Tootoo who runs around looking to finish every check regardless if the intended target has his head down or not. He picks his spots when the opportunity is there for the taking. If Ovechkin keeps his head up when crossing paths with Dion, Phaneuf will not over committ himself going for the big hit... Thats how you get schooled as a defender one on one off the rush, especially against a guy with Ovechkin's skills. And yes, Ovechkin is fully capable of laying Phaneuf out with a big time hit as well, if the right opporunity presents itself.

WVP

01-03-2005, 03:31 PM

WRONG!

Ovechkin > Crosby....and Ovechkin is the better player.
Malkin = Bergeron
Carter > Shirikov...Canada wins this one easy.
Radulov > Ladd....Ladd has proven to me in this tournament his offensive upside is about the same as Ken Daneyko (Joking, but still)
Khubdobin > Glass
Dawes > Voloshenko
Richard > Lisin

Seems about right...

Alex Kovalev

01-03-2005, 03:32 PM

The only person you gotta question in this game is Glass. He has yet to see a lot of action in this tournament and this game is gonna be his busiest by far. If he can keep us in, we will win. If he is letting in softy's like the Olesz goal, Russia could take this one.

I cant wait to watch this game.

Aaron Vickers

01-03-2005, 03:33 PM

The WHL Media Guide has Phaneuf listed at 6'3, 208 lbs, a figure taken before the season.

Ironically enough, they are the exact same figures that they have Shea Weber listed at, someone Ovechkin's certainly going to have to keep his head up for as well.

Canada's Defense/WHL Media Guide
Dion Phaneuf - 6'3 - 208 LBS
Shea Weber - 6'3 - 208 LBS
Shawn Belle - 6'2 - 224 LBS
Brent Seabrook - 6'2 - 215 LBS
Braydon Coburn - 6'5 - 210 LBS

ktownhockey

01-03-2005, 03:34 PM

I had a feeling 6"2 200 was a little low for Phanuef.....however Ovechkin is solid as hell....I don't see him getting flattened by either of them. Someone like Shirokov etc. but not one of the big boys.

It doesn't matter how tall you are, or how much you weigh it's how you position yourself to hit and the impact you present to the contact.

Phanuef is a hitter and will hit. This doesn't mean he will dominate AO. I think he'll use his defensive tools for this not JUST his body checking skills.

Bobby Lou

01-03-2005, 03:36 PM

I can't believe how many people are underplaying Schwarz's role in the Canadian/Czech semi-final. In my mind this guy was frigging sensational and was maybe the best player in that game. He was almost positionally perfect and demonstrated a huge amount of poise in a game where Canada held the Czech zone magnificently.

If Russia had Schwarz I'd be pretty worried. But they don't and their defense is also possibly worse then the Czech's. You have the two best offensive teams in the tournament, but Canada has the better defense by a mile. Goaltending is pretty comparable, but Canada should win this one due to the fact they have possibly the most dominant defensive group in tournament history.

Aaron Vickers

01-03-2005, 03:36 PM

Again Voloshenko is a top 6 NHL material while Dawes will be an energy 3rd line player for the Rangers that says it all. I still like Dawes very much though.

In a game like this, I could care less if Voloshenko is projected to be a 1st liner and Dawes a career minor leaguer.

In a one game, winner take all, I'm not concerned about top end potential five years from now, I'm more concerned with what level each player is currently on.

Anksun

01-03-2005, 03:38 PM

I dont know but i keep hearing how powerful the russia offense is...
Canada offense now own the record of the most goals scored in the round-games.

While i hope this game stay close (perhaps we'll see a "real" game with team Canada in this year tournament as only the semi-final was close in scoring but still a blow-out in about everything else), i think the only team that could make Canada lost this year is themselves. There's not a team in this tournament who REALLY stand much of a chance unless Canada doesnt show. Taking into consideration last year final result, they will show this year.

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 03:39 PM

In a game like this, I could care less if Voloshenko is projected to be a 1st liner and Dawes a career minor leaguer.

In a one game, winner take all, I'm not concerned about top end potential five years from now, I'm more concerned with what level each player is currently on.

Very good point Aaron.

Dawes can energize & his the best of the two in the tournament so far.

But on 1 final game, will you take skills or heart ?

Aaron Vickers

01-03-2005, 03:43 PM

Very good point Aaron.

Dawes can energize & his the best of the two in the tournament so far.

But on 1 final game, will you take skills or heart ?

Depends what qualities the other 21 players on my roster possess.

2forsbergaura1

01-03-2005, 03:47 PM

silly question but what time is this game on and is it today?

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 03:47 PM

Depends what qualities the other 21 players on my roster possess.

Sure it really depends if it's the NHL or the WJC but my reasoning is that the FINAL GAME will be all about OFFENSIVE RUSH & OFFENSIVE WEAPONS so the 3rd line should be more about skills than character.

Anyway, it always worked for Canada to have a great mix of power, leadership & energy, why should they change that ? THAT'S CANADA !!!

It always worked for Russia to live & die with SKILLS , FINESSE & some HARD play along the boards , why should they change that ? THAT'S RUSSIA !!!

At least that's how I see it

Aaron Vickers

01-03-2005, 03:50 PM

silly question but what time is this game on and is it today?

Tuesday at 8 ET I believe.

Camshaft77

01-03-2005, 03:52 PM

I think too many people are basing predictions just on individual skills, instead of looking at it from this point of view, its a team game, all 12 -13 forwards all 6-7 defense have to play well and of course the goaltending or youn won't win. Hell Jeff Carter can play amazing but if his linemates don't show up then it will be hard to be effective. AO can pot a hattrick but if the rest of russia dosn't play well then they will lose. It's not baseketball, its hockey the ultimate team game.

CSKA

01-03-2005, 03:55 PM

Berkut

01-03-2005, 04:01 PM

Why dont we all just give the credit both teams deserve and watch what happends tomorrow?
Each team has its strenghts and weaknesses, so the team that works the hard will get the gold. The only thing I'm sure about is that it will be a good game!

Edler Statesman*

01-03-2005, 04:01 PM

Malkin's upside is greater than Bergeron's. I completely agree and do not dispute that fact. The issue at hand is whether or not Malkin is better than Bergeron right now? I don't think he is. He has more raw skill for sure, but he doesn't have the maturity that Bergeron has. Bergeron is a better all-round player.

So, for the next game, I'd take Bergeron over Malkin. Ask me who I'd like in my system and I'd say Malkin so quickly that you'd have to go back in time to hear me say Malkin.

CSKA

01-03-2005, 04:05 PM

Shane

01-03-2005, 04:07 PM

You forget that Phaneuf is widely considered the best defenseman prospect in the world right now. Many people who have seen him play say he's Scott Stevens with more offense. Phaneuf would be playing in the NHL right now if there was no lockout..so he'd be in the top league in the world.

I'm not saying Ovechkin isn't big and doesn't hit hard...I'm just saying Phaneuf is both bigger and stronger and he will get the better of Ovechkin in the physical department.

Stevens had offense as well. Look at the numbers he put up in the early nineties.

THE NEXT ONE #87

01-03-2005, 04:14 PM

Edler Statesman*

01-03-2005, 04:17 PM

Please dont understand me wrong BUT why is Bergeron a better all-round player ? Because Malkin is russian and can only score Goals ????

Hehe..

I've only seen one game by Malkin, and I may have misinterpreted his game, but he seemed very lazy. He is a complete offensive package but he failed to backcheck hard at all. Also I didn't see him use his size very much, while Bergeron throws a lot of hits. I was paying close attention to both him and Ovechkin.

That said, I think Ovechkin is the best player on both teams right now.

Slick Nick

01-03-2005, 04:17 PM

O man Bergeron better than Malkin ? No way ! NOOO way !

Damn i saw Malkin with metalurg in the RSL and what can i say he is just SICK ! The way he skates , hes ice-vision - playmaking ability ! He will be 100 % a superstar in the NHL ! Hes two way game is so good :bow:

I see him very close to Ovechkin ! Hell he is 2nd overall ! In other draft 1st overall !

It's really hard to compare these players. Beregeron is a very energetic, hard working forward with a lot strenght. I loved this guy since the first time I saw him play with the Bruins (habs fans, we see them all the time, and for an 18 years old, he was trumenous for Boston). He was one of their best players in the playoffs also.

Malkin on the other hand is such a superb finesse player. It's just amazing to see him carry the puck from end to end, beating his opponents with his sped and awsome moves at center ice. His zone entries are incredible, he can feather the puck through 4 players exactly on the tape of his winger, or skate around till he's in a good position, backhand passes, blind passes.. he's going to be a concession player, no doubt about that.

So yeah I also think Malkin is a better player than Beregon overall, but Bergeron is also very good, but in another way...

CSKA

01-03-2005, 04:19 PM

:lol in which draft??

2001 Kovalchuk
2002 Nash
2003 Fleury
2004 Ovechkin
2005 Crosby
2006 Kessel, Frolik, Mueller, Vasjunov, Joensuu
..
2008 John Ta...

He is just a good pick for 2nd overall but not a number one!!

O man do you saw him play ? 2006/2003/2002 no problem !!!

And what means :lol ha ? This kid has so much talent you just dont know it ! But hey i know Crosby all the way babyyyyyyyyyyyyy :shakehead

willie

01-03-2005, 04:20 PM

Steve Latin*

01-03-2005, 04:28 PM

The Old Master

01-03-2005, 04:29 PM

Hehe..

I've only seen one game by Malkin, and I may have misinterpreted his game, but he seemed very lazy. He is a complete offensive package but he failed to backcheck hard at all. Also I didn't see him use his size very much, while Bergeron throws a lot of hits. I was paying close attention to both him and Ovechkin.

That said, I think Ovechkin is the best player on both teams right now. i have only seen him in two games, one he spent bounceing pucks off his wingers sticks and didn't look that good till he started to try to do things himself. the second game he looked much better,skateing shooting, and crushing players with great checks, even out playing ao. he dosen't look like he is skateing fast but no one can catch him.
its real hard to judge a player by one or two games even the great ones have off nights.

Slick Nick

01-03-2005, 04:30 PM

O man do you saw him play ? 2006/2003/2002 no problem !!!

And what means :lol ha ? This kid has so much talent you just dont know it ! But hey i know Crosby all the way babyyyyyyyyyyyyy :shakehead

I wouldn't say he's better than Nash... pretty close race, but Nash would still be the no 1 over Malkin simply because he's a pure goal scorer...

Sort of Bure/Fedorov comparaison; the most spectacular and best scorer is Bure, but Fedorov is a better player... so..

Agreed about Fleury and Kessel/Frolik ... I'm pretty sure any GM would pick Malkin over them.

Gags1288

01-03-2005, 04:33 PM

Richards got more leadership but not more offensive power than Lisin SORRY !

.
He might be more talented offensively, and I don't think he is, but he isn't even Richard's LEAGUE when it comes to all around ability. Not even close. Richard's is infinately better defensively, he's better in the corners, he's a better playmaker, he's feistier, he's just flat out better.

As for Shirikov being better than Carter, I haven't stopped laughing about this one. Carter, imo, has been the best player on team Canada in this tournement. The kid has flat out dominated on a line where he's being asked to go up against the other teams top forwards. I think Carter could be the best player in this game and will play a big part in limiting Ovechkin's chances because of his great speed and size.

man for man, no one can compete with Canada's depth offensively and defensively. There is a reason that many 1st round picks were not able to make this team Canada. There are many future NHL stars on this team Canada, most of them are 18 or 19 and many of them would be in the NHL right now if they were playing (Carter, Richards, Phaneuf, Bergeron, etc....). That being said, most years Canada clearly has the best set of players and it hasn't translated to victory in quite a few years.

I just see Canada overwhelming Russia with their great depth. I think with Canada's skill, the Ovechkin line and the Malkin line will be asked to play a ton of minutes and by the end of the game, they will have worn down. If Canada can make this a physical game, I see them pulling away in the 3rd period and winning be 3 goals.

Prediction:
Canada 6
Russia 3

Goals:
Canada: Carter (2), Crosby (2), Bergeron, Dawes
Russia: Malkin (2), Shirikov

Edler Statesman*

01-03-2005, 04:35 PM

\

You must have missed Malkin crushing O'Sullivan in the final minutes of yesterday's game...

anyone have a pic of that?

S L

I could only catch that game by radio, we don't get RDS

Gags1288

01-03-2005, 04:40 PM

I wouldn't say he's better than Nash... pretty close race, but Nash would still be the no 1 over Malkin simply because he's a pure goal scorer...

Sort of Bure/Fedorov comparaison; the most spectacular and best scorer is Bure, but Fedorov is a better player... so..

Agreed about Fleury and Kessel/Frolik ... I'm pretty sure any GM would pick Malkin over them.
First, you must remember that Bouwmeester was the real #1 pick in that draft, but the trade dropped him down to 3. In addition, I don't think Malkin goes #2 in that draft, I believe he goes #5 in that draft. That's right, all of Nash, Bouwmeester, Lehtonen and Pitkanen would all have gone before Malkin. 2004 was one of the weeker drafts in recent memory with the exception of Ovechkin. Malkin's a very nice player, but he's got a long way to go. He's very talented, but he's a bit of a floater (maybe an understatement) and that won't cut it at the NHL level.

A side note, I hope the Russian team does not disgrace the game of hockey with their show boating tactics like last night, like in previous years. I'd love to see a clean game without all the diving, the taunting, the unnecessary extra curicular activities.

Bruins4Ever

01-03-2005, 04:49 PM

Canada: 6
Russia: 3

Bergeron nets 1 and gets 2 assists, Crosby gets 2 goals, Ladd steps up and gets one, finally Carter will net 2 and beat out Lindross' record of 11 goals in his tourny history. Everyone will know how good Carter is. Philly's going to be dangerous in 3-5 years. :eek:

Berkut

01-03-2005, 04:50 PM

A side note, I hope the Russian team does not disgrace the game of hockey with their show boating tactics like last night, like in previous years. I'd love to see a clean game without all the diving, the taunting, the unnecessary extra curicular activities.
It won't happend, unless the canadians provoke them (which they don't usually do, it never happened in the past games between these 2 teams). The Americans obviously provoked them...

Aaron Vickers

01-03-2005, 04:50 PM

Agreed about Fleury and Kessel/Frolik ... I'm pretty sure any GM would pick Malkin over them.

Malkin vs. Zherdev...who would you take?

Slick Nick

01-03-2005, 04:51 PM

First, you must remember that Bouwmeester was the real #1 pick in that draft, but the trade dropped him down to 3. In addition, I don't think Malkin goes #2 in that draft, I believe he goes #5 in that draft. That's right, all of Nash, Bouwmeester, Lehtonen and Pitkanen would all have gone before Malkin. 2004 was one of the weeker drafts in recent memory with the exception of Ovechkin. Malkin's a very nice player, but he's got a long way to go. He's very talented, but he's a bit of a floater (maybe an understatement) and that won't cut it at the NHL level.

A side note, I hope the Russian team does not disgrace the game of hockey with their show boating tactics like last night, like in previous years. I'd love to see a clean game without all the diving, the taunting, the unnecessary extra curicular activities.

I agree for the most part, but I still see him as a top 3 in this draft.. it's always hard to say because teams draft players depending on their needs along with what is still available. But I agree that he wouldn't have been the top pick in that draft.

Your side note is what Canadians say every year, I am used to it right now. You are the best, always been and always will be, and there's only one right way to play hockey and it's the Canadian way. And every other nation is a disgrace to this sport, and they keep on diving, ducking, and scoring silly magnificant goals on incredible plays, which is g@y hockey and the way to play the game is to shoot the puck and pick up the grabge in front of the net... Ok, sorry for my exagerations, but all this bashing is really getting annoying.

Slick Nick

01-03-2005, 04:53 PM

Malkin vs. Zherdev...who would you take?

Malkin without a doubt, although both are great.

The way I see it is there are 4 russian players who are going to dominae this game for years (among with lots of other non russian, dont get me wrong)

Kovalchuk/Ovechkin/Malkin/Zherdev

Gags1288

01-03-2005, 04:59 PM

I agree for the most part, but I still see him as a top 3 in this draft.. it's always hard to say because teams draft players depending on their needs along with what is still available. But I agree that he wouldn't have been the top pick in that draft.

Your side note is what Canadians say every year, I am used to it right now. You are the best, always been and always will be, and there's only one right way to play hockey and it's the Canadian way. And every other nation is a disgrace to this sport, and they keep on diving, ducking, and scoring silly magnificant goals on incredible plays, which is g@y hockey and the way to play the game is to shoot the puck and pick up the grabge in front of the net... Ok, sorry for my exagerations, but all this bashing is really getting annoying.

First of all, I think that the players who went 1-4 in that draft were, are, and will be better players that Malkin. That's just the way I see it; two will be dominate D-men, one will be a top 3 NHL goalie, and the last has already scored 40 in a season.

As for your second comment, I'm american. I'm very american and quite frankly, I sometimes also don't appreciate the way that some Canadians (a very small minority) feel that there is nothing beyond Canadian hockey. However, what the Russian squad did last night, what the Russian squad, namely Ilya Kovalchuk (a player I love to watch play) did a few years ago did not represent what these hockey championships are all about. I'm sure you can see that despite being a fan of team Russia.

THE NEXT ONE #87

01-03-2005, 04:59 PM

O man do you saw him play ? 2006/2003/2002 no problem !!!

:shakehead Yes I saw malkin once play and i highly respect him but he wouldn´t be the no 1 in the 2002 draft. NASHER is the real deal. Malkin isn´t as good as nash is. Nash is the raining rocket man... and i see him 3 times a week play.

espo

01-03-2005, 05:05 PM

First of all, I think that the players who went 1-4 in that draft were, are, and will be better players that Malkin. That's just the way I see it; two will be dominate D-men, one will be a top 3 NHL goalie, and the last has already scored 40 in a season.

As for your second comment, I'm american. I'm very american and quite frankly, I sometimes also don't appreciate the way that some Canadians (a very small minority) feel that there is nothing beyond Canadian hockey. However, what the Russian squad did last night, what the Russian squad, namely Ilya Kovalchuk (a player I love to watch play) did a few years ago did not represent what these hockey championships are all about. I'm sure you can see that despite being a fan of team Russia.
i don't appreciate American and Russian fans (a small minority) who do the same thing and always seem to have such short memories about it and then complain about Canadian posters. Now....what about that Canadian-Russian GAME!!I think that is the story here.....not talking about one another but judging this final is the way to keep it here

CH Wizard*

01-03-2005, 05:13 PM

Malkin is the real deal.Yesterday(I saw the game on RDS) , He wasn't lazy at all.He almost killed O'Sullivan in the last minute.I said almost killed.He was pretty decent defensively.His skating isn't bad (for a big guy like him)either.He was also solid offensively , He scored a goal on a empty net but He did some real nice moves to get that goal.I hope He'll impress even more in the final.

Just my 2 cents.

espo

01-03-2005, 05:16 PM

I don't want him to impress me at all,lol,if he is then that means more difficulty in winning the game tommorow.They have some weapons those guys.....a good game should happen.

velimiiro

01-03-2005, 05:16 PM

RUSSIA FOR GOLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :yo:

The True Blue Crew

01-03-2005, 05:21 PM

dude, I think Bergeron's been the best player on Canadian team.

p.s. Shirokov owns Carter ;)

As for Shirikov being better than Carter, I haven't stopped laughing about this one. Carter, imo, has been the best player on team Canada in this tournement. The kid has flat out dominated on a line where he's being asked to go up against the other teams top forwards. I think Carter could be the best player in this game and will play a big part in limiting Ovechkin's chances because of his great speed and size.

cassius

01-03-2005, 05:24 PM

5-3 Russia

Radulov, Shirikov, Ovechkin (2), Malkin

Crosby, Bergeron, Carter

Lessy

01-03-2005, 05:25 PM

:shakehead Yes I saw malkin once play and i highly respect him but he wouldn´t be the no 1 in the 2002 draft. NASHER is the real deal. Malkin isn´t as good as nash is. Nash is the raining rocket man... and i see him 3 times a week play.

I personally think that the number one pick would be used to address a single teams needs. If you need a playmaking center, Malkin. If you want a scoring winger, Nash. If you want a top goaltender, Lehtonen. If you need a top defensemen, Bouwmeester. I am convinced that all will become very good NHL players though and you can't go wrong with one of the big three from that draft.

EroCaps

01-03-2005, 05:26 PM

You guys are putting way too much emphasis on Crosby. The kid is 17, playing with 19 year olds. Jeez, the kid hasn't been drafted yet. Give him a chance.

This game has to be won by the likes of Bergeron, Carter, et al. Not Crosby.

He's a year behind Ovechkin and Malkin, maybe a little more. Both of whom make a living playing w/30 yr olds, and producing...

Tricolore#20

01-03-2005, 05:27 PM

I say 5-4 Canada. Canada will have a 3-1 lead going into the 3rd, but then Russia will make it 4-3, before Bergeron leads a heroic comeback.

CSKA

01-03-2005, 05:35 PM

:shakehead Yes I saw malkin once play and i highly respect him but he wouldn´t be the no 1 in the 2002 draft. NASHER is the real deal. Malkin isn´t as good as nash is. Nash is the raining rocket man... and i see him 3 times a week play.

O dude thats so funny :joker: I mean when we talk about Kovalchuk : A Russian Rocket who will score ton of goals but he never will win a Hart Trophy or win a cup

And what about Nash ha ? "Nash is the raining rocket man" ? He can do it all ? "NASHER is the real deal"

I see Malkin very close to Ovechkin ............but im still think Kovalchuk is best draftet player since 10-15 years !

letterH

01-03-2005, 05:37 PM

Vic Rattlehead

01-03-2005, 05:53 PM

dude, I think Bergeron's been the best player on Canadian team.

p.s. Shirokov owns Carter ;)
Please, you can't be serious. Carter is a better player than Shirokov.

Kasparov*

01-03-2005, 05:55 PM

Can we start a new thread when the game actually starts?!?!?! :banghead:

CH Wizard*

01-03-2005, 05:55 PM

5-3 Canada.

Canada : Bergeron , Crosby , Dawes , Carter , Phaneuf

Russia : Shirokov , Ovechkin , Malkin.

Jamie

01-03-2005, 06:04 PM

Please, you can't be serious. Carter is a better player than Shirokov.
Not that I disagree with you. I do think Carter is better as well, but Shirokov most certainly is a good player as well and I can see where someone could say they think he's been the better player.

Personally, I think Bergeron has been the best player in the entire tournament, and will most likely make a big impact in the finals.

Lessy

01-03-2005, 06:06 PM

This game has a number of matchups that will determine the outcome.

Ovechkin vs. Phaneuf/Weber

Get used to seeing this matchup, they will be constantly on the ice against each other, weather it be even strength, powerplay or penalty kill. If Ovechkin can be shut down, I don't think there's much doubt that Canada will win. Ovechkin is the best Russian player, Phaneuf is in my opinion, the best Canadian. I expect a physical battle whenever these guys are on the ice together. It should be an interesting matchup and very fun to watch. The winner of this battle will be anyone's best guess but will go a long way to determining the outcome.

Ovechkin vs. Crosby

The two "next one's" The two players who are supposed to dominate hockey through the next decade or two. Weather they will live up to expectations is anyones guess but in this one game, winner take all match, both will have to be at their best. This will be there last shot at winning gold at this tournament barring a longer lockout than expected. Crosby however, is still only 17 and playing in a 19 year olds tournament isn't exactly following in the footsteps of the Great One despite his six goals.

Russian Defense vs. Canadian Forwards

The Russian defense, outside of Megalinski and Belov are pretty undersized. Team Canada's forwards, on the other hand are massive for the most part. If Canada forechecks the Russian defense hard in the early going with the likes of Stewart, Getzlaf and Carter, they should stand a better chance in the later going. The cycle game of Canada has also been a huge strength. I expect them to be able to control the game along the walls in the offensive zone and create good chances either at the goalmouth or with open shots from the point.

Glass vs. Khudobin

The glaring match-up that on paper, could go any way. In my opinion, it should just come down to who is having the good night. There could be one guy who steps up, or one that chokes. Both goalies are relatively unproven in this tournament although Khudobin has faced considerably more shots than Glass. It is the game of these young men's life and it is anyones best guess as to how they will perform come Tuesday night.

Canadian Penalty Killers vs. Russian Powerplay

The Canadian penalty killers are simply outstanding. The likes of Macarthur, Fraser, Richards, and Dixon have been phenomonal in pressuring the opposing defensemen and creating several offensive chances of their own. However, they haven't faced a powerplay comparable to that of the Russians. It will be important for Canada's forwards and defensemen to get in passing lanes and clear the front of the net, and also to watch for potential backdoor opportunities.

I think that the comparison of Shirokov to Carter definitely needs to come to an end. There is no doubt that Carter is the better player. Shirokov is lighting it up this tournament, and is definitely comparable to Carter offensively, but Carter's game is so well-rounded in the defensive and checking aspects of the game, it's really not a fair comparison at all. In terms of the Bergeron-Malkin comparisons, both in my opinion are excellent players that will need to have big games Tuesday. I'd rather have Bergeron than Malkin for this game simply because he has experience of big games (NHL playoff game 7, World Championships) under his belt and he is a year older than Malkin. Don't get me wrong, Malkin is a great talent who I would take over Bergeron any day when starting a franchise, but I'd rather have the better rounded Bergeron for this one game.

London Knights

01-03-2005, 06:35 PM

Very awesome game.

Can Russia penetrate the Canadian defense?
Can Glass hold Russia out, it hasn't been proven that he can yet, although neither has it been proven that he cannot.
Can the Russian defense/goaltending limit Canada's tallies?

Both teams have firepower. Canada has a superior defense, but how will they respond. They are down to 6, and there are no guarantees on how Seabrook's health will be.

Canada 6 Russia 4

Russian Fan

01-03-2005, 06:36 PM

Frankly, I don't even this going to much a game. Sure, Russia has some amazing top-end talent but, at the end of the day, I think their skill will be negated by a dominant Canadian defense. I'm thinking the game is going to wind up something like 7-2 with shots heavily in favour of Canada.

Just because Canada utilizes a mix of power,leadership, & energy to play hockey doesn't mean skill is not an equally integral part of their team. This Canadian team is damn skilled and every bit as talented as their Russian counterparts.

1st paragraph is just dreams ! Even on my side I never expect a 7-2 Russia over Canada. Not with all the power on both sides.

2nd paragraph : I meant that the staff always go with 2 offensive power , 3rd line half offensive, half defensive & the 4thline = Energy line. Always has been like that & that worked most of the time. I'm not saying it's not good , i'm just saying that someone like Alexandre Picard on Russia would have been picked because SKILLS is what's matter on Russia !!!

We play the most talented player that's all on our team & we create a chemistry after. We don't think something like ''This guy can't be our 3rd liner, he's not that defensive, he can only scores'' like the Canada where you think that it's important to have ''ROLE PLAYERS''.

Is that bad ? Nope , just 2 major difference between how Canada's staff is working & how the Russian's staff thinking.

sonnytheman

01-03-2005, 07:01 PM

i predict a 3-3 tie. They are very evenly matched teams

Fighter

01-03-2005, 07:03 PM

6-2 Canada

Bergeron (2), Crosby, Carter, Perry, Dawes
Ovechkin, Shirokov

espo

01-03-2005, 07:59 PM

I am a little surprised at some Canadian fans cheering Canada. Reading all the posts when the list of invitees was posted, I recall many saying they were not going to cheer for Canada. Its funny looking back at how so many said there were too many WHL players, and how disgusted they were at Sutter and Hockey Canada. Now, CANADA RULES for them once again....
I've been meaning to mention it.I think they had a point in that there are players from other leagues who could be doing just fine in the same roles as the guys here from the dub that got picked but i never agreed that the picks were wrong...i just think it's one of those years where whether a guy like Bernier got picked would'nt make any difference because they are just strong anyway.As for Canadian fans not cheering for team Canada because they did'nt like the picks well.....that is something that just struck me as bizarre........talk about having a favourite player skewer your judgement.....amazing...i'll never understand that attitude.

Puckhead

01-03-2005, 08:24 PM

I could have talked about PArshin, Nikulin & Pestunov but why bother , people who never watched them would easily say that their canadians are better because they saw them in the CHL.

I agree that Canada's 4th line is NO MATCH with Russia's 4th line but at this point & on 1 GAME (not a best of 7) 3 lines & 5 D will be enough.
Very True, so let the best team win!!!

wilka91*

01-03-2005, 08:57 PM

Go Russia!

St.Louis sports fan

01-03-2005, 09:19 PM

onice

01-03-2005, 09:39 PM

Look all this bravado is useless. Let's look at some facts. In the last 10 years Canada and Russia both won 3 golds. Canada a total of 9 medals; Russia 8. Do I need to say more?

ryz

01-03-2005, 09:42 PM

Goaltending should be fairly even as well as offensive firepower, but when it comes to defence (d-men and forwards abilities), grit, heart and CLASS, this will be men against boys.

5-2 Canada and hopefully Phaneuf and Webber catch a few of these prima-donnas with their heads down at the blue-line. (Sorry guys, I didn't feel that way until last night).

Leafer4Life

01-03-2005, 10:03 PM

Crunch Time!!!!!!! C'mon Canada, let's get those Russians back!!!!!!!!!!!!

GO CANADA GO!!!!!!!!!!! :handclap: :handclap: :handclap:

Boucicaut

01-03-2005, 10:19 PM

Both teams have incredible offense. Team Canada has better defense, but the goalie hasn't been really tested yet.

I'd still go for a 6-4 victory for Canada, with the last one being an empty netter.

Lets hope for a clean, exciting game without taunting or unnecessary violence.

#66

01-03-2005, 10:20 PM

Don'tcry4mejanhrdina

01-03-2005, 10:46 PM

http://www.glue.umd.edu/~gdogum/ovechkin-tootoo.avi
I'm not trying to start something but last year Matt Bradley did the exact same thing Ovechkin just did.........to Scott Stevens.

Drakkar

01-03-2005, 11:13 PM

All other stuff aside has Canada seen offense like the Russians yet in the tourney(i've only seen the us games)? and can their goaltending hold up? This was my first look at Ovechkin and Malkin and I am very impressed wth their skill. Just happy to be watching skilled hockey players able to use their skill no like in the NHL. Enver Lisin hs also been impressive. Canada will also nee to watch that homerun pass from the Russians that goes from endline to blueline in one pass---they caught the US d-men a couple of times. For American fans it's a shame that Canada wasn't in our pool, I would've liked to see them play. As far as the taunting is concerned IMO if you taunt when you win be a man and taunt when you lose. Kind of like the NBA. You would never know if a players team is winning big or losing because they celebrate with head pounds and chest bumps even when they are getting smoked. Not good IMO, but what ever floats your boat you just can't have it both ways. Good luck to all hope it will be a good game.

I like your comments. Canada has not seen anything like the Russians yet, the closest thing was probably themselves during practice.

I have only seen the Russians twice, so I can't tell much, but from I've seen, Canada needs to be at its best to win, because if Russia gets the best efforts from Malkin and Ovechkin, Russia has will probably win. If Canada starts like they did against the Czechs (missing empty nets, getting nervous) and that Russia scores first, it's anybody's game.

I think that's the only way that Canada will lose (that and a goaltending's collapes, but that's always the case so...) It's the only way, but it very well could happen if they get nervous and do not play 100%

But I'm probably biased as hell so...

Randy Marsh

01-04-2005, 12:06 AM

I personally think Bergeron will come up with a huge game and carry Canada to a fairly close win.

6-4 Canada

Crosby, Stewart, Phaneuf, Bergeron (3)

Malkin (2), Shirokov, Ovechkin

deandebean

01-04-2005, 12:09 AM

1st paragraph is just dreams ! Even on my side I never expect a 7-2 Russia over Canada. Not with all the power on both sides.

2nd paragraph : I meant that the staff always go with 2 offensive power , 3rd line half offensive, half defensive & the 4thline = Energy line. Always has been like that & that worked most of the time. I'm not saying it's not good , i'm just saying that someone like Alexandre Picard on Russia would have been picked because SKILLS is what's matter on Russia !!!

We play the most talented player that's all on our team & we create a chemistry after. We don't think something like ''This guy can't be our 3rd liner, he's not that defensive, he can only scores'' like the Canada where you think that it's important to have ''ROLE PLAYERS''.

Is that bad ? Nope , just 2 major difference between how Canada's staff is working & how the Russian's staff thinking.

Well, if you look at Canada's track record at the pro level, this mentality seems to work. As for Russia's, well...

deandebean

01-04-2005, 12:11 AM

He's a year behind Ovechkin and Malkin, maybe a little more. Both of whom make a living playing w/30 yr olds, and producing...

The comparisons have to stop. Sidney is a Canadian hockey player, playing a Canadian brand of hockey. The other 2 are Russians playing another type of game. Which one will be more suited for the NHL? We'll see. The NHL ain't the Russian Super League. Sorry to wake you up on that.

deandebean

01-04-2005, 12:13 AM

O dude thats so funny :joker: I mean when we talk about Kovalchuk : A Russian Rocket who will score ton of goals but he never will win a Hart Trophy or win a cup

And what about Nash ha ? "Nash is the raining rocket man" ? He can do it all ? "NASHER is the real deal"

I see Malkin very close to Ovechkin ............but im still think Kovalchuk is best draftet player since 10-15 years !

Kovalchuk?!? Why? Show me some stats that prove it. 15 years?!?

deandebean

01-04-2005, 12:19 AM

First of all, I think that the players who went 1-4 in that draft were, are, and will be better players that Malkin. That's just the way I see it; two will be dominate D-men, one will be a top 3 NHL goalie, and the last has already scored 40 in a season.

As for your second comment, I'm american. I'm very american and quite frankly, I sometimes also don't appreciate the way that some Canadians (a very small minority) feel that there is nothing beyond Canadian hockey. However, what the Russian squad did last night, what the Russian squad, namely Ilya Kovalchuk (a player I love to watch play) did a few years ago did not represent what these hockey championships are all about. I'm sure you can see that despite being a fan of team Russia.

Have you seen Kovalchuk act the same way in the real league? No way, because he knows he'll get his head unscrewed pretty fast.

This is the juniors, just like College football. There is much more triumphalism in College football than in the NFL. Kids are hyped up crazy. Same with junior hockey at the international level. Hey, I remember when the Soviet teams did not even raise their sticks after a goal, not even rejoicing. THAT made me hate them much more than the taunting, which is part of the show...until someone chops your head off.

deandebean

01-04-2005, 12:20 AM

Please dont understand me wrong BUT why is Bergeron a better all-round player ? Because Malkin is russian and can only score Goals ????

They are still pups at the hockey level. They haven't proven squat yet. Let's wait before we start comparing them.

deandebean

01-04-2005, 12:29 AM

Well that doesn't mean anything. If stats is your only argument than Lisin must be very good because he played 1st line with full of NHLers in Kazan.

What I meant is that Radulov is playing in a Canadian league, with Canadian (read here NHL) rules, on a Canadian ice surface (rink size). And in a league that isn't at par with the other 2 CHLs this season. And, no, I'm not talking (or rather writing!) about stats. I'm talking about his overall performance. Radulov cheats a lot on the ice. He's not the most reliable fella in his zone. And in North America, to play the game adequately, you need to be reliable in both ends.

Radulov has been a peripheral player this season. That doesn't cut it in North America.

Like you said, it's 2 different hockey styles. In North America, you need to play a more efficient game.

Mxpunk

01-04-2005, 12:38 AM

Good luck Canada! Even though I can't watch you here in the U.S., I'll be rooting for you!!!

Sting

01-04-2005, 12:51 AM

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 01:23 AM

After reading pages of flames back and forth between us Canadians and the Russian posters...I think I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy the game tomorrow heh. We can debate all day if Bergeron is better than Malkin, Crosby than Ovechkin, etc. Fact is none of that will matter tomorrow as it's a team game.

Hope it's a good one.

Amen.. both our countries have great forwards, and if Ovechkin is slightly better than Crosby or if Bergeron is better than Malkin, probably won't be the deciding factor.

Hockey is a team game, and we shall see who comes out on top..

Personally I'm just really nervous.. next 19 hours are going to be hell for me..

Julia

01-04-2005, 01:52 AM

Don't know about you, guys, but I'm getting very nervouse too... :shakehead
Can' t wait till tomorrow... :)

ktownhockey

01-04-2005, 01:58 AM

I want the game to be now wow.... its gonna be a good afternoon/night of hockey.

TSN 4 o clock bronze medal game, followed by the big show CANADA VS RUSSIA FOR THE GOLD!!!!

Go Canada gooooo!!!!!

x Goodwill x

01-04-2005, 02:17 AM

I can't wait for tommorrow's game :D

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 02:17 AM

18 hours before the puck drops..

you'd think I'm smart enough to go sleep now and kill off about 8 of those hours, but you are wrong..

AgentNaslund*

01-04-2005, 02:23 AM

Please, you can't be serious. Carter is a better player than Shirokov.

I find some russian fans here, out of this world. Russian Homers are just unbelievable sometimes. They will give no credit what so ever to other opponents,r egardedless of how good other players are.

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 02:25 AM

x Goodwill x

01-04-2005, 02:28 AM

Carter is better than Shirokov. He is a Mats Sundin clone!!! :D

Canuck21t

01-04-2005, 02:32 AM

Russia should win this one.

Now that everybody knows that the group B, at the exception of Canada, totally sucked, and that Canada beat the Czech Republic 3-1, I believe Russia and Canada are evenly matched, but the Russians want the gold more, and will prevail!
Explain to me why Russia wants the Gold more? Canada should be hungrier since it hasn't won the precious metal since 1997 while Russia has won it a few times since.

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 02:33 AM

Watching the Russia - USA game, some players that nobody talks about, but who could be dangerous IMO:

Pestunov
Lisin
Nikulin
Galimov
Shafigulin
Voloshenko

Parshin has awesome moves but he's just too damn small.. especially against Canada.. it's such a shame..

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 02:35 AM

Explain to me why Russia wants the Gold more? Canada should be hungrier since it hasn't won the precious metal since 1997 while Russia has won it a few times since.

Oh please, both teams are equally hungry... Canada's hunger for gold is obvious, but saying that Russia is any less hungry for it is ridiculous.

Ovechkin is the only one on this team who's ever won the WJCs, so the rest of the team is in the same boat as the Canadian players.. none of these guys have ever won it and thus all of them are hungry..

Just because Russia's won 2 golds in the last 3 years is meaningless.

Oi'll say!

01-04-2005, 02:46 AM

7-1 Canada. They won't taunt the Russians either, the WHL'ers never even said boo when they beat them 11-1 or whatever it was.

Canuck21t

01-04-2005, 02:48 AM

You say Canadians weren't showing off, I can only ask you these:

What do you call it then when you pass from a scoring chance and end up losing the puck? What do you call it when you circle around the goal 2-3 times and don't take a shot even though you have a chance and end up losing the puck? (I call this showing off, maybe because I don't know a better word for it in the English language, but this is what I meant anyway.)
Showing off my butt. To you it may have been a scoring chance but to the player who is on the ice and in action, the angle was not deemed good enough to score. It's so easy to say things from afar but it's something else when you're actually the one doing the action.

The Soviets used to wait for the perfect play before they shoot, would you say that they were showing off? :speechles

Canuck21t

01-04-2005, 02:57 AM

Oh please, both teams are equally hungry... Canada's hunger for gold is obvious, but saying that Russia is any less hungry for it is ridiculous.

Ovechkin is the only one on this team who's ever won the WJCs, so the rest of the team is in the same boat as the Canadian players.. none of these guys have ever won it and thus all of them are hungry..

Just because Russia's won 2 golds in the last 3 years is meaningless.
I agree that the players on Russia's team are as hungry as the Canadians. I was just looking at the big picture of this tournament's recent history and Canada SHOULD be hungrier. It was just a theory in response to wilka91's comment which you have to agree was as ridiculous as mine.

Luigi Lemieux

01-04-2005, 02:59 AM

I agree that the players on Russia's team are as hungry as the Canadians. I was just looking at the big picture of this tournament's recent history and Canada SHOULD be hungrier. It was just a theory in response to wilka91's comment which you have to agree was as ridiculous as mine.
that would make sense if there wasn't so much turnover for the junior teams. as mentioned, only AO remains from their last gold medal team.

Canuck21t

01-04-2005, 03:17 AM

that would make sense if there wasn't so much turnover for the junior teams. as mentioned, only AO remains from their last gold medal team.
Uh... yeah, I got MOGiLNY's point. You don't have to repeat it.

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 03:44 AM

Showing off my butt. To you it may have been a scoring chance but to the player who is on the ice and in action, the angle was not deemed good enough to score. It's so easy to say things from afar but it's something else when you're actually the one doing the action.

The Soviets used to wait for the perfect play before they shoot, would you say that they were showing off? :speechles

same goes for the taunting.. we don't know what the US fans were screaming at the Russians..

barrytrotzsneck

01-04-2005, 03:51 AM

What I meant is that Radulov is playing in a Canadian league, with Canadian (read here NHL) rules, on a Canadian ice surface (rink size). And in a league that isn't at par with the other 2 CHLs this season. And, no, I'm not talking (or rather writing!) about stats. I'm talking about his overall performance. Radulov cheats a lot on the ice. He's not the most reliable fella in his zone. And in North America, to play the game adequately, you need to be reliable in both ends.

Radulov has been a peripheral player this season. That doesn't cut it in North America.

Like you said, it's 2 different hockey styles. In North America, you need to play a more efficient game.

:shakehead :lol

a peripheral player that, prior to the WJC break was

1. Leading his team in points
2. One goal behind Josh Hennessy for the goalscoring lead on the team
3. Leading all rookies in points
4. Leading all rookies in goals
5. Fourth in the LEAGUE in power play goals

Quebec must be some team this year if their peripheral players are accomplishing all that. Sounds to me like you've got some unreasonable hate-on for Radulov, because you're one of the few that isn't predicting big things for him.

barrytrotzsneck

01-04-2005, 03:53 AM

I find some russian fans here, out of this world. Russian Homers are just unbelievable sometimes. They will give no credit what so ever to other opponents,r egardedless of how good other players are.

"6-2, Canada" "Canada will win by at least 3 goals" " I predict the Russians won't get 10 shots the entire game"

I guess it's only "unbelievable" when you don't like what's being said?

Canuck21t

01-04-2005, 04:00 AM

same goes for the taunting.. we don't know what the US fans were screaming at the Russians..
The Russians were CLEARLY taunting but the question is was there something that caused that behavior? Most probably yes, the Americans were no angels. Canadians are not perfect either but to say that the Canadians were showing off because they were making one too many circles around the goal?!? Give me a break here. Next time, people are going to complain about Canadian's arrogance for purposely shooting at the goal post just to scare the opposition. :shakehead

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 04:01 AM

teams getting ready for the big game..

http://images.sportsline.com/u/gettyimages/photos/51880761DS002_Canada010316_lower.jpg
http://images.sportsline.com/u/gettyimages/photos/51880761JV003_CANADA010316_lower.jpg
http://images.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/GFX115010317_lower.jpg
http://images.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/GFX119010317_lower.jpg

MOGiLNY

01-04-2005, 04:03 AM

The Russians were CLEARLY taunting but the question is was there something that caused that behavior? Most probably yes, the Americans are no angels. Canadians are not perfect either but to say that the Canadians were showing off because they were making one too many circles around the goal?!? Give me a break here. Next time, people are going to complain about Canadian's arrogance for purposely shooting at the goal post just to scare the opposition. :shakehead

eh, I never said any of these things except that the Americans must've done something to cause the taunting..

nomorekids made a pretty good point though

Canuck21t

01-04-2005, 04:11 AM

eh, I never said any of these things except that the Americans must've done something to cause the taunting..

nomorekids made a pretty good point though
I know you didn't say that. It was a response to you about the taunting but also to tommi462 about the Canadians showing off. Sometime I'm too lazy to make two separate posts so I combine everything in one. I guess that leads to confusion. :dunce:

Faaxinho

01-04-2005, 04:52 AM

Just realized that the game will start 3.00 am here in Finland. So no sleep because pronze game is before it. :help:

High flyin' Habs*

01-04-2005, 05:12 AM

Just realized that the game will start 3.00 am here in Finland. So no sleep because pronze game is before it. :help:
On what channel will you be watching it?

Faaxinho

01-04-2005, 05:18 AM

On Finnish Broadcasting Companys channel number two. I think they are TSN's feed.

Panopticon

01-04-2005, 05:33 AM

Showing off my butt. To you it may have been a scoring chance but to the player who is on the ice and in action, the angle was not deemed good enough to score. It's so easy to say things from afar but it's something else when you're actually the one doing the action.

The Soviets used to wait for the perfect play before they shoot, would you say that they were showing off? :speechles

Ah, so the chance wasn't good enough for him so decides to give away the puck instead of at least trying to score. Logical.

And yes I would call that showing off, but only when they win games like that.

wilka91*

01-04-2005, 06:34 AM

Explain to me why Russia wants the Gold more? Canada should be hungrier since it hasn't won the precious metal since 1997 while Russia has won it a few times since.

Because of Ovechkin and Malkin! They'll be taunting the Canadian players and crowd. :madfire: This is war!

I Hate You All*

01-04-2005, 07:07 AM

Yeah, it's war! I hope your boys have booked their stretchers! (http://www.russianhockey.net/Media/Molson%20Canadian%20Team%20Canada%20vs%20Russia.mo v)

Kaizer

01-04-2005, 07:11 AM

On Finnish Broadcasting Companys channel number two. I think they are TSN's feed.
Do they have internet broadcast ?

Faaxinho

01-04-2005, 07:23 AM

Do they have internet broadcast ?
Not that I know of. Propably not.

wilka91*

01-04-2005, 07:57 AM

Yeah, it's war! I hope your boys have booked their stretchers! (http://www.russianhockey.net/Media/Molson%20Canadian%20Team%20Canada%20vs%20Russia.mo v)

Hahaha, awesome! :lol

gpearson1968

01-04-2005, 08:15 AM

Please tell me I can listen to the game online; freakin ESPN would rather show POKER of all things...
Sorry Dude,

Us all here in the states are going to be treated to Womens professional billiards tonight on ESPN.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/tvlistings/index

Anybody gotta broadband connection, TSN, and a webcam they can set up ?

Cheers,
Geoff.

ZombieMatt

01-04-2005, 08:23 AM

Because of Ovechkin and Malkin! They'll be taunting the Canadian players and crowd. :madfire: This is war!

This seems like a moot point.

What happened three, four, five, six, seven years ago is of no consequence to this team.

The Russians want to win because if they don't they're going to look awfully ridiculous with all the taunting and celebrating.

The Canadians (well, half the team) want to win because of what happened last year.

And, most importantly, both teams want to win because that's why you play the game.

So arguing over who wants it more seems sort of silly doesn't it?

wilka91*

01-04-2005, 08:44 AM

I was joking ... I mean it was obvious, right? :lol:

Slay

01-04-2005, 08:55 AM

My Sentiments exactly.. just glad there's gonna be a hcokey game of any importance...

really though, this might be the first time out of the last 4 meetings between the teams that Canada are favorites...

I'd say in 2002 Canada was sure favorite and I think that team Canada was not weaker than this one.

Russian team in 2002 had a better D than this Russian team, but I think offence and goaltending are quite similar (though someone may argue that this year offence is better, all debatable).

Canada is a favourite in this year final but with notable reservations.

Some history of Russia - Canada head-to-head games:

1998 2-1 OT quarter-final
1999 3-2 OT gold medal game
2000 3-2 semi-final
2001 3-1 robin round
2002 2-5 robin round
2002 5-4 gold medal game
2003 3-2 gold medal game

I think it will be close game with 1 or 2 goals difference in favour of any team.