Constantine Booted

I'd have to say it's a rare thing for a WHL coach to get booted from a game...especially one he is winning on the road, but with about 5 or 6 minutes to go in the 2nd period tonight & the Silvertips beating Portland 1-0 in Portland, Constantine got his 2nd bench minor and a Game Misconduct by the on Ice referee (Savage). I'm listening to the game on the Silvertips web broadcast, so I don;t know exactly what happened, but the radio guys (who admittedly are major homers) are talking about the calls on both teams being totally bush league tonight. Ofcourse the Hawks only have 6 PIM after 2 periods and the Tips have 8 non-bench PIM. Any Hawks fans in attendance have any insight about what happened?

well..the portland website says that he was "sarcastically applauding" savage after the too many men on the ice call....and savage saw him and booted him...he wouldn't leave....and when he finally crawled his way across the ice, he did NOT leave the arena but continued to watch the 2nd period from the corner

can't he get a suspension or something for not leaving the arena immediately like the rules say?

anyway...very, very, very childish behavior...I don't care how poorly the game was or wasn't called...a coach should NOT act like that...what is he teaching his players by acting like that?

I've always liked the guy...but I am disappointed in his bahavior last night

I'll tell you what he is teaching his players: WIN

He sticks up for them and they perform for him. Why in baseball were we so happy when Lou Pinniela got tossed? Because his players respected that he'd put himself between them and bad officiating. He concentrates on that, the players concentrate on playing. And winning. Check the record.

:yo: :bow: :lol

MikeS,
I have to respectfully disagree. I think there is a certain point where you've taken it too far. In baseball it is common for coaches to get ejected after a perceived horrible call. In Hockey it is almost unheard of. To compare the two is like comparing night and day. As a Tips fan I like the antics of Constantine on the bench when he animatedly argues a call...but at the point where he is hurting his team by drawing penalties and embarrising the franchise by failing ot follow the rules of the game. It's one thing to get ejected, but to blatantly ignore the rules and stay in the area after being ejected.

I disagree...he seems to be teaching his players to act high and mighty and that rules can be ignored

arguing over a call and standing up for a player is one thing...acting like a spoiled child is another

and, as I mentioned previously, I've always had great respect for the guy..but he slipped a few notches after last night's episode

Calling a spade a spade is ok in my book. What he does has everything to do with winning. The league is developmental for officials too, and there are good ones and bad ones, good nights and bad nights. If Constantine (or Habsheid or Hay) stand up for their players when they are getting mugged and some homer referee fails to call it, I say the players play harder for them. You can't argue with success.

As far as baseball and hockey are concerened, I know there is a difference. The point I was making is keep the player from griping by letting the coach tell it like it is. The coaches know when a player is hamming it up or when he really has a legit beef. It is not only his right, but his obligation to point it out. He knows the risk (bench minor) and accepts it.

The rarity of ejections probably points to a thin-skinned referee in this case. I bet Constantine did nothing more than he usually does in these instances and nothing more than most coaches do.

In a league that travels its referees, there are no homer referees.



Yup. Your team's coach is right.

...And you're suggesting some referees are "homers". :speechles
When ever Constantine is in Kelowna he looks like Dempsey, red faced from whining all night.

I miss seeing Dempsey, every two minutes you look over at him his face get more red by the minute!

When ever Constantine is in Kelowna he looks like Dempsey, red faced from whining all night.

I miss seeing Dempsey, every two minutes you look over at him his face get more red by the minute!
go check out a BCHL game....you'll think you're looknig at a whole new/different Dempsey....lol....seriously...I don't know if he's meditating, or doing the yoga thing...but the guy has calmed down compared to what he used to be! IT's astonashing...It doesn't look like he's having a heart attack every 5mins on the bench anymore....It's just not the same fun...haha...

In a league that travels its referees, there are no homer referees.


Sure there are...more calls that favor the home team. Who wants to get booed?

The WHL has fined Constantine for the second time this season. Constantine was tossed out of Everett's win over Portland on Dec. 3 and it will cost him $250. Earlier this season, Constantine was fined $500 was not being available to the media in Prince George.

I think it a bit naive to think that no referee ever caves in to pressure from fans or coaches. I think Constantine, one of the best coaches in this league, knows that too. I think everything this guy does is to develop a winning team. His results speak for themselves.

As far as his other $ fine this year, it was not for giving the officials crap, but was for not talking to the media after two losses to PG, as Tipped Off pointed out...

I think, deep down, you know that officials, as human beings, can and are occasionally manipulated. Constantine is not the only coach to do it. He just seems to be pretty damned good at every aspect of his role.

More power to him. The players respect him and they win.

If you say "more power to him" for Constantine trying to manipulate referees, then I think you should try officiating some minor hockey in your area. Maybe you will have a bit more respect for the men in stripes. Manipulating officials is not an aspect of coaching.
or, at least it should NOT be an aspect of coaching

refs, much like the players and coaches, are oblivious to the crowd for the most part...they have a job to do, and that is what they are concentrating on

I will admit I have never officiated a game, so your point is taken. I can only report what I have witnessed and I have seen far more coaches than just Kevin Constantine who effectively argue calls and get the benefit of the next call. Can you honestly say you have NEVER seen such a thing? Where the coach jaws at the referee, and gets an "even up" call or a benefit somewhere else down the line?

It is when the officials screw up and DON'T make amends, either by apology or consiliation that egos get in the way. Two egos colliding make for incidents like the one in Portland. If you think Constantine will change that tack, I think differently. He is trying to win and HE believes that he can prevail on an official by jawing at him.

Why does Constantine believe he can influence the officiating and you believe he cannot? Who is right? Maybe both. Some officials probably are not very pliable. Some probably are. I think Constantine is figuring it out. I think it is part of who he is as a coach and SOME SMALL PART of his success can be traced to it.

Don't you think that is a reasonable theory? I do.

If this is the case, then we have identified one reason why Kevin Constantine is a former NHL coach.

There are a lot of FORMER NHL coaches, and you know as well as I that he didn't leave the NHL as a result of conflicts with officials. Constantine said he has NEVER been tossed from a game in 23 years of coaching until Portland.

Me-thinks he knows the game at the various levels better than you are giving him credit for...and 2,000 people or 20,000 in the building changes little in his approach to the game.

He has said the similarities are far greater than the differences in the various levels he has coached at. I suspect that goes for how to handle officials. As I have continued to say, check the record. His success speaks for itself.

I hope someday you get the opportunity to officiate at any level you aspire to. Maybe then you can be the second person to kick Constantine out of a game in his life. :lol

Well,
I don't have hockey officiating experience, but I did umpire baseball for 5 years at various levels of the minor leagues here in the U.S. Being a season ticketholder I can tell you I don't think Constantine goes into a game thinking about how to manipulate the officials.
That being said, like any good coach, he will "protect" his players by being the one to get the officials attention if he thinks his team might be about to implode because of perceived bad officiating. I can tell you this, the same "crappy" official who is out there for your team is also out there for the other side. For the most part I would say 99.9% of officials don't care who wins. We are human & I would say once out of every 1000 games or so you might run into some guy who has had a bad experience with a team. That doesn't mean he goes out there with intentions to screw that team, but it could mean he hasn't forgotten what has happened in the past & might be a bit quick to blow the whistle.
Just the other night Hromas got blatantly tripped...i mean the guy had his stick around his leg and yanked it so hard Hromas had to be helped off the ice with a twisted knee. The officials call: Diving on Hromas...two minutes. It happened right in front of me. Constantine was livid and screamed at the official. At one point he grabbed a stick, stood with one foot on the bench, the other on the rail and used the stick to grab his own leg and "demonstrate" what happened to Hromas. The official completely ignored it and play resumed. The official was wrong. To his credit he called the rest of the game fairly and didn't let the 7000 tips fans bother him.
Could he have exploded on Constantine and kicked him out for visibly showing him up? Sure. But like I said, for the most part the officials do a good job & they aren't going to make it to the NHL with a history of kicking out coaches and not "controlling" games.

No, Van. You need a re-read. You said "former NHL coach" as if the reason for his exodus was because of his troubles with officials.

I speculated that CONSTANTINE'S approach would be no different before 2,000 or 20,000, not every coach, not every official. I guarantee you, the pressure of 20,000 would make a difference in some people. Maybe even you.

So I made perfect sense. Perhaps we should let this go, as you seem think every official is perfect and infallible, something you accuse me of saying about Constantine (which I have not, only that he is very good and gets results with his approach).

If you have no argument with that, then we have no argument.
Peace, Love, 'Tips

I'll say this, Van: Putting himself between his players and bad calls is likely part of the approach of EVERY successful coach. This is my entire point. He took one for the team. Did he break the rules? Yes. Was he penalized? Yes. Would he respond the same in another instance if he thought he had too? Probably yes. In my opinion he appears to place long term goals (winning) at the forefront. EVERY GOOD COACH argues or complains when he feels the officials are wrong. This is not only Constantine's issue.

I can't believe we are 25 posts into this discussion. I'm done beating this dead horse.

You can have the last word. :shakehead